Spoilers and Spoiler Speculation: Benchmarking

[TigerLynx]

1 hour ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

I have a feeling that, if April isn't killed off, she'll take Harriet with her wherever she goes.  No, it doesn't make ANY sense that Jackson would let that happen, but doing things that don't make sense is sort of Jackson's MO at the moment and, let's face it, Harriet is an obstacle to the whole "Jaggie" situation that Vernoff so, so, so desperately wants to be a thing.

I stopped watching Grey's regularly when Lexie and Mark were killed off.  I pop back in every now and then, and Grey's reminds me of how ER ended up (another show I stopped watching long before it ended).  A major character would be killed, a catastrophe would happen at the hospital, and a new generic doctor/character would be brought on.

I think it would be foolish for them to kill off April or Arizona.  They aren't my favorite characters, but at least they have defined personality traits.  They aren't interchangeable carbon copies of someone else.

[anna0852]

I think it would depend on why April is taking off. If it's a simple matter of she needs to get out of Seattle and needs a fresh start then Jackson might be okay with her taking Harriet with her depending on where she goes. If it's a matter of she needs intensive therapy or inpatient treatment or is in a place where she needs to focus on herself and and feeling better, then he probably won't. Simply because if she's in that bad of a place, then how can she adequately care for Harriet?

[Shellie]

Is there a season finale date scheduled yet?

[esco1822]

April can go and not let the door hit her but man, I'm going to miss Arizona. She's been one of my favorites since the beginning and I think a huge loss for the show. At the very least, I hope they give her a good and proper send-off. Going to New York would make sense but I'd kind of hate that because it means her bending again after she gave up her custody rights to make Callie happy.  As toxic as their relationship was at the end, I'd be happier if NY meant their reunion and not just co-parenting in the same city. Arizona deserves better than to be forever subjected to the terrible Penny. 

I hope it's just 2 more years left for this show, I've been ready for it to die for a while now.  It's time. Shonda keeps starting new shows and giving them all of her creative energy so maybe let her do that and end this one with a little dignity. 

[BaseOps]

On 3/14/2018 at 2:32 PM, HazelEyes4325 said:

I have a feeling that, if April isn't killed off, she'll take Harriet with her wherever she goes.  No, it doesn't make ANY sense that Jackson would let that happen, but doing things that don't make sense is sort of Jackson's MO at the moment and, let's face it, Harriet is an obstacle to the whole "Jaggie" situation that Vernoff so, so, so desperately wants to be a thing.

To be fair, Vernoff didn't start the Jaggie thing. It was introduced at the end of last year when she had nothing to do with the show. She just continued down the path. Japril have been over as a couple for a long, long time. 

[jschoolgirl]

I fear they may kill off April and Harriet in an accident, perhaps a DUI incident. 

Or April will die instantly, but Harriet lives for Maggie to thave her.

[doLLish]

Am I the only sensing the return of Izzie? Jo and Alex are finally engaged and seemingly happy, two major female characters are being written out....

[jschoolgirl]

14 minutes ago, doLLish said:

Am I the only sensing the return of Izzie? Jo and Alex are finally engaged and seemingly happy, two major female characters are being written out....

I don't know ... would Shonda bring Heigl back? She did with Isaiah Washington. Would Heigl do it?

[anna0852]

I don't think Heigl is coming back. Washington didn't insult Shonda personally and the two cast members he fought with had long since left. Heigl on the other hand made it clear what she thought and was not marching the shondaland beat. I'm surprised they haven't slipped in a mention of Izzy's death by now. That was an extremely aggressive cancer and it be very easy and believable to have it stated that she has died off screen.

[HazelEyes4325]

3 hours ago, BaseOps said:

To be fair, Vernoff didn't start the Jaggie thing. It was introduced at the end of last year when she had nothing to do with the show. She just continued down the path. Japril have been over as a couple for a long, long time. 

It began at the very end of last year and I'm not convinced that there wasn't a "transition time" where Vernoff started to have some say so that she could lay the groundwork for the story lines that she wanted in seasons 14+.  Ergo, I'm still holding to the theory that Jaggie is a Vernoff creation (especially since it seemed to come out of nowhere...)

