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Pet Peeves: Aka Things That Make You Go "Gah!"


Message added by Mod-Tigerkatze,

Your Pet Peeves are your Pet Peeves and you're welcome to express them here. However, that does not mean that you can use this topic to go after your fellow posters; being annoyed by something they say or do is not a Pet Peeve.

If there's something you need clarification on, please remember: it's always best to address a fellow poster directly; don't talk about what they said, talk to them. Politely, of course! Everyone is entitled to their opinion and should be treated with respect. (If need be, check out the how to have healthy debates guidelines for more).

While we're happy to grant the leniency that was requested about allowing discussions to go beyond Pet Peeves, please keep in mind that this is still the Pet Peeves topic. Non-pet peeves discussions should be kept brief, be related to a pet peeve and if a fellow poster suggests the discussion may be taken to Chit Chat or otherwise tries to course-correct the topic, we ask that you don't dismiss them. They may have a point.

Message added by Mod-Tigerkatze,
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I'm peeved at myself for getting a therapeutic massage today instead of a soft, relaxing, essential oils one. My back and neck are totally jacked up from sleeping on a hospital couch when my mom was recovering from surgery, so it was necessary, but I'm going to be sore af tomorrow. My masseuse said he stopped counting the knots in my back at 8, ugh.

  • Love 2
1 hour ago, ParadoxLost said:

What is the deal with two lane round a bouts?  Isn't that just a four way stop where, it you are on the inside lane, the cars on your left have license to try to kill you as you try to cross one lane of traffic and merge into the inside lane of the round a bout.

Its like frogger but in a circle.

  • Love 3

Can I get a JEER to those clods who decided to fly drones close enough to  Gatwick- Great Britain's 2nd largest airport  to shut it down due to them being too close to the airplanes' flight patterns?  Sorry but I think that the time's come to insist that, rather than just keep selling them to anyone with enough cash, that ALL drone owners be licensed having completed a training course (as in cars) AND that they are required to file any flight plans at least 24 hours in advance- with consequences spelt out if they fail to maintain safety. Yeah, I like the pics taken by them and some those pics are quite amazing but when one's toys create havoc for thousands of folks needing to get from Point A to Points B , I say enough's enough! 

  • Love 9
18 hours ago, ParadoxLost said:

There are states that passed laws that everyone must get ID'd.  I live in one.  Its not always the company.

Or it's corporate policy. I'm a fan of 'we card everyone'. It takes the burden off the employee to make that judgement call and if they get hassled they can point that it's company policy. I'm also a fan of bars that card everyone for the same reasons.

  • Love 7
23 hours ago, theredhead77 said:

Or it's corporate policy. I'm a fan of 'we card everyone'. It takes the burden off the employee to make that judgement call and if they get hassled they can point that it's company policy. I'm also a fan of bars that card everyone for the same reasons.

One time I went out to a favorite bar and I was in some kind of cranky state (boy-related, I'm guessing). The bouncer there carded a bunch of people walking in ahead me and my friends. Well, he did not card me and, due to my mood, I saltily (and inexplicably) snapped something like, "Oh, I guess I look old then?!" The poor guy looked sad and quietly said, "No, I already know you--you come here all the time." He had been about to say hi when I got all indignant!

Edited by TattleTeeny
  • Love 4
5 hours ago, ari333 said:

Our bank is kind of far. Sometimes I get cash back at the grocery. I hate it when the cashier SCREAMS  my money back to me. yeah go ahead and tell everyone I have 100 $ in cash. I am old and have a bad leg. Just scream it.

 It beats having medical history screamed back! Yes, I've had that happen and while I have nothing shameful or embarrassing in my history, it's really NO ONE ELSE's BIZ! BOO!

Edited by Blergh
no ed
  • Love 8

I have got to vent about my neighbors. They have been the caraway seed in my wisdom teeth for years. First, it was their stupid fucking dogs and their non stop LOUD barking. Well, the fucking things finally croaked and we had peace for a while. Now, today on Christmas Eve, they are jackhammering their fucking front steps. It has been non stop since eight o'clock this morning. I have family coming this afternoon and I swear to all that is holy I'm going to start cutting a bitch if it doesn't stop.

