S05.E07: A House Full of Extremely Lame Horses

[iMonrey]

I got a kick out of the school and Ethan being in the "happiness" group. And then the teacher saying "It's quite unusual for a student to do worse the second time" after Abe insisted he re-take the aptitude test.

I honestly still don't see the point of these flash-forwards. What did this one tell us? Midge is bleeding cash to indulge her mother. Is the point to tell us Midge is a good daughter? OK, couldn't they just do that without a flash-forward? The gimmick just seems unnecessary to me.

[DrSpaceman73]

5 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I got a kick out of the school and Ethan being in the "happiness" group. And then the teacher saying "It's quite unusual for a student to do worse the second time" after Abe insisted he re-take the aptitude test.

I honestly still don't see the point of these flash-forwards. What did this one tell us? Midge is bleeding cash to indulge her mother. Is the point to tell us Midge is a good daughter? OK, couldn't they just do that without a flash-forward? The gimmick just seems unnecessary to me.

I think the flash forward are focusing on showing the fates of her family.  And Susie.  

We have her first husband, her kids, Susie, I expect we'll see something next about her dad and finally the fate of Midge herself 

[maggiegil]

On 5/13/2023 at 7:47 PM, EtheltoTillie said:

  Midge was not incompetent--she kept making the delicious brisket.  

Thats what I don't get, Midge is shown to be an above average cook several times but we're lead to believe that she didn't know how to use the burners on the stove. She seemed to live perfectly well without help (apart from Zelda babysitting) when she was married to Joel, clearly she at least would know how to do basic household chores

 

On 5/12/2023 at 11:43 AM, EtheltoTillie said:

Do you think Abe was proud of his granddaughter when he discovered her talent?  Will we learn the follow up?

In the ep where we see Esther having therapy while at University she says that her Grandfather was the only person who understood her so it sounds like they had a very close relationship

Edited May 14, 2023 by maggiegil

[Cosmocrush]

On 5/12/2023 at 8:15 AM, AriAu said:

2. How do you have a musical number with Hank Azaria singing and NOT Sutton Foster.

I thought that was part of the devaluing  of women's talents.  🤷‍♂️

10 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I got a kick out of the school and Ethan being in the "happiness" group. And then the teacher saying "It's quite unusual for a student to do worse the second time" after Abe insisted he re-take the aptitude test.

Same.   An aptitude for happiness.... what a wonderful euphemism.   I also appreciated that his parents were completely okay with that, although I couldn't really tell if that was genuine or disinterest. 

[quangtran]

I just realized that this is the second show I've watched where a Jewish person explicitly says that happiness is for stupid people. In Crazy Ex-Girlfriend, Rebecca tells her mother that if she ever has a daughter then she'll want her to be happy (because their own relationship is strained), in which Rebecca's mother says that happiness is for stupid people because Jewish people are all about survival. Which is a silly mentality for people of privilege to believe because the Cossacks aren't coming back.

Edited May 15, 2023 by quangtran

[chaifan]

On 5/13/2023 at 9:22 AM, AuntieMame said:

Im surprised that Rose’s matchmaking business is a loser.

My guess is that that level of matchmaking - prompted more by the parents than the potential couple - was simply not in fashion in the 70's.  It was all the rage in the 50's and 60's, but was rejected by the 20-somethings of the 70's era.  And, as we heard, Rose was spending far too lavishly - buying a building instead of renting, taking out full page ads in whatever big newspaper it was that they mentioned.  So Midge just pays for it all to make her mom think she's got a successful business.

I like Suzie and Mike bonding over poker, and Mike getting the Parr showcase for Midge.  Mike knows he owes Suzie for everything he's got at that moment.  I agree with the post above that Gordon may have done something to tank Midge's chance of getting on the Parr show.  Otherwise, it really doesn't make sense.  They don't "get" her.  What's to get?  Everyone in the room laughed, that's really all that matters.  I think if it were overt sexism, Parr's agent wouldn't have hesitated to just say "We don't think our audience is ready for a female stand up comic.  Yeah, this room loved her, but that's not our audience."

After last week's amazing episode, this one was a bit of a let down.   I really wanted this week to pick up where last week left off, and now we have to wait another week.  Boo.

 

[DrSpaceman73]

The matchmaking business, in the parlance of shark tank, doesn't scale well. 

It works great when you know lots of people snd connections know at least a semi personal level and you're basically connecting people within a social group, in the Jewish community of their part of New York. 

You try to expand that though to all of new york or a bigger region where you're outside the social circle you know at least semipersonally and it become no better probably than just random matches. 

