S01.E07: The Wedding

[Petunia846]

I thought Frank's impromptu wedding proposal was nice just because Claire doesn't really have any family, and a big ceremony might point that out uncomfortably. Oh, how nice, Frank's side of the church is full of people...oh, but there's Claire's side with just a couple random friends and no family. I thought getting married the way they did was kind of a sacrifice on Frank's part, since he clearly loves that kind of family milestone and seems to have a flare for all things tradition, while Claire is very untraditional.

[Pestilentia]

 

And it's Scotch Whiskey after all.

 

Ooh, heads up- there is no "e" in whisky of the Scottish variety- the pedants will kill you for that.

http://grammarist.com/usage/whiskey-whisky/

[Criminey]

The Wedding is on Stars tonight! Starting now on the west coast. Happy Valentines!

Uverse, 1904.

Edited February 15, 2015 by Criminey

[WatchrTina]

I downloaded the first 8 episodes from ITunes this weekend and got 7 "goodies" with the purchase.  One of them was already shared by STARZ as a Droughtlander goody but the others were new -- either behind-the-scenes specials or additional scenes from the first 8 episodes.  The biggest, best surprise was an extended scene that was cut from the wedding episode.  I'll slip behind a spoiler bar now.  Join me if you want to hear about it. 

Remember when Claire and Jamie are about to kiss and Claire suddenly says "tell me about your family"? They filmed quite a bit of Jamie doing just that. In the episode as aired, you don't hear him talking very much -- they decided to condense it and use a Claire voice-over instead. But in the extra, they show you the scene as filmed, with Jamie working very hard to charm Claire and charming the viewer (or at least me) as a result. The most poignant moment comes when Jamie tells of his mother refusing the marry the man she was told to marry. Claire says "Your mother didn't love Malcolm Grant?" and Jamie says "Love and marriage dinna always go together Sassenach." Claire's face suddenly becomes somber and she says "Indeed." Jamie's face shows his realization of his mistake. Later he talks about his parents meeting. He says "They met at the Gathering, had taken one look, and decided there could be no other for either one of them." The look on his face when it says that tells me he had the same reaction to Claire. Pity she didn't feel the same way.

Edited February 16, 2015 by WatchrTina

[MedievalGirl]

Dang it. I have all the episodes sitting in my DVR so I have little reason to do Netflix. Do they let you just get the goodies. I want to see that one.

[WatchrTina]

I just looked at iTunes and I can't tell if you can buy the extras without buying the episodes (because for me it all shows up as "you already purchased") but the really odd thing is that four of the seven goodies don't appear in the menu, including the one from The Wedding.  Apparently they just show up when you buy the set and click on "download all."

[CatMack]

They only come with the season pass.  I also have all the episodes already, but I bought it anyway.  I want to support them, and I wanted the extra materials (which are adorable and I'm a little annoyed they didn't keep that version in, it was a much better character study than the voiceover IMO).  The standard def versions are significantly cheaper than HD, for the record, and the SD looks fine.

[Kiwi]

You can see the clip here https://www.dailymotion.com/video/k7mmFzeJBrDsQUa5ZIT

 

Hope that works!

[MedievalGirl]

Squeeeeee!
 

 

That's a yes.

[Nidratime]

I'll probably end up buying the Blu-Ray disks. I have a little Blu-Ray player hooked up which I hardly ever use. This will be a good opportunity to give it some love. ;-)

[insubordination]

Oooh what a lovely gift that link was.Thank you.  He was trying to charm her with his posing, his cups and rolling rrrrrs and letting her know that Frasers have patience.  It was working too.

 

Now I've got to send that link to my mother!

[methodwriter85]

For those wondering why Claire drank heavily all day -- or why Claire didn't "smile more for Jamie" on her wedding day -- or why Claire looked sad or conflicted despite poor Jamie's sweetness, I just do not understand this at all. I'm totally befuddled.

 

If we're taking "Outlander" as a real story with richness and complexity, then Jamie is not the waiting-in-the-wings Ken Doll Claire has always secretly wanted. Instead, he's a cute and admittedly charming boy who's crushing on her while she's trying to get back to her real life, her real husband, her real family. I thought her wedding with Frank was not a sign of Frank's unworthiness but that they'd waited years (through an entire war) and he simply couldn't wait one moment more to marry her. I also loved that the only approval he wanted was hers, that his family didn't matter. I just didn't see it as a portrait of a 'lesser' wedding. No matter how Jamie dressed it up -- and he definitely tried to do so -- he was trying to sugarcoat a forced marriage. I thought the disparity was startling and deliberate -- between Claire's radiant happiness in the impromptu wedding with Frank, in comparison with her rigid control and palpable unhappiness during the formal, forced marriage to Jamie. (She looked, understandably, like she was going through the motions in a nightmare.)

 

I get that Jamie's hot and cute and brave and blameless and increasingly smarter and more complex than he seems (all wonderful things), but Claire is being coerced into marriage and sexual congress in a 24-hour period with a guy she barely knows, purely to save herself from terrible torture, imprisonment and possibly death. And just to repeat: Two months ago she was on her freaking honeymoon.

 

So I'm fine with Claire not being Mary Sunshine on her wedding day. I savored every moment in which she looked conflicted -- it was appropriate. If I am to continue to take this story seriously at all, then I'm very happy for those little moments. Because otherwise, why have Claire be married at all storywise? (And FWIW, I was not a fan of the book or of Book Frank, who was barely paper-thin -- the show and Tobias Menzies have made him so much richer and sweeter and more interesting).

 

Anyway. I thought it was a great episode overall, and I enjoy both Jamie's beauty and sweetness as well as the disparity between his feelings and Claire's. I loved the sophistication of the wedding night progression and how the intimacy and sex changed between them with the passage of time and secrets. And I like that the show never forgets the two viewpoints -- Jamie may feel like he's just lucked into the best thing ever, marrying the beautiful woman he's sweet on, but Claire is in a different place entirely.

 

No matter how beautiful Jamie is, no wonder it took her a few bottles of liquor to get through it all. I loved this episode even while feeling incredibly sorry for Claire throughout.

 

Yeah, I really liked the contrast. Claire has this no-frills, justice-of-the-peace wedding with nobody there, and she's smiling radiantly and looks overjoyed. Then she has this beautiful wedding with a princess dress and she's completely blitzed during it to get through it.

 

The show has done a great slow burn with Jamie and Claire....it feels a lot more realistic that she's still very conflicted about Frank.

[John Potts]

OK, while I get that this is very much a coerced marriage, Claire could have been nicer to Jamie (initially) - either that, or she's a mean drunk. Getting tipsy I could understand, but when Jamie was trying to get intimate, she kept knocking back another shot (like when Jamie proposed a toast to his new bride) - and not refilling his glass. At least say how he's very brave/handsome/tall before knocking back another - a man might take it a bit personally that you can't say a good word about him without being completely blotto. It's a coerced marriage for him too, even if he's not exactly unwilling. You could reasonably say something like, "I was thing about my first wedding and my poor lost husband Frank," which would be both a reasonable explanation of her reluctance AND mostly true.

