S21.E10: Icons Night & Dance Off Challenge

[sinkwriter]

Ugh, but how many times do we have to watch Alexa fuck up a step?  She did lots of that, and stumbled and the judges one of whom is ballroom trained gave the round to Tamar probably grudgingly having to admit, yeah, Tamar danced the cha cha better. And then  I watched that awful Argentine Tango. Deer in the headlights for the majority of that dance is not dancing. That was a hella mess, horrible dance position, out of sync, even Mark didn't look good. The only part that kind of looked okay was when they went into Ballroom, not Argentine Tango hold so Mark could hang on to her.  But as an Argentine Tango? Hated it.  You can't just keep doing theatrics and forget about the dance style.

 

Those were two entirely different performances. I didn't get into Alexa's tango performance, but I did very much like what they did in the dance-off, regardless of one misstep she had near the end.

 

Fuck-ups don't mean an entire dance is ruined, just as flawless steps don't always mean a dance is fully engaging or emotionally satisfying.

[spanana]

Agree to disagree on the dance off at this point, but I saw Alexa miss one or two steps in the dance off.  Right towards the very end.   But I don't think a couple of missed steps negates everything else she did before or after that moment, especially since Mark was able to get her right back into the dance.  It's not like Tamar's dance was perfect.  I think Tamar had the spirit of the cha cha right and maybe she was feeling the music and all that, but IMO there was a lack of footwork.  It actually surprised me since I agree with the poster that said usually Val prepares his celebs very well for the dance off challenge.  The only thing I could think of was that Tamar was in Georgia last weekend and had a few concerts and maybe they didn't really have the time to work out the dance off routines fully, so Val focused on her getting her upper body moving.  I don't think anybody is arguing that Alexa was perfect in the dance off or that Tamar was bad even.  All I'm saying is it surprised me that I thought Alexa was better and I didn't totally understand what Val was having Tamar do at times.

 

Tamar's individual dance was good though.  So there is that.

Edited November 3, 2015 by spanana

[Andie1]

Yeah I know. And Alexa still fucked up the ending of the hang on for dear life Cha cha.  That girl can't dance a routine without a stumble some where.  And she can't dance out of hold. That's a problem, because constant fuck ups  isn't dancing. 

Edited November 3, 2015 by Andie1

[Wings]

Australia is still ruled by the British monarch, so I imagine all facets of royalty reigns supreme down there. Australia had a pretty big Grace Kelly fashion exhibit set up a few years ago and Nicole Kidman starred as Grace Kelly in an Australian biopic. It's not a stretch that's Bindi's idol.

I did think some of the celebrities were shafted in their package. Carlos & Alek had interviews from their idols (I'm counting Taya Kelly). Andy got to talk about his mom again. Nick had his gender reveal. Then Alexa had the producers, Bindi had her feet, and Tamar had crying. It felt very uneven for it being idol week.

 

 

What is a gender reveal?  My DVR did not catch this show, damnit and I fell asleep as I watched in real time. 

Edited November 3, 2015 by wings707

[birkenstock]

They found out the sex of Nick and his wife's baby. It revealed he and his wife are having a boy. They opened a box and blue balloons came out.  

[AdorkableSars]

Alek:

Very pretty dance.  He's back to looking like the leading man.  Simple choreography - I feel like he's not advancing in difficulty.  A bit of a hiccup on one lift but Alek had hold of her as she came down. (Very different from Witney saving herself.)  Perfect theme for him after coming off a bit pissy in last week's rehearsal package. I think he very effectively reversed any negativity.  The scores were okay.

 

I agree with all of this. I also agree with Carrie Ann and Julianne that Lindsay should've given him some actual choreography. He's not advancing in difficulty because Lindsay's choreography isn't advancing in difficulty. He needs to prove himself, and we have seen Lindsay choreograph some good routines for him this season. Give him a chance to show what he's capable of. 

 

Boy, did the judges project that loss, though. ALL NIGHT they kept saying to Andy, "If you make it through to the next round..." but they didn't say that to anyone else, so I just knew he was going home. I would have been shocked if he hadn't, after all their obviousness.

 

Yeah...it was pretty blatant. 

 

This may be better suited for Allison's thread but I was really frustrated on Andy's behalf last night. I don't think he had a chanice to make the finals but think he could have made it at least one more week with better training.

 

I still maintain that his best dance of the season was his Argentine Tango...which was with Sharna! I adore Andy, and really wish he would've had a different partner. But on the plus side, his being on the show got me to download all of his albums (I only had "Keep Your Head Up" and "Honey, I'm Good" before), and I am now a huge fan. Great, catchy music, and and awesome personality. This dude has it in spades! 

 

That dance off was pretty dumb. But I laughed pretty hard when Carrie Ann told Andy and Alek that they needed to learn how to samba, becaue yeah...that was not good. At least Andy went out on an awesome move/the worm!

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

Dancing With The Stars Is 1% Inspiration And 99% Perspiration
Especially if you're Nick Carter. That dude is sweaty.

[realdancemom]

Julianne doesn't see anything wrong with Bindi because she doesn't want to find anything wrong.  Bindi was definitely not synchronized during the floor section.

