S01.E12: Crazy For You

[rtms77]

Ronnie told her to leave him alone, so she listened. Which I find kind of refreshing. Most of the time on TV everyone ignores each other and does whatever they want, like Cisco (although finding out he was doing it for his own reasons helped). 

 

To me Caitlin doesn't seem the type to put up a fight in her personal life, maybe she thinks she doesn't deserve too? She's meek and socially awkward. Someone says to leave them alone, so she does. It doesn't mean she doesn't care, just that she doesn't do much to change anything. Which could be an interesting development if they go with her comic story. 

Except that two episodes ago she was all about finding out about what happened to Ronnie and has already linked Martin Stein and transmutation to Ronnie's problem. Clearly she wasn't listening, only to have this episode act like it was a surprise and insult that Cisco was trying his own way to find what happened. I feel they are just cheating the female leads out of stories and giving them all to men. Wells and his scrects, Barry and Reverse Flash etc, and now Cisco and his man pain. As usual freeze out the women becuae girls are not cool,bro!

[cynic]

On dp's acting, even good actors sometimes suck at drunk acting. I think she's much better in her regular scenes. She projected a nice warmth at the end with Barry IMO.

Eh, she's actually been bothering me all season. There's something very artificial and overplayed "kids show" about her performance. She's not unwatchable like Charlie on Revolution or Katrina on Sleepy Hollow level bad. I actually think she'll probably get better, she's just not good now. She is cute though.

[wayne67]

 

4. While Peekaboo was presented as flirty, and fun, it should be remembered that she participated in a robbery in which her accomplice was armed and shot the Flash (and presumably would have shot other folks too). Under the felony-murder rule, she is an attempted murderer. 

 

While I do admit that Peekaboo committed crimes, there should be some examination of her motivations and extenuating circumstances before the Flash Gang sentence her to solitary life imprisonment which is usually reserved for death sentence prisoners...

 

And if we were to hold metahumans and above average humans to the same standards as real world law.

 

Wells wouldn't be roaming around free after causing the deaths of 17 people and the resulting mayhem and death resulting from the metahumans... He'd be held accountable for the loss of the prototype tachion device.

 

Barry would be obliged to lock up Green Arrow for being a mass murderer. By that logic Barry is an accessory after the fact to Green Arrow's multiple murders.

 

As for Barry himself, he's guilty of negligent homicide, countless numbers of assaults, attempted homicide of a police officer, multiple kidnappings, false imprisonment, destruction of property, trespass, theft and just this episode assisted a felon in a prison escape. One could argue about him being guilty of treason by interfering with the US Army.

 

The Flash Gang are playing judge, jury and prison wardens, it's totally in their discretion to let non violent offenders out with a stern warning that their behaviour will be monitored and any further infractions will be punished severely.

 

Unfortunately no other meta human can be allowed to be redeemed or inducted into the Flash Gang otherwise Barry wouldn't be the star any more because the other metahuman could steal the spotlight from Barry. I find it odd that no one wonders about what Wells is doing with all this research. Does he still have a company? Does he pay these people anything for their time ?

Edited February 4, 2015 by wayne67

[rubyred]

It's weird, to me it's like Iris has spark/romantic chem with Flash, but it's definitely on a platonic wavelength with Barry. I didn't think she looked jealous last night, just bemused. Of course this is a by-the-numbers romantic storyline so yeah, she'll have her lightbulb moment that she wants Barry. It's just a matter of whether it will be because she knows he's the Flash or if she starts seeing Barry as a romantic prospect and then finds out he's the Flash, which would be my preference. But CP is given so little to do, who the hell knows if they'll bother with making it interesting. There seems to be little to no urgency about making Iris a well-rounded character.

[paigow]

Eh, she's actually been bothering me all season. There's something very artificial and overplayed "kids show" about her performance. She's not unwatchable like Charlie on Revolution or Katrina on Sleepy Hollow level bad. I actually think she'll probably get better, she's just not good now. She is cute though.

Add Ray Donovan's daughter to that unwatchable list.

[ElectricCityy]

It's weird, to me it's like Iris has spark/romantic chem with Flash, but it's definitely on a platonic wavelength with Barry. 

