S06.E02: JSS

[Boofish]

I was really taken aback at first that Carl didn't shoot him immediately. I had even told my husband after last weeks preview that my money is on Carl - noone is getting in that house or anywhere near the baby with Carl on the job! Hesitating and possibly sympathetic didn't seem like the Carl I've come to know/expect. However, after the re-watch, I think it was because of Enid. 

 

They had just had their little chat in the house, with him saying something like '"they all have to die" and Enid was all "Why? they are just people".  When he was facing off with the wounded wolf on the ground, Carl took his eyes off him momentarily to glance at Enid (which is what enabled the guy to get a hold of him). Then of course he had no choice, it was an up close & personal life or death situation. I think he had temporarily let his guard down because of Enid in the same way Daryl did back at the mortuary house because of Beth. They were both letting someone else's rose-colored glasses temper their natural tendencies. 

 

It makes me think of Rick wanting to shoot Jesse's husband but not doing so until Deanne gave him permission. Which in turn makes me think of Willard in Footloose not beating the crap out of the guys outside the dance until his gal Rusty gave him permission.  Not sure where I am going with this other than it all seems to tie together. Whether it's for political or strategic or romantic reasons, a man's innate instinct is often tempered by a woman. 

 

So I think yeah, it was because of Enid that Carl didn't blow the guy away right off. 

 

 

He shot Morgan, too. Morgan didn't end up dying but Carl was shooting to kill when he shot him. I wonder if Morgan knows that?

Yes he does because Carl apologized and Morgan said "don't ever be sorry"

[morgankobi]

Just had a thought about JSS.

Every time Enid writes it, she has made an active decision she doesn't seem to like, but considers necessary to her survival:

-The note to Carl-she doesn't want to leave him

-Written in dirt on her hand- she doesn't want to go to ASZ, she even turns around at first

-Bones of the turtle- she probably didn't want to eat raw turtle (just guessing)

-In the car after stabbing the zombie on the ground in the head- never fun

So why does she write it the first time we see it after he parents are killed? What was her decision that time? ...Perhaps she locked them out so she herself could survive!

 

OK, I doubt that is it, but girl is definitely off and likely not a wolf.

[RainOnToosdays]

Quite a few of the wolves were women. I thought that a point was being made by that, they weren't just a marauding gang, like Randall or Joe's people but that they were a community of some sort, maybe they have a fixed base, maybe they move about a territory. Calling themselves Wolves has a suggestion of a nomadic lifestyle to me.

 

The first She-Wolf I remember seeing was the one who Jesse encountered. And it hit me like the proverbial ton of bricks that unlike her male counterparts who were out not just to kill but to to over-kill in the most grisly way possible, she did not attempt to kill Jesse and make mincemeat out of her, she was satisfied to leave her just unconscious (though I am sure Jesse was faking it). Then I think Carol tangoed with a She-Wolf, the second and only other one I noticed. And it seemed to me that unlike their male counter parts both were unarmed? Does that say something about the Wolfpack's ethos? or about women in general? or about this viewer not noticing everything? (Maybe they were armed and I just didn't notice their weapon?)

 

 

 

 

 

 

[CletusMusashi]

Right. And there was the time she got her knife stuck in the walker's head, when going out to fix the water hose, and Rick had to come save her. Carol definitely isn't untouchable. But I do think she's very clever and has realized she needs to be more stealth and think things through, because strength is not her strong suit. She has a great learning curve. She realized "camo", of various sorts, works well and so she uses it again. 

 

 

Thanks for everyone who confirmed the smoking lady IS Mrs. Niedermeyer. Or was. Can we please get an actual cute, old lady in this community then??? 

Please recast Deanna with Bettie White.

[Yolapukka]

The first She-Wolf I remember seeing was the one who Jesse encountered. And it hit me like the proverbial ton of bricks that unlike her male counterparts who were out not just to kill but to to over-kill in the most grisly way possible, she did not attempt to kill Jesse and make mincemeat out of her, she was satisfied to leave her just unconscious (though I am sure Jesse was faking it). Then I think Carol tangoed with a She-Wolf, the second and only other one I noticed. And it seemed to me that unlike their male counter parts both were unarmed? Does that say something about the Wolfpack's ethos? or about women in general? or about this viewer not noticing everything? (Maybe they were armed and I just didn't notice their weapon?)

 

 

I thought the woman who Jessie took out simply had her guard down and turned her back to retrieve her knife, the one she'd tried to stab Jessie with before they struggled. I'm not sure about the gender of the two people walking in front of the townhomes who Carol shot. The other two coming down the steps included the woman Carol tangled with in the armoury, she had chased her down after Carol ran out of ammo and I thought she was armed with a blade as well. At least two of the people who surrounded and attacked Morgan looked like women to me.

