S19.E19: Wedding Bell Blues; S19.E20: Happily Ever After?

[Bort]

Quote

Simone’s wedding day arrives as Jo and Link’s relationship hits a major turning point.

Quote

The attending surgeons fly to Boston, forcing a reunion between Nick and Meredith. Bailey gets a big surprise.

Airdate: May 18, 2023

[KaveDweller]

Don't hospitals have covering doctors or something for when half the staff flies across the country and another one passes out? Someone should have answered that page at the end. Jo and Linc will probably feel guilty if someone dies because they were finally making out instead of paying attention to their patient.

I guess Bailey winning the award was nice even though it is shady to give it to someone who wasn't even nominated.

Amelia really makes things all about her doesn't she? Meredith thinks she has a breakthrough in Alzheimer's, and she just wines about how it will destroy Derek's legacy?

[choclatechip45]

I'm happy Bailey won the award. I thought this finale was to calm until the last 30 minutes.

I doubt Teddy is dead. Adams and Simone are probably screwed until everyone forgets what they did. Link and Jo will feel guilty. 

I don't really want to see Richard relapsing again.

[KaveDweller]

14 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

Adams and Simone are probably screwed until everyone forgets what they did. Link and Jo will feel guilty. 

Schmidt killed a guy because he didn't call for help when operating alone, and Richard ended up begging him to come back.

Adams and Simone will be fine. 

[cam3150]

I liked the finale and I have really grown to like this group of interns. 

I’ve thought all along that Simone & Lucas had good chemistry together so I was happy that she didn’t marry Trey and explored her feelings for Lucas. We’ll see what happens with them.
 

I will say that I don’t think the writers have done a great job of giving these new characters depth through most of this season. It’s like they realized it at the end so the last few episodes have been better in that regard. 
 

The whole plane scene, turbulence and all, was entertaining. 
 

I was so happy for Miranda!!

Everyone looked beautiful in their gowns. I especially loved Maggie’s. 

I’m happy to see Mer & Nick work it out (though she owed him a much better apology than that) but I hope Nick stays in Seattle. I really enjoy his character on this show

Richard! Don’t you dare!!!

I’m over Amelia and her whole attitude about everything this season  Derek would be right by Meredith’s side if he believed she was right in her research  

Hopefully Linc & Jo can finally be happy

I’m so glad Jules’ roommate & favorite person lived. I don’t feel so great about Sam. 

I am in no way worried that Altman won’t make it but I guess we’ll have to wonder until at least early 2024 with the strike. 

Edited May 19, 2023 by cam3150

[txhorns79]

32 minutes ago, cam3150 said:

 

The whole plane scene, turbulence and all, was entertaining. 

It was odd that Bailey didn't mention the obvious reason why her character might be deeply uncomfortable with taking a private plane, i.e. the plane crash that killed Lexi and Mark, left Arizona seriously injured and caused Christina, Meredith and Derek to be trapped in the wilderness for days.

I can't even with this show retroactively justifying Blue's gross breach of ethics.  You don't get to override a patient's DNR/DNI because you've decided you know better than the patient as to what they would want.  That's the kind of stunt that gets an intern fired and can cause a doctor to lose their license. 

I liked Bailey getting the award, but I'm pretty sure they could have just given her a special award without pulling the kind of stunt they did where someone who isn't even nominated wins an award meant for surgical innovation. 

1 hour ago, choclatechip45 said:

Link and Jo will feel guilty. 

It was odd that neither was paged about their patient crashing.     

Finally, I'm just not invested in Sloane or Adams.  I have no idea why these two would be so deeply in love, much less that Sloane would leave her boyfriend for Lucas at the altar, other than general proximity.

[dancingdreamer]

I think  it was obvious,  that Simone was never going to go through  with the wedding, she has much better  chemistry  with Lucas.

I wonder  if Teddy didn't  have a toothache,  it was something  else, and that's why she collapsed.

I was so happy  for Miranda, I've always  loved her character. 

Please don't let Richard  take a drink.

Poor Sam, he was a good looking  guy, with such charm.

Meredith  and Nick make a good couple, I'm glad they worked it  out. I don't  feel that way about Maggie.

[jcbrown]

I assume that Teddy was having a heart attack and this was to emphasize that jaw pain is a potential symptom, especially for women.  The scenes with Meredith, particularly those in her lab, just annoyed me. Her dress was tragically bad. The worst part, for me, is I had two parents IRL who died of Alzheimer’s so it is not playacting for me to have someone pretend to have a breakthrough and make it all about her career. I found the writing of those scenes infuriating. And if the whole reason she showed up in the finale was to take away a character who is one of the best recent adds to the show? Take a ton of seats, Meredith, we no longer require your input.

[funnygirl]

Boring. 

Meredith was acting a little manic. 

Happy for Bailey. 

Teddy will be fine, multiple media outlets released articles yesterday afternoon that Kim Raver and other actors renewed contracts for season 20. The show has gotten lazy with the cliffhangers and suspense. 

