All Episodes Discussion

[Melina22]

I figure that if you stab a completely unsuspecting person out of the blue, strength wouldn't matter too much. They wouldn't have time to defend themselves. 

As for her dragging the body outside... I don't know how or why she would do that. It would be incredibly difficult. 

[TVbitch]

She either had help...

OR

Now I've never stabbed anyone  : D  but I imagine it puts your adrenaline at 1000%, so she possibly had super human "mom lifts car off child" strength for a bit of time.

As for the chin quivering, the look she had on her face read as revulsion to me. I think even though she chose to do it, her own psyche was shocked and revulsed by her gruesome, bloody actions.

[howiveaddict]

Not that I would ever kill someone, but Becky could have rolled Linda onto a plastic tarp, shower curtain, trashbag and pull her across a slick floor to the outside. From pictures she did look quite taller than Linda.   Wonder why she put her out back though? Was she planning on putting her in the trash can come trash day?  Did she not think someone would look under the tarp or would they just search the house for LInda?  

[Irlandesa]

I do think her initial plan was to dispose of the body. 

Yesterday's second episode was new to me: It was about the 24 year-old son who was dating a woman in her 30s who liked expensive things so he killed his 40 something year old father (who I guess also lusted after his son's girlfriend) for the money.

So bizarre.  During her interview, I didn't think she had anything to do with it but then she talked about the things she "blacked out" like a confession.

Edited April 10, 2022 by Irlandesa

[Ohmo]

3 hours ago, TVbitch said:

Now I've never stabbed anyone  : D  but I imagine it puts your adrenaline at 1000%, so she possibly had super human "mom lifts car off child" strength for a bit of time.

I'd go with that scenario because I don't get the sense that Tim was involved.  I'm more of the "he got duped by Becky and he's mad because he probably let his guard down, and he's telling himself he should have known better" camp.

He seems to me that he's a lonely guy who worked in LO for a long time, met Becky, thought she was nice, wanted to give the benefit of the doubt instead of reverting to be a LEO when it came to his love life and got burned.

Wasn't that cart thing where Linda's body was found on wheels?  Becky could have rolled that cart into the kitchen and then put Linda's body in it.

The footage with the knife completely shocked the heck out of me.

I do wonder, though.  Phil didn't do THIS, but Linda was afraid of him.  I'm not saying that Phil was involved in this, but I wonder if he would have had Linda killed if Becky hadn't done it for her own reasons.

[Irlandesa]

16 minutes ago, Ohmo said:

Phil didn't do THIS, but Linda was afraid of him.  I'm not saying that Phil was involved in this, but I wonder if he would have had Linda killed if Becky hadn't done it for her own reasons.

The people who said she was afraid of him were Tim and Becky, right?  Her kids seem to love him and refused to take sides in the divorce even though Linda wanted them to.   I know that can happen in abusive families but I thought it was noteworthy.

Becky was the one who claimed to have witnessed the abuse and then I believe Tim said Linda was afraid of Phil but I can't help but wonder if it's a Pam Hupp type of situation where Becky realized she was going to have to kill Linda and started planting the seed that Phil was a scary dude with Tim and maybe even Linda.

But I'll say it, based on things said and not said in the episode, I think Linda was a little wackadoodle too.  I get that watching porn on a state computer is bad but the way she used it to go after her ex just seemed over-the-top and clearly didn't help her in her divorce case if he came out better off.  But she got him fired so I guess that was a win for her?  Then there was the fact that she talked about how maybe she had made the wrong choice when she chose Phil over her current lover but what wasn't said is she likely went with the guy who had money and a job. 

And she was afraid he was poisoning her but it sounds like it was a tooth thing. 

I bet she loved a conspiracy theory and could easily be convinced people were after her, especially since it sounds like Tim and Becky came out of nowhere to become important in her life.

So no, I don't think she was in danger of being killed by Phil.

[Vivigirl10]

I'm sure many can counter this statement but I find it a little odd that as an adult woman, your new best friend and deep confidant is a man you are not romantically interested in.  It just seemed a little weird and makes me lean towards Tim and Becky together identifying Linda as a "mark".  I think Tim was in on the embezzlement (or at least knew about it).  Even her kids said they were like "who are these people" when they started showing up as "best friends" and no one had ever heard about them or seen them before.  It just struck me as weird.  