Surprisingly, one thing that did make me smile was when Claire promised she wouldn't laugh at Jamie's ignorance and then did anyway - it did seem natural (on both their parts, in fact) and explains an earlier scene where she gets naked and he comes up behind her and she looks slightly puzzled before turning to face him. It was believable that he would assume that people mate like horses and even though his fellow Clansmen would have no doubt offered him all sorts of "advice", I'm not sure I'd trust any of it to be true.

On ‎21‎/‎09‎/‎2014 at 4:30 AM, nara said:

Beautiful ceremony and the dress was gorgeous.

Granted that the opportunities for picking up dresses would be limited, but who shops for clothes in a brothel (Ned, apparently)? Though loved the Madam's eyes lighting up on seeing his purse and going, "Sure you wouldn't like to hang around for a bit?" He even snagged his "plus one" for the wedding!

On ‎21‎/‎09‎/‎2014 at 4:30 AM, nara said:

Does anyone know why the ring was put on her right hand?

I thought she put her old ring on her right ring finger and the new one on her left. I've heard of widows doing that to remember their late husbands when they enter a new marriage.

On ‎21‎/‎09‎/‎2014 at 0:39 PM, nara said:

The fact that she berated herself for being a bigamist, adulteress, and enjoying the sex right afterwards

While I can understand he thinking that way (and I guess she feels it is true) is she really? There will probably be a century between Jamie's death and Frank's birth, so legally she can't be married to somebody who isn't born yet (clearly the law fails to allow for the possibilities of time travel). She's more akin to somebody shipwrecked on a desert island - you can attempt to escape and even hope for rescue, but there would probably come a time when you "face reality" and move on (when that happens will vary from person to person, I expect).

On ‎21‎/‎09‎/‎2014 at 5:04 PM, annlaw78 said:

the reality is that the fashion of that era just is not very flattering, and it's hard to dress up wool and linen.  And the smashed boobs.

Speaking from a purely straight male perspective, there's a certain fascination with "how are you staying in that!?" (combined with, "I hope you won't!"). And while intellectually I know it's mostly an effect of tight corsetry, my libido is going "BOOBS!"

On ‎22‎/‎09‎/‎2014 at 3:06 AM, MedievalGirl said:

I figure a corset acted like armor and spread the force from the punch out.

I have to admit, I had never considered the possible armour potential of corsetry (I have also worn armour, though never a corset). 

On ‎21‎/‎09‎/‎2014 at 5:04 PM, annlaw78 said:

He knows her, and figured a simple registry office marriage (which is pretty common in England) would be fine with her.

That sort of "Insta Wedding" would be unusual even today (and probably invalid - as the priest said, Banns still need to be read to ensure the marriage is legal). However, I got the impression that scene was before heading off to war, so those requirements might be waived (de facto if not de jure).

[guiser]

On 23/09/2014 at 6:12 PM, justmehere said:

Dougal: "An English officer cannot compel a Scottish person, unless there is proof a crime has been committed, and even so, cannot force a Scottish subject from clan lands without permission from the laird concerned."

However, back in the real 18th century, there was one offense that did allow the authorities to proceed without interference and that was treason and I'm pretty sure spying for the Jacobites would have constituted treason! Claire was a subject of the King and that was all that mattered as far as she was concerned.

In so far as clan chiefs had legal powers they stemmed from that fact that some of them possessed heritable jurisdiction in the form of baronies or the more powerful regalities. Where they existed, these jurisdictions covered particular pieces of land and their inhabitants, not necessarily all clan lands. 

In the case of regalities the "lord of regality" was in charge of prosecuting all crime in the locality except for treason.  Also, technically speaking, inhabitants of regalities accused of crimes elsewhere were not supposed to be tried in any of the royal courts but instead repledged to their regality for prosecution. The less powerful holder of a barony was in charge of prosecuting the more "evident" crimes (where people were caught red-handed) excluding treason and pleas of the crown ('secret' murder, violent robbery, rape and arson).  So, if the Mackenzies had been trying to protect Claire from prosecution for something other than a charge of treason then there would have been some plausibility to the marriage scenario.

In terms of Mackenzie protection for Jamie and given the offense that he was accused of committing,  it would make sense that his offense was committed outwith a Mackenzie barony or regality and that the protection of the Mackenzies was purely practical rather than legal. This would explain his skulking around and concealing his true identity.

 

On 24/09/2014 at 2:54 PM, WatchrTina said:

It's likely that Dougal took Angus and Rupert and a few other fighting men with him to Ft. Williams. He could easily say "The woman's married one of my nephews. I've a half dozen men here with me who witnessed the wedding and the bedding. If called upon I can produce a marriage contract, drawn up by my personal lawyer, as well as the priest who performed the ceremony, but you're not going to insult the war-chief of the MacKenzie clan by calling me a liar are ye?" I'm going to assume BRJ will be able to read Dougal well enough to know he's telling the truth, so that nit-picking the details isn't worth the effort. Also, it won't only be up to BJR -- a higher ranking officer may be there and he may be even less willing to insult Dougal to his face by demanding to see the bona fides. Especially when the woman in question is not actually suspected of any particular crime.

ETA: The other thing is that the officers at Ft. Williams have to know what BJR is. And Dougal probably wasn't the only one who heard BJR yell "Kick her!" Certainly many people saw what Claire looked like when she came out of that room. So the other officers at Ft. Williams may be very happy that they've been given a face-saving way to let the matter drop and a way to call BJR off the hunt. They may also be much less interested in ever seeing their "English Rose" again, now that she's been despoiled by a local "savage."

Disregarding the more esoteric real-life legal aspects, I really like this as an in-story explanation and I'm going to adopt it as my head-canon! :D But Dougal will have to do without the priest because, in real life, he would definitely have been arrested!  And there is a point past which I don't think that it is appropriate for fiction to distort reality!

On 21/09/2014 at 7:15 AM, magdalene said:

I really liked the performance of the actor who played the priest with the bad head cold and his small knife. He didn't have a lot of air time but he was very vivid and funny.

Definitely a memorable character! I'm sure that, in Scotland at this time, anyone prepared to be a Catholic priest would have been feisty.  But, would he have been that easy to bribe? Also, if the Mackenzies were protecting him I'd have expected him to live up at the castle!  

Edited September 3, 2017 by guiser

[peggy06]

New to this forum as I just finished Book 1 and the first 8 episodes of S1. I wasn't a fan of the book, but the series had been recommended to me and I thought I would see if it was an improvement. It is. Having said that, I thought the drinking thing was way overdone with Claire.  Also, maybe I'm misremembering, but Claire's attraction to Jamie was so strongly portrayed in the book, that I never had a second's doubt she would say Yes to marrying him. The series is making Claire's feelings for Frank much, much more of a thing than they were in the book. It does tend to make her look better as a person. 

 

I'm not sure I'll stick with the series, but the scenery and Scots accents are a big plus.