[MarylandGirl]

As soon as Teddy mentioned the toothache in the beginning, I figured it would turn out to be more serious. I wonder if maybe it's a tooth infection and she became septic? Or could be a heart attack, as @jcbrown mentioned. I doubt she's dead. Though maybe she will be impaired in some way, at least temporarily, if it were a stroke or heart attack?

I did find this to be a really good episode, with lots going on. Don't care about Linc and Jo--feels like too little, too late. And didn't she tell him before that she had feelings for him, or maybe even that she loved him? When he just wanted to be casual?

I really thought when they first showed Meredith that she was starting her decline with having Alzheimer's. So glad it wasn't that. It sucks that someone having a new opinion on a condition risks losing their funding. And I agree with @cam3150 that Derek would be supporting Meredith if she had a potential breakthrough, even if it conflicted with his research.

I wasn't worried about the plane crashing, because they've already done that (then again, ER with the helicopter...). And @txhorns79, yes, I thought Bailey should have said the previous plane crash was why she didn't want to fly on a small plane!

I really don't care what happens to Sam. And I think Simone and Lucas did the right thing in operating. They tried to contact people. I doubt they'll be fired for it.

And shouldn't they have been awarding Addison instead of or along with Bailey? I really was expecting them to announce her name.

[DEL901]

So, 

Linc and Jo had time for their romantic kiss in the rain, but not respond to an emergency.  I know it wasn’t their prime area, but with the place so short staffed….and why wasn’t Owen carrying his pager?

I always liked Amelia, but this has finally done it for me.  And of course hot guy was just a plot device to hurt Nick.  Guess he will move after all.  Winston had better come to his senses and stay as head of cardiac surgery  

And the Catherine Fox awards are now officially a joke.  Who will care, or even attend if nominated, if she can arbitrarily give it to anyone.   Since it is supposed to be for surgical innovation or some such, couldn’t she have just created a special one-off for Bailey and Addison?

[Madding crowd]

They already did an interrupted wedding with Jackson and April. It was the right thing to not get married but a little tacky to leave a guy at the altar and immediately have sex with someone else. 
Can’t stand Jules and her ranting and yelling at Kwan was over the top. Really don’t like any of these entitled interns. And no way would someone be given a secret last minute award , especially in front of a bunch of rich donors who may not agree with the politics of what Bailey is doing.

I don’t like Teddy but assume she will be fine unlike bone break guy who has to die so Jo and Linc can kiss in the rain.

 

 

[statsgirl]

This was Grey's distilled, all the glorification of the Cool Kids and the immaturity of people in their forties and older.

I thought when they were talking about the award going to someone who wasn't nominated, it was going to go to Addison who had to leave her son and husband and is driving around the country risking her life providing health care to women who couldn't get it otherwise. I should have known that it would go to one of the show's pets, in this case Bailey.

The awards on GA remind me of rich people's fundraisers -- they talk a lot about providing for those in need but they're really for the in-kids to have a party and make themselves feel good.

9 hours ago, jcbrown said:

The scenes with Meredith, particularly those in her lab, just annoyed me. Her dress was tragically bad. The worst part, for me, is I had two parents IRL who died of Alzheimer’s so it is not playacting for me to have someone pretend to have a breakthrough and make it all about her career. I found the writing of those scenes infuriating. And if the whole reason she showed up in the finale was to take away a character who is one of the best recent adds to the show? Take a ton of seats, Meredith, we no longer require your input.

I didn't miss Meredith The Sun at all. While I have become inured to Meredith (and Bailey, Maggie etc.) making brilliant discoveries out of nowhere, the show portrayed Alzheimer's research and research funding in an overly simplistic way for the drahmah. To put out the idea that The Sun is now going to find the cure for Alzheimer's now is unfair to people who had dealing with it in their own lives and praying for a cure for themselves or their loved ones.

If Meredith didn't want to answer Nick right away when he told her that he loved her and used her children as an excuse, what about all the months since then?

My heart sank at the end when Nick and Meredith kissed. She doesn't deserve him. Nick is one of the increasingly few characters on the show that I like and to lose him to the black hole that is Meredith adoration is a real loss to the show.

I liked Linc in the relationship with Amelia because he was an adult there. Sunny, looking on the positive, but an adult. With Jo he was a kid with a grumpy face. I'm glad that the willy they/won't they is finally over but this is a couple that I'm fast-forwarding now.

Speaking of ... Winston: "Do you stand by what you said?"  Amelia: "I stand by my apology."  Winston (louder): Do you stand by what you said?"  Amelia: "I stand by my apology.I shouldn't have said what I did.:  Winston (almost shouting): Do you stand by what you said?"  Amelia: I stand by some of what I said, that I think you're partly to blame for Maggie leaving."   Winston, if you don't want the truth, stop asking for it.  And don't ask Nick to switch places because Amelia sat down beside you. Act like an adult. By the way, you did a few good operations with your wife but you're not "one of the best cardio-thoracic surgeons in the country."  Ugh. I wish that it had been Winston who stayed and Nick who got to go back to Seattle.

Amelia was also the only one who actually read Meredith's notes and missed the ceremony in order to do it.

Good point @jcbrown about Teddy probably having a heart attack. I will give the show this, they are good at the PSAs.

Nice to see Juliet Mills, I liked her character's story.