Quote

Then there was the fact that she talked about how maybe she had made the wrong choice when she chose Phil over her current lover but what wasn't said is she likely went with the guy who had money and a job. 

You had Rendell, who lived in the boonies with no cell service (he probably wasn't that much different in his younger years?), and a well-off attorney to choose between.  Yeah, I chuckled at why she made that choice too!

Quote

What I shook my head at was them pulling the family away from the visitation to tell them Becky had been arrested and then sending them back to greet mourners like nothing happened.  C'mon, guys!  

Thank you!  I didn't care about the arrest but why didn't they tell the family after the service?

[12catcrazy]

2 minutes ago, Kiki620 said:

I'm sure many can counter this statement but I find it a little odd that as an adult woman, your new best friend and deep confidant is a man you are not romantically interested in.  It just seemed a little weird and makes me lean towards Tim and Becky together identifying Linda as a "mark".  I think Tim was in on the embezzlement (or at least knew about it).  Even her kids said they were like "who are these people" when they started showing up as "best friends" and no one had ever heard about them or seen them before.  It just struck me as weird.  

You had Rendell, who lived in the boonies with no cell service (he probably wasn't that much different in his younger years?), and a well-off attorney to choose between.  Yeah, I chuckled at why she made that choice too!

Thank you!  I didn't care about the arrest but why didn't they tell the family after the service?

Yes! To all of the above.  And yeah, the video of Becky holding the bloody kitchen knife was the hi-light of this episode.   And I have to agree with whoever said that the victim was kind of "a whackadoodle" - she might have been a good mother to her children but there seemed to be something a bit off there too.   And what I don't understand is why she and her ex-husband built those two motels in that part of Arkansas.   It's not as if there is really anything "there".  Not the Ozarks and unless there is a major highway there, what's the point?  Looked like standard "no tell motels" to me.  Maybe there is a lot of "sin" going on in that Bible Belt town?  

And yeah, God help America with all of this bullshit conspiracy stuff.  I remember the good old days when conspiracy theories were fun - and usually about stuff like the Roswell crash and Men In Black, and the Illuminati.  You also had to read about this stuff in BOOKS - and had to actively search out the books at that.   Now, all you do is turn on the computer and it's all out there on social media.  The fact that Q Anon actually had so many people believing it is a real wake up call.   If you look at countries that have dictatorships, you see that conspiracy theories are also part of the national psyche.   Democracy can not hold when you have an uneducated populace who will believe almost everything outlandish that they read on Facebook.   For some strange reason, it seemed that the day Hillary Clinton remarked something to the effect that she hadn't wanted to stay at home and bake cookies that she became the lighting rod for every type of evil thing a politician could be behind.   And the weird thing is, at one time, the Clintons were very popular in Arkansas.  And when this murder happened people whispered that they were behind killing a FORMER state senator who nobody outside of Arkansas had ever heard of.  I still don't get it.  

[JudyObscure]

This just in -- Lori Daybell has been declared competent for trial. 

Chad and Lori Daybell’s cases are set to be tried together in Ada County in January 2023.

I needed something to look forward to.  I sure hope Court TV gets to film it all for us.

[Crashcourse]

5 hours ago, 12catcrazy said:

And what I don't understand is why she and her ex-husband built those two motels in that part of Arkansas.   It's not as if there is really anything "there".  Not the Ozarks and unless there is a major highway there, what's the point?  Looked like standard "no tell motels" to me.  Maybe there is a lot of "sin" going on in that Bible Belt town?  

That's what I thought they were, and that's why they built them.  People had to have a place for...uhh..."recreation."

[LGraves65]

22 hours ago, 12catcrazy said:

 And what I don't understand is why she and her ex-husband built those two motels in that part of Arkansas.   It's not as if there is really anything "there".  Not the Ozarks and unless there is a major highway there, what's the point?  Looked like standard "no tell motels" to me.  Maybe there is a lot of "sin" going on in that Bible Belt town?  

It's duck hunting country, plus there's a small Baptist college in a neighboring town.  And I'm 80% positive they're the only motels in Pocahontas.  The Days Inn is newer, so it's nicer, but the Rock 'n' Roll Inn is, yeah, a place where truckers stay when they drive on 67. 

