S01.E12: Rix Road

[Tachi Rocinante]

1 hour ago, LJones41 said:

Hmmm . . . I don't think so.  I think "Andor" had too many writing issues to accept this view.  But I did like it.

Weird.  That wasn't my quote.

[dwmarch]

1 hour ago, LJones41 said:

I think "Andor" had too many writing issues to accept this view.  But I did like it.

I'm curious as to where you found the writing lacking in this show. The one scene in that category for me was where the fishers freed Cassian and Melshi. But part of that was because I couldn't parse their weird pirate-speak into meaningful dialog so their reversal from kidnappers to liberators was too sudden to work for me. Then again, I would not have wanted to spend a whole episode with them either.

One thing I loved about the writing for Andor is that you can take the Star Wars elements out of it and it still works. You'd have to tweak a few things but you could set it present day as a spy thriller. But maybe that's what some people didn't like about it. Maybe it didn't have enough Star Wars in it.

I also loved that the show was clearly written by people who have had jobs in offices and industry. People who have had overbearing bosses and try-hard coworkers who don't know when to leave well enough alone. But I can see someone not wanting to watch a show about that. If I wanted to watch a show about work, I'd go to work, right?

[Tuggy]

10 minutes ago, dwmarch said:

If I wanted to watch a show about work, I'd go to work, right?

Or you can watch Severance 😉

[paigow]

47 minutes ago, dwmarch said:

If I wanted to watch a show about work, I'd go to work, right?

[andromeda331]

Wow, that was an incredible speech. I love her telling Cassian that she loved him more than anything he could do wrong.

 I love how despite Dedra's planning it all when to hell as the people rose up. Those were really great scenes. I always love seeing people fighting back against the Empire. Damn the Empire for hitting B2. 

Cassian proved smart by going after Bix and not falling into the trap. I love that he got everyone off including B2. 

I like Mon Mothma setting up her husband for gambling. That's really not too hard to believe of his character. 

What a great end to a great season. I can't wait for season 2!

[LJones41]

6 hours ago, dwmarch said:

I'm curious as to where you found the writing lacking in this show. The one scene in that category for me was where the fishers freed Cassian and Melshi. But part of that was because I couldn't parse their weird pirate-speak into meaningful dialog so their reversal from kidnappers to liberators was too sudden to work for me. Then again, I would not have wanted to spend a whole episode with them either.

One thing I loved about the writing for Andor is that you can take the Star Wars elements out of it and it still works. You'd have to tweak a few things but you could set it present day as a spy thriller. But maybe that's what some people didn't like about it. Maybe it didn't have enough Star Wars in it.

I also loved that the show was clearly written by people who have had jobs in offices and industry. People who have had overbearing bosses and try-hard coworkers who don't know when to leave well enough alone. But I can see someone not wanting to watch a show about that. If I wanted to watch a show about work, I'd go to work, right?

I had expressed my issues with the series in an earlier post.  And yes, the series had felt as if it came from the SYFY Channel, instead of being part of the Star Wars universe.  Technically, it's supposed to be a part of the Star Wars universe, so it's not surprising that some would criticize the series for this near erasure of Star Wars elements.  Even some of the franchise's most ambiguous productions still felt as if they were a part of the Star Wars Universe.

Don't get me wrong.  I enjoyed "Andor".  I would rate it 7 out of 10.  But I believe this first season had its flaws, which I have stated in an earlier post.  But what really bothers me is that so many seemed unwilling to accept that not everyone views it as a perfect addition to the Star Wars franchise.  I don't.  I don't believe the franchise has a perfect production to begin with.

Edited November 26, 2022 by LJones41

[Shanna Marie]

I finally got to watch last night (I was traveling for the holiday and wanted to watch in good conditions instead of huddled over my laptop). And they managed to both satisfy and surprise me.

I'd said last week that it would be amusing if everyone had set up a trap for Cassian at the funeral, and instead he knew what Maarva would want him to do and he was somewhere else, but then that would be anticlimactic if all the other characters were there and the main character was elsewhere. At the same time, I really didn't want to see Cassian walking into an obvious trap purely for plot purposes, only to make the narrow escape we know he has to make. They found a really nice way to get around all these problems, with him not really being anywhere near the trap. They had the tip from the informant but didn't find him there, and I don't think any of the people who were there to catch Cassian ever set eyes on him until he went to Luthen's ship. So the trap was a non-issue, and instead Cassian used the funeral (and the fact that everyone was there in hopes of catching him) as a diversion to rescue Bix. So, our main character was part of the action where everyone else was without walking into and narrowly escaping from the obvious trap.

I'd rewatched the previous two episodes before watching this one, and when that one officer kicked over Bee, I immediately thought "Power doesn't panic." I'm sure some other trouble might have gone down, since there was a bomb, but it might not have been the riot it turned out to be if the Empire had left it alone. Having to suppress what was said was a panic move that showed how weak their position really was. If they were truly strong, they could withstand criticism. Aside from the bomb, if they'd let the whole speech play out, most of those people at the funeral might have heard it, silently agreed with it, but just gone on about their daily lives. Only a few might have ended up being truly radicalized into taking action. But by kicking the little droid to try to stop the speech, they created a bloodbath that probably radicalized every survivor. That's one of those things that reflects the real world, where so often the violence is actually initiated by authorities panicking about possibly losing control.

There were a number of times I got teary-eyed, but the scene with Cassian and Brasso, where Cassian hugs him and just buries himself against his friend, like he desperately needs the comfort and human contact and that's the moment when he's finally letting all his emotions out, really got me, especially when Brasso then gave him Maarva's final message. Cassian's face, with the tears spilling from his eyes, was heartbreaking. Give Diego Luna all the awards. Next season, I hope they return to some of the flashbacks because I'd love to connect the dots between Clem and Maarva basically kidnapping this kid to them being such a loving family and him considering them his parents. I can't imagine that he was like, "Okay, guess you're mom and dad now." It would have taken time to earn his trust.

I wonder if Luthen had given up on the idea of killing Cassian after hearing Maarva's speech or if he was leaving it to Vel and Cinta. He seemed affected by the speech, but did it change his perspective, did he think Cassian wasn't there, after all, after not spotting him, or was he being a master manipulator and figured that he wouldn't need to kill Cassian, that if he was there and heard that speech, he'd find Luthen and then Luthen would finally have his man on board?

[Ohiopirate02]

6 minutes ago, Shanna Marie said:

I wonder if Luthen had given up on the idea of killing Cassian after hearing Maarva's speech or if he was leaving it to Vel and Cinta. He seemed affected by the speech, but did it change his perspective, did he think Cassian wasn't there, after all, after not spotting him, or was he being a master manipulator and figured that he wouldn't need to kill Cassian, that if he was there and heard that speech, he'd find Luthen and then Luthen would finally have his man on board?