Nice to see Sam Page too, So sorry you had to be sacrificed to the LInc/Jo tween romance.

The interns:

If I were Simone, I would have been feeling too guilty about leaving my fiance who spent a ton of money on the wedding, and leaving my friends and family, to have sex with Lucas in the break room.

When Mullins was telling Blue how selfish and egoistical and know-all he is, only thinking of himself, she could have been talking about Meredith. Or Maggie.

I applauded Helm last week telling Yasuda that there would be no romantic stuff between them once she was her boss. But there they are, making out in the hospital lobby.

[Rae Spellman]

Birds died. Zippers broke. Simone's second engagement started and ended with her and Lucas minutes away from taking each other's clothes off. Lucas told her he'd do anything for her. Yasuda is still Team Skywalker. Of course Simone left Trey at the altar. 

Amelia had the audacity to tell Winston that he should have put his love for Maggie before his career. When Winston tried to do exactly that, Maggie told him that she didn't respect it! Then, Maggie put her career before her love for Winston. 

Seriously, Jo? Sleeping with a stranger months before she starts her internship is totally different from flirting with a recovering patient.

Hopefully Winston and Nick stay at Grey Sloan. Jules and Lucas need their mentorship. If they really want to be with those terrible sisters, they can talk to can talk to Richard or Miranda about long distance marriage/relationships.  

If Sam dies, at least he found out that Kelly and Kwame named their fourth child after him before the end.

They could have added a second award. One for Miranda and the other for one of the nominees.

Edited May 19, 2023 by Rae Spellman

[DEL901]

I almost forgot to mention the assertion that those attending the awards were the best doctors in the world.  Hyperbole, much?   

[Lady Calypso]

23 minutes ago, Madding crowd said:

Can’t stand Jules and her ranting and yelling at Kwan was over the top. Really don’t like any of these entitled interns.

I think Jules was well within her right to be upset at Kwan, though. What he did was not respect the wishes of his patient. She legally signed documents to avoid intubation, which he actively ignored. Jules was the one who knew Maxine; if she wasn't an intern who was friends with Kwan, she'd be Maxine's advocate and she would be well within her right to yell at the doctor who broke the law. It's because she personally knows Kwan that gave her more opportunities to be angry at him (that, and he kept approaching her when she clearly didn't want him around).

I like Kwan, really like what he did with the child in the first half, but he shouldn't get away with what he did to Maxine. He's VERY lucky things worked out for now, but Jules pointed out that there were decisions she would have to make that Maxine couldn't. And she even said that she was upset but also understood that he just saved her life, so she couldn't stay mad at him. Jules was in the right with her reaction; I actually appreciated the more nuanced reaction. 

Simone and Lucas are just so....boring. Simone sucks for immediately leaving her wedding to run to Lucas. It immediately proved Trey right in saying that she left him for another man. Simone had no business in trying to say otherwise; she DID leave him for Lucas. It had less to do with herself because, if it had, her first stop wouldn't have been the hospital AND she wouldn't have made her decision based off of what her grandmother said about her mother leaving another man for her father.

Plus, we barely know both characters before we got two seasons worth of plots thrown at them. We essentially got a Meredith/Derek/Addison AND April/Jackson plot redux all rolled into one before their first season was even up.

Mika's great, though; I really like her and Helm together.

So, they waste all the nominees' times by selecting a non-nominee to win the award instead. Nice moment (I loved Bailey's reaction), still wrong of the foundation to throw that in last minute. Plus, I feel like Addison should have also co-won with Bailey.

Nick/Meredith? Yawn. I've really liked Nick away from Meredith. Plus, what she did was pretty horrible and she never apologized for it. If Nick is sticking with Meredith, does that mean he won't be back for season 20? I've really liked his mentorship with Lucas.

Glad Winston finally asked for that divorce. Also glad the Winston/Amelia drama is over for now.

Jo/Link? Yawn. But at least Link's passive aggressive behaviour goes away for now.

I'd be more worried about Teddy, but she'll probably be fine. 

[JeanJean]

22 minutes ago, statsgirl said:

 

 

If I were Simone, I would have been feeling too guilty about leaving my fiance who spent a ton of money on the wedding, and leaving my friends and family, to have sex with Lucas in the break room.

 

I don't know how much jilting someone at the altar happens in real life, but TV shows sure like it. Wouldn't it be better to go through with the ceremony and then get an annulment rather than humiliating the bride/groom?

[DEL901]

1 hour ago, JeanJean said:

I don't know how much jilting someone at the altar happens in real life, but TV shows sure like it. Wouldn't it be better to go through with the ceremony and then get an annulment rather than humiliating the bride/groom?

Or just don’t sign the marriage license?

That said, I’d rather not go through with a ceremony that was just going to be dissolved.  That might be even more traumatizing.  

Edited May 19, 2023 by DEL901

[Madding crowd]

46 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

I think Jules was well within her right to be upset at Kwan, though. What he did was not respect the wishes of his patient. She legally signed documents to avoid intubation, which he actively ignored. Jules was the one who knew Maxine; if she wasn't an intern who was friends with Kwan, she'd be Maxine's advocate and she would be well within her right to yell at the doctor who broke the law. It's because she personally knows Kwan that gave her more opportunities to be angry at him (that, and he kept approaching her when she clearly didn't want him around).