[HighHopes]

40 minutes ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

It began at the very end of last year and I'm not convinced that there wasn't a "transition time" where Vernoff started to have some say so that she could lay the groundwork for the story lines that she wanted in seasons 14+.  Ergo, I'm still holding to the theory that Jaggie is a Vernoff creation (especially since it seemed to come out of nowhere...)

Didn't "Japril the Sequel" air this time last year? It seems odd that you would devote an entire episode to a dead ship when both characters are sticking around. I could see it if it was a flashback/story for a True Love ship where one half dies, maybe, but that wasn't the case. So I don't fully believe that Jackson/April have been dead for a "long long time", but rather the new showrunner came in during the last bit of last season and started to lay the groundwork for what she wanted the show to be. 

I think April does die, or at least leaves and doesn't take Harriette with her. I keep seeing talk that Kelly McCreary said that Maggie would help make Jackson a better parent, tho I have to see a source for it. If that is true, then I could see Maggie being there for Jackson as after the death of the parent of his children and helping him through that. 

[Joana]

Looking back to it, the whole Jaggie business started when he, a plastic surgeon, treated her mother, a cancer patient. The entire storyline was so ridiculous and inexplicable from medical perspective that there had to be another reason why they went along with it, and it was that they started to bond at the time. Of course, they didn't follow it through properly with the writing being all over the place last season, so when April commented on it in the season finale, it did appear to have come out of nowhere. 

[Chas411]

6 hours ago, HighHopes said:

Didn't "Japril the Sequel" air this time last year? It seems odd that you would devote an entire episode to a dead ship when both characters are sticking around. I could see it if it was a flashback/story for a True Love ship where one half dies, maybe, but that wasn't the case. So I don't fully believe that Jackson/April have been dead for a "long long time", but rather the new showrunner came in during the last bit of last season and started to lay the groundwork for what she wanted the show to be. 

Japril the sequel was terrible though. Actually so was the first Japril bubble episode. Neither did the couple any favours and only highlighted how badly matched they were. Japril the sequel though seemed like the final nail in the coffin And like more of a goodbye to a popular ship. It actually made me dislike Jackson and think April deserved better because somewhere from mid season 13 onwards he started to despise her and treat her like crap. The second bubble episode really highlighted this.*

 

Before I get attacked April is not without sin and it was her selfishness that caused the eventual destruction of their marriage but I've never felt she disliked Jackson whereas since last season I feel Jackson really can't stand her. Everytime she speaks he gets irritated. I think that's why I'm having a hard time with him this year - he doesn't owe April a whole lot but a little respect would go a long way given she's the mother of his child. Watching him dismiss her while being all doe eyed with Maggie doesn't endear him to me and he just comes off Skeevy. 

Edited March 17, 2018 by Chas411

[BaseOps]

On 3/16/2018 at 10:28 PM, HazelEyes4325 said:

It began at the very end of last year and I'm not convinced that there wasn't a "transition time" where Vernoff started to have some say so that she could lay the groundwork for the story lines that she wanted in seasons 14+.  Ergo, I'm still holding to the theory that Jaggie is a Vernoff creation (especially since it seemed to come out of nowhere...)

She was hired over the summer, long after season 13 had wrapped and literally months after the writing would have been done. I mean clearly she's a Jaggie fan as it was her choice to continue the storyline this year, but she wasn't there at the end of last year so its inception had nothing to do with her. 

Regarding April / Jackson last season, I always found it odd that that episode was ever billed as a 'Japril' episode when there was nothing romantic about it other than them having sex at the end (which the writers then literally ignored for the rest of the season until Vernoff had April address it in early S14). "Japril The Sequel" was much more a Jackson-centric episode where April happened to be the supporting player who was present. 

Edited March 19, 2018 by BaseOps

[Chas411]

57 minutes ago, BaseOps said:

"Japril The Sequel" was much more a Jackson-centric episode where April happened to be the supporting player who was present. 

I completely agree with this. In fact I don't get why they had April there at all. It would have made more sense for Maggue to go in that it might have established a connection and made the sudden pairing a little less forced. Jackson wouldn't have been a straight up asshole to Maggie either so maybe he'd have come off more sympathetic. Having April there seemed pointless. Even the sex at the end was depressing because it was obvious there was no love on his side and he was just looking for a hookup. 