  • Love 6
22 minutes ago, peacheslatour said:

I have got to vent about my neighbors. They have been the caraway seed in my wisdom teeth for years. First, it was their stupid fucking dogs and their non stop LOUD barking. Well, the fucking things finally croaked and we had peace for a while. Now, today on Christmas Eve, they are jackhammering their fucking front steps. It has been non stop since eight o'clock this morning. I have family coming this afternoon and I swear to all that is holy I'm going to start cutting a bitch if it doesn't stop.

Oh hells yeah, sorry to hear about your ongoing neighbor frustrations, @peacheslatour; somehow this time of year really up’s the ante on assholish neighbors’ loud activities.

Like the loudmouth with no inside voice in the loft next to mine decided to start yammering on his phone around 8ish this morning while I attempted to sleep in. He might as well have been in bed with my husband and me, the way his voice was booming through our radiator vent into our bedroom. Never mind his incessantly hacking smokers cough I hear every night, even over my earplugs. My sentiments to the poor bastards who have to deal with that loud dicklick this holiday season.

On the other side is the asshole adolescent with dippy new-agey parents(aka they’re *not* disciplinarians) whom I’ve had to listen to meltdown ever harder than usual at this time of year since they adopted his ass 9 years ago. After his raging, stomping 20-minute shit-fit last night as I sipped egg nog and attempted to relax and watch TV, I hope he gets nothing but a dingleberry-covered lump of coal this year. Or a straightjacket. And maybe a good child psychologist/meds, because that kid is nuts.

Sorry to sound all Scrooge-like; I actually love the holidays. I just can’t take rude assholes who get even ruder around this time.

 

And @ALenore, I feel ya on the pointless one-star reviews online, books or otherwise; one of the many reasons I follow the hilarious website www.bitchywaiter.com is because he lives to publicly disgrace those morons on his site who leave such idiotic reviews on Yelp or Facebook. So many people have no idea just how harmful those reviews can be for local business owners! I actually had a few back and forth’s with one such moron at Yelp who left a one star review for my friend’s restaurant because “phone was busy throughout brunch service.” Um, just because your dumb ass can’t get someone on the phone during a restaurant’s peak hours, does NOT give you the right to completely diss an entire restaurant you didn’t even eat at or visit!!

Reminds me of this sad-but-true meme: 

2949834C-926E-4E37-99A5-2F6753171A3C.jpeg

On that note...happy holidays, everyone. Keep venting and being the best you can be otherwise.

Edited by Sun-Bun
  • Love 6

Oy vey--it's that time of year: the time that I field 165 calls from my mom asking what I can eat.

  • Yesterday: "You eat chicken, right?" "No, Mom--no meat." "Oh, that's right, hahahhahahhaa--never mind!"
  • Last night: "Hi, it's me: I can make eggplant parm!" "Well, thank you but..." "What?" "No cheese--nothing from an animal." "Ohhhhhh, what about chicken parm?" (This woman just really wants to make chicken!) "Don't worry--I'll make some kind of pasta to bring."
  • Earlier today: "I am making shrimp cocktail for you! And spinach quiche!" (The quiche is extra funny because I have hated eggs my whole life!)
  • An hour ago (after I made a giant thing of vegan mac & cheese*): "I made you some lemon-butter pasta!"

Oh, Mom.

* Bonus peeve (not that my mom herself is the peeve, exactly--but if that phone rings once more...): Our oven is being a real asshole. Works fine for a while, then seems to start losing heat. Either that or I have somehow developed super powers that allow me to touch and even remove a metal tray at 400 degrees with my bare hands.
 

Edited by TattleTeeny
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34 minutes ago, Sun-Bun said:

Nope, I dunno what’s up with that link; just a meme pic I uploaded from my collection. Sorry about that!

 

4 hours ago, Sun-Bun said:

one of the many reasons I follow the hilarious website www.bitchywaiter.com

I was trying to check out website you linked but goes to a domain landing page.

image.thumb.png.c66429c8634b0c941ea42f1cfaeaf9cd.png

  • Love 1

My parents' neighbors are having a party, and playing bass-heavy music at 11:30 at night loud enough that I can hear it - not just feel the bass, hear the music - through triple pane windows and across a rather large yard for Los Angeles.  Jackasses (they moved in a few years ago and have been annoying ever since).  I had the TV on in the living room, and now that I'm in my old bedroom I'll just put my headphones on, as I won't go to sleep for another couple of hours anyway, but how rude. 