I'm of the opinion that Luthen never really wanted to kill Cassian and that order was only due to Cassian being a loose end.  Luthen would much rather have Cassian willingly join his merry band of rebels than waste a man of Cassian's talents.  

[Shanna Marie]

2 hours ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

I'm of the opinion that Luthen never really wanted to kill Cassian and that order was only due to Cassian being a loose end.  Luthen would much rather have Cassian willingly join his merry band of rebels than waste a man of Cassian's talents.  

But Luthen left while Cassian was still a loose end, so was the hit off? Or did he figure his team would handle it or assume Cassian wasn't there because he didn't show himself? If the hit was off, did he anticipate after seeing Maarva's message that Cassian would end up looking for him and join? Or was it just that he was sick of killing after seeing what happened? At any rate, it doesn't seem like Luthen to leave a loose end like that and leave without knowing Cassian's fate, unless maybe he was just getting himself out of there before he got caught and before they locked down the planet or if he saw Maarva's message, knew how it was likely to affect Cassian, and figured he'd find Cassian at his ship.

I loved the little marching band and the fact that the theme music actually exists as a Ferrix anthem in-universe, but as someone who played flute in a marching band, I find it amusing that all their woodwinds seemed to be on a flute form-factor, played off to the side. I guess this band didn't march in formations, but if you're countermarching while in close ranks, a flautist has to stop playing and move the instrument so you don't get your instrument shoved into your teeth. If everyone in the band has an instrument held off to the side, you'd lose the whole band while countermarching. I hadn't considered welding my oboe to my flute, though. I wonder how that would work.ting

It was interesting seeing Dedra come so unraveled. She's always been so cool and collected, totally unflappable, so it was a jolt to see her so utterly terrified when she got caught up in that riot and feared for her life. It's easy for her to sit in the icy remove of the ISB offices and make life-and-death decisions about other people, but it's entirely different to find herself on the ground in the middle of the action.

I actually cackled out loud when Mon Mothma set her husband up to be the reason for any financial irregularities by dropping the hint in front of the driver she figured was an informant that her husband had a gambling problem. But I'm not sure why she would still need the money from the gangster enough to be willing to set her daughter up if she'd managed to explain the missing money.

[MrWhyt]

2 hours ago, Shanna Marie said:

unless maybe he was just getting himself out of there before he got caught and before they locked down the planet

that's what i thought, that he decided with the chaos and the obvious incoming imperial crackdown that discretion was the better part of valor

[dwmarch]

This is interesting, if true. Maarva was originally going to say "Fuck the Empire" but Disney said no:

[Cthulhudrew]

11 hours ago, Shanna Marie said:

I loved the little marching band and the fact that the theme music actually exists as a Ferrix anthem in-universe, but as someone who played flute in a marching band, I find it amusing that all their woodwinds seemed to be on a flute form-factor, played off to the side.

I wasn't in a marching band, so I didn't think of the oddity of that particular instrument in that formation. I did play a woodwind (alto sax) though, and thought the instruments reminded me of a flute but sounded more like a clarinet. Interesting what our backgrounds lead us to focus on.

[tkc]

On 11/25/2022 at 10:48 AM, Jediknight said:

When the funeral music began the Empire couldn't see them, and were panicked, but when it stopped that's really when the Empire should have been afraid.

Maarva in episode 3:

“Gets to you, doesn't it? That's what a reckoning sounds like. You want it to stop, but it just keeps coming. It's when it stops, that's when you'll really want to start to fret.”

Edited November 27, 2022 by tkc

[Zaffy]

so this is Star Wars' Deep Space 9.

the Bad: The lead. I cannot stand of him, the character and the actor. At the beginning I though this was a parody or something. Then I remembered  he was in Rogue One. I do not think they made a good job building his character. 

the Good: Most of all the rest. Ok the writing was sometimes stupid and not very original, but the whole nightmarish world under the Empire was very well made. Ok its soldiers are still mostly incompetent, but this is the first time I truly felt the evilness of it in a more realistic form. 
The ISB lady would be the MVP of the season if it wasn't for...

the Great: Wall-e/Bee. Of course they saved it and of course I am gonna a 2nd season for it, even if I will have to tolerate that insufferable Andor dude.

oh, and Stellan Skarsgård is amazing. Always!

 

[PsychoDrone]

Not a bad series.  I didn't start watching until a couple of fans of the series were raving about it.  By this point, all of the episodes were available so I could binge it.  IMO, not as good as Mandalorian, but better than Kenobi or Book of Boba Fett.  Those series were so bad, not really a difficult feat to accomplish.

Similar to any prequel series, much of the suspense is gone.  We all know Cassian is going to survive, so the "cliffhanger" ending is just silly.  Lots of good characters.  Dedra is very good as the villain.  Infinitely better than the inquisitor in Kenobi.  My one complaint is, are humans really cheaper, and easier to replace, than using droids to build the Death Star part?  Automation ensures accuracy, high production rates, and 24/7 work times.  Droids may require maintenance, but not to the level of people.  Droids don't have strokes, need breaks, and the Empire wouldn't have to worry about punishments, revolutions, or break outs.

I am looking forward to Season 2. It's too bad the series isn't doing better, but Lucasfilm, or actually Kathleen Kennedy, has burned the fans so much that people have given up on Star Wars.  Once she is gone, and a true Star Wars fan takes over, then it can return to popularity.

[snickers]

On 11/26/2022 at 6:58 AM, LJones41 said:

But what really bothers me is that so many seemed unwilling to accept that not everyone views it as a perfect addition to the Star Wars franchise.  I don't.  I don't believe the franchise has a perfect production to begin with.

I'm with you here, I feel in the minority to say I wasn't completely wowed by this, everyone I talk to that think this show is the best thing on TV right now and hands down the best Star Wars show, maybe I need a re-watch, but I just don't agree-

I had MAJOR issues with the pacing of this show, it didn't need to be 12 episodes, 7-8 would have done just fine and to hear they are going to do ANOTHER 12 episodes for season 2?????

Mon Mothma's scenes were SOOOO BORING! I cringed every time they showed her and her boring husband-it just seemed like nothing happened except setting her husband up as a gambler and getting her daughter betrothed.  

3 hours ago, Zaffy said:

the Bad: The lead. I cannot stand of him, the character and the actor. At the beginning I though this was a parody or something. Then I remembered  he was in Rogue One. I do not think they made a good job building his character. 

