Figure Skating

[kittykat]

My only hope is that Kaori has the skate of her life and the Russians flub it up.  Not that it won't stop the overscoring.

As far as the Americans falling behind.  I don't know.  Given everything we know about Eteri and the whole Nassar fiasco I feel better knowing that the American girls are healthy, not being forced to dope and are hopefully not prey to some predator in the skating federation.  As much as I'd like to see them medal again, I'll take a physically and mentally well treated skater over a gold medal.

[Bill1978]

4 hours ago, Lady Whistleup said:

Patrick Chan of the "I always fall in every LP but I've won three WC's" has entered the chat ...

I understand the concept of rewarding difficult jumps etc but I always feel that if you do a clean skate with no falling over you should get like a bonus of 10 points. I just find it ridiculous that falling over loses you only one point each time, I find it odd you can get onto a podium falling onto the ice above a competitor who nailed everything they did and they place 4th. I actually find I disconnect a bit these days with figure skating cause everyone is obsessed with leaps and jumps instead of skating. I remember the days of skaters falling over and the commentators saying 'Well there goes there chance of a medal' but these days it's like 'Eh they fell over, give them Silver'

Or maybe I'm just a bitter Australian who is just annoyed we never do that well in judged sports in general haha. 

 

[Minneapple]

12 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

I'm talking about the 80s as well when Romania and the Soviet Union were using underage gymnasts. Marinescu, Silvas (was world champion at age 13) and Goegean are probably the most famous.

But that's why they raised the age limit, right? Now the gymnasts have to turn 16 in an Olympic year. Figure skating is similar, the girls have to be 15 the year before the Olympics. I don't know if they'll raise the age limit higher than that.

[choclatechip45]

2 minutes ago, kittykat said:

My only hope is that Kaori has the skate of her life and the Russians flub it up.  Not that it won't stop the overscoring.

As far as the Americans falling behind.  I don't know.  Given everything we know about Eteri and the whole Nassar fiasco I feel better knowing that the American girls are healthy, not being forced to dope and are hopefully not prey to some predator in the skating federation.  As much as I'd like to see them medal again, I'll take a physically and mentally well treated skater over a gold medal.

Yup. I'll gladly take Alysa looking happy getting into snowball fights, making a snowman and posting about the village on Instagram over her being miserable and winning a gold. Especially with how happy she looked after her performance. 

Just now, Minneapple said:

But that's why they raised the age limit, right? Now the gymnasts have to turn 16 in an Olympic year. Figure skating is similar, the girls have to be 15 the year before the Olympics. I don't know if they'll raise the age limit higher than that.

People are talking about raising it until 17 or 18. I think 16 is fine. 

[izabella]

52 minutes ago, Good Queen Jane said:

Interesting comments from the skaters about raising the minimum age. It would be nice to see women's figure skating instead of little girl's figure skating.

Wonder what Tara "I won my Olympic Gold at 15 and immediately retired" Lipinski thinks of that idea.  She was 14 when she won nationals and worlds.

[Jess14]

6 minutes ago, Minneapple said:

But that's why they raised the age limit, right? Now the gymnasts have to turn 16 in an Olympic year. Figure skating is similar, the girls have to be 15 the year before the Olympics. I don't know if they'll raise the age limit higher than that.

I doubt they will raise the age higher than 16, but as seen with China in 2008, if the country is sponsoring the cheating, then it’s not that hard to simply change the birth year on the official documentation. You just have to do it early enough to not raise suspicion and be consistent. The only reason the 2000 Chinese team got caught was because the gymnast went back to using her real birthdate years later in official documentation. If Russia is willing to engage in doping 15 year olds, then changing a birthdate seems pretty minor in comparison.

I do think that they need to raise the age to address this “protected person” issue. As it to stands now, it just seems like an invitation pump drugs into teenagers and then feign innocence. 

