S02.E05: The Weeping Lady

[tv echo]

This episode showed us two significant things:

 

First, this episode marks the beginning of Ichabod's disillusionment with Katrina.  Before, he was completely in love with Katrina, thought she was virtually perfect, and trusted her fully.  Now, he is beginning to wonder if he can trust her or whether he even knows her.  Since it is unlikely that Ichabod would ever divorce Katrina - I think he takes his marriage vows too seriously to do that, perhaps Katrina will eventually turn evil and be killed.  Katrina is showing her true manipulative colors.  Like others here, I also wouldn't be surprised if we later find out that Katrina bewitched Ichabod into falling in love with her so that she could control one of the witnesses.  If that's the case, then Ichabod could consider his marriage vows invalid and feel free to divorce her.

 

Second, we now know that Hawley and Jenny did indeed hook up in the past, but Hawley is now no longer interested in doing that - perhaps because he is intrigued by Abbie.  Although "ick" on the sister-swapping, the show may be setting up tension between the sisters - again "ick" on a possible love triangle dividing them.

 

Other notes:
- Ichabod gets to save Abbie this time, although he needed Hawley to perform CPR.
- Now we know how Katrina planned to communicate with Ichabod while trapped in the Horseman's house (little bluebird), but why waste her suppressed powers just to send a love note with no vital info?
- Poor Miss Caroline.  I wish she had survived.  She had more chemistry with Ichabod than Katrina - or Abbie for that matter.

[DeLurker]

 

I guess Ladies Love Cool Ichabod

LL Cool I - Colonial Rapper

 

Winnief - more likely the bewitching took form of the Victoria Secret push up bra, but I like your theory.  Easy for me to believe since Katrina is the Black Void of the show which absorbs and destroys all decent acting.

[DearEvette]

Even if Mary did 'trip' and 'happen to hit her head' and Katrina didn't straight up kill her she still lied about it. She faked that note and sent it to Ichabod. Shady.

 

An not only that, she had to dispose of the body.  And since Mary was all about water & drowning people, Katrina most likely dumped her in the river.  Yikes.

[lucindabelle]

The thing that really gives me pause is th fake letter. Mary had family too. That part of the lie is evil and I'd be severely weirded out if I were Ichy.

More of Ichy and the reenactors, please.

[Latverian Diplomat]

Word. I wonder what Abbie said to the paramedics to explain why she was soaking wet in the middle of the library. 

I'm going to go with Ichabod claiming it was a freak water fountain accident, possibly with some editorializing about the dangers of putting faith in infernal conveniences instead of the character building exercise of drawing water from the well oneself.

 

Aww, I really liked Caroline. She could have been an acclimating friend for Ichabod,

She could also have been a reliable source of the period clothing he insists on wearing.

 

Then again... What the heck is hellfire? Why does moloch want her so badly? He did say he wants her turned which is pretty conclusive evidence that she isn't already.

There are still two openings for horsemen, correct? And the two we have are connected to Ichabod already.

 

This week 's nit pick: When Mary and Katrina are in the water, why don 't their big full skirts rise up?

 

If they were teleported into the water, there's no reason the air under their skirts would come along with.

[Neurochick]

I couldn't stand Mary, what a weak person.  Someone get her a copy of "He's Just NOT that Into You." 

[AConspiracy]

It's the same today as it was 200 years ago: when a woman churns butter for you she wants you!

[proserpina65]

Can Crane not swim? Why didn’t he jump in the hole to rescue Abbie instead of just reaching his hand in to try and grab her?

 

Maybe not.  Many people didn't learn to swim in the 18th century.  Including a large number of sailors in His Majesty's Navy, surprisingly enough.

[GinevradiBenci]

 

I guess Ladies Love Cool Ichabod.

Arrgh! I just used this as a quick throwaway line in a post about the show on another site - great minds, I suppose.

 

I feel like 90% of my problem with Katrina is the fact that she is played with an over-the-top LADY FROM THE PAST aspect to her voice and somehow she doesn't make it work like Tom Mison manages. She ends up sounding like she stepped out of a bodice-ripper and it makes it hard for her to deliver her lines in any sort of way I find convincing, especially in comparison to Abby, who isn't saddled with it. Honestly, I'm kinda rooting for her to turn Abraham back to the good (or at least the not-actively-evil) and ride off with him into their own happy sunset. Can't a witch and a headless dude just go build a new life for themselves? I say yes. 

 

I want more Jenny and less Romancing the Stone. And I want to know what Irving is doing. Can he please be looking up supernatural contract law, or something? I'd love it if he countersued Henry.

[proserpina65]

Good episode on the whole. The beginning was slow, but the end really picked up.

