Sweet Fellowship: Duggars and Friends (aka the Bates Family and Other Featured Families Thread)

[louannems]

Check out the newest post on davidlovesprincilla! The Florida Prison Ministry. Quickly scroll down and see Princilla visits with her sister, Suzanne. Suzanne's daughter has the meanest, most angry look! Scroll down a bit more and see Princilla enjoying ice cream with Ma Keller. Has Ma Keller blossomed??

[Sew Sumi]

Erin just announced via her Instagram that her due date is AUGUST 30 (!!!!!), but she's going to be induced early (didn't say how early). She also confirmed the heparin shots (already known via Kelly). How early can you learn gender these days? I thought it was 18-20 weeks, which is why I presumed a July due date. Apparently, it's much sooner than I thought. 

 

Damn...

Edited March 12, 2016 by Sew Sumi

[Arwen Evenstar]

It sounds like they didn't plan on another baby so soon. Even with family nearby, having two kids so close in age is going to be tough. Honestly, I wonder if Chad and Erin aren't exactly as thrilled about the pregnancy as they claim to be, but naturally they'd never admit it.

I'm not sure it's because they aren't thrilled...I imagine there is quite a bit of trepidation surrounding the potential for possible heartbreak now that they felt it was safe to announce the pregnancy . We're I Erin's shoes I might be scared it could well happen again.

She seems like a very sweet young lady and she's beautiful as well. Hope and pray all goes well for her.

Not surprised that any barrier or NFP failed them... NFP only works better if one has regular cycles...and given the lack of sex education that even married Fundies likely receive, this doesn't surprise me in the least.

Not sure why they completely choose to ignore science...her FIL is a doctor and Steve Maxwell is supposed to be an engineer...even very religious engineers that I've worked with UNDERSTAND and love science.

[GeeGolly]

Erin just announced via her Instagram that her due date is AUGUST 30 (!!!!!), but she's going to be induced early (didn't say how early). She also confirmed the heparin shots (already known via Kelly). How early can you learn gender these days? I thought it was 18-20 weeks, which is why I presumed a July due date. Apparently, it's much sooner than I thought. 

 

Damn...

When is Whitney due? They must be due near each other. I wonder if Alyssa will be announcing a pregnancy soon. 

[Defrauder]

Check out the newest post on davidlovesprincilla! The Florida Prison Ministry. Quickly scroll down and see Princilla visits with her sister, Suzanne. Suzanne's daughter has the meanest, most angry look! Scroll down a bit more and see Princilla enjoying ice cream with Ma Keller. Has Ma Keller blossomed??

My favorite fundy couple.   I like David's comment - Paul and Noelle are only two months apart...you can definitely tell their cousins by their similar looks.  OK, how do you explain your's and Priscilla's similar looks?  You look like twins.  David is looking especially fabulous these days.  Glad he's finally getting a break from working on the impossible rehab house he took on.   Matching shirts with Priscilla of course.  Starting to wonder if it's some zombie code in their secret apocalypse.

 

Edited to correct 'their' to 'they're'.  Not my fault, I've been spending too much time reading fundie blogs. 

Edited March 12, 2016 by Defrauder

[becca3891]

At least they aren't supporting Trump.

Cruz has some ideas that are nuttier than Trump's, though. He spoke at a conference recently where the keynote speaker was almost literally frothing at the mouth and calling for the execution of gay people. This is for real. Cruz's dad is a Christian Dominionism pastor who believes we should implement Old Testament law. I don't want to get too political here, but although Trump is hateful, Cruz is no picnic.

[frenchtoast]

In this current atmosphere (and I'll admit it troubles me deeply) please let's keep this a place with no politics. Even though everyone here is respectful and kind, let's not have political talk test the limits of that.

 

And to clarify, mentioning they're at a rally is ok, discussing the candidates platforms and views are not. 

 

Thanks!

[louannems]

Ma Keller 'blossomed'?? I seriously doubt this is possible.

Well, isn't "blossomed" a nice way to imply weight gain?

[Absolom]

There are ways to determine the sex of the fetus at the end of the first trimester now.  If Erin needed extra testing, the sex determination would have been a side benefit.

[queenanne]

Well, isn't "blossomed" a nice way to imply weight gain?

 

I would've thought it meant she relaxed and became less fundie, myself.

[Sew Sumi]

When is Whitney due? They must be due near each other. I wonder if Alyssa will be announcing a pregnancy soon.

Two months apart. Whitney's due date is 6/25.