  • Love 3
12 hours ago, AgentRXS said:

Last night I heard fireworks for the first time ever on Christmas Eve. Its not enough to limit it to New Years and the 4th. Now we have to have Christmas fireworks. 

Oh well. Wishing my fellow PTVers(for those of you who celebrate) a Happy Holiday.

I'd never heard of fireworks on Xmas or New Year's Eve until I moved down to Raleigh. We're now in the the metro DC area & I'm still hearing them. Annoying!

  • Love 1
11 hours ago, TattleTeeny said:

Hope you all had a peeve-free day today!

December 26 is National Whiners Day. You are allowed to whine about anything EXCEPT what you did or didn’t receive as gifts. You should be thankful for all you have and acknowledge there are others less fortunate than you, but go right ahead and whine about eating too much (check), having to go back to work (check), and other things today. 

  • Love 5
3 hours ago, JTMacc99 said:

December 26 is National Whiners Day. You are allowed to whine about anything EXCEPT what you did or didn’t receive as gifts. You should be thankful for all you have and acknowledge there are others less fortunate than you, but go right ahead and whine about eating too much (check), having to go back to work (check), and other things today. 

I'll go first. Another holiday where I was sick for most of it--body aches, fever, headache verging on migraine. So I barely ate. Instead, I spent most of it on my couch, just watching Nash Bridges (DON'T JUDGE!) to make sure all the dvds were in good condition. And counting the number of dimples that Don Johnson has. I SAID, DON'T.JUDGE.ME.

  • Love 6

@GHScorpiosRule - you were obviously not thinking clearly because of a high fever and bad headache.

 

We ate Christmas dinner at my brother's - I make the main dish for carnivores, a fruit & vegetable plate and my SIL makes a ton of other stuff.  This year I made prime rib (which turned out nicely).  Regrettably, I did not provide supervision when my brother was divvying up the leftovers and I believe I got shorted. 

This is going to go on his permanent record and will be brought up at next year's Festivus.

  • Love 10

dangerous peeve. toddlers outside unsupervised in an apt complex. someone could snatch them. a car can hit them. they dart in and out of parked cars. WHERE ARE THE EFFING PARENTS? it is not once. many times. I called management. They asked what apt they live in, well how the hell do I know? Come back here and ask them

  • Love 6
12 minutes ago, ari333 said:

dangerous peeve. toddlers outside unsupervised in an apt complex. someone could snatch them. a car can hit them. they dart in and out of parked cars. WHERE ARE THE EFFING PARENTS? it is not once. many times. I called management. They asked what apt they live in, well how the hell do I know? Come back here and ask them

Call your local PDs non-emergency number. Tell them there are unsupervised toddlers running around a parking lot and you are concerned for their safety. They should send an officer to help these kids find their way home.

  • Love 7

Two pet peeves already today:

1. While out running errands I got stuck behind a guy who is apparently serving up lunch to the person in the backseat, while driving through a parking lot. He's going about 2 mph and keeps turning around to hand things to the backseat, which caused us both to miss the green light at the main entrance. 

2. While walking the dog, she stops to pee in a neighbor's yard. I kept hearing a knocking noise while she was sniffing the same yard and I eventually saw someone in the window knocking on it. I have no idea what's going on so I just wave and we continue on our way. A few houses down, I see an adult and two kids in the front yard looking at the area where she peed. I guess they thought she pooped and I was just going to walk away without picking it up? I'm slightly familiar with these neighbors and I thought they knew I'm not a person who would leave their dog's poop in someone's front yard, but I guess not. For some reason, it made me really irritated. 

I'm not leaving the house again until the new year if I can help it.

  • Love 7
On 12/23/2018 at 7:13 PM, Blergh said:
On 12/23/2018 at 5:45 PM, ari333 said:

Our bank is kind of far. Sometimes I get cash back at the grocery. I hate it when the cashier SCREAMS  my money back to me. yeah go ahead and tell everyone I have 100 $ in cash. I am old and have a bad leg. Just scream it.

 It beats having medical history screamed back! Yes, I've had that happen and while I have nothing shameful or embarrassing in my history, it's really NO ONE ELSE's BIZ! BOO!

 

Blergh, I do agree that it is very inappropriate to have staff scream out your medical history to everybody and their dog.   However,  in the case of ari333, having the supermarket cashier screaming out the amount of cash money they have just paid out to an older person with a bad leg is a loud broadcast invitation for any lowlife within earshot to try to assault and rob him/her once they leave the store.

