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S02.E03: 1893

formerlyfreedom

By formerlyfreedom
in Loki

formerlyfreedom
Message added by formerlyfreedom,

Posts in this topic should be about the episode. If your post is not primarily about the episode, please rethink where to post it; the topic Marvel Movies and Comics: Loki+ is a good spot. Posts that are primarily or only about the Marvel movies (or that quote such posts) will be removed without notice, and warnings may be issued. Thank you.

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MsNewsradio

MsNewsradio

Too much Timely, not enough Loki/Mobius. I was not a fan of the affectations that Majors went with this episode - not sure if that was his choice or not, but it was grating and a very in your face choice for “I’m not the same guy as He Who Remains, clearly!!”
 

And good lord, Sylvie and Renslayer keep making stupid decisions. 
 

No way would I still be going “my mission is from He Who Remains” when Miss Minutes is clearly off the rails and had him DROP YOU OFF A BOAT. Renslayer has a blind spot the size of a Buick.

 

And Sylvie dropping her at the End of Time…why?? Forgetting Miss Minutes for a moment (since hey, every other character seemed to in the final confrontation of the episode), I would never drop her there in case He Who Remains had anything in that place that could possibly aid her or help her return to the TVA. Strip her down, make sure she has no way to travel through time, and dump her in a random part of the timeline to live out her life. 

  • Like 12
  • Applause 1
phalange

phalange

Love the theme being redone to sound like old-timey carnival music.

The 1893 World's Fair is a perfect setting for all of this to go down given everything else that went on. Loki's reaction to the statues was great. "Thor's not that tall." And lol at Mobius being called Loki's butler.

Considering that HWR said he came from the 32nd(?) century, I hadn't really considered that variants could be born so many centuries earlier, but I guess if they fulfill similar roles on the timeline that's all that matters.

Uh, Miss Minutes has a real creepy, stalker vibe going on. 

Sylvie hearing Victor say "I can make my own choices" is ultimately what got her to reconsider killing him. She always wanted to be free to live her own life and make her own choices despite being a variant and realized in killing him, she'd be taking that chance away from someone else.

Curious what secret Miss Minutes is going to tell Ravonna. Maybe just that Ravonna is a variant who was also taken from the timeline? I don't think Ravonna knows that does she? 

  • Like 9
thuganomics85

thuganomics85

It's probably a safe bet that when he first started his career, Owen Wilson probably never would have predicted he would be saying something like "How do we find a cartoon clock that doesn't want to be found?" in a future project.  Ah, Marvel!

So, we get our first sighting of a "He Who Remains" variant.  He is Timey, a swindler in Chicago in the 1890s, who isn't without talent (that refrigerator chair would be totally amazing), but is basically about getting a quick buck and screwing investors over.  And he ends up being front and center, as not only are Loki and Mobius trying to get him to save the TVA, and not only is a returning Renslayer wanting him for her own purposes, but Sylvie finds out about him and wants him dead.  Oh, and Miss Minutes wants him on a physical level.  Not quite as weird as having the hots for a variant of yourself, but credit for trying, show! 

This also leads to getting our first glimpse of Jonathan Majors post arrest/controversy and getting to play the "can one separate the art from the artist?" game (and now I've been hearing Tara Strong; the voice of Miss Minutes; has also been in hot water lately for some stuff she said.  Disney and Kevin Feige are no doubt email blasting everyone else to just please not say anything about anything!)  Kind of ironic that despite the issues and hate Quantumania got, that one probably had his best performance so far.  I get what they were trying to go for with his stuttering and meekness, but I felt like he overplayed it here.  Just didn't vibe with everyone else's performances. 

Really could have watch more of just Loki and Mobius at the fair, and bonding over crackerjacks and complaining about the accuracy of Norse mythology exhibits.  Really hope we see the MCU's version of Balder at some point, since Loki seemed just a little miffed over him getting a statue.

OB didn't have much to do this time, but hopefully that was just an one off.

Sylvie restrains herself for once, but you just known sparing Renslayer will be the time it all blows up in their faces.  Especially since it will involve some kind of secret that Miss Minutes has in her pocket.  She really might be the most dangerous character here.

  • Like 8
tkc

tkc

(edited)

Wow! Apparently Miss Minutes is descended from Bing:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2023/02/16/microsoft-bing-chatbot-professes-love-journalist-dreams-stealing/

“An artificial intelligence chatbot designed by Microsoft has encouraged a user to end his marriage, claimed to have spied on its creators and described dark fantasies of stealing nuclear codes amid fears that it is becoming unhinged.”

Edited by tkc
  • Like 2
Athena

Athena

Since I am watching this show live and not a binge, I am really hoping things pick up because this ep and the last one were weak. I think there is a lot weak character writing. I continue to not care about Sylvie.

I have liked Gugu Mbatha-Raw since her film Belle and she can be stunning in the right costume. Renslayer is not believable because why is she doing this? For power? I guess. Miss Minutes is a crazy AI clock so that's fine to have her as a literal caricature.