Thanks s for the gender info. I had no idea they could know so soon. At least they waited until the end of the first trimester to announce. I just didn't expect a gender announcement two weeks later! LOL

Edited March 12, 2016 by Sew Sumi

[RazzleberryPie]

It sounds like they didn't plan on another baby so soon. Even with family nearby, having two kids so close in age is going to be tough. Honestly, I wonder if Chad and Erin aren't exactly as thrilled about the pregnancy as they claim to be, but naturally they'd never admit it.

If you're not actively doing something to prevent pregnancy, then plan on a baby. The end.

 

I'd like  to suggest ModerateToSevere Paine.  Sure, it's a mouthful, but it would qualify her for so many drugs.

Excellent. Can we please spell it Maudeirrate though?

 

I wonder if Erin figured she wouldn't get pregnant because she was breastfeeding and decided to forego birth control.

In their covenant marriage vows, they said they would let God decide the size of their family. This always meant no birth control - no pills, condoms, IUDs, sponges, vasectomies, tubals, rhythm method, etc. Now that they're 'no longer following ATI/Gothard' who knows if they'll change what they said in their vows.  Who knows with these people if it's ok to pick and chose how their words are interpreted when reality (ie life endangering pregnancies) happen.

 

On one hand, I commend them for using their brains and not trying to kill Erin just for the sake of some words. On the other hand, I want to scream LIAR LIAR PANTS ON FIRE - YOUR SEX LIFE IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN GOD'S WILL, RIGHT?

[Absolom]

When did Tennessee get covenant marriage?  I think anything they may have said about no birth control may have gone out the window when the clotting condition was diagnosed.

[Libby96]

I can understand the desire to have a family and being willing to take some calculated medical risks in order to have a couple kids. What I can't understand is the long term plan for a woman in her twenties who has to have an intense medical regimen in order to maintain a pregnancy, yet is unwilling to do anything to limit the number of pregnancies or space them to give her body sometime to recover. Erin is what, 25 or 26? She could potentially be fertile for another twenty years. I really think that it is only a matter of time before one of these famous fundie family pregnancies ends in disaster. Michelle's pregnancy with Josie almost did, and Jill and Jessa's deliveries were not walks in the park despite being healthy young women with no pre-existing problems. I guess the one thing Erin has on her side is that she actually obtains real medical care for pregnancy and delivery.

[RazzleberryPie]

When did Tennessee get covenant marriage?  I think anything they may have said about no birth control may have gone out the window when the clotting condition was diagnosed.

Many, many, people have 'covenant' marriages outside the three or four states where they're actually legal. I've been to quite a few - they make sure the programs and signage say 'a covenant marriage' and refer to it in vows, or at least the ones I've attended did. 

[GeeGolly]

If you're not actively doing something to prevent pregnancy, then plan on a baby. The end.

 

Excellent. Can we please spell it Maudeirrate though?

 

In their covenant marriage vows, they said they would let God decide the size of their family. This always meant no birth control - no pills, condoms, IUDs, sponges, vasectomies, tubals, rhythm method, etc. Now that they're 'no longer following ATI/Gothard' who knows if they'll change what they said in their vows.  Who knows with these people if it's ok to pick and chose how their words are interpreted when reality (ie life endangering pregnancies) happen.

 

On one hand, I commend them for using their brains and not trying to kill Erin just for the sake of some words. On the other hand, I want to scream LIAR LIAR PANTS ON FIRE - YOUR SEX LIFE IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN GOD'S WILL, RIGHT?

Great post!

[RazzleberryPie]

Because a wedding vow in a 'regular' marriage is less holy? Ridiculous. These people and all their stupid rules need to get over themselves instead of spending their lives looking for ways to presume moral superiority over 'the others'.

I don't know what the legal rules are in the legal states, but the Covenant Wedding's I have personally attended, usually have some fundie lite overtone. The couples I've seen are usually either very serious and solemn, or more likely - wanting to tell the world they are Special Holy Snowflakes who want everyone to know My Marriage is Better Than Yours Because it is A COVENANT. 

 

They usually describe the marriage as a covenant, an official contract between them and God (not sure how this is different or separate from the normal Sacrament of Marriage in Christian weddings), and they're marriage is sacred and holy (also not sure how this isn't part of the sacrament of marriage, except so many fundies and fundie lites want to reinvent every aspect of religion and rename it their own). They go on about how they'll never  go to bed angry, put the Lord first in all decisions, agree to go to counseling if needed, and to work through any difficulties for at least a year or two before separating or divorcing.