[Cinnabon]

On 4/11/2022 at 10:40 AM, Kiki620 said:

I'm sure many can counter this statement but I find it a little odd that as an adult woman, your new best friend and deep confidant is a man you are not romantically interested in.  It just seemed a little weird and makes me lean towards Tim and Becky together identifying Linda as a "mark".  I think Tim was in on the embezzlement (or at least knew about it).  Even her kids said they were like "who are these people" when they started showing up as "best friends" and no one had ever heard about them or seen them before.  It just struck me as weird.  

You had Rendell, who lived in the boonies with no cell service (he probably wasn't that much different in his younger years?), and a well-off attorney to choose between.  Yeah, I chuckled at why she made that choice too!

Thank you!  I didn't care about the arrest but why didn't they tell the family after the service?

I can definitely counter that statement, as a woman who’s had a couple male best friends that I wasn’t involved with. But this woman is still off!

[SunnyBeBe]

Is this the thread with a lot about the Lori Vallow case?  Charged with murdering her children.  

[gaPeach]

Quote

What I shook my head at was them pulling the family away from the visitation to tell them Becky had been arrested and then sending them back to greet mourners like nothing happened.  C'mon, guys!  

I did too.  And even the whole following them to the funeral while waiting for the warrant.  None of that was necessary.  Tim and Becky did not even know they were suspects much less on the brink of being arrested so what was the hurry?  Barney Fife acted like if Becky made it to the funeral without being arrested, they would lose the killer.

Interrupting the Memorial Service just to tell the family they caught the killer of their mother but Hey, go back out there and face all those people, don't say anything and just act normal.  WTF?!  It seemed to me that Barney Fife just wanted the one to tell them so he could be a big man.  It was a cruel thing to do to a grieving family.

[Ellee]

1 hour ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Is this the thread with a lot about the Lori Vallow case?  Charged with murdering her children.  

Yes it is.  
 

Her court date is JANUARY 2023!  My goodness. 
 

@SunnyBeBe, I’m usually nice but I can’t wait for that woman to get her’s.    Daybill too of course but the sooner the better. 
 

 

[SunnyBeBe]

1 hour ago, Ellee said:

Yes it is.  
 

Her court date is JANUARY 2023!  My goodness. 
 

@SunnyBeBe, I’m usually nice but I can’t wait for that woman to get her’s.    Daybill too of course but the sooner the better. 
 

 

I agree. Was going to post about her being found competent to stand trial.  Will try to locate the link again.  She is an incredibly vile and monstrous person.  I hope her pack of lies will stop helping her.  And, that her protectors stop the BS.  She killed her kids for no reason!  Totally evil woman.  

[LuvMyShows]

On 4/9/2022 at 1:58 AM, Annber03 said:

I had to laugh at the one guy who worked for Linda being shocked at the news Becky was the murderer, though. He was all, "You'd never expect it to be the woman who worked for her, who was her friend, who handled her money....". I was sitting here like, "...you haven't seen a lot of true crime shows, have you?" Does the name Yolanda Saldivar mean anything to him, by any chance? 

It continues to amaze me that there are people who are embezzling, and get caught by someone, and decide that the very best thing they could do for themselves is to murder that person.  Never mind that once that person gets killed, the amount of scrutiny will be magnified multi-fold, and now you will likely be tried for the embezzlement and the murder..

[Ellee]

Found the perfect cell mate for Vallow. 
 

A 41 yr old woman killed her 3 yr old boy and 5 yr old girl.  She apparently called the police to ‘come get them — doesn’t want them anymore.’  
 

Just can’t understand a mom doing that to her babies.  Just can’t. 

[amarante]

19 hours ago, LuvMyShows said:

It continues to amaze me that there are people who are embezzling, and get caught by someone, and decide that the very best thing they could do for themselves is to murder that person.  Never mind that once that person gets killed, the amount of scrutiny will be magnified multi-fold, and now you will likely be tried for the embezzlement and the murder..

If criminals really thought about repercussions and weighed the likelihood of getting caught, there would be fewer criminals.

I watch American Greed which has a lot of scammers and Ponzi schemers who are able to keep the scam going but inevitably are caught. I mean Bernie Madoff was amazing in terms of how long he did it but he caught have have been wealthy even by Wall Street standards even if he didn't run the Ponzi scheme - how much time and psychic energy did that take - plotting and worrying constantly.

But most of them are like the accountant who embezzled about $2 million from the Collin Street Bakery in Texas and he lasted about two or three years. During that time he made no effort to even conceal the wealth in terms of stashing it and then heading to the Maldives or some other place that doesn't extradite for financial crimes. 