[choclatechip45]

4 minutes ago, izabella said:

Wonder what Tara "I won my Olympic Gold at 15 and immediately retired" Lipinski thinks of that idea.  She was 14 when she won nationals and worlds.

I read an interview with her years ago before she was commentating with Johnny and she was against it. She said training methods would remain the same. I agree with her.

[KittenPokerCheater]

4 hours ago, ShellsandCheese said:

I skipped the Russians but I thought overall this was a pretty good short program; Kaori was amazing! 

I skipped the russians too (turned the tv off for their performances) but I guess they did their thing.   I am so happy for Kaori and I hope that she takes a medal.  I hope Wakaba makes it into the top 10, as Mariah and Alyssa.  

Truly, I cannot believe China would let something like this happen- it makes them lose face to let this happen in their country, it makes them look weak. 

If Kamila/Eteri/the ROC team had any respect for the sport, Kamila should withdraw from the long program, so that there could be a medal ceremony.  I know it won't happen, but it should.  

[ShellsandCheese]

6 minutes ago, KittenPokerCheater said:

Truly, I cannot believe China would let something like this happen- it makes them lose face to let this happen in their country, it makes them look weak.

China has no say in this matter and truthfully I doubt they care. They have no horse in this race, if it were the Pairs competition, I’m sure they would have made a big stink. There are plenty of things that are a reflection of China when it comes to these games;  but the CAS decision and Valieva being allowed to skate is not one of them. 

If Kamila/Eteri/the ROC team had any respect for the sport, Kamila should withdraw from the long program, so that there could be a medal ceremony.  I know it won't happen, but it should.

Kamila has no say in that decision and I would argue that if Eteri had any respect for the sport or the girls she trains, she’d change her training methods and clearly the ROC has one concern and that’s winning. 

Edited February 15, 2022 by ShellsandCheese

[scarynikki12]

30 minutes ago, kittykat said:

As much as I'd like to see them medal again, I'll take a physically and mentally well treated skater over a gold medal.

Agreed.

[ShellsandCheese]

2 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

Agreed.

Those two aren’t mutually exclusive - plenty of skaters win gold without mental or physical abuse. Unfortunately, right now the top American women skaters just don’t have the skills or talent to match up with the top skaters from Japan, S. Korea, and Russia. Doping aside, I can objectively admit there is a certain amount of natural talent and skill that some of the top Russian skaters have and they would probably still be pretty ahead of the pack even without cheating to enhance stamina and endurance, etc. (Which again makes it all the more sadder, because they don’t need to do it) 

[alexa]

42 minutes ago, kittykat said:

My only hope is that Kaori has the skate of her life and the Russians flub it up.  Not that it won't stop the overscoring.

As far as the Americans falling behind.  I don't know.  Given everything we know about Eteri and the whole Nassar fiasco I feel better knowing that the American girls are healthy, not being forced to dope and are hopefully not prey to some predator in the skating federation.  As much as I'd like to see them medal again, I'll take a physically and mentally well treated skater over a gold medal.

Love this, totally agree!!

[Avaleigh]

I'd love to see Russia get a real ban where they aren't allowed to compete at all but wouldn't the Russian skaters just end up skating for other countries? It's already happening. We'd just see Russians representing countries that were once in the USSR. It's hard not to be pessimistic about all of this. 

As for raising the age, yeah, they'll just falsify documents. These people are cheaters. 16 to me seems like a reasonable age to compete internationally. I agree that raising the age to 18 is just going to shorten the window for a lot of non Russian athletes. 

Very disappointed that Loena and Ekaterina Kurakova didn't have better skates. They were both such bright spots at the Europeans. 

Wakaba should be in fourth. Makes no sense how Trusova is over her. 

Kaori was awesome. Looking forward to seeing her in the long. 

[galaxygirl76]

18 minutes ago, Avaleigh said:

Wakaba should be in fourth. Makes no sense how Trusova is over her. 