 

I actually thought the opposite, that the episode started out strong and became really creepy, but then got to the answer of the Weeping Lady mystery way too early and went downhill from there.  Except for the reveal to Ichabod that Katrina had lied to him about one more thing.  And Henry getting reamed out by Moloch.  Those two bits rocked.

 

[GinevradiBenci]

Also, to me Mary read as way more Victorian than she did late 18th-century. I think it's mostly due to the hat and the parasol she kept waving around. I didn't really get a good enough look at the dress. I suppose it works, since Weeping Lady spectres feel more Victorian anyway, but she looked odd next to Ichabod in his tricorn.

[proserpina65]

Yeah, as fun as the Caroline misunderstanding scene and sweet apology, the Ichabod can learn to drive, but not CPR ?

 

I'm guessing the need for it hadn't come up before.  But Ichy definitely needs to get on that right away.

[catrox14]

I heard Lew-tenant a few times as well. Maybe Ichabod is just starting to adapt his language to the times and he'll use Lef-tenant vs lew-tenant whilst adapting.

 

Or we are going to get a big mindscrew soon that this has not been the real Ichabod or that Abbie is hallucinating and still in Purgatory.

[Eliza422]

I heard Lew-tenant a few times as well. Maybe Ichabod is just starting to adapt his language to the times and he'll use Lef-tenant vs lew-tenant whilst adapting.

 

Or we are going to get a big mindscrew soon that this has not been the real Ichabod or that Abbie is hallucinating and still in Purgatory.

 

 

He has said "Lew-tenant" a couple of times in this episode and last episode as well. I hope you are wrong and that's not a hint of something more sinister! Although it could be super awesome too...

[Lila82]

Mary was a dead ringer for Creedence Leonore Gielgud (of Ancient Druid Origins), but with better brows.  Inspired costuming for the win.

 

I'm going to need Abbie to lay off the pistol fire.  At this point, she knows better than to shoot at supernatural creatures, and it's a danger to civilians.  She might be a cop, but there are more appropriate weapons for this kind of fight.

 

I'm also going to need help understanding Mary's wrath: did Henry make her angry or just unleash repressed anger?  I'm leaning towards the latter, which makes me hate Katrina all the more.  Don't tell Mary how to feel!  Let her get her revenge on.

 

The CPR thing doesn't bother me.  Why would Ichabod know CPR?  He's still grasping the basics of 21st Century living and specialized skills would come into play on a need-to-know basis.  He's struggling with logging into Abbie's user account; CPR would be far down the list.

[HalcyonDays]

What happened to the diversity on this show?  Last night, Abbie was the only POC for most of the hour.

 

Well, it would all depend on which characters they assemble together, based on the story need. Last season, Crane was the only white guy, during the episode where Macey was possessed. This week, the characters just all happen to be white, except for Abbie. Sometimes its a 50/50 split. I'm sure next week the ratio will change again.

 

Besides the theorizing that Katrina may have played more of a role in Mary's death than she let on, (which seems entirely plausible but I don't know if the show will go there,) there is another possibility as well; that Mary's accusation that Katrina had 'bewitched' Ichabod may have had more truth to it than anyone realized, and that yes indeed Katrina's need to secure the Witness to the cause, made her use magic to stack the deck in her favor by ensuring his affections.  (This frankly would explain a LOT.)  Of course the problem for Katrina would be that whatever she used isn't completely foolproof, as evidenced by his recent anger towards her and perhaps more significantly by his bond with Abbie.  Like not even the most powerful of enchantments could stand in the way of the immediate connection between the two witnesses.

 

Or maybe I'm just reaching.  What do you think?

 

No, I don't think you are reaching, actually. Henry at the end mentioned "severing the bond' between Ichabod and Katrina. Those again were such odd words to use, that it stood out to me. Severing a bond? Why not just say "turn Ichabod against Katrina" or vise verse. I have always thought it possible that she cast a spell on Ichabod in that the scene in last years Sin Eater, when Katrina was whispering in his ear. It would explain some of his behaviour, to be honest. And from very early on in season 1, I have always thought that Ichabod was deliberately put on his Witness path and manipulated by Washington, Katrina and everyone else around. It's just too bad no one bothered to tell Ichabod himself.

[Amethyst]

And when she and Katrina met? And she's calling out K on "stealing" Ichabod and how she must be a witch? She was totally right. Not that a person can be stolen, natch, Ichabod broke up with her before he left England, but Katrina's weak-ass "I'm engaged to Abraham" was completely transparent, and she is a witch.

