S01.E05: We Light the Way

[paigow]

12 hours ago, Constantinople said:

So Corlys thinks his son is just going through a phase? Laenor just needs to meet the right girl?

Drop him in Dorne with some Sand Snakes

[aghst]

7 hours ago, Lady S. said:

Of course Otto leaves unspoken the corollary to Rhaenyra needing Aegon out of the way is Team Green needing Rhaenyra and any children she produces dead.

Is that what Alicent is going to do at some point, slut-shame Raynera, accuse her of not being a virgin when she married, so her claim and the claim of her children to the Iron Throne are invalid and it should go to her son Agon?

Agon better be a good dragon rider.

[paigow]

11 hours ago, bunnyblue said:

And fuck Cole for going ape shit and killing a man because Rhaenyra turned him down and he can't live with his guilty conscious and rejection. 

Not totally true... he was threatened with blackmail and a future of waiting for Ser Douchebag to throw him under a dragon...

[Carolina Girl]

12 hours ago, AimingforYoko said:

I don't think it to be anything official. I just think she'll secret him out of King's Landing.

Take the Black?  

12 hours ago, ShannaB said:

I get Littlefinger vibes with Larys Strong. 

Yep - the first that came to mind to me as well!

[paigow]

Is Daemon still commanding the City Watch?

He could claim jurisdiction and CSI Ser Douchebag as a suicide...

[Uncle JUICE]

I thought the little scene of him killing Rhea Royce was...confusing. It's a crazy low percentage way to kill your spouse, I mean if that horse doesn't fall on her exactly right, then what? Better off just disappearing her. 

[paigow]

1 minute ago, Uncle JUICE said:

I thought the little scene of him killing Rhea Royce was...confusing. It's a crazy low percentage way to kill your spouse, I mean if that horse doesn't fall on her exactly right, then what? Better off just disappearing her. 

True... but there was at least one witness to confirm that she started hunting perfectly healthy and not getting lost. Better to have a ludicrous crime scene than an unsolved mystery that might not declare her dead...

[iMonrey]

I think it's weird that everyone seems to know Laenor is gay. I mean, I guess Mom and Dad might have walked in on him and Joffrey at some point, but is the news so widespread it's even reached the shores of Kings Landing and the ears of Rhaenyra? How would she know? She hasn't even seen her cousin in years, so the "news" must really be out there. And Westeros doesn't strike me as a particularly gay-friendly society.

Quote

Sir Criston seemed like he felt the creepy Knight of Kisses was either trying to blackmail him or hitting on him.  Is gay panic defense valid in Westeros?

This confused me as well, I thought I must have missed something because I wasn't sure why Criston went off on Joffrey like that.

Quote

I feel like the producers made a grave mistake here. Given all the ages of the four actors I think they should have started with Olivia and kept Millie. TV audiences fall for actors more than anything. 

Agree. It's much too jarring to change actors mid-season. At the very least they should have waited until Season 2 to do it. 

Edited September 19, 2022 by iMonrey

[Cristofle]

3 minutes ago, Uncle JUICE said:

I thought the little scene of him killing Rhea Royce was...confusing. It's a crazy low percentage way to kill your spouse, I mean if that horse doesn't fall on her exactly right, then what? Better off just disappearing her. 

Yeah, I was thinking that seemed oddly deliberate for a fall that needed to happen EXACTLY LIKE IT DID, which wasn't necessarily the most likely scenario. He seemed completely unsurprised by how she fell as he stepped on her arm to make sure she was paralyzed.

I still felt the tension of the scene as Rhea realized what was going to happen to her while she was still on the horse, but is Daemon somehow THAT good at predicting how a horse will fall and how the rider will be injured?

1 minute ago, iMonrey said:

I think it's weird that everyone seems to know Laenor is gay. I mean, I guess Mom and Dad might have walked in on him and Joffrey at some point, but is the news so widespread it's even reached the shores of Kings Landing and the ears of Rhaenyra? How would she know? She hasn't even seen her cousin in years, so the "news" must really be out there. And Westeros doesn't strike me as a particularly gay-friendly society.

