S19.E06: He Delivered Me from All My Fears

[LotusFlower]

1 hour ago, Granny58 said:

Christine, I think, said something interesting last night.  She said if she had the love of her life (David) she wouldn't then want to go off and have to spend time with other people.  THAT, I believe, is what happened.  He finally met his true love and grew ever more resentful of having to be with people he didn't want to spend time with.  Then he has to spin up a story about it to justify it all to himself, and the viewers.  The lesson here is that you can't have polyamory if you have a real love in the mix. 

True.  But what about the kids?  You have children with these (three) wives that you don’t want to spend time with anymore.  Even if you resent having to go spend time with wife #1, 2, or 3, you have a duty to help raise your kids!!  And yes, that means spending time with them, and getting to know them.  It always pissed me off how the wives did all the parenting.  And still are. 

[altopower]

3 hours ago, nosedive said:

Of the three women who left the relationship, I think she was the one most hurt. For her own emotional health, she would do well to box him out of her life completely.

Agreed. That's probably one of the many reasons she went to the AUB to get a release from him, so there would be no ties at all, and no reason to have to see him. Leon is old enough to have a relationship or not with Kody and any of their siblings. Meri can stay out of it and live her own life. More power to her.

[altopower]

6 minutes ago, LotusFlower said:

It always pissed me off how the wives did all the parenting.  And still are. 

And the children are always referred to as "Janelle's kids" or "Christine's kids," never "OUR kids." That gives him a degree of separation from them. I believe he loved them as much as his stilted self could when they were little and adored their wonderful daddy. But once they hit Vegas and even moreso in Flagstaff, they were separate and Kody spent more time with Robyn and the Robynettes, The now-teenager kids were out in the world for the first time and seeing relationships in a new light. They got closer to each other and to their moms, and that's the family that's left of the original bunch. Kody is out in the cold with Robyn and their weird art.

[BAForever]

1 hour ago, altopower said:

Agreed. That's probably one of the many reasons she went to the AUB to get a release from him, so there would be no ties at all, and no reason to have to see him. Leon is old enough to have a relationship or not with Kody and any of their siblings. Meri can stay out of it and live her own life. More power to her.

Totally agree @altopower. Interesting that Janelle doesn't feel the need to get a release. Of the 3 OG, she seemed the most committed to polygamy. I've said it before, Janelle never needed polygamy. Janelle needed a man who is gone 3/4 of the time. A truck driver, a military spouse, etc. At my gym are two men (heroes) who are travelling utility workers. Both have been gone weeks now off helping with hurricane survivors. Long, hard work, good money. Perfect for her now.

Edited October 22 by BAForever

[b2H]

A few observations: They had the right idea at Christmas when Christine was discussing the evolving relationship with David with the older kids - wanting to have this discussion before Truely was there.  But then they continued the discussion with Truely present and she was not comfortable.  She absorbed herself into her book, but we cannot miss that she could still hear the ensuing discussion.

Meri has Kody’s number.  She was smacking him over the head with her explanation that she wasn’t buying his perception of things.  Meri wasn’t going to Christmas with people that didn’t love her.  Not sure who the people were that she did spend with, but good on her.  Kody using Robyn as the reason Meri should still come shows just how sick he is.  Glad she said no.

Christine finally understanding Kody/Robyn now that she has her own wonderful relationship.

Edited October 22 by b2H

[barshi50]

5 hours ago, General Days said:

Yeah, and someone (Christine, maybe) called Leon "Leon," on screen, either at the end of last season or the beginning of this season. Mostly though, they don't mention Leon. Robyn talked about "Meri's kids" or "Meri's children" in relationship to Thanksgiving, too. 

I believe it was on the Christine/David wedding special. Christine was talking about all the kids being there, and that Leon and Audrey were coming. I seem to remember a few quick glimpses of them, and if you look at the family pictures, they are in them.

[65mickey]

So Janelle said that the Coyote Pass property was going to be split 4 ways. i don't think that she she said 4 equal ways but I hope she meant that. And she said it was up to her, Meri and Kody to pay off the loan. what about Robyn's share? And surprise surprise Kody doesn't have the money to pay his share but Janelle has the money to pay off her share.   But we also know that Janelle recently sunk a bunch of money into undeveloped land in NC. At the rate these knuckleheads are going I wouldn't be surprised if Coyote Pass is in foreclosure. 

Edited October 22 by 65mickey

[ragingpixie]

Before this episode, I was merely flabbergasted.

After this episode, I am gobsmacked.

[laurakaye]

10 hours ago, ragingpixie said:

Before this episode, I was merely flabbergasted.

After this episode, I am gobsmacked.

I love the word gobsmacked.  I want to use it in my everyday vocabulary but I feel like an imposter - same as when I really want to use the phrase "bless his heart" but I'm a northerner.  Not sure if I have anything to really use on Kody Brown except maybe "yeah, no."