 

I don't think Katrina assisted Mary over that cliff; I think what happened is what we were shown. She ducked out of the way, Mary went over and hit her head, Katrina went to check on her---and just decided on a prudent, Keep The Witness Here course of action, all the while lying to herself about her real motives. And that's why Katrina is so vulnerable. She can't admit the fact that circumstance dedicated emergency or no, she also doesn't want to marry Abraham, to lose Ichabod, to deal with the whole "I went out to meet this woman and she ended up dead..." thing--she chooses the easy path, the one paved with secret after secret, lie after lie. Yes, she mostly does it for the greater good, but she won't admit it's not all Big And Noble Motives. 

 

Nobody wants to admit to the ignoble parts of themselves, the part that wants to marry somebody no matter who it hurts, the part that wants to yell "YES, HE LOVES ME, NOT YOU," the part that realizes that it's become really really easy to lie. Lying has become a part of you, not just a series of one-offs, a part of who you are. 

 

Word to all of this.  While I don't think Katrina killed Mary, she can't admit to anyone (including herself) that her actions in the end weren't purely altruistic.  It wasn't just that Ichabod was a Witness, it was that he would have left the colonies for Mary's burial back in England and Katrina might never see him again.  Maybe he would meet some other woman.  Who knows.  At any rate, it wasn't a risk Katrina was willing to take, and it backfired.

 

This is why Katrina lying to Ichabod is so much worse, because it's easy to assume that she killed Mary because of her own jealousy.  And the funny thing is, Ichabod probably would have believed Katrina had she told the truth, because he was fully aware of Mary's jealous nature. 

 

Why didn't Katrina just put Mary's soul to rest back in their century?  Could have saved them all a lot of trouble.

[Primetimer]

Crane knew Mary well (but threw her over for Katrina); now she's raisin' hell (because Henry's a petty turd).

Read the story

[johntfs]

 

I also don't really see why he is needed.  I'm scratching my head as to why Jenny couldn't serve the same purpose as him while having a personal stake in it all.  It's especially annoying since ever since Hawley has had more to do, Jenny has been largely MIA.

 

Hawley is "needed" to be a romantic obstacle between Abbie and Ichabod.  Jenny is not going to date her own sister and she really doesn't need to fall for Ichabod because at that point Ichabod is basically collecting a harem.  I'm fine with an "opposites attract" romance between Abbie and Hawley.

[johntfs]

Maybe not.  Many people didn't learn to swim in the 18th century.  Including a large number of sailors in His Majesty's Navy, surprisingly enough.

 

That was deliberate.  Sailors knew that if the ship sank, there would be no rescue.  They preferred to die quickly from drowning rather than swim and eventually die from thirst, exhaustion or being eaten by sharks.

[marceline]

This is what I was hoping for when Kartina left Purgatory. Now she gets to be fleshed out as something more than Crane's Manic Pixie Dream Witch. Now she's a person with her own thoughts who made bad decisions that Crane is going to have to come to terms with. We also finally get to see her be a powerful witch instead of just hearing about it. I can easily see Katrina starting to stray from the cause. Both she and Crane have lost everything. I can see it turning her dark while Ichabod stays on the side of good especially with Abraham and Henry whispering in her ear. Again the question this season seems to be "Who can you trust?"

 

So sad to see Caroline's death. I liked the idea of Ichabod having a friend other than Abbie. Mison played the hell out of Crane's grief and sense of responsibility for Caroline's death and his panic at the thought of losing Abbie. I'm no shipper but I eat that stuff up with a spoon.

 

I'm officially tired of Hawley. He's had three eps of introduction now let's put him on the backburner for a while and bring back the Mills sisters being badass and getting Irving out of the asylum.

[rubyred]

I would be more likely to believe Katrina's version of events re: Mary's death if she had tripped and fallen INTO THE RIVER, not over a cliff. If she was already dead when she went into the river, why would that be her murder weapon of choice as the Weeping Lady? Shouldn't she be throwing people over a cliff? Maybe that is being too logical for an urban legend.

Once Ichabod started listing Katrina's lies -- none of which were little white lies, they were all damn huge lies, I was like dayum, and you're just now starting to face the reality that your beloved is shady?

I am not too worried about a Abbie/Hawley/Jenny triangle, because it would be extremely OOC for Abbie to start up a romance with anyone while all this is going on, let alone with someone who's an ex of her sister. And Abbie has never had a problem laying that out to men who are interested -- thinking back to "adjust your expectations" to Luke last year, when he was just suggesting coffee. One of the things I like best about Abbie is her bluntness. She hasn't shown any romantic interest in Hawley (or in Crane, TBH, bless her) and I don't think it's because she's hiding her true feelings from herself. She's got too much else going on, like, say, saving the world. She doesn't have time for messy emotional foolishness.