[Camera One]

It was nice to get a quieter episode with no violence.  As usual, this was well acted, though I'm not sure if the flashbacks to the wedding preparations were necessary.  We already knew Jaime was a very honorable guy, and the past scenes sort of dragged.  Does Jaime know that Claire looks sad because she is still grieving over her husband?  Maybe it was known but unsaid?  As a viewer, it's hard to feel totally happy because we know Claire's heart was still with Frank and she wouldn't do this if she got a choice, but the chemistry between the actors who play Jaime and Claire is what makes this work.  Even though I've mostly enjoyed this show, there's this unsettling atmosphere that Claire could be raped at any time, and I don't like that feeling.

Edited February 26, 2018 by Camera One

[Iju]

parts i liked:

omg the marriage ceremony. i'm not a huge romantic but i am such a sucker for marriage, the ceremony, the man and wife. i know this wasn't done in love, but i just imagined another pair that was in love and it fit just fine. and when jamie explained what the gaelic meant, with the symbolic wrist cutting. lawd i dang near fainted. so beautiful. so happy i learned that beautiful piece of scottish culture (although i'm sure it's changed now). claire's dress was beautiful of course, as well. and that kiss she gave jaimie! dear me, i'm a sucker for kisses so.

jaimie immediately stopping mid "swing" at claire's cries: "Oh, did I hurt you? I'm sorry..." and "I thought my heart was going to burst!" PLEASE. JAIMIE. ENOUGH. MY HEART.

parts i didn't like (or more precisely, couldn't watch)

firstly i don't understand the sex. i mean why didn't they just lie and say they did it? it's not like the others could bring up any proof they didn't.

secondly, i probably watched 10% of the actual sex because i was too busy cowering in what i believe half cringe, half shame, maybe? i know i have major problems with associating anything sexual with shame but that's another story for another century. ANYWAY my real point is that i was deliberately not looking because well, i just see them as two friends screwing each other. it was just plain awkward for me. claire and her husband scenes - no problems. claire and jaime - ehhh sorry fam. they can feel whatever they want about each other and the show can tell the audience that. but i felt like the whole time it was like i was forced to sleep with my brother's friend. no thanks. i was aching for the episode to switch to the daytime, and the plot would finally begin again.

i didn't like that jaimie had the first out of three rounds. especially since he half joked "I hope you know what you're doing", i expected for claire to do everything. "teach" him if you will. but i guess claire wanted to let jaimie get in on his first try so i don't feel that too bad about it.

i also couldn't help but get sucked in and out of the episode as the same time. the wedding was beautiful, she finally gave into the sex, but she really is so alone. she has no family, no friends from the other side, nothing. she tossed all that aside for round 2 and 3 but the first round she couldn't shake it and even when she did it left me thinking about it as well. i was thinking a lot about the episode, in fact, since a lot pf the episode was nudity and sex, which i said beforehand i barely watched. 

random so i'm putting in spoiler:

honestly the borgias sex scenes were better for me, even the gay scene (you know who) \_(ツ)_/¯ but they are the only sex scenes i have seen besides this tbh. i could at least watch and not feel much with that show, but this episode brought up all sorts of feelings in me i didn't even know existed. i just hope my wedding night won't be a flop because i was a mess indeed.

 

none of the eps are worth a rewatch for me so far but i would definitely rewatch that marriage ceremony, even though claire ruins it by being sad (just kidding she deserves to feel what she feels). i'm not hating on the episode at all in case anyone sees it that way. these are just my muffed up feelings on the matter. now i must go to bed.

On 16/02/2015 at 9:49 PM, Kiwi said:

You can see the clip here https://www.dailymotion.com/video/k7mmFzeJBrDsQUa5ZIT

 

Hope that works!

P.S., thanks a lot, i love deleted scenes on TV shows and movies and try to scrape them up from anywhere i go.

[LilJen]

Newish viewer (Netflix only so far, and some spoilers from youtube because I'm pathetic). Since there is no thread for haikus or other parodies, I need to put one here. From Jamie's POV:

Forced to wed Claire. . . but

"WON THE F*CKING LOTTERY!"

<heart bursts> Pearls. "Precious."

[foxfreakinmulder]

Since Netflix only has the first 2 seasons (which I've finished) I decided to rewatch The Wedding last night and this is my take on it after my rewatch.

I understand Claire's POV she wants to go home but doesn't know how to get to the stones and she made an enemy with Black Jack so now she's forced to marry a man to keep her safe and away from BJ. But Jamie has always been kind to her and protected her, I don't know what would've happened to Claire if Jamie hadn't saved her when she first encountered BJ. I know she would've been raped but would he have killed her or taken her prisoner?

Jamie took the marriage seriously and as he told Murtagh before the wedding he only plans on getting married once. I know Claire's mind must have been spinning out of control trying to understand how this is happening to her when a short time ago she was planning on meeting Frank for dinner. But I did feel sorry for Jamie because he took the marriage seriously and Claire as his bride. I believe Claire had some attraction to Jamie but her guilt of betraying Frank was weighing heavy on her.

I would've been nervous too and probably would have got tipsy/drunk to calm my nerves. But Jamie was very sweet letting her take her time to feel comfortable. As he said, he would not force himself on her. Instead he did as she asked and told her stories about his family and he was very charming according to Claire's VO.

Claire is the one who initiated sex the first time, when she said we should go to bed, and Jamie asked bed or sleep? Once the marriage was consummated Claire could've made some excuse about not wanting to have sex again, she's not ready to move on because she still loves her dead husband or something, but she again initiated sex the second time and she enjoyed it.

I was a little sad when Jamie gave Claire the pearls that belonged to his mother and she said nothing. Tell him thank you or say they're beautiful, something. She did climb on him for the third time so I guess that's her way of thanking him :-)

Jamie looked so handsome at the wedding and the dress was pretty for the era but her boobs bugged me, they looked lopsided and barely covered they were distracting. It must have been hard for the actors to keep eyes up and not look at them especially when she was breathing heavily lol.

[LilJen]

Wedding day/night haiku from Claire's POV:

Forced, for my safety

I don't think I can do this

Oh MY! Frank? Frank who?

[AZChristian]

28 minutes ago, LilJen said:

Wedding day/night haiku from Claire's POV:

Forced, for my safety

I don't think I can do this

Oh MY! Frank? Frank who?

And this is why I LOOOOOOOVE this website.  The participants are "da bomb"!!!!

[FormerMod-a1]

I have started watching this series at the behest of a couple of friends.  I can see I am in quite the minority with finding this romance with Jamie the least interesting part of the series.  I knew there'd be a lot of focus on it, of course, I'm not oblivious to the source material, but there is so much more going around it all, so I found this episode boring.  When I realized the whole episode would the wedding night I just rolled my eyes.  Granted, it took me way to long to realize that.  Anyway, moving on...

[Cdh20]

7 hours ago, aquarian1 said:

I have started watching this series at the behest of a couple of friends.  I can see I am in quite the minority with finding this romance with Jamie the least interesting part of the series.  I knew there'd be a lot of focus on it, of course, I'm not oblivious to the source material, but there is so much more going around it all, so I found this episode boring.  When I realized the whole episode would the wedding night I just rolled my eyes.  Granted, it took me way to long to realize that.  Anyway, moving on...