The stuttering was over the top and annoying. Don't think Majors is a good actor. Don't care about He Who Remains as a villain.

Mobius and Loki continue to be a highlight but Loki spent too much time with Sylvie again.

  • Like 5
Enigma X

Enigma X

(edited)
1 hour ago, Athena said:

Mobius and Loki continue to be a highlight but Loki spent too much time with Sylvie again.

Yeah, Mobius and Loki are what I am here for. 

Majors was never a draw for me, and I get that Kang may have been this powerful in the comics, but I already have an issue when a protagonist has too much power. In the X-Men franchise, this is why I hate Apocalypse. 

Also, all other variants whether they look alike or are a different gender or species make sense but Sylvie. I guess she has never come off as a "Loki" to me other than being told she is.  The actress is fine enough but the character and what she is supposed to be are weak to me.

I like B-15, Renslayer (though her motivation is off), O.B., Casey, and X-5. I even like Miss Minutes, but she was pushing it in this episode.

I mean, I am still entertained, but not like in season one.

Edited by Enigma X
  • Like 7
tennisgurl

tennisgurl

The Chicago Worlds Fair is one of my favorite historical events so I had a ton of fun with this one. I did hope that this episode would involve Loki and Mobius fighting HH Holmes but I appreciated the shout out and I liked the period details like seeing several of the cultural booths and and old timie soundtrack. This felt like a bit of a diversion from the main plot, but it was at least a pretty fun diversion. 

As usual, the Loki and Mobius buddy cop show was the episodes highlight, Mobius having a great time just exploring the fair and Loki's offense at seeing the Norse mythology exhibit was hilarious, he was just so affronted at seeing Balder with a statue instead of him. Are we going to meet him at some point? Was he on vacation while the rest of the pantheon were dealing with Hela and Ragnorok? 

I like Sylvie for the most part, I get her purpose as a main character, and feel bad for her, but I always feel more checked out when she's the focus instead of Loki. I prefer when the show is about Loki, the guy who's name is on the credits, when they explore the mythology surrounding the TVA and time travel, and the rest of the supporting cast. I know that she's also a Loki variant, but she's definitely the Loki that feels the least like Loki, and not even because she's the only female Loki we've met. At least it seems like Loki has gotten through to her for now. 

You really have to ask Ravonna "to what end?" at this point. She knows that everything she's been told is a lie, that she's a variant herself, that the Kang she followed is dead, I think she's dealing with a sort of sunk cost fallacy mixed with pure denial. She just cant accept that everything she's done has been bullshit and that Kang has been manipulating her so she's doubling down on Kang and her mission, but in a different way than the faction that was obsessively pruning timelines. She can tell herself that she's working to still protect the timeline, but it seems like she's running on desperation more than anything. 

I guess Miss Minutes being hot for Kang is only slightly weirder than Loki falling in love with an alternate gender swapped version of herself. Oh yeah, that is super weird, nothing like finding out that the super AI is also a stalker obsessed with our main bad guy. 

Jonathan Major I think really overdid it with awkward snake oil salesman Victor Timely, but I liked the references to the comics and his original backstory. 

  • Like 8
Spartan Girl

Spartan Girl

(edited)
8 hours ago, Brn2bwild said:

I haven't been crazy about any of Jonathan Majors's performances.  He always comes across as equal parts hammy and creepy.  If he isn't replaced due to real life issues, I don't know that he has the charisma to draw people to watch him as Kang.

Seriously. Maybe I’m biased thanks to knowing he’s a POS in real life, but I simply do not give a crap about Kang or any of his variants. Miss Minutes is a much more engaging villain. Which brings me to the moral of this episode: never trust AI.

I am curious about the secret Miss Minutes is about to spill to Ravonna that’s going to piss her off. I mean, she already knows she’s a variant, right?

The Chicago World’s Fair was amazing to watch. As usual, Loki and Mobius are the best parts of the show. Especially loved Loki complaining that Cracker Jack “tastes like ash” and his disgust with Asgard carvings: “Thor’s not that tall.” At this point, we HAVE to get some kind of temporary reunion with Thor by the end of this show!

Edited by Spartan Girl
  • Like 11
festivus

festivus

What the hell was that with the Kang variant? Jonathan Majors acting choices are just weird. Still I hated it just slightly less than He Who Remains. I hope Renslayer is a variant, then she can take over.

Loki and Mobius looked so fly in their 1890s garb. We really should have gotten to see them ride the bike. When that dude knocked Loki's hat off I was like no! Go back and get it. 

What the ever lovin' fuck is up with Sylvie's hair? So, so, bad. I would love less of her and Majors, more OB and B-15.

  • Like 7
KerleyQ

KerleyQ

In an earlier episode, when Loki heard that recording of Renslayer and HWR, it kind of sounded to me like they were romantically involved. So I'm wondering if the secret Miss MInutes is going to tell her is that they were but then, at some point, Renslayer's memory got wiped, and he was done with her. I could see Renslayer having a previous romantic history with HWR being the reason that Miss Minutes was so quick on the draw to separate her and Victor as soon as she saw them getting cozy. Maybe she was the one who wiped Renslayer's memory, not HWR, because the two of them being involved puts a crimp in her plans.