Posters on reddit pointed out that Wakaba scored lower with the triple axel than she did in the team event when she had a double axel. It's an outrage she's below Trusova who fell on her ass trying the same thing. 

Edited February 15, 2022 by galaxygirl76

[absnow54]

13 minutes ago, galaxygirl76 said:

Posters on reddit pointed out that Wakaba scored lower with the triple axel than she did in the team event when she had a double axel. It's an outrage she's below Trusova who fell on her ass trying the same thing. 

As more time passes, the more upset I get on her behalf! She should be in that Top 3 cluster around 80 points!

[jenh526]

Apologies if this has been explained already, but if Valieva has had negative results recently, then how is she able to do the jumps now without the PED? (Not excusing her or the Russians, just want to understand the mechanics of it)

[Jess14]

It seems like Trusova is a favorite among many skating fans, but I honestly don’t see the appeal, especially not in the free skate. It’s just jump, jump, jump….

[blackwing]

1 hour ago, KittenPokerCheater said:

If Kamila/Eteri/the ROC team had any respect for the sport, Kamila should withdraw from the long program, so that there could be a medal ceremony.  I know it won't happen, but it should.  

It's hard to have respect and clarity when you don't believe you did anything wrong and that you believe you are suffering unfairly because of anti-Russian bias.  After all, according to them, this poor girl, all she did was drink from Grandpa's glass instead of her own.  Because of that, now the entire world thinks she is a cheater.  In Russia, glass drink you!  And now the world is so unfair to her!

Ugh.  I wish there was a way for the skaters to send a message.  Can they line up in the stands and then collectively turn their backs on her as she is skating?

[absnow54]

Just now, jenh526 said:

Apologies if this has been explained already, but if Valieva has had negative results recently, then how is she able to do the jumps now without the PED? (Not excusing her or the Russians, just want to understand the mechanics of it)

The speculation is that the PED she uses is for enhancing her practices. She has endurance for longer practices, so can get 90 minutes of peak performance, where as before she could only get 60 minutes, and that is creating an unfair advantage. 

[Ohiopirate02]

Just now, jenh526 said:

Apologies if this has been explained already, but if Valieva has had negative results recently, then how is she able to do the jumps now without the PED? (Not excusing her or the Russians, just want to understand the mechanics of it)

The drug she tested positive for would have been used during her training as a means to allow her body to train for longer.  She most likely stopped taking it after she won nationals and before the Olympics.  Once the competition season starts, you do not train as hard as a way to lessen the risk of injury before competition.

[Hana Chan]

2 minutes ago, Jess14 said:

It seems like Trusova is a favorite among many skating fans, but I honestly don’t see the appeal, especially not in the free skate. It’s just jump, jump, jump….

And it's not as if her jumps flow well in the programs. She's gotten a bit better, but a lot of the times she comes to nearly a full stop after a jump and it's pretty unpleasant to watch. I can admire her athleticism, but that's only part of the sport. 

[galaxygirl76]

 

[HartofDixie]

NYTimes reporting Kamila had 3 substances in her sample that are for treating heart conditions.

[proserpina65]

8 hours ago, ChitChat said:

Thanks for the clarification!  Putting that aside,  I'm still glad that H & D got a bronze.  I really enjoyed their free dance performance.  

I don't care about the behind the scenes crap.  I watch the skating.  Period.  H&D were better than C&B in both the rhythm dance and the free dance, imo, and deserved their bronze medals.

Edited to note that while Guillaume Cizeron is an attractive man, he seems to me to have a weirdly long neck.  Or maybe that's just because of his sloped shoulders?  Lovely skater to watch, though.

Edited February 15, 2022 by proserpina65

[Minneapple]

Holy shit is there anything she wasn't on?

[Chaser]

Were the other substances banned as well?

They need to drug test all the Russian ladies now.

Edited February 15, 2022 by Chaser

[proserpina65]

3 minutes ago, Minneapple said:

Holy shit is there anything she wasn't on?

Weed?