I like Kwan, really like what he did with the child in the first half, but he shouldn't get away with what he did to Maxine. He's VERY lucky things worked out for now, but Jules pointed out that there were decisions she would have to make that Maxine couldn't. And she even said that she was upset but also understood that he just saved her life, so she couldn't stay mad at him. Jules was in the right with her reaction; I actually appreciated the more nuanced reaction. 

Simone and Lucas are just so....boring. Simone sucks for immediately leaving her wedding to run to Lucas. It immediately proved Trey right in saying that she left him for another man. Simone had no business in trying to say otherwise; she DID leave him for Lucas. It had less to do with herself because, if it had, her first stop wouldn't have been the hospital AND she wouldn't have made her decision based off of what her grandmother said about her mother leaving another man for her father.

Plus, we barely know both characters before we got two seasons worth of plots thrown at them. We essentially got a Meredith/Derek/Addison AND April/Jackson plot redux all rolled into one before their first season was even up.

Mika's great, though; I really like her and Helm together.

So, they waste all the nominees' times by selecting a non-nominee to win the award instead. Nice moment (I loved Bailey's reaction), still wrong of the foundation to throw that in last minute. Plus, I feel like Addison should have also co-won with Bailey.

Nick/Meredith? Yawn. I've really liked Nick away from Meredith. Plus, what she did was pretty horrible and she never apologized for it. If Nick is sticking with Meredith, does that mean he won't be back for season 20? I've really liked his mentorship with Lucas.

Glad Winston finally asked for that divorce. Also glad the Winston/Amelia drama is over for now.

Jo/Link? Yawn. But at least Link's passive aggressive behaviour goes away for now.

I'd be more worried about Teddy, but she'll probably be fine. 

I didn’t see any nuance with Jules, she was hysterically screaming. Kwan made a mistake but he had just been talking with the poor woman and he reacted. I’m not a fan of anyone screaming at medical staff who are not perfect but just trying to make the best decision under very stressful circumstances. She could have said she was upset without the yelling.

[chitowngirl]

Yes, Kwan was wrong. But you know if Maxine had passed away, Jules would have been screaming at him because he let her die…l

[Lady Calypso]

1 minute ago, Madding crowd said:

I didn’t see any nuance with Jules, she was hysterically screaming. Kwan made a mistake but he had just been talking with the poor woman and he reacted. I’m not a fan of anyone screaming at medical staff who are not perfect but just trying to make the best decision under very stressful circumstances. She could have said she was upset without the yelling.

It wasn't hysterical screaming. She very clearly explained why she was upset and why what he did was wrong. 

Kwan reacted emotionally; as a doctor, regardless of his opinion, his job is to respect the wishes of his patients. Maxine's wishes was to NOT be intubated. He broke the law. Jules was the one who had to deal with the aftermath. He got lucky this time and he may have been right; it doesn't mean he should be let off the hook for doing the right thing. 

Jules will move on from this once Maxine is ok, but I think she was fine to react emotionally in the moment. Because, had things gone wrong and Maxine had gotten worse, Jules would have had to make Maxine's end-of-life decisions, something Maxine did not want Jules to do (hence the DNR and DNI). We did see her acknowledge what Kwan did was the right thing, hence why she said "I hate you for your decision, but you saved her life, so I also love you". She acknowledges both feelings, especially once Maxine wakes up. But the worry was what if she didn't.

[Rae Spellman]

1 minute ago, JeanJean said:

 Wouldn't it be better to go through with the ceremony and then get an annulment rather than humiliating the bride/groom?

Maybe. If they had a ceremony and didn't file a signed marriage certificate, an annulment might not have been needed. But, Simone looked miserable walking down the aisle though. Trey saw it. Jules saw it. There was a lot going on with that plot. The guy who doesn't fit in with his family. The girl who didn't fit in at her internship. The guy who didn't want to lose the girl to the guy with the medical pedigree. 

Awful Amelia more or less told us that Gen-X Shepherds are horrible relatives. But, the messaging that Lucas, a twenty-something medical school graduate is a failure, or the black sheep of his family because he wasn't accepted to the best residency and/or isn't a phenom is terrible. What exactly did Lucas mother, aunts, uncles, siblings, or cousins do by their late twenties that he isn't already doing? It's also a rewrite of the Jackson Avery "they don't think I'm as great as my grandfather or mother because I'm pretty" story. The great Shepherd medical legacy, like the Grey, Fox, and Avery legacies isn't even necessarily older than Lucas. 

[Rammchick]

12 hours ago, jcbrown said:

I assume that Teddy was having a heart attack and this was to emphasize that jaw pain is a potential symptom, especially for women.  

That was my assumption too.  Sad that all the women who hold this position at Grey-Sloane end up with heart conditions.

I don't know why Maggie seemed so shocked when Winston suggested they get divorced.  She moved away to take another position and basically told him she didn't respect him.  Great sex, as they even said, is not the only criterion for a great relationship.  These are clearly two people who want different things out of life at the moment, and sex can't fix that.