 

Honestly, who actually goes into marriage, sans a few insane gold diggers or whatever, expecting to divorce five minutes later? 

 

What I have personally seen with 'covenant' marriages, is an amplified 'LOOK AT US ON OUR SPECIAL DAY' couple. Most big weddings, religious or not, have a lot of that aspect, so the covenant marriages - whether or not sincere or just for attention - just play into the Bridezilla/Groomzilla antics.

 

Maybe I'm jaded, maybe I think it's silly to try to invent some sort of extra holiness from something that is already a Holy Sacrament. Maybe I want to roll my eyes at groups like this who shun liturgical churches as being cold and fake, and not 'real' worship, then turn right around and reinvent what they've shunned. Either way, I may be wrong, but am pretty sure the Paines went through whatever 'covenant' means at their wedding.  

[RazzleberryPie]

You said it much more articulately than I! Well stated.

Thanks - I don't think Chad and Erin are bad people or intentional liars. I think it's great that they're thinking more for themselves than any of the others we see on 19Kids and whatever the Bates show is called now. 

 

I do get really irked when people have zero humbleness, and love to sanctimoniously inform everyone non Baptist fundie that their ways are wrong, they're not really following Christ's teachings, they don't read or understand scripture, they're ceremonial heathens with no 'real' worship. Then the sanctimonious fundies turn right around and rename whatever they previously called heathen, but it's ok, because they invented something they formerly rejected.

 

It's the whole "we do everything a LITTLE DIFFERENTLY" with a huge smug smirk, then turn right around and embrace whatever you condemned. Don't go around trying to lay all the ground rules for everyone you encounter, condemning them to eternal damnation for not following your rules, then pull and 'oops, my bad, we changed our minds to suit our likes and wants'.

 

Have some humbleness and humility while you're figuring things out for yourself, or SHUT UP.

[Obsidian]

I had to look up what a covenant marriage is. It seems to be a marriage where there are more rules and less freedoms (particularly to divorce). Surely the only people who would want one are the people who shouldn't need lots of extra rules to stick with their marriage? Why do they need more rules, if they take marriage more seriously than the rest of us riff-raff? Hold on, I know this one - for the same reason that these fabulously devout and pure people can't go to the supermarket without an accountability partner: they're illogical! Though they might inadvertently put their bananas in the wrong position in the trolley.

[Kiss my mutt]

Is a covenant marriage enforceable in a court of law or is it just a religious covenant that sets them apart from the riff raff who manages to get married. Oh, you're married, well, are you covenant married? Side eyes....

I wonder why Chad and Erin picked Brooklyn for a name. Has either of them even set foot in New York? I guess people do pick location names without having been there but it just surprised me that it would win the baby name game with a less worldly couple. I do know a couple who named their kid Boston and neither of them had been.

[Absolom]

Last time I looked three states offered a legal variant of covenant marriage.  The rest of the couples it seems to be something they or their church made up.

[BitterApple]

Is a covenant marriage enforceable in a court of law or is it just a religious covenant that sets them apart from the riff raff who manages to get married. Oh, you're married, well, are you covenant married? Side eyes....

I wonder why Chad and Erin picked Brooklyn for a name. Has either of them even set foot in New York? I guess people do pick location names without having been there but it just surprised me that it would win the baby name game with a less worldly couple. I do know a couple who named their kid Boston and neither of them had been.

Brooklyn was the name du jour for all the trailer park hillbillies on Toddlers and Tiaras, so I'm not surprised it's familiar in the Bates' circles. They're only several years removed from shack living.

I think it would be really pretty but it's just so annoyingly trendy that I'm just "meh" on it. It's one of those names that's been kind of ruined for me, much like Ava, Sophia, Olivia etc,.

Edited March 13, 2016 by BitterApple

[bigskygirl]

No offense, but just because someone lives in a manufactured home does not mean their lives are over. Many of our ancestors lived in shacks, tents, or other housing with big families and managed to survive. Some people can buy and live in a manufactured home without going into major debt for up to thirty years. People in trailers can lead happy and healthy lives and work just as hard as a home owner. In fact, I have seen newer manufactured homes that look better and are better made than most houses.

 

Yes, a Bate or Duggar may end up in a shack for some reason, but I do not think we should look down on them for it. To me, it is the way a person lives his or her life and treat others is more important than if they live in a small trailer, shack or a big expensive house.