On a very minor level I worked at a company in which one of the accountants was embezzling by writing checks to a company controlled by a relative. Her first mistake was driving a car and wearing a watch that was out of line with her income so her co-workers were talking about it. Her second mistake was going on vacation when her "replacement" spotted the accounting discrepancies and she was arrested the first day she returned. One of the best business practices is to *force* people to go on vacation periodically so that their work is then taken over by new people who can spot the accounting discrepancies

Edited April 13, 2022 by amarante

[Melina22]

1 hour ago, amarante said:

One of the best business practices is to *force* people to go on vacation periodically so that their work is then taken over by new people who can spot the accounting discrepancies

So true! This is how they caught the loan manager at our bank, who had embezzled thousands of dollars and who also was flaunting it, despite living in a mobile home. (I don't believe in revelling in anyone's misery, but I felt some vindication after her conviction, because of how rudely she dismissed our loan application, making us feel like she was so much better than us.) 

Dateline doesn't focus much if at all on embezzlers, unless murder is involved, but they can be pretty fascinating. The psychology of how and why they do it especially interests me. 

[amarante]

3 hours ago, Melina22 said:

So true! This is how they caught the loan manager at our bank, who had embezzled thousands of dollars and who also was flaunting it, despite living in a mobile home. (I don't believe in revelling in anyone's misery, but I felt some vindication after her conviction, because of how rudely she dismissed our loan application, making us feel like she was so much better than us.) 

Dateline doesn't focus much if at all on embezzlers, unless murder is involved, but they can be pretty fascinating. The psychology of how and why they do it especially interests me. 

I can't think of any financial crimes only which have been covered by Dateline. They are always tied somehow to a twisted murder. I am not sure if it was Dateline but there was one where the incredibly respectable wife drowned her husband while taking an inscrutable early morning boat ride in the winter. She had been embezzling from some foundation she was running.

And then there are the dime a dozen spouse killers who are killing for the insurance policy. I think it was Dateline but could have been 48 Hours where there was a soldier who was killed by his spouse - as I recall for some reason he had too many dependents and so he was being booted out of the Army or coudn't reenlist. 

American Greed which is on CNBC is great for intriguing scammers and they have had a few of the fascinating killers for greed like the Dahlia? who was arrested on camera for attempted murder. The guys had pulled a sting on her. That one is so bizarre it has been covered by multiple true crime shows.

[LuvMyShows]

On 4/13/2022 at 3:56 PM, amarante said:

On a very minor level I worked at a company in which one of the accountants was embezzling by writing checks to a company controlled by a relative. Her first mistake was driving a car and wearing a watch that was out of line with her income so her co-workers were talking about it. Her second mistake was going on vacation when her "replacement" spotted the accounting discrepancies and she was arrested the first day she returned. One of the best business practices is to *force* people to go on vacation periodically so that their work is then taken over by new people who can spot the accounting discrepancies

 

On 4/13/2022 at 5:14 PM, Melina22 said:

So true! This is how they caught the loan manager at our bank, who had embezzled thousands of dollars and who also was flaunting it, despite living in a mobile home.

I am stunned that on this forum alone, there are at least two people who have been employed at places where embezzlement occurred.  It must be way more common than gets reported.

And I love the concept of people's disproportionate spending, which is basically flaunting, being the contributor to their undoing, although as mentioned above, the Collin Street Bakery guy (and wife, since I definitely think she knew or should have known) flaunted flagrantly for several years before getting caught.  

That's a good point about the vacation substitute employees noticing the irregularities.  That would seem to add to the psychic worry and stress, at least for normal people.  But my theory, based on no knowledge whatsoever, is that initially they may worry because the stealing is so new.  But once some time passes, maybe as little as one or two months, I bet they stop worrying and just enjoy for quite awhile.  But then something happens, like new management or someone who is sort of peripheral but suspicious and determined, and then they get worried/stressed because by now, there is a long history of it to be exposed.

[Jalyn]

33 minutes ago, LuvMyShows said:

 

I am stunned that on this forum alone, there are at least two people who have been employed at places where embezzlement occurred.  It must be way more common than gets reported.

Probably even more. Unless you work in Finance, HR or legal, you probably would never find out unless the company prosecuted the crime. The only thing people that don't need to know would be told is "so-and-so no longer works for the company."