[Minneapple]

1 minute ago, proserpina65 said:

Weed?

How do you "laugh" and "cry" at a post at the same time?

[GreyBunny]

36 minutes ago, HartofDixie said:

NYTimes reporting Kamila had 3 substances in her sample that are for treating heart conditions.

Gee, grandpa must have been drinking one helluva cocktail. 🙄

As for the age, raise it to 17. It won’t shorten the window for healthy, properly trained athletes. Healthy, well-fed women in their 20’s are now doing skills in gymnastics that the underfed teens never could.

[Sarahsmile416]

1 hour ago, Ohiopirate02 said:

The drug she tested positive for would have been used during her training as a means to allow her body to train for longer.  She most likely stopped taking it after she won nationals and before the Olympics.  Once the competition season starts, you do not train as hard as a way to lessen the risk of injury before competition.

I’d be willing to guess that she is she is still taking things, she’s probably just taking other types of masking agents to hide it.  

[Lady Whistleup]

Here me out here -- I;m starting to think she might have a serious heart ailment.

The reason is this: she grew a lot in the past year, all the way up to 5'3". That's "big" in Eteri world.

She might have a serious heart problem because of eating disorders. Most people who die of eating disorders die of heart problems.

[Minneapple]

Or their crazy doctor had the skaters on a drug cocktail that helped them train longer.

[Lady Whistleup]

Just now, Minneapple said:

Or their crazy doctor had the skaters on a drug cocktail that helped them train longer.

Ok I HATE to think this but ...

anyone think that Sergei Grinkov's sudden death might be to overtraining on a doping cocktail. Apparently this stuff has been around for decades.

[absnow54]

The other two substances are not banned, although one is banned by IV infusion. From the article:

“The document said that Valieva had declared three products on her doping control form that was submitted with the now-failed test. Those products, the document said, were L-carnitine, Hypoxen and Supradyn, an immunity boosting supplement.”

[choclatechip45]

1 hour ago, GreyBunny said:

Gee, grandpa must have been drinking one helluva cocktail. 🙄

As for the age, raise it to 17. It won’t shorten the window for healthy, properly trained athletes. Healthy, well-fed women in their 20’s are now doing skills in gymnastics that the underfed teens never could.

If you are willing to drug a 15 year old. You are going to forge documents to make them old enough to compete. 

[Lady Whistleup]

Although think it's important for people not to shake their heads and say "those Russians" and "where are her parents"? In the US you had gymnasts' parents swearing up and down what a great guy Larry Nasser was and sending kids to Marta month after month. 

Child abuse in sports is unfortunately way too common universally. Everyone needs to do better.

[Minneapple]

9 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

Although think it's important for people not to shake their heads and say "those Russians" and "where are her parents"? In the US you had gymnasts' parents swearing up and down what a great guy Larry Nasser was and sending kids to Marta month after month. 

Child abuse in sports is unfortunately way too common universally. Everyone needs to do better.

I agree but I don’t think the parents of the gymnasts knew the deal with Nassar. He was in demand because he claimed to be able to fix the hip and pelvic issues that a lot of gymnasts go through. He was even interviewed by police and showed them diagrams of what he did and explained why he was doing it, and the police bought it. He was a very good liar and his target was teenage girls — unfortunately not a population we take seriously enough.

[Jess14]

59 minutes ago, Sarahsmile416 said:

I’d be willing to guess that she is she is still taking things, she’s probably just taking other types of masking agents to hide it.  

Yeah, I have no idea if she is still taking all of these drugs, but plenty of people who are doping have passed drug tests before getting caught. That’s part of the issue - the cheaters are always ahead of the tests. 

[Lady Whistleup]

8 minutes ago, Minneapple said:

I agree but I don’t think the parents of the gymnasts knew the deal with Nassar. He was in demand because he claimed to be able to fix the hip and pelvic issues that a lot of gymnasts go through. He was even interviewed by police and showed them diagrams of what he did and explained why he was doing it, and the police bought it. He was a very good liar and his target was teenage girls — unfortunately not a population we take seriously enough.