[Caelicola]

Tyrese was a selfish liar and the Termites would have never come to that church calling out CDB by name if he had just told any one of them that he beat up the guy but did not kill him.

Yeah, and they would still be alive, out in the world killing and eating people, so in my book it ended up being a positive thing after all.

[RustbeltWriter]

Father Gabriel has me intrigued. He has admitted he was wrong, that he was describing himself and not Rick's group. He didn't hide when the Wolves attacked and he accepted the gun from Morgan. He has explicitly asked to help at least twice. I really think there is some hope for him and I wonder if the show will give him the chance to grow.

[Timetoread]

Yeah, and they would still be alive, out in the world killing and eating people, so in my book it ended up being a positive thing after all.

 

No actually they would have all been dead if he told Rick what went down with Judith.  Rick would have killed that dude and gone after the rest.  Hell, Carl would have! 

[Anela]

The way I see it: Carol and Morgan balance each other out, the way we all do with the people in our lives. They both have something to learn from each other, and they will have each other's backs, even as they disagree vehemently on how they should go about that. 

 

I don't think they show Morgan as weak, at all, and I love Carol knowing what to do - she's really learned from the people around her (and I'm not a member of the AARP! ;) ). Morgan was the one to suspect something was up at the main house, where he found the last Wolf. He was smart - and he made sure to check things out, to continue protecting what was left of his new extended family. 

Edited October 19, 2015 by Anela

[Caelicola]

No actually they would have all been dead if he told Rick what went down with Judith.  Rick would have killed that dude and gone after the rest.  Hell, Carl would have! 

Oh, gum-chewing douche (I can't remember his name! Gareth was the other one, what was his name?! I keep thinking Nicholas, but that's Alexandria's resident douchebag) would have been dead at least five times over (I imagine Rick, Coral, Michonne, Daryl and Carol), but going after the other termites had already been nixed by the rest of the group for very pragmatic reasons (mainly, that's a dumb plan, Rick, they could be anywhere, how in the eff do you propose we find them?), so I don't see them launching an assault not knowing who made it out and where they went. No one died in the attack on the church, they just got spooked, and they got a nice little pack of cannibals delivered directly to their door neatly sidestepping the issue of having to find them. Bob was toast anyway, so win-win. In the grand scheme of things, Tyreese's lie didn't really affect anything at all, just Tyreese's conscience.

 

ETA: MARTIN! Got it!

Edited October 19, 2015 by Caelicola

[Morrigan2575]

The first She-Wolf I remember seeing was the one who Jesse encountered. And it hit me like the proverbial ton of bricks that unlike her male counterparts who were out not just to kill but to to over-kill in the most grisly way possible, she did not attempt to kill Jesse and make mincemeat out of her, she was satisfied to leave her just unconscious (though I am sure Jesse was faking it). Then I think Carol tangoed with a She-Wolf, the second and only other one I noticed. And it seemed to me that unlike their male counter parts both were unarmed? Does that say something about the Wolfpack's ethos? or about women in general? or about this viewer not noticing everything? (Maybe they were armed and I just didn't notice their weapon?)

  

I thought the woman who Jessie took out simply had her guard down and turned her back to retrieve her knife, the one she'd tried to stab Jessie with before they struggled. I'm not sure about the gender of the two people walking in front of the townhomes who Carol shot. The other two coming down the steps included the woman Carol tangled with in the armoury, she had chased her down after Carol ran out of ammo and I thought she was armed with a blade as well. At least two of the people who surrounded and attacked Morgan looked like women to me.

I could be wrong but I think the she-wolf went to pick up Jessie's gun to finish the kill. I don't think she wasn't as into killing as the males, merely going for a weapon to finish the job.

[Timetoread]

Oh, gum-chewing douche (I can't remember his name! Gareth was the other one, what was his name?! I keep thinking Nicholas, but that's Alexandria's resident douchebag) would have been dead at least five times over (I imagine Rick, Coral, Michonne, Daryl and Carol), but going after the other termites had already been nixed by the rest of the group for very pragmatic reasons (mainly, that's a dumb plan, Rick, they could be anywhere, how in the eff do you propose we find them?), so I don't see them launching an assault not knowing who made it out and where they went. No one died in the attack on the church, they just got spooked, and they got a nice little pack of cannibals delivered directly to their door neatly sidestepping the issue of having to find them. Bob was toast anyway, so win-win. In the grand scheme of things, Tyreese's lie didn't really affect anything at all, just Tyreese's conscience.

 

ETA: MARTIN! Got it!

 

I guess that makes Tyrese the hero.  We should all follow his example - lie about how we handle a situation so that a BIGGER situation is instigated, which will later be resolved, because of course CDB will show up in the nick of time to kill the cannibals that came to eat the children.  Lying is good and Bob didn't need that leg much longer anyway.  Yay Tyrese!  ;P

[RainOnToosdays]

I was disappointed with last week's episode (after the season opener that featured the horror of Terminus and the ensuing escape I have high expectations for premieres) but last night's episode rocked. It should have been the opener but I understand they had to set things up to explain why most of CDB was not there. 