 

Between Tamar and Alexa on the dance-off.  I would have voted for Tamar but I do agree with the positives and negatives written on both.  Alexa didn't just mess up at the end.  She had several missteps.  That is why I would choose Tamar.  However, I do agree that I was waiting for more intricate footwork from Tamar.  I was disappointed because she is capable of it.

 

I'm also a little confused because Derek said that the styles for the dance-offs were agreed before the show.  However, why would Alek and Andy agree to do the samba if neither one has every danced it before?  It seems like if TPTB wanted to be fair (yeah right), they would have chosen another style if the other two styles were already chosen by the other couples.  Even if the styles were chosen before hand, I was a little turned off that Derek asked who wanted to do the jive.  Bindi and Derek were supposed to choose a competing couple.  They are not supposed to pick the style.  The couple that they choose gets to pick the style.  At least, make it look like that's what's happening.

[iMonrey]

They found out the sex of Nick and his wife's baby. It revealed he and his wife are having a boy. They opened a box and blue balloons came out.

 

Yeah like they were on Let's Make a Deal. "You can have what's in this big box or . . . take what's behind Curtain #3!" And how (much more) awkward would that whole thing have been if they'd just been given sevens and eights and told their dance wasn't up to snuff? The whole baby production seemed designed to go hand-in-hand with perfect 10s. There was just a little too much propping going on with Nick, especially when you consider the fact that all the other celebs had to come up with some kind of entertainment or military icon. Even Andy chose Stevie Wonder while "dedicating" the dance to his mother. Nick's "icon" is his wife? Really? That seems to have missed the point of the theme no matter how flimsy it was.

[Artymouse]

Re: the David and Goliath confusion: I am fairly certain that the rocks from the slingshot killed Goliath. The decapitation was to prove to the Philistines that Goliath was dead (and as my son liked to remind me when he was about 10, when David conquered most of the remaining Philistines, he collected their foreskins, for a reason that I can't remember at the moment).

As as someone mentioned upthread, I also wondered why Lindsay was wearing the fringey samba pants (which I think are ugly and unflattering) when she didn't know what dance she'd be doing. Is it possible that there were three outfits chosen for each pro, and then the dance style determined which costume they would wear?

[Pattycake2]

Of the remaining contestants, I think Bindi, Alexa, and Tamar are the best.  Yes, they aren't perfect, but they certainly can dance.  Nick and Carlos are sort of even to me.  Alek stinks.  He. can't. dance.   It's not his fault, but boy, it's time for him to go.  He probably isn't getting more advanced choreo because he can't do it. 

[truthaboutluv]

Also, Riker was in the audience for the second week in a row and I don't think he was mentioned? Second place finisher and all? They highlighted Victor Espinoza.

 

 

They gave Victor a shout out because he won a major horse-racing competition this past weekend. 

 

It may have been the split screen but I kept wondering what the heck Tamar and Val were doing back there. Like you, I kept waiting for them to kick it up at least a half notch. They may have been feeling the music but to me it looked more like they were pausing to figure out what to do next. I was underwhelmed.

 

 

IMO, this is not the first time I've seen that from Val in one of these things. In Season 17 I think, when they did the switch-up challenge where the couples were split in two groups and had to dance to music that would keep changing, he and Elizabeth were the same. I remember Val spent a number of counts in the first song just walking around Elizabeth, strutting and posing while she clearly kept looking to him for what to do. And in the end they ended up third in the group, losing to Brant and Peta who most thought for sure they would beat. 

 

Is that fair though - to have all those other people on stage in sync?

 

 

How is it any different than the number of troupe appearances every week in any number of the dances? The synchronicity of the group can actually be a bad things at times because if the celebrity is slightly off, it's way more obvious as was the case when Bindi went off in the floor sequence. 

[calipiano81]

I actually found the dance-off portion much more interesting than the individual dances this week.

Bindi and Carlos were pretty even to me, so I was surprised that all 3 judges went for Carlos/Witney. I was expecting a split.

Same thing for Tamar and Alexa, who I thought had the most exciting dance off of the three. One thing about Alexa...she was actually doing all NEW choreography since her previous "cha cha" was the Britney Spears dance, which was primarily moves from the VMA performance.

Andy and Alek could have just stepped aside and let their ladies dance off since the both of them were really not doing much samba anyways. Andy had more energy and personality though, so that gave him the edge. BTW, usually all the couples work out the pairings and strategies backstage to try and benefit everyone. So how did the hardest dance go to the two weakest dancers, both of whom have not done samba yet?

[Andie1]

I'm sorry but standing there and shaking your ass and then doing a bunch of grapevine twizzles, isn't doing much Cha Cha.  That's about all I saw from Alexa, and it wasn't even good. She fucked it up.  

[crowceilidh]

 

Showing the running vote percentages behind the dance-off couples was a HUGE mistake IMO. I'm assuming the couples could see them - imagine being Tamar or Carlos, and glancing behind you and realizing essentially nobody was voting for you. Distracting and disheartening, and a good indication of how overall voting is going this season.