But parents sent their kids back to Marta month after month and the gymnasts were getting horrifying injuries. Like ... torn abdominal muscles, broken bones, torn Achilles ... the list goes on. Injuries a young and healthy body should not be getting. Gymnasts like Dominique Moceanu also expressed how abusive the Karolyis were and her parents just sent her back.

Again, this goes back to certain sports incentivizing an extremely ruthless training regimen for extremely young bodies. 

Athletes with a longer shelf life tend to have less of these abuse issues because the goal is not to squeeze a gold medal out of the age 15-19 time frame.

[izabella]

4 minutes ago, Jess14 said:

Yeah, I have no idea if she is still taking all of these drugs, but plenty of people who are doping have passed drug tests before getting caught. That’s part of the issue - the cheaters are always ahead of the tests. 

Yes, one could actually say the Russians are especially bad at cheating because they get caught while others do not.

[choclatechip45]

35 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

Although think it's important for people not to shake their heads and say "those Russians" and "where are her parents"? In the US you had gymnasts' parents swearing up and down what a great guy Larry Nasser was and sending kids to Marta month after month. 

Child abuse in sports is unfortunately way too common universally. Everyone needs to do better.

I completely agree. Nassar was able to go into the gymnasts room at the ranch and at competitions. Most of these parents basically let the coaches raise their kids it's gross.

I remember reading a profile on Laurie Hernandez in 2016 and it talked about how she slept at Maggie Haney's house and Maggie drove her everywhere. I got a bad vibe in the article. A few years later Maggie gets suspended for being abusive. 

Maggie Nichols parents were both mandatory reporters because her mom was a nurse and her dad was a doctor neither went to the police. 

They need stricter rules and enforce the rules! 

[ShellsandCheese]

1 hour ago, absnow54 said:

The other two substances are not banned, although one is banned by IV infusion. From the article:

“The document said that Valieva had declared three products on her doping control form that was submitted with the now-failed test. Those products, the document said, were L-carnitine, Hypoxen and Supradyn, an immunity boosting supplement.”

I really don’t care about stuff that is not banned, those drugs aren’t the issue and it’s just a distraction to focus on it. If the drug isn’t banned - it’s not an issue. Period. At least according to WADA.

Edited February 16, 2022 by ShellsandCheese

[Lady Whistleup]

4 minutes ago, choclatechip45 said:

I completely agree. Nassar was able to go into the gymnasts room at the ranch and at competitions. Most of these parents basically let the coaches raise their kids it's gross.

I remember reading a profile on Laurie Hernandez in 2016 and it talked about how she slept at Maggie Haney's house and Maggie drove her everywhere. I got a bad vibe in the article. A few years later Maggie gets suspended for being abusive. 

Maggie Nichols parents were both mandatory reporters because her mom was a nurse and her dad was a doctor neither went to the police. 

They need stricter rules and enforce the rules! 

Also ... no judgment, just an observation. Larry Nasser apparently liked to abuse gymnasts at meets. Apparently, he liked that they had separate hotel rooms and he could just go in and do his thing (gross).

Simone said that Tokyo 2021 was the FIRST time her parents ever were not with her at a meet. Apparently her parents always traveled with her, cooked her food, and took care of her needs. Which is great -- that's what parents are for.

But you mean to tell me that Simone's parents traveled with her ALL those years and never noticed that there was this creepy guy going in and out of gymnasts' hotel rooms? 

[CeeBeeGee]

5 hours ago, blackwing said:

I am glad to hear that she is retiring.  Such a hypocrite.  I do hope that Chock and Bates stick around for another four years.  They are 32 and 29, I don't think it's out of the realm of possibility, is it?  Have they said anything about this?

