S02.E05: The Tell

[luvly]

3 hours ago, grandmabegum said:

Not verbatim, but what I remember is Oliver gave some explanation about how he was stuck under a bridge surround by vigilantes. It. was. odd.

He said, "Sorry, but you've been found guilty by a vigilante mob of bridge-and-tunnel lunatics."

Bridge-and-tunnel is New Yorker/Manhattanite slang for the people who commute there, via bridges and tunnels, for work and/or social events. Basically, locals vs outsiders.

[paigow]

What else sounds like 14?

4D:

Who lives there?

Bra size of killer

[Kiddvideo]

Was I the only one who said, “Fawn Hall” at the same time as Oliver and Charles? I can’t imagine the media craze about her appearance happening today.

[Haleth]

On 7/19/2022 at 2:45 AM, phalange said:

Figures that whoever Bunny had lunch with was facing away from the security camera,

Couldn't they have rewound the video to see him walk in?

Schools having people take dna tests is an incredible invasion of privacy.  Poor Oliver.  What a shock for him.

22 hours ago, dovegrey said:

Super strange the fans were at the restaurant in this episode, right?

Oh, wait.  Those were the super fans from last season?  I didn't make that connection.  Add them to the suspects!

Ah, NYC in the 70s!  Good times, good times.

[cardigirl]

I thought the DNA test that Will and Oliver participated in was for a science project Will's son was doing. It was their idea to do it, and not at the school's request. Will was "helping" his son, and promised his wife that he would make his son do at least some of the project. 

Edited July 20, 2022 by cardigirl

[shapeshifter]

1 hour ago, paigow said:

What else sounds like 14?

“leonORa, LEoNora”?

[DoctorAtomic]

1 hour ago, Kiddvideo said:

Was I the only one who said, “Fawn Hall” at the same time as Oliver and Charles? I can’t imagine the media craze about her appearance happening today.

The whole thing would be bonkers with social media today. 

1 hour ago, cardigirl said:

I thought the DNA test that Will and Oliver participated in was for a science project Will's son was doing. It was their idea to do it, and not at the school's request. Will was "helping" his son, and promised his wife that he would make his son do at least some of the project. 

They were going through old pictures and stuff, so I bet that was the actual project, and Will & fam probably said, 'hey let's do a dna test while we're at it.'

[grandmabegum]

8 hours ago, luvly said:

He said, "Sorry, but you've been found guilty by a vigilante mob of bridge-and-tunnel lunatics."

Bridge-and-tunnel is New Yorker/Manhattanite slang for the people who commute there, via bridges and tunnels, for work and/or social events. Basically, locals vs outsiders.

Ah, thank you so much. I only really remembered some key words and that he made some BS up to eliminate Charles. But hey, at least Charles got pretzels!

[FGomez]

1 hour ago, shapeshifter said:

What else sounds like 14?

The most straightforward meaning of "14 passage" to me is that the killer went through the passage to floor 14

[chaifan]

First, I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought 70's era Charles looked a lot like Bunny!  That was the first thing that came to my mind in that segment.

I my opinion, Oliver had to knowingly give Alice the Son of Sam card.  That was the whole point of him having the group play the game - was to see if he could catch Alice in a lie.  Whoever has the Son of Sam card has to be constantly lying, so it gave him the opportunity to watch her and figure out her tell.  I did love the addition of the bowl of drugs, possibly also from the 70's.  And I personally loved the going back and forth between 70's era and today during that scene.  I thought that was brilliant! 

What I don't get about the game, is that everyone has one hand into the center, and the SoS card holder has to pinch someone for them to die.  Wouldn't it be pretty obvious that SoS is within 1-2 persons of the dead person?  What am I missing here?

Also, what bothered me most about the end, with the showing of the Son of Sam card in Alice's bag was that she just ruined a vintage card deck!  The game is useless without that card. 

I really really hope Charles is playing Jan, but I don't think so.  His expressions during that last phone call were so sweet, and it looked like he was genuinely in love.  Yeah, he's an actor, but no one else was in the room.  I'm hoping I'm wrong about this.