 

It was really interesting as a viewer but also somewhat deceptive.  Was it Alek and Andy head to head getting the same number of votes a lot - 2 each would that be?  Quite distracting and ultimately cruel

[McManda]

I'm going to go against the grain and say that I think Tamar has stalled as a dancer. I used to not mind watching her, but now I find her facial expressions distracting at best and awful at worst. I also think she's starting to get into her head, or not have enough time to practice, because her bottom half is usually fine but her top lines look wobbly and flaily a lot. Sometimes it's like Val's flinging her around. I honestly don't think she's any better than Alexa. Or at least Alexa is more compelling to watch.

 

That said, not a fan of Alexa's Argentine Tango. I thought it was a really mild paso doble for awhile and was super confused.

 

I was also not a fan of Broadway Bindi's dance. And it definitely wasn't perfect, so I'm not sure what Julianne was thinking. I do like that Bindi seems to be rolling with the punches, at least outwardly.

 

Alek and Carlos ... eh. They're there.

 

I'm sad that Andy didn't get better training.

 

The good pros on this show always have one eye on their celeb so that they can tell if things are falling apart.

 

This is an interesting observation, and very true IMO. I know Derek splits sides, but when DWTS did the "top 10" dances (for the 150th episode?) one of the dances was his futuristic paso with Joanna Krupa. There was a popup in that clip that mentioned that Joanna got ahead with some arm movements when they were dancing side by side and that Derek just rolled with it and matched her. Honestly, if they hadn't said anything I never would have noticed. Stuff like that sets some of the pros apart, I think. (Tony has also done that, but it's been more noticeable because his celebs usually aren't the type to commit to sell a performance.)

[smiley13]

I'm going to go against the grain and say that I think Tamar has stalled as a dancer. I used to not mind watching her, but now I find her facial expressions distracting at best and awful at worst. I also think she's starting to get into her head, or not have enough time to practice, because her bottom half is usually fine but her top lines look wobbly and flaily a lot. Sometimes it's like Val's flinging her around. I honestly don't think she's any better than Alexa. Or at least Alexa is more compelling to watch.

I do not think that is going against the grain at all.  I do not enjoy Tamar's dancing at all.  She had a good first week and went totally downhill after that.  Her bad attitude detracts from her dancing.

[Andie1]

nm

Edited November 4, 2015 by Andie1

[kitcloudkicker]

I'm going to go against the grain and say that I think Tamar has stalled as a dancer. I used to not mind watching her, but now I find her facial expressions distracting at best and awful at worst. I also think she's starting to get into her head, or not have enough time to practice, because her bottom half is usually fine but her top lines look wobbly and flaily a lot. 

 

I think her schedule might be starting to catch up with her. Apparently her and Val had to practice something like 11PM - 3AM a few nights this week, because that's the only time she could fit it in. She's good enough that she's been able to get away with it so far, and I don't doubt she'll keep being able to keep up with the steps, but I can't imagine Val is getting to drill in the extra mile of performance factor like he would like to. And it's getting to the point where that last bit of performance polish is really important.

 

She's remarkably calm though, for all she has going on. I would be curled up in a ball on the dance floor crying if that was my schedule. 

[enthus-pro]

Enjoyed the week 8 dances, as the iconic figures were telling about each of the celebrities background, personalities and influences.

 

3b.  Alexa & Mark
Nice to see Alexa have the confidence to carry out a solo performance at the very top.  Thought she didn't let the occasion collapse upon her, but rather delivered with intent and purpose (enjoyed her strong moves and glaring eyes) prior to assuming hold with Mark.  Nice to see Alexa go onto the balls of her feet to create that subtle 'A' frame with Mark when in hold at the beginning.  The first lift seemed a bit precarious for a split-second but thought Mark saved and salvaged it.  The foot hiccups opposite and next to the judges table midway was unfortunate, but to Alexa's credit she carried on.  It's still a little confusing trying to reconcile how the theme/iconic story line and music fits and cooperates with the argentine tango narrative (maybe a paso doble), but its nice to see Mark making amends with the conflict.  Enjoyed watching Alexa slowly grow and looking forward to how she builds upon this based on the last two weeks of her dancing.

 

2b.  Nick & Sharna
Thought this was the first dance where Nick was able to free himself of his hip hop/pop tendencies, moves and mannerisms in his body.  The freeze-frame moment where both Nick and Sharna leapt side-by-side gracefully away from the judges table (with the extended toes and arms), suspended full-frontal in the air free of tension, was a beautiful sight to see.  Enjoyed the story unfolding on the floor along with the signature delicate touches of Sharna's feet and hands.  Still think Nick needs to continue relaxing his shouders (feel a bit of tension) and to keep his bottom inwards for the more upcoming technical dances.  While the contemporary dance was nice, I thought and felt the choreography had an unusual hint of stress, relative to the natural and effortless contemporary/freestyle routines that Sharna is capable of producing (dance-off/music choice may have been a factor, though Sharna should stick to her own pure style imo).  Nonetheless, it was nice to see Nick let a dance inhabit his body and to let the style dictate his moves out on the floor.  Interested to see how he progresses from this point forth in his performances after this number.