Since the women's competition has devolved into a farce, I think it would be incredibly awesome if multiple spectators or officials from other country contingents brought air horns and let them rip just before Grandpa Doped Me launches into her now-known-to-have-been-achieved-through-doping quads.  She deserves to go splat city as often as possible.  I would rewind the DVR over and over.

I really hope C/B stick around. I loved their alien program.

There really should be some kind of social price, beyond just being denied a medal ceremony.

 

5 hours ago, choclatechip45 said:

That is strange. I remember him saying his whole USSR/Russia obsession started because of the cold war he didn't understand why America hated them.

Interesting--I was always fascinated with Russia as a child, but I knew almost nothing about the Cold War. But I had read (memorized, really) A Little Princess which has a slight exchange where Russia is quite romanticized, and I'd read Eloise in Moscow (again, the Cold War references went over my head) and the two books definitely piqued my interest.

 

4 hours ago, choclatechip45 said:

Yup. I'll gladly take Alysa looking happy getting into snowball fights, making a snowman and posting about the village on Instagram over her being miserable and winning a gold. Especially with how happy she looked after her performance. 

She is such a ray of sunshine.

 

3 hours ago, Avaleigh said:

I'd love to see Russia get a real ban where they aren't allowed to compete at all but wouldn't the Russian skaters just end up skating for other countries? It's already happening. We'd just see Russians representing countries that were once in the USSR. It's hard not to be pessimistic about all of this. 

I wouldn't have a program with that, as long as they're not doping.

 

12 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

But parents sent their kids back to Marta month after month and the gymnasts were getting horrifying injuries. Like ... torn abdominal muscles, broken bones, torn Achilles ... the list goes on. Injuries a young and healthy body should not be getting. Gymnasts like Dominique Moceanu also expressed how abusive the Karolyis were and her parents just sent her back.

Hell, for Dominique's dad, that was a feature, not a bug.

[choclatechip45]

14 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

Also ... no judgment, just an observation. Larry Nasser apparently liked to abuse gymnasts at meets. Apparently, he liked that they had separate hotel rooms and he could just go in and do his thing (gross).

Simone said that Tokyo 2021 was the FIRST time her parents ever were not with her at a meet. Apparently her parents always traveled with her, cooked her food, and took care of her needs. Which is great -- that's what parents are for.

But you mean to tell me that Simone's parents traveled with her ALL those years and never noticed that there was this creepy guy going in and out of gymnasts' hotel rooms? 

Apparently the parents weren't allowed at the same hotels as the gymnasts. I think it was mentioned on Athlete A. They mentioned Maggie and Simone's parents sneaking in and giving them snacks. 

[EllenB]

4 minutes ago, CeeBeeGee said:

I really hope C/B stick around. I loved their alien program.

There really should be some kind of social price, beyond just being denied a medal ceremony.

 

Interesting--I was always fascinated with Russia as a child, but I knew almost nothing about the Cold War. But I had read (memorized, really) A Little Princess which has a slight exchange where Russia is quite romanticized, and I'd read Eloise in Moscow (again, the Cold War references went over my head) and the two books definitely piqued my interest.

For my age group, we became fascinated with Russia/USSR thanks to Doctor Zhivago.  Most of us outgrew it, or reduced it to a mild interest. I worked for a guy my age who, even decades later, was still completely obsessed with anything Russian. I have a USSR military badge he gave me for Christmas one year, since he did most of his shopping at Russian military surplus sites - and by mail pre-internet. Very strange dude.

[Jess14]

17 minutes ago, Lady Whistleup said:

Also ... no judgment, just an observation. Larry Nasser apparently liked to abuse gymnasts at meets. Apparently, he liked that they had separate hotel rooms and he could just go in and do his thing (gross).

Simone said that Tokyo 2021 was the FIRST time her parents ever were not with her at a meet. Apparently her parents always traveled with her, cooked her food, and took care of her needs. Which is great -- that's what parents are for.

But you mean to tell me that Simone's parents traveled with her ALL those years and never noticed that there was this creepy guy going in and out of gymnasts' hotel rooms? 