I feel the same but then I felt more romantic chemistry between Stefan and Katherine than Stefan and Elena on The Vampire Diaries despite it being the same actress. Maybe because Iris and Flash has that mysterious factor going on to give it more sex appeal.

[sking24450]

Eh, she's actually been bothering me all season. There's something very artificial and overplayed "kids show" about her performance. She's not unwatchable like Charlie on Revolution or Katrina on Sleepy Hollow level bad. I actually think she'll probably get better, she's just not good now. She is cute though.

Yes, she's bothered me outside of last night.  I remember the scene where she was talking about Barry taking too many risks and I just cringed through the whole thing and it's happened a few times with her.  I like her well enough as a character but the actress is killing it for me.  Not unwatchable but I prefer when she's in a larger group.

[Shriekingeel]

Also, what the hell is up with Flash fighting villains with x-men powers? Professor x, Iceman, Colossus, Pyro, now Nightcrawler. I would call Pied Piper Banshee but that would just be forcing it.

Actually the Flash's main rogues gallery predates the X-Men by several years. /nerd

[BkWurm1]

My issues with the Pipeline Prison goes beyond the inhumane conditions (just solitary is widely considers a form of mental torture). I can hand wave the ability to feed and clean and provide a place for them to sleep but this stuff takes time and effort and except for one janitor that no longer shows up to work, we've been given no indication that anyone but Wells, Cisco and Caitlin work at Star Labs.  None of them live there and it seems that all of them have weekends off and even if Netflix doesn't count as an exciting life, it is still a life that is keeping Caitlin away from Star Labs.  

 

It seems insane that they would create this secret prison for almost unstoppable meta criminals and then at the very least leave no one watching them at night.  I have to assume someone feeds them on the weekend but we have no proof or indication that anyone even remembers they have people locked down there except when they are adding a new prisoner. 

 

Even if we subscribe to the "they're good guys, they aren't starving them" theory, the question becomes, when and how?  It's too big of a thing not to account for.  It's breaking the credulity of the show and interfering with my enjoyment.  It does not compute. 

 

They can't tell and show us that Barry can freely zip in and out of Star Labs free of any concern about giving away his identity (and later Arrow and Co) and then expect me to fanwank that of course they have other employees taking care of the prisoners.  Even that janitor stretched my belief.   

 

I've already suspended my disbelief on all things meta with the explosion of the collider, I signed on for that.  I'm ready to accept that Wells has access to knowledge of the future - so add in time travel to accepted things that might happen in Central City.  The show runners did their world building on that stuff but they've dropped the ball on the prison.  All we really know about it is what they've shown. And that has been a series of 8x8 square padded cells that are shuffled off out of sight but not out of my mind.  No daylight, no companionship, no where to exercise, and as far as we can tell no furniture, toilet or bathing facilities, no clean clothes, food or entertainment. 

 

Someone has to speak up for the audience.

 

I don't care how farfetched their answers are.  Bring in someone's 2nd cousin, throw him into a generic uniform, slap a name tag that says Marv on him and let him stand silently in the background while the A-listers gloat.  Include a random shot of a linen deliver or food services truck pulling into the garage.   Complain how high the cable bill is getting and talk about a nifty gadget that gets around all those required extra cable boxes. Offer Joe some overtime to watch the monitors.  If this Pipeline Prison is supposed to be taken seriously and accepted into this world they've created, they need to  include the details that support its existence. 

 

Then we can talk about the other continued ethical and moral questions that remain.

Edited February 5, 2015 by BkWurm1

[venusnv80]

I can honestly say, I never gave the prison thing that much thought. 

[quarks]

The odd thing is that they could probably answer at least some of these questions by having a Roomba go by in the background. That would cause sound problems, granted, but since they already seem to be doing some sound looping anyway, it seems like something that could be fixed.  Or toss in a throwaway line about how terrifying Cisco's robot bathroom cleaner is.  It's a cheap solution and in the context of this show makes sense enough.

Edited February 5, 2015 by quarks

[Actionmage]

The show runners did their world building on that stuff but they've dropped the ball on the prison.  All we really know about it is what they've shown. And that has been a series of 8x8 square padded cells that are shuffled off out of sight but not out of my mind.