For small enough issues, the thief is told a) you are fired, b) if you pay us back we won't take this to the cops. At least, that's what they did in the early 90s :)

One of the AP clerks that worked for my mom turned out to have been cutting checks to pay her personal credit card bills. It looked like she just couldn't pay it one month and put it in the check run. When it worked, she just kept doing it. 

As a teenager, I was hired to go through every check run for years before she was caught to verify everything else was on the up and up. I was not allowed to tell anyone else that worked for the company specifically what I had been temp hired to do or discuss that employee at all. 

[badgerwoman]

16 minutes ago, Jalyn said:

Probably even more. Unless you work in Finance, HR or legal, you probably would never find out unless the company prosecuted the crime. The only thing people that don't need to know would be told is "so-and-so no longer works for the company."

For small enough issues, the thief is told a) you are fired, b) if you pay us back we won't take this to the cops. At least, that's what they did in the early 90s :)

 

My company had someone embezzling for a year, in huge amounts, and was caught due to a scheduled internal audit.  Her husband said he didn't know, but she paid for a couple of cars in cash, paid of some loans, they ate out every night.  she went to prison.

But my mom caught an embezzler at her work.  My private high school had an office person embezzling (she would say someone didn't pay fees and enough people didn't realize they had paid for her to get away with it for a few  years.  She tried it with my mom, a bookkeeper by profession, and my mom said nope, here's the check that cleared).  The drugstore close to us caught a clerk who had been embezzling over 20 years, very small amounts at first.   the drug store prosecuted.   All of those were prosecuted.  

 

[JudyObscure]

On 4/13/2022 at 5:14 PM, Melina22 said:

This is how they caught the loan manager at our bank, who had embezzled thousands of dollars and who also was flaunting it, despite living in a mobile home.

One of the loan officers in the credit union where I worked was caught after the low level person who actually cut the checks noticed the signatures on a lot of loans looked similar. The loan officer was a woman in her forties who always dressed beautifully and swanned around like she was far above us lowly tellers.  Imagine my surprise one day when a couple of FBI men came in and walked her out in handcuffs.

Taking this to "Crimes we'd like to see"...

[Toothbrush]

Before I worked at my current company, the office manager was embezzling funds and using his company credit card for personal expenses. He didn’t pay at least one tax bill which resulted in a lien & fines, and longtime vendors weren’t getting paid. He was caught and there were basically no repercussions. He lost his check writing privileges & no longer has his own credit card (but will be provided a card as needed in order pick up lunch, coffee, etc for the office). He also got a raise and a higher % of the business because the owner figured he would only do this if he needed the money 🙄 Oh, and she bought him a BMW but when owner decided they needed to upgrade she bought him a Tesla and the BMW went to his daughter. Insurance all paid of course, and she had the building install a charging station for his Tesla. And she told a co-worker that embezzler is the only one who is not expendable, and that he is the only one in the office who has job security. Nuts right? Owner & manager have a long personal history (not romantic) so for whatever reason he can pretty much do as he pleases. It’s all supposed to be hush-hush, but my co-workers filled me in prior to me starting there. We’ve also had various internal clients based in our office for the past 6 or 7 months working on a project, and at least 2 of them have been told all about it. And he swans around the office like the cock of the walk. SMH 

[Annber03]

Wooooooooow. That is absolute bullshit that he's getting that kind of treatment after doing what he did. I feel like it's only a matter of time before somebody who works there blows the whistle and calls him and the owner out on this, and I hope they do. Somebody needs to hold them accountable. 

[CrazyInAlabama]

Rita Crundwell, Comptroller of Dixon IL embezzled millions.   The way she got caught is she was on vacation, and the substitute figured out massive amounts of money were missing.  I'm sure Dateline, and 20/20 covered the case.   It stuns me that she was released during Covid, to house arrest, at her brother's ranch in Dixon.   I was amazed that people actually thought that her money came from her Quarter Horse business.    In reality, that's a great way to lose a lot of money. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rita_Crundwell

I hate that embezzlers can get soft sentences, make no restitution, and go right back to their community.      

Edited April 17, 2022 by CrazyInAlabama

[nora1992]

Pam Hupp revisited, this time with the former prosecutor: the previews look good.

Update 60 minutes in:  I’m not a fan of the prosecutor at all, but this is so uncomfortable to watch.  Almost feeling sorry for the prosecutor.  Almost.