I don't know, this is fairly on par with how everyone knew Ser Loras was gay in GoT. Rhaenyra grew up with Laenor, so she may have noticed even when they were much younger. It seems to be something that is tolerated as long as you're not very loud about it and as long as you do your duty to your House. 

[aghst]

Rhea seemed like she could have been an awesome character but Ryan Condal said her death was a brief sentence in the books.

So they made a short movie to give a sense of her character or a sense or what she could have been.

She speaks bluntly to Damon, taunts him.  But she also ditches her cousin who offered to go hunting with her.  She might still be alive if she agreed to let him come with her.

Girl might have been a little dramatic, a little high maintenance.

Edited September 19, 2022 by aghst

[Uncle JUICE]

15 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

This confused me as well, I thought I must have missed something because I wasn't sure why Criston went off on Joffrey like that.

Agree. It's much too jarring to change actors mid-season. At the very least they should have waited until Season 2 to do it. 

These two problems are sort of related: by having the giant time jump next episode, and no explanation for his not dying offered during this episode, how the hell do you explain it now? Should have figured it out before doing the time jump. 

That altercation is getting to be a way bigger deal in my mind than the show made it, I mean seriously. Doesn't someone have to answer for that guy violating guest rights? Either he instigated something toward a kingsguard, or the kingsgaurd went rogue and just killed the hell of out that guy for no reason. "He threatened the princess / king" is not enough to justify beating him to death when there's an entire squad of guards who could have subdued him and then tried him. Ugh, why did that guy get to live, I really hope this doesn't turn into Jaime Lannister surviving the loot train assault. SOMEONE PLEASE GIVE ME A THEORY THAT MAKES SENSE OF IT. 

[paigow]

13 minutes ago, aghst said:

But she also ditches her cousin who offered to go hunting with her.  She might still be alive if she agreed to let him come with her.

Daemon would have improvised like Jason Bourne... and staged a murder-suicide crime scene...

[Uncle JUICE]

Who's got lamer house words: the Hightowers or the Tyrells?

[Helena Dax]

I feel a bit underwhelmed by this episode. There were things I liked, most of them Daemon-related, but some characters came across as unreasonably extra, like Alicent and Criston, or stupid, like Joffrey. Lots of things felt forced, I don't know.

[Athena5217]

34 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

I think it's weird that everyone seems to know Laenor is gay. I mean, I guess Mom and Dad might have walked in on him and Joffrey at some point, but is the news so widespread it's even reached the shores of Kings Landing and the ears of Rhaenyra? How would she know? She hasn't even seen her cousin in years, so the "news" must really be out there. And Westeros doesn't strike me as a particularly gay-friendly society.

I think it’s not so weird considering 1) what a small social circle Westeros nobility is, 2) many people live under the same roof, and 3) there are lots of servants who will probably tell secrets for a price.

I suspect that for men of a certain status, it okay as long as they married and had heirs. I also suspect that for women, even royalty and nobility, it would be much less tolerated because women’s sexuality is so much more regulated. In GoT, Yara and Ellaria Sand were bisexual, but I don’t remember any lesbian characters. And those two women were certainly not part of Westeros high society.

People here have commented on Alicent having romantic feelings for Rhaenyra, but that is not overt. I’m not convinced her feelings are anything more than a result of losing her best friend then feeling betrayed at being deceived by that former bestie.

[Cristofle]

Just now, Helena Dax said:

but some characters came across as unreasonably extra, like Alicent and Criston

I understand that the show wanted Alicent to have a complex reason for ultimately turning on Rhaenyra, but this...was not it for me. She is overreacting, lol. She finds out Rhaenyra has a FWB situation with Criston and all of the sudden she dresses for war? Calm down.

[magdalene]

Daemon held up his gloved hand to the horse, did the horse rear because it smelled dragon on him?

How much did Daemon plan all of this? I am a rider all my life and have fallen off plenty in my time.  Using a horse to kill someone is a crap shoot at best.