And go away with Linc-Jo.  The show has been so obvious that that's where this was going, that when it arrived, it fell flat for me. I was more touched that Bailey was given the Catherine Fox award.

[txhorns79]

34 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

 

Kwan reacted emotionally; as a doctor, regardless of his opinion, his job is to respect the wishes of his patients. Maxine's wishes was to NOT be intubated. He broke the law. Jules was the one who had to deal with the aftermath. He got lucky this time and he may have been right; it doesn't mean he should be let off the hook for doing the right thing. 

Yes.  He broke the law, committed assault and put Jules in a terrible position.  If a patient is DNR/DNI, the doctor doesn't get to override them.  If a real intern had done this, he likely would no longer be an intern.  I really hate that the show is treating this as though the ends justify the means.   

1 hour ago, Lady Calypso said:

Plus, I feel like Addison should have also co-won with Bailey.

Seriously.  Addison was run down by a car while standing up for the rights of her female patients to healthcare.  That deserves at least an acknowledgement.  

 

1 hour ago, Lady Calypso said:

 

Simone and Lucas are just so....boring. Simone sucks for immediately leaving her wedding to run to Lucas. It immediately proved Trey right in saying that she left him for another man.

I didn't even think about it, but you are right.  There is something kind of gross about leaving one person at the altar and immediately jumping into bed with someone else.  Though in fairness to the characters, bed hopping is a tried and true move on this show.   

[ams1001]

42 minutes ago, txhorns79 said:

I didn't even think about it, but you are right.  There is something kind of gross about leaving one person at the altar and immediately jumping into bed with someone else.  Though in fairness to the characters, bed hopping is a tried and true move on this show.   

This shouldn't bug me but...she was wearing what appeared to be a a white one-piece bodysuit under her dress. When they were in the bed after, she appeared to still be wearing it....did she get up and put it back on or did they just work around it?

[Slider]

Next season I have a feeling that they will get Amelia and Winston together.  The hand holding was a major foreshadowing.

[shantown]

I think they rushed the story with Lucas and Simone, but I'm interested in seeing how they move forward next season. In general I liked the new interns, even if the stories were a little shaky, because they at least tried to give them meaningful connections to other doctors in the hospital. I'm interested in how they resolve Jules/Blue, and thought Harry Shum Jr made the most of being given a lot of material this episode. I would still rather see Yasuda/Helm as friends but I enjoyed Yasuda learning to advocate for herself and she played a part in making Helm likable so overall... I'm pro MAGYK and looking forward to how they continue to evolve next season.

I did not like Maggie/Winston falling into bed together or Nick/Meredith reconciling. It was a little overkill to have both sisters get dumped at once, but Winston and Nick were both establishing themselves outside of those relationships and I liked where (I thought) they were going with the characters. I'm hoping they both make it back next season - I would like to see another bromance on the show again.

Don't really care about Jo/Linc and their refusal to just communicate with each other was incredibly annoying. I liked Teddy as Chief as it gave her purpose outside of Owen. Am realizing now that I'm just sick of all the romantic drama and just want some of the fun social life aspects of the show back!

Not the best season finale, but not the worst. The season overall was enough to keep me invested another year... even if that won't be until 2024

[chitowngirl]

Is Gilles Marini going to factor in next season? Seems a pretty big name for a 30 second cameo. And of course Michael is gay. Because heaven forbid an attractive straight man be in the home of a single woman and be mistaken for ANYTHING other than a love interest…🙄

[KaveDweller]

3 hours ago, Rae Spellman said:

Seriously, Jo? Sleeping with a stranger months before she starts her internship is totally different from flirting with a recovering patient.

Especially since when Jo was an intern she slept with her attending. So she should know that it is pretty standard practice in Grey's land.

1 hour ago, Slider said:

Next season I have a feeling that they will get Amelia and Winston together.  The hand holding was a major foreshadowing.

I had that thought too, but it feels kind of gross considering Amelia and Maggie called themselves "sisters" for so long. Dating your sisters ex-husband isn't a great look.

[ECM1231]

11 hours ago, funnygirl said:

Meredith was acting a little manic. 

I came here to see what everyone was thinking. I guess I misinterpreted the writer's intent because I thought that Meredith had gotten on the train to crazy town. Not trying to be funny. I thought she had had some sort of nervous breakdown, especially the way Richard was looking at her. Then Richard telling her that she must keep her new research secret made me think he was just appeasing her until they could get a psych evaluation. Imagine my surprise seeing her all dolled up for the awards banquet!

I guess it's too much to hope for that Teddy won't be back next season.

[statsgirl]

Winston is only a few years out of his residency. Amelia must be at least a dozen years older than him, probably more, and several decades older in lived experience. This show puts together people who make no sense just because they happen to be single or are made single but I can't see Amelia with Winston in any sense.

[Rae Spellman]

The sister thing is whatever. Amelia is Maggie's biological sister's sister in law. Maggie dated her biological father's stepson. 