[Sew Sumi]

Don't forget, Gothard attended the Paine Wedding. He may well have even spoken, as he did at Smuggar's and Davilla's weddings. That makes it a certainty that family size was part of their "covenant."

Now that they've openly shunned Billy Boy, and given Erin's condition, who knows how, or if, they've altered their plans.

[RazzleberryPie]

No offense, but just because someone lives in a manufactured home does not mean their lives are over. Many of our ancestors lived in shacks, tents, or other housing with big families and managed to survive. Some people can buy and live in a manufactured home without going into major debt for up to thirty years. People in trailers can lead happy and healthy lives and work just as hard as a home owner. In fact, I have seen newer manufactured homes that look better and are better made than most houses.

 

Yes, a Bate or Duggar may end up in a shack for some reason, but I do not think we should look down on them for it. To me, it is the way a person lives his or her life and treat others is more important than if they live in a small trailer, shack or a big expensive house.

Some of those manufactured homes are pretty swanky these days - they're not all tin campers on wheels. I've seen them with vaulted ceilings, two stories, granite  counters, spa tubs, etc. 

 

Brooklyn - always makes me think of Posh and Beckham's son. it's not my first pic, but I've heard far worse. 

[becca3891]

When did Tennessee get covenant marriage?  I think anything they may have said about no birth control may have gone out the window when the clotting condition was diagnosed.

I am sincerely hoping their eyes have been opened regarding Gothard's black and white dogma about birth control. What could he, a single man, possibly know of the pain and agony that can come from normal pregnancy, never mind one with hyperemesis gravidarum, postpartum depression, traumatic labor, etc.? Remember Andrea Yates, who was deep in the IFB lifestyle, had struggled with postpartum depression/psychosis so badly that they had finally decided to use birth control, but it was too late because of course her getting help for her already existing condition was forbidden. The idea of it being medical rather than her own rebellion was beyond the thinking capability of the church elders. It makes me sick.

 

I am ALL for it if a woman loves pregnancy and feels up to the task of parenting all of her own children. But poor Erin was miserable with her daily shots and they both lived in daily fear that something could go badly wrong. It sounded high-risk enough that it's hard to picture her getting through 10 or 15 pregnancies without something serious or potentially catastrophic happening. And my gut tells me that they realize this too. The only regrettable thing is that all too often, people like them don't change their minds on this kind of topic until a danger faces them personally. It would be far better to be open-minded enough to come to the right conclusion on your own.

[Jynnan tonnix]

I can understand the desire to have a family and being willing to take some calculated medical risks in order to have a couple kids. What I can't understand is the long term plan for a woman in her twenties who has to have an intense medical regimen in order to maintain a pregnancy, yet is unwilling to do anything to limit the number of pregnancies or space them to give her body sometime to recover. Erin is what, 25 or 26? She could potentially be fertile for another twenty years. I really think that it is only a matter of time before one of these famous fundie family pregnancies ends in disaster. Michelle's pregnancy with Josie almost did, and Jill and Jessa's deliveries were not walks in the park despite being healthy young women with no pre-existing problems. I guess the one thing Erin has on her side is that she actually obtains real medical care for pregnancy and delivery.

What I really can't fathom is how you even maintain that mindset after, let's say, 10 years of marriage or so...

Unless you somehow have the sort of relationship where even after that amount of time the only thing you can think of when you have a moment alone is getting into each others' pants. 

 

But even then I would imagine that after the fifth or sixth kid it would be second nature to mentally calculate your chances of conceiving and either joyfully go for it or end up getting distracted. Of course, having a regular cycle is a big part of this and after being pregnant more often than not over time, I suppose this may throw a wrench in all that. But then again if it was SO difficult to keep track of fertile/non-fertile days, those cycle charts would be useless. So evidently it is at least reasonably possible to follow.

 

I suppose that's where being "joyfully available" comes into play, though. In other words, if the man, being a man, and having, on average, a higher and maybe more insistent sex drive is in the mood, the wife has no choice but to comply even if she is pretty sure she has a better-than-average chance of conceiving a child she doesn't feel mentally or physically up to handling. Though, after this hypothetical 10 years of marriage, how many men would mindlessly relieve their tension without ever noticing whether their partner seemed to be into it (how good of actors ARE these women?)? (by the way, this is a legitimate question...not to go into details, but after 31 years my husband more or less never initiates sex since he has noticed that it is less than comfortable for me at times)

 

And, for that matter, what if a guy like, say, Josh, was not happy at the prospect of more children, would he even be able to get it up after 10 years and 5 kids if he had any inkling that his wife was primed to catch a baby?