I'm sure they'll do some dumbass thing where Hawley starts looking at Abbie with moonie eyes, and Jenny will sense it and get jelly (yawn) but I doubt there will be much reciprocity there. Abbie is too focused to let that stuff get in the way of her job.

[marceline]

I am not too worried about a Abbie/Hawley/Jenny triangle, because it would be extremely OOC for Abbie to start up a romance with anyone while all this is going on, let alone with someone who's an ex of her sister. And Abbie has never had a problem laying that out to men who are interested -- thinking back to "adjust your expectations" to Luke last year, when he was just suggesting coffee. One of the things I like best about Abbie is her bluntness. She hasn't shown any romantic interest in Hawley (or in Crane, TBH, bless her) and I don't think it's because she's hiding her true feelings from herself. She's got too much else going on, like, say, saving the world. She doesn't have time for messy emotional foolishness.

I'm sure they'll do some dumbass thing where Hawley starts looking at Abbie with moonie eyes, and Jenny will sense it and get jelly (yawn) but I doubt there will be much reciprocity there. Abbie is too focused to let that stuff get in the way of her job.

 

Yeah, one of the things I like about Abbie is that she's all business. That said, she's a very closed off person and I think one of the long arcs for her character is going to be becoming less so. When we started this show, she was all alone except for Corbett. Now she's got Crane and Jenny and Irving all looking out for her.

[FormerMod-a1]

Regarding Ichabod and not jumping in after Abbie...  He also didn't know where that watery portal led.  It probably seemed safer to try to fish her out than just jump in and hope for the best.

[apgold]

 

I'm sure they'll do some dumbass thing where Hawley starts looking at Abbie with moonie eyes, and Jenny will sense it and get jelly (yawn) but I doubt there will be much reciprocity there. Abbie is too focused to let that stuff get in the way of her job.

 

I think they will go this way too.  I also think it will give Crane the opportunity to be protective of her, since he hasn't hid his distaste of Hawley.  He should have thanked him for saving her life though!

 

Orlando Jones was live tweeting last night - his tweets are hilarious. He used the hashtag #Crane on the Brain, lol.

[angelwoody]

That was deliberate.  Sailors knew that if the ship sank, there would be no rescue.  They preferred to die quickly from drowning rather than swim and eventually die from thirst, exhaustion or being eaten by sharks.

Really?  Fascinating!  I love learning new things!  :-)

[slade3]

And I'd probably be drooling all over Ichabod, too. Tom Mison is sexy as heck.  Especially with the wig--and the pony tail. With his hair loose, I'd feel like I was trying to put the moves on Jesus. Awkward.

 

But I still find it interesting that Tom Mison has better chemistry with every other character on the show than he does with "my love" Katrina. Even in the two scenes with Caroline and the two scenes with Mary, Ichabod has a palpable emotional connection with those two ladies that he never quite has with Katrina. I'm not dogging Katia Winter--I've gotten to like her more this season. Their scenes are just different than his scenes with other characters.

 

And my favorite Ichabbie moment was at the library when Abbie says she's waterlogged but back in action. Crane says, "Thankfully," and Abbie gives him a smile that says...what does it say? I'm glad I'm alive, glad to see you, glad that you're glad that I'm alive, glad that you've already seen what my hair looks like when I've sweated out my perm. (That last one's just me).

I was thinking the same thing (re: Crane = Jesus)! But he sure is pretty when his hair is down. Also love that last bit, Topanga. Ha!

 

It's funny, I'm not so attracted to Tom Mison when i see his press photos (too skinny), but as Crane, I think he's beautiful.

 

I loved this episode. It made me want to buy the season 1 DVDs before Christmas (when they'll probably go on sale).

 

I agree Sleepy Hollow becomes Haven when Hawley is around and I don't love that. I like Hawley, but I had expected a serious character when his casting was announced, so this light-hearted goofball is throwing me off ("Romancing the Stone", indeed!). I personally don't think the show needs him to be comic relief since Crane's moment's of levity are perfect. I also agree his appearances are "contrived run-ins" and that takes me out of the show. Last season, Jenny's help always flowed seamlessly while this season, I'm often wondering why they needed to go to Hawley for help. I think I'd be 100% okay with him, though, if he didn't seem to be taking time away from Jenny, who seems a better fit for the show.