[lucindabelle]

I guess I’m a table for one, but I preferred this episode to last week’s. For one, we visited a year we hadn’t seen before: 1973! And you know, dramas rarely do that- neither do books. Usually htey go back and forth between one time period and another. But this is a flash forward of only 12 years- people don’t look so different. But a lot has changed. Kudos to Neena Beber and her talented writers. 
 

I agree wi th all those who criticized the Weissmans inability to look at the book. Getting Production Stage Manager PTSD here. Every theater has a Book. Beber is a playwright and I wonder if that’s where she got the idea of a big loose leaf folder that has directions for EVERYTHING. 
 

(most corporate and school notebooks of directions are pitifully thin.)

to those saying Ethan is the stupid one & a lettuce farmer: NO. He’s working on a Kibbutz, which is an Israeli rite of passage, and he’s studying to be a RABBI, which, as he told his mother, takes more time than it does to be a lawyer. Anyone who thinks an Israeli rabbi can be stupid (intellectually, not stupid in the human way) just doesn’t know anything about Judaism. For one thing there is no Conservative movement in Israel; he’d be an Ortthodox Rabbi, and that shit is HARD. The sheer amount of memorization and interpretation. 
 

I think Ethan was indeed just plain happy. Once he found something to be interested in he was as smart as he wanted to be.

 

I loved seeing Midge break down and I loved her speaking up for the other comic too. It was touching, and added a level of real pathos to the show that I haven’t seen lately.

I think Rose has cancer. Dementia as a death sentence just seems too vague for the period. 
 

I wonder if Gordon becomes one of Midge’s husbands. I do not think Gordon tanked her chances. 

[shapeshifter]

43 minutes ago, lucindabelle said:

to those saying Ethan is the stupid one & a lettuce farmer: NO. He’s working on a Kibbutz, which is an Israeli rite of passage, and he’s studying to be a RABBI, which, as he told his mother, takes more time than it does to be a lawyer. Anyone who thinks an Israeli rabbi can be stupid (intellectually, not stupid in the human way) just doesn’t know anything about Judaism. For one thing there is no Conservative movement in Israel; he’d be an Ortthodox Rabbi, and that shit is HARD. The sheer amount of memorization and interpretation

We heard there was an exception or 2 in which the so-called Weissman Genius didn’t appear until age 7 — which leaves room for Ethan’s genius to be revealed. 
Still, likely Abe never sees any genius in Ethan after seeing him relegated to the happiness circle, followed by discovering granddaughter Esther’s precocious mastery of the piano.

Edited May 15, 2023 by shapeshifter

[shapeshifter]

41 minutes ago, lucindabelle said:

I do not think Gordon tanked her chances

It looked to me like Gordon had motive, means, and opportunity to screw Midge’s deal with Paar. 
But you may be right. 
Maybe Gordon was trying to steer Midge away from opportunities that he knew The Mob would put the kibosh on? 
Even if Gordon is not beholden to the Mob himself, he may be aware of their doings in his realm.

 

Edited May 15, 2023 by shapeshifter

[Cosmocrush]

On 5/12/2023 at 12:27 PM, shapeshifter said:

Huh. So Rose might just be weary in that scene rather than being terminally ill? 
But soon after (right?) Midge states:

• "We will continue to tell her business is great, and we will make as many commercials as she wants, because that's all I can do for her in the brief time she's got left."

I need to watch the 1973 commercial scene again because I completely missed that line.  

Edited:  Okay I watched it twice and still missed it.  Was it the commercial scene that Midge said this?

Edited Again:  I finally caught it.  Apparently I missed the last two scenes entirely  before the Danny Stevens Show ending.  Note to self, don't watch the show late at night when you might doze off. 

Edited May 15, 2023 by Cosmocrush

[lucindabelle]

4 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

We heard there was an exception or 2 in which the so-called Weissman Genius didn’t appear until age 7 — which leaves room for Ethan’s genius to be revealed. 
Still, likely Abe never sees any genius in Ethan after seeing him relegated to the happiness circle, followed by discovering granddaughter Esther’s precocious mastery of the piano.

To be clear I do t think Ethan has genius. I think he’s just very  smart. 

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, lucindabelle said:

To be clear I do t think Ethan has genius. I think he’s just very  smart. 

Right. Same. 
Although if he found the secret to happiness, that would be “genius” in the more colloquial sense of the word.😉

[Juneau Gal]

Ugh, I just didn’t like this episode; found it dull and boring. Or maybe it’s just that I haven’t liked this entire season. It feels as if instead of watching a cohesive series, we have been given random, one-off shows that have varied wildly in look, tone, style, tempo, and storytelling. 
 