Anyone else think that now that Meri has dismissed Kody and gotten her release, he's going to re-re-re-re-write history again and tell us that now he kinda digs her vibe?  As much as he got his man-panties in a bunch over Christine - who we know he found repulsive even before he married her - what's he going to do about Meri?  It's almost as if he gains some reluctant respect for any woman who dares to leave the masterpiece that is Kody Brown and starts to second guess his mistreatment.  Either that or he can't keep straight the revisionist history he's created for all of his exes and starts to hit on Meri, thinking she's Janelle or something.  Without Robyn next to him pulling up the .pdf file on the narrative they've created, he tends to riff and ad-lib.  Also, he's nuts, so there's that.

Over/under on the next episode's couch sessions with Robyn dry-crying over the fact that she can no longer use Meri as her plaything to keep pretending that she's still in a plyg marriage?  I'll say 5.  No, 20.

[ginger90]

On 10/21/2024 at 8:59 PM, 65mickey said:

I wouldn't be surprised if Coyote Pass is in foreclosure.

 

Spoiler

The property was paid off last year, I believe it was June, 2023.

 

[General Days]

I don't think Robyn is "in love" with Kody. You could tell that Meri and Christine were in love with him. (I'm not sure about Janelle. She keeps her cards close to her vest.) I thought Robyn was into him at during their courtship, but after that, her main interest seemed to be getting recognition from the whole pack.

I thought Kody was in love with Meri at the very beginning of the series. I've known he was in love with Robyn for a long time, and think I would have known, even if he and the other women didn't talk about it. Robyn doesn't strike me as being in love, though. 

 

18 hours ago, nosedive said:

Maybe it refers to David (boyfriend, not King), from Christine's perspective? Or maybe, like in the Psalm from which the text is taken, it refers to God? Or maybe some writer just liked the way it sounded.🤷‍♀️

 

I think that must be it. Christine married Kody when she was just shy of 22 years old. It sounds like he was never very affectionate with her, which (especially since he had other women in his life) must have been devastating to her feelings of self-worth. We know he would humiliate her (the nachos incident comes to mind). Then along comes David, who both loves and wants her. 

 

18 hours ago, nosedive said:

Agree!  That scene was so disturbing.  He was intentionally trying to manipulate Meri, deliberately inflicting injury and trying to strip her of her dignity.  He's such a despicable creep.  I hope she never gives him the chance to speak to her again.  Of the three women who left the relationship, I think she was the one most hurt. For her own emotional health, she would do well to box him out of her life completely.

 

Yes! Since (from Kody's warped perspective) Meri took an action that "made" the AUB issue a judgment that Kody had abandoned Meri, and she deserved a release, he had to cause injury to her, to kind of erase the injury his psyche sustained.

He can still push Meri's buttons, too. He got her to agree with him that whatever the AUB guy told him on the phone was "bullshit." He was able to make Meri express anger toward the AUB on his behalf, when what the AUB did was listen to Meri's case and side with her. 

She should stay far, far away from him whenever possible.

 

18 hours ago, Shelbie said:

I don’t think Robyn ever wanted him all to herself either.

I think she wanted to be the top wife and have the first three jealous and heartsick and desperate to please her and acknowledge her as the queen of polygamy. It hasn’t turned out as she expected and she has no idea what to do.

 

I agree about Robyn's expectations. I definitely think she wanted the financial security, but I'm not sure I think her motives were all that dark. Christine, Meri, and Robyn were conditioned into this life since childhood. Robyn did the "best" job of pleasing a husband in plural marriage. 

Kody's whole spiel about "It's your fault if I love you and it's your fault if I don't love you," is probably a very unprettified rewording of their sect's attitude towards women and marriage. 

I also think Robyn got herself and her first three kids out of a situation where they were pretty insecure. She wanted and needed this marriage to work, so she could give them a good life.

I also think she held at least some of the beliefs, and thought she needed plural marriage to save her and her older children who were born into a marriage that wasn't sealed by the AUB. (From things I have read, it seems to me that they don't seal marriages where the couple conceived out of wedlock.)

 

16 hours ago, Granny58 said:

Christine, I think, said something interesting last night.  She said if she had the love of her life (David) she wouldn't then want to go off and have to spend time with other people.  THAT, I believe, is what happened.  He finally met his true love and grew ever more resentful of having to be with people he didn't want to spend time with.  Then he has to spin up a story about it to justify it all to himself, and the viewers.  The lesson here is that you can't have polyamory if you have a real love in the mix. 

 

I agree. It's just a shame it affected his treatment of his first 13 children. 

I would imagine most plural husbands have a favorite wife (even if that changes over the years). You just click with some people better than you click with other people. Some are probably better at hiding it than Kody was, but I bet it's a pretty common experience. I feel like that is the situation Genielle (Kody's mom) experienced, once Winn married Sheryl (Janelle's mom). She described it differently (and only blamed herself for her insecurities), but I remember thinking she knew how it felt to lose favor with her husband. 