 

I was disappointed by the last scene with Hawley and Jenny. I'd hoped they had just been friends/colleagues in another life since I'm pretty sure the show is planning to hook Hawley up with Abbie. Now that Jenny and Hawley have a Past, and Jenny still wants it to be a thing, there's no way I can get on board any Hawley/Abbie fooling around. It would make it difficult to root for Hawley on any level since I've always found it despicable when a person dates siblings (and I've watched soap operas). Now I think Jenny will realize Hawley is into her sister (or Hawley will tell her), and Jenny will ask him to keep their past a secret. Hawley and Abbie will hook up, Abbie will eventually learn Jenny had a thing with him (maybe Crane will find out and spill the beans), and Abbie will dump him, opening the way for an Ichabod/Abbie thing. All as side story, of course, which means it will play out all season.

 

I liked the MotW. I've always been fascinated by the myth of the widow's walk, where sailor's wives supposedly walked while waiting for their husbands' ships to return. Mary reminded me of that in her black dress and veil.

 

I liked Caroline and I loved that Crane attends a reenactors meeting each week.

 

When Crane was talking to the reenactors and said Caroline was meant for a richer, truer moment in history, he noticed Abbie and looked a bit uncomfortable. I wonder what he was thinking.....

[Elsinore]

Aw, sweet Caroline. I liked her and she's only had three scenes.

 

I like Heather Lind well enough on Turn, I thought she was a bit over the top here though. Part of me hopes it bleeds over on her day job, because that show NEEDS it.

 

He called her Abbie. Twice. There is hope yet.

 

Still don't fathom the Katrina situation. Either she's delusional or she's got an excellent poker face.

 

Hawley has a neater boat then Duke Crocker on Haven does. I seriously think someone stole or swapped notes. edit: Jinx with the poster above me apparently. I swear that whole scene where they pick up the crossbow could be played out on Haven.

 

I thought Jenny and Hawley had decent chemisty. More decent then Abbie has with him anyway.

 

If I were musically inclined and wanted to form a band, I will name it Hellfire Shards. Also, the fact that it has Hellfire in the name does not convince me that Katrina is inclined towards good magic. And that they need more then on Shard to complete whatever he was talking about.

 

I was amused that Mary fell off a cliff but likely didn't die from drowning.

 

Because if she didn't drown, why is she a water logged banshee, then?

Edited October 21, 2014 by Elsinore

[Winnief]

Hawley is "needed" to be a romantic obstacle between Abbie and Ichabod.  Jenny is not going to date her own sister and she really doesn't need to fall for Ichabod because at that point Ichabod is basically collecting a harem.  I'm fine with an "opposites attract" romance between Abbie and Hawley.

 

 

Exactly.  Frankly half the time that seems to be the only reason Katrina's around either, (unless she does go evil which would be AWESOME,)...but again I just don't see Abbie/Hawley happening anytime soon.  Really, if they want these obstacles to seem like actual OBSTACLES, they're gonna have to start coming up with better people here! 

[AConspiracy]

I think Mary set a record for "longest distance pop-in" on Crane.

[marceline]

 

Hawley has a neater boat then Duke Crocker on Haven does. I seriously think someone stole or swapped notes. edit: Jinx with the poster above me apparently. I swear that whole scene where they pick up the crossbow could be played out on Haven.

 

Ha! While you were thinking Haven, I was thinking Grimm. Hawley's boat is basically Nick's trailer. I guess all demon hunters need a place where they can just be themselves. 

[kia112]

And the way he cradled her on the floor, my goodness. I was clutching my pearls on that scene.

 

You weren't the only one -- clutching pearls is exactly how I would describe Ichabod.  When he yelled, "SHE'S DROWNED!!!" I laughed so hard.  It struck me as so melodramatic.

[Indi]

I'm officially tired of Hawley. He's had three eps of introduction now let's put him on the backburner for a while and bring back the Mills sisters being badass and getting Irving out of the asylum.

Aw, I like Nick! He's pretty, he has great chemistry with Abbie and he's been useful, as long as he's been present, which is more than I can say about Katrina and yet, there she is still.

 

I'm not worried about triangle with Nick yet. I don't think anything is going to happen between him and Abbie (or anyone/Abbie), because, as much as I dislike their choice to make him and Jenny an item, it's the perfect excuse for the producers to not bother with Abbie in a romantic relationship. They are too far up Ichy's ass to give a shit about Abbie's personal life.

[HalcyonDays]

Little things of note: During the flashback, when Mary is upset and demanding that Ichabod come back with her, his one hand was doing some massive finger twitching. I love that little detail that Mison has included for his character. It's so expressive.

 

Felt terrible for him, when Mary threw out that old standby insult "She (Katrina) will never have you." as though he is completely undesirable and should be happy that a woman - any woman - would deign to want him. Typical attacking comment.

 

Loved his outfit that he wore at Miss Caroline's memorial, especially the tails on the coat and the high collar.