 

BkWurm1,^This x1000 likes.  This is supposed to be the lighter, more fun superhero show. How can it be when there is a Guantanamo Bay situation in Central City?

[venusnv80]

LOL...Guantanamo Bay? 

[BkWurm1]

LOL...Guantanamo Bay? 

Even those prisoners get to go outside and interact with other prisoners. 

 

I understand the in show reasons why the Pipeline Prison is needed but I wish they would at least acknowledge that it isn't a perfect solution. 

Edited February 5, 2015 by BkWurm1

[venusnv80]

Even those prisoners get to go outside and interact with other prisoners. 

 

I understand the in show reasons why the Pipeline Prison is needed but I wish they would at least acknowledge that it isn't a perfect solution. 

I think they get to acknowledge when all of the prisoners break out and wreck havoc on the city. 

[bluebonnet]

I'm glad I'm not the only one thinking about Gitmo when the Pipeline Prison comes on screen.

 

And like BkWurm1 says, I'm not opposed to the existence of the prison. Meta-humans clearly cannot be safely held in regular prisons.  I most strongly object to the superhero not recognizing that it's a pretty inhumane solution.  This is the sort of thing one would expect Oliver Queen to be doing (he threw a man in a hole in the ground on a 'deserted' island).  Barry Allen isn't the same as Oliver Queen.  Every time these horrible cells come on screen, all characterization of Barry is damaged. Takes me right out of it when the hero becomes a mustache twirler at the end of every episode. 

[Lantern7]

I liked the episode. I don't see Danielle Panabaker as a weak link. Then again, I don't seem to notice weak links on this show. I'm okay with it, even with leaps of logic like the metahuman prison and a criminal gorilla. BTW, dos anybody else think "Grodd" will be another acronym, like what "Firestorm" turned out to be?

 

Barry isn't so bad at karaoke. I will admit, the bit with Linda more or less throwing herself at him was a bit much. I'm happy Barry could be getting some lovin', but it seems like it could be too easy.

 

I liked Peek-A-Boo, but I think "line of sight teleportation" is a bit derivative.

[cynic]

It's weird, to me it's like Iris has spark/romantic chem with Flash, but it's definitely on a platonic wavelength with Barry. I didn't think she looked jealous last night, just bemused. Of course this is a by-the-numbers romantic storyline so yeah, she'll have her lightbulb moment that she wants Barry. It's just a matter of whether it will be because she knows he's the Flash or if she starts seeing Barry as a romantic prospect and then finds out he's the Flash, which would be my preference. But CP is given so little to do, who the hell knows if they'll bother with making it interesting. There seems to be little to no urgency about making Iris a well-rounded character.

I think a lot of the difference in chemistry is intentional. I'm expecting (hoping) that will change as Barry's normal self matures and grows in confidence to be more like his Flash alter ego. With luck, this dalliance with Linda will be the first step to that.

As for the prison, I kinda wish the rogues were put in some hand wavy suspended animation or something. I'd have an easier time overlooking their complete loss of rights if they at least weren't aware of their miserable new existence.

[slayer2]

There comes a time in every show and every season when there must be an unequivocal dudd. The Flash, your time is now. Wow. And I mean like WOW that was TERRIBLE. /Blair Waldorf. Who wrote that? Seriously? It was like Child's Play only even Chucky would be more welcome. What WAS that? 

 

First off...are we now just throwing people in the void for any old thing? The girl stole some money for god's sakes. It's not like she was trying to blow up the city like everyone else in the basement. Sounds like if you chained her up in an old mansion and gave her a good talking to she could have come out of it okay/ circa Angel intervention Buffy season 3.

 

Secondly? It's nice (really nice) that Caitlin was so (adorably cute) forgiving of Cisco (as well she should be) but that scene which was built up over 10-odd episodes lasted all of 2minutes. Talk about wrapping it up. Nothing that happened in this story made any damn sense. Why was The Flash/Barry so hellbent on catching a teleporting girl that his father had to get stabbed? The supervault is starting to seem more 33.1 than whatever the hell it is they are intending it to be. Maybe Dr.Wells has a deal going with Lex and he's planning on collecting them all at the end of the year?