 

I too thought at first that Carol was entering into Crazy Town and hallucinating (or fantasizing) when we saw Smoking Lady get slaughtered. Wow! I am totally not a fan of the horror genre but that was just genius. To do something like that, in broad daylight, after showing Susy Homemaker making a dish and checking the baby monitor, with no ominous music to prepare us... totally unexpected and surreal. Which made it downright terrifying. Likewise, something about the scene with the wolf chasing Ron was seriously frightening. I don't have a DVR so will have to wait for an opportunity to re-watch on TV but it seemed to me that for a moment before Ron took off running from behind the tree, everything was still and there was not even any audio. Game set match. I sure won't mind if Ron dies but darn that shot had impact. 

 

The opening scenes of Enid's backstory - all I could think was darn, what a little Dixon. Surely she is Daryl & Merle's long-lost little sister. 

 

I never understood all the Morgan-love for a character we only saw twice before they brought him back in bits and pieces last season but I am definitely not liking him now. I too thought he was going to be shot by the girl Carol left to guard the armory and then would have to be treated by the not-really-a-doctor-doctor. I am wondering if the gun Carol gave him is what is in the bag he had with him on his apparent exit from Alexandria. 

 

I know Deanne is supposed to be all stressed and grieving but what is up with her look? They had her looking like death twice over, all drawn and sunken and skeletal in the face. Ack.

 

Jesse using little hair-cutting scissors to dispatch the She-Wolf made me laugh out loud. Beth anyone? It's not the weapon it's the attitude & context. 

 

I was very happy Carol did not smoke the cigarette at the end.

[Caelicola]

I guess that makes Tyrese the hero.  We should all follow his example - lie about how we handle a situation so that a BIGGER situation is instigated, which will later be resolved, because of course CDB will show up in the nick of time to kill the cannibals that came to eat the children.  Lying is good and Bob didn't need that leg much longer anyway.  Yay Tyrese!  ;P

Well, not the hero, but not the heel either. I just think so many characters made stupid, myopic mistakes that resulted in much more dire consequences that Tyreese's lie is kinda small potatoes. I mean, I could list Rick's dumb ideas and silly plans -some of which borne of cowardice too- but I'd be here until next episode... and Bob still had the other leg! Jeez, what a crybaby.

[nodorothyparker]

None of these people are unequivocal heroes because as Rick has said they've "all done something."  Some are just farther toward one end or the other on the scale of good vs. bad things.

 

It certainly wasn't great that Tyreese lied, and I do think if his moral conflict over killing even in clear self-defense was as bad as it apparently was he had an obligation to let everyone know so he wasn't needlessly risking anyone.  And maybe that's what all the baby carrying was about after Terminus.  But even if Tyreese seemed to want to blame himself for Bob in the Beth sings him into the afterlife episode, I can't do that without also placing some of the blame on Glenn and Maggie and everyone else who balked at wanting to go back and finish the known cannibals that the Termites were.  If Gareth and crew hadn't been left alive to track our gang to the church, it wouldn't have mattered all that much that Martin knew who Judith was.

[kj4ever]

Because he KNOWS that, unlike with his mother, there WILL be consequences if he doesn't listen. Lori would have just whined and asked Dale to find him. 

 

 

 

 

He left two of them tied up in a car, and they ended up coming to ASZ and killing  people. 

 

He "scared" a pack of them away from ASZ, but they are still alive and could easily come back. Or kill Rick and co. out on the road. 

 

In the time he took hog tying that one dude, three more Wolves could have been killed and ASZers could have been spared. 

 

I don't hate Morgan and I can't judge what he's going through, but I think his philosophy should NOT apply to all situations, and this is one where he needs to toss it aside and kill those unfair fuckers. 

 

 

 

 

 

Yea, I think Carol shares a house with Rick and Carl, maybe Michonne as well? I love how she is so cut and dry with Sam, but he keeps coming back. He recognizes that underneath it all, she's a woman who cares. If she didn't, she wouldn't give him all of her sage advice. 

It really, really bothered me when he left those wolves alive last season.  I know that sometimes it takes a lot of courage to go the peaceful route rather then the violent one, but that dude sat there and told him that they actively look for people to "run through".  How could you leave someone like that alive?  In my mind all the blood that was spilled  from those two after he had the opportunity to kill is on his hands too.

 

I wonder if he will tell Rick that he chased some of them off.  Rick will be PISSED.

[Helena Dax]

The difference between Morgan and Carol is the same difference I see between Morgan and Rick/Michonne/Abraham/Daryl... If you're trying to kill them, they will kill you. So I expect more arguments between him and the others, not just Carol.