 

Glad they explained that Katrina's magic was being suppressed by Henry. Good to know and explains a lot. I hope she gets around it (and I think she will). I've always wondered though why Henry is more powerful than his mother. He's only half magic, so I would expect his powers would be weaker, but maybe they will explain it.

 

We are all talking about the excessive lying, but I don't think anyone commented on how evasive she always is when information is demanded from her. When confronted by Ichabod, she throws out her standby line "There isn't time / This isn't the time and place" and brings the (crocodile?) tears. That is one of the major reasons so many think that she is shady. She wants to avoiding having to explain anything like the plague, when divulging that information should have been a priority. Instead, by hiding it, she's caused more harm than good. Makes you wonder if Serilda of Abadon was really the true 'bad' witch. Also, Katrina was kicked out of her coven, and knows dark magic. Hmmm...So many questions...So much shadiness...but it is actually pretty fascinating - I'm dying to these answers.

 

She probably would rather stay with Headless and company at this point, because she will never have to explain / own up to anything. When Katrina ends up at the cabin (I assume she will), Ichabod better sit down with a bottle of rum and demand that she explain everything. Because there will be a ton of time to do so.

[Snookums]

When Crane was talking to the reenactors and said Caroline was meant for a richer, truer moment in history, he noticed Abbie and looked a bit uncomfortable. I wonder what he was thinking.....

 

 

Maybe that back in that "richer, truer" time his dearest friend would have been enslaved and he would have had to literally purchase her, then take her to Canada, in order for her to enjoy the freedom she has now. The past ain't no fairy tale.

 

I was amused that Mary fell off a cliff but likely didn't die from drowning.

Because if she didn't drown, why is she a water logged banshee, then?

 

 

Maybe she was only mostly dead when Katrina rolled her into the river? She obviously had to hide the body or the fact that a respectable young woman's corpse was found on the banks would have panicked the town. It would have taken a while--Katrina would have had to weight the body, make sure Mary's skirts didn't buoy her up---maybe there was a moment of "wait... is she breathing?...no, no, get this terrible task over with and get home quickly!"

[catrox14]

You weren't the only one -- clutching pearls is exactly how I would describe Ichabod.  When he yelled, "SHE'S DROWNED!!!" I laughed so hard.  It struck me as so melodramatic.

 

It wasn't Mison's best line reading ever but considering everything else he does pretty much perfectly, I can let that one slide. Plus, let's face it. Ichabod is pretty melodramatic. I mean look at his speeches about water, pens at the bank, skinny jeans, the price of a latte or cappucino, the lamentations over everything. 

[kia112]

I agree, catrox14.  I love me some Tom Mison as Ichabod, but...still didn't make it any less funny ;-)

[Watermelon]

Aw, sweet Caroline. I liked her and she's only had three scenes.

 

I like Heather Lind well enough on Turn, I thought she was a bit over the top here though. Part of me hopes it bleeds over on her day job, because that show NEEDS it.

 

He called her Abbie. Twice. There is hope yet.

 

Still don't fathom the Katrina situation. Either she's delusional or she's got an excellent poker face.

 

Hawley has a neater boat then Duke Crocker on Haven does. I seriously think someone stole or swapped notes. edit: Jinx with the poster above me apparently. I swear that whole scene where they pick up the crossbow could be played out on Haven.

 

I thought Jenny and Hawley had decent chemisty. More decent then Abbie has with him anyway.

 

If I were musically inclined and wanted to form a band, I will name it Hellfire Shards. Also, the fact that it has Hellfire in the name does not convince me that Katrina is inclined towards good magic. And that they need more then on Shard to complete whatever he was talking about.

 

I was amused that Mary fell off a cliff but likely didn't die from drowning.

 

Because if she didn't drown, why is she a water logged banshee, then?

Katrina totes put weights to her body and dropped her in the river.  I shant be convinced otherwise.

[Helena Dax]

I like Hawley, he's fun. My problem's that suddenly there's too much of him and the  last thing I want is an affaire between Abbie and him. And his house's stupid.

 

My favourite part was to see Ichabod realizing Katrina has lied to him a lot. He already knew, deep down, but "it's for the greater good", "it's better for you that way" are powerful excuses, especially if you're in the middle of a mission bigger than you. I mean, Dumbledore lied to Harry and manipulated him and he still named one of his kids after him. 

 

 

Honestly, I'm kinda rooting for her to turn Abraham back to the good (or at least the not-actively-evil) and ride off with him into their own happy sunset. Can't a witch and a headless dude just go build a new life for themselves? I say yes.

 

I'd like that too. Unless she really  killed Mary.  If she did kill her, she and Abraham can die. 