Edited October 22 by General Days
to be more clear

[RoxiP]

20 hours ago, Shelbie said:

He is a sad and pathetic excuse for a man and if Robyn ever leaves him he will crumble into dust and be left with no one.

Even more frightening - he will show up on those shows that feature failed reality stars.

[kimaken]

15 hours ago, mythoughtis said:

Kody has pretty much abandoned Meri for 10 years.

Actually, he pretty much was done with her even before the legal divorce (which happened BEFORE the catfish incident--it was no wonder she was such an easy target). He did remain on friendly terms (at least for the show; not sure if it was for real) until the past 3-4 seasons, when he started telling everyone BUT Meri that he was done with her.

Edited October 22 by kimaken
replace missing letter in the word

[laurakaye]

1 hour ago, RoxiP said:

Even more frightening - he will show up on those shows that feature failed reality stars.

As long as it's Celebrity Boxing, I am OK with that.  And Mike Tyson is his opponent.

When Meri told Kody she was moving to Parowan and Kody said, "Ok, bon voyage!" - I just wish that Meri had simply gotten up, walked to her front door and gestured for Kody to GTFO without another word to him.  And then made sure that he could hear her lock the door behind his scraggly a$$. 

  

[Granny58]

1 hour ago, RoxiP said:

Even more frightening - he will show up on those shows that feature failed reality stars.

Dancing with the "Stars."  That would be a sight!  🤣

[AZChristian]

19 minutes ago, Granny58 said:

Dancing with the "Stars."  That would be a sight!  🤣

It WOULD be a sight, but Kody would be all puffed up and love the fact that he was invited.  And he would blame the whole world for laughing at him - because it couldn't be HIS fault that his dancing makes him look like a doofus.  The world has no taste!!!!

I loved your reference to Dancing with the "Stars."  I haven't even known who half of them are.

[Marley GMA]

18 hours ago, Granny58 said:

Christine, I think, said something interesting last night.  She said if she had the love of her life (David) she wouldn't then want to go off and have to spend time with other people.  THAT, I believe, is what happened.  He finally met his true love and grew ever more resentful of having to be with people he didn't want to spend time with.  Then he has to spin up a story about it to justify it all to himself, and the viewers.  The lesson here is that you can't have polyamory if you have a real love in the mix. 

You are exactly right  He just went about it horribly and has acted like the last 20 years never happened.  To speak about the mothers of his children the way he does, it is no wonder the kids are estranged.  And now Robin is stuck.  He has the love of his life, but does she have the love of her life......not too sure (if she sees what we are seeing, I doubt it). 

 

[MamaMax]

2

Quote

 

hours ago (edited)

I don't think Robyn is "in love" with Kody. You could tell that Meri and Christine were in love with him. (I'm not sure about Janelle. She keeps her cards close to her vest.) I thought Robyn was into him at during their courtship, but after that, her main interest seemed to be getting recognition from the whole pack.

 

I think Robyn is a deeply emotionally damaged person and is trying to undo her childhood traumas by creating for her kids a "real" version of her fantasy of a "perfect polygamous family." She has obvious abandonment issues stemming from her bio dads disappearance/ rejection of the family. Then her mom spiritually remarried a "polygamous"  man who wasn't a real polygamist - he just had a second family on the side.  (IIRC, this was the Sullivan, who she calls her dad but is not her bio dad). Then she (shotgun?) married a major player in the UAB who wouldn't live polygamy, reportedly was abusive, and couldn't provide financially for her or the kids  (at least not to her her standard).  Her attempts to whitewash this part of her life were SUPER obvious at the beginning of the marriage (the creepy portrait of K with the kids, having her kids IMMEDIATLEY call Kody daddy), continued until Kody legally married her (I think that was her insistence so she couldn't ever be discarded as "not a real wife" like her mom). Her "just sittin on the porch with her sisterwives"  fantasy was her ultimate pie in the sky. That would prove that Her beloved dad wasn't just a cheater! See??  Polygamy could work and be legit and everyone can be happy and get along!!  Except  all the things she needed to feel secure and safe with Kody, and that he then provided for her, were the things that drove her sisterwives away.

Kody said that he could never satisfy Meri. I'd bet my bottom dollar that what Meri really wanted were all the same things Robyn did... but she thought she couldn't ask for them, couldn't insist on them because she KNEW they would destroy the family because she understood polygamy. It's about women pushing down their jealousies, subjugating their needs and desires. It is SO patriarchal in its very design that it was hilarious that Kody claimed her never was patriarchal.  Of course you were, its just that your OG wives made it easier for you. Now that you care about one woman's emotional well-being and the other 3 could see you didn't care about theirs: that was the end of the family.

[JoannKBC]

Quote

Janelle never needed polygamy. Janelle needed a man who is gone 3/4 of the time.

That's what she needs now. But I think she did need polygamy when she had young kids, because she wanted a big family and she wanted a career, but she did not want to be a single mom raising a bunch of young children. She wanted and needed someone to co-parent with her in a situation where she would still be head of the household. That's why I think she appreciated polygamy for at least part of her life. It's funny now she says she doesn't want to be married because she wants her independence - Kody was so oppressive that she can't even seem to imagine a husband who could love and support her AND encourage and enjoy her independence.