[Anela]

I also noticed the quiet, in certain scenes, and it had more impact, at least for me. I checked my headphones, when Morgan was walking up that hallway, because I couldn't hear *anything*. 

[What Fresh Hell]

Wow! Just caught up with the last two episodes. Carol is so freaking awesome, just doing what needed to be done. She's been through this with Tyrese, that's probably why she was so dismissive of Morgan. I adore this character so very much. Really like that she finally showed emotion after all the killing, I felt it was needed to show the human part of her still in there somewhere.

I hate that Morgan is like this and wish the writers could have thought of something other than just making him Tyrese 2.0. Why didn't they just keep Tyrese instead? I liked him! The whole idea that he's not going to kill anyone is just stupid in this situation. And letting those dirty murderers just run out of there like he was chasing off a group of feral cats?! Whatever, writers.

I don't care if Spencer is incompetent, he's nice to look at.

Wouldn't Carl look much better with a super short haircut? I bet he ate half of that casserole before everyone got back.

[JenMcSnark]

Just had a thought about JSS.

Every time Enid writes it, she has made an active decision she doesn't seem to like, but considers necessary to her survival:

-The note to Carl-she doesn't want to leave him

-Written in dirt on her hand- she doesn't want to go to ASZ, she even turns around at first

-Bones of the turtle- she probably didn't want to eat raw turtle (just guessing)

-In the car after stabbing the zombie on the ground in the head- never fun

So why does she write it the first time we see it after he parents are killed? What was her decision that time? ...Perhaps she locked them out so she herself could survive!

 

OK, I doubt that is it, but girl is definitely off and likely not a wolf.

 

Thank you!  You just answered what I was taking to be a huge pothole.  I was wondering why Enid's parents wouldn't have just closed the car doors when the walkers were coming!  I mean, I would have, especially if I had my kid with me.  

 

You can hotwire a car with the doors closed.  Just sayin'.

[BananaRama]

Morgan: Killing people BEFORE the Zombie Apocalypse is wrong. Killing people who are KILLING PEOPLE and trying to kill you during the Zombie Apocalypse is the smart thing to do. Killing people whose weaknesses or stupidity may result in getting others killed is a gray area.

I'm sure Morgan is trying to hold onto a piece of his humanity and a semblance of who he was before the apocalypse. He wasn't a killer. His current way of thinking isn't very practical, but I can see where he is coming from.

As far as the folks in Alexandria go: They have been in a safety bubble. It might not be easy for them to go from discussing casseroles one minute to hacking someone to pieces the next minute.

[Macbeth]

Sam and Carol's relationship is evolving.  At least this time she didn't threaten to tie him to a tree and let the zombies get at him.  Baby steps.

[iRarelyWatchTV36]

I totally agree that Christian Serratos (Rosita) is a very attractive woman, either on show or not.  But part of me finds it a bit funny that only on a show like this, can people see a woman be classified as super sexy and hot when she's violently killing people and zombies.

 

And if that's the case, s3B-current Carol is the beauty pageant Queen of the Universe.  Hotter than the sun.

Edited October 19, 2015 by iRarelyWatchTV36

[bosawks]

"Ms. Peletier, you are an honest to goodness hero."

Best quote of the night.

Well that and, "Come around 3. We'll start with the machete."

Love Carl.

[MrsRafaelBarba]

Thank you!  You just answered what I was taking to be a huge pothole.  I was wondering why Enid's parents wouldn't have just closed the car doors when the walkers were coming!  I mean, I would have, especially if I had my kid with me.  

 

You can hotwire a car with the doors closed.  Just sayin'.

The walkers that appeared were some distance away from the car.

When she warned them to hurry up.

It appears two others came from the side and caught Enid's parents off guard.

[Eln5]

Sam and Carol's relationship is evolving.  At least this time she didn't threaten to tie him to a tree and let the zombies get at him.  Baby steps.

The child actor playing Sam is so good at that round eyed horror look. When they were hiding in the closet he had such a look of terror on his face. Between that and the things Carol has said to him I really hope the actor isn't having nightmares in real life.

[candall]

Okay, I'm sticking Rick and Michonne at the peak of The Walking Dead Order of Protection Pyramid and positioning Carol, Darrell and Morgan one-half step down.

 

--Whatever Morgan's current mindset, he works that staff like a mofo and has the skill to be every bit as deadly as Michonne and her katana.  With a stick!  (Later, he might want to consider making one end pointy.)

 

--Likewise, I see Darrell as Rick's equal for badassery, but he also has some issues which make him want to disassociate from other people and always be out on his own, so he's going to be just a smidge less effective than people who are actually on-site.

 

--Carol's a rock star who has overcome x,y,z and earned her place in the upper echelon.  Being a petite AARP'er (snort) is the only thing keeping her half a click below Rick and Michonne.