 

Thirdly, Malese Jow...is AMAZING. How did this writer find a way to make her boring? Malese Jow...boring! What the actual fuck? Whoever the writer is I demand they be fired immediately and I will use my blackboard eraser to wipe out this episode with the same generous strike I used to wipe out the DoubleMeat Palace episode on Buffy. You can't win 'em all but you sure can lose. Jees /Long Duck Dong

Edited February 5, 2015 by slayer2

[Galileo908]

Peekaboo is the first one I've really felt didn't deserve Pipeline level imprisonment. Her skills didn't exactly seem supervillain level.

 

Speaking of which, since her powers relied on being able to see, putting her in a brightly lit cell was a really dumb move.

[Raja]

I'm glad I'm not the only one thinking about Gitmo when the Pipeline Prison comes on screen.

 

And like BkWurm1 says, I'm not opposed to the existence of the prison. Meta-humans clearly cannot be safely held in regular prisons.  I most strongly object to the superhero not recognizing that it's a pretty inhumane solution.  This is the sort of thing one would expect Oliver Queen to be doing (he threw a man in a hole in the ground on a 'deserted' island).  Barry Allen isn't the same as Oliver Queen.  Every time these horrible cells come on screen, all characterization of Barry is damaged. Takes me right out of it when the hero becomes a mustache twirler at the end of every episode. 

I wouldn't go that far because our folks are a CSI and a detective. Not a jailer or corrections officer who really has to think about the long term care of prisoners. however having a prisoner showing the effects of long term solitary confinement should get the team to awaken to what they are doing and question how much power they have taken upon themselves and with someone like Peek-aboo who would probably have had a few years, not life in supermax

[CMH1981]

Wow, I know the characters don't exactly match up w/the different versions of the Flash based on history, but let's get rid of Iris and bring on Linda Park full time.  

 

The fact that we have Iris playing the role of only loving the Flash, and not Barry is such a parallel to Lois Lane being in love w/Superman but not Clark Kent is horrible.  

[Jordan27]

A lot of shows have characters that are stupid on a regular basis to create conflict.  I have a feeling that Cisco is that character here.

This is the third week in a row that he has done stupid things...

 

1. Let's bad guy character manipulate him to release him from the prison.

2. Let's bad guy escape.

3. Does this for a reason that a character told him not to be concerned about.

4. Declares at the end that no one will escape from there again.( Yeah, right.)

 

All clichés we've seen many times.

 

I didn't think Peek a boo was all that great of a bad guy.  Again, making it seem like Barry couldn't have taken her down much easier. She could move quick, but she shouldn't have been able to hit Barry.

 

And Barry and Iris have zero chemistry as a couple.  She reminds me of a high school teacher and he's the student.  

 

And that prison is getting easier to break out of than a perimeter on 24.

 

The scenes with Barry and his father were really good and for me the only good thing about this ep.

 

This is show is just being really comicky, soapy and cliché ridden right now.  I hope they can get it back on track.

Edited February 5, 2015 by Jordan27

[MDKNIGHT]

 

don't agree with that assessment of the prison. Until they show some evidence that the prisoners are being mistreated or tortured or abused in some way I don't think we can call it inhumane. If anything they all seem very comfortable if bored.don't agree with that assessment of the prison. Until they show some evidence that the prisoners are being mistreated or tortured or abused in some way I don't think we can call it inhumane. If anything they all seem very comfortable if bored.

 

There is no way that 4 people especially with other jobs can humanly take care of a bunch of prisoners.  Even murderers are allowed excercise and to talk to other people and visits from loved ones and a bunch of other activities that have to be monitored by staff.  4 people can't do anything like that and there is no evidence that is even a consideration.  BTW no showers?  Really?  Prisoners have to do something special while IN prison to get sent to solitary confinement and then there are limits to how long they can be kept there.  And we are missing one other big thing. THERE HAVE BEEN NO TRIALS.  Even Charles Manson got a trial.  So yes this whole thing is beyond most levels of vigilantism.  I initially assumed that the villains were in suspended animation and were therefore unaware.  That still wouldn't be right without trials but at least they wouldn't be conciensely suffering because of the whim of 4 people who are acting as judge jury and executioner. 