Edited April 16, 2022 by nora1992
Episode continues

[UsernameFatigue]

OMG, that prosecutor had hubby and me yelling at the TV, and wondering why the f**k she isn't in jail along with Pam. What a vile human being. I don't know why she wasn't sued by Russ's four buddies in his first trial for totally making up a story that they covered for Russ, even fabricating a theory that one of them drove Russ's cell phone back to him after he killed Betsy. I guess like Russ, they are not allowed to sue the prosecutor, which is B.S. when she totally fabricated her theory without a shred of evidence. 

Thank goodness the new DA is going after her. And we are to believe that three different police officers are lying about her wanting them to lie on the stand? Doubtful.

That may be the most annoyed bordering on mad I have ever seen Keith when half way through the episode, he told Askey that it was totally her job to go in a different direction if that is where the evidence led. 

Askey may not have killed anyone (at least not directly) but she is as low of a human as Pam is. Maybe one step above, but when you start at the bottom it isn't much of a step. 

 

[Annber03]

1 minute ago, UsernameFatigue said:

That may be the most annoyed bordering on mad I have ever seen Keith when half way through the episode, he told Askey that it was totally her job to go in a different direction if that is where the evidence led.

Keith was NOT having it with her bullshit, and I loved it. The exasperated look on his face after listening to Askey defend her belief that Russ is guilty... 

I also loved that clip of the new D.A., Mike, holding that press conference to openly call out this sham of an investigation, with him flat out stating this was more about ego and an agenda than doing the right thing. Damn straight. And Askey's sitting there acting all offended by that press conference and claiming she was "duped" by Mike, like, please, get over yourself. And she had the nerve to claim Schwartz was the one with the bruised ego, in that clip of her interview with Pam? Look in the mirror, lady. 

The thing that makes this pathetic investigation all the more appalling is that Pam absolutely SUCKED at covering her tracks. She left so many clues and signs pointing to her that even the most newbie of investigators could've figured out she was involved. But she was able to get away with this for so long because the people in charge of investigating this stuff were even dumber than her. I appreciate that the show said that Louis would still be alive were it not for the corruption and ineptness involved in this investigation. Askey and others like her can try and distance themselves all they want, but they absolutely have blood on their hands. 

Also, I said this elsewhere, but I was completely unsurprised by the news that Pam tried to pit her fellow inmates against each other. She just doesn't quit, does she? 

This episode also made me appreciate the casting department for the miniseries all the more, 'cause wow, they really did nail the casting and the look for the key players in this story. Especially Renee as Pam. She had Pam's mannerisms down cold. 

[UsernameFatigue]

I agree that I was shocked at how badly Pam covered her tracks, in both Betsy's murder and Louis's murder. For someone who was addicted to true crime/crime novels, you would think she would have learned a thing or two about what not to do.

And yes, as I was watching Russ, Pam, pretty much everyone once again after watching The Thing About Pam, I was also struck by the fantastic casting. Renee really did nail Pam, and deserves and Emmy nod for her performance. 

Edited April 16, 2022 by UsernameFatigue

[ridethemaverick]

I feel like this episode was one big flex for Dateline, as in, "We really nailed it, didn't we?"

And to that, I say yes, you did. Bravo!

Keith wasn't having any of Askey's bullshit and I loved it. I've never seen him that frustrated with a guest before but she deserved it.

 

[pasdetrois]

Askey's comment that she would put her morals up against everyone else's is deeply revealing. She's riddled with small-town judgment and personal superiority and brought that into the case. That monstrous ego allows her to try to continue to cling to her story.

Did the show ever portray where Pam's husband worked? What was his profession besides "flipping houses?"

Edited April 16, 2022 by pasdetrois

[TVbitch]

I hope Russ will find it in his heart to forgive his step-daughter and mother-in-law. They were in an impossible situation. 

I'm surprised the prosecutor was willing to be interviewed. Does she not even have the foresight to know she would come off looking bad. I did rewind Keith's eye-roll moment a couple times. : D

[iMonrey]

Quote

OMG, that prosecutor had hubby and me yelling at the TV, and wondering why the f**k she isn't in jail along with Pam. What a vile human being. I don't know why she wasn't sued by Russ's four buddies

I think they said she was sued initially but she was dropped from the lawsuit because of some prosecutorial immunity law, or something.

It's been so long since the original Pam Hupp story aired I didn't remember it at all, and I haven't watched The Thing About Pam either. This was a good refresher.