If you don’t buy into Jamie & Claire as “the “ couple I am not sure you are going to love this series.   I’m 5 & 1/2 seasons in & it’s still my #1 episode, so I look forward to seeing you post here as you go on🤗

[FormerMod-a1]

I guess I just don't need anyone to be "the" couple.  For me there's so much more interesting story going on outside the romance.  Plus, it seems like Claire doesn't really care about getting back to her time any more.  I can see why she'd get married - she has to survive.  She has to go along to get along, but in the course of this night she's all in love?  They just don't have that kind of chemistry for me.  Plus, she seemed to really love her husband in her time, so it's just ...  I don't know.. the least interesting part of the story for me,  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Cdh20]

14 minutes ago, aquarian1 said:

I guess I just don't need anyone to be "the" couple.  For me there's so much more interesting story going on outside the romance.  Plus, it seems like Claire doesn't really care about getting back to her time any more.  I can see why she'd get married - she has to survive.  She has to go along to get along, but in the course of this night she's all in love?  They just don't have that kind of chemistry for me.  Plus, she seemed to really love her husband in her time, so it's just ...  I don't know.. the least interesting part of the story for me,  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Well there is the history, adventure  & other characters to love! I am clearly a big romantic, so that moment was when I was like “I am all in now”! 

[Ziggy]

19 hours ago, aquarian1 said:

I guess I just don't need anyone to be "the" couple.  For me there's so much more interesting story going on outside the romance.  Plus, it seems like Claire doesn't really care about getting back to her time any more.  I can see why she'd get married - she has to survive.  She has to go along to get along, but in the course of this night she's all in love?  They just don't have that kind of chemistry for me.  Plus, she seemed to really love her husband in her time, so it's just ...  I don't know.. the least interesting part of the story for me,  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I think there is so much more to the story than the romance 🙂  I enjoy romance, but I'm not super big on steamy, sex scenes.  So this episode was good, but it's not my favorite.

I hope you stick with the series and enjoy it.  Personally, I love it!

[GHScorpiosRule]

@aquarian1, the first season and buik is ALL about Jamie and Claire--meeting, fighting, falling in love.

Ron Moore, who developed this for television, didn't care for the time traveling aspect of this, even though THAT'S what the premise is. And he did a lousy job with a lot of the emotional beats.

Because he loves Tobias Menzies, he expanded on Frank, and made him a lot more rootable in the show than he is in the buiks. I know, I know, I'm in the minority about him. But I don't care.

So, he didn't provide or show Claire's conflict and struggle

when she found herself at the stones and if she should go back or stay.

My theory is she was in love, or falling for Jamie by the time they did marry in the buik; and because Ron skipped over a lot, viewers who are non-buik readers, didn't see that.

And let me add for your benefit, in case you haven't read through all the threads, that I don't care for Gabaldon's style of writing; but I do love the world and characters she created and the emotional beats are where she excels. 

Just my .02. I spoiler tagged, because I realized you're only on episode 7, and don't know if you've read the buik.😉

[FormerMod-a1]

Thanks, everyone.  I am keeping with it.  There are plenty of things I do enjoy about it, so far, this was just a temporary stopping point.

And no, I am not a buik reader, but do know a good bit about them.  

[gingerella]

So full disclosure, I watched this episode three times. The first time I watched it I felt exhausted by the end of it. There were beautiful parts but it felt like 'Jesus H. Roosevelt Christ! Do they really need to spend the entire episode in one long wedding night sex scene?!?' I went back to watch it again after it was decided that a small group of us would watch and post about our experiences watching this series. So I have found myself after three viewings, looking at this episode completely differently.

The first thing that struck me is the contrast between Claire's wedding to Frank and Claire's wedding to Jaime. Frank springs a Registry wedding on her, clearly she hasn't been part of this decision but Frank has already planned it. Was he worried that his hoity toity Randall family would think Claire - an orphan with no 'family name' - wasn't good enough pedigree for him and thus might try to put them off marrying, and so he pushes an unexpected last minute Registry wedding without any proper church one (I know in the UK one has a registry wedding first, but most folks opt for a church wedding or something more eventful after they sign their registry papers). Anyway, it doesn't feel special, it just feels rushed. Does she look upset? Not really, but she's allowing Frank to call the shots and so she complies. Maybe this orphan with no 'important' family name is just relieved that someone wants to marry her, someone wants her to belong to them?

Now when Jaime agrees to marry Claire it's an entirely different event. When Jaime says, 'but I have three conditions' I start to see something very different unfolding. I did love Dougal's exasperation and saying it would have been easier to kill them both instead of this! Dougal can be unintentionally very funny in his more exasperating moments. But what struck me after watching this a few times, was the understanding that while on the surface, Jaime's requests appear to be sweet - he wants the marriage to be in a proper church with a priest, he wants Claire to have a real wedding dress and he wants to be married wearing his Fraser tartan, and he wants her wedding ring made from a special key he has on him - I now see those requests are far beyond just sweet gestures. Jaime agrees to marry Claire to protect her, aye, but for him this isn't a shotgun wedding, it is now the real deal. This is forever for him. He wants to marry Claire with all the frills of a real, romantic wedding, and more importantly, he wants Claire to have a real wedding too - she has awakened something in him that I don't think he expected or thought would ever happen for or to him. He's been a wanted man for so long now that I think he gave up on ever finding a mate that would come close to what his parents likely had. He wants a wedding his mother would be proud of, and that says it all right there.  He isn't a 'mama's boy' but again we see that he was raised in what was most likely a very loving home filled with love, laughter and a certain level of partnership between husband and wife. He doesn't want Claire to feel like this is just for show, he wants her to feel what he is feeling and so he goes the extra mile for her, even though every minute they wait is a minute closer to BJR finding them and hauling Claire back to the garrison for more torture. He has to make sure that this wedding sweeps her away as much as it is sweeping him away. He is giving her the romantic wedding that Frank never even thought to offer her. It's a wedding about binding them together - literally and figuratively- as a couple, and he wants to please her as much as possible. Hell, he even has a 'father/son' chat with Murtagh about women and Jaime's mother - the sort of conversation a father or beloved uncle has with his son/nephew before the occasion of their marriage - it's what people do in real weddings, not in pretend shotgun weddings. He wants to know if his mother would approve of him marrying Claire and when Murtagh compares Claire's smile to Jaime's mom and says Claire's is just as sweet, that is all that Jaime needs to know that this is somehow meant to be. Sound hokey as hell, I know, and yet it was anything but hokey to watch, it was so beautifully done. And I'm also  left feeling that Murtagh more than just 'knew' Jaime's mother, it seems he was deeply in love with her too. Which again makes me wonder if Jaime is his son (I dont think so), or if he protects Jaime because of his love of Jaime's mother. I hope we unfurl this story line because I find Murtagh a very compelling character in his own quiet way. He's been looking out for Jaime, he has been cluing in Claire on important things related to Jaime when needed...there is more to this guy than meets the eye.