Sorry gotta disagree with you here, Diego Luna was the only thing keeping me invested in this show, we need to see him in more movies/shows like we are FINALLY seeing Pedro Pascal in things (not counting WW1984 😉)

I did like B2, but I like all the droids, the hubby called him, "the trash can looking droid" LOL

I'm definitely watching season 2, but I just hope they fix these pacing/writing issues (and make Mon Mothma relevant please)....but it was nice to finally an "adult/drama" Star Wars show on Disney Plus finally, but I'm still giving the Madalorian the number 1 spot for shows, followed by Wanda vision then this. 

[Zaffy]

8 hours ago, PsychoDrone said:

My one complaint is, are humans really cheaper, and easier to replace, than using droids to build the Death Star part?  Automation ensures accuracy, high production rates, and 24/7 work times.  Droids may require maintenance, but not to the level of people.  Droids don't have strokes, need breaks, and the Empire wouldn't have to worry about punishments, revolutions, or break outs.

This whole thing, "we have high tech - but we don't" is one of my issues with the series (and probably the franchise). 
But you know, robots factory is less drama!
I could get the post-apocalyptic/wild west kind of style in the Mandalorian, here it doesn't make sense. Ferrix has a lot of technology but looks like if nobody ever bothered to take care of it. They had orchestras and rituals etc etc, but their places looked almost like abandoned. When you love your place, as the residents of Ferrix did, you take care of it. But yes, I guess they needed the strong contrast with Senator's world. 
This is why I referred to stupid writing, or shall I say weak.

And  also, with this technology why you need Doctor Nightmare to interrogate prisoners? Torture was always a tool of regimes, but really they  couldn't have some kind of truth serum or an hypnotizing technique to get their info? They are building a Death Star ffs!!

7 hours ago, snickers said:

I had MAJOR issues with the pacing of this show, it didn't need to be 12 episodes, 7-8 would have done just fine and to hear they are going to do ANOTHER 12 episodes for season 2?????

I agree with you, they dragged the story a lot. I confess I Fast Forwarded a bit, especially Senator's scenes. And I do not have issues with slow pace.

[LJones41]

22 hours ago, snickers said:

I'm with you here, I feel in the minority to say I wasn't completely wowed by this, everyone I talk to that think this show is the best thing on TV right now and hands down the best Star Wars show, maybe I need a re-watch, but I just don't agree-

I had MAJOR issues with the pacing of this show, it didn't need to be 12 episodes, 7-8 would have done just fine and to hear they are going to do ANOTHER 12 episodes for season 2?????

Mon Mothma's scenes were SOOOO BORING! I cringed every time they showed her and her boring husband-it just seemed like nothing happened except setting her husband up as a gambler and getting her daughter betrothed.  

Sorry gotta disagree with you here, Diego Luna was the only thing keeping me invested in this show, we need to see him in more movies/shows like we are FINALLY seeing Pedro Pascal in things (not counting WW1984 😉)

I did like B2, but I like all the droids, the hubby called him, "the trash can looking droid" LOL

I'm definitely watching season 2, but I just hope they fix these pacing/writing issues (and make Mon Mothma relevant please)....but it was nice to finally an "adult/drama" Star Wars show on Disney Plus finally, but I'm still giving the Madalorian the number 1 spot for shows, followed by Wanda vision then this. 

I agree with you about Diego Luna.  I had enjoyed his performance in "Rogue One" and in "Andor".  In fact, I enjoyed his arc a lot more than I did the Mon Mothma arc, which struck me as a waste of time.  At least for this season.  On the other hand, I disagree that "Andor" was the first Star Wars production that was an adult drama.  The latter has always been prevalent in Star Wars, especially since "The Empire Strikes Back".  Sure George Lucas and Disney had shoved a few characters for the sake of the kids.  

When I first saw "A New Hope" as a kid, I didn't like it.  I had felt overwhelmed by it.  I had felt the same about "The Empire Strikes Back".  I found myself unable to appreciate the franchise until I was an adult.  By the time I saw the Prequel Trilogy, which I had no trouble accepting, I finally came to my own conclusion that despite characters like the droids, Ewoks and Jar Jar Binks; at its heart, Star Wars is for adults.

Edited November 29, 2022 by LJones41

[snickers]

My apologies I need to clarify-

when I say Andor being the first “adults only” show, I myself am referring to these Disney Plus original content shows-I don’t mean the original trilogy. Mandolorian is pretty adult but my Baby Yoda(I refuse to call him by his real name 🤣) keeps it at a fine line because they know the kids are watching. I just feel this show doesn’t really have anything for the kids to draw them in. 
 

I wonder if this is why some of my adult friends are loving it so much 😉

[Ilovepie]

On 11/23/2022 at 9:22 PM, dwmarch said:

Luthen made a rookie mistake parking his ship in the same spot as last time. He's lucky it was Cassian waiting for him instead of the ISB.

Thank you! I am late to the party here (busy holiday week), but I could not figure out how Cassian knew where Luthen's ship was - this totally makes sense now. I loved that exchange. I wonder if hearing Maarva's speech helped change Luthen's mind about Cassian. His little smile was perfect - you could see his wheels spinning on what he could do with a guy a like Cassian on his side......

This show was amazing. Tony Gilroy really knows how to amp the intensity - that funeral scene - wow. By the time the music stopped I was fairly jumping out of my skin waiting for whatever was going to drop! Maarva's speech - incredible, and yet, only the third best on this series! What!??? This from a franchise with such gems as "I have a bad feeling about this" and "Hello There". Talk about an upgrade in dialogue!

I don't know what Karn is doing with Dedra, but it is creepy and I am here for it. They are both awesome.

Mon Mothma - cold as ice. Her turd of a husband deserves whatever happens from this exchange.

Yet another "Climb!" - I think that should have been the name of this show. Still, glad Bix got out with some of her marbles intact. Glad that Maarva got to fight the Empire when Brasso started beaning people with her brick.

Bring on the next season! FIGHT THE EMPIRE!!!!!!

[MrWhyt]

On 11/28/2022 at 4:05 AM, Zaffy said:

This whole thing, "we have high tech - but we don't" is one of my issues with the series (and probably the franchise). 

Technology disparity exists on our world. I'm sure that there are people with cell phones and internet connections that are otherwise living exactly as people were 100 years ago in their area.

[Shanna Marie]

It occurred to me, after the fiasco of the funeral, in which they completely failed to capture Andor and lost Bix, along with whatever Imperial casualties there were and Ferrix getting out of control, Dedra is in for a demotion that will make Karn's exile to cubicle hell look mild. This was her operation, and it went wrong in every possible way while getting zero results. Maybe the Empire would do better to just back off and leave Ferrix alone. Their "easy" operations there never go well. They should also give up on Andor. Every time they try to crack down on him, things get worse for them. Without Karn's attempt to nab him the last time, he probably wouldn't have joined the Aldhani heist, so it likely would have failed, and he wouldn't have been sent to the prison, so the escape wouldn't have happened. Just cut your losses and leave this guy alone. He's not even the critical piece of the puzzle they think he is (yet).