Quote

I'm surprised the prosecutor was willing to be interviewed. Does she not even have the foresight to know she would come off looking bad.

I guess it speaks to how delusional she is about herself and her own judgment.

[Keywestclubkid]

I haven't seen any evidence that would point to someone else!

and his eyeroll lol 

there is no way in hell she can say she is unbiased after all of that 

Edited April 16, 2022 by Keywestclubkid

[Guest]

38 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I guess it speaks to how delusional she is about herself and her own judgment.

After watching last night I hope the people who truly need a lawyer and see her advertising say “Nope.  No.  Not at all”. 

She really needed a lawyer to give the age old advice…shut up! 

[Keywestclubkid]

Question tho if she really thought that his 4 friends assisted with helping him murder his wife were they charged? And if not why weren’t  they charged? Doesn’t posing as him or going to get the arbys for him to have an alibi sound like Accessory to murder at the least? I mean  If she really thought that’s what they did  .. she just said meh? … there are soo many holes in her whole “story” in why she thinks he did it and prosecuted him … 

Edited April 16, 2022 by Keywestclubkid

[Cinnabon]

1 hour ago, Keywestclubkid said:

Question tho if she really thought that his 4 friends assisted with helping him murder his wife were they charged? And if not why weren’t  they charged? Doesn’t posing as him or going to get the arbys for him to have an alibi sound like Accessory to murder at the least? I mean  If she really thought that’s what they did  .. she just said meh? … there are soo many holes in her whole “story” in why she thinks he did it and prosecuted him … 

Exactly! WHY would these 4 friends take part in the murder of a woman they presumably liked? It makes absolutely no sense.

[UsernameFatigue]

21 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I think they said she was sued initially but she was dropped from the lawsuit because of some prosecutorial immunity law, or something.

It's been so long since the original Pam Hupp story aired I didn't remember it at all, and I haven't watched The Thing About Pam either. This was a good refresher.

I guess it speaks to how delusional she is about herself and her own judgment.

She was dropped from Russ's suit, but I don't think they ever said that the 4 friends sued her as well. She was dropped from Russ's suit because he wasn't allowed to sue Askey, which would mean his buddies would not be able to either. Which is a crime in my mind. 

What was mind numbingly stupid/prejudicial was that Russ's lawyer was not allowed to bring up that Pam benefited from Betsy's death and was the last known person to see her alive. BUT Askey was allowed to accuse 4 men of conspiring to help Russ kill Betsy,  with not a shred of evidence and a far fetched theory. The judge should have been disbarred as well as Askey. They both lost their reelections, but I don't think that was enough.

You should watch The Thing About Pam. It is fantastic. 

23 hours ago, pasdetrois said:

Askey's comment that she would put her morals up against everyone else's is deeply revealing. She's riddled with small-town judgment and personal superiority and brought that into the case. That monstrous ego allows her to try to continue to cling to her story.

 

Not only did she say her morals, but her education and experience. But it was stated that Russ's case was her first murder case. So no experience. Nada. None. Zilch.  Went hand in hand with her lack of morals. Nada. None. Zilch. 

Edited April 17, 2022 by UsernameFatigue

[Tdoc72]

14 hours ago, TVbitch said:

I hope Russ will find it in his heart to forgive his step-daughter and mother-in-law. They were in an impossible situation. 

 

I respectfully disagree. Maybe at first, it was a bad situation. But their attitudes should’ve changed once they had to sue for the money, and IIRC, it took a lot longer for them to see the light. That should’ve been a big clue that Pam wasn’t on the up&up. And then all the stories Pam was telling. I mean, did they ever hear Betsy say any of this stuff—that Russ was cruel, tried to smother her, etc. 

On most of these types of shows, it seems the immediate families hang on to believing in their accused loved ones as long as possible and sometimes despite all other evidence saying the guilt. 

I’m glad that they see the truth now.  But Russ still seems very hurt. 

[Irlandesa]

12 hours ago, Cinnabon said:

Exactly! WHY would these 4 friends take part in the murder of a woman they presumably liked? It makes absolutely no sense.

And her reasoning was that they were likely covering for him because they thought he was out with a girlfriend but it makes zero sense why, after he was accused of murder, not one of them would have changed their story and taken back their alibi if they were lying for him. 

I mean, she really thinks all four of them committed perjury.  This is where the jury lost me.  Did they just think they didn't really know what time he actually left them?