From what we have seen of Jaime, I believe he is not only a romantic and deep-feeling guy, I think he is rather ahead of his time, and he isn't just going along with the status quo of social norms. This is shown in many ways, but most recently when he says angrily to Dougal at night, "It's me body and me back I'll decide what's done with it" (paraphrasing). Jaime has agency over everything in his life except total freedom because he has a price on his head. But other than that one big issue, somewhere along the way our protagonist is a man comfortable in his own skin, even when he is taking decisions that aren't the norm, and even when that skin is riddled and disfigured with scars. So it's no wonder that he's creating a real wedding from a situation of desperation, because he's falling in love with this woman, and I think he believes with his heart, mind and soul that this/she is his destiny, and this is his chance to make this real, so he is pulling out all the stops to show Claire how much he already cares about her. In a way, they are two outlaws, he is a Scot of Clan MacKenzie, yes, but because of the price on his head he's sort of an Outlander too. It's not safe for him to stray too far from MacKenzie lands, ditto Claire, but they can provide a home for one another in this weird situation they are both in.

At first I was rather disappointed that we got nothing of the wedding, until I realized we were in for a night of flashbacks. Seeing the day unfold and again, how much care and love and respect Jaime put into each aspect of the wedding was beyond romantic, it was soulful. The fact that he remembered every second of the wedding while Claire remembered very little made me think that he is somehow carrying their destiny on his shoulders until she can fully be with him (does this mean emotionally, or until she can let go of the past and Frank? I dont know yet). When he calls her his 'brown haired lassie' and talks about her hair being the color of a burn, the way the water ruffles through it, the sun highlighting the auburn of the water, like her hair, Jesus H. Roosevelt Christ, I was about to jump into the TV myself and marry this guy. Whew! But seriously, the level of connection he has with Claire, anticipating what is important to her and what will make her happy, he is the polar opposite of Frank, who lives according to what Frank wants. Claire will never be an afterthought in Jaime's life, but she will always be so in Frank's.

Dougal's comment about making sure he got Jaime a wife that was better than the stable fillies was both crude - not the first crass thing Dougal has said - but there seemed to be an actual sentiment of uncle/nephew feeling, like yes, Jaime is a wanted man but his uncle got him a wife nonetheless, and not for nothing one who is highborn and classy and educated, he made sure Jaime didn't have to settle for a low class lass or a hoor, because he was a wanted man. Weird but still I felt there was some sort of caring there.

ETA: Then again, when Dougal tells Claire he's been to see BJR and tell him she's married, he says "I find you a most singular woman" and makes a pass at her, and in that moment I feel a little like he does indeed have a crush on her, and he seals that sentiment by punching the guy who says she looks like she's been rode hard before, or however that insult goes. I don't know what this will mean in the future, and I hope he doesn't push the issue, I don't think anyone realizes at this point, that these two have fallen in love and this is now a legitimate in love couple. It will be interesting to see how that plays out to the others who probably assume it's all just for show to save Claire from BJR.

So we cant avoid the shagaganza Wedding Night Sex in Three Parts, can we? No we most certainly cannot because it was front and center.

Just Sex...

The first time was so well done in terms of a guy's first time. I mean, I'm not a guy, but I am so used to seeing that scene always from the woman's perspective OR from the guy's perspective of 'Yeah I got it in and I was a champ!' This is the first time I think I've ever seen a realistic version, where the guy is shy and sort of unsure of himself, though I appreciated the "if I need guidance I'll ask" comment. He seemed sort of 'hmm, so that's what it's about?!' afterwards and it was endearing. It also again, spoke volumes about how much he already cares for Claire when he wanted to know if she liked it. When she was quiet he seemed to be ruminating like "how can I get her to like it because I want to please her" even if he doesn't yet know what that even means or how to go about it. But above all else, that first time is about consummating the marriage so that it is legally binding - it is 'just sex', and lust. And there is bewilderment, confusion, and guilt on Claire’s side.

Making Love...

The second time, after hearing how Jaime put so much thought into every detail of this wedding that she can barely remember, it felt like Claire was so overwhelmed with emotion that she was able to finally just give in to the moment and the feelings she was having, completely separate from her previous life. When he opens his heart to her and says that the way she kissed him after they took their vows made him feel like maybe there was a glimmer of hope that she wasn't too sad about having to marry him (and the subtext was that she would grow to love him the way he already loved her). It was such a sweet yet raw and emotional moment - a quick soundbite in a long and methodically slow episode, but it was so heartbreaking that he felt palpable fear that she might never reciprocate what he already feels for her. She hears what he is saying and she has to admit to herself that she too is all in now, she couldn't stop herself from falling in love with this man, and so she initiates the next round, but it isn't just sex now, they are both giving in to the lust and the feelings that they're feeling, maybe she's still not sure what 'this' is though, but she enjoys it, and enjoys showing him some moves that he didn't even know existed, and also is showing him that yes, she does enjoying laying with him in this way. She's showing him that she is opening herself to him as the evening progresses, meeting his feelings with her own. They have exchanged family stories, some laughter, and she has let her guard down wrt her 'old life'. She is seeing only the here and now and this new life, with this new husband, for whatever that might mean...When she tells Jaime to take off his shirt, and she looks him over, the way her hands linger here and there, what a great scene. I supposed this second time could be considered making love, as opposed to just consummating a marriage with the act of sex, as in the first go.

Soul Mates Connecting...

Then, after Jaime gives Claire his mother's pearls - and what another beautiful moment that was, again you see how much his mother meant to him and if she had a strand of rare Scottish pearls she was not your average landowner's wife - anyway, after he says 'they belonged to my mother, and now they belong to my wife', he is telling her "this marriage isn't just to save you from BJR, this is real for me, this is it, you are my wife, my life now (and I hope this is the same for you)'. And when Claire initiates a third go (good for them, three times huzzah!), this time it's beyond making love, this time it's soul mates, connected on all levels, there's no turning back now for these two, and while it's not hinted at, I'd wager that Claire has never experienced this level of intimacy and connection with Frank...wait, Frank who?!? This last act is something that feels binding - like across time and space they will always be connected. Kudos to the showrunners for pulling this episode off and loading it with so much meaning without reducing it to a tripey, tropey mess as most shows would have done!

As a GoT devotee, I panicked like hell when Jaime threw on his clothes and told Claire to hurry up or there'd be no more breakfast downstairs for them. In GoT world, that exit would have meant certain death for Jaime, so I think I actually blurted out, "Dont go downstairs Jaime!" but thankfully it is Outlander, where a breakfast can be just a breakfast and a wedding needn't result in gruesome murders!

When Claire's wedding ring from Frank falls to the floor and lodges between the floorboards, I almost wished she would have been unable to pry it out, and she'd have to leave it there. But taking it with her seems to indicate we're not done with Frank just yet, no matter how much I wish it were so. And I think her look of being torn isn't so much about being unfaithful to Frank but rather, knowing in that moment that she never had, could never have, and will never have a connection with Frank like she has with Jaime, this man she just met after falling through time. What an overwhelming thing for her to realize in that moment! What I don't really get is this - it seems like nobody really mentioned her Frank ring, sort of odd. And also, can we talk about the hygiene of the time? I wish we'd seen some proper bathing happening pre-wedding, just sayin'...