[Gweilo]

Although sarcasm is my second language and I'm allergic to emotions, I can't help but be charmed by the Seven Sisters blog and Facebook (Seven farmgirls) http://sevenfarmgirlsisters.com/

 

In a nutshell:

7 sisters; 2 brothers; all unmarried

One of the sisters is getting her pilot's licence and talks in glorious nerdy detail about flying and maps and loves what she does (and attends conventions for women in aviation!!)

One of them is studying to be an EMT (I'm making an educated guess that that is what in Oz we'd call a paramedic?) and rides in her vehicle with her partner. Who is sometimes a guy.  And Satan's all like "weird, I put a male and female in the same space so that they could debauch each other and yet they're just hanging out and saving lives...what gives?"

One of them is studying midwifery and went to Haiti and there were women wearing shorts and she didn't scream "Whore of Babylon!" at them.

They craft and cook and attend agricultural fairs and are totally engaged in the community.

They justify their modest dress and headcoverings in a way that shows they have faith in their own convictions.

 

I have a real soft spot for them.  I think they are a good example of Christians.  If you do what you love, and use your skills and talents to do good, then you're glorifying God.  Think of them as a refreshing sorbet in between the turd-based main courses that are the Maxwells, Rodrigui, Bates, Duggars, etc.

 

[GeeGolly]

What I really can't fathom is how you even maintain that mindset after, let's say, 10 years of marriage or so...

Unless you somehow have the sort of relationship where even after that amount of time the only thing you can think of when you have a moment alone is getting into each others' pants. 

 

But even then I would imagine that after the fifth or sixth kid it would be second nature to mentally calculate your chances of conceiving and either joyfully go for it or end up getting distracted. Of course, having a regular cycle is a big part of this and after being pregnant more often than not over time, I suppose this may throw a wrench in all that. But then again if it was SO difficult to keep track of fertile/non-fertile days, those cycle charts would be useless. So evidently it is at least reasonably possible to follow.

 

I suppose that's where being "joyfully available" comes into play, though. In other words, if the man, being a man, and having, on average, a higher and maybe more insistent sex drive is in the mood, the wife has no choice but to comply even if she is pretty sure she has a better-than-average chance of conceiving a child she doesn't feel mentally or physically up to handling. Though, after this hypothetical 10 years of marriage, how many men would mindlessly relieve their tension without ever noticing whether their partner seemed to be into it (how good of actors ARE these women?)? (by the way, this is a legitimate question...not to go into details, but after 31 years my husband more or less never initiates sex since he has noticed that it is less than comfortable for me at times)

 

And, for that matter, what if a guy like, say, Josh, was not happy at the prospect of more children, would he even be able to get it up after 10 years and 5 kids if he had any inkling that his wife was primed to catch a baby?

I think typical IFB families do not TRY for a dozen or so kids. In fact I tend to believe that both the husband and wife individually, consciously and unconsciously avoid intimacy during fertile times. But even if they didn't, the average Catholic family back in the day had 6 - 8 kids.

 

IMO, having 19 kids takes planning and effort, and 2 sets of twins certainly helps. The Duggars and Bates tried very hard for every blessing they caught.

[Churchhoney]

I had to look up what a covenant marriage is. It seems to be a marriage where there are more rules and less freedoms (particularly to divorce). Surely the only people who would want one are the people who shouldn't need lots of extra rules to stick with their marriage? Why do they need more rules, if they take marriage more seriously than the rest of us riff-raff? Hold on, I know this one - for the same reason that these fabulously devout and pure people can't go to the supermarket without an accountability partner: they're illogical! Though they might inadvertently put their bananas in the wrong position in the trolley

 

I thought it was all because they're such powerful effective warriors for Jesus that Satan spends his whole temptation budget on them and barely glances at other people. I picture them with thousands of the devil's minions throwing temptations at them from all directions, 24-7. I mean, other people might get to put bananas in their grocery carts, but when the Duggars and company try it, the bananas turn into an enticing bunch of penises, standing up and waving colorful flavored condoms and cock rings at them. And when Satan's working overtime on you, knowing he'll lose his earthly dominion if you're not there to battle on behalf of Jesus, you'd better believe you need extra-special, watertight wedding vows and a fellow warrior or two fighting beside you as you march down the aisle at Aldi's.