 

Then, the dependable others--Maggie, Abraham, Rosita, Glen.  (Glen's definitely a force, but he's always so preoccupied with Maggie.)  Carl's almost fully vested.

 

This is obviously just my personal ranking, but I see a pretty decent mix of gender, race, age and good/bad hairdos.

Edited October 19, 2015 by candall

[Casually Observant]

I'm so disappointed in Deanna and her chickenshit son. They need to sit all the way down. They need to let the Rictatorship happen. Because sitting around and looking scared is weak as fuck. I see why the writers decided to have Rick embark on this doomed zombie herding mission. It got almost all the badasses out in the field, leaving the town unprotected. Suspicious timing, I'd say. Enid or someone had to have tipped the Wolves off.

 

What the hell is wrong with the Wolves? Do they really want to be the only 20 people left alive in the US? When does that get fun? Are they like the Westboro Baptist Church? They think it's their mandate from God to cause as many problems as possible for the people left alive? (We all know that if there ever was a real zombie apocalypse the Westboro Church would turn all Wolvesy on us on by the third day.)

 

I am thinking that the Wolves were the original people who were exiled from Alexandria by Deanna and friends before the wall was built. And so, when they found Aaron's backpack with the photos, they could see how Alexandria was thriving without them and had become a sort of fortress and they decided to come back and ruin it and kill all the people who voted them out in the beginning. Remember how the little boy was stamping everyone at the party with the letter "A" for Alexandria?  You even saw a reference to that where there was an  "A" stamped on the white post in front of a house. So the Wolves adopted the same letter stamping idea by using a "W" to stand for their group.  Also, remember when Carol killed that female Wolf who was trying to take the guns out of the room where they were kept?  How would she know they were there unless she was an original exilee?

 

Aaron lost that backpack in the walker trap in last season's finale. Now that he knows that he's responsible for bringing the Wolves to Alex, does he mope around with a guilty look on his face or does he get pissed off? Let's hope it's the latter.

He is such a kind character. I hope this doesn't break him.

 

They made it clear that she was dizzy doing everyday tasks. She just woke up not too long ago. Fighting a onslaught like this in her condition makes no sense.

She's dizzy from suffering a serious head injury in the previous zombie encounter where they lost Noah.  But, it looked more like she was dizzy from morning sickness!  The first thing I thought when I saw her was, "Man, she must be pregnant!" And, how will they write it into the script since she's supposed to be a lesbian and hasn't been involved with anyone, certainly not a guy.

 

Any ideas why the wolves were butchering? I suggested to Mr. Mya that it was to feed the walkers that they keep, but he thinks they butchered them to eat themselves.

See first comment I made above.  I think they were the original exiled Alexandrians coming back to seek revenge.

 

Deanna hoped in that truck like she was the President and had to be saved at all cost. Ummmm yeah someone needs to be around so they can collect all the guns and teach people to hide in closets. If not you then who? Child hitch a ride on Abrahams short bus go to Pee Pants Baptist Church and have every seat available.

I think it was because she had been in a walking stupor after witnessing her husband's death on top of the recent loss of her son and was in shock and could not have been any help, anyway. But then, it seemed like there was some recognition when she saw one of the dead Wolves and I wondered if she saw it was a previous exiled member and she had the sick realization that all of this was her fault and that she'd be an absolute target if they saw her. Hiding in the cab of the truck would get her out of the way and no one would have to worry about defending her.

 

Very action packed episode!  The wolves are pretty damn vicious - but definitely a cult mentality.  The one captured that was spouting "you're not supposed to be here" makes me think that this group is following some twisted religion to allow the walkers to take over the world and to expedite the deaths of any living souls.

Yes, again, the one captured was only expecting the previous members of Alexandria who exiled him, not the pacifist man who didn't kill him at the campsite when he could have. More reason to believe these Wolves lived here before.

-  So, there was a live driver, in the semi (before it plowed into the wall)?  If so, how did they do that with a walker right there to bite them??  If not, and remote controlled, not sure I can hand-wave that.  Or are they trying to tell me that the driver was live, but killed by Spencer's shooting, and then was reanimated when Spencer got there?  The last makes most sense, but despite the 'door' being stuck, Spencer didn't take that much time to get to the semi and open the cab door, did he??

Yes, there was a live driver that was shot by Spencer, I think, which caused him to veer off and hit the structure which caused the horn to get stuck. The driver must have died and turned by the time they got out of the building and into the truck cab to stop the horn sound.

 

Can you remind why he had the pictures?

Yes, Aaron had taken photos to show prospective people he and his boyfriend found out and about in hopes of enticing them to join the very nice community of Alexandria. Photos show a secure tall fence, nice homes, happy people, etc.