And…..guess what, women still make less money than men in comparable jobs, women are still overlooked, men still take credit for women’s ideas/accomplishments in the work space, and the ERA has still not been enshrined into the law of the land. Were we supposed to be surprised/enlightened/educated by that particular storyline? Telling it through the lens of Midge, a person who has spent her entire life entitled and privileged and even in her comedy career has been given huge advantages, that she has often blown up due to her lifetime of entitlement, was clunky. 

[amarante]

10 hours ago, quangtran said:

I just realized that this is the second show I've watched where a Jewish person explicit says that happiness is for stupid people. In Crazy Ex-Girlfriend, Rebecca tells her mother that if she ever has a daughter then she'll want her to be happy (because their own relationship is strained), in which Rebecca's mother says that happiness is for stupid people because Jewish people are all about survival. Which is a silly mentality for people of privilege to believe because the Cossacks aren't coming back.

In fairness, the trope that only fools are happy is not limited to Jews although in the popular culture as promulgated by the many Jewish writers and film/television personnel, Jews are portrayed as more neurotic than the average WASP

In The Great Gatsby, Daisy Buchan said about her new born daughter

Quote

All right…I’m glad it’s a girl. And I hope she’ll be a fool – that’s the best thing a girl can be in this world, a beautiful little fool. 

 

[tennisgurl]

I definitely think that Rose is terminal in the 70s flashforwards, it seems very in character for Midge to respond to her mom dying by funding her vanity project and Rose to power through an illness to do a big commercial for her match making service. Its too bad that Rose was so obsessed with the venue instead of the actual matchmaking part, even if by the 70s most women were over the whole matchmaker thing. Just a bad time to be pushing that particular service. 

I like how the season is jumping around in time instead of just focusing on one era, it gives a fuller picture of the characters and where they end up. We go back to the 50s to see more about Abe and his tendency towards narcissism and sexism, we see Rose trying to keep up appearances in the 70s as well as more of Susie and Midge's dynamic now that Midge has made it, its like solving a mystery to see how everything fits together. 

I really felt for Midge when she was crying in her bathroom, I think we've all been there when we're disappointed, especially when we did everything that we could possibly do. Susie made a bad call when she told Jack not to take the Parr gig, Midge might be her first and favorite client but she represents Jack as much as Midge. I don't blame him at all for being pissed, especially as she couldn't even give him a reason besides "because I don't want you to". 

I don't at all think that Jack Parr was just offering Midge a job to hit on her, he really did just think she was talented and could bring something special to his show. I can see why he would be interesting in hiring her even beyond her making his act sparkle, her whole "take your real life and make it funny" thing is what sitcom writing is all about, and they do need to have women writers on a show about women. I almost wish that we could see Midge writing a sitcom, but then she probably wouldn't end up where she is in the future. 

Mike was absolutely glowing when he got to do the morning announcements, even if that didn't last long. I like him and Susie as a team, he knows how much he owes her and he's trying to pay that forward.

Edited May 15, 2023 by tennisgurl

[txhorns79]

13 hours ago, lucindabelle said:

 

I loved seeing Midge break down and I loved her speaking up for the other comic too. It was touching, and added a level of real pathos to the show that I haven’t seen lately.

I liked seeing her just commiserating like a normal person with one of her peers.  The show often loses the idea that these are all just people, not half-crazed, wildly eccentric quip machines, so it was nice to see Midge just acting like a person.

[Sarah 103]

On 5/13/2023 at 12:31 PM, Suzn said:

Moishe and Shirley can't understand that Midge can get tickets and Abe and Rose don't understand that TV shows have writers. 

Funny story about that. There was concern in the early 1960s that the premise of The Dick Van Dyke Show might be too "inside ball"/difficult to understand for some viewers, so maybe the idea that people didn't understand that TV show writers existed wasn't as crazy as you would think. I tend to agree with you. By the time TV existed, people had been watching movies for decades and seeing "screenplay by" as part of the opening credits/titles of movies. Plus, the HUAC hearings/Hollywood blacklist made the news at least in LA and New York, so there would have been some awareness of the idea that movies were written by people, and it shouldn't have been too big of a leap to make that if movies were written by people, than TV shows were also written by people. 