 

Quote

Kody's whole spiel about "It's your fault if I love you and it's your fault if I don't love you," is probably a very unprettified rewording of their sect's attitude towards women and marriage. 

This was so weird to me. If this is his logic, would he also say that it's his fault if someone does or doesn't love him? I don't think so. He sure doesn't take any responsibility for the wives and children who don't love him anymore.

 

[toodywoody]

Omg, why did I have to look up the orgasm crap. Now I must throw up. 

[General Days]

I don't know what that comment above mine is referring to and I don't want to. 

[Granny58]

4 hours ago, Marley GMA said:

And now Robin is stuck.  He has the love of his life, but does she have the love of her life......not too sure (if she sees what we are seeing, I doubt it). 

well she NEVER looks jubilant and in love, that's for sure.  I do believe she found a good way out of her situation but was cool with having him 1/4 of the time.  

[precious pupp]

49 minutes ago, Granny58 said:

well she NEVER looks jubilant and in love, that's for sure.  I do believe she found a good way out of her situation but was cool with having him 1/4 of the time.  

At least before Sol and Ari, who "couldn't go more than 2 days" without seeing their dad.

 

[kassa]

8 hours ago, laurakaye said:

I love the word gobsmacked.  I want to use it in my everyday vocabulary but I feel like an imposter - same as when I really want to use the phrase "bless his heart" but I'm a northerner. 

You can go with "God love him" - means basically the same thing.

The only reason Kody is engaging with Meri is to film something other than Robyn pleading with him to do something to stem the tide of public disapproval.  I have no doubt attempts were made to film with Janelle and even Christine (Janelle has mentioned that he is in contact and that she is the one telling him "nah, I'm good.") Of course he knows there's no hope with Christine, but would absolutely think she "owed" him another sit down for the sake of the show. Meanwhile, she's got 20 other people to film with, thankyouverymuch. 

Oddly, Meri holds some pretty big cards now where Robyn and Kody are concerned. She was always a toy they could pull out from the back of the closet when it suited them, and was grateful to be included.  Now (in show time) the only people they interact with who have spoken in complete sentences on the show for the past however many years are Tony, Mykelti, and whichever gunbuddy Kody spills his guts to next. 

I'm glad the younger kids are only minimally on the show compared to years ago, but aside from some sulky couch appearances by the older girls, the Robyn/Kody family doesn't even film with each other! The crew seems to have been banned from shooting in their home... but don't they ever LEAVE it? 

Edited October 22 by kassa

[Granny58]

what's confusing to me is how Kody feels about Janelle now.  All through the years they appeared to have a good relationship.  They camped and enjoyed each other's company and it was alluded to that they had a good physical relationship.  Plus she didn't seem to put any pressure on him (worked for both of them).  And now he says he never loved her?  

[Roslyn]

8 hours ago, General Days said:

Kody's whole spiel about "It's your fault if I love you and it's your fault if I don't love you," is probably a very unprettified rewording of their sect's attitude towards women and marriage.

 

4 hours ago, JoannKBC said:

This was so weird to me. If this is his logic, would he also say that it's his fault if someone does or doesn't love him? I don't think so. He sure doesn't take any responsibility for the wives and children who don't love him anymore.

Kody gave away that all of his relationships are "business" transactions. If he doesn't feel love and respected then he gives no love or respect. He just has such a convoluted way to describe it, added with his overly dramatic "performance" for the cameras and he looks like a man spewing nonsense on the street corner.

[SemiCharmedLife]

11 hours ago, Marley GMA said:

You are exactly right  He just went about it horribly and has acted like the last 20 years never happened.  To speak about the mothers of his children the way he does, it is no wonder the kids are estranged.  And now Robin is stuck.  He has the love of his life, but does she have the love of her life......not too sure (if she sees what we are seeing, I doubt it). 

 

I just don't understand why Kody keeps using this argument about not loving his first three wives.  It is truly painful for them and their offspring.  Does he want Robyn to think that she is the only person he has loved to pump up her ego or ???  To say things like it was a mistake to get married also means that the children involved wouldn't have existed.  SMH

[Denize]

12 hours ago, AZChristian said:

It WOULD be a sight, but Kody would be all puffed up and love the fact that he was invited.  And he would blame the whole world for laughing at him - because it couldn't be HIS fault that his dancing makes him look like a doofus.  The world has no taste!!!!

I loved your reference to Dancing with the "Stars."  I haven't even known who half of them are.

Being the first one booted off Dancing with the "Stars" would be sweet karma. He thinks his bouncing up & down and hair-swinging circular gyrations are "dancing".