[GeeGolly]

I thought it was all because they're such powerful effective warriors for Jesus that Satan spends his whole temptation budget on them and barely glances at other people. I picture them with thousands of the devil's minions throwing temptations at them from all directions, 24-7. I mean, other people might get to put bananas in their grocery carts, but when the Duggars and company try it, the bananas turn into an enticing bunch of penises, standing up and waving colorful flavored condoms and cock rings at them. And when Satan's working overtime on you, knowing he'll lose his earthly dominion if you're not there to battle on behalf of Jesus, you'd better believe you need extra-special, watertight wedding vows and a fellow warrior or two fighting beside you as you march down the aisle at Aldi's.

A PSA commercial.

[Zahdii]

I thought it was all because they're such powerful effective warriors for Jesus that Satan spends his whole temptation budget on them and barely glances at other people. I picture them with thousands of the devil's minions throwing temptations at them from all directions, 24-7. I mean, other people might get to put bananas in their grocery carts, but when the Duggars and company try it, the bananas turn into an enticing bunch of penises, standing up and waving colorful flavored condoms and cock rings at them. And when Satan's working overtime on you, knowing he'll lose his earthly dominion if you're not there to battle on behalf of Jesus, you'd better believe you need extra-special, watertight wedding vows and a fellow warrior or two fighting beside you as you march down the aisle at Aldi's.

 

OK, I'm afraid to look it up, not after I googled 'Jacob's Ladder' after hearing it mentioned one time in regards to the male appendage.  I was all "Yikes!"  "Ouch!", and "This is a joke, right?  Who would want to do this to themselves?"

 

So now I have to admit I don't know what a cock ring is.  Do men really 'put a ring on it'?  When?  If they wear a ring when they're flaccid, would that interfere with urination?  And wouldn't a spontaneous erection be really painful, and possibly a health issue?  If they put it on in preparation for sex, how do they get the ring sized?  Does my local jewler really have a private room in the back with visual aids so they can get the circumference right?  I assume the ring is a plain flat one, no jewels or such, although maybe an inscription is OK?  And what woman would want that thing rubbing up inside them, over and over again?  How is any of that sexy?

[crazycatlady58]

OK, I'm afraid to look it up, not after I googled 'Jacob's Ladder' after hearing it mentioned one time in regards to the male appendage. I was all "Yikes!" "Ouch!", and "This is a joke, right? Who would want to do this to themselves?"

So now I have to admit I don't know what a cock ring is. Do men really 'put a ring on it'? When? If they wear a ring when they're flaccid, would that interfere with urination? And wouldn't a spontaneous erection be really painful, and possibly a health issue? If they put it on in preparation for sex, how do they get the ring sized? Does my local jewler really have a private room in the back with visual aids so they can get the circumference right? I assume the ring is a plain flat one, no jewels or such, although maybe an inscription is OK? And what woman would want that thing rubbing up inside them, over and over again? How is any of that sexy?

Thanks for asking this, not only was I afraid to google it, I was afraid to ask.

[Barb23]

It's one thing to have a Covenant marriage but these people go over the top to make sure the rest of us know. I can still hear Jilly Muffin in her screechy voice thanking guests for joining them in their Covenant marriage.

Razzleberry Pie mentioned who goes into a marriage expecting a divorce 5 minutes later? Maybe Dad Seewald -remember him mentioning divorce in the prayer he said before Benessa got married? Oh these people.....

[BitterApple]

I mean, other people might get to put bananas in their grocery carts, but when the Duggars and company try it, the bananas turn into an enticing bunch of penises, standing up and waving colorful flavored condoms and cock rings at them.

So THAT's why the Duggars never eat fresh fruits and vegetables! Too much potential to be sent to hell. Bananas, cucumbers, melons, they're all evil.

[louannems]

I opened the farmgirlsisters website. THAT is likely how the Duggar girls would STILL be dressing if TLC hadn't come along. They dressed that way (minus the headscarfs) just 10 years ago! I think they only evolved to modern modest because ratings.

[Arwen Evenstar]

Ma Keller 'blossomed'?? I seriously doubt this is possible.

Even in her frump-wear...she does seem to have a nice smile when she's actually free to enjoy herself away from the disapproving glance of her headship.

One of my best friends grew up as the son of an Independent Baptist minister and told me he can tell when his dad isn't home when he calls...because his mom becomes a completely different bubbly happy person when the patriarch isn't about. We talked about how sad that had to be for his mom.