  • Love 5

Oh, another food peeve* has fallen upon me! OK, so, my neighbor (who was on Hell's Kitchen, haha!) has a rustic-style Italian restaurant. It's doing well so he opened a more casual pizza place--and he has vegan options (clearly not the peeve). The soft opening (just pizza, not entrees, etc.) is tonight and I yelled with joy when I saw the menu. So I called immediately to make a pizza order and drat! Only the "normal" pizza is available tonight. Boo, I was so excited!

*I guess not really a full-on peeve, just a temporary setback. Oooh, I can't wait until next week!

Also, by the way, my family, who cannot understand why anyone would be vegan, basically inhaled the entire tray of mac & "cheese" I brought to Xmas dinner. 

Edited by TattleTeeny
  • Love 4

So a few days ago, my mom told me my son, who measured at around the 7th percentile in terms of weight for his age, is fairly normal/higher (maybe 30-40th?) in many charts from Asia.  However, his HEIGHT is more like 30th percentile (North American charts), making him likely in the 60th percentile on Asian charts.  This means he's a long and lean type, but my mom insists that it's "average."  And that's no matter what I say.  Average-average would mean both percentiles are fairly close together, no?  Sorry, I'm new at this whole parent thing...

Those are statistical averages based on some pretty substantial numbers.  My son was average-average at birth, but in a few months he was close to the top percentile in height and dropped to 40s in weight.  The pediatrician said he was fine and not concerned at that point, but to try bumping up his diet (breast milk) by mixing in a small amount of rice cereal.  For as long as they charted him, he pretty much stayed in the same percentiles after that - high end on height, slightly below average on weight.

I would suggest seeing what your pediatrician has to say and if he/she has any concerns.

On ‎12‎/‎26‎/‎2018 at 2:36 PM, emma675 said:

2. While walking the dog, she stops to pee in a neighbor's yard. I kept hearing a knocking noise while she was sniffing the same yard and I eventually saw someone in the window knocking on it. I have no idea what's going on so I just wave and we continue on our way. A few houses down, I see an adult and two kids in the front yard looking at the area where she peed. I guess they thought she pooped and I was just going to walk away without picking it up? I'm slightly familiar with these neighbors and I thought they knew I'm not a person who would leave their dog's poop in someone's front yard, but I guess not. For some reason, it made me really irritated. 

I had a neighbor who expressed irritation that my dog peed on their lawn.  She thought it would wreck the grass.   Yeah, because all the rabbits and squirrels and geese, not to mention racoons and possums, don't PEE  on grass?  

  • Love 3
3 hours ago, PRgal said:

So a few days ago, my mom told me my son, who measured at around the 7th percentile in terms of weight for his age, is fairly normal/higher (maybe 30-40th?) in many charts from Asia.  However, his HEIGHT is more like 30th percentile (North American charts), making him likely in the 60th percentile on Asian charts.  This means he's a long and lean type, but my mom insists that it's "average."  And that's no matter what I say.  Average-average would mean both percentiles are fairly close together, no?  Sorry, I'm new at this whole parent thing...

You are correct.   It sounds like he's lean for his height.  My kids were always like that - average weight, but very tall, so actually underweight for their height. 

Remember though, that the growth charts are important not just for comparison to what's average.  Pediatricians track height and weight over time, to spot trends which could indicate medical problems.   When a change in weight, height, or head circumference percentile is dramatic, either a sharp drop off or a jump, it can indicate genetic developmental issues.  Same as when one of those three measures is very different from the others.   (an interesting aside, one early indicator of autism is a dramatic increase in head circumference - like a jump from 50th percentile to 90th) 

4 hours ago, tinkerbell said:

I had a neighbor who expressed irritation that my dog peed on their lawn.  She thought it would wreck the grass.   Yeah, because all the rabbits and squirrels and geese, not to mention racoons and possums, don't PEE  on grass?  

Yes, dog urine can damage your lawn.  I don't know that a random piddle from a passing dog will make a big difference; having your dog use the same area in your backyard is probably more destructive, but grass can be damaged from it - as well as from urine from other animals.

https://www.thesprucepets.com/dog-urine-brown-spots-on-grass-1118287

  • Love 3

In just the month that we had a dog* at my parents' house when I was a teenager, she managed to kill the grass in at least one sizable circle, maybe two, with her pee; I guess she had her favorite pee spots despite the large backyard. 