[LilyD]

After reading the comments on the 1st-2nd-3rd-4th wives club, here are some of my thoughts on Robyn, Christine and Janelle:

Robyn likes Kody, and likely even loves him a little. Definitely not as much as he loves her. Her marriage was mainly convenient if you ask me, for reasons mentioned before. However, she doesn't seem as happy as she was before. Whatever feelings she had, are disappearing fast! I believe little she says, but her losing respect for him? Absolutely!

Janelle and Kody had more of a friendship/sibling relationship per their own words. Just not the passionate head over heels type of love. Her choice for polygamy seems deliberate. More about the lifestyle than actual faith though so it seems. It would explain why she didn't know about a release. On a side note, she is probably too practical and down to earth to go through the trouble of getting a release, especially if she isn't into the faith anymore. 

Christine: I suspect she was naive enough to believe that Kody would grow to love her as much as the others. Her not asking for a release surprised me as the Allreds are quite important within the AUB. 

[Soapy Goddess]

9 hours ago, Granny58 said:

what's confusing to me is how Kody feels about Janelle now.  All through the years they appeared to have a good relationship.  They camped and enjoyed each other's company and it was alluded to that they had a good physical relationship.  Plus she didn't seem to put any pressure on him (worked for both of them).  And now he says he never loved her?  

I don't think either one of them ever loved each other. I believe Janelle was simply infatuated with the fact that she landed someone who she found attractive, practiced the same faith, and who also wanted a big family.

While Kody found a good friend in Janelle that he cared enough about...who was willing to share her finances, work to support the family, and of course, have as many kids as possible to grow his family.

[Yeah No]

On 10/21/2024 at 9:54 AM, islandgal140 said:

A woman has to make Kody love them. That is the most jacked up thing about love I think I have heard on a reality show. That man most definitely has some form of personality disorder. No doubt. 

Exactly and I think I know which one although I can't say it here. 😉

On 10/21/2024 at 1:49 PM, Denize said:

I know the title of this episode "He Delivered Me from All My Fears" is from the Bible, but why was it chosen for this episode? Kody just continues to increase everyone's fears and God hasn't delivered anyone from all their fears yet. Janelle and Meri seem happy, but they still have financial fears. Christine's rush to marry may not have a happy ending, just like her first rushed marriage.

I took it as referring to Christine and David's relationship as she was talking about how scary it was to move so fast.

On 10/21/2024 at 2:41 PM, Marley GMA said:

This is not the Kody I just rewatched for the first 10 seasons. He was actually likeable, engaging with the wives and kids. They seemed to have a good thing going, at least on TV.   I have no idea what the hell happened to him, but it is a 180.  He actually went nuts.  He is unrecognizable now.  Went off the deep end.

I always saw this Kody lurking inside of him. From day one I knew he was a misogynistic b-tard who was in this for himself and had zero idea what real love is. And I never liked him. All of that nicey stuff he put on was for the cameras. And as long as he could tell himself that he was the king of his own brood of women and children, all of whom served him and his big inflated ego, they were wonderful and he "loved" them. But as soon as their increasing dissatisfaction wrecked up his little egotistical, self-serving fantasy after he found Robyn he turned on all of them and then disavowed ever loving or caring for them. If they were willing to act like nothing was wrong he would never have disavowed ever loving them and we would never have seen the "true" Kody. He would still be putting on the act he put on for the first few seasons of the show.

On 10/21/2024 at 6:21 PM, Granny58 said:

Christine, I think, said something interesting last night.  She said if she had the love of her life (David) she wouldn't then want to go off and have to spend time with other people.  THAT, I believe, is what happened.  He finally met his true love and grew ever more resentful of having to be with people he didn't want to spend time with.  Then he has to spin up a story about it to justify it all to himself, and the viewers.  The lesson here is that you can't have polyamory if you have a real love in the mix. 

Exactly! The thing about this polygamy garbage is that it's not about soulmates and its probably even discourages soulmate relationships. None of these women could possibly have felt that he was their true soulmate either but their religion made them think marriage is not about that so they didn't even realize they were settling. Their faith makes them think it's all about family and child bearing and respecting each other but nowhere in there is finding a true love of your life. These women were each in their own kind of infatuation with him or "friends with benefits" relationship. They never had a true soulmate relationship with him any more than he did with them. Not defending Kody but all of them were duped by their stupid religion and this is the sad outcome of that.

[Yeah No]

Just some more thoughts:

Now that we're seeing more of Christine's evolution with David, I'm feeling less secure about their relationship. They did move a little fast for my liking. Christine strikes me as rebounding big time. I hope they work out but for now I'm a little less than confident. As time goes on I might feel differently.

About Gen X and Boomers - I'm a later Boomer myself and I don't find that much difference between us and older Gen X. David is definitely a late boomer but I think there is some overlap of early Gen X-ers and later Boomers. I just hate it when Gen X-ers try to distance themselves from Boomers. People tend to identify all Boomers with earlier Boomers and I've always felt that they were more different from later Boomers than later Boomers were from early Gen X. Just my personal peeve.

Also on a shallow note, note to David: Mitch Miller called and wants his beard back, lol.