 

1.  Bindi & Derek
Nice to see Bindi bring a Broadway style and grace to the foxtrot routine.  Thought the miming at the beginning worked well with the routine, and that Bindi danced well alongside with the troupe members throughout the number.  Think Derek does a nice job showcasing the strengths of Bindi in her performances and he should be given credit for doing so.  Relative to the other performances (where couples either started immediately or allowed a five second introduction before assuming hold), I felt the foxtrot was leaning more on the theatrics (half the routine timed with the troupe, other overall half in hold).  Taking out the pivot turns in hold, it would've been nice to see more feather steps alongside with basic footwork that would've highlighted the gliding feel of this style even more (again, perhaps the dance-off was a factor).  Nonetheless, think this experience should assist her as she moves deeper into the competition.  While she should give herself more permission, enjoy and appreciate how she puts the interest and welfare of others in front and center before hers.

 

Best of luck to all the celebs and looking forward to their dances.

Edited November 4, 2015 by enthus-pro

[Packerbrewerbadger]

I didn't think they had to give us the audience's per cent, they could have just said who had more votes, felt bad for Tamar.

If they had no problem doing that, why don't they give us the real bottom 2!

[TiredMe]

I really wish they hadn't have shown bindis feet. I was eating dinner. Eww

I will miss Andy. He completely charmed me this season and yay to going out on the worm!

I really hope Alek goes next. He's just not good and I'm not enjoying his dances. But I honestly think it will be Tamar. Like many others, I just don't connect with her dancing.

But really, I don't see any stellar standouts this season. I guess Bindi maybe followed by Nick. I guess I just don't care. That hasn't happened in a long time.

[dirtydi]

I really liked Andy, knew he was going home (like someone else said) just by the judge's comments. Alek and Tamar have to go next.  I see no joy or improvement in them anymore.   I hated that they has the Samba in there for the dance off.  I think it should be what all of the dancers have had. Who did Samba already, this year?

[Andie1]

duplicate post

Edited November 4, 2015 by Andie1

[Andie1]

I didn't think they had to give us the audience's per cent, they could have just said who had more votes, felt bad for Tamar.

If they had no problem doing that, why don't they give us the real bottom 2!

Yes it's pathetic that the hate on this woman is so palatable. She's a contestant, but the hate is like she's some sort of demon. She has an attitude? That's just a dog whistle for the pile on.  I remember Rumer Willis was easily forgiven for "not having any competition" since she preached confidence because she was bullied, and yet Tamar has to get a relentless beat down for being confident. So the message is, be confident, just don't be black and confident, you need to cowtow, because even if you dance well a stumbler will be better liked..then when you're not so confident, knowing so many hate you, you're easier to kick off. Of course Tamar loves to dance, the way her body moves is all about loving dance.  It's painful to watch non dancers constantly stumble over themselves, hesitate and dance with no rhythm but hey they got that great "attitude"!  Ugh, frankly it's intolerant and highly embarrassing to witness how the show and its audience treat Tamar so differently.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Andie1

[sinkwriter]

 

Of course Tamar loves to dance, the way her body moves is all about loving dance.

 

That has not been my experience watching Tamar dance. I see a woman who is very good at dancing, but doesn't seem to have much joy in doing it. She doesn't express much of anything emotionally.

 

In fact, this week was the first time I felt Tamar showing any sort of vulnerability, when she said sometimes she comes in with the tiniest shred of self-confidence. She doesn't show that to us. Which could be admirable, I suppose, because maybe it shows she's potentially capable of keeping cool under even the toughest of circumstances. But at the same time when she's not willing -- or able? -- to show any vulnerability (in her dancing or outside of the dance floor), she makes it very difficult to relate to or connect to her. I didn't love that comment from Rumer back when she said it either, but she managed to share things about herself, she showed emotion and vulnerability at times, and she did show love of dancing. At times she seemed to be having such a great time. I don't see that in Tamar from week to week. From day 1, she's presented herself a very specific way (strong, reserved, separate). She does the work unfailingly each week, but she doesn't seem to be there for fun.

 

Overall I don't watch her and think, that is a woman who is having a great time and loves to dance. The only time I felt it watching her was with the Charleston. The rest of the time, her face tends to be immovable. 

 

Sometimes I wonder why she agreed to be part of the competition in the first place. 

Edited November 4, 2015 by sinkwriter

[kitcloudkicker]

I am glad that Nick's story was so overwhelmingly compelling to the jidges this week that they did not reward Bindi's obvious missteps.  That "star effect" with the other dancers?  she utterly messed it up.  Really bad.  Enough to drop her to an 8, bad.

 

I watched this again because I've seen this comment come up a few times, and they weren't making a star, they were making alternating triangles. They should have been every other person with their pulled in, with the others meeting their toes to make a triangle, and switching off. Here's a gif: 

 

 

It's definitely not as crisp as it could have been. (All around really, not just Bindi. Sasha's a little too far back and they all get in each other's way a tad.) But it looks to me like Bindi is doing what she's supposed to be doing - she's matching her movements to what the alternating troupe members (Haley and Alan?) are doing. 

Edited November 4, 2015 by kitcloudkicker

[Andie1]

That has not been my experience watching Tamar dance. I see a woman who is very good at dancing, but doesn't seem to have much joy in doing it. She doesn't express much of anything emotionally.