Before this series began, it looked like it was going to be the "grimdark" entry in the Star Wars universe, showing how terrible life is under the Empire in a gritty, realistic way. And it was gritty and realistic in showing life under the Empire, but I also found it very hopeful, with moments of beauty. I love that it's essentially about community. Cassian may have "brooding outcast loner" vibes, but he's surrounded by community. He had family in Maarva and Bee. He had close friends in Brasso and Bix, and everyone else in town (well, mostly, with a few exceptions) seemed to like him. We never saw him pre-crisis, just hanging out with friends, so we don't know how that worked, but so many people were willing to help him and even put themselves on the line for him that he had to have a good circle of people who cared about him. Then he had to work with a team on the heist, and then he was the heart of the prison break, the one who was able to pull everyone together and then hand it over to Kino to run. Those prisoners had a nice community going. It wasn't the typical prison story with gangs and beating up the weak. They looked out for each other and cared for each other. And then we came back to Ferrix, with its civic organizations and community band, everyone coming together in mourning, and everyone looking after each other and making sure those who were most in danger could escape. I've seen complaints by some that this series isn't very "Star Wars," but I think the heart of the original trilogy was the friendship/family that formed among the main characters, so this idea of everyone pulling together, and that's what will ultimately defeat the Empire, to me is very "Star Wars."

It also struck me that in this season, Cassian went on an emotional journey similar to what we saw in Jyn in Rogue One (or, I guess it's the other way around, timeline-wise). She was taken away from her home as a child and lost family due to the Empire. She was an outlaw without a cause on her way to an Imperial prison labor camp and a bit of a troublemaker who didn't want to get dragged into the rebellion, but then when she learned more about what was going on she became a committed rebel, especially after encouragement from her dying father, who had faith in her. No wonder he got her (and was sometimes irritated by her). He probably saw himself in her, which reminded him of parts of his life he wasn't proud of. And we're back to Karn being ultimately responsible for the downfall of the Empire. Would any other rebel agent have dealt with Jyn in quite the same way Cassian did? No Cassian, and would the Skarif raid have happened?

On 11/27/2022 at 7:51 PM, PsychoDrone said:

My one complaint is, are humans really cheaper, and easier to replace, than using droids to build the Death Star part?  Automation ensures accuracy, high production rates, and 24/7 work times.  Droids may require maintenance, but not to the level of people.  Droids don't have strokes, need breaks, and the Empire wouldn't have to worry about punishments, revolutions, or break outs.

Droids might be cheaper than paying union wages and benefits, but here they're dealing with slave labor, paid in flavorless nutrient goo piped into their cells. The healthcare consists of lethal injection if they can't work, and they just bring in the next guy who walked on the grass or looked too long at a stormtrooper to replace him. It seems like revolutions and breakouts weren't something they considered. They figured the floor covered that. These don't seem to be violent criminals. Like I mentioned above, there are no gangs, there's no bullying. They all seem to be reasonably good citizens who are terrified to find themselves in this situation and are obedient. It would probably take about as many people to maintain and run a factory full of thousands of droids as there were guards, and they'd be more highly skilled and expensive than guards who seem to just be unskilled thugs. And then there are all the factories you'd need to build all the thousands of droids. When labor is cheap (or free), people tend to choose human labor.

[HawaiiTVGuy]

On 11/26/2022 at 4:09 PM, Shanna Marie said:

But Luthen left while Cassian was still a loose end, so was the hit off? Or did he figure his team would handle it or assume Cassian wasn't there because he didn't show himself? If the hit was off, did he anticipate after seeing Maarva's message that Cassian would end up looking for him and join? Or was it just that he was sick of killing after seeing what happened? At any rate, it doesn't seem like Luthen to leave a loose end like that and leave without knowing Cassian's fate, unless maybe he was just getting himself out of there before he got caught and before they locked down the planet or if he saw Maarva's message, knew how it was likely to affect Cassian, and figured he'd find Cassian at his ship.

My read on the whole thing was that the funeral was what they felt was their one chance at killing Andor and once it became a riot, that plan was out the window so they just had to cut their losses and leave.  Cinta and Vel were all packing up as quickly and thoroughly as possible because they knew things were about to get a lot more crowded with Imperials on Ferrix soon.

On 11/30/2022 at 5:29 PM, Shanna Marie said:

It occurred to me, after the fiasco of the funeral, in which they completely failed to capture Andor and lost Bix, along with whatever Imperial casualties there were and Ferrix getting out of control, Dedra is in for a demotion that will make Karn's exile to cubicle hell look mild. This was her operation, and it went wrong in every possible way while getting zero results. Maybe the Empire would do better to just back off and leave Ferrix alone. Their "easy" operations there never go well. They should also give up on Andor. Every time they try to crack down on him, things get worse for them. Without Karn's attempt to nab him the last time, he probably wouldn't have joined the Aldhani heist, so it likely would have failed, and he wouldn't have been sent to the prison, so the escape wouldn't have happened. Just cut your losses and leave this guy alone. He's not even the critical piece of the puzzle they think he is (yet).

Yup I was telling my wife the same thing.  None of the security guys really liked Dedra, she kept overriding what they thought they should do, and her only real ally (non-stalker edition) on the ground there just got himself killed, so all the security guys on Ferrix will love to point the finger at Dedra.  IIRC, these guys were initially brought in by the other guy, Bevins, so any loyalty would be to him, not Dedra.

Also, IMO, the ending was never designed to be a cliffhanger, it was just to end this chapter of Andor's life before he is fully committed into the Rebellion, and the way Luthen reacted, no one would think he was going to shoot Andor even without Rogue One, especially since Luthen had invested so much time and effort to track him down and try to recruit him initially.  Andor was a loose end if he had no loyalties, but now that Andor was committed, he is another tool of the enemy to use on them.

[Shanna Marie]

8 hours ago, HawaiiTVGuy said:

Yup I was telling my wife the same thing.  None of the security guys really liked Dedra, she kept overriding what they thought they should do, and her only real ally (non-stalker edition) on the ground there just got himself killed, so all the security guys on Ferrix will love to point the finger at Dedra.  IIRC, these guys were initially brought in by the other guy, Bevins, so any loyalty would be to him, not Dedra.

Now that both Dedra and Karn will be disgraced and out of their respective jobs, will they team up and become rogue rebel hunters, obsessed with hunting Andor?