David seems like a nice guy but his beard bugs me big time. My husband has a mustache/goatee combination but he keeps it trimmed very close to his face. David's is annoyingly long and I don't think it flatters him but it doesn't seem to bother Christine. She's more focused on his eyes. And of course, love is blind! 😍

 

[LilyD]

1 hour ago, Yeah No said:

I always saw this Kody lurking inside of him. From day one I knew he was a misogynistic b-tard who was in this for himself and had zero idea what real love is.

He seemed different in the first few seasons, but I agree with you: The Kody we see now, has always been lurking beneath the surface. It first showed his ugly head when Christine was giving birth. Saying goodbye to Robyn and nagging her OB about IVF for Meri seemed way more important than Christine giving birth to Truley...

[ginger90]

From the beginning, Kody reminded me of the employee who walks around with a clipboard accomplishing nothing.

[Denize]

4 hours ago, Yeah No said:

I always saw this Kody lurking inside of him. From day one I knew he was a misogynistic b-tard who was in this for himself and had zero idea what real love is. 

I thought the same. He always got over-excited when he told random strangers and shopkeepers that he had 3-4 wives and 16-18 kids and enjoyed their reactions to his apparent virility more than he enjoyed time with his wives and kids.

Edited October 23 by Denize

[BAForever]

Loving all the comments from old episodes- amazing how hindsight is 20/20, no doubt the signs were there. 

As the kids grew and started to make their own decisions, he lost power. As his wives left him, he lost more. Kody thrives on being the center of attention (see the pond dive, the sprint around the LV cuddle-de-sac, the announcing that he has 3 wives and lots of children.) The people he has power over now are SADKRAB, and I think Day'un has moved on.

He's a king of no kingdom now, and it's karma.

[AZChristian]

2 minutes ago, BAForever said:

He's a king of no kingdom now . . . .

I think of him as an alien without a planet.

[Yeah No]

3 hours ago, LilyD said:

He seemed different in the first few seasons, but I agree with you: The Kody we see now, has always been lurking beneath the surface. It first showed his ugly head when Christine was giving birth. Saying goodbye to Robyn and nagging her OB about IVF for Meri seemed way more important than Christine giving birth to Truley...

For me it came down to the mere fact of him being a polygamist. I feel that no matter how they spin it, it's inherently sexist and the women most often come out on the losing end of their relationship with the husband. In the beginning Kody made it sound like he was the most liberated guy, but I knew that was BS. A liberated guy (or any guy that really cared about women's feelings) would never think he could do right by 4 wives nor would he subject them to that kind of deprivation and jealousy! And I knew the women would only feel jealousy if he didn't bend over backwards to prevent it, which was more than obvious to me from day one that he wasn't. And then the way Christine acted when Robyn came into the fold told the whole tale for me. That he would just expect her or any of them to shut up and accept that like it was their problem was completely heinous in my view.

I also feel that polygamy attracts sexist men like Kody which only makes it worse. His self-serving attitude is no great shock or surprise to me, I've seen it under the surface all along. He was only half good to his wives under the BEST of circumstances but as soon as they didn't serve his purposes anymore and started to complain about it, he pulled back even more. The problems were there in their relationships with him from day one and all the smoke and mirrors didn't fool me. Then as we heard more about the history pre-show it became even more obvious to me.

Unfortunately there is no such thing as a "benevolent dictator".

[laurakaye]

19 hours ago, JoannKBC said:

This was so weird to me. If this is his logic, would he also say that it's his fault if someone does or doesn't love him? I don't think so. He sure doesn't take any responsibility for the wives and children who don't love him anymore.

Let's see....if Kody loves you, it's your fault for being so wonderfully demure.  It helps if you come to him with your cap in hand, and also if you used to be a Diesel jeans model.  If he doesn't love you, it's your fault because it's on you for entering into this relationship, knowing what you were getting into - there's only one Kody, right?  What is he supposed to do?  Share his time equally?  As if.  If you love him but he doesn't love you back...your fault for being a whiny, needy shrew.  If he loves you but you don't love him back, he never loved you in the first place and you tricked him, connived him, and he could never do anything right by you - also, you didn't like spearmint gum.  If you have any questions about this, please see Robyn Brown.

 

16 hours ago, precious pupp said:

At least before Sol and Ari, who "couldn't go more than 2 days" without seeing their dad.

Or what?  That's what I always wondered.  What happened if it was more than those magical 2 days?  Would Sol and Ari run around the house screaming all night long?  Hide under the couch and refuse to come out?  Take a sledgehammer to the Precious Moments figurines?  That's total crap.  It was ROBYN who couldn't handle Kody being away because she'd have to parent her children solo and she didn't want to.  There are a hundred ways to distract your kids if they really are missing a parent, but that was always going to be too much work for poor Robyn.  She made those kids dependent on Kody all by herself so she had an excuse to keep him at her house, period.  And the other 13 kids paid the price.