They probably assumed there were adults in the room and didn’t see him as creepy. The Nassar scandal was such a perfect storm of everything that is wrong in elite sports. I think parents assumed that there was adequate supervision at the ranch and definitely in the examination rooms, and from what I remember, he abused some girls when their parents were in the room! Everyone (parents, individual coaches, gymnasts) were scared of making waves because they didn’t want them or their kids to get blackballed by Marta. Then, you add in the fact that gymnasts have said that Nassar (classic predator) was one of the only adults who was nice to them. So, the gymnasts didnt want to think anything was wrong with the one person at the ranch who was slipping them snacks and treating them (from their perspectives) as people instead of robots….and boom, you get hundreds of girls abused.

On the Valieva matter, I do think any decent parent who has a kid that trains with Eteri has to be wondering what the hell their kid is ingesting at this point. Beforehand, maybe they just assumed “the coach knows best,” but at this point, it would be crazy not to at least inquire about their meds and “vitamins.”

 

 

[Sarahsmile416]

1 minute ago, Jess14 said:

They probably assumed there were adults in the room and didn’t see him as creepy. The Nassar scandal was such a perfect storm of everything that is wrong in elite sports. I think parents assumed that there was adequate supervision at the ranch and definitely in the examination rooms, and from what I remember, he abused some girls when their parents were in the room! Everyone (parents, individual coaches, gymnasts) were scared of making waves because they didn’t want them or their kids to get blackballed by Marta. Then, you add in the fact that gymnasts have said that Nassar (classic predator) was one of the only adults who was nice to them. So, the gymnasts didnt want to think anything was wrong with the one person at the ranch who was slipping them snacks and treating them (from their perspectives) as people instead of robots….and boom, you get hundreds of girls abused.

On the Valieva matter, I do think any decent parent who has a kid that trains with Eteri has to be wondering what the hell their kid is ingesting at this point. Beforehand, maybe they just assumed “the coach knows best,” but at this point, it would be crazy not to at least inquire about their meds and “vitamins.”

 

 

Clearly this applies to Grandpa too 😜

[Rootbeer]

3 hours ago, jenh526 said:

Apologies if this has been explained already, but if Valieva has had negative results recently, then how is she able to do the jumps now without the PED? (Not excusing her or the Russians, just want to understand the mechanics of it)

 

3 hours ago, absnow54 said:

The speculation is that the PED she uses is for enhancing her practices. She has endurance for longer practices, so can get 90 minutes of peak performance, where as before she could only get 60 minutes, and that is creating an unfair advantage. 

Also, the positive test occurred during the Russian National Championships in December which she won.  It was because she placed so high at the Russian championships that she competed and won at Europeans.  The skaters chosen for the Olympics are usually the top finishers at those competition who are chosen by their country's Olympic committee.  So, if she hadn't taken the med, then she might not have done so well at the Russian championship and then she wouldn't have been on the Olympic team at all.

[Rootbeer]

1 hour ago, Lady Whistleup said:

Ok I HATE to think this but ...

anyone think that Sergei Grinkov's sudden death might be to overtraining on a doping cocktail. Apparently this stuff has been around for decades.

Absolutely not.  Grinkov died in Lake Placid, on the ice, while practicing for Stars on Ice with his wife.  His death was witnessed by multiple other famous skaters including Scott Hamilton and Paul Wylie.  An autopsy was performed by an American coroner in an American facility, no Russians anywhere.  Sergei had severe atherosclerosis of his cardiac arteries, to the point where the main coronary artery had an opening the size of a pinhole.  He was known to have high cholesterol and multiple male members of his family had suffered heart attacks at young ages.  Genetic testing was done after his death and it was found that he had a genetic mutation which results in premature blockages forming in the coronary arteries in young men.  Since his death, this genetic issue is often referred to as The Grinkov Factor just as we often call ALS Lou Gehrig's Disease.