Now I want the post-credits scene at the end of season 2 to take place soon after the destruction of the Death Star, when Dedra and Karn have managed to pull strings to get their hands on the reports about the Skarif raid, and when they see that Andor was involved, they both shout, "I knew he was the problem!"

[Penman61]

On 11/23/2022 at 11:03 PM, Bill1978 said:

My only complaint about the episode is the lame cliffhanger, it's not like Cassian is going to die and honestly I don't think the fate of Luthien would be considered a cliffhanger.

I guess I didn't see the ending as a cliffhanger. It was Cassian declaring he will either die now or become a part of the rebellion. It's the resolution of his season-long arc.

[Shanna Marie]

5 hours ago, Penman61 said:

I guess I didn't see the ending as a cliffhanger. It was Cassian declaring he will either die now or become a part of the rebellion. It's the resolution of his season-long arc.

Yeah, I think it was a turning point, not a cliffhanger. Not every TV season has to end with a cliffhanger (and I wish writers would remember that). We know that Luthen wanted to recruit Cassian, not kill him. He was only going to kill him when he went off on his own instead of joining the rebels and therefore became a danger. Once he said he was in, Luthen got what he wanted. And I kind of suspect Luthen was anticipating that. If Cassian was at the funeral and heard Maarva's message, it was a good bet what Cassian would end up choosing. So that moment at the end wasn't meant for suspense. It was showing us that Cassian had made a choice and was committed, which will launch him into the next arc that will lead up to Rogue One.

[7kstar]

On 11/24/2022 at 10:43 AM, LJones41 said:

I also had a problem with the series' pacing and believe it could have been whittled down to at least eight or nine episodes.  One of my main problems with “Andor” is that the writing in several of the episodes felt like padding.  As I have stated before, the first two episodes could have merged into one.  And the fourth and fifth episodes could have merged into one.  I also believe that the seventh episode could have merged into the eighth one.  I found the abrupt endings for some of the episodes problematic as well, especially some of the early episodes.  But despite my issues with the series, I still managed to enjoy "Andor" and look forward to its second season.  Perhaps it might feature better writing.

I found several issues with transitions, that created confusion.  The pace was off on some eps,

and then it would deliver it in spades.  The first arch seemed to be the strongest on a second watch.  The prison arch had some unbelievable moments that took me out of the story.  I felt that they did do strong character arcs, but some of the plot holes also harm the story.

On rewatch, I did fast forward through the bits that didn't work so well the first time. 

I think the show is stronger if you don't have to wait for the next one to drop, so it flows a little better.  But the writing was uneven.  The did a lot of killing off characters that they had made you care about.   Then it felt as if they just jumped without really setting up where it was going.  Hence my criticism about transitions.  Some eps did better on the transitions than others.

On the whole, it is an interesting story and worth watching.  I wouldn't even have a problem with watching season 2.  I would rate the weaker eps closer to a 6 and then the stronger ones jump to 8/9.

Most of the positive parts have been addressed several times. 

On 11/23/2022 at 2:47 PM, tennisgurl said:

I was about to throw hands when that bastard kicked my poor baby B2EMO, but luckily the good people of Feffix did it for me. That droid has been through enough, I am so glad that he managed to get away, even if he's separated from Cassian again. Also having been through enough is Bix, who looks about half dead now and even after Cassian saved her she is clearly very out of it, understandably so. Hopefully she can recover from this, I am very relived that most of Cassian's friends made it out. 

IA. I wish that B2EMO gets a happy ending.  Not sure we've seen such a sad droid before for as long as this one experienced.    The acting had several outstanding moments for this series.  It could be the flaw that they tried to do too much with the first season.  They did do some wonderful fleshing out with minor characters, so the potential is high that they can improve.

[Sarah 103]

On 11/30/2022 at 6:29 PM, Shanna Marie said:

We never saw him pre-crisis, just hanging out with friends, so we don't know how that worked, but so many people were willing to help him and even put themselves on the line for him that he had to have a good circle of people who cared about him.

I got the sense that there is no Andor pre-crises, just downtime between one crises and the next. He is always in trouble or mixed up in something, but his friends like him, trust him, and know that he is not going to target or harm someone he cares about or is close to (or any local of Ferrix). Most of his targets seem to be connected to the Empire in one way or another, so the people of Ferrix are more than willing to help, out of a sense of loyalty, but not due to any political motivation. 

[bethy]

On 12/3/2022 at 4:55 PM, Sarah 103 said:

I got the sense that there is no Andor pre-crises, just downtime between one crises and the next. He is always in trouble or mixed up in something, but his friends like him, trust him, and know that he is not going to target or harm someone he cares about or is close to (or any local of Ferrix). Most of his targets seem to be connected to the Empire in one way or another, so the people of Ferrix are more than willing to help, out of a sense of loyalty, but not due to any political motivation. 

I was thinking about this when I was rewatching Rix Road. Cassian clearly has good, close friends who love him and are willing to risk themselves for him. The hugs he got from Brasso and Pegla(?) were long and meant to be comforting to him on the loss of Maarva. He has deep connections on Ferrix. What I was trying to figure out was when that happened. I mean, he was probably 10-11 when Maarva and Clem adopted him; Clem died when Cassian was 13 or 14, then he went to some juvenile facility when he was 14 for - I'm guessing - attacking those storm troopers for Clem. And then I think he was in the military after he got out of the juvenile facility? (I'm piecing some things together from memory, so I may not remembering everything exactly.) I think Cassian is the kind of guy that people are drawn to and like naturally - he's got charisma, plus who wouldn't want to take care of the little woobie. :) But the timing of his life is kind of a mystery to me. 

Edited December 5, 2022 by bethy

[paigow]

On 11/27/2022 at 8:51 PM, PsychoDrone said:

My one complaint is, are humans really cheaper, and easier to replace, than using droids to build the Death Star part? 

The prequel trilogy proved that Empire built Battle Droids were failures... Palpatine realized that Clones / Stormtroopers were better... similarly, human slaves were likely more productive than droids... especially when tricked into thinking they could eventually earn their freedom...

[Raja]

6 minutes ago, paigow said:

The prequel trilogy proved that Empire built Battle Droids were failures... Palpatine realized that Clones / Stormtroopers were better... similarly, human slaves were likely more productive than droids... especially when tricked into thinking they could eventually earn their freedom...

What? Rogue One was the only franchise show I liked after The Empire Strikes Back before Andor and never saw the prequel trilogy.  but from the prison task shown Ford could have built robots that could out perform any human John Henry doing them

[LJones41]

Quote

On the whole, it is an interesting story and worth watching.  I wouldn't even have a problem with watching season 2.  I would rate the weaker eps closer to a 6 and then the stronger ones jump to 8/9.