[Uncle JUICE]

1 minute ago, Cristofle said:

I understand that the show wanted Alicent to have a complex reason for ultimately turning on Rhaenyra, but this...was not it for me. She is overreacting, lol. She finds out Rhaenyra has a FWB situation with Criston and all of the sudden she dresses for war? Calm down.

I didn't think her dress declaring war (lame, I'm sorry, but it is) was about Rhaenyra's side piece, rather about how she's not going to just have Aegon set aside as easily as all that now that there's a threat Rhaenyra may have a child with Ser Stupidhair. In my mind had more to do with what Otto said before he rode out (speaking of, you're the former hand of the king, they can't provide a carriage for you??? Can't wait until it stops raining? Wouldn't he have had to have his stuffed packed out of the Tower of the Hand?) about the specter of war over succession. 

[CouchTater]

12 hours ago, Bulldog said:

Did none of the many guests at the dinner find it odd that Laenor had such a complete and total meltdown over his "friend's" death?  Or is it one of those things people just wouldn't talk about?  In public, at least.  I'm quite sure tongues were wagging in private.   

Oh my gosh.  He did this weird crawl on his knees, with his feet in the air behind him, over to Joffrey.  I literally laughed out loud!

[cardigirl]

3 minutes ago, Cristofle said:

I understand that the show wanted Alicent to have a complex reason for ultimately turning on Rhaenyra, but this...was not it for me. She is overreacting, lol. She finds out Rhaenyra has a FWB situation with Criston and all of the sudden she dresses for war? Calm down.

For me it's more that Alicent thinks Rhaenyra lied to her, when she didn't. She swore she did not have sex with Daemon, which was true. That's all Alicent was asking about. Therefore she told Viserys that she believed Rhaenyra was innocent, and in turn the king felt he had to send Otto away. (That and Rhaenyra's vehement outburst about Otto's plotting.)

When she finds out that Rhaenyra did have intercourse, just not with Daemon, and that she (Alicent) contributed to her own father's downfall because of the lie of omission from Rhaenyra, she realizes that Rhaenyra will not be on her side when she ascends the throne. Otto's warning about Alicent's children being put to death and her realization that Rhaenyra is not above subterfuge sends her into the self-preservation mode. She wants it all, now, for her children.

[Uncle JUICE]

3 hours ago, paigow said:

Dude is going to Essos with a few tonnes of cinnamon....

This is the Westeros version of Mike Ehrmentraut's retirement in Belize. I will use this often now. 

[steelyis]

13 hours ago, Lassus said:

How much time is spent on weak, drunk, sick, sad-sack, predictable Viserys over endless far more interesting characters?

12 hours ago, bunnyblue said:

 Viserys would have been so much happier never being King. He just gets shit from every side: Daemon, Corlys, Rhaenyra, Otto, and now Alicent. Hell even the Maester sucks as caring for his health. Interesting the tension between Melos and Orwyn (?) regarding how best to treat the infected arm. Lyonel Strong seems to be the only one who gives a shit about Viserys.

I low-key love Viserys!

The whole episode he looked like he wanted to scream: "Please, please, can you people for five minutes just... Just not?"

😆

9 hours ago, Roccos Brother said:

I must have missed something, why did the horse flip out for seemingly no reason in the beginning?

Daemon smelled of dragon.

[Constantinople]

I'm not saying Rhaenyra should be named Girlfriend of the Year or Ser Loudmouth wasn't smug, but I'm having a hard time feeling sympathetic for Ser Criston after he beat Joffrey's head in.

From Season 1 Episode 3:
Rhaenyra: Were you ever betrothed, Ser Criston?

Criston: I had an adventurous youth when my father served at Blackhaven, to be sure. But my station was never high enough for a formal betrothal. Before I spoke my vows as a knight of the Kings guard, I could've married a common-born girl had I wished.

Rhaenyra wasn't Criston's first romp in the hay and Criston was experienced enough to know that sex and marriage aren't the same. 

Nor was Criston's offer much better, if at all, than Rhaenyra's. Either way he's breaking his vows. And if Rhaenyra said yes, how would they get by in Essos. I wouldn't expect a stipend from her dad which means Criston works as a sellsword. That's not much of a life even if he doesn't get killed.