[queenanne]

Eh, secular Bridezillas do lots of funny fetishistic wedding things that no one gives a damn about as well, so I'm not overtly exercised by the covenant marriage concept.  Except to say that as I understand it it does seem like "doth protest too much" hysteria, and that I don't think they're much different (hell, maybe "no" different) than ordinary non-speshul wedding vows.

[Arwen Evenstar]

I opened the farmgirlsisters website. THAT is likely how the Duggar girls would STILL be dressing if TLC hadn't come along. They dressed that way (minus the headscarfs) just 10 years ago! I think they only evolved to modern modest because ratings.

Orthodox Jewish women wear FABULOUS modern modest clothes. So do many other religions and denominations.

I wonder why the Fundies opt for the prairie wear...but I think it has more to do with economy than anything else. Ugly fabric is cheaper...buy enough fabric to make several copies of the same drab pinafore with a couple of your slaves (daughters), hence the matchy matchy clothing.

Then you demonstrate your thriftiness by showing other Fundies that you are more thrifty than they.

It makes sense to me that most Fundy families barely get enough to eat and their kids aren't properly fed...because patriarchy ...that buying "modern modest" isn't really an option under already strained finances

So THAT's why the Duggars never eat fresh fruits and vegetables! Too much potential to be sent to hell. Bananas, cucumbers, melons, they're all evil.

Help, help....I'm being defrauded by produce! I must now purpose myself to don my worst frumpwear Fundie misery fashion and protest this filth at my neighborhood Whole Foods!

[wait.what]

Ummm a cock ring is not made of metal. It's made of a rubbery elastic material. So it stretches.

It's not worn all the time like a piece of jewelry.

I only know because I am a nurse. (Cough)

[RazzleberryPie]

Although sarcasm is my second language and I'm allergic to emotions, I can't help but be charmed by the Seven Sisters blog and Facebook (Seven farmgirls) http://sevenfarmgirlsisters.com/

 

In a nutshell:

7 sisters; 2 brothers; all unmarried

One of the sisters is getting her pilot's licence and talks in glorious nerdy detail about flying and maps and loves what she does (and attends conventions for women in aviation!!)

One of them is studying to be an EMT (I'm making an educated guess that that is what in Oz we'd call a paramedic?) and rides in her vehicle with her partner. Who is sometimes a guy.  And Satan's all like "weird, I put a male and female in the same space so that they could debauch each other and yet they're just hanging out and saving lives...what gives?"

One of them is studying midwifery and went to Haiti and there were women wearing shorts and she didn't scream "Whore of Babylon!" at them.

They craft and cook and attend agricultural fairs and are totally engaged in the community.

They justify their modest dress and headcoverings in a way that shows they have faith in their own convictions.

 

I have a real soft spot for them.  I think they are a good example of Christians.  If you do what you love, and use your skills and talents to do good, then you're glorifying God.  Think of them as a refreshing sorbet in between the turd-based main courses that are the Maxwells, Rodrigui, Bates, Duggars, etc.

They seem quite hippified, but very genuine. They do what they feel led to do, without shoving down anyones throat or any sort of sinister smugness. They're odd, but nice people, from the looks of it.

[JoanArc]

Ummm a cock ring is not made of metal. It's made of a rubbery elastic material. So it stretches.

It's not worn all the time like a piece of jewelry.

I only know because I am a nurse. (Cough)

They make metal ones, too.

 

I'm a nurse too...that's *cough* done some stuff.

[GeeGolly]

I opened the farmgirlsisters website. THAT is likely how the Duggar girls would STILL be dressing if TLC hadn't come along. They dressed that way (minus the headscarfs) just 10 years ago! I think they only evolved to modern modest because ratings.

I peeked at the site a little. They wear head coverings to show their submission to their father, UGH.

 

What it is with Fundies and flying? Does it represent freedom? Also it seems Fundy families play musical instruments, while I think it is awesome, I was wondering if there is some biblical reasoning behind it. And guns; Fundy or regional?

[Churchhoney]

OK, I'm afraid to look it up, not after I googled 'Jacob's Ladder' after hearing it mentioned one time in regards to the male appendage.  I was all "Yikes!"  "Ouch!", and "This is a joke, right?  Who would want to do this to themselves?"

 

So now I have to admit I don't know what a cock ring is.  Do men really 'put a ring on it'?  When?  If they wear a ring when they're flaccid, would that interfere with urination?  And wouldn't a spontaneous erection be really painful, and possibly a health issue?  If they put it on in preparation for sex, how do they get the ring sized?  Does my local jewler really have a private room in the back with visual aids so they can get the circumference right?  I assume the ring is a plain flat one, no jewels or such, although maybe an inscription is OK?  And what woman would want that thing rubbing up inside them, over and over again?  How is any of that sexy?