This is why I would rate Season One with 7/10 or 7.5/10.

[Shanna Marie]

On 12/4/2022 at 2:01 PM, bethy said:

I think Cassian is the kind of guy that people are drawn to and like naturally - he's got charisma, plus who wouldn't want to take care of the little woobie. :)

I was watching some of the Rogue One bonus features, and in the one on Cassian, one of the producers was talking about the casting of Diego Luna and how he has this quality where the minute you meet him, you want to be his friend, and that was something they wanted for the character. It definitely carries over into the character. They were also talking about how he had a humble, modest quality that they wanted, that this wasn't supposed to be a cocky superhero kind of guy. He's just an ordinary guy who's been caught up in big events and eventually made the choice to do something. We saw in the series that he wasn't worried about getting glory or recognition. He'd rather not be noticed at all, and he deflects recognition to others (like letting Kino be the voice of the prison break, even though he was the one who planned the whole thing and Kino had only come on board that morning). People tend to like that kind of person.

It would be funny if he ended up really meeting Karn and even Karn couldn't help but like him.

On 12/3/2022 at 4:55 PM, Sarah 103 said:

I got the sense that there is no Andor pre-crises, just downtime between one crises and the next. He is always in trouble or mixed up in something, but his friends like him, trust him, and know that he is not going to target or harm someone he cares about or is close to (or any local of Ferrix).

In that downtime, he must hang out with Brasso, since that was going to be his alibi for the killings -- they were drinking together and he got so drunk that he fell and hurt himself and didn't make it home. It sounded like that wasn't entirely out of the question to be something that might have happened. There had to be some depth to their friendship to have the kind of hug they had when Cassian returned for the funeral. As for everyone else on Ferrix, he probably gets a lot of allowance as Maarva's kid. She's well-respected and liked and was considered a prominent citizen, so even people who didn't know him well probably were willing to help him for her sake.

On 12/4/2022 at 2:01 PM, bethy said:

I mean, he was probably 10-11 when Maarva and Clem adopted him; Clem died when Cassian was 13 or 14, then he went to some juvenile facility when he was 14 for - I'm guessing - attacking those storm troopers for Clem. And then I think he was in the military after he got out of the juvenile facility?

I'm also confused how his age fits into that. Supposedly he was 26 in Rogue One, but I think that was based on him saying he'd been in the fight since he was 6, and it was about 20 years between the start of the Empire and Rogue One. There's nothing else on-screen giving his age, though I think it might have been mentioned in the novelization (I read it when the movie came out, but I don't recall that detail). However, when Maarva and Clem found him, it seemed to be pre-Empire and he was older than 6. If he was from an Outer Rim Separatist world, he might not distinguish between the Republic and the Empire, since they were essentially the same thing by the time they got to the Clone Wars, so if he was orphaned at 6 due to something the Republic did, he might consider that being in the fight since then even though the Empire didn't yet technically exist. If he was around 10 at the time the Empire started, that would put him closer to 30 in Rogue One, so 25 or so in this series, which is a bit more believable than him being 21 here. I think Luthen said he ran away from military service, so he might not have served for long, which gives him time to have been on Ferrix long enough to have friends as close as Brasso and Bix. I kind of got the feeling he and Bix might have been exes who managed to remain friends even though the romance didn't work out, and thus Timm's jealousy.

[wanderingstar]

I'm usually meh on content from Collider.com, but this piece - Syril and Dedra's Relationship on 'Andor' Isn't About Love - is the best thing I've read on the Dedra/Syril connection as it played out in season 1. The concluding paragraph articulates how I've been feeling about the dynamic between these two:

Quote

Dedra and Syril’s relationship is less about a villainous romance on the other side of the trenches and more about how authoritarians depend on each other to affirm their ideologies and deepen their dependence on them. Dedra emboldened Syril by proving he hadn’t failed by pursuing Cassian, and in turn, Syril will embolden Dedra by showing her how he is made fearless by his fanaticism. By each of them allowing the other a way out of confronting the horrors their own allegiance reaps, they're pushing each other deeper down the rabbit hole of fascism, whether they realize it or not. What further terrors they'll justify together remains to be seen in Season 2.

That's what I see when they interact, particularly their interaction in the finale when he rescues her from the crowd on Ferrix. 

[Kel Varnsen]

How much of a badass do you have to be where you make a speech from beyond the grave at your own funeral and it ignites an uprising. The idea of regular folks just getting to the point where they have had enough and fight back is super interesting.

It was also hilarious that a guy headbutted a Storm Trooper and it actually worked. So not only can they not shoot but their helmets are also pointless?

The great thing about Mom Mothma burning her husband is it probably would do zero damage. Since his reputation already seems to be useless rich socialite, so it's not like also being a problem gambler is going to ruin that reputation.

On 11/27/2022 at 8:51 PM, PsychoDrone said:

My one complaint is, are humans really cheaper, and easier to replace, than using droids to build the Death Star part?  Automation ensures accuracy, high production rates, and 24/7 work times.  Droids may require maintenance, but not to the level of people.  Droids don't have strokes, need breaks, and the Empire wouldn't have to worry about punishments, revolutions, or break outs.

Maybe it's the kind of thing where you have to lock people up anyway, since at least before that super hardline law was passed you couldn't kill them. So if you are going to lock them up you might as well put them to work. 

[Camera One]

I was wary of Cassian walking into a trap, but this finale was plotted well.  Everything came to a head, but it was interesting to watch how things unraveled, mainly, once again, due to the citizens resisting quietly by refusing to follow the rules with the funeral.  The scene with the marching was sad, hopeful and tense at the same time.

Maarva's offscreen death was made up for by her inspirational speech, which was well written and kickstarted the climax.   I just wish Cassian got to hear some of it.

I must say it was satisfying to see Dedre getting trampled.  Too bad Karn didn't get knocked down as well.  

When Vel said she knew Sinta had to do what she needed to do, for a moment, I thought Sinta killed Maarva to get Cassian to come back.  I sure hope not.

I was surprised but glad Cassian successfully saved Bix.  I guess they planned to meet up at the junkyard to fly out?  But they had no idea there was going to be a riot, no?  They probably would have arrested Brasso for Maarva's inflammatory speech.

Overall, I thought this was a very well-made series.  The dialogue was strong and they spent time to develop the characters' daily lives and the world.  I can see where some would be impatient for the exciting action stuff, but I'm glad they have chosen to show the characters living, rather than just jumping from one battle directly to the next. 