And if he didn't want to marry someone common born, why should expect Rhaenyra to?

Edited September 19, 2022 by Constantinople

[Cristofle]

Just now, Uncle JUICE said:

I didn't think her dress declaring war (lame, I'm sorry, but it is) was about Rhaenyra's side piece, rather about how she's not going to just have Aegon set aside as easily as all that now that there's a threat Rhaenyra may have a child with Ser Stupidhair. In my mind had more to do with what Otto said before he rode out (speaking of, you're the former hand of the king, they can't provide a carriage for you??? Can't wait until it stops raining? Wouldn't he have had to have his stuffed packed out of the Tower of the Hand?) about the specter of war over succession. 

I think if that was their intention, the scene with Ser Criston where Alicent was still desperately trying to get an answer about whether Rhaenyra did the deed with Daemon (and then found out it was Criston) probably shouldn't have played out the way it did. She had that initial scene with her father, but she spent a lot of the rest of the episode seemingly enraged that Rhaenyra was no longer a virgin after all, rather than focusing on her son. They even could have had her distress fixated on the fact that Rhaenyra was about to marry Laenor (and therefore secure a much firmer hold on the throne) but it was all about Rhaenyra's sexytimes. 

I watched the fight scene again - if the intention was for Ser Criston to snap because he saw Daemon and Rhaenyra about to go at it on the dance floor, I wish they'd shown that, because they don't clearly show the beginning of the fight. The sequence goes - Joffrey says what he does to Criston, pats him on the back and leaves to return to Laenor's side (we see them together a second later), Daemon interrupts Rhaenyra and Harwin, they have their moment, Viserys looks horrified/furious, and then people start screaming. I'm not sure we even saw Criston react to Daemon and Rhaenyra. I can see that setting him off (as much as he's apparently very slow on the uptake if he didn't realize it before then) but we don't seem to see it. So why did Criston actually actively seek Joffrey back out when Joffrey had already walked away from him? If he wasn't set off by Daemon, was he really set off by Joffrey being kind of annoying and inappropriate? That seems...extreme.

Also, I missed in the first watching that Criston actually struck Laenor. Yeah, how is he not about to be executed? 

Daemon peaced out of that brawl so hard and so fast, lol. 

[Semiglued]

2 minutes ago, Constantinople said:

I'm not saying Rhaenyra should be named Girlfriend of the Year or Ser Loudmouth wasn't smug, but I'm having a hard time feeling sympathetic for Ser Criston after he beat Joffrey's head in.

From Season 1 Episode 3:
Rhaenyra: Were you ever betrothed, Ser Criston?

Criston: I had an adventurous youth when my father served at Blackhaven, to be sure. But my station was never high enough for a formal betrothal. Before I spoke my vows as a knight of the Kings guard, I could've married a common-born girl had I wished.

Rhaenyra wasn't Criston's first romp in the hay and Criston was experienced enough to know that sex and marriage aren't the same. 

Nor was Criston's offer much better, if at all, than Rhaenyra's. Either way he's breaking his vows. And if Rhaenyra said yes, how would they get by in Essos. I wouldn't expect a stipend from her dad which means Criston works as a sellsword. That's not much of a life even if he doesn't get killed.

And if he didn't want to marry someone common born, why should expect Rhaenyra to?

I don’t feel sorry for Criston at all. Some people seem think she forced him into sleeping with her? I don’t think she even seduced him. She offered herself to him and, with deliberation, he decided to accept. He’s the one who made vows he broke, not her. And I don’t think he killed dumb Joffrey because he felt threatened - he hated having the fact that he broke his vows thrown in his face and knowing that others knew. 

Up until this point in the show I felt like there was reply no one to root for. But I’m w solidly on the anti-Alicent/Cole side (assuming they team up after she gets him off for what was a crazy murder of an invited guest). 

[Cristofle]

6 minutes ago, Semiglued said:

(assuming they team up after she gets him off for what was a crazy murder of an invited guest). 