Edited October 19, 2015 by Casually Observant

[riverheightsnancy]

Morgan is in no way a coward, or a punk, and I don't think that was the point of the episode at all; the conflict wasn't between "is too afraid to kill" versus "she's a badass who can teach him to survive", but between "he's been alone all this time and has developed a method that saves both his life and his sanity" versus "she's protecting her group with everything she has, because she knows from experience that it's necessary".

We've seen in last season's finale that Morgan can take care of himself, the problem is that he hasn't had to take care of anybody else for a very long time. Incapacitating and intimidating the enemy away from you works perfectly when you're on your own, not so much if you have kids, babies and Eugene around. He doesn't need to be taught anything from Carol, he just needs to shift his priorities from "every life is sacred" to "the lives of the people I love more so than those of the people who try to kill them", and I hope he sticks around to do so -because I love Lennie James.

I agree. I think that until we see what happened to Morgan and his son after Rick left, we truly will not understand the why or the how Morgan got to this point. Something happened. And it really changed him.   Perhaps he was responsible for his son's death and he realized that it was his fault? Maybe, that is why he has had a change of heart and does not want to kill. Remember, he couldn't kill his Zombie wife either.  Also, the thing with Carol is now she doesn't want to get close to anyone, especially any new children, especially after what happened to Sophia and the 2 girls from the prison. It is too painful for her. I think that she is  traumatized (as they all are) and this is her way of coping.

 

It is unfortunate that the psychiatrist is being portrayed as a complete neurotic though. She could be a source of great help, but she is all caught up in her own inabilities. Its the ZA, get over it! Psychiatrists HAVE the same training as any other doctor (not specialists like surgeons though-the psychiatric training IS the specialty). Even if she did not know how to do surgery or felt at ease, she had to know that this is a hail-Mary and she should have said, I am the authority and the person is too far gone, or I will try, but I don't know if she will make it. Don't waffle! As a person who works in an affiliated field, that depiction of her will annoy if she doesn't try to lean on her training and leave behind her fears. This is an emergency situation, let your emergency room training kick-in! 

 

Regarding Carl's hair. I FLOVE it. I think he is so cute. I was just watching season 1 the other day and Carl has grown so much. He really is a fine little actor. I am impressed how good he is. As a newcomer to the series, you guys are correct. Those early episodes really show the walkers as more cognizant and more energetic. When that walkers busts through the store with the rock and then some climbing fences, it is a damn good thing that the show runners pulled back on that depiction (as terrifying as it was), because I don't think that the humans would have had a chance in hell with walkers like that!  

[JenMcSnark]

The walkers that appeared were some distance away from the car.

When she warned them to hurry up.

It appears two others came from the side and caught Enid's parents off guard.

 

Yeah, I saw that.  But I guess if it were me, knowing that the sound of walkers can bring more walkers, I would have closed the damn doors.  And figured out a way to fight them after that.  

 

I think it's plausible that Enid possibly panicked when the other walkers came around the back and then jumped in and closed the doors.  Possibly she inadvertently knocked and/or locked her parents out in the process.  But that doesn't explain why she would be covered in so much blood when, I think, she was pretty clean before.  

[ghoulina]

The opening scenes of Enid's backstory - all I could think was darn, what a little Dixon. Surely she is Daryl & Merle's long-lost little sister.

 

I got the same vibe from her. When she broke that turtle's neck and started to chow down, I actually said - "Daryl would be proud". They could sure put together a nice squirrel/turtle soup.

 

The child actor playing Sam is so good at that round eyed horror look. When they were hiding in the closet he had such a look of terror on his face. Between that and the things Carol has said to him I really hope the actor isn't having nightmares in real life.

 

I always wonder about that with child actors. There are kids on this show of an age where I wouldn't let my kids WATCH it. But yes, I think that little boy is much better than the one who plays his older brother. I could FEEL Sam's fear in that scene. I was all, "Hold it in, Sam, hold it in!" It looked like he was about to let loose a scream any minute. 

 

See first comment I made above.  I think they were the original exiled Alexandrians coming back to seek revenge.

 

I entertained that thought last season, but now I don't think that's the case at all. There were only around 3 exiles, I believe, and there are a TON of wolves. This looks like a group that has been together for awhile. They were also the ones who destroyed Noah's subdivision. I think they're just some crazy cult that loves causing mayhem and destruction. I bet the people Deanna exiled were killed.

[Chairman Meow]

 "Your dad used to hit you and then he got himself killed.  It happened.  Now it's done.  You live with it or it eats you up." 

 

Bedtime Stories: By Carol

[Casually Observant]

Can someone remind me what the significance of the "A" written on the bannister outside of Carole's house is?  All I can recall is the A on the train car at Terminus.

 

Overall, I liked the episode, but the flashback to Enid's discovery of Alexandria reminded me of this: when Rick & Michonne rolled up on the ASZ, they heard kids playing outside.  On this ep, so did Enid.  Where the hell are those kids?  And what ever happened to that old couple who liked playing with Judith when CDB first arrived?