I got into a little debate in another forum about the justice system and I brought up just how often prosecutors/cops will not admit that they're wrong.  Askey represents the worst of the worst about this.  She doesn't even realize just how much her confirmation is deceiving her.  Blood on his feet but apparently not enough to be identified?  There are numerous reasons why someone might have blood on their feet.  Heck, we all probably get little cuts here and there that we never know about.  She doesn't even realize that isn't evidence. 

And I'm surprised they didn't talk about her relationship with the cop.

[JudyObscure]

On 4/15/2022 at 6:42 PM, CrazyInAlabama said:

Rita Crundwell, Comptroller of Dixon IL embezzled millions.   The way she got caught is she was on vacation, and the substitute figured out massive amounts of money were missing.  I'm sure Dateline, and 20/20 covered the case.   It stuns me that she was released during Covid, to house arrest, at her brother's ranch in Dixon.   I was amazed that people actually thought that her money came from her Quarter Horse business.    In reality, that's a great way to lose a lot of money. 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rita_Crundwell

Wow, that's a good story.  My bank got in trouble for not seeing the red flags! Now her "house arrest" is on a luxurious 80 acre horse ranch partially funded by her stolen money.  She's living her passion!

 

3 hours ago, Tdoc72 said:

And then all the stories Pam was telling. I mean, did they ever hear Betsy say any of this stuff—that Russ was cruel, tried to smother her, etc. 

 I know. We never got to hear exactly what the step-daughters said about Russ on the stand. If they made him sound like an abusive monster after he had loved and raised them as his own, I can understand his inability to forgive them. I think "bearing false witness" is one of the worst things you can do and if those cops talked teenage girls into doing that "to get justice for your mother" then they really should pay a big price for that.

[Cinnabon]

12 hours ago, Irlandesa said:

And I'm surprised they didn't talk about her relationship with the cop.

Exactly. Why ignore that part? Let the truth come out and let everyone see who she really is.

[chediavolo]

On 4/17/2022 at 2:54 AM, Tdoc72 said:

I respectfully disagree. Maybe at first, it was a bad situation. But their attitudes should’ve changed once they had to sue for the money, and IIRC, it took a lot longer for them to see the light. That should’ve been a big clue that Pam wasn’t on the up&up. And then all the stories Pam was telling. I mean, did they ever hear Betsy say any of this stuff—that Russ was cruel, tried to smother her, etc. 

On most of these types of shows, it seems the immediate families hang on to believing in their accused loved ones as long as possible and sometimes despite all other evidence saying the guilt. 

I’m glad that they see the truth now.  But Russ still seems very hurt. 

I think there’s more to the daughters much more than is being told here which wasn’t much. I’d like to see the original documentaries etc. but none of them seem to be streaming anywhere. 

[gaPeach]

What an absolute travesty this entire story of Pam Hupp.  This so reminds me of Making a Murderer.  Corrupt DA, lazy cops and abuse of the power of the badge.  I believe his sister's boyfriend/husband and the other nephew were involved but they were state witnesses to convict Steven Avery and the younger slow witted nephew.  And they were each other's alibi.  

How this DA thought she was going to come off good on this piece just shows her lack of integrity, moral compass and common sense.  How she believed Pam and her ever changing story and to this day still believe the husband did it is BS.  Her and her thin lips can just go pound sand.  The blood of Pam's mother and that innocent guy are on her hands and so many others involved in this case.  

Throw the Memphis Three into the mix.  Again, people in power abusing it and ruining innocent people's lives and letting the real killers go because of egos, stupidity or power.......

[Crashcourse]

29 minutes ago, gaPeach said:

Her and her thin lips can just go pound sand. 

Yeah, those thin lips spewed out a lot of stupidity and incompetence. 

[Cinnabon]

Just now, Crashcourse said:

Yeah, those thin lips spewed out a lot of stupidity and incompetence. 

On behalf of others with thin lips, it seems unfair to mention that, lol. But nothing about either her appearance or words did her any favors in that interview. She didn’t have to agree to the interview - I wonder what she thought she’d achieve?

[gaPeach]

Quote

On behalf of others with thin lips, it seems unfair to mention that, lol. 

So sorry.  I did not mean to cast any aspersions on thin lipped people.  Just her.  And I was totally distracted by them when she talked. I think I needed the distraction so I did not start yelling at my TV.  :-)