I think I might end up rewatching "Rogue One" again in the long wait for Season 2.  In some ways, it was really nice not to know exactly what was going to happen, and who was a cameo and who wasn't.  But this season has made me curious about where everyone winds up (even though I've watched "Rogue One" before, I literally remember nothing except the ending).

Edited December 16, 2022 by Camera One

[LJones41]

Quote

Overall, I thought this was a very well-made series.  The dialogue was strong and they spent time to develop the characters' daily lives and the world.  I can see where some would be impatient for the exciting action stuff, but I'm glad they have chosen to show the characters living, rather than just jumping from one battle directly to the next. 

When I had complained about the series' pacing, I never made any demand for more action.  I just thought 12 episodes were too much for the narrative that Tony Gilroy had presented.  And I found most of the Mon Mothma scenes unnecessary, because she had no real connection to Cassian's character.  Certainly not in Season One.  I didn't need more action.  I thought the series could have benefited from better editing.

[Camera One]

If they edited it down to fewer episodes and cut out Mon Mothma's scenes, then there would be less of a wait between the more exciting action parts.

I do agree they could have tightened the story, but at the same time, it depends on what one wants from a story.  For this series, I appreciated that they slowed down the pace and included the more mundane moments that may not be absolutely necessary but provides either insight into character or insight into the world.  

I also agree that the Mon Mothma scenes were quite remote from the Cassian story.  Though it seemed like the series was also telling the story of the Rebellion and the different facets of it.  Mothma's angle provided another "in" to the Luthen character, and how one event had cascading effects on other aspects of society and government.  I think if the show was solely Cassian centric, it would have been more of an average reluctant hero plot whereas this show zoomed out and to me, that made it stand out.

[Orbert]

I liked how we got a look into the beginnings of the rebellion from several different angles.  True, Mon Mothma's story seemed only tangentially linked to Andor's (that tangent being Luthen), but it gave us some nice backstory regarding the rebellion and helped answer the question "Where are they getting their funding?"  Her meetings with Tay and Luthen at the very least showed us that it wasn't all black and white.  There were agents of change in the government and in places of relative power.  Similarly, even though Karn has been pursuing Andor since Episode 4, we didn't really need all of his scenes with mom and soggy cereal with blue milk.  But they added depth to the character and I didn't mind the detail.

The name of the series is Andor, but Andor himself is just the focus.  This is all about the rebellion and how it all started, and who the key players were.  I liked all the different stories all weaving together in different ways.

I don't think Cinta killed Maarva.  They dropped hints that Maarva wasn't long for the world.  She was hiding her meds and specifically didn't turn on the heat despite being reminded to do so many times.  Classic "elder person, final stage" behavior.  I think Maarva finally succumbed of natural causes, not long after spending her last energies to record that awesome speech.

[Shanna Marie]

19 hours ago, Camera One said:

I also agree that the Mon Mothma scenes were quite remote from the Cassian story.  Though it seemed like the series was also telling the story of the Rebellion and the different facets of it.  Mothma's angle provided another "in" to the Luthen character, and how one event had cascading effects on other aspects of society and government.  I think if the show was solely Cassian centric, it would have been more of an average reluctant hero plot whereas this show zoomed out and to me, that made it stand out.

The stories might not be directly connected, but everything is interwoven. Mon Mothma's trouble getting funding to the rebellion was part of the impetus behind the Aldhani heist Luthen recruited Andor for, and then the heist ended up making things tougher for her. Vel is also connected to both stories, with her being Mon Mothma's cousin and part of the heist team and ordered to kill Andor.

But I think Mon Mothma's role in this season was laying the groundwork for stuff that will happen in the next season. The series is about the development of Cassian into the person he was in Rogue One. Season one was about radicalizing him to the point of joining the Rebellion instead of being a lone wolf criminal with a grudge but without a cause. Season two is supposed to lead up to Rogue One, so their stories are going to end up colliding, and we'll probably see there's some kind of struggle over the vision of the Rebellion and probably Cassian having to pick a faction. It would be a bit of an infodump to have Mon Mothma suddenly show up on the scene a year or so later with the various problems she's having being explained. Better to set it up as it happens so it's more organic when it becomes more important to Cassian's story and to the rebellion as a whole.

Plus, her side of the story shows where the privileged class are in all this, so we get the contrast between them and the people in places like Ferrix. Most of them are comfortable because the boot being on other people's throats makes them feel secure, but then there are also big risks for those who try to do something, like with Mon Mothma feeling like she's living under constant surveillance and having to watch everything she says and does.

41 minutes ago, Orbert said:

Similarly, even though Karn has been pursuing Andor since Episode 4, we didn't really need all of his scenes with mom and soggy cereal with blue milk.  But they added depth to the character and I didn't mind the detail.

I think those scenes add to his motivation. The more extreme an action a character takes, the stronger his motivation has to be. He's going total rogue, risking everything for this obsession, and his mother and their relationship go a long way toward explaining how he came to be the kind of person who would do these things, why he's trying so hard to stand out and rise up in status. And it makes him a human being rather than a cardboard villain. You can feel for him even as you disagree with him.

[Camera One]

I rewatched the first 42 minutes of "Rogue One" and it didn't leave much of an impression yet, even Cassian.  The film did seem to have a similar style and scope to the TV show, so that felt consistent.  Many recent prequels or sequels are distracting because the actors have aged so much, so I'm glad they didn't wait as long to do this one.

[aemom]

I really loved this series.

We watched it 3 episodes at a time, which was perfect since it seemed to be divided into chapters like that.

The acting was fantastic and because it was such a slow burn building up the intensity and characters, they were so rich and you really cared about them.

I KNEW that they were building parts for the Death Star in prison so that end credit scene was so thrilling to watch. 

I'm going to have to watch Rogue One again. I'm really surprised we're getting a second season. 

[LJones41]

Quote

I also agree that the Mon Mothma scenes were quite remote from the Cassian story.  Though it seemed like the series was also telling the story of the Rebellion and the different facets of it.  Mothma's angle provided another "in" to the Luthen character, and how one event had cascading effects on other aspects of society and government.  I think if the show was solely Cassian centric, it would have been more of an average reluctant hero plot whereas this show zoomed out and to me, that made it stand out.

 

All this tells me is that Mon Mothma's character shouldn't have been so big in the first place and that it was unnecessary to focus so much attention on her family or career.  Judging from what I have seen, Luthien seemed more qualified to be the series' main supporting character, not Mothma.  The name of the series is "ANDOR", not "THE REBEL ALLIANCE" or "ANDOR AND MOTHMA".  Mothma's character WAS NOT that interesting to me.  I also believe she was a waste of time for this series.  I think reducing her character and eliminating her arc would have benefited the season and tightened the writing.

[dwmarch]

I keep finding more things to love in this episode.