Oh, the classic Chekov's DNA test - introduce it in Act I, and it will reappear by Act III...   Yeah, I wasn't crazy about the Oliver/Will DNA B plot.  Maybe it ties into things later, somehow???  But if not, what's the point?  Will is such a minor part of this show.  I like that it establishes how far back Oliver and Teddy go, which gives some insight into the profanity laden threat Teddy issued earlier in the season.  (And why it was directed at Oliver, not the rest.)  But still, what's the point?

[grandmabegum]

4 minutes ago, chaifan said:

Also, what bothered me most about the end, with the showing of the Son of Sam card in Alice's bag was that she just ruined a vintage card deck!  The game is useless without that card. 

Yeah, my first thought was how pissed Oliver would be about the missing card. Question is when will he go through the deck to find it missing.

[cardigirl]

27 minutes ago, chaifan said:

Oh, the classic Chekov's DNA test - introduce it in Act I, and it will reappear by Act III...   Yeah, I wasn't crazy about the Oliver/Will DNA B plot.  Maybe it ties into things later, somehow???  But if not, what's the point?  Will is such a minor part of this show.  I like that it establishes how far back Oliver and Teddy go, which gives some insight into the profanity laden threat Teddy issued earlier in the season.  (And why it was directed at Oliver, not the rest.)  But still, what's the point?

Last season, there was speculation about Will being involved in Tim's murder, because he knew Mabel from when she would visit the Arconia as a young girl. He even told his father that she was bad news. He kept trying to get his father to give up the podcast. At the end of the season he told him he was proud of him, so maybe he was just given enough suspicious behavior for the audience to think about him, a little. 

Theo was a minor, minor character until The Boy from 6B episode, and then he became a BIG part of the story. 

I have some concerns about Will, and I hope they are unfounded. It's going to be awful enough if he is not Oliver's bio kid. 

[dovegrey]

24 minutes ago, chaifan said:

What I don't get about the game, is that everyone has one hand into the center, and the SoS card holder has to pinch someone for them to die.  Wouldn't it be pretty obvious that SoS is within 1-2 persons of the dead person?  What am I missing here?

Also, what bothered me most about the end, with the showing of the Son of Sam card in Alice's bag was that she just ruined a vintage card deck!  The game is useless without that card.

I had the same thought about the proximity between people and didn't understand how the killer was supposed to stay hidden for so long. The people packed in next to the killer would also certainly feel the killer move, albeit with disorientation from it being dark (and the drugs, I guess). I figured it would work better without the hands and more as free-roam mingle with the lights suddenly going off.

Alice secretly having the Son of Sam card and giving Oliver a fake card doesn't make any sense to me as a convincing lie. It was a cool TV moment but it doesn't really hold up, IMO. As others have noted, Mabel should have instantly realized that Alice was lying, since Mabel knew Mabel wasn't Son of Sam and there was no one left but Alice. And there's a high risk that night of Oliver re-organizing the deck and making sure the Son of Sam card wasn't mixed in randomly (as the one card that always needs to be distributed), but, when it's not there, then...

Generally, I also don't remember Oliver being good at detecting lies or picking up on tells, at least the way he was depicted in the flashbacks and during the party. Where were these micro skills last season? It was fun but I questioned that.

[shapeshifter]

4 hours ago, chaifan said:

I my opinion, Oliver had to knowingly give Alice the Son of Sam card.  That was the whole point of him having the group play the game - was to see if he could catch Alice in a lie.  Whoever has the Son of Sam card has to be constantly lying, so it gave him the opportunity to watch her and figure out her tell. 

Right. That does make sense:
Oliver setting up the game to observe Alice's "tell," and anyone would have a tell, even if only for little white lies, for which Mabel later gives examples.
 

4 hours ago, chaifan said:

I did love the addition of the bowl of drugs, possibly also from the 70's. 