Handholding notwithstanding, Amelia maintained that there was "some truth" to her assertion that Winston is small, a coward, and inferior to Maggie. In this episode alone Amelia cared more about Derek's legacy than Meredith actually curing Altzheimers. She wasn't even in the room when the Catherine Fox Award winner was announced. Winston deserves better. If he really needs a new love interest, Vic from Station 19 should be available soon. The lawyer with breast cancer appreciates attractive doctors. Maybe one of Mika's seven sisters is single. Jules, or almost anyone in the Seattle metropolitan area would be a better choice than Amelia. 

The timeline on this show is fuzzy. Amelia seemed fairly established when she first appeared in season 7. Meredith was still a resident and became an attending in season 9. Maggie was born in  November 1983 when Meredith was around 5. Winston was Maggie's resident. But, she skipped enough grades that he could be her age. Basically, if it's '23 in Grey's universe, Amelia should be 50ish and like @statsgirl said, older than Winston. And Link. 

 

[PrincessTT]

40 minutes ago, Rae Spellman said:

The timeline on this show is fuzzy. Amelia seemed fairly established when she first appeared in season 7. Meredith was still a resident and became an attending in season 9. Maggie was born in  November 1983 when Meredith was around 5. Winston was Maggie's resident. But, she skipped enough grades that he could be her age. Basically, if it's '23 in Grey's universe, Amelia should be 50ish and like @statsgirl said, older than Winston. And Link. 

 

Winston is older than Maggie - in his first episode he told her that he had a crush on her when she was his chief of cardio; her being younger than him AND his chief made him like her even more.

 

We also know that Derek was 16 and Amelia was 5 when their dad was killed; it seems to be accepted that Derek was born in 1966 (although he grew up with and went to medical school with Mark Sloan who was born in 1968) so that make Amelia born in 1977 or 1979 - putting her at around the same age as Meredith (1978).

 

Meredith’s “year abroad” in Europe (and both Maggie & Lexie skipping grades at school) does a lot of the heavy lifting when it comes to explaining why she seems to be years behind in her career in comparison with those the same age / younger than her.

[Rae Spellman]

9 hours ago, PrincessTT said:

We also know that Derek was 16 and Amelia was 5 when their dad was killed; it seems to be accepted that Derek was born in 1966 (although he grew up with and went to medical school with Mark Sloan who was born in 1968) so that make Amelia born in 1977 or 1979 - putting her at around the same age as Meredith (1978).

This is helpful. Did Amelia also skip a bunch a grades and finish college/med school at an accelerated pace despite the teenage drug use? From what I remember, Izzy, George, and April were born around '80. Amelia seemed more than 1-3 years ahead of them professionally, too. Then again, Sam was 44 in episode 17 and 43 in the finale. So time and age are fluid on Grey's. 

Maggie and Amelia may not have a sisters before misters rule. Winston saw what happened with Link. He knows Richard is probably the only guy Amelia treats decently. If he finds himself entangled with Amelia despite all of that, hopefully it's incredibly brief and something along the lines of what Jo and Jackson or Shane and Cristina had.

[statsgirl]

12 hours ago, Rae Spellman said:

In this episode alone Amelia cared more about Derek's legacy than Meredith actually curing Altzheimers. She wasn't even in the room when the Catherine Fox Award winner was announced.

During the dinner and awards, Amelia was out of the room reading through Meredith's notes on her research as she had asked (the reason that Meredith had called them all to her lab was to ask them to go over her ideas and see if they saw the same things she did). Amelia told Richard (who along with Bailey and the others had not read Meredith's research) that Meredith's ideas were valid and deserved to be researched further even though it would destroy her brother's legacy.

Amelia then said that she needed to find a meeting now and offered to take Richard. He refused, so as she left she said that she would text him the information on the meeting.

[psychfan]

On 5/19/2023 at 1:34 PM, statsgirl said:

I didn't miss Meredith The Sun at all. While I have become inured to Meredith (and Bailey, Maggie etc.) making brilliant discoveries out of nowhere, the show portrayed Alzheimer's research and research funding in an overly simplistic way for the drahmah. To put out the idea that The Sun is now going to find the cure for Alzheimer's now is unfair to people who had dealing with it in their own lives and praying for a cure for themselves or their loved ones.

 

I rolled my eyes a little at the idea that Meredith in isolation discovered this but other than that it is a real thing that the plaque theory may be wrong and that therefore the treatment research has been misdirected because of that. So I like that that info may get out there more.

https://www.science.org/content/article/potential-fabrication-research-images-threatens-key-theory-alzheimers-disease

(I similarly liked spelling out those reasons for Jules to be angry even if he did save Maxine’s life, and how it’s not okay to go against a DNR/DNI, and if Teddy did have a heart attack as others mentioned raising awareness of different symptoms for women.)

Edited May 21, 2023 by psychfan

[circumvent]

I never got into this show because every time I tried to watch it, I hated all the characters. 

This time wasn't different. It got so bad, the writing is still soap opera of the lowest quality, and the older actors (some of the not so old) seem to be there just to get their paycheck for as long as they can. 

I never understood Kim Raver's appeal. I can't stand her face but that's just me. But I think she is also a terrible actor. Pair her up with what's his name? the husband/partner and the quality goes even lower. What a pitiful couple they make (in my eyes, of course)

I don't get the appeal of the "Maggie" character either. I had seen her before and thought - in a very shallow note - that she looked awful with her hair straight. She is also very unlikable, for the little I know of her.