[leighroda]

I think at least one of them (Arizona and April) will die, I like both of them so that’s going to be hard, but statistically more often than not when someone leaves they die, so I guess I should just accept it.

[AriAu]

I do wish there was a separate thread for spoilers and another for speculation since I can speculate that logically, April must die (no way Jackson or his Momma let's Harriet go), but I have NO WAY of knowing.

With Arizona, she doesn't logically have to die...... other than the fact that Alex is on his way to some level of happiness so it is obviously necessary for his mentor and friend to die.

There are actually a lot of episodes to go-that was only episode 15 so there are 8 or 9 left depending on how many they have this season.

[cycworker]

4 hours ago, BaseOps said:

She was hired over the summer, long after season 13 had wrapped and literally months after the writing would have been done. I mean clearly she's a Jaggie fan as it was her choice to continue the storyline this year, but she wasn't there at the end of last year so its inception had nothing to do with her. 

Regarding April / Jackson last season, I always found it odd that that episode was ever billed as a 'Japril' episode when there was nothing romantic about it other than them having sex at the end (which the writers then literally ignored for the rest of the season until Vernoff had April address it in early S14). "Japril The Sequel" was much more a Jackson-centric episode where April happened to be the supporting player who was present. 

Although she was hired over the summer, I still believe there had to have been talks well before that. I really sense she had some input over the last few episodes. 

If she had not been hired, I think that Jackson & Maggie, while it may still have happened, would not have been endgame. But Vernoff never saw JApril as a romantic couple & so she's taken the story in a different direction. While I don't necessarily like it, I do respect her right, as the show runner, to make that choice. 

[GalvDuck]

2 hours ago, AriAu said:

I do wish there was a separate thread for spoilers and another for speculation since I can speculate that logically, April must die (no way Jackson or his Momma let's Harriet go), but I have NO WAY of knowing.

Same here.  I'm one of those freaks who lives for spoilers.  They used to be easy to find (and people posted them with spoiler tags on IMDB).  Now, it seems they're kept under wraps with the exception of a few photos online and Matt Roush's cryptic comments on TV Guide.   

[beautifulGA]

A friggin' plane over prospect studio for 30 minutes with a banner saying we love Sarah drew and Jessica Capshaw.

I can't remember any other major cast departure bringing in this kind of reaction from fans. 

Should Greys TPTB reevaluate their decision?

People : Grey's Anatomy Fans Raise Over $1K to Fly Banner in Support of Sarah Drew and Jessica Capshaw

[moonorchid]

21 minutes ago, beautifulGA said:

A friggin' plane over prospect studio for 30 minutes with a banner saying we love Sarah drew and Jessica Capshaw.

I can't remember any other major cast departure bringing in this kind of reaction from fans. 

Should Greys TPTB reevaluate their decision?

People : Grey's Anatomy Fans Raise Over $1K to Fly Banner in Support of Sarah Drew and Jessica Capshaw

They won’t. Their egos are too big to go back on this, plus I’m pretty sure they’ve burned their bridge with Sarah drew and Jessica Capshaw. 

[funnygirl]

12 hours ago, BaseOps said:

She was hired over the summer, long after season 13 had wrapped and literally months after the writing would have been done.

She actually announced her return to Grey's Anatomy on April 28, 2017, three weeks after filming wrapped on the season.  This isn't to say that she hadn't been consulting on the final episode or two to help steer direction of where she wanted to start the new season (for instance, firing Minnick and making Ben a central figure in the firefighting rescue as a prelude to eventually spinning off to Station 19). 

[GSMHvisitor]

5 hours ago, moonorchid said:

They won’t. Their egos are too big to go back on this, plus I’m pretty sure they’ve burned their bridge with Sarah drew and Jessica Capshaw. 

Burned bridges with Jessica Capshaw for sure. And they both apparently unfollowed Vernoff on twitter. But I'm confused about Sarah Drew. If she got a new show within a week after being let go from Grey's, doesn't that mean she had one foot out the door already? Surely getting cast in a new show takes longer than one week? I'm really confused what was going on there BTS.

[Chas411]

Why do you think they burned bridges with Capshaw?