 

In fact, this week was the first time I felt Tamar showing any sort of vulnerability, when she said sometimes she comes in with the tiniest shred of self-confidence. She doesn't show that to us. Which could be admirable, I suppose, because maybe it shows she's potentially capable of keeping cool under even the toughest of circumstances. But at the same time when she's not willing -- or able? -- to show any vulnerability (in her dancing or outside of the dance floor), she makes it very difficult to relate to or connect to her. I didn't love that comment from Rumer back when she said it either, but she managed to share things about herself, she showed emotion and vulnerability at times, and she did show love of dancing. At times she seemed to be having such a great time. I don't see that in Tamar from week to week. From day 1, she's presented herself a very specific way (strong, reserved, separate). She does the work unfailingly each week, but she doesn't seem to be there for fun.

 

Overall I don't watch her and think, that is a woman who is having a great time and loves to dance. The only time I felt it watching her was with the Charleston. The rest of the time, her face tends to be immovable. 

 

Sometimes I wonder why she agreed to be part of the competition in the first place. 

 

Oh Christ.  So if Tamar talked about her being abused that would be good fodder and make her relatable?  I really don't care about people's "sharing"  I care about their dancing.  And it's a shame that people didn't see how great that QS was week 1, because it was underscored, or how lovely that Foxtrot was and didn't have any out of sync moments that the judges want you to believe, or how Rhythm Nation was a pretty great tribute, or how good that Paso was.  It doesn't go with the narrative.  When I look back on season's past and I see how great the black women were - the narrative is the same, they're not "connecting" with the audience, which is simply code. I liked Emmitt Smith, but damn that dancing from Monique Coleman was stellar and the best ballroom of the competition. It was absolutely almost eerie the comments Carrie Ann was grasping at to beat down Monique.I watched it back and I thought, man, how could I be so gullible to listen to Carrie Ann? This girl could dance beautifully. 

Leila Ali was underscored, Mya was worlds better than that jackass Osmond, but everyone has a story about their "favorite" and it's not the black girl, regardless of how she dances. This show has been down this road 21 seasons, and the only black woman they gave the trophy to was one who could hardly move, because she was so "relatable"   I am not surprised at how Tamar is being portrayed. She is dancing great, and isn't getting the respect, just like the ladies before her.  This show is a hunk of bullshit. 

I watched this again because I've seen this comment come up a few times, and they weren't making a star, they were making alternating triangles. They should have been every other person with their pulled in, with the others meeting their toes to make a triangle, and switching off. Here's a gif: 

 

 

It's definitely not as crisp as it could have been. (All around really, not just Bindi. Sasha's a little too far back and they all get in each other's way a tad.) But it looks to me like Bindi is doing what she's supposed to be doing - she's matching her movements to what the alternating troupe members (Haley and Alan?) are doing. 

This is the first I saw this. How ugly and unimaginative.  Where did Derek get this crap? The Rockettes?  

[sinkwriter]

 

Oh Christ.  So if Tamar talked about her being abused that would be good fodder and make her relatable?  I really don't care about people's "sharing"  I care about their dancing.

 

That's not what I said at all. 

I care about the dancing too. That's why I'm not enjoying most of Tamar's performances. It's not just about technical movement; if it was, Tamar would have this competition sewn up. It's also about heart and connection to the music and to the dance itself, and I don't feel joy in Tamar's movement. She dances well, she doesn't dance like she's having any fun or showing any emotional connection to what she's doing. And that is about the dance, not about her personal story.

[Andie1]

Well agree to disagree, since I saw a lot of joy on the Quickstep, the Charleston, Rhythm Nation, the Foxtrot, the Paso and especially the Cha Cha dance off, I really loved how she moved.  Now the Rumba was more personal and emotional and I saw that in her -- and the Tango was more intense, and I saw that as well. I don't subscribe to what people are piling on her, since that's something manufactured by Carrie Ann. 

 

The movement especially on the Cha Cha dance off was from the soul. Most of the others are soul less, their dancing lacks this big time.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Andie1

[crowceilidh]

I'd like your post, sinkwriter, but the reputation vote function seems to be malfunctioning.  

 

I don't disagree with the idea that Tamar is getting a horrible edit, but I think that has more to do with Tamar the person than Tamar the black woman.  That's just my feeling (not coming from any expertise) - I agree that she has never seems or has seemed happy to be on the show; she seems to be repulsed by Val; and, she seems to disassociate when she dances.  But I'm a white person, so maybe I'm just not seeing something because of my own naivete/privilege (<--this statement sounds sarcastic but it is not).  I've found her fundamentally dislikeable since the getgo, but that is also true of Alexa who seems like a neurotic idiot and Bindi who seems like the tragic victim of a showbiz mum.  I like Tamar marginally better than either of those, but I just can't sympathize with someone who is repulsed by Val.  It's outside of my ability to imagine.  

 

I have never disliked a whole cast so much as I do this one.  I had 2 shows of liking Alek and I'm done with him now.  I like Tom and I like watching all the pros in the pro numbers and that is it.  Everything else is dire and mostly unwatchable.  Everything seems "off" somehow. I seem to be watching out of habit rather than for fun.