 

Edited because the quote function hadn't worked for me before.

Edited February 7, 2015 by MDKNIGHT

[driedfruit]

I don't agree with that assessment of the prison. Until they show some evidence that the prisoners are being mistreated or tortured or abused in some way I don't think we can call it inhumane.

 

Indefinite isolation is inhumane.

 

 

As for the prison, I kinda wish the rogues were put in some hand wavy suspended animation or something. I'd have an easier time overlooking their complete loss of rights if they at least weren't aware of their miserable new existence.

 

I agree, because it's starting to seriously weigh on me that the prisoners' current situation is more horrific than the fates of their victims.

 

The fact that we have Iris playing the role of only loving the Flash, and not Barry is such a parallel to Lois Lane being in love w/Superman but not Clark Kent is horrible.

 

Iris is in love with the Flash? Since when?

Edited February 5, 2015 by driedfruit

[slayer2]

I agree with all who are bitching about the prison problems. Real world Prisons have been taken to task for less, even those super-duper fucked up mass murderers who have a tiny cell with barely any light are allowed out once a day to exercise and benefit from some vitamin D. Life without sunlight brings scurvy, depression and all manner of disassociative disorders that would seem to only highlight and magnify issues the "prisoners" already have. You're not teaching them a lesson by depriving them of sunlight, human contact or emotional support and restricting them to what appears to be a room the size of a middle class walk-in closet.

 

It's not a normal thing to do and it makes Team Flash seem even more disturbed than the prisoners because they never talk about how abnormal it is and it doesn't seem to weigh them down at all (emotionally). How comfortable would you be working above a ton of super-powered people who you knew were being isolated against their will directly below you and going crazier by the second? I can easily see the ass-backwards bonkers-as-a-ninties-candysnack Dr.Wells being comfortable with this and Cisco may be take it or leave it but Caitlin and certainly Barry should be all kinds of fucked up over this. Particularly given how Ronnie died I'm surprised Caitlin isn't rocking back and forth in a corner somewhere.

Edited February 5, 2015 by slayer2

[ottoDbusdriver]

It would make more sense if they handwaved that the metahuman prison was more along the lines of a cryo-prison like in Demolition Man -- put the metahumans in a state of suspended animation, and then you wouldn't have to worry about feeding them, bathroom/shower/entertainment facilities or the possibility of the metahumans escaping.

[slayer2]

It would make more sense if they handwaved that the metahuman prison was more along the lines of a cryo-prison like in Demolition Man -- put the metahumans in a state of suspended animation, and then you wouldn't have to worry about feeding them, bathroom/shower/entertainment facilities or the possibility of the metahumans escaping.

 

Yaaaaas! Right? I could deal with that. Plus they'd be frozen and instead of 33.1 it'd be more like a timeout until they learn how to behave.

[bluebonnet]

I could totally deal with frozen metas.  I mean, it's still really questionable but on a comic show, very easy to ignore those questions and accept the hero is a hero all the time instead of just when he's outside Star Labs.  

[Oscirus]

The strangest thing about the inhumanity of the cells is that there's no opposing voice. The only possible main character that could state opposition is Iris. 

 

I wonder if that dude that Flash broke out will be killed due to snitching since it can't be too hard for that kingpin dude to figure out who told Flash about the latest robbery attempt.

[Actionmage]

I wonder if that dude that Flash broke out will be killed due to snitching since it can't be too hard for that kingpin dude to figure out who told Flash about the latest robbery attempt.

 

Again, a highlight of Barry just plain not thinking. He told the guy who shanked his dad  he'd take him back in if Shanker told him the info he needed. Shanker told him the info in as much good faith as Barry could expect. Barry then left him to the guards! Because there wasn't enough time? We were supposed to titter at Shanker getting, essentially framed for a break-out?  Also, why worry about Shanker? He tried to kill Henry, so we're supposed to root on that Barry "righteously"/ "funnily" left dude to guards and dogs? Who cares about keeping a bargain with a criminal, even if he kept his end?