1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

I definitely think that Rose is terminal in the 70s flashforwards, it seems very in character for Midge to respond to her mom dying by funding her vanity project and Rose to power through an illness to do a big commercial for her match making service. Its too bad that Rose was so obsessed with the venue instead of the actual matchmaking part, even if by the 70s most women were over the whole matchmaker thing. Just a bad time to be pushing that particular service. 

Rose being obsessed with the venue was in 1961. The commercial was in the early 1970s. In the early 1970s, my guess is that younger women would have been over it and not interested in a matchmaker, but I can see mothers pushing thier daughters into using the service with variations of "it's just a meeting/it's just one date, what have you got to loose?"

1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

I don't at all think that Jack Parr was just offering Midge a job to hit on her, he really did just think she was talented and could bring something special to his show. I can see why he would be interesting in hiring her even beyond her making his act sparkle, her whole "take your real life and make it funny" thing is what sitcom writing is all about, and they do need to have women writers on a show about women. I almost wish that we could see Midge writing a sitcom, but then she probably wouldn't end up where she is in the future. 

Jack Parr wasn't offering her the job. His booking agent was the one who turned her down. Danny Stevens was the one who offered her a job on the staff of his sitcom. However, I do agree with you that it was a genuine offer and not an attempt to sleep with her. Take your real life and make it funny was pretty much the motto of The Dick Van Dyke Show writers' room. Also, did anyone else think the set for the sitcom looked a bit like the Peitere living room? It's the same era so it's not a total shock. 

As soon as I heard the piano playing at the end of the episode, I knew it was going to be Esther. We know from the first episode that they were close and she felt her grandfather was the one person who understood her, so clearly they had a pretty good relationship. 

[chessiegal]

12 minutes ago, Sarah 103 said:

it shouldn't have been too big of a leap to make that if movies were written by people, than TV shows were also written by people

The credits at the end or beginning of tv shows that says who the writers were should be a dead giveaway.

[chaifan]

2 hours ago, Sarah 103 said:

Also, did anyone else think the set for the sitcom looked a bit like the Peitere living room? It's the same era so it's not a total shock. 

I think that was very purposely done to hark back to The Dick Van Dyke Show.  I also felt that Sutton Foster's character was very much Laura Pietrie inspired.  A lot of similar expressions and mannerisms.  All that was missing was for Danny Stevens to trip over the couch.  People have commented on other episode threads about Pallidino borrowing/paying homage to other artists, and I think this was very clearly a DVDS "homage".

I once went to a summer event in crop pants, flats and a sleeveless button up top.  Someone complimented me on my outfit, and I said "Thank you.  I feel very Laura Pietrie in this."  And they had no clue what I was talking about. 

[FaginZorro]

I respectfully disagree. IMO this was not intended as homage Rob and Laura Petrie in New Rochelle. For one thing, they did not have a teen daughter. The outro of the fictional Danny Stevens show was meant to evoke "The Danny Thomas" show aka "Make Room for Daddy."  Even the split-level arrangement of their apartment was modeled after the set for Danny Williams' family's living area. Danny Stevens (Hank Azaria) corresponded to Danny Thomas, especially discussing how poor his family was. The character of Nancy corresponded to the Angela Cartwright character.  Sutton Foster's character corresponded to the Marjorie Lord/Jean Hagan wife character.  Even when Danny Stevens tried to steal Midge under Gordon's nose at Toots Shor's, he had mentioned that as a producer he was developing several shows, (similar to the real-life Thomas  who produced The Dick Van Dyke Show, The Andy Griffith Show, That Girl and The Mod Squad.) But mostly I support my contention with the fact that there was no ottoman to trip over. ☺️

In other matters, If I had been in charge of casting TMMM,

·       Sean Gunn (GG Kirk) would have taken the role of “Village Voice editor.”

·       Scott Cohen (GG Max Medina) would have taken the role of “Handsome Man/Sylvio”.

·       Milo Ventimiglia (GG Jess Mariano) would have taken the role of emcee at Susie’s Roast-i-monial.

·       Chris Eigemann (GG Digger) would have taken the role of a wealthy industrialist with many female relatives.

Just sayin’…

[Cosmocrush]

1 hour ago, FaginZorro said:

I respectfully disagree. IMO this was not intended as homage Rob and Laura Petrie in New Rochelle. For one thing, they did not have a teen daughter. The outro of the fictional Danny Stevens show was meant to evoke "The Danny Thomas" show aka "Make Room for Daddy."  Even the split-level arrangement of their apartment was modeled after the set for Danny Williams' family's living area. Danny Stevens (Hank Azaria) corresponded to Danny Thomas, especially discussing how poor his family was. The character of Nancy corresponded to the Angela Cartwright character.  Sutton Foster's character corresponded to the Marjorie Lord/Jean Hagan wife character.  Even when Danny Stevens tried to steal Midge under Gordon's nose at Toots Shor's, he had mentioned that as a producer he was developing several shows, (similar to the real-life Thomas  who produced The Dick Van Dyke Show, The Andy Griffith Show, That Girl and The Mod Squad.) But mostly I support my contention with the fact that there was no ottoman to trip over. ☺️

And don't forget Shirley talking about how he is "constantly visiting sick children, the sicker the better." 