The "A"  is for Alexandria. It was from the hand stamp the little boy had that he used to stamp everyone's hand at one of the group's dinner parties. a few episodes back.

[lulee]

Morgan's philosophy needs a tweak, but Rick's and Carol's need a complete re-think. Carol is what -- in her fifties? How much longer does her "badassery" window extend to before age, illness, and injury take a toll? 10 years, tops? What then? How long does Rick have?

Might as well put the ol' girl out to pasture before she falls and breaks a hip fighting off a walker or Wolf.

 

10 years from now it may be the same or they may have a stable society. For now, Carol, Rick and most of the rest of them live by Enid's motto of "Just Survive Somehow."

[nodorothyparker]

Every time someone makes an issue of Carol's "advanced age" I feel compelled to point out that Melissa McBride, Lennie James, and Abraham's Michael Cudlitz are in fact all the exact same age.  And that both Andy Lincoln and Norman Reedus are only a few years younger.  

 

Somehow you never see anyone worrying about their possible hernias or failing prostates.

Edited October 20, 2015 by nodorothyparker

[Bad Example]

not so much if you have kids, babies and Eugene around. 

 

<snort>! This is going to be my favorite phrase for a while.

[Dodginblue]

Every time someone makes an issue of Carol's "advanced age" I feel compelled to point out that Melissa McBride, Lennie James, and Abraham's Michael Cudlitz are in fact all the exact same age.  And that both Andy Lincoln and Norman Reedus are only a few years younger.  

 

Somehow you never see anyone worrying about their possible hernias or failing prostates.

 

Carol is the ZA's version of Tina Turner.    

[Nashville]

Armory girl (Olivia?) hiding in the closet in a room full of guns because she didn't know how to use any of them summed up the frustration with how completely inept and unprepared these people are to be surviving this far into the ZA better than another half dozen episodes of Rick rolling around bloody in the street ever could have.

Swear to god. Your armory tender doesn't know how to handle a pistol? Wonder how many people have come close to blowing something off because Olivia doesn't know how to unload or clear the weapons she's collecting off everybody? Because that pretty much implies every weapon in that armory has the potential to be locked and loaded, and safeties may or may not be in play.

I think this is akin to the quislings in the novel World War Z.  A small percentage of people's coping mechanism for an insurmountable enemy (psychologically) is to "become" them.

  

Good thing Carol already took care of Lizzie; she would've fit in with the Wolves just fine.

 

Morgan's philosophy needs a tweak, but Rick's and Carol's need a complete re-think. Carol is what -- in her fifties? How much longer does her "badassery" window extend to before age, illness, and injury take a toll? 10 years, tops? What then? How long does Rick have?

 

  

News flash - fifties ain't that old. I'm older than Carol, and if anyone tries rolling up a walker to me as a present on my next birthday, they'll end up wearing it for a hat - that, or they'll require surgery to remove it from where I'll stow it. ;)

Morgan's refusal to kill should not be seen as a weakness. He will clearly defend himself and his home. For all we know he ended up killing that Wolf at the end. I think he has adopted a philosophy for himself that gives him peace and purpose. That shouldn't be mistaken for him being less than masculine. I find his story fascinating and look forward to seeing more.

I don't think Morgan is weak; I do think, however, he's showing a degree of moral inflexibility, and not in a good way. Morgan's "I don't wanna kill anybody " philosophy was fine when he had only himself to consider, but that's no longer the case; Morgan is part of a community now, and that community's survival considerations - such as killing the band of murderers happily intent upon your extinction, for example, trump his philosophical considerations. Every Wolf Morgan DIDN'T kill may quite possibly have run down the street and killed another ASZhat - how is anybody (including Morgan) okay with that? Suppose Newly-Gun-Toting-Wolf took it into his mind to shoot Maggie or Rosita before leaving? They were out in the thick of it, after all. How much solace do you think Morgan's principles would be for Glenn or Abraham under those circumstances?

Carol doesn't like killing, but she recognizes its occasional necessity for survival; Morgan is halfway there. Morgan needs to either finish that trip PDQ, or get to stepping on down the road before someone else is sacrificed on the altar of his "morality".

[Morrigan2575]

I could be completely wrong but I think what they're highlighting with Carol and Morgan is how they're chosen philosophies are both inherently dangerous.

Carol has chosen the path of protecting herself and those she loves by becoming hard/cold/killer and it's slowly destroying her soul/sanity.

Morgan has chosen to protect himself and those he cares about by using non lethal force/methods. This protects his soul/sanity but leaves his (and others) physical well being in danger.

What needs to happen is a give and take. Morgan needs to accept that there are times when there is no other choice but to kill. Carol needs to learn that killing isn't the go to answer.