Really? I was a little horrified at the idea of Oliver roofying them.
IDK. What color are Good N Plenty candies these days? 
 

I still need to rewatch this episode.
 

Edited July 20, 2022 by shapeshifter

[grandmabegum]

41 minutes ago, chaifan said:

What I don't get about the game, is that everyone has one hand into the center, and the SoS card holder has to pinch someone for them to die.  Wouldn't it be pretty obvious that SoS is within 1-2 persons of the dead person?  What am I missing here?

I've actually played similar games where you sort of walk around and do the pinching (lights on] so you have to be discreet. For whatever reason, when they did the hands in, I assumed that the hand they put in did the pinching. I don't know why I thought that cause then you wouldn't be able to pick out your victim specifically, but maybe that was the point. It didn't matter who you killed just that you killed someone.

[dovegrey]

43 minutes ago, chaifan said:

Oh, the classic Chekov's DNA test - introduce it in Act I, and it will reappear by Act III...   Yeah, I wasn't crazy about the Oliver/Will DNA B plot.  Maybe it ties into things later, somehow???  But if not, what's the point?  Will is such a minor part of this show.  I like that it establishes how far back Oliver and Teddy go, which gives some insight into the profanity laden threat Teddy issued earlier in the season.  (And why it was directed at Oliver, not the rest.)  But still, what's the point?

Sorry to quote you twice; I just re-read and caught this. I think that Teddy directly threatened Oliver and not the others (yet?) because their apparent friendship goes back so far. It's one thing to be accused of murder by two randos, but it's a deep betrayal to be accused of murder by a long-time friend. Just like it's a deep betrayal to sleep with your friend's wife and hide the true paternity of a child for decades.

Someone said this in another thread (last week's I think) but it seems like the theme of this season is fathers, with the story about Charles' father, Lucy seeking Charles as a father figure, Theo disavowing Teddy, and now Oliver realizing that Will isn't biologically his son. The character backstory stuff that seemed completely unrelated to the murder plot was one of my main gripes about last season, and I can't say I'm anymore invested in it this year, but maybe it will actually go somewhere or tie into a series-long arc.

[shapeshifter]

4 minutes ago, dovegrey said:

Someone said this in another thread (last week's I think) but it seems like the theme of this season is fathers, with the story about Charles' father, Lucy seeking Charles as a father figure, Theo disavowing Teddy, and now Oliver realizing that Will isn't biologically his son.

Also Charles as a "father" to Lucy. Any others?

[DoctorAtomic]

I don't recall if Oliver told the group to close their eyes too. I mean, you have to buy into the game if you are playing fair. If they all put their hands in and each time the circle is different, then you're not really going to know who it is. 

I take the point of Oliver slipping Alice the card on purpose because he and Charles had an agenda, but I would think he would still pile on at that point when she showed the other card - No, you're still lying because I slipped you the card! 

I don't think in general Oliver routinely slipped the card when he played the game in the past. 

[MollyB]

On 7/19/2022 at 8:22 AM, grandmabegum said:

I could be wrong, but I think the timeline is messed up. She meets with the mystery dinner the day before her death and the courtyard confrontation happens the day of her death.

Bunny gets a call about the painting (on the day of her death) and presumably the dinner the day before was with someone interested in the painting.  I haven't seen anything to indicate Marv knew about or was interested in the painting until after the murder when it is mentioned in the podcast.  I also can't imagine Bunny sitting down to a meal with Marv and/or the substitute waiter describing him as her friend. 

Of course, if the painting has nothing to do with the murder, then it could be Marv in a pissed off mood. But how would he know to put the painting in Charles' apartment?

[MollyB]

On 7/19/2022 at 8:33 AM, dovegrey said:

But since Marv said he did mold removal for the building in this episode, he and Bunny must have known each other in at least a business capacity.

I don't think Bunny came face to face with the maintenance people for the building.  That's what Gut Milk lady is for.  She handled the elevator inspections and presented the invoice to Bunny.  I think Bunny didn't like him because he was associated with the Podcast fan club and was selling merch.