Which she started by being two places at once, I just realized. LOL. I guess the idea is that it's not happening at exactly the same moment, but it was still confusing that she was saying his name, cut to the wedding, and she's right beside Viserys as he collapses. 

[DigitalCount]

1 minute ago, Cristofle said:

Which she started by being two places at once, I just realized. LOL. I guess the idea is that it's not happening at exactly the same moment, but it was still confusing that she was saying his name, cut to the wedding, and she's right beside Viserys as he collapses. 

Yeah I think they do this sometimes, where they cut back and forth between two events for striking visual effect but those events aren't meant to be simultaneous.

My love for the Strong family continues; each member that we've seen plays perfectly to his strengths.

[mjc570]

1 hour ago, paigow said:

Not totally true... he was threatened with blackmail and a future of waiting for Ser Douchebag to throw him under a dragon...

I think he was also triggered by Ser Joffrey referring to himself as the "Knight of Kisses," thus implying that Criston also is a K of K.  I think that linkage was the last thing to set him off (along with the other issues, his humiliation, etc)

[HoneyBeach]

2 hours ago, Constantinople said:

Corlys: You flatter me, Your Grace. Though I do wish we could meet under happier pretenses. 
Viserys: How so?
Corlys: Daemon's wife, the Lady Rhea Royce, has passed.
Rhaenys: A hunting mishap. She was thrown from her horse. Her neck and skull both crushed in the fall.

Lady Royce's skull wasn't crushed before Daemon picked up that rock.

I kind of took this as Rhaenys saying this tongue-in-cheek. Like they all know, but aren't saying, Daemon had a hand in her death. They all know who Daemon is.

[mjc570]

36 minutes ago, Cristofle said:

I understand that the show wanted Alicent to have a complex reason for ultimately turning on Rhaenyra, but this...was not it for me. She is overreacting, lol. She finds out Rhaenyra has a FWB situation with Criston and all of the sudden she dresses for war? Calm down.

I think it was the threat to her children's survival - as explained by her father - that set her off. 

[LoveIsJoy]

Unpopular opinion I know, but I’m glad that they’ll be switching the actor playing Rhaenyra.  She seems to be an okay actress, but there’s something about her facial expressions that grates.  Especially that half-opened mouth thing she does.  Her eyes look vacant (to me) and she seems confused, dopey or something.  I don’t know, she’s just never popped on the screen for me like the actresses who played Daenerys, Arya, Mellisandra, Margaery Tyrell, Circe, etc.  

I do really like the actress playing Allicent and will miss her.  This version of Rhaenyra, not so much! Sorry.

[mjc570]

Did the show ever explain why Matt Daemon never consummated his marriage? I remember him saying something about his wife being hideous, but she really wasn't unattractive (not a young, blond relative, but still).

I wonder if he did it deliberately so there would be no heirs when he eventually killed her? 

[jeansheridan]

1 hour ago, iMonrey said:

How would she know? She hasn't even seen her cousin in years, so the "news" must really be out there. And Westeros doesn't strike me as a particularly gay-friendly society

They may have seen each other since the crabfeeder was killed. Also it seems like they were closer as tweens.  It may have been obvious then. I don't think it is that odd. She's never been slow witted. 

[Uncle JUICE]

3 minutes ago, mjc570 said:

Did the show ever explain why Matt Daemon never consummated his marriage? I remember him saying something about his wife being hideous, but she really wasn't unattractive (not a young, blond relative, but still).

I wonder if he did it deliberately so there would be no heirs when he eventually killed her? 

Can't get his...uh...dragon "rider ready," if you know what I mean. Problem with his...uh...red worm not wanting to, uh, take the sky, if you know what I mean. His...uh...blade...isn't exactly made of...valyrian steel, if you take my meaning.

He has dick problems. Just in case I was being too obtuse. :)

Edited September 19, 2022 by Uncle JUICE

[jeansheridan]

6 minutes ago, LoveIsJoy said:

Unpopular opinion I know, but I’m glad that they’ll be switching the actor playing Rhaenyra.