 

It's just tone-deaf and not heroic to me. MMV.

 

(I am not really Edward Nygma; I just have questions due to the poor writing choices the episode presented to me as "entertaining.")

[Cirien]

WRT to Danielle 's acting on the show, I wonder if it's because Caitlyn was written as being older.

 

Maybe that's why the acting seems so....off? With the exception of Joe and Harrison and maybe Eddie, most of the main characters on the show seem very very young: at least they read that way because of the whole possible child prodigy thing. Like Barry and Iris have what just graduated or few years before the show starts?

Iris is just moving in her boyfriend and by contrast Caitlyn was engaged. That's level of maturity that would work for someone ...older. Which would have worked visually on screen with Robbie.

 

While Danielle Panabaker is at the same age that most people end up getting engaged (and intellectually similar if she graduated earlier) maybe she's too young? It doesn't help that she has a baby face. The costuming generally seems suited for someone older too.

 

(I mean if the actress was older you could ditch the stupid subplot with Barry and introduce one with Harrison if the CW insists on a soap opera style plot)

[quarks]

The strangest thing about the inhumanity of the cells is that there's no opposing voice. The only possible main character that could state opposition is Iris. 

 

 

Just adding to my growing list of reasons why Iris needs to be told.

[jah1986]

Speaking of which, since her powers relied on being able to see, putting her in a brightly lit cell was a really dumb move.

I thought Cisco said it was a mirrored room so she couldn't see out. She could only see inside the cell. Not going to think about that too hard though.

 

Unlike most, I enjoyed this episode. Having avoided all things Glee I had no idea GG could sing and was pleasantly surprised. I don't mind DP, I guess she gets my good will from Skyhigh.  I thought their night out was cute, especially Barr taking such good care of her.

 

I'm so glad Barry's father knows about the Flash. I would have been very disappointed if they kept him in the dark.

Edited February 5, 2015 by jah1986

[bluebonnet]

One of Caitlin's biggest problems is she always gets stuck with the dumbest, most awkward dialogue.  It's like some fifth grader is writing her lines.  

 

Did anyone figure out what happened to Shawna's boyfriend?  Is that just some serious continuity fail or what?  

[MarkHB]

Did anyone figure out what happened to Shawna's boyfriend?  Is that just some serious continuity fail or what?  

Isn't he the one that the Flash wanted Iris to help find, or was that the honcho he originally owed the money to?  Either way, my impression was that he was still on the lam.

[bluebonnet]

I meant, how did the boyfriend disappear from the car?  

[Trini]

Poor Eddie. He only had one scene in this episode. They at least could have had him around for some of the police stuff.

 

Also, now that the Flash has been "outed", they (Joe) need to stop hiding metahuman stuff from the police. ...But then that leads right back to the STAR Labs prison. Yeah, I hope the writers address this by the end of the season.

[slayer2]

 

(I am not really Edward Nygma; I just have questions due to the poor writing choices the episode presented to me as "entertaining.")

 

All these little Gotham references are adorbs, keep 'em coming.

 

 

I thought Cisco said it was a mirrored room so she couldn't see out. She could only see inside the cell. Not going to thing about that too hard though.

 

So wait... they locked her for eternity with mirrors so she could see nothing but herself? The fuck?! This is a woman's worst nightmare, by the time she finally escapes, what's left of her self esteem will be a big ol' zero! Sadism at its finest.

[chelsie]

I thought the meta humans were undead so don't need food, rest or maintenance.

 

Iris's pic of Flash had a clear view of his face. If she doesn't figure it out I woudn't know what to say.

Edited February 5, 2015 by chelsie

[Actionmage]

This is a woman's worst nightmare, by the time she finally escapes, what's left of her self esteem will be a big ol' zero! Sadism at its finest.

 

I don't know if she'll have zero self-esteem, as Shawna was pretty lovely, but sick of her own face? Looking at her body in toto? Yeah.

 

I also hope that the one-way mirror is on the outside of the cell; Shawna had spike heels. Once she calms down, trying to break that glass will be Job 1 for her.

 

I thought the meta humans were undead so don't need food, rest or maintenance.

 

Genuine question: Why did you think that?