[Granny58]

7 hours ago, Yeah No said:

I always saw this Kody lurking inside of him. From day one I knew he was a misogynistic b-tard who was in this for himself and had zero idea what real love is. And I never liked him. All of that nicey stuff he put on was for the cameras. And as long as he could tell himself that he was the king of his own brood of women and children, all of whom served him and his big inflated ego, they were wonderful and he "loved" them. But as soon as their increasing dissatisfaction wrecked up his little egotistical, self-serving fantasy after he found Robyn he turned on all of them and then disavowed ever loving or caring for them. If they were willing to act like nothing was wrong he would never have disavowed ever loving them and we would never have seen the "true" Kody. He would still be putting on the act he put on for the first few seasons of the show.

1000 percent agree.

7 hours ago, Yeah No said:

About Gen X and Boomers - I'm a later Boomer myself and I don't find that much difference between us and older Gen X. David is definitely a late boomer but I think there is some overlap of early Gen X-ers and later Boomers. I just hate it when Gen X-ers try to distance themselves from Boomers. People tend to identify all Boomers with earlier Boomers and I've always felt that they were more different from later Boomers than later Boomers were from early Gen X. Just my personal peeve.

Yeppers.  I'm mid-to-late boomer and hubby is a Gen X and he's an old fart while I'm not.  LOL.  Not true, I'm kinda an old fart but we're equally yoked.  

[Granny58]

7 hours ago, Yeah No said:

David seems like a nice guy but his beard bugs me big time.

Oh yeah, agree with this too.  It's too long for his head.  

[smarty]

51 minutes ago, Granny58 said:

1000 percent agree.

Yeppers.  I'm mid-to-late boomer and hubby is a Gen X and he's an old fart while I'm not.  LOL.  Not true, I'm kinda an old fart but we're equally yoked.  

The Boomer generation technically goes until 1964, but those born 1960-1964 probably have more in common with Gen X than the early Boomers (1946 - 1960).

[RoxiP]

Well I just found out I'm a Boomer apparently (1958) but not sure I have more in common with people who are 12 years older than me.

[AZChristian]

14 minutes ago, RoxiP said:

Well I just found out I'm a Boomer apparently (1958) but not sure I have more in common with people who are 12 years older than me.

That would be me.  :-)

[General Days]

19 hours ago, Granny58 said:

what's confusing to me is how Kody feels about Janelle now.  All through the years they appeared to have a good relationship.  They camped and enjoyed each other's company and it was alluded to that they had a good physical relationship.  Plus she didn't seem to put any pressure on him (worked for both of them).  And now he says he never loved her?  

 

And remember last season at Salsa Brava? I think it was Janelle and Kody's first meetup since their big Christmas fight. He said they'd had a "renaissance" in Vegas and that he had been "sprouting poetry" (I hope he meant spouting).

I this Kody's personality is ordered such that he isn't really capable of loving anyone with much depth. I think it's all about how they make him feel. He seems to have difficulty understanding that other people have needs and feelings, too. And like @Roslyn said a bit back, he's very transactional.

 

10 hours ago, LilyD said:

Janelle and Kody had more of a friendship/sibling relationship per their own words. Just not the passionate head over heels type of love. Her choice for polygamy seems deliberate. More about the lifestyle than actual faith though so it seems. It would explain why she didn't know about a release. On a side note, she is probably too practical and down to earth to go through the trouble of getting a release, especially if she isn't into the faith anymore.

 

Janelle knows/knew that releases exist. She's mentioned them in prior seasons. I think she's not great at talking about it, because it makes her uncomfortable.

I think Janelle's issue with trying for a release has some layers to it. I think she mostly thinks she doesn't have real grounds, though.

Meri had grounds. Kody shut Meri off sexually, some years before the catfish. Kody hasn't stayed in Meri's house since she kicked him out during the catfish. Kody lured Meri to move from Vegas to Flagstaff by saying it would be a whole new start for them, and then refused to work on their marriage. Meri did wrong too (the emotional affair), but she really was abandoned and then she got Kody to admit that he didn't want to be married to her on camera. The AUB would have been hard-put to deny her.

Janelle, on the other hand, chose her adult children (and dogs) over her husband. Now hey, good for Janelle, but in a patriarchal religion like this one, that's never going to be seen as Kody's failing. It will be seen as Janelle's.

If Janelle had done what Kody wanted her to do — namely, kick out Garrison and Gabriel, Kody would have resumed rotating between Robyn and Janelle.

I also think though, Janelle isn't really sure she wants it to be over. She also probably doesn't want to trigger (sorry for using his overused word there) Kody by saying he abandoned her. 

 

9 hours ago, Yeah No said:

About Gen X and Boomers - I'm a later Boomer myself and I don't find that much difference between us and older Gen X. David is definitely a late boomer but I think there is some overlap of early Gen X-ers and later Boomers. I just hate it when Gen X-ers try to distance themselves from Boomers. People tend to identify all Boomers with earlier Boomers and I've always felt that they were more different from later Boomers than later Boomers were from early Gen X. Just my personal peeve.