I hope you are right. The older actress looks so different and she seems a bit grating in clips. I just hope she has chemistry with Matt Smith. Oops. I think the actor uses they/them pronouns but I guess it's okay to use female pronouns for the character.

[sugarbaker design]

31 minutes ago, jeansheridan said:

They may have seen each other since the crabfeeder was killed. Also it seems like they were closer as tweens.  It may have been obvious then. I don't think it is that odd. She's never been slow witted. 

Rhaenys did mention to Corlys that they grew up together.  If they were indeed close Laenor may even have come out to Rhaenyra.

[paigow]

57 minutes ago, jeansheridan said:

They may have seen each other since the crabfeeder was killed. Also it seems like they were closer as tweens.  It may have been obvious then. I don't think it is that odd. She's never been slow witted. 

She also seems to get along well with The Step-Mother That Never Was so there could have been a lot of OMG Did You Know???  talking...

[PatsyandEddie]

I do think Alicent’s dress showed a deliberate “I’m putting you on notice” vibe. Otto telling her that her children could be in danger was definitely a catalyst.
There was also a quiet comment between the Hightowers when she was standing in the doorway that the colour of the Hightower beacon when war is declared, is green. 

[FormerMod-a1]

Does she even like her kids?  She always seems so put off when holding the baby and ready to give her back to the nanny.

[Lassus]

1 hour ago, LoveIsJoy said:

Unpopular opinion I know, but I’m glad that they’ll be switching the actor playing Rhaenyra.  She seems to be an okay actress, but there’s something about her facial expressions that grates.  Especially that half-opened mouth thing she does.  Her eyes look vacant (to me) and she seems confused, dopey or something.  I don’t know, she’s just never popped on the screen for me like the actresses who played Daenerys, Arya, Mellisandra, Margaery Tyrell, Circe, etc.  

I do really like the actress playing Allicent and will miss her.  This version of Rhaenyra, not so much! Sorry.

I'm sorta opposite in similar unpopular opinions.  Everyone loves Emily Carey, but to she seems to have one expression, discomfort.

Of all the time jumps where they could have used the same actors, this one seems to be it, but ah well.

1 hour ago, jeansheridan said:

I just hope she has chemistry with Matt Smith.

This is a great point, because Milly Alcock really does have this in spades.

[ursula]

1 hour ago, Semiglued said:

Some people seem think she forced him into sleeping with her? I don’t think she even seduced him. She offered herself to him and, with deliberation, he decided to accept.

The reaction to Rhaenyra and Cole is a good case study at how pervasive double standards around gender roles are. Because the sequence of events were clear and yet people still don't see it as at least sexual coercion.

She tricks him into her room. When he gives up trying to recover his helmet and he tries to leave, she shuts the door and bars it with her body. Then she uses the helmet to trick him into a kiss. He then tells her STOP. She smirks and starts taking off his clothes.

If their genders were switched - if it was the King's son that lured in a celibate female soldier into his room, locked her in, stripped her, and slept with her, would people still say "Well she went along with it eventually" or "she wasn't a virgin so what does it matter?" 

If that same King's son told the female soldier that he doesn't care she broke her vows, and when he's King, he can keep having sex with her for as long as he wants... will people think she's crazy for not being happy with that?

[aghst]

How much older are they suppose to be, like in their 30s?

Raynera will have children?

[Semiglued]

3 minutes ago, ursula said:

The reaction to Rhaenyra and Cole is a good case study at how pervasive double standards around gender roles are. Because the sequence of events were clear and yet people still don't see it as at least sexual coercion.

She tricks him into her room. When he gives up trying to recover his helmet and he tries to leave, she shuts the door and bars it with her body. Then she uses the helmet to trick him into a kiss. He then tells her STOP. She smirks and starts taking off his clothes.

If their genders were switched - if it was the King's son that lured in a celibate female soldier into his room, locked her in, stripped her, and slept with her, would people still say "Well she went along with it eventually" or "she wasn't a virgin so what does it matter?" 

If that same King's son told the female soldier that he doesn't care she broke her vows, and when he's King, he can keep having sex with her for as long as he wants... will people think she's crazy for not being happy with that?