[zamp33]

2 hours ago, chaifan said:

I think that was very purposely done to hark back to The Dick Van Dyke Show.  I also felt that Sutton Foster's character was very much Laura Pietrie inspired.  A lot of similar expressions and mannerisms.  All that was missing was for Danny Stevens to trip over the couch.  People have commented on other episode threads about Pallidino borrowing/paying homage to other artists, and I think this was very clearly a DVDS "homage".

I once went to a summer event in crop pants, flats and a sleeveless button up top.  Someone complimented me on my outfit, and I said "Thank you.  I feel very Laura Pietrie in this."  And they had no clue what I was talking about. 

I thought Danny Thomas right away but then felt like it was a blend of Dick Van Dyke and Danny Thomas. The living room did give off very Petrie vibes! And Dick Van Dyke would often perform music and dance on the show with Mary Tyler Moore. As much as I enjoyed the nostalgia I wasn't sure what it meant - I kept looking for "Midge Maisel" in the writing credits for the Danny Stevens show, even though I was watching the Maisel credits.

 

 

Edited May 15, 2023 by zamp33
deleted a sentence by accident - noticed after I posted.

[shapeshifter]

10 hours ago, Juneau Gal said:

And…..guess what, women still make less money than men in comparable jobs, women are still overlooked, men still take credit for women’s ideas/accomplishments in the work space, and the ERA has still not been enshrined into the law of the land. Were we supposed to be surprised/enlightened/educated by that particular storyline? Telling it through the lens of Midge, a person who has spent her entire life entitled and privileged and even in her comedy career has been given huge advantages, that she has often blown up due to her lifetime of entitlement, was clunky. 

Thank you, @Juneau Gal,  for summarizing the inequality of women as it is depicted in the show and especially this episode. 
Your disdain for the show's manner of focus on the topic of the continuing inequality of women is valid.
But, in contrast, I appreciate the show making palpable the continuing frustration of this majority of oppressed Americans (and world wide), especially through:

• Shirley's insistence on bowing to the lower status of women as illustrated by her persistance in trying to get Midge to name a man as being responsible for the tickets Midge got to the show Shirley loved.
  And, although it was Midge who had access to the tickets to give to Shirley, Shirley is not really wrong in that Midge could not have had the tickets without being bequeathed access to them by a man.
   
• Midge's/Rachel Brosnahan's authentic wail and then sobs of heartbreak and frustration at having lost her earned place in her world. All the advantages she ever had, and all of her successes and respect were not enough — because those were not (and still are not) enough for all but a very few women.

[basil]

11 hours ago, chessiegal said:

The credits at the end or beginning of tv shows that says who the writers were should be a dead giveaway.

You mean the credits that most people never watch?

9 hours ago, chaifan said:

I think that was very purposely done to hark back to The Dick Van Dyke Show.  I also felt that Sutton Foster's character was very much Laura Pietrie inspired.  A lot of similar expressions and mannerisms.  All that was missing was for Danny Stevens to trip over the couch.  People have commented on other episode threads about Pallidino borrowing/paying homage to other artists, and I think this was very clearly a DVDS "homage".

 

 

6 hours ago, zamp33 said:

I thought Danny Thomas right away but then felt like it was a blend of Dick Van Dyke and Danny Thomas. The living room did give off very Petrie vibes! And Dick Van Dyke would often perform music and dance on the show with Mary Tyler Moore.

I think you are both correct. Sutton was 100% Laura Petrie. Azaria was a Van Dyke/Thomas combo.

[kwnyc]

23 hours ago, lucindabelle said:

I think Ethan was indeed just plain happy. Once he found something to be interested in he was as smart as he wanted to be.

 

That's such a nice way of putting it.

I also thought that the final collapse of Midge at the end was the result of being treated as though she was invisible by EVERYONE: from Moishe and Shirley, to Rose expecting Midge to take care of everything for the business (not like Midge has a job!) to the surprising raise, and finally, when she got a shot to do what she does better than almost everyone else, that she's been working on for years, Jack Parr and his booker "don't get her." They literally refuse to accept that a woman, especially a pretty woman, can be a good standup.