[Andie1]

I don't think Tamar is repulsed by Val in the least.  She may not be used to dancing intimately with someone not her husband, but that certainly doesn't say she hates Val. But I don't watch the show - at least in real time, I pick what I want to watch on youtube.  I avoid most of it, the overt pimping and bullshit against anything Tamar says just pisses me off.

Edited November 4, 2015 by Andie1

[TeeMo]

We could go around and around about Tamar all day and never come to an agreement. I will say again that my lack of interest in Tamar has nothing to do with the shitty edit she is getting or the judges' opinion of her. I have watched this show long enough to not be manipulated by the games played by the likes of Carrie Ann Inaba. I really wanted to like Tamar. I like Val and am predisposed to root for his partners as a result. I was excited for this pairing before the season started because I expected them to have a fun, back and forth dynamic with no showmancing possibilities.

I loved Tamar's dance in week 1 and I was excited for what the season would hold with her but other than the Charleston, I've been underwhelmed the rest of the time. In lots of ways she reminds me of Elizabeth Berkley who was a pretty fabulous dancer that I couldn't seem to muster up any excitement for.

Yes there is a whole lot of manipulation on this show and plenty of people buy into whatever narrative the judges throw out there but not liking Tamar doesn't automatically make someone a dope who can't see past the show's agenda. I see the narrative they are spinning for Tamar and I think it sucks. Truly. But I still don't really care about her dancing. I don't feel compelled to go back and rewatch her dances. I often don't remember her dances from week to week. To be fair, there really isn't anyone I DO care about this season. As a previous poster mentioned, this is a pretty mediocre season for me and I honestly don't care how it all shakes out in the end. No one is blowing me away and no one is really stinking out the joint either. I could see an argument for almost any one of the remaining contestants walking away with the mirror ball (except maybe Alek).

But even if the judges were giving Tamar the Bindi treatment and jumping out of their seats in delight after every dance, I still would not be compelled to pick up my phone and vote for her. I don't dislike her at all but I don't like her enough to be bothered. And that has nothing to do with her terrible edit, her relationship with Val, the BS spun by the judges, whether or not she walks the press line or any of that stuff. I just don't care all that much about her dancing regardless of her very good technique. And that doesn't make me blind or stupid or easily manipulated by Rob Wade's shenanigans. This is a reality show couched in the premise of a dance competition, not an actual ballroom dancing competiton decided solely on skill and ability and everyone is allowed to have their own preferences about who strikes their fancy. It's not that serious.

[Andie1]

No it can't be serious. God I hope not, because the terrible time Tamar is enduring is intolerant bullshit. No wonder people don't like this season.

Elizabeth Berkley was a lovely dancer but people got all up in her grill about her " weird eyes." And the fucking minutia about how her eyes must be a problem and "I can't watch her because of it..." I mean, that's how damn petty the people are who watch this show. It didn't matter you had an even better dancer in Corbin on the show, he was a guy, so he wasn't beat on like Elizabeth. Amber got an awful lot of praise for doing next to nothing.

But it seems when there's a popular female dancer on the show, the object of the game is to beat on the better female dancer until they're gone, preferably before the semi-finals so the popular female has no female competition. The few exceptions are when you have a really young girl competing or a disabled girl or something where yeah, you can't really get nasty with the comments, so all of a sudden they're finalists. All you can muse is their dancing isn't mature enough, or creative choreography around a disability isn't really dancing.

Nastia was an excellent dancer, there was a little disconnect with Derek early on, but the cold narrative got old and relentless. It was like, wow the woman deserves the high score because she earned it. People can make up their own minds who they prefer, but Nastia and Elizabeth were treated pretty well compared to Tamar.

Not only does she gets low scores, she gets to watch while the show says 75% of the audience can't stand you. So that 25% that supports her has to be crazy!! If you had an inkling that you didn't like her well now you got company, isn't that grand?

Confident woman? Pfst, you're no Rumer who said she had no competition, you're an uppity black girl who should know her place.

Where the hell is the show that says "we can't reveal the vote because it would be hurtful to the contestant" ha, it doesn't matter, it's only Tamar, she has no feelings, see she doesn't cry on cue, or is all cheery all the time to make me feel good, so it's okay to kill her.

This is ugly and has nothing to do with dancing, but has everything to do with exploiting a "mean girls" juvenile mentality in supposedly a mature mostly female audience. I don't watch Real Housewives, and all that crazy, I watch for dance. It's why I can only watch some of the dancing on youtube. ABC has made millions revealing the pettiness of some people. You only have to watch the Bachelor and all of that spawn to see the sludge. The rest of it is just vomit inducing for any rational thinking person.

I love watching a good dancer like Tamar, and I'm not even black! But the entire show has stacked the odds against her from the beginning. I knew from early on she'd be toast, I thought a lot earlier. So congrats to the people who tried to keep her in. For me, there's no other reason to watch except for good dancing. The reality show aspect has always been the weakest part of this and now it's taken over far too much to be enjoyable.