Now, Meredith gave me her mom's vibes. She was completely ridiculous and I am not sure if that's the show's direction or if it was just bad acting. Someone who sees a fault in a decades-old acceptable research doesn't go all maniac. They take steps to make sure their research gets the attention it needs. Talking to herself and walking around like she is in trance is the opposite of a road to success. 

And what is happening to Elen Pompeo's face? I get that hollywood demands a lot of women, it is a patriarchal environment, but trying to hide the signs of aging by turning her face into something that looks a bad reconstruction after a bad accident kind of defeats the purpose of the botox or whatever else she is filling up her face with, no?

[iMonrey]

What is Ellen Pompeo's status on the show? Do we know if she's coming back next season, and if so, in what capacity?

Nobody can say Sam the Daredevil didn't bring about his own fate. I got a big kick out of Linc calling him "Rocky the flying squirrel."

Quote

I don't know why Maggie seemed so shocked when Winston suggested they get divorced.  She moved away to take another position and basically told him she didn't respect him. 

I got whiplash from that. She left him. What the hell was she expecting?

Quote

I guess it's too much to hope for that Teddy won't be back next season.

Amen to that. Don't tease me with a fake-out death, show! I won't be satisfied until Teddy is really dead. As in morally, ethically, spiritually, physically, positively, absolutely, undeniably and reliably dead!

Edited May 22, 2023 by iMonrey

[DEL901]

28 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

What is Ellen Pompeo's status on the show? Do we know if she's coming back next season, and if so, in what capacity?

Nobody can say Sam the Daredevil didn't bring about his own fate. I got a big kick out of Linc calling him "Rocky the flying squirrel."

I got whiplash from that. She left him. What the hell was she expecting?

All that she is committed to is the narration.  

[SoCal Mema]

On 5/21/2023 at 10:33 AM, circumvent said:

I never got into this show because every time I tried to watch it, I hated all the characters. 

This time wasn't different. It got so bad, the writing is still soap opera of the lowest quality, and the older actors (some of the not so old) seem to be there just to get their paycheck for as long as they can. 

I never understood Kim Raver's appeal. I can't stand her face but that's just me. But I think she is also a terrible actor. Pair her up with what's his name? the husband/partner and the quality goes even lower. What a pitiful couple they make (in my eyes, of course)

I don't get the appeal of the "Maggie" character either. I had seen her before and thought - in a very shallow note - that she looked awful with her hair straight. She is also very unlikable, for the little I know of her.

Now, Meredith gave me her mom's vibes. She was completely ridiculous and I am not sure if that's the show's direction or if it was just bad acting. Someone who sees a fault in a decades-old acceptable research doesn't go all maniac. They take steps to make sure their research gets the attention it needs. Talking to herself and walking around like she is in trance is the opposite of a road to success. 

And what is happening to Elen Pompeo's face? I get that hollywood demands a lot of women, it is a patriarchal environment, but trying to hide the signs of aging by turning her face into something that looks a bad reconstruction after a bad accident kind of defeats the purpose of the botox or whatever else she is filling up her face with, no?

I agree with you about Ellen Pompeo’s face.  And something weird is going on with her mouth and the way she speaks.  I never found her attractive, and her acting is mediocre, so therefore, just never got her as being “it”.

[Crashcourse]

I always thought Ellen Pompeo had a lisping sound.  Same with the Maggie character.

[Snow Fairy]

And to me it looks like Ellen has bigger lips than before. I don't know if that's just the make up or did she have something done

[PWHCHCH]

Yeah I noticed her lips looking a lot fuller than

normal. Nice to see Daryl from Charmed as one of the doctors. 

[Rae Spellman]

On 5/19/2023 at 2:43 PM, KaveDweller said:

I had that thought too, but it feels kind of gross considering Amelia and Maggie called themselves "sisters" for so long. Dating your sisters ex-husband isn't a great look.

Weren't Meredith and Maggie both involved with DeLuca?

[KaveDweller]

21 hours ago, Rae Spellman said:

Weren't Meredith and Maggie both involved with DeLuca?

Oh, yeah, I guess they were. I forgot all about that.

I guess this "sister" group doesn't care about sharing partners then.

[Rae Spellman]

Trey told Simone that Lucas was going to drag her down, get saved by his family name and Trey wasn't going to be there to help Simone pick up the pieces. Even though Simone lives in Lucas' aunt's house, got a second chance at interning at Lucas' aunt's hospital AND Trey didn't head to Seattle to see Simone until AFTER she started new friendships and found attending surgeons who "saw" and respected her. 

Based on what we've seen/heard, even with that fiasco at the end of the finale, Simone was more likely to fall apart with no one to help her pick up the pieces with Trey than she was/is with Lucas. In Seattle she's developing friendships with Jules and Mika. She described having no one other than Trey in Baltimore. Non-legacy interns get into and out of a lot at Grey Sloan. Nick told Lucas he was capable of making his own name. Lucas seems to be more like Meredith or Jackson than like Jackson's dad. Early on they, their parent, or their peers thought they were nepo babies who weren't up to continuing the family legacy. Then, they fond their footing and become well regarded in their own right. Meredith went from Ellis calling her a disappointment to winning a Harper Avery. Jackson went from being the pretty boy that the family supposedly didn't expect much of to having Mark fighting for him to join the plastics posse. 