It was heartbreaking in that way.

 

[Sarah 103]

5 hours ago, zamp33 said:

I thought Danny Thomas right away but then felt like it was a blend of Dick Van Dyke and Danny Thomas. The living room did give off very Petrie vibes! 

I agree. The actor Danny Stevens reminded me of Danny Thomas, especially the mention of his work with sick kids, but the living room set reminded me so much of the Petries. Since both shows were on the air at the same time, it's possible that it's more the look of a particular era than a specific show. I am more familiar with The Dick Van Dyke Show, which is probably why that's the show I thought the Danny Sevens show looked most similiar too in terms of the apartment. 

[shapeshifter]

8 hours ago, chaifan said:

I think that was very purposely done to hark back to The Dick Van Dyke Show.  I also felt that Sutton Foster's character was very much Laura Pietrie inspired.  A lot of similar expressions and mannerisms.  All that was missing was for Danny Stevens to trip over the couch.  People have commented on other episode threads about Pallidino borrowing/paying homage to other artists, and I think this was very clearly a DVDS "homage".

5 hours ago, zamp33 said:

I thought Danny Thomas right away but then felt like it was a blend of Dick Van Dyke and Danny Thomas. The living room did give off very Petrie vibes! And Dick Van Dyke would often perform music and dance on the show with Mary Tyler Moore.

1 hour ago, basil said:

I think you are both correct. Sutton was 100% Laura Petrie. Azaria was a Van Dyke/Thomas combo.

Sutton Foster was doing a perfect imitation of Laura Petrie, while her blonde hair and the last name of Stevens being a nod to  Bewitched's Samantha Stevens, played by Elizabeth Montgomery. 

 

[shapeshifter]

A meme of a quote of Jason Alexander about his fictional Jewish parents who are much like Shirley and Moishe:

(facebook.com/groups/1303773296362062/permalink/9463529217053055)

Edited May 16, 2023 by shapeshifter

[janie jones]

On 5/14/2023 at 2:05 PM, maggiegil said:

Thats what I don't get, Midge is shown to be an above average cook several times but we're lead to believe that she didn't know how to use the burners on the stove. 

It wasn't that they didn't know how to use the burners, but that they didn't know how to handle the pilot light being out. I didn't think Midge was depicted as being as helpless as her parents. She was actually interested in Zelda's book. My feeling was the Midge knows her way around the kitchen, but whenever the pilot light went out in her own apartment, she called Zelda to relight it. The only "incompetent" thing I recall Midge doing in that scene was being afraid she'd blow up the whole building. And if I'm being honest, I don't blame her. I've never had to relight a pilot light but I've had to light a gas barbecue and it scares me every time.

I can buy people not knowing that the Gordon Ford Show had writers. I used to think that the hosts of late night shows - comedians themselves - came up with all the jokes. So I can see people with no interest in the inner workings of a TV show continuing to think that. What I don't buy is people not understanding when someone tells them they write for the Gordon Ford Show.

[debraran]

22 hours ago, zamp33 said:

I thought Danny Thomas right away but then felt like it was a blend of Dick Van Dyke and Danny Thomas. The living room did give off very Petrie vibes! And Dick Van Dyke would often perform music and dance on the show with Mary Tyler Moore. As much as I enjoyed the nostalgia I wasn't sure what it meant - I kept looking for "Midge Maisel" in the writing credits for the Danny Stevens show, even though I was watching the Maisel credits.

 

 

 I thought it was a blend too and apartment a little tiny bit of MTM show back in the day.  She had the steps the balcony she never used the door to the hall was her bathroom. Maybe because I loved the show, I thought of that first. How I loved that apartment.

This long kind of rambling interview talks of everyone here's thoughts on Danny and MTM and giving homage to that time but my eye caught this one line and I hope they do come together for a movie one day. I'm sure schedules, money and all that will curtail it but I hope not.

For this episode of Streamed & Screened, hosts Bruce Miller and Terry Lipshetz, provide a (mostly) spoiler-free analysis of the the program, which is a favorite of both. Also hear from the stars, including clips from Rachel Brosnahan (Miriam "Midge" Maisel), Alex Borstein (Susie Myerson), Tony Shalhoub (Abraham "Abe" Weissman) and Kevin Pollak (Moishe Maisel) who reflect on the characters, the series and whether we might see them all reprise their roles in the future as part of a feature-length movie.

https://www.stltoday.com/entertainment/its-the-end-for-the-marvelous-mrs-maisel-hear-from-rachel-brosnahan-michael-zegen-and/article_15dc0b00-fc74-50ea-8a94-2736b1033ff3.html

Edited May 16, 2023 by debraran

[txhorns79]

16 hours ago, debraran said:

 I thought it was a blend too and apartment a little tiny bit of MTM show back in the day.  She had the steps the balcony she never used the door to the hall was her bathroom. Maybe because I loved the show, I thought of that first. How I loved that apartment.