 

As a Gen Xer who was born in '67, I agree.

I see latter day Boomers as more like Gen X, than either older Boomers or much younger Gen Xers. My husband is a Boomer, but we're only a few years apart. We have much more in common with each other, than he would with someone born in the second half of the 1940s or the early 1950s, or than I would with someone born in the second half of the 1970s to 1980 (or wherever they're cutting off Gen X this week -- it seems to vary). 

We grew up with the same music, TV show, movies, clothes, and were in school for most of the same years. The generation stuff gets over-played.

 

45 minutes ago, RoxiP said:

Well I just found out I'm a Boomer apparently (1958) but not sure I have more in common with people who are 12 years older than me.

 

30 minutes ago, AZChristian said:

That would be me.  :-)

 

Okay, you two. I must confess that kind of made me giggle. Boomers just refers to the post-World War II baby boom. And it's generally considered to be from 1946 to 1964.

There's a sub-category of Boomers called "Generation Jones" — and you younger Boomers fall within that. 

Edited October 23 by General Days

[RoxiP]

1 hour ago, General Days said:

As a Gen Xer who was born in '67, I agree.

I see latter day Boomers as more like Gen X, than either older Boomers or much younger Gen Xers. My husband is a Boomer, but we're only a few years apart. We have much more in common with each other, than he would with someone born in the second half of the 1940s or the early 1950s, or than I would with someone born in the second half of the 1970s to 1980 (or wherever they're cutting off Gen X this week -- it seems to vary). 

We grew up with the same music, TV show, movies, clothes, and were in school for most of the same years. The generation stuff gets over-played.

 

 

 

Okay, you two. I must confess that kind of made me giggle. Boomers just refers to the post-World War II baby boom. And it's generally considered to be from 1946 to 1964.

There's a sub-category of Boomers called "Generation Jones" — and you younger Boomers fall within that. 

Honestly I kind of hate being put in a box - I pretty much get along with anybody until they are terminally stupid.  Anybody else have trouble seeing yourself as your biological age because in your brain you just aren't feeling it?

[Teri313]

Oh my God, Kody is really freaking me out. Why is he going after Meri so hard? She's been the easiest and most accommodating ignored wife of all of them, but he's acting like freaking Satan the way he's talking about her and picking this fight with her. He's got some crazy story in his head that has zero connection to reality. Is he having a mental breakdown right in front of us? I think Robyn's schtick is 98% acting, but Kody really seems like he has spiraled into a psychotic break.

[precious pupp]

9 hours ago, laurakaye said:

Let's see....if Kody loves you, it's your fault for being so wonderfully demure.  It helps if you come to him with your cap in hand, and also if you used to be a Diesel jeans model.  If he doesn't love you, it's your fault because it's on you for entering into this relationship, knowing what you were getting into - there's only one Kody, right?  What is he supposed to do?  Share his time equally?  As if.  If you love him but he doesn't love you back...your fault for being a whiny, needy shrew.  If he loves you but you don't love him back, he never loved you in the first place and you tricked him, connived him, and he could never do anything right by you - also, you didn't like spearmint gum.  If you have any questions about this, please see Robyn Brown.

 

Or what?  That's what I always wondered.  What happened if it was more than those magical 2 days?  Would Sol and Ari run around the house screaming all night long?  Hide under the couch and refuse to come out?  Take a sledgehammer to the Precious Moments figurines?  That's total crap.  It was ROBYN who couldn't handle Kody being away because she'd have to parent her children solo and she didn't want to.  There are a hundred ways to distract your kids if they really are missing a parent, but that was always going to be too much work for poor Robyn.  She made those kids dependent on Kody all by herself so she had an excuse to keep him at her house, period.  And the other 13 kids paid the price.

1,000%!  Robyn and her constant victim neediness schtick completely engulfed Kody.  We are not fooled in the least!

[jschoolgirl]

15 hours ago, Yeah No said:

About Gen X and Boomers - I'm a later Boomer myself and I don't find that much difference between us and older Gen X. David is definitely a late boomer but I think there is some overlap of early Gen X-ers and later Boomers. I just hate it when Gen X-ers try to distance themselves from Boomers. People tend to identify all Boomers with earlier Boomers and I've always felt that they were more different from later Boomers than later Boomers were from early Gen X. Just my personal peeve.

Google “Generation Jones.”

[SemiCharmedLife]

7 hours ago, RoxiP said:

Honestly I kind of hate being put in a box - I pretty much get along with anybody until they are terminally stupid.  Anybody else have trouble seeing yourself as your biological age because in your brain you just aren't feeling it?

I usually ignore all the nasty comments about Boomers- it's a stereotype and just like other stereotypes, we don't all fit into the "box."  But, hearing Christine (who I've always liked, BTW) be disgusted that her new boyfriend might be a Boomer really made me mad.  It seemed so superior and to me that is laughable.  I've had a much cooler life experience and made more of an impact on this world (children notwithstanding) than she could imagine.  When did age-shaming become popular ... and why????