[exodia]

I have my doubts as to what shade of "natural" blonde this woman is.  She may be dishwater or something.  Her choice of garish hair color is horrible IMO and it is distracting.  Whatever colorist did that to her should never work again.

 

She flat out admitted it's on purpose. She's a natural blonde (which still surprises me, can't picture her as a blonde) and she said there's enough blondes on this show.

 

You can see a see a very quick shot of her natural hair colour in her video in the 'Hometowns' group number:

 

[boyznkatz]

I really wish they hadn't have shown bindis feet. I was eating dinner. Eww

I will miss Andy. He completely charmed me this season and yay to going out on the worm!

I really hope Alek goes next. He's just not good and I'm not enjoying his dances. But I honestly think it will be Tamar. Like many others, I just don't connect with her dancing.

 

I really don't know why they showed Bindi's gnarly feet. Eww. They might have been trying to garner sympathy for her, but that was just gross.

 

As for Alek, I'm really starting to dislike him. He is a horrible dancer and should appreciate his gifts from the judges instead of criticizing them. They are the ones keeping him in the competition. At least Andy had a pleasant attitude and tried hard. Alek just sways around while his partner dances circles around him. The wrong person went home.

[skyways]

Yes I don't know what people mean when they say 'bad attitude'. This is not on the level of Gossellin or Ne-Ne. She doesn't walk out on her pros or throw off her Mic as I've seen many both pros and celebs do on national tv. I just don't get it. The same used to be said of Mya and I was ??? eh? where?

Do you relate to someone only when they talk nonstop about their struggles, their challenges etcetc? Because personally I find it embarrassing (for them especially). I can respect any as long as they don't show me any of the above. That's bad behavior.

[Bella]

Folks, let's stay on topic.

 

That means discussing the current episode and taking other discussions to their appropriate threads. 

 

Thanks.

[Fliz]

I think this is the first week that I have not re-watched any of the dances, and I almost always watch Val twice. I don't hate Tamar, but I don't like her either, and it has nothing to do with her skin color. She's a fine dancer from the neck down, but for my admittedly shallow viewing purposes, Val may as well be dancing with a mannequin.

[radishcake]

Guys if you have made the same point over and over in all the threads available to you, you can safely know that we got it. You are now beating the proverbial dead horse. Continuing in this vein is going be fruitless.

If you haven't read over the ignore thread now would be a good time to do that.

[spanana]

Nevermind.

Edited November 4, 2015 by spanana

[ari333]

I watched Bindi and Derek twice. It was more like a production number than a couple dance, but I liked it. Bindi's foot looked horrible and I cant imagine losing toenails...nails dropping off etc. Im not sure I needed to see that.

 

Sorry to see Andy go. Glad to see Allison go. Sheesh.

 

Tamar seems like she doesn't enjoy being there, but since she's there she is sticking it out, enduring. tolerating, or riding it out or however I should say it. There is (imo too) no joy, as mentioned above.

 

Im on the tired-of-Mandy-Moore-train too. The opening was kind of blah and meh for me... when it should be WOW! and has been in the past. (for me) when others do the choreography. *sigh* Why is Mandy there? Does she have indelicate photos of TPTB compromising a goat? :)

[truthaboutluv]

A reality show that is disguised as a dance competition, but I don't really understand why after 10 years there is this outrage when the best technical dancers don't always win.

 

 

Amazing isn't it? I mean would a real ballroom competition pit a 60+ year old against a 21 year old? Or hell have underage kids competing against adults? Of course not. More importantly, a real dance competition wouldn't have non-dancers competing. This is a reality show that doesn't even require actual dancers and some are expecting that technical perfection and the best technical dancer will win? This when you have shows like American Idol that supposedly had actual singers and the best one didn't always win or So You Think You Can Dance which has actual dancers and the best doesn't always win. With SYTYCD, eventually the producers just gave up the ghost and just started saying it's America's Favorite Dancer, not best. 

 

This is also the reason I get annoyed with people like Louis and even Tony to an extent. Because I feel like they have always had this attitude of how accomplished they are in the ballroom world and it's almost an insult that they are to be critiqued by someone like Carrie Ann Inaba and lose to people who aren't sticking to the technical purity of the dance. And don't get me wrong, I don't think the show should ignore the rules of ballroom and goodness knows I've complained about Mandy Moore's watered down crap and Alison's presence enough. But at the end of the day this is an entertainment show where the vast majority of the viewers are looking to be wowed and dazzled. And most will not know technical ballroom terms and will simply like who they like and vote for them. 

 

I mean people love Alek and I personally think he's gone as far as he can and he's pretty average at this point. Doesn't mean he won't outlast some who may be better technical dancers because if people like him they will vote for him and that's the show. It's why I didn't even care last season when Noah outlasted Nastia. Was it ridiculous in terms of dance ability, of course but doesn't mean it was surprising or unexpected in the least. And it wasn't new for this show. So I guess my point is if this is something that truly bothers a person then probably best to just not watch the show. As I've said, this show is way too silly for anyone to get truly pressed or upset about, imo.