In the category of fridge brilliance: I have seen many reactions where people criticize Brasso and Xan for loudly talking in public about Cassian calling in to say he was coming to town. Why aren't these dudes having a hushed conversation? But if we speculate that they have been working in heavy industry for most of their lives it follows that they would both be kinda deaf as a result so as far as they were concerned they were speaking quietly. They forgot that Nurchi with his young snitch-ass ears could hear them from all the way down the block.

I wanted to say Nurchi kinda-sorta redeemed himself by outing Corv during the faux-arrest. Corv goes barrelling through the Imperial line like he owns the place confirming his spy status and the next shot is of Cinta watching. But Cinta also saw him walking around with Dedra the previous evening so she already knew. Maybe the arrest confirmed that he was worth shanking.

Speaking of the previous evening, I also like how Disney kept it subtle but actually kind of explicit with Vel and Cinta. "Come away from the window" or in other words, Come To My Window.

Two moments with Cyril that I like in retrospect. First, when he tries to cross the Imperial line like he owns the place. Remember, not that long ago he did own the place (until it owned him, am I right?) and it makes sense that he would still have that cop swagger until he remembers that he had to turn in his badge. I also appreciate that at some point during the voyage he had a conversation with Mosk about Dedra. When Cyril says "it's her!" Mosk doesn't ask him who he is talking about. That would have been an interesting conversation to listen in on.

[jah1986]

Just finished the entire season and I really liked it. I'm one of those people that avoided the series at first because I've become fatigued with everything having to be "dark" and serious. It seems if anything is joyful or optimistic it's not to be taken seriously and has no meaning. I'm just over that type of entertainment. But, like others, a friend recommended this series and I'm glad I gave it a chance. It wasn't what I was expecting, in a good way. Cassian wasn't a favorite character in Rogue One but I liked learning more about him here.  Unlike some others, I really enjoyed all the Mon Mothma scenes. I felt her scenes showed that tension can come from more than action/fight scenes. And learning what people sacrificed for the rebellion was nice. Leia wasn't the only "princess" or person of privilege in the rebellion. Mon Mothma's story helped me understand why she and Leia got along so well (in the books).

Could the story have been tighter? Yes, probably one less Aldhani episode and one less prison episode but the show wasn't ruined for me by the pacing. 

I didn't realize there was going to be a season 2, very happy to find that out. Because there are still big gaps between this and Rogue One which I rewatched right after finishing episode 12. I understand some thought this show didn't feel as much like "Star Wars" as other shows, but for me it had enough elements for me to believe it's the same universe. Jedi and Force users can't be everywhere. 

Glad I gave this show a chance and will be back for season 2.

[Ms.Moon]

On 1/8/2023 at 1:49 AM, LJones41 said:

 

All this tells me is that Mon Mothma's character shouldn't have been so big in the first place and that it was unnecessary to focus so much attention on her family or career.  Judging from what I have seen, Luthien seemed more qualified to be the series' main supporting character, not Mothma.  The name of the series is "ANDOR", not "THE REBEL ALLIANCE" or "ANDOR AND MOTHMA".  Mothma's character WAS NOT that interesting to me.  I also believe she was a waste of time for this series.  I think reducing her character and eliminating her arc would have benefited the season and tightened the writing.

I liked the Mon Mothma character because she was integral to the development of the rebellion.  She believed in the rebellion so much that she funded it with her own money.  She was not just a leader in the rebellion because she gave nice speeches but because she believed in the cause so much she helped to pay for it.  The rebel ships, bases, blasters, paying snitches was not free the money had to come from somewhere and much of the money for the early rebellion came from her own family fortune.  Han Solo got a reward for helping blow up the Death Star where did that money come from?  We see the rebel ships, pilots and bases in A New Hope we see the people that get to be heroes but the money that paid those things, the people that built the foundations that the rebellion was built upon we never thought about it this part of the Star Wars universe expands on all of that.  Mon Mothma was that lady in white that gave Luke Skywalker an opportunity to become a hero of the rebellion but Luke couldn’t do that without her first believing in that rebellion and getting it off the ground.

[dwmarch]

In retrospect, the one thing I wish they had done differently with Mon Mothma is give her a loving family. Rather than a sleazebag husband and a daughter who just openly hates her, what if instead her husband was loving but just a little slow on the uptake? And the daughter was too loyal to her to say no even though she doesn't want an arranged marriage to a gangster? And then she had to sell them out anyway because she got into deeper trouble than she ever imagined. I think that would have been a much more interesting take on her than a husband and daughter who deserve to get sold out because they are always in a bad mood and have never done anything nice for her.

[Ms.Moon]

55 minutes ago, dwmarch said:

In retrospect, the one thing I wish they had done differently with Mon Mothma is give her a loving family. Rather than a sleazebag husband and a daughter who just openly hates her, what if instead her husband was loving but just a little slow on the uptake? And the daughter was too loyal to her to say no even though she doesn't want an arranged marriage to a gangster? And then she had to sell them out anyway because she got into deeper trouble than she ever imagined. I think that would have been a much more interesting take on her than a husband and daughter who deserve to get sold out because they are always in a bad mood and have never done anything nice for her.

Mon Mothma’s situation is a consequence of her marrying young.  She was basically married to the most popular guy in high school.  That guy peaked in high school and it was all downhill from there but she was not given a choice she got married because of tradition and she has use for her useless husband right now but honestly she knows people if she was tired enough of her husband she could have insured him to the hilt and have him “accidentally” fall into a sarlacc pit.  People grow up and grow apart that happens because people change but in Mon’s case her status itself is a trap.  Mon is in a difficult spot because she has nowhere where she is not wearing a mask.  The danger in her life comes from all sides personal and professional.  I love it because it shows that everyone has dangers of different variations going on.  Mon going off to lead in the rebellion is something that frees her in a way.  She was in a great deal of danger from the emperor but she was finally living her truth, she was a rebel from very early in the rebellion and by admitting it, by embracing it publicly she is free.  I don’t know what it means for her husband and daughter but she has to give them up and like Luthen said she has to sacrifice something for everyone else to be free in her case it’s her family.  

[Orbert]

That's all true, but I agree with dw; it would have been nice to have at least one family situation depicted as "nice" rather than literally everybody's home life being crappy.  The closest we got was Cassian and Maarva, and Maarva's gone now.

[Hanahope]

we may know that arranged marriages suck, but Mon Mothma's daughter is all for it.  so its hard to call Mon Mothma's actions bad or forcing her daughter into something she didn't want to do.  and if the husband opposed the marriage, he could say something too.  so Mothma is giving her daughter what she wants, and Mothma is getting money for the rebellion.