 

In my  opinion, the fact that Ichabod and Katrina have no chemistry isn't a mistake. He might think she's his True Love (or he did, until now), but we're not supposed to agree with him. I see no reason to believe Ichabod and Abbie won't be endgame. They're too cute together and there's already so much love, trust and respect between them. We see that every episode but what do we see between Ichabod and Katrina?

[Miss Dee]

Maybe that back in that "richer, truer" time his dearest friend would have been enslaved and he would have had to literally purchase her, then take her to Canada, in order for her to enjoy the freedom she has now. The past ain't no fairy tale.

I completely agree - and I'm glad it was there. I don't mind Ichabod waxing nostalgic about his own time when confronted by the vagaries of the modern age; we all do the same in unfamiliar situations. But it's another thing entirely to state to all and sundry that his own time was THE BESTEST EVAH, completely oblivious to all the people of colour in the room giving him the side-eye. I'd like to think that if Ichabod feels as close to Abbie as he claims, he'd think now and then about how much more difficult it would be for her in his world than vice versa. Otherwise it's going to be hard to root for them in any kind of partnership.

[fantique]

To make things worse, the show has been posting this picture all over the place but cut it from the show.  I cry foul!  Foul, I say!

 

Wow, I don't want them to be more than friends (at least not until season 4/5, probably will change my mind by then) but this is a sell that is very easy indeed.

 

That final shot of him on the floor crying ( legs splayed out like a child) because daddy was mad at him said a lot for a scene with no dialogue. 

Aww that reminded me of all these moments on fringe when he was vulnerable and I just wanted to hug him. Fringe segue alert: anyone remember that scene where he lost Astrid while they were out and he couldn't remember the phone numbers of anyone. Heartstring tugs. It was amazing because you could tell everything he was thinking at that moment and see his emotional immaturity.

 

I couldn't stand Mary, what a weak person.  Someone get her a copy of "He's Just NOT that Into You." 

Or is she smart? In those times when women were just accessories, playing the victim whose honour/feelings have been insulted and making the other feel they are wronging her is a good way to make things go the exact way she wants them. Tenacity is also a form of strength.

 

Also, to me Mary read as way more Victorian than she did late 18th-century. I think it's mostly due to the hat and the parasol she kept waving around. I didn't really get a good enough look at the dress. I suppose it works, since Weeping Lady spectres feel more Victorian anyway, but she looked odd next to Ichabod in his tricorn.

She did read Victorian (I think it's the shawl and the black dress, for some reason I always think of Victorian era dresses to be more somber than other time periods) as well to me! Although women used anyway to protect their fair skins from the sun well into the beginning of the 20th century so the umbrella is not an anachronism, I think.

 

I would be more likely to believe Katrina's version of events re: Mary's death if she had tripped and fallen INTO THE RIVER, not over a cliff. If she was already dead when she went into the river, why would that be her murder weapon of choice as the Weeping Lady? Shouldn't she be throwing people over a cliff? Maybe that is being too logical for an urban legend.

Once Ichabod started listing Katrina's lies -- none of which were little white lies, they were all damn huge lies, I was like dayum, and you're just now starting to face the reality that your beloved is shady?

I am not too worried about a Abbie/Hawley/Jenny triangle, because it would be extremely OOC for Abbie to start up a romance with anyone while all this is going on, let alone with someone who's an ex of her sister. And Abbie has never had a problem laying that out to men who are interested -- thinking back to "adjust your expectations" to Luke last year, when he was just suggesting coffee. One of the things I like best about Abbie is her bluntness. She hasn't shown any romantic interest in Hawley (or in Crane, TBH, bless her) and I don't think it's because she's hiding her true feelings from herself. She's got too much else going on, like, say, saving the world. She doesn't have time for messy emotional foolishness.

I'm sure they'll do some dumbass thing where Hawley starts looking at Abbie with moonie eyes, and Jenny will sense it and get jelly (yawn) but I doubt there will be much reciprocity there. Abbie is too focused to let that stuff get in the way of her job.

Ding, ding and ding. I so agree with everything you said and the bolded resonates so much with me. I do think it would be OOC for Abbie to date her sister's ex.

 

I absolutely LOVE that she does not beat around the bush. I also agree that she hasn't objectively speaking shown to be into Crane. She likes to have a companion, someone who is supporting her and understands what she is going through.

Let's be honest, Abbie is hot. I am woman enough to admit that. She is feminine in her body type but she has that cool chick that can hang with the boys vibe. I doubt Abbie had a hard time getting a boyfriend BUT I think what she values familial love above all else. To her, Ichabod is precious because he is family and he came at a time when she had none (Jenny was away and Corbin had just died). I think when we see her open up, it will be first with Jenny (already seen a bit of it) or Crane, others of the Scooby gang and then maybe her romantic interest. Also because she is so honest and thoughtful, I think she would have a hard time being with someone knowing that could put them in jeopardy because of the mission and the big target on her back. Ichabod is a lot more oblivious in his love, he had rose tinted glasses when confronting Abraham about being with Katrina. Abbie would be more aware of the repercussions of being with someone and I love her for it.