Edited November 4, 2015 by truthaboutluv

[realdancemom]

I watched this again because I've seen this comment come up a few times, and they weren't making a star, they were making alternating triangles. They should have been every other person with their pulled in, with the others meeting their toes to make a triangle, and switching off. Here's a gif: 

 

 

It's definitely not as crisp as it could have been. (All around really, not just Bindi. Sasha's a little too far back and they all get in each other's way a tad.) But it looks to me like Bindi is doing what she's supposed to be doing - she's matching her movements to what the alternating troupe members (Haley and Alan?) are doing. 

This is just showing two counts that keeps repeating.  Bindi was mostly off timing at the beginning but then her timing was o.k.  However, synchronized does not just mean timing issues.  Bindi is too far in.  That is why her feet don't connect properly with the other two and the person to the left of her has to cut his movement short but they still end up hitting each other.  The person to the right of her has to really go out to avoid hitting her.  In contrast, notice how perfect the other three are when connecting together.

 

I don't like this move but I can understand why Derek put it in the dance.  It was a musical number and I think he was trying to mimic synchronized swimming.  A lot of the old musicals used to have these type of scenes.

[ari333]

This is just showing two counts that keeps repeating.  Bindi was mostly off timing at the beginning but then her timing was o.k.  However, synchronized does not just mean timing issues.  Bindi is too far in.  That is why her feet don't connect properly with the other two and the person to the left of her has to cut his movement short but they still end up hitting each other.  The person to the right of her has to really go out to avoid hitting her.  In contrast, notice how perfect the other three are when connecting together.

 

I don't like this move but I can understand why Derek put it in the dance.  It was a musical number and I think he was trying to mimic synchronized swimming.  A lot of the old musicals used to have these type of scenes.

 

It looked like Bindi was lifting her legs straight and the others were bending their knees into their chests. IDK if she blew it or that is how it was supposed to be? 

Bindi seemed too far in, as mentioned, and Artem (?) seemed too far out. It was kind of a mess imo.

Bindi was kind of a half count or count ahead of the other pair with whom she was supposed to be in sync. It looked that way to me

I don't love Carlos personally, but I do love salsa. Actually I will enjoy salsa in any way I can get it on this show. Unless someone destroys it, I will probably love it. And Witney has totally grown on me to the point where I am a fan now.

Edited November 4, 2015 by ari333

[sinkwriter]

 

Im on the tired-of-Mandy-Moore-train too. The opening was kind of blah and meh for me... when it should be WOW! and has been in the past. (for me) when others do the choreography. *sigh* Why is Mandy there? Does she have indelicate photos of TPTB compromising a goat? :)

 

Yeah, when I find myself skipping the openers and anything performed when they're coming back from commercial, if I'm skipping watching the pros because the choreography is boring and one-note, maybe it's time to shake things up!

[Alapaki]

I mean people love Alek and I personally think he's gone as far as he can and he's pretty average at this point. Doesn't mean he won't outlast some who may be better technical dancers because if people like him they will vote for him and that's the show. It's why I didn't even care last season when Noah outlasted Nastia. Was it ridiculous in terms of dance ability, of course but doesn't mean it was surprising or unexpected in the least. And it wasn't new for this show.

 

 

I'm kind of surprised that Tom brought up the fact that, especially during these weeks with maudlin themes (or any week for contestants with certain types of backstories) the backstory directly impacts the voting.  Especially because it seems to me that the scores the Judges have been giving Alek are not as overtly in-congruent with ability/performance as they were for Noah last year.

[spanana]

It's not even just the choreography in the opening numbers IMO.  I get since there is no longer a results show there really is no time to showcase other non DWTS ballroom dancers, but part of my problem with these dances is that our DWTS dancers these days are so same-y.   So it's not just that all the choreography looks the same, but we've got a ballroom full of latin dancers and/or crosstrained Utah dancers.  Basically we only get some sort of mishmash of jazz and latin numbers, and if we do get anything standard it's usually not done by anyone who excels at that type of dancing.  Heck, now the troupe is hiring non ballroom dancers.  I'd trade in the entire troupe for a little variety on this show.  Even the DWTS tour, at least from the videos I've seen, is downright boring and mostly a contemp/jazz/latin fest.

Edited November 4, 2015 by spanana

[Andie1]

Agreed. That's why I like the old youtubes of Jonathan and Anna, just to get some variety. I mean, how often does Foxtrot have to be a "broadway" number? Doesn't anyone dance Standard anymore?  It's by far my favorite.  At least Rumer's favorites seemed to be more standard light, so I'll take it.  But how much better would she be with a Standard pro?  Gosh, if she had a few lessons with Jonathan, or international standard star Luca Bracchi who was on the show briefly one season I think to help out with a standard tango, a whole world could be open to her.  The Quicksteps on this show are...not great, maybe one was pretty great that was Louis and Sabrina Bryan on the all stars, but the rest like the ones Derek does you could drive a mac truck between the dancers,in hold, and that's simply incorrect. They have just thrown out the rules all together, because frankly latin dancers find it tough to do well.  But I never expected Jonathan to be a samba king either.  

Edited November 4, 2015 by Andie1

[Lone Wolf]

I hope Tom was taking a shot at Ricky Martin when he said that he wished that he could pull off that sunglasses-indoors look.  That's about the douchiest look going and one of my top pet peeves.