[dovegrey]

15 minutes ago, MollyB said:

Bunny gets a call about the painting (on the day of her death) and presumably the dinner the day before was with someone interested in the painting.  I haven't seen anything to indicate Marv knew about or was interested in the painting until after the murder when it is mentioned in the podcast.  I also can't imagine Bunny sitting down to a meal with Marv and/or the substitute waiter describing him as her friend. 

Of course, if the painting has nothing to do with the murder, then it could be Marv in a pissed off mood. But how would he know to put the painting in Charles' apartment?

The regular waiter assumed it was a friend. The substitute waiter wasn't shown on screen and didn't describe anything. I took it as the substitute waiter said Bunny was with someone different, and the regular waiter used "friend" as a polite descriptor. Bunny told the regular waiter, "Oh, no. Not coming. And not my friend."

I wouldn't be surprised if Marv, murderer or not, has been hanging out in the passages to eavesdrop and learn about the podcast. Some fans get extreme, and he has access to the building. All he'd need to do is overhear Bunny (right by Mabel's apartment, where a superfan might want to eavesdrop) talking about having a painting of Charles' dad's balls on her wall.

[MollyB]

56 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

Really? I was a little horrified at the idea of Oliver roofying them.

I thought they were Skittles.

[grandmabegum]

33 minutes ago, MollyB said:

7 minutes ago, MollyB said:

I thought they were Skittles.

I also can't imagine Bunny sitting down to a meal with Marv and/or the substitute waiter describing him as her friend. 

I don't know why it put the quotes in this order, but moving right along.

I thought they looked more like Mike and Ikes. And  yeah, he'd be crazy to give a bowl of expired pills of any nature to a group of people, but he also popped that pill he couldn't identify from his car when they were following Mabel and Oscar.

Did they mention or did I miss them asking the sub waiter about a description?

Someone pointed out on Reddit that Teddy made a Darth Vader reference when he threatened Oliver and we all know Darth Vader's famous phrase. I won't spoil it for people who have been lucky enough to avoid that movie this long. Sorry, I was the only girl of my siblings and every movie night of my childhood I was outvoted and forced to watch StarWars. Not bitter. At. All.

[Snapdragon]

With Teddy being Will's bio dad, I'm kinda hoping that Oliver turns out to be Theo's bio dad and the explanation is that back in the day, one of their drug fueled parties accidentally turned into an orgy.  That would be hilarious.  

[Cranberry]

1 hour ago, dovegrey said:

Someone said this in another thread (last week's I think) but it seems like the theme of this season is fathers, with the story about Charles' father, Lucy seeking Charles as a father figure, Theo disavowing Teddy, and now Oliver realizing that Will isn't biologically his son.

I think it might be families and their secrets in general, not just fathers. We've also got Bunny's mom and her hazy history in the mix, and I wouldn't be at all surprised if Alice the artist is related to Rose Cooper the artist in some way.

[Snazzy Daisy]

Oliver thinks he is good because of that grainy footage. 🤦🏻‍♀️

I screamed at my screen; “Oliver! Talk to the substitute waiter or get his number from Ivan. He can help to describe that mystery person!” 🙄

You can’t tell whether this is a man or a woman but he/she isn’t that tall.

So it couldn’t be Marv (the mold remover).

Edited July 21, 2022 by SnazzyDaisy

[grandmabegum]

40 minutes ago, Snapdragon said:

With Teddy being Will's bio dad, I'm kinda hoping that Oliver turns out to be Theo's bio dad and the explanation is that back in the day, one of their drug fueled parties accidentally turned into an orgy.  That would be hilarious.  

Yes, those "Accidental" orgies. Hehe.

14 minutes ago, SnazzyDaisy said:

I screamed at my screen; “Oliver! Talk to the substitute waiter or get his number from Ivan. He can help to describe that mystery person!” 🙄

Yeppers. And as you pointed out, we can't tell if it's a man or a woman. The vague use of "friend" is so infuriating.