*She was a stray who just walked up to my mom one morning in the driveway; we unsuccessfully looked around the neighborhood for an owner, then took her to the shelter and told them to call us if she wasn't claimed (or adopted by someone -- basically, do not kill her), and because she was a pit mix, as soon as her 3-day owner hold was up, they called to say she'd be euthanized if we didn't adopt her, so we did and kept her until we could find a good home for her. 

  • Love 6

In my retirement community, people will cut a bitch if someone lets their dog pee on a neighbor's property. Guy drew a gun on a dog walker a couple of weeks ago.

Our local discussion board has this convo on permanent repeat:

If urine is so harmless, let them pee on your lawn!
I can't control where my dog pees when we're on a walk!
Ever heard of a leash!
What's the big deal! It's just a bit of pee!
IT'S MY PROPERTY AND MY LAWN!

Even so, feces is where it gets real.

I'm peeved about the weather. 71 degrees in late December may sound kind of dreamy, except for the 96% humidity. I needed to set the A/C to 68 degrees just so the thermostat would kick in and remove some of the moisture. I swear, weather in Central Florida only meets my needs for about 8 weeks out of the year.

  • Love 5

A few peeves:

I understand straws are wasteful and I respect the No Straw Movement. In fact, I'll often not use a straw at a restaurant. BUT if I'm at a restaurant that doesn't look 100% clean, I. WILL. USE. A. STRAW. I'm peeved by the baby killer looks I get from the waiter when I ask for a straw.

My birthday was a few weeks ago. I had a common, non-assuming boring cake. Which is what I wanted. Everyone was surprised I didn't have one of those extra super themed cakes that are basically all style and no flavor. People kept bringing it up so much I realized it'd been years since I've had a slice of simple birthday cake -- everything is covered in fondant and 3D these days. Bah, I long for simpler times. 

  • Love 13
6 hours ago, Stenbeck said:

I understand straws are wasteful and I respect the No Straw Movement. In fact, I'll often not use a straw at a restaurant. BUT if I'm at a restaurant that doesn't look 100% clean, I. WILL. USE. A. STRAW. I'm peeved by the baby killer looks I get from the waiter when I ask for a straw.

I was on Amazon shopping (before Christmas) and for $4.99 purchased 4 stainless steel straws with a cleaning brush. I gave them out as Christmas prezzies. I take mine out to eat in a ziplock, use it, put it back in the bag and bring it home for washing. Problem solved. Everyone loves them. Especially those who like milkshakes. They are so thick they don’t suck up through a paper straw. 

  • Love 8
8 hours ago, Stenbeck said:

Everyone was surprised I didn't have one of those extra super themed cakes that are basically all style and no flavor

People who know me would drop dead from a heart attack if I had an ornately decorated cake.  The fanciest I get is a Carvel ice cream cake (which I love beyond reason).

 

1 hour ago, Mindthinkr said:

I gave them out as Christmas prezzies.

I bought some of the re-usable straws at IKEA, they are not metal though, and gave some out as presents too.

  • Love 9
6 minutes ago, DeLurker said:

The fanciest I get is a Carvel ice cream cake (which I love beyond reason).

My favorite too. Love that cookie crunch between the layers. There was a Carvel about half hour from where I grew up and I have fond memories of my older (by 16 years) brother and sister taking me there for a treat when I was younger. 

  • Love 3
22 minutes ago, Mindthinkr said:

Love that cookie crunch between the layers.

The best part!

There used to be some Carvel ice cream stores in South Florida when I was growing up, so we used to get the commercials on tv.  The guy's voice was like gravel and that found 100 ways to use the Fudgey the Whale mold throughout the year.

When I lived in California, a store opened up a few towns over.  I used to take the kids there every once in a while, but I think it was more of a treat for me!

  • Love 3
4 hours ago, Mindthinkr said:

I was on Amazon shopping (before Christmas) and for $4.99 purchased 4 stainless steel straws with a cleaning brush.

Thanks for the suggestion! I ordered a set with a carrying case.

It never occurred to me to take reusable straws to a restaurant; I just drink from the danged glass. In my area you have to specifically tell the servers not to bring straws. Even if they're left unopened on the table, I have a feeling the bussers just toss them. (P.S. I live in a state where the governor has banned the use of climate change or global warming in official state communications.)