Last but not least, when I look at this 'long wedding night' episode, I get why they shot it and edited it the way they did - it shows us two people falling deeply in love with each other over the course of an evening, and yet it seems so completely natural and realistic. It's so well done and to be honest, I have never seen a scene like this ever, not on TV or on film. It's just stunningly done and I just cannot imagine that Claire would even want Frank after what Jaime has made her feel here.

 

Edited March 17, 2021 by gingerella

[Cdh20]

2 hours ago, gingerella said:

Claire will never be an afterthought in Jaime's life, but she will always be so in Frank's.

I believed  this right from this episode!

2 hours ago, gingerella said:

It's so well done and to be honest, I have never seen a scene like this ever, not on TV or on film. It's just stunningly done and I just cannot imagine that Claire would even want Frank after what Jaime has made her feel here.

I agree, I've not seen anything like it before & It is perhaps my fave epi of TV ever! 

[gingerella]

7 minutes ago, Cdh20 said:

I believed  this right from this episode!

I agree, I've not seen anything like it before & It is perhaps my fave epi of TV ever! 

Yes but...it's so heady that it sort of makes you yearn for this level of angst and wanting and that's not realistic! But damn it's a good escape, and more so during a pandemic. These two...I want them to stand the test of time...literally and figuratively!

[Cdh20]

15 minutes ago, gingerella said:

Yes but...it's so heady that it sort of makes you yearn for this level of angst and wanting and that's not realistic! But damn it's a good escape, and more so during a pandemic. These two...I want them to stand the test of time...literally and figuratively!

I always say this is the episode where you are in or out, because it was intoxicating. I love how Jamie reveals the lengths he went to, & we  ( the audience, & me personally) are all falling in love with him the same time as Claire is! 
 

This year was a perfect time for people to find this show & be able to binge so many seasons in a row! 

[gingerella]

10 minutes ago, Cdh20 said:

I always say this is the episode where you are in or out, because it was intoxicating. I love how Jamie reveals the lengths he went to, & we  ( the audience, & me personally) are all falling in love with him the same time as Claire is!

This year was a perfect time for people to find this show & be able to binge so many seasons in a row! 

OMG yes! This is such a perfect way to describe this episode - intoxicating - and you are right, either you're in or you're out after this. Either you believe A Story fully or you don't. I hadn't thought about it this way but you are so right, we are falling in love with Jaime at the same time Claire is...(now if only I could get in on the consummation part of things!).

[Anothermi]

I guess they answered my concerns about whether the marriage would go ahead. Yikes! They didn't have to beat me over the head with it. 

Besides the "the education of Master Jamie Fraser" (xx rated—they left something to the imagination, thankfully) I think we might have had 10 minutes of footage to further the story. 

There was the mangy cat, though. That's one for the plus side. 

The episode was fine. At least we didn't have to see folks beating each other up (see: Dothraki wedding entertainment)

We now know Jamie's full name (and Claire's—she's got a royal name too—so there). And that his mates don't know crap about sex but they want the best for him anyway. And that marvellous Murtagh is a Fraser. And that actually Jamie has some things from his mother—whom he reveres. 

Also that Jamie insisted on a real wedding, but Dougal doesn't think it is. Made me harken back to Claire thinking Dougal was Hamish's father. Is that how he ensures his blood line will permeate the Mackenzie Clan? Or is he just a letch? That was the only twist/ new perspective I caught.

 

[gingerella]

@Anothermi, So, it wasn't good for you then?!?

[Anothermi]

3 hours ago, gingerella said:

@Anothermi, So, it wasn't good for you then?!?

If the definition of "good" is needing a smoke after? No. But I was pleased with half the sexy stuff. But like you (if I understood you correctly) it wore me... down. A whole episode? I felt for the actors. That must have been a long day. 

ETA. I went out after posting 1st time, but have read your post now and it has given me food for thought. I think I need time to ruminate on what I have seen and I haven't been getting it. Good thing I have your perspective—as well as Pallas'.  Thanks.

Edited March 14, 2021 by Anothermi

[SassAndSnacks]

19 hours ago, gingerella said:

So full disclosure, I watched this episode three times.

I read this post of yours probably no less than 6 times.  Truly, it is one of the best synopses of this episode I've ever seen.  I feel like you captured everything so perfectly and so astutely.  It is absolutely brilliant.

The Wedding is one of my favorite tv episodes of all time.  If I'm having a terrible day, this is one of the episodes I'll watch (of ANY show) to bring me out of my funk.  I could never fully put my finger on WHY I gravitate to it so much.  I don't particularly like a lot of sexual scenes, so that can't be it.  I find a few of the points in the episode a little cheesy.  And yet, I continuously come back to this one over and over again.  

19 hours ago, gingerella said:

Frank springs a Registry wedding on her, clearly she hasn't been part of this decision but Frank has already planned it.

Reason #67 why I really don't like Frank.  Self-centered prick.  Way to make a girl feel special.  And I know that so many couples did the quick, impromptu wedding in the lead up to WWII, but that isn't the sense I got with this one.  It was something HE wanted to do, so they did it. 

19 hours ago, gingerella said:

When he calls her his 'brown haired lassie' and talks about her hair being the color of a burn, the way the water ruffles through it, the sun highlighting the auburn of the water, like her hair, Jesus H. Roosevelt Christ, I was about to jump into the TV myself and marry this guy.

This is my favorite line from any book, show, poem, anything ever.  Sighhhhhhhhhh........

19 hours ago, gingerella said:

the level of connection he has with Claire, anticipating what is important to her and what will make her happy, he is the polar opposite of Frank, who lives according to what Frank wants. Claire will never be an afterthought in Jaime's life, but she will always be so in Frank's.

I'm sorry, Frank who?

19 hours ago, gingerella said:

Soul Mates Connecting...

My favorite part of this time around is Claire wrapping Jamie's plaid around them.  His family's plaid now enveloping the two of them.  

19 hours ago, gingerella said:

And I think her look of being torn isn't so much about being unfaithful to Frank but rather, knowing in that moment that she never had, could never have, and will never have a connection with Frank like she has with Jaime, thus man she just met after falling through time. What an overwhelming thing for her to realize in that moment!

This is such a great observation.  I can't imagine the emotions coursing through her, and there had to be such a sense of guilt, I'd think.  How could she possibly be feeling this way about Jamie when just a few weeks ago she had been married to someone else?  Further, I think she would be questioning just what kind of relationship she and Frank had, because it definitely wouldn't have felt like this.   It's also important to remember that she met and married Frank when she was so young.  She is more experienced in love than Jamie certainly, but it isn't as though she has a ton of relationship experience with various men to use as comparison.

19 hours ago, gingerella said:

it shows us two people falling deeply in love with each other over the course of an evening, and yet it seems so completely natural and realistic.

There.  You said it.  THAT is why I keep coming back to this one.  

17 hours ago, Cdh20 said:

I always say this is the episode where you are in or out, because it was intoxicating. I love how Jamie reveals the lengths he went to, & we  ( the audience, & me personally) are all falling in love with him the same time as Claire is! 

YES!!

[Anothermi]

59 minutes ago, SassAndSnacks said:

I read this post of yours probably no less than 6 times.  Truly, it is one of the best synopses of this episode I've ever seen.  I feel like you captured everything so perfectly and so astutely.  It is absolutely brilliant.