[DoctorAtomic]

34 minutes ago, grandmabegum said:

Yes, those "Accidental" orgies. Hehe.

And playing Son of Sam. The 70s win. 

[iMonrey]

Quote

The killer chooses a victim during the "blackout," then everyone votes on who it could be going with majority vote. If they pick the killer, the game is over and the killer loses. If they're wrong, the person voted is out. And you keep playing rounds, until either you pick the killer or the killer is the last one standing.

I had trouble following this game.

So, the Son of Sam pinches someone in the dark, the lights go on, that person falls to the floor. At that point, they're out of the game, right? Because they're dead.

So then everyone votes on who they think the killer is, whoever gets the most votes is out of the game if they're NOT the killer? And everyone else stays in? So two people are out each round, right? 

Do I have this right?

[Haleth]

I think that’s Alice in the diner video. Tall and slender.

[Suzn]

36 minutes ago, Haleth said:

I think that’s Alice in the diner video. Tall and slender.

I think so too.  Definitely looks woman-shaped to me.

[Lugal]

5 hours ago, shapeshifter said:

Also Charles as a "father" to Lucy. Any others?

Alice did mention being the daughter of a plumber from Essex.

5 hours ago, DoctorAtomic said:

I take the point of Oliver slipping Alice the card on purpose because he and Charles had an agenda, but I would think he would still pile on at that point when she showed the other card - No, you're still lying because I slipped you the card! 

I don't think in general Oliver routinely slipped the card when he played the game in the past.

On rewatch, Oliver had his back to the camera when he gave Alice her card.

[Cranberry]

30 minutes ago, Lugal said:

On rewatch, Oliver had his back to the camera when he gave Alice her card.

But you get the tiniest glimpse of him pulling her card from the bottom of the deck and handing it to her with his left hand, when he handed everyone else their card from the top of the deck using his right hand. Watch when he's saying "but one of you is the Son of Sam killer" -- it's right on the word "killer."

[Clawdette]

To backtrack a little, I've always thought that Leonora Folger and Rose Cooper are the same person. Not sure how that figures in to the murder, though.  We haven't seen Shirley Mac lately so it's time for Leonora to reappear.

[LEILANI2]

I think it was Mabel. It's just like a recent show which I won't spoil but the main character spends the entire series defending herself from committing the crime she's accused of. Then when the series ended and everyone live 'happily ever after' in the credits, it was shown she was indeed guilty.

Edited July 21, 2022 by LEILANI2

[grandmabegum]

1 hour ago, LEILANI2 said:

I think it was Mabel. It's just like a recent show which I won't spoil but the main character spends the entire series defending herself from committing the crime she's accused of. Then when the series ended and everyone live 'happily ever after' in the credits, it was shown she was indeed guilty.

Aw, damn! Now I really want to know what show it is you're talking about. I'm one of those people who doesn't care if someone spoils the ending. I will walk into someone watching the final five minutes of a show, sit down and watch and then happily go back and watch from the beginning. Could you message me please?

Edited July 21, 2022 by grandmabegum

[bybrandy]

I thought it was so heavy handed that it might be a red herring. Teddy futzed with the test or Teddy and Oliver are secret sibs. 

[grandmabegum]

While looking for the show @LEILANI2 mentioned suggesting that Mabel was the killer, I stumbled upon the "show" that pretty much Alice to a T. The art world has never been more exciting to me.

[BingeyKohan]

On 7/20/2022 at 9:01 AM, Kiddvideo said:

Was I the only one who said, “Fawn Hall” at the same time as Oliver and Charles? I can’t imagine the media craze about her appearance happening today.

Actually I said Jessica Hahn because I was thinking of the wrong scandal but Fawn Hall is who I was thinking of...

[BingeyKohan]

I think Marv is the person Lucy saw in the passageways bundled up and wearing booties over his feet for his mold removal work but was not the killer - though you'd think he'd speak up more about what he's seen in the passageways knowing that podcasters devoted to the mysteries of the building would find that useful. 