Am I misremembering MTM?  I don't recall her using her hallway as a bathroom, but that certainly would have been a memorable part of the series!   My recollection was she had to go through her closet to get to the bathroom in her apartment.  

 

On 5/15/2023 at 1:46 PM, Sarah 103 said:

On 5/15/2023 at 11:31 AM, tennisgurl said:

 

Rose being obsessed with the venue was in 1961. The commercial was in the early 1970s. In the early 1970s, my guess is that younger women would have been over it and not interested in a matchmaker, but I can see mothers pushing thier daughters into using the service with variations of "it's just a meeting/it's just one date, what have you got to loose?"

I had thought Rose's clients were older women, like those in their 30s/40s who had not gotten married in their 20s and needed help.

[Daff]

On 5/15/2023 at 1:46 PM, Sarah 103 said:

set for the sitcom looked a bit like the Peitere living room?

Your entire post is spot on! I was a big fan of DT’s show, and was jarred into memories of it by their re-creation of the set. I’d say the set designs for DVD show took a page from that book, especially since that modern design was popular. 

[chessiegal]

25 minutes ago, txhorns79 said:

Am I misremembering MTM?  I don't recall her using her hallway as a bathroom, but that certainly would have been a memorable part of the series!   My recollection was she had to go through her closet to get to the bathroom in her apartment.  

We never saw the bathroom in MTM's original apartment. You are correct, she walked through her closet to get to it. Very different from her second apartment. In the episode where she has insomnia, half the cast showed up in her bathroom when she was taking a bath to help her sleep!

[Sarah 103]

2 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

I had thought Rose's clients were older women, like those in their 30s/40s who had not gotten married in their 20s and needed help.

You are correct in that Rose's clients were "older" women who had not married in thier 20s. My point was that by/in that 1970s, the 30something women were probably visiting Rose because thier mother had made the appointment and were eager to have thier daughters married. The women were probably reluctantly going along with or it, or went along due to a major guilt trip. 

[debraran]

5 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

Am I misremembering MTM?  I don't recall her using her hallway as a bathroom, but that certainly would have been a memorable part of the series!   My recollection was she had to go through her closet to get to the bathroom in her apartment.  

 

I had thought Rose's clients were older women, like those in their 30s/40s who had not gotten married in their 20s and needed help.

                  I wrote that too fast sorry. I meant that on Maisel it was the hallway but on MTM, it was her closet/bedroom/bath you never saw. The setup with the stairs and balcony was the same.

[shapeshifter]

5 hours ago, Sarah 103 said:

You are correct in that Rose's clients were "older" women who had not married in thier 20s. My point was that by/in that 1970s, the 30something women were probably visiting Rose because thier mother had made the appointment and were eager to have thier daughters married. The women were probably reluctantly going along with or it, or went along due to a major guilt trip. 

If Rose's health hadn't been failing, I wonder if she (or any other matchmakers of the '70s?) might have made money matching gay men with gay women to be beards for each other?

[Sarah 103]

18 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

If Rose's health hadn't been failing, I wonder if she (or any other matchmakers of the '70s?) might have made money matching gay men with gay women to be beards for each other?

By the 1970s, there were some industries, especially in New York City where people could live openly as gays or lesbians. There were other industries where that was not possible. 

Also, your idea sounds like it could be a series.

[ChattyCathyLA]

On 5/12/2023 at 10:28 PM, shapeshifter said:

I assumed Midge didn’t get booked on Jack Paar’s show because Gordon Ford somehow got Paar’s people to not hire Midge after Midge had gone to Gordon Ford to give him a heads up that she was doing the Paar thing (12 comics getting to do short sets, with, apparently, the best one winning a spot) but Midge and Gordon started arguing about Midge not being good enough and Stevens only wanting to shtup Midge rather than hire her to write, and then Midge got in Gordon’s face and told him she’d prove him wrong. 