I take Rubbermaid containers to restaurants to use for leftovers and wait staff have pretty much stopped boggling about that, so progress.

Edited by 2727
  • Love 4

My pet peeve is me. Inspired by the conversation going on in the Transitions thread, I cleaned out all my drawers of unnecessary paperwork/clutter, and I plan to do the closets sometime after the new year. My problem is that every time I go through my clothes, I convince myself I can lose the 10 or 20 lbs needed to wear some of the stuff again, knowing damn well I am not. I always  end up parting with very little. I know a lot of people struggle with the same issue, but I just annoy the crap out of myself every time I attempt to get started.

Wish me luck that this is the year that I finally wake up and smell the roses.

  • Love 14
25 minutes ago, AgentRXS said:

My pet peeve is me. Inspired by the conversation going on in the Transitions thread, I cleaned out all my drawers of unnecessary paperwork/clutter, and I plan to do the closets sometime after the new year. My problem is that every time I go through my clothes, I convince myself I can lose the 10 or 20 lbs needed to wear some of the stuff again, knowing damn well I am not. I always  end up parting with very little. I know a lot of people struggle with the same issue, but I just annoy the crap out of myself every time I attempt to get started.

Wish me luck that this is the year that I finally wake up and smell the roses.

I used to do that all the time.  But about 5ish years ago, I realized I'd never fit into that stuff again.  Now I just tell myself that if I somehow get down to that size, I'd much rather buy new, fun clothes than wear the old stuff.  That works!

 

Good luck!!

  • Love 5
4 hours ago, DeLurker said:

People who know me would drop dead from a heart attack if I had an ornately decorated cake.  The fanciest I get is a Carvel ice cream cake (which I love beyond reason).

I grew up in the nyc suburbs, there used to be lots of Carvels by me when I was growing up and we went to them all the time.    Now they're all gone and I miss them.    Their soft ice cream and thick shakes were the best.

  • Love 3
54 minutes ago, AgentRXS said:

My pet peeve is me. Inspired by the conversation going on in the Transitions thread, I cleaned out all my drawers of unnecessary paperwork/clutter, and I plan to do the closets sometime after the new year. My problem is that every time I go through my clothes, I convince myself I can lose the 10 or 20 lbs needed to wear some of the stuff again, knowing damn well I am not. I always  end up parting with very little. I know a lot of people struggle with the same issue, but I just annoy the crap out of myself every time I attempt to get started.

Wish me luck that this is the year that I finally wake up and smell the roses.

I cleaned out my closet last week and am taking the clothes to the resale shop today. I have work pants (chinos) and jeans from size 6 to 14. I have two dresses(!) I forgot I had that I can't wear anymore. I'm brokenhearted that I've gained weight and can't wear the clothes anymore, but they're just taking up space, and I desperately need the money I can get from selling them. It sucks, but I don't have the capacity to maniacally work out and try to get to a smaller size. There's just more to life than what size I am. My mental health is more important than my waistline. *shrug*

The stores I take clothes to are Clothes Mentor and Plato's Closet. They may be in your area. They skew kind of young and inexpensive; they definitely aren't the fancy consignment shops you think of when you think "consignment shop". I buy my jeans there because they still have the styles that the stores have discontinued.

Sending you love, @AgentRXS. You are so much more than your size.

  • Love 6
Message added by Mod-Tigerkatze,

Your Pet Peeves are your Pet Peeves and you're welcome to express them here. However, that does not mean that you can use this topic to go after your fellow posters; being annoyed by something they say or do is not a Pet Peeve.

If there's something you need clarification on, please remember: it's always best to address a fellow poster directly; don't talk about what they said, talk to them. Politely, of course! Everyone is entitled to their opinion and should be treated with respect. (If need be, check out the how to have healthy debates guidelines for more).

While we're happy to grant the leniency that was requested about allowing discussions to go beyond Pet Peeves, please keep in mind that this is still the Pet Peeves topic. Non-pet peeves discussions should be kept brief, be related to a pet peeve and if a fellow poster suggests the discussion may be taken to Chit Chat or otherwise tries to course-correct the topic, we ask that you don't dismiss them. They may have a point.

Message added by Mod-Tigerkatze,

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