 

Many are kind of stretchy. Presumably they help hold an erection. You don't keep them on all the time! You just put them on when you're about to start something. Some of them are constructed so as to have contact with a woman in a way that she might enjoy, shall we say. For example, some vibrate.

 

End of that conversation! 

 

(I'm not a nurse. :  )   )

Edited March 13, 2016 by Churchhoney

[Skittl1321]

There are ways to determine the sex of the fetus at the end of the first trimester now. If Erin needed extra testing, the sex determination would have been a side benefit.

A CVS can be done at like 6 weeks, though they reccomend waiting until after 10 weeks because it can cause birth defects if done too. Fewer OBs do them though so more people use amnio, hitch is done 2nd trimester.

I know some women like to have these tests just to find our the sex! Kind of crazy for invasive testing.

I wonder what Erin gets early testing for. I mean it's good to be able to prepare if there are fetal abnormalities, but finding out late would still work for her. After an anamoly scan at 20 weeks she would be able to consult with doctors if necessary. It's not like they would terminate. Most people who won't waive this test. Does anyone know of a test that says anything about maternal health this early (that also shows baby sex)? I've never heard of a CVS for that, and never heard of maternal testing that determined sex.

[Absolom]

It's a newer test than CVS and I believe it's non-invasive.  It's called It's called the Materni 21, Panorama, or Harmony test. They're typically done in the late first trimester and test for genetic abnormalities and gender. They're typically not done unless you're high risk or have advanced maternal age. I wonder if Erin's OB does something like this and they would consider not doing the heparin shots for pregnancy with abnormalities.

[RazzleberryPie]

Two clarification comments, then y'all have defrauded me so much that I have to go spend some time in the prayer closet.

 

I think cock rings are supposed to be more, uh, functional than decorative, so no, not worn 24/7 or bejeweled. There are plenty of jewel in that area already anyway LOL.

 

Fundie frumpery - I think they wear those hideous sack dresses because: 1) they're easy to sew. Most of these women absolutely do not have the domestic skills they portray. Cutting two panels and sewing a couple of side seams in stiff cotton is easy.

2) so many of them are really out of shape due to perpetual pregnancy or just not being active, and those sacks hide any shape. Claim 'modesty' instead of 'I'm an unfit blob (this goes for the stick skinny ones and the overweight ones)' and you're set. You also don't have to distinguish between sizes very much, so as long as you're not tripping over the hem, all the women in the family from kids to teens to adults can share.  

3) Michelle herself said those big ole collars are meant to 'draw attention to the countenance' - meaning up away from their bodies. Look at our faces instead of how badly these dresses fit and that we're not eating healthy or exercising.

4) the frumpy fabric always looks like quilt fabric - country patterned (don't know how else to describe it) cotton that can be picked up for a couple of dollars per yard at Wal-mart. Loud, busy patterns that won't show wear, stains or bad sewing.

5) They all see to have some nostalgia for Laura Ingalls' version of late 1800s farm life. They think they're dressing like a wholesome, innocent time period. They seem to fail to realize or to admit that Laura Ingalls wrote a CHILDREN's BOOK series - it was very selective in content, because it was geared toward children. Laura skims over a lot of racial hatred (there's a little bit about Native American's as savages that are only good when dead), terrible poverty, gruesome illness and death, illiteracy, war, and basically any negativity that was present at that time. Don't get me wrong, I loved those books as a kid, and I still believe they are excellent pieces of children's literature. However, they are not a fair or accurate representative of general life in late 1800s/early 1900s America. They're trying to recreation some fictional utopia by emulating characters in a children's book. 

[Skittl1321]

It's a newer test than CVS and I believe it's non-invasive. It's called It's called the Materni 21, Panorama, or Harmony test.

Right, I forgot about those. My OB doesn't use those because a positive usually results in a follow up on CVS or amnio so she starts there if the screenings or prior pregnancies suggest it. But they would show sex. And can be done as early as 10 weeks.

Thank you! Probably what she had done.

[Sew Sumi]

FYI: This thread broke my interwebz. I think all that talk of cock rings gave it the vapors. 

[RazzleberryPie]

Maybe we should submit a question to that Marriage Bed website and ask their opinion on cock rings. I learned about a whole lot of weirdness on that site that I never would've dreamed of.