I agree completely about Gordon putting the kabosh on Midge’s big break on Paar.  When she went into Gordon’s office giving him a “chance” to book her first, I KNEW that was a big mistake!  I’m hoping she finds out about the kabosh in the future.  She should have just kept her mouth shut, gotten on Paar and then said “I told ya so” to Gordon.  To be honest, I was surprised that someone as shrewd as Midge would do something so stupid.  You don’t show your cards in poker … you just play them!

[smartymarty]

On 5/21/2023 at 7:31 AM, ChattyCathyLA said:

I agree completely about Gordon putting the kabosh on Midge’s big break on Paar.  When she went into Gordon’s office giving him a “chance” to book her first, I KNEW that was a big mistake!  I’m hoping she finds out about the kabosh in the future.  She should have just kept her mouth shut, gotten on Paar and then said “I told ya so” to Gordon.  To be honest, I was surprised that someone as shrewd as Midge would do something so stupid.  You don’t show your cards in poker … you just play them!

She did it because she really wanted to appear on Gordon's show, as she considered it more prestigious. But yeah, I guess she could have appeared on Paar first, and seeing that, Gordon would finally let her perform on his show. Of course, she then would likely leave as his writer, which he wouldn't like, since he's still attracted to her.

[Blakeston]

On 5/14/2023 at 11:18 PM, chaifan said:

I agree with the post above that Gordon may have done something to tank Midge's chance of getting on the Parr show.  Otherwise, it really doesn't make sense.  They don't "get" her.  What's to get?  Everyone in the room laughed, that's really all that matters.  I think if it were overt sexism, Parr's agent wouldn't have hesitated to just say "We don't think our audience is ready for a female stand up comic.  Yeah, this room loved her, but that's not our audience."

I can buy that people wouldn't "get" Midge. Joan Rivers dealt with that constantly. An unapologtetic smart aleck Jewish woman comedian who talks a mile a minute and tells it like it is? At that point in time, it was a very jarring thing for a lot of people, and a lot of them were just bewildered by her. 

People just not "getting" Midge makes sense with the theme of the episode. I don't think it was Gordon. I think it was the industry not being ready for her.

 

[chaifan]

11 hours ago, Blakeston said:

I can buy that people wouldn't "get" Midge. Joan Rivers dealt with that constantly. An unapologtetic smart aleck Jewish woman comedian who talks a mile a minute and tells it like it is? At that point in time, it was a very jarring thing for a lot of people, and a lot of them were just bewildered by her. 

People just not "getting" Midge makes sense with the theme of the episode. I don't think it was Gordon. I think it was the industry not being ready for her.

Yes, I agree that some people wouldn't get Midge.  But, this was a showcase, with an audience that I'd have to assume was picked to represent Parr's audience.  And they all laughed.  Everyone said she killed.  So, the audience got her.  The point of a showcase isn't just whether Parr himself likes a comedian, it's also the audience reaction.  It just doesn't make sense for her to get a great audience reaction and then dismiss her with a "we don't get her" excuse.  Sounds fishy to me.  YMMV.

[Dobian]

On 5/14/2023 at 9:59 AM, iMonrey said:

I got a kick out of the school and Ethan being in the "happiness" group. And then the teacher saying "It's quite unusual for a student to do worse the second time" after Abe insisted he re-take the aptitude test.

I honestly still don't see the point of these flash-forwards. What did this one tell us? Midge is bleeding cash to indulge her mother. Is the point to tell us Midge is a good daughter? OK, couldn't they just do that without a flash-forward? The gimmick just seems unnecessary to me.

In this episode, they flashed forward and flashed backward.  They're flashing all over the place!

[Shermie]

I like the flash forwards; it’s a more effective way of showing the viewers what happens to these characters. Most people who watch a show all the way through are curious about the endgame of the characters. Many shows do the blurbs at the end of the finale, giving a line and a photo of each character; it can be effective in a comedy since it’s just another gag, but not so much for a show like this with so many layers. This way we know what happened to them and how it came to be.

Random comment - Shirley has an enormous head. Once you see it, you can’t unsee it. She’s next to anyone, her head is twice the size of anyone else. Yes, part of it is her voluminous hairdo, but her actual head is also huge. Just like Joy Behar. 

As entertaining as Abe and Rose are, they certainly are useless people, especially Rose. How can two adults be so dense? Although I suspect there are many people in this day who are equally obtuse (people who actually don’t know that  food comes from actual plants and animals, yes, this is a thing). 

[mostlylurking]

What a weird episode. Nothing happened, and it was especially weak after the last episode which for me was one of the best in the entire series. What was with the ending and that extended Hank Azaria bit??  Made no sense at all. What a waste of an episode and an hour of my time.