[Pallas]

51 minutes ago, GSMHvisitor said:

If she got a new show within a week after being let go from Grey's, doesn't that mean she had one foot out the door already?

Nope. The timeline seems to be that on March 6, Drew was informed that her contract would not be renewed; on March 8, the news broke; by March 13, she signed as a lead in the pilot for a potential reboot of Cagney and Lacey. The two production teams -- Grey's and the pilot's -- are said to be coordinating her shooting schedule. Yesterday it was announced that VIng Rhames will also join the cast.

The late timing of the pilot's production indicates that CBS already has the show set in the schedule for next season.CBS was opportunistic; Drew was fortunate, and the unknown actors who read for the role can now accept that CBS was always going to cast a name actor, instead.

[GSMHvisitor]

2 hours ago, Chas411 said:

Why do you think they burned bridges with Capshaw?

Well, I can't know obviously, but she was let go from a show/role/job she didn't want to leave, so I wouldn't be surprised if she's not only disappointed but also hurt and pissed.

1 hour ago, Pallas said:

Nope. The timeline seems to be that on March 6, Drew was informed that her contract would not be renewed; on March 8, the news broke; by March 13, she signed as a lead in the pilot for a potential reboot of Cagney and Lacey. The two production teams -- Grey's and the pilot's -- are said to be coordinating her shooting schedule. Yesterday it was announced that VIng Rhames will also join the cast.

The late timing of the pilot's production indicates that CBS already has the show set in the schedule for next season.CBS was opportunistic; Drew was fortunate, and the unknown actors who read for the role can now accept that CBS was always going to cast a name actor, instead.

But how can we know exactly that that's how it went down?

[moonorchid]

18 minutes ago, GSMHvisitor said:

Well, I can't know obviously, but she was let go from a show/role/job she didn't want to leave, so I wouldn't be surprised if she's not only disappointed but also hurt and pissed.

But how can we know exactly that that's how it went down?

We don’t but then we would have to accept that Sarah drew lied about some things and if she had lied shondaland would have called her out on it because the only ones what look bad are Shonda, Krista, and Debbie.

[Chas411]

I think both actresses are smart enough to realise that even though they're pissed they're only going to hurt themselves by burning bridges with Shondaland. They'd lose out on too much potential work in the future. 

[Bort]

Yeah, I think the way it went down was that CBS was having a hard time finding someone for that last role on Cagney & Lacey, heard Drew was suddenly available and pounced.

[Lady Calypso]

47 minutes ago, GSMHvisitor said:

Well, I can't know obviously, but she was let go from a show/role/job she didn't want to leave, so I wouldn't be surprised if she's not only disappointed but also hurt and pissed.

But how can we know exactly that that's how it went down?

It's true that we can't know exactly how the events transpired. But Sarah made it very clear that her being let go from the show was sudden, and lying about that would only cause for her career being hurt in the long run. We can only speculate how things went down, but piecing all of the news together from different sites, Sarah got let go from the show, and then the Cagney and Lacey showrunners grabbed her almost immediately. Casting can surprisingly be very, very quick. I've read stories from actors where you can go to an audition one day, be cast the next day, and then start filming a few days after that. Plus with a reboot such as C&L, they'll want to find the right person, especially a named actor, to draw people to the show. 

Plus, I suspect if Sarah had been cast before her departure from Grey's had come out, her initial post about it would have been far less angry. Vernoff and Rhimes wouldn't have wanted themselves to look bad if they knew about Sarah's new role. Them working around Sarah's schedule so she can film the pilot seems to also indicate that they're accommodating for her because they did, indeed, let her go and the fan backlash was too great for them not to give Sarah something in return. 

[GalvDuck]

21 minutes ago, Chas411 said:

I think both actresses are smart enough to realise that even though they're pissed they're only going to hurt themselves by burning bridges with Shondaland. They'd lose out on too much potential work in the future. 

Capshaw is the step-daughter of Steven Spielberg.  I think other bridges for Capshaw could be built and Shondaland could have burned some future bridges.

[Chas411]

42 minutes ago, GalvDuck said:

Capshaw is the step-daughter of Steven Spielberg.  I think other bridges for Capshaw could be built and Shondaland could have burned some future bridges.