On 10/20/2023 at 12:35 AM, Nacos for Rufus said:

I think we were supposed to be worried about Victor, but my eye was on Ms. Minutes. Petty, jealous, stalker-y, and then pulling the I-know-something-you-don’t know thing at the end? Yowza. I wonder if Victor put some of himself in there like Voldemort or something.

At this point, I'm honestly wondering if he really created her, or if she kind of created him, so to speak. I think she's the real "big bad" when it comes to the TVA. I'm sure that his variants being largely evil is true, and he was helping keep them at bay, but I also think that it's possible that he was working for her at the TVA, because she needed a figurehead. I still haven't fully worked through my theory of how she came to exist, but I think she did exist somehow before HWR became a part of the TVA. 

I'm also working on a theory that the TVA workers actually aren't variants, in the sense that they weren't timeline hopping and got picked up and turned into workers. I think that Miss Minutes has just been identifying people who have certain skills or fit certain needs, and having them brought in and their memories wiped. Or maybe its a mixed bag of some variants and some people who were just plucked out of their lives. I feel like we're going to find out that Mobius was not a variant. 

5 minutes ago, festivus said:

What the ever lovin' fuck is up with Sylvie's hair? So, so, bad

Since she's been living in Oklahoma in the early 80's, I've been assuming she got that mullet-like atrocity to fit in. 

  • Like 4
magdalene

magdalene

On 10/20/2023 at 3:12 PM, Spartan Girl said:

Seriously. Maybe I’m biased thanks to knowing he’s a POS in real life, but I simply do not give a crap about Kang or any of his variants. Miss Minutes is a much more engaging villain. Which brings me to the moral of this episode: never trust AI.

I don't know him and have no idea which way his trial is going to go but I am very familiar with the type of theater actor he is - he is only interested in show-boating and himself, never mind the other actors and his scene partners. I am sure we are supposed to find him charismatic, I am finding him tiresome. Miss Minutes is much more interesting and scary to me.

  • Like 5
arc

arc

Did Majors just decide that Timely should have a stutter in addition to being a before-his-time genius AND a con man? Or did the director keep telling him to do more acting? Every acting choice he made this episode felt showy and unnecessary, which I never felt watching him before. (though except for Ant-Man 3, I hadn't known about the abuse allegations with anything else I watched him in, and it certainly colors how I watch him now.) Anyways, he has always been an actor who makes a lot of big choices, but this was the first time where I felt like I could see him acting. Tremendously distracting.

Every bit of this episode felt like it was spinning its wheels, even if Loki and Mobius went a little meta by lampshading it. The multiple stand-offs with Sylvie had a lot of shouting and it never made sense to me why she wouldn't believe that the TVA was crucial to keeping the multiverse alive, esp since she did at the end and it wasn't because anyone finally gave her a more convincing argument either.

And the 1893 sets were good but somehow like 5% below great. I feel like the similar era "Warrior" show did it better, though to be fair their entire thing is set in the 1870s, while "Loki" time travels all over.

I wonder if original formula He Who Remains was self-built or if he was also kick-started by a TVA manual from OB. So is Ravonna's big secret that she's a HWR variant too? Or is OB the real power behind the TVA? "He Who Remains" is a good name for someone who set up his throne at the "end of time", but Ouroboros is a good name for someone who's always been there, a truly self-created man.

  • Useful 2
arc

arc

Also, and this carries over from the last episode, I just can’t buy any kind of ticking bomb deadline for a crisis at the TVA. It sits outside of normal time, right? It shouldn’t matter how long Loki and Mobius stay in 1893 or any other point in normal time. The rules aren’t very clear about this and the way they can talk to B-15 does seem to imply that there is a 1:1 correspondence of time spent in the field to time passing in the TVA, but that makes very little sense.

Honestly I’d be fine with the show being vague about the rules if they didn’t try to impose imminent doom in two places that don’t share the same time. At least back in the first episode the deadline for saving Loki from time slipping occurred entirely within the TVA.

  • Like 1
Silver-hyren

Silver-hyren

Halfway through this episode I found myself wondering if this show was about Loki, the god of mischief or Kang, the over actor.  Kudos to Majors for committing to his choices for Timely the whole way through but we spent so much time on him that Loki - the title character - came across as an afterthought.    

Tom Hiddleston is acting his heart out with with the little they give him to do and is a bright spot in this series (well, him and OB) but as for everything else, I simply Do. Not. Care.  And if you can't get people invested in the characters or story, that's a problem.   

formerlyfreedom
Message added by formerlyfreedom,

Posts in this topic should be about the episode. If your post is not primarily about the episode, please rethink where to post it; the topic Marvel Movies and Comics: Loki+ is a good spot. Posts that are primarily or only about the Marvel movies (or that quote such posts) will be removed without notice, and warnings may be issued. Thank you.

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