Edited February 5, 2015 by Actionmage

[wayne67]

I thought the meta humans were undead so don't need food, rest or maintenance.

 

Iris's pic of Flash had a clear view of his face. If she doesn't figure it out I woudn't know what to say.

 

Except Barry needs food and continual maintenance hence the Flash Gang.

 

Wells is always going on about how the metahumans and their powers have limits and all of them seem to be energy based as the human vessel they are in can only do so much before they need to recharge with food and or rest.

 

Even if we hand wave that somehow these metahumans don't need food or sleep. That still doesn't excuse the lack of entertainment options, they still have human psychological requirements; human interactions, sunlight, relief from endless tedium and exercise.

 

Also why did they need an elaborate mirrored cell, couldn't they just have just shoved her in a basement without windows?

 

And they had Pied Piper who is an actual human who definitely requires the normal food and rest and maintenance and it seemed like Cisco was taunting him by denying him the simple request of Thai Food and we saw his room and none it would make sense for basic maintenance of a human being.

Edited February 5, 2015 by wayne67

[Sakura12]

Considering it looks like they use the exact same set for the prison, why can't the prop people throw in a futon, a sink and toilet. 

[Raja]

Poor Eddie. He only had one scene in this episode. They at least could have had him around for some of the police stuff.

 

Also, now that the Flash has been "outed", they (Joe) need to stop hiding metahuman stuff from the police. ...But then that leads right back to the STAR Labs prison. Yeah, I hope the writers address this by the end of the season.

Now that the discussion about the jail has started here and other sites I have faith that they will, maybe not this season though. Just as was done after the early days of Arrow when people started saying WTF about an archer going around killing and being our hero.

[wayne67]

Now that the discussion about the jail has started here and other sites I have faith that they will, maybe not this season though. Just as was done after the early days of Arrow when people started saying WTF about an archer going around killing and being our hero.

 

At least in that show the police had legitimate reason to be hunting him down. He was killing random mooks and the ridiculously wealthy. The show had some justification for Oliver being a bit bat shit crazy, 5 years on an island with people trying to kill him. He also had his former body guard call him out on his craziness all the time.

 

In this show, they gloat over their prisoners which ignoring the entire prison set up just feels like kicking someone while they're down. Barry the supposed good guy seems to delight in gloating to people trapped in their solitary cells with no hope of parole, conjugal visits or exercise outside their cells, he did it with Girder (I know it's the robot name but it makes more sense for metal man), Cisco did it to Pied Piper. It's all so unnecessary and undermines these people as good guys.

 

It's one thing for Wells to be doing secret experiments on the dead metahumans even though there should be security cameras all over that place. Also that prison has security cams inside the cells so the prisoners don't even have an illusion of privacy. It just seems to be cruel and unusual punishment for these people who are often a victim of circumstances and poor decision making. There's no need to continue to rub it in their faces.

 

You could just defeat them and have a cutaway scene where the "Good Guys" say such and such is in the prison. We don't need to see the prison every episode as it just rubs the illogic and cruelty continually in the audience's faces.

Edited February 5, 2015 by wayne67

[Chicago Redshirt]

Also why did they need an elaborate mirrored cell, couldn't they just have just shoved her in a basement without windows?

I suppose one-way mirrors allow them to fully observe her without using such things as cameras that might break or be broken. 

 

Again, a highlight of Barry just plain not thinking. He told the guy who shanked his dad  he'd take him back in if Shanker told him the info he needed. Shanker told him the info in as much good faith as Barry could expect. Barry then left him to the guards! Because there wasn't enough time? We were supposed to titter at Shanker getting, essentially framed for a break-out?  Also, why worry about Shanker? He tried to kill Henry, so we're supposed to root on that Barry "righteously"/ "funnily" left dude to guards and dogs? Who cares about keeping a bargain with a criminal, even if he kept his end?

 

It's just tone-deaf and not heroic to me. MMV.

I think it was not portrayed as Barry purposefully ditching Shanker, but rather Barry realizing that the purported robbery was potentially going on right that second. I suppose Barry could have taken the 10 seconds to return Shanker to his cell, but as we saw, by speeding off when he did, Barry was able to catch Peekaboo and her Boo in the act. Even that 10 seconds delay might have meant it was too late. (Not that Barry would objectively know that for a fact, but still).