I get that but I hadn't seen her in much prior to Greys or during her run in Greys so while nepotism is certainly alive in Hollywood I'm not sure it's gotten her that far in the past. 

[Bort]

8 minutes ago, Chas411 said:

I get that but I hadn't seen her in much prior to Greys or during her run in Greys so while nepotism is certainly alive in Hollywood I'm not sure it's gotten her that far in the past. 

Capshaw may not have wanted to use Spielberg as a leg-up and made her way on her own merit. However, if Shonda ever wanted to break into movies, she probably won't be getting business from any Spielberg productions now.

[HazelEyes4325]

3 hours ago, GalvDuck said:

Capshaw is the step-daughter of Steven Spielberg.  I think other bridges for Capshaw could be built and Shondaland could have burned some future bridges.

This is true, but I've gotten the impression that there has never been any nepotism in play.  I had never heard of Capshaw before Grey's, and have not seen her in anything else.  Plus, I read that she auditioned several times for several different characters in Grey's before finally being cast as Arizona.  I would think that if Capshaw and Spielberg had the sort of relationship where he would go to bat for her professionally, her work history would have been much different.

[GalvDuck]

2 hours ago, kariyaki said:

Capshaw may not have wanted to use Spielberg as a leg-up and made her way on her own merit. However, if Shonda ever wanted to break into movies, she probably won't be getting business from any Spielberg productions now.

This was my main point.  I don't think Capshaw necessarily would have used Spielberg to her advantage or worked directly with him, but others may have seen it as a good thing to work with her and not really get on his bad side.  He has a lot of connections and a lot of influence.  Shonda and her ilk could hit barriers to reaching the big screen.

[DearEvette]

Or nothing could come of it.  Speilberg has worked for a very long time in a business where actors don't get their contracts picked up, they get written off for many reasons, they get recast for many reasons. This isn't necessarily personal.  And if he ran around throwing his influence against anyone who didn't cast or wrote her our or didn't pick up her contract, then rather than helping her and hurting the other people it could backfire on her.  Who would want to hire her if they knew their longevity or continued success in the business relied on them never letting her go if they needed to?  Not just that but the optics of a white man blocking the opportunities of a black woman in a business because she fired his step daughter is not great in this day and age.  Of course that even assumes the decision was actually Shonda's and she hasn't pretty much stepped back from the day-to-day runnings of the ABC shows since her big deal with Netflix. 

[HazelEyes4325]

47 minutes ago, DearEvette said:

Of course that even assumes the decision was actually Shonda's and she hasn't pretty much stepped back from the day-to-day runnings of the ABC shows since her big deal with Netflix. 

I'm not a big Shonda-defender, but I do think there is truth to this.  I was under the impression that she had actually stepped away a few seasons ago and now, with her Netflix deal, I can't see her even having the time to be more involved than a bit of publicity here and there.

[SnoGirl]

On 3/19/2018 at 1:38 PM, AriAu said:

I do wish there was a separate thread for spoilers and another for speculation since I can speculate that logically, April must die (no way Jackson or his Momma let's Harriet go), but I have NO WAY of knowing.

With Arizona, she doesn't logically have to die...... other than the fact that Alex is on his way to some level of happiness so it is obviously necessary for his mentor and friend to die.

There are actually a lot of episodes to go-that was only episode 15 so there are 8 or 9 left depending on how many they have this season.

I wonder if something happens to Arizona that is April’s fault sending her further down this spiral we’re seeing. Or maybe its not April’s fault, but she thinks it is.

I hope its nothing that has to do with Matthew and his new baby. That might be a step too morbid, even for this show...

[Catznip]

10 hours ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

I'm not a big Shonda-defender, but I do think there is truth to this.  I was under the impression that she had actually stepped away a few seasons ago and now, with her Netflix deal, I can't see her even having the time to be more involved than a bit of publicity here and there.

I've always wonder why Capshaw didn't use her step-dads influence for the big screen.  Any chance Shondaland will bring Capshaw to Netfix?

I also read some where that Arizona will likely finish up her story line by episode 18 and not appear in the last 6. This make sense if they plan to kill April off.