It’s almost as if gender influences power dynamics even when the female is heir to the throne. In any case, not a big fan of people claiming things are “clear” just because they want to support their own interpretation. It’s a cheap way to argue. Criston deliberated his decision, his choice to sleep with her. 

[Dac22]

59 minutes ago, ursula said:

The reaction to Rhaenyra and Cole is a good case study at how pervasive double standards around gender roles are. Because the sequence of events were clear and yet people still don't see it as at least sexual coercion.

I also think it's a case for a lot of people where they like Rhaenyra, so therefore they either twist the narrative to make her look better and/or ignore it completely. People do that for all characters.

If Rhaenyra had an ounce of respect or concern for him, she never would have put Criston in that place to begin with. 

58 minutes ago, aghst said:

How much older are they suppose to be, like in their 30s?

Raynera will have children?

Rhaenyra and Alicent should be around 28 at the next time-skip.

53 minutes ago, Semiglued said:

Criston deliberated his decision, his choice to sleep with her. 

His initial choice was to leave the room which she took away. His second choice was to tell her to stop which she didn't.

Your argument seemingly is that someone's first two decisions/choices in the situation are completely invalid simply because another person ignores them.  Which, frankly, is messed up to me.

All his choices were valid and he should have been allowed to leave when he wanted to leave.

Edited September 19, 2022 by Dac22

[racked]

One thing I wonder about is why Daemon didn’t kill his wife sooner, before he tried to get Viserys to let him marry Rhaenyra. If he was going to do it anyway, seems like an easier sell when he’s single than letting him take her as a second wife. 

[jeansheridan]

4 minutes ago, Dac22 said:

Your argument is that someone's first two decisions/choices in the situation are completely invalid simply because another person took them away.  Which, frankly, is messed up to me.

He said no twice. It was coercion.  I think about Dany with her lover before she came to Westeros and how more balanced it felt. 

[Dac22]

5 minutes ago, jeansheridan said:

He said no twice. It was coercion.  I think about Dany with her lover before she came to Westeros and how more balanced it felt. 

I just don't understand the logic behind the idea that him trying to bolt from the room when he caught on to what she was doing is somehow deliberation or hesitation on his part. 

How is that not a firm choice he made that she ignored when blocking his exit?

I'm open to being swayed, but every counterpoint has basically been 'because I like Rhaenyra'. I like the character as well, but can acknowledge her character messed up there.

Edited September 19, 2022 by Dac22

[Helena Dax]

1 hour ago, Uncle JUICE said:

Can't get his...uh...dragon "rider ready," if you know what I mean. Problem with his...uh...red worm not wanting to, uh, take the sky, if you know what I mean. His...uh...blade...isn't exactly made of...valyrian steel, if you take my meaning.

He has dick problems. Just in case I was being too obtuse. :)

Not sure about that, he used to have a lover and while I'm not sure they were having sex in last episode, back in episode one and two it looked like their relationship included sex.

[Affogato]

4 hours ago, Constantinople said:

Corlys: You flatter me, Your Grace. Though I do wish we could meet under happier pretenses. 
Viserys: How so?
Corlys: Daemon's wife, the Lady Rhea Royce, has passed.
Rhaenys: A hunting mishap. She was thrown from her horse. Her neck and skull both crushed in the fall.

Lady Royce's skull wasn't crushed before Daemon picked up that rock.

The back of the skull could have been and it would have been awkward to make hitting her with a rock look accidental and in line with original injuries.  
 

i think it is interesting if Daemon does indeed make any crime he is accused of his own. He is an ambiguous character and this would be in line. Oh, He killed her. He makes an odd little gesture and the horse freaks. He probably signaled his hidden dragon. The rock? Maybe but she was dead or worse anyway. 
and killing her with the rock would have been a kindness. 

Edited September 19, 2022 by Affogato

[DigitalCount]

Just now, Helena Dax said:

Not sure about that, he used to have a lover and while I'm not sure they were having sex in last episode, back in episode one and two it looked like their relationship included sex.

Honestly it seemed like he was having performance issues earlier in the series with Mysaria too.