I've only read it once, but I agree with the bolded part (I haven't read any other synopses, but I trust Gingerella.) And now I won't (may not) have to go back and watch it again. :-D

Quote

My favorite part of this time around is Claire wrapping Jamie's plaid around them.  His family's plaid now enveloping the two of them. 

And it harkens back to Episode One when he (painfully I might add) wraps the cloak around both of them while they ride through the rain.  He initiates the first one, she the second—with reciprocal feeling. 

[gingerella]

5 minutes ago, Anothermi said:

I've only read it once, but I agree with the bolded part (I haven't read any other synopses, but I trust Gingerella.) And now I won't (may not) have to go back and watch it again. 😄

And it harkens back to Episode One when he (painfully I might add) wraps the cloak around both of them while they ride through the rain.  He initiates the first one, she the second—with reciprocal feeling. 

Yes! I was just coming here to say that I also loved when she wraps Jaime's tartan around his shoulders the third go, because he did that for her when first they met. She was so on guard that first time, being plunked on a horse, sitting basically in a strange man's lap in the rain wearing nothing but a rain sodden thin dress. His gesture was not just protection from the elements in that moment, it was also protection for Claire, to make her feel like someone was taking care of her, watching out for her, but no words were really said. And in that moment she was probably too traumatized to know or feel any of that. But this time, she essentially does the same exact thing to Jaime. She is wrapping his tartan around his shoulders to keep him warm while they're engaged in sex, but she is also telling him - by doing that and by looking him directly in the eyes - that yes, what he hoped her wedding kiss meant, it did mean that, it does mean that, she does feel what he is feeling. She is the one now cloaking him in protection, they are one now. It's damn good, and damn difficult to convey that sort of intense feeling without it coming across as a Hallmark movie.

*whew* I don't smoke but maybe I could quaff some Rheinish wine right about now...

PS: Just to be clear, as a GoT devotee, I can remember exactly zero weddings or love connections that were this well done, like ever.

[Beeyago]

3 hours ago, SassAndSnacks said:

I'm sorry, Frank who?

 This! 😬

[FnkyChkn34]

On 3/14/2021 at 3:23 PM, gingerella said:

PS: Just to be clear, as a GoT devotee, I can remember exactly zero weddings or love connections that were this well done, like ever.

I'm fairly certain that I am not spoiling anything when I say that Jaime and Claire's connection is the central focus of the show, the #1 storyline.  No love connection on GoT was ever that important, and the central focus of GoT was very, very different.  In my opinion, the two shows can't be compared.  

[Cdh20]

On 3/14/2021 at 12:02 PM, SassAndSnacks said:

The Wedding is one of my favorite tv episodes of all time.  If I'm having a terrible day, this is one of the episodes I'll watch (of ANY show) to bring me out of my funk.  I could never fully put my finger on WHY I gravitate to it so much.  I don't particularly like a lot of sexual scenes, so that can't be it.  I find a few of the points in the episode a little cheesy.  And yet, I continuously come back to this one over and over again.  

Me too! 🙋🏼‍♀️( And I thought it was just our fave episode of Outlander! ) Maybe when these posters are caught up, they will find the thread for fave episodes, &  post over there! 

[Pallas]

Another way of looking at the contrast between Claire's two weddings is that Frank gave her the wedding she wanted at the time, and Jamie gave her the wedding he wanted and knew she  needed, to dignify the occasion and her standing. Both were thinking of her. But they're different men, in different times, and most of all, Claire is different too.

Frank and Claire are on their way to meet his parents for the first time, and running because they are late (and likely, giddy with nerves). Frank doesn't strike me as a very impulsive man, but when he sees the Registry, he comes to full halt and immediate decision. When he proposes that they elope on their way to lunch, Claire looks amazed, not unsettled -- amazed at Frank, not unsettled by the idea. She has one reservation (paraphrased): "Don't you want the big event with all your family there?"

Now, Claire's no master of indirection; if she wanted the big event with all Frank's family there, she'd have said -- or at least, given some indication. And Claire's no fool: most people understand that lots of men could live very well without the big event with all their family there. But that's Claire's one concern, so my take is that the ceremonial and ancestral aspect is something that Frank the historian had been interested in. Yet Frank's very clear: Nope. Not now. And, "You're the only the family I want. You, and our children."  And still hand-in-hand with Frank, Claire goes skidding gleefully across the threshold of the Registry office. Their wedding was a caper and they pulled it off.  

Of course Frank was likely nervous about what his parents would think of his orphaned, unconventional fiancee, and how that would play out over the years. He;s no fool either. But the point of the flashback is to show us how it affects Claire years later, in the hour when she's about to marry Jamie, and she's clearly moved by the memory. She still treasures it, for them and then.

The big event with all his (mother's) family there that Jamie wedding-plans is for both of them too: Claire's just too already-married-to-someone-else-and-from-1945--and-hungover to know it, at the time. It's symbolic of a whole world that Jamie is making available to her, despite his current status as an outlaw. Unlike most weddings, each of Claire's seems to reflect what the marriage might become -- for Claire, in her time and place in life. The contrast and conflict may revolve around the two men, but it resolves around Claire.  

[gingerella]

On 3/23/2021 at 5:49 AM, Pallas said:

Another way of looking at the contrast between Claire's two weddings is that Frank gave her the wedding she wanted at the time, and Jamie gave her the wedding he wanted and knew she  needed, to dignify the occasion and her standing. Both were thinking of her.

I love what you said about Jamie’s intention, but I still feel like Franks idea of a wedding was more about him though Claire didn’t seem to mind, but she also seems so much more docile Claire-like compared to the Claire we come to know with Jamie, and I say that based solely on his Frankcentric blethering on about is ancestors with the Reverend, he just seems like this always about him and his wife is a decoration in his life. I also felt like Jamie created this romantic gesture because he knows this thing is bigger than both of them, it's forever, even if Claire doesnt know it quite yet.

There are some inconsistencies with this episode. Firstly, Murtagh tells Jaime that the village is crawling with Red Coats, so how is it they’re hiding both Jamie and Claire without anyone seeing them, let alone having a wedding under the radar?!

Second, Dougal rescues Claire and BJR says to have her back by sundown the following day, yes? Then we see in flashbacks all the wedding prep happening during an entire day, yes? And people keep saying the wedding is the next day. But after the wedding they’re upstairs all night and it seems that they were supposed to deliver her at sundown, so color me confused...

On a shallow note, Claire’s wedding dress is rather spectacular, even Dougal seems overwhelmed. But when we first see her in it it looks taupe, and then as she walks into the church it looks blue. Also, I love that the make up they use for Claire is very natural and light, as if she’s not wearing anything at all. 

And because it bears repeating, when he tells her how when she kissed him he thought maybe she wasn’t so sorry to be marrying him after all, the look on his face as she touches him, and he realizes that she feels more than he thought she did,  that’s just got to be one of my favorite moments of this season. 

Edited March 24, 2021 by gingerella

[SassAndSnacks]

On 3/23/2021 at 8:49 AM, Pallas said:

Now, Claire's no master of indirection; if she wanted the big event with all Frank's family there, she'd have said -- or at least, given some indication.