[pennben]

I've actually always appreciated that Capshaw didn't use her family. I really hope she gets something good coming out of this, as I've always enjoyed her contributions here.  Her work stands on its own. 

[funnygirl]

43 minutes ago, Catznip said:

I also read some where that Arizona will likely finish up her story line by episode 18 and not appear in the last 6. This make sense if they plan to kill April off.

Both Jessica and Sarah were on set yesterday filming for episode 22. 

[Catznip]

1 minute ago, funnygirl said:

Both Jessica and Sarah were on set yesterday filming for episode 22. 

Hey, how do you know that?  Have any spoiler to share?

[funnygirl]

12 minutes ago, Catznip said:

Hey, how do you know that?  Have any spoiler to share?

Jessica posted a photo of her and Sarah on set in scrubs yesterday. And then Sarah posted a photo with Jesse and mentioned how it was her one day to work with him as a director, and Jesse is directing episode 22. 

[Catznip]

1 minute ago, funnygirl said:

Jessica posted a photo of her and Sarah on set in scrubs yesterday. And then Sarah posted a photo with Jesse and mentioned how it was her one day to work with him as a director, and Jesse is directing episode 22. 

there's going to be an episode directed by Jesse that with be huge for Arizona, I guess it 22. So much for that rumor.  I was hoping she would finish up early so i can turn off watching greys after Jessica's last episode.

[Layne]

12 hours ago, HazelEyes4325 said:

I'm not a big Shonda-defender, but I do think there is truth to this.  I was under the impression that she had actually stepped away a few seasons ago and now, with her Netflix deal, I can't see her even having the time to be more involved than a bit of publicity here and there.

Correct, GA is no longer Shonda's show. She handed the reigns over to Krista and she's focusing her attention elsewhere. 

1 hour ago, Catznip said:

Hey, how do you know that?  Have any spoiler to share?

Look at Sarah, Jesse, Jessica or Kevin's Instagram feeds. 

[Layne]

2 hours ago, Catznip said:

I've always wonder why Capshaw didn't use her step-dads influence for the big screen.  Any chance Shondaland will bring Capshaw to Netfix?

I also read some where that Arizona will likely finish up her story line by episode 18 and not appear in the last 6. This make sense if they plan to kill April off.

Someone on Reddit yesterday posted a finale spoiler that said "Tragedy that no one sees coming. Character who dies is not April or Arizona." Or something like that. It was deleted. There was a similar finale spoiler posted to Reddit around this time last year that turned out to be accurate. Hopefully this will be too. 

[Chas411]

Quote

I've always wonder why Capshaw didn't use her step-dads influence for the big screen.  Any chance Shondaland will bring Capshaw to Netfix?

Capshaw possibly wanted to strike out on her own which I think is great. I also think Spielbergs been in the business long enough that he'd know casting due to nepotism isn't always a good thing. Also isn't he still getting slated for casting his later wife I that Indiana Jones film. She was awful.

[Bort]

2 hours ago, Chas411 said:

Capshaw possibly wanted to strike out on her own which I think is great. I also think Spielbergs been in the business long enough that he'd know casting due to nepotism isn't always a good thing. Also isn't he still getting slated for casting his later wife I that Indiana Jones film. She was awful.

Ha, do you mean KATE Capshaw, Jessica's mother? She wasn't his wife at the time, so it's not like he purposely cast her that way. I think the Indiana Jones movie was how they met.

[Chas411]

9 minutes ago, kariyaki said:

Ha, do you mean KATE Capshaw, Jessica's mother? She wasn't his wife at the time, so it's not like he purposely cast her that way. I think the Indiana Jones movie was how they met.

Yeah that's who I meant and I know she's her mother I just forgot her name. I also know it's not how they met but my point is he got enough flack over it even though she wasn't his wife so I'd say he's weary of nepotism. 

[funnygirl]

7 hours ago, Layne said:

Someone on Reddit yesterday posted a finale spoiler that said "Tragedy that no one sees coming. Character who dies is not April or Arizona." Or something like that. It was deleted. There was a similar finale spoiler posted to Reddit around this time last year that turned out to be accurate. Hopefully this will be too. 

If it's true, it's probably intern Sam Bello, since the actress got cast in the Roswell reboot.