A commenter on Vulture's recap says that if you pause in the right place you can see Oliver's sleight of hand that gives Alice the SoS card and when Alice nabs the phony blonde one. so they were each playing each other in a way.

Maybe this is dense but I'm not sure how to take opening voice-overs like the one from Oliver's son who seems to tease out the big secret that his Dad didn't know to look for. Is that podcast audio? And it's from the future, looking back, since the paternity discovery wasn't made until the end of the episode (and even then was only implied rather than stated outright)? So Oliver's son agrees to go on the podcast and discuss the sort of delicate matter of his paternity surprise? Not super important, just trying to understand the 'rules' of v/o.

I think Jan could be throwing Charles off the scent with her talk of someone suddenly getting close to you because she hopes he'll eventually think of Lucy coming back into the picture and she'll make him mistrust her (especially since she is withholding information, which will probably come up again). We're meant to think it's Alice she means but that's too obvious since they cut right to her after Jan first said it so it's someone else Jan is trying to cast suspicion on. 

[tennisgurl]

20 hours ago, Cranberry said:

I think it might be families and their secrets in general, not just fathers. We've also got Bunny's mom and her hazy history in the mix, and I wouldn't be at all surprised if Alice the artist is related to Rose Cooper the artist in some way.

Don't forget Charles's new role in Brazzos as the new Brazzos uncle, Nina having a baby and her freak out about being a mom, and Charles freaking out that he and Bunny might have been siblings! Families are a huge theme this season, I feel like there has to be some connection to the crime. I am looking at just about everyone wondering if they could be a long lost relative. 

[cardigirl]

I guess I am hoping that Alice is the killer. I'm worried about others. I don't think Mabel or Charles or Oliver killed Bunny, mostly because they didn't have time, but I am worried about how quickly Oliver agreed with the police that Mabel could have done it. (Episode 1) That seemed really out of character for him. Does it mean something in the long run?  Don't know, but I don't like it. 

Here's my list, based on this week's episode, of people I don't WANT to be the murderer.  

Charles, Oliver, Mabel, Will, Theo, Teddy, Uma, Lucy.

[Lovecat]

On 7/20/2022 at 12:06 PM, chaifan said:

What I don't get about the game, is that everyone has one hand into the center, and the SoS card holder has to pinch someone for them to die.  Wouldn't it be pretty obvious that SoS is within 1-2 persons of the dead person?  What am I missing here?

On 7/20/2022 at 12:43 PM, dovegrey said:

I had the same thought about the proximity between people and didn't understand how the killer was supposed to stay hidden for so long. The people packed in next to the killer would also certainly feel the killer move, albeit with disorientation from it being dark (and the drugs, I guess). I figured it would work better without the hands and more as free-roam mingle with the lights suddenly going off.

On 7/20/2022 at 12:50 PM, grandmabegum said:

I've actually played similar games where you sort of walk around and do the pinching (lights on] so you have to be discreet. For whatever reason, when they did the hands in, I assumed that the hand they put in did the pinching. I don't know why I thought that cause then you wouldn't be able to pick out your victim specifically, but maybe that was the point. It didn't matter who you killed just that you killed someone.

At first I thought the pinch was on the bum or in the side or something, and then the penny dropped--it's got to be a pinch on the hand.  In the middle of that scrum with the lights off you're not necessarily going to know whose hand is above or below yours.

23 hours ago, grandmabegum said:

I thought they looked more like Mike and Ikes. And  yeah, he'd be crazy to give a bowl of expired pills of any nature to a group of people, but he also popped that pill he couldn't identify from his car when they were following Mabel and Oscar.

Mike and Ikes--made in my home town, woot-woot!

[Lugal]

17 hours ago, Cranberry said:

But you get the tiniest glimpse of him pulling her card from the bottom of the deck and handing it to her with his left hand, when he handed everyone else their card from the top of the deck using his right hand.