True.  But, Claire really isn't one for a lot of fuss for any occasion.  

My take on the Frank wedding is that Claire wasn't expecting it and went along with it.  She was a willing participant, but it always came across to me as "this is something to do and it could be fun."  

7 hours ago, gingerella said:

she also seems so much more docile Claire-like compared to the Claire we come to know with Jamie, and I say that based solely on his Frankcentric blethering on about is ancestors with the Reverend, he just seems like this always about him and his wife is a decoration in his life. I also felt like Jamie created this romantic gesture because he knows this thing is bigger than both of them, it's forever, even if Claire doesnt know it quite yet.

Absolutely.  Frank stifles her.  It's not an overwhelming overpowering, which makes it even more dangerous.  He stifles passively and bit by bit.  

On 3/23/2021 at 8:49 AM, Pallas said:

It's symbolic of a whole world that Jamie is making available to her, despite his current status as an outlaw.

 Yes! Jamie doesn't have much to offer her, and he knows that.  He's giving her what he can.  It comes off as so much more heartfelt and true and thoughtful.  But I'm biased.  I loathe Frank too much to see that he would have ever done anything just for Claire.  

7 hours ago, gingerella said:

when he tells her how when she kissed him he thought maybe she wasn’t so sorry to be marrying him after all, the look on his face as she touches him, and he realizes that she feels more than he thought she did,  that’s just got to be one of my favorite moments of this season. 

Swoon.  I also love the comment about her hair.  You could see Claire weakening her defenses and falling in there.  (Or am I projecting?)

[Cdh20]

8 hours ago, gingerella said:

 

On a shallow note, Claire’s wedding dress is rather spectacular, even Dougal seems overwhelmed. But when we first see her in it it looks taupe, and then as she walks into the church it looks blue. Also, I love that the make up they use for Claire is very natural and light, as if she’s not wearing anything at all. 

And because it bears repeating, when he tells her how when she kissed him he thought maybe she wasn’t so sorry to be marrying him after all, the look on his face as she touches him, and he realizes that she feels more than he thought she did,  that’s just got to be one of my favorite moments of this season. 

I have seen the wedding dress in real life ( it’s on display at Sony Studios in LA) & it is kinda taupe ( beige & grey), but it has silvery threads running through it, (& the leaf embroidery is silver ) so that might cause the bluish tones.

I too adore the look on Jamie’s face when she touches him then! These are the looks I am talking about that one might miss on the first watch but that are so important. Both Sam & Cait are gifted actors. 

[Quilt Fairy]

On 3/24/2021 at 8:57 AM, Cdh20 said:

On 3/24/2021 at 12:30 AM, gingerella said:

 

On a shallow note, Claire’s wedding dress is rather spectacular, even Dougal seems overwhelmed. But when we first see her in it it looks taupe, and then as she walks into the church it looks blue. Also, I love that the make up they use for Claire is very natural and light, as if she’s not wearing anything at all. 

And because it bears repeating, when he tells her how when she kissed him he thought maybe she wasn’t so sorry to be marrying him after all, the look on his face as she touches him, and he realizes that she feels more than he thought she did,  that’s just got to be one of my favorite moments of this season. 

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I have seen the wedding dress in real life ( it’s on display at Sony Studios in LA) & it is kinda taupe ( beige & grey), but it has silvery threads running through it, (& the leaf embroidery is silver ) so that might cause the bluish tones.

I am very late to the party here, I only started watching last year, first the early seasons on Netflix and then caught up on the later seasons when Starz had a free weekend.   Like several others, this is one of my favorite episodes and I've watched it several times.  In fact, I watched it twice right before I started this post.   And I believe there is a glaring continuity error regarding the wedding dress.   The dress that Claire is wearing in the bedroom (the one that Jamie unlaces for her) is not the same dress she was married in.  It's a beautiful dress, but it's a different dress.  The color is different, the shape and the embroidery on the corset is different, it does not have the divided skirt with the embroidered leaves on the underskirt.  At first I thought it was possible, although unlikely, that Claire changed after the wedding.  But the next morning when Claire picks the dress up off the floor it is the wedding dress.  This is not a show where one would expect this kind of gaff, but there it is, and it bugs the hell out of me every time I watch. 

[gingerella]

50 minutes ago, Quilt Fairy said:

I am very late to the party here, I only started watching last year, first the early seasons on Netflix and then caught up on the later seasons when Starz had a free weekend.   Like several others, this is one of my favorite episodes and I've watched it several times.  In fact, I watched it twice right before I started this post.   And I believe there is a glaring continuity error regarding the wedding dress.   The dress that Claire is wearing in the bedroom (the one that Jamie unlaces for her) is not the same dress she was married in.  It's a beautiful dress, but it's a different dress.  The color is different, the shape and the embroidery on the corset is different, it does not have the divided skirt with the embroidered leaves on the underskirt.  At first I thought it was possible, although unlikely, that Claire changed after the wedding.  But the next morning when Claire picks the dress up off the floor it is the wedding dress.  This is not a show where one would expect this kind of gaff, but there it is, and it bugs the hell out of me every time I watch. 

I believe the dress we see in the bedroom scenes is the under dress, which would have been worn under the fabulous dress we see Claire in during the wedding ceremony. Such gowns would have been removed as soon as possible as cleaning them would have been nearly impossible. So the dress beneath is what we see her in once she is upstairs in their wedding night bedroom. It's plainer but still lovely. The thing I wonder is where did she put that dress when they saddled up and rode back to Leoch?! Claire has alot of fabulous outfits but all are thick heavy materials and she only seems to have a small cylindrical saddlebag so where is a her stuff?! 🤔

[Anothermi]

1 hour ago, gingerella said:

I believe the dress we see in the bedroom scenes is the under dress, which would have been worn under the fabulous dress we see Claire in during the wedding ceremony. Such gowns would have been removed as soon as possible as cleaning them would have been nearly impossible. So the dress beneath is what we see her in once she is upstairs in their wedding night bedroom. It's plainer but still lovely. The thing I wonder is where did she put that dress when they saddled up and rode back to Leoch?! Claire has alot of fabulous outfits but all are thick heavy materials and she only seems to have a small cylindrical saddlebag so where is a her stuff?! 🤔

I thought Mrs. Fitzgibbons was tasked with packing and sending a trunk of all their worldly possessions to Lallybroch. And that it arrived before Jamie and Claire which is how Jenny learned her brother wasn't dead. I have to assume all that stuff is still at Lallybroch.

[gingerella]

3 hours ago, Anothermi said:

I thought Mrs. Fitzgibbons was tasked with packing and sending a trunk of all their worldly possessions to Lallybroch. And that it arrived before Jamie and Claire which is how Jenny learned her brother wasn't dead. I have to assume all that stuff is still at Lallybroch.

Quite right, but I was meaning how did she schlep that big huge wedding dress and all the petticoats under it on her horse back to Leoch. She never has a very big saddlrbag on her horse but her wardrobe is, how shall I say, extensive!

Edited April 22, 2021 by gingerella