 

Iris is in love with the Flash? Since when?

Iris seems to turn the flirtiness up when the Flash is nearby. Somebody who's better with the computers can come up with plenty of gifs where it looks like she has her O face on after a visit from him. (Now admittedly, that could just be the sort of amazement that most people would have at seeing someone with the Flash's abilities. But still). There's also that Eddie has IIRC accused her of having a thing for the Flash. He has been pretty perceptive about these things.

[Actionmage]

I think it was not portrayed as Barry purposefully ditching Shanker, but rather Barry realizing that the purported robbery was potentially going on right that second

 

I do get that, truly. I'm actually not all super choked-up that poor Shanker is getting the fuzzy end of the lollipop, w/r/t The Flash and the info.  The man tried to kill Henry, a character I like. Yet, it will get around that The Flash is not worth being straight with because he'll not keep good faith bargains. (I can't see someone willing to shank Henry for snitching being cool and understanding that Flash had  to get gone to use the info and stop his gang's robbery.)

 

Barry has not learned the Consequences To Actions lesson, it seems. For this one, possibly the "Keep your promises to felons/informants or you will cease to get cooperation in the future." 

 

Everyone, myself included, have headdesking over Barry's not taking Oliver's advice to heart. Well, Oliver also hasn't taken his own damn advice, so I can't get upset over Barry being hardheaded like Ollie. We will see what kinds of birds come home to roost as the season rolls on, I guess.

[Raja]

 

 

Everyone, myself included, have headdesking over Barry's not taking Oliver's advice to heart. Well, Oliver also hasn't taken his own damn advice, so I can't get upset over Barry being hardheaded like Ollie. We will see what kinds of birds come home to roost as the season rolls on, I guess.

I was telling the wife when The Flash just missed getting shot that was the exact scenario Oliver used on him in the training exercise

[wayne67]

I do get that, truly. I'm actually not all super choked-up that poor Shanker is getting the fuzzy end of the lollipop, w/r/t The Flash and the info.  The man tried to kill Henry, a character I like. Yet, it will get around that The Flash is not worth being straight with because he'll not keep good faith bargains. (I can't see someone willing to shank Henry for snitching being cool and understanding that Flash had  to get gone to use the info and stop his gang's robbery.)

 

Barry has not learned the Consequences To Actions lesson, it seems. For this one, possibly the "Keep your promises to felons/informants or you will cease to get cooperation in the future." 

 

Everyone, myself included, have headdesking over Barry's not taking Oliver's advice to heart. Well, Oliver also hasn't taken his own damn advice, so I can't get upset over Barry being hardheaded like Ollie. We will see what kinds of birds come home to roost as the season rolls on, I guess.

My problem with Barry leaving Shanker behind isn't a moral one but a logistical one.

 

1. It ignores the fact that people in gangs/prison usually have allies, friends, associates and connections that might seek retribution for Shanker's treatment on his father
2. That there was no way for Barry to know that Shanker wouldn't get another 10 years at the same prison once they heard his story that the Red Flash broke him out
3. How did Barry super speed his way through the cell doors exactly?
4. That Barry is super fast and the 3-4 seconds required for Barry to return Shanker at least to the inside of the prison if not his cell isn't that much of an effort
5. That he just did another criminal act inside and outside a prison that should have some security cameras and he should now be back on the radar of the police for engaging in more criminal acts...

 

 

My biggest problem is that none of this will be addressed as Barry continues to learn nothing from Oliver's advice or from his experience fighting metahumans. Peekaboo shouldn't have been much of a fighting threat, all Barry really needed to do was grab a hood and put it over her head and her power would have been voided. The fisticuffs made no sense. There was no indication that she had gained super strength with her teleportation power and not to belabour the point but can Barry fight anyone successfully the first time ?

[Terrafamilia]

When Barry and Caitlin got out of the elevator at Star Labs, there was a sign that said Level 600. Level 600! I hope that was metaphorical or the name of Star Lab's house band. Because LEVEL 600!!