Even if Lucas was more like Jackson's dad than Jackson or Meredith, Catherine turned out just fine post Robert Avery. Simone is the Miranda Bailey of her class. It's likely that she'll recover from whatever disaster Grey Sloan and Lucas Adams throw her way.

On another note, I wonder if Grandma really liked Trey before the first break up and her cognitive decline or if she, and Dewane really thought he was okay rather than super, duper awesome and  pretended to like him because Simone seemed so convinced that it was meant to be. 

[PepSinger]

On 5/19/2023 at 10:12 PM, ECM1231 said:

I guess I misinterpreted the writer's intent because I thought that Meredith had gotten on the train to crazy town. Not trying to be funny. I thought she had had some sort of nervous breakdown, especially the way Richard was looking at her. Then Richard telling her that she must keep her new research secret made me think he was just appeasing her until they could get a psych evaluation. Imagine my surprise seeing her all dolled up for the awards banquet!

Yeah, it was super fucking weird. It also seemed cliche.

 

On 5/19/2023 at 2:48 AM, jcbrown said:

 

I assume that Teddy was having a heart attack and this was to emphasize that jaw pain is a potential symptom, especially for women

 

I had no idea, so thank you for sharing. Personally, I thought that they were going for a “dental health is important because it can impact the rest of the body — including the heart —  if left untreated, so why is dental separate from health insurance” type of storyline. 
 

On 5/19/2023 at 1:34 PM, statsgirl said:

I thought when they were talking about the award going to someone who wasn't nominated, it was going to go to Addison who had to leave her son and husband and is driving around the country risking her life providing health care to women who couldn't get it otherwise. I should have known that it would go to one of the show's pets, in this case Bailey.

Like, why on EARTH wasn’t Addison a co-winner with Bailey????? I was expecting to see Addison pop out and accept an award as well, but nope! Utterly ridiculous! Bailey’s done good work, but Addison has made way more sacrifices, IMO.

On 5/19/2023 at 3:29 PM, txhorns79 said:

Seriously.  Addison was run down by a car while standing up for the rights of her female patients to healthcare.  That deserves at least an acknowledgement.  

If I were Addison, I’d be furious.

 

On 5/22/2023 at 3:50 PM, iMonrey said:

Quote

I don't know why Maggie seemed so shocked when Winston suggested they get divorced.  She moved away to take another position and basically told him she didn't respect him. 

I got whiplash from that. She left him. What the hell was she expecting?

Right? Like, Girl, WHAT?! You…left him. 

 

On 5/24/2023 at 5:38 PM, PWHCHCH said:

Nice to see Daryl from Charmed as one of the doctors. 

I am so glad someone else recognized him! Hello, Dorian!

On 5/20/2023 at 2:32 AM, Rae Spellman said:

Basically, if it's '23 in Grey's universe, Amelia should be 50ish and like @statsgirl said, older than Winston. And Link. 

 

On another note, I liked how Kwan’s patient story in part one had a little bit to do with the actor’s background. Shum was born and raised in Costa Rica, so he knows Spanish. 
 

The idea of Teddy covering for Winston was so fucking stupid. Do you who would cover the Chief of Cardiothoracic Surgery? The ASSOCIATE CHIEF and/or Vice Chair of Cardiothoracic Surgery. What the fuck? This show…

Please don’t let Nick leave. We need more adults at Grey Sloan.

[readster]

Thing with Teddy asking Schmitt to look at her mouth. He said: "I see nothing." He should have said: "I don't see anything, in fact I'm not dentist, but you have some really nice teeth there, Dr. Altman. It could be something more serious, isn't that a sign of possible heart or in some cases stroke?" Teddy could have simply said: "What? Me, the head of cardio for years possibly having a heart attack? No way." 

[MarylandGirl]

1 hour ago, readster said:

Thing with Teddy asking Schmitt to look at her mouth. He said: "I see nothing." He should have said: "I don't see anything, in fact I'm not dentist, but you have some really nice teeth there, Dr. Altman. It could be something more serious, isn't that a sign of possible heart or in some cases stroke?" Teddy could have simply said: "What? Me, the head of cardio for years possibly having a heart attack? No way." 

That would have been a way to fit it in! I do wonder whether they'd go the female atypical heart attack symptom route again though, as they did that with Bailey already. Tooth/gum infections can spread to the blood and causes sepsis though, I believe, so I wonder if it will be something like that? As that could also be a good PSA. Though stroke would be different enough from Bailey's, too.

[DEL901]

2 hours ago, MarylandGirl said:

That would have been a way to fit it in! I do wonder whether they'd go the female atypical heart attack symptom route again though, as they did that with Bailey already. Tooth/gum infections can spread to the blood and causes sepsis though, I believe, so I wonder if it will be something like that? As that could also be a good PSA. Though stroke would be different enough from Bailey's, too.

Can cause blindness too.