I did notice that, and it wouldn't surprise me if he gave her the Son of Sam card deliberately just to see how she reacts, because the other times we saw him play, Oliver seemed to figure out the killer long before they were down to the last two.  But I think Oliver overplayed his hand and Alice was able to deflect by revealing her past.  But I wonder if that could have been a kind of limited hangout situation, hiding her true motives for seeking out Mabel.  And for an outsider to find a Rose Cooper painting would increase her street cred in the art world.

[MollyB]

17 hours ago, Clawdette said:

To backtrack a little, I've always thought that Leonora Folger and Rose Cooper are the same person.

Me, too.  We're told Rose Cooper died a "mysterious death".  But Leonora says she just vanished.  Leonora skirts the issue with Charles about her relationship to Rose, even though they are supposedly having sex with the same man.  Leonora would not be lying if she said she had sex with Charles' father if she was impersonating Rose.  Which brings me to the scene of Charles' father being taken from the building by police.  His undershirt is torn and there may be blood on it.  What was that all about?  If Rose had been murdered he would not have spent the rest of his life in and out of jail and drinking himself to an early death. He would have been in jail for life.   Was the incident the end of the Rose Cooper charade and her "mysterious" death?

3 hours ago, BingeyKohan said:

I think Jan could be throwing Charles off the scent with her talk of someone suddenly getting close to you...

3 hours ago, BingeyKohan said:

but that's too obvious since they cut right to her after Jan first said it

Could she have meant getting close to all three of the podcasters?  My first thought was Alice because Jan profiled the killer as an artist, a creator.  (Although I agree, it's a little too obvious.)  

2 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Families are a huge theme this season,

Which is why I'm voting for Alice.  She rattled off a bio of Rose Cooper and her work but no one else seems to have every heard of her.  She's not a famous artist, certainly not a Frieda, but Alice talks as if she is.  I would say she talks almost defensively, but that could just be her accent.  Maybe Rose/Leonora is her grandmother.  Bunny talks to the person interested in the painting somewhat familiarly and responds to the intruder as if she knows them.  Maybe it is Alice just wanting the painting because it's her grandmothers.

And now that I have presented my case, the murderer will probably be Anaya's dad. LOL.

1 hour ago, cardigirl said:

That seemed really out of character for him.

Oliver is pretty self-centered and dismissive of other people's feelings sometimes.  He brushed off the thought of Bunny wanting to come in and he blew off his son to work on his podcast.  He would protect himself first if a murder conviction was on the table and excuse it as okay since he knows he didn't do it.

[emma675]

50 minutes ago, MollyB said:

2 hours ago, cardigirl said:

That seemed really out of character for him.

Oliver is pretty self-centered and dismissive of other people's feelings sometimes.  He brushed off the thought of Bunny wanting to come in and he blew off his son to work on his podcast.  He would protect himself first if a murder conviction was on the table and excuse it as okay since he knows he didn't do it.

Plus, he admitted to Charles in the last episode of season 1 when they were running out of the building that he probably wouldn't have gone to get Mabel if Charles wasn't making them do it (and then they ran into her apartment and the infamous Bunny body/Bloody Mabel scene).

[meep.meep]

Was I the only one thinking that Jan had poisoned the blueberry bagels and was trying to lure Charles into eating them?

I don't think that's how phone calls from jail work.

[DoctorAtomic]

If I'm playing Son of Sam, I'm totally pinching on the bum. 

[paigow]

Teddy & Theo have alibis - they were in custody / jail when Bunny was murdered.

[cardigirl]

5 hours ago, emma675 said:

Plus, he admitted to Charles in the last episode of season 1 when they were running out of the building that he probably wouldn't have gone to get Mabel if Charles wasn't making them do it (and then they ran into her apartment and the infamous Bunny body/Bloody Mabel scene).

I thought that was out of character too, because he and Mabel had gone to the funeral home together and survived being captured by Theo and then they went to save Charles. Maybe he is just that selfish, but I like to think he's a little more loving than that. Deep down.  Maybe.