I think that was the point of their interaction several times during the episode. The scene where Morgan says "you don't like killing" and the scene at the end when they crossed paths (nice visual). Plus their separate ending scenes, Morgan killing the wolf and Carol smoking the cigarette.

I thought this was an excellent episode for both characters.

Edited October 20, 2015 by Morrigan2575

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

Wolves On Walled Streets
Never mind the herd, Alexandria's got its own horrific attack to deal with first.

[Tracy]

I think a guy was driving the semi truck, it seems to be headed pretty straight and then once Spencer shot it up, it turned into the house next to the fence and crashed. Guy was dead and turned. It seems like it took Spencer a few minutes to get through the door which was caved in. We know humans can turn in just a couple of minutes..such as Shane and Amy. They were both maybe one to two minutes.

[AngelaHunter]

I mean, I could list Rick's dumb ideas and silly plans -some of which borne of cowardice too- but I'd be here until next episode

 

Me too, but one of them would not be deliberately allowing someone to live who had threatened to break a baby's neck, as Tyreese did and then lied about it.

 

What I loved: Pacifist Morgan struggling with the Wolf and tying him up (was he planning to take prisoners? Is there a jail in Alexandria? Can they afford to feed and care for someone who wanted to kill them all?)  - anyway, I loved the way Carol just strolled over and casually shot him in the head. Problem solved.

[iRarelyWatchTV36]

I think a guy was driving the semi truck, it seems to be headed pretty straight and then once Spencer shot it up, it turned into the house next to the fence and crashed. Guy was dead and turned. It seems like it took Spencer a few minutes to get through the door which was caved in. We know humans can turn in just a couple of minutes..such as Shane and Amy. They were both maybe one to two minutes.

 

Correct on Shane turning quickly, but Amy took at least a few hours.  She was attacked just as the sun was setting, died after all the walkers were dealt with, and didn't reanimate until after sunrise the next day.

Edited October 20, 2015 by iRarelyWatchTV36

[mandolin]

Amy took all night to turn as Andrea sat with her, but yeah it can be quick. Shane, TS-19, the guy that got burned in the attack this ep, Terminus butcher in the apron.

[iRarelyWatchTV36]

 "Your dad used to hit you and then he got himself killed.  It happened.  Now it's done.  You live with it or it eats you up."

 

Bedtime Stories: By Carol

 

"Now go to sleep, before you find out that I wasn't kidding about the whole 'tying you to a tree far from here' threat.  Nighty-night, brat, and don't let the bed walkers bite!" - Scarol

[iRarelyWatchTV36]

Re: differing lengths of time for people to turn after their deaths..

 

Has anyone done a little research into it?  The analytical side of my brain can't help but wonder if the time between receiving life-threatening injury(s) and actual death doesn't equate to the length of time between that and reanimation.  IE, Shane died very quickly from Rick's stabbing him, and then he reanimated in just a few moments.  Amy was bitten a couple of times, but didn't die for a little while afterwards, and took hours to reanimate.  I'm trying to remember if there was any kind of time jump between Milton did the "research" on that old guy who died and reanimated, but considering both he and Andrea were still there and didn't seem to have taken a noticeable break between, I'm guessing it wasn't all that long to wait.... *shrugs*

 

Any sense to be made in my rambling thoughts, or am I just grasping at straws?

[catrox14]

Re: differing lengths of time for people to turn after their deaths..

 

Has anyone done a little research into it?  The analytical side of my brain can't help but wonder if the time between receiving life-threatening injury(s) and actual death doesn't equate to the length of time between that and reanimation.  IE, Shane died very quickly from Rick's stabbing him, and then he reanimated in just a few moments.  Amy was bitten a couple of times, but didn't die for a little while afterwards, and took hours to reanimate.  I'm trying to remember if there was any kind of time jump between Milton did the "research" on that old guy who died and reanimated, but considering both he and Andrea were still there and didn't seem to have taken a noticeable break between, I'm guessing it wasn't all that long to wait.... *shrugs*

 

Any sense to be made in my rambling thoughts, or am I just grasping at straws?

 

I think WalkerResurrection Rate is a function of Plotonium.

[Macbeth]

I like that this is a teaching show.  Any object can be used to kill.  Now Beth did not properly use her small scissors when she tried to kill the cop.  Also the cop had a gun.  

 

In this episode, Jessie showed how small scissors can actually be used as a lethal weapon.  

 

I really picture a tv show in TWD world.  A Martha Stewart show on creative ways to kill.  Jessie would host.  Carol could demonstrate.  

[Cheetosandchoc]

Please recast Deanna with Bettie White.

Betty White would be kicking ass beside Carol......or the savage leader of  the unfair wolves.

 

*ETA..I typed king instead of kicking

Edited October 20, 2015 by Cheetosandchoc

[Maverick]

 Betty would have busted a cap in Enid's ass for what she did to that turtle.