Her reaction to be called Mrs Crane wasn't flustered being all like "Oh my, you thought we were married #fanningmyself", it was more like "Oh god, what on Earth did he do now? This poor girl must be so confused. SMH". 

 

Re: Ichabod looking at Abbie after the speech. I do think some of those circumstances do to his mind he appreciates at least this part of this new era. Although I took that look to be triggered by the words "truer". I think nostalgia kicks in because back then everything was straightforward and he knew his role and place. Now? Everything is uncertain and then he sees Abbie, who is part of the present, who represents everything that is true in his life right now. She consistently reminds him of the good things he has and that he does have a home in present day Sleepy Hollow. She also was thoughtful and kind enough to organise that gathering. That was him appreciating the here and now => Abbie a lot more.

Edited October 21, 2014 by fantique

[janeta]

Headless is a better actor and more interesting than Abraham.

 

 

YES.

 

-ahem-   Totally agree.  Even without a head he has much more presence than the guy playing Abraham.

[Helena Dax]

What's that thing Caroline gives to Ichabod after the cranberries? A small pillow?

[Carrie Ann]

Yeah, it's a pillow that she's embroidered IC on, with a tree in the middle. For a minute, I thought it meant "Ichabod/Caroline" but then I realized it was probably just meant to be his initials.

[DearEvette]

I like Hawley, he's fun. My problem's that suddenly there's too much of him and the  last thing I want is an affaire between Abbie and him. And his house's stupid.

 

Ha!  At first I was all...oooh...cool digs.  But then I became obsessed by how impractical it was.  He has a leather couch, an oriental rug, and little rattan blinds on what is basically a dock.  Doesn't it rain in Sleepy Hollow?  Dude, it isn't Southern California.  Those little rattan blinds aren't gonna  keep anything off that rug.  And the leather will get ruined.  And who keeps their arrows filled with Basilisk venom out like that?  Just no. 

 

But he can still get it, though.

[ABay]

Maybe the reason Katrina seems so evasive is that the writers haven't decided where they're going yet.

[Bruinsfan]

An not only that, she had to dispose of the body.  And since Mary was all about water & drowning people, Katrina most likely dumped her in the river.  Yikes.

Katrina totes put weights to her body and dropped her in the river.  I shant be convinced otherwise.

That's how I'm seeing it go down, too. "Oh dear, what a tragic accident! [drag, drag, sounds of roots rising from the water to entwine Mary's legs, groggy scream, splash] Ichabod must never know!"

 

I'll give them credit, Katrina is much more interesting to me now that she's actually using her power and being manipulative toward others besides Ichabod. Henry better watch out, or War may end up riding sidesaddle.

[slade3]

Re: Ichabod looking at Abbie after the speech. I do think some of those circumstances do to his mind he appreciates at least this part of this new era. Although I took that look to be triggered by the words "truer". I think nostalgia kicks in because back then everything was straightforward and he knew his role and place. Now? Everything is uncertain and then he sees Abbie, who is part of the present, who represents everything that is true in his life right now. She consistently reminds him of the good things he has and that he does have a home in present day Sleepy Hollow. She also was thoughtful and kind enough to organise that gathering. That was him appreciating the here and now => Abbie a lot more.

I like this take, even though I think he was thinking about slavery.

[cassandle]

 

Little things of note: During the flashback, when Mary is upset and demanding that Ichabod come back with her, his one hand was doing some massive finger twitching. I love that little detail that Mison has included for his character. It's so expressive.

 

Those twitchy fingers are one of my favorite character beats.  Like you said, it's expressive and yet subtle at the same time. You notice it but it's not like he's flailing around drawing attention to himself the way more scenery-chewing actors would do it.  Well acted, TM.

[GenieinTX]

If you loved Miss Caroline, google The Lizzie Bennett Diaries.  The girl who played Caroline this week played Jane Bennett in that series.  And she was as sweet and charming and I love her to pieces.  Plus, LBD are all on youtube for free to watch.  So great! 

 

 

 

 I am really beginning to wonder if Crane exudes some magical Witness pheramones.  Yeah, he's smoking hot, but every week we find out about a new woman who wanted/wants him.

 

At first, I thought we were going to have to deal with more Ichabod/Katrina true love crap, but no, happy surprise, this is where he starts seeing how really bad she is.  Nice!