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S05.E07: An Introduction to Engineering and a Glob of Hair Gel


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Howard!

Loved Missy and her popcorn. "Watching Sheldon struggle with homework. It's so great."

I think we had Connie's cordless phone when I was a kid...

How bad must Dale have been before if Connie's getting the better version of him?

The President and the Professor talking about Sheldon's reaction to getting locked out of class was mean and hilarious. "I'm gonna sit for this." 😄

Edited by ams1001
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4 minutes ago, Browncoat said:

I wondered if the teacher was tearing up Sheldon's assignment because it was early.  There are instructors who mean it when they say as assignment is due on x day, and won't accept it before or after that date.

I was thinking the same thing. He wasn't even looking at it after the first time. (Though if that was the case he should have just told him.)

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It was great to hear Howard again.

Gee, too bad Sheldon showed up late. Professor Boucher was awesome, not taking any of Sheldon’s crap and making him work to figure it out in his own. George helped drive that point across too. Had he not gotten locked out of the classroom, that lesson might have stuck and he might have turned out better for it. But no surprise his disdain for engineering was for a petty reason.

1 hour ago, ams1001 said:

The President and the Professor talking about Sheldon's reaction to getting locked out of class was mean and hilarious. "I'm gonna sit for this." 😄

It’s nice to see that the President gets tired of dealing with Sheldon and was happy to see someone stand their ground with him.

Edited by Spartan Girl
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7 hours ago, Browncoat said:

I wondered if the teacher was tearing up Sheldon's assignment because it was early.  There are instructors who mean it when they say as assignment is due on x day, and won't accept it before or after that date.

7 hours ago, ams1001 said:

I was thinking the same thing. He wasn't even looking at it after the first time. (Though if that was the case he should have just told him.)

That's what I thought too.
But I think the engineering professor rejecting Sheldon’s early versions of the assignment would have been better used as a joke using the comic "rule of 3."

Lance Reddick as Professor Boucher was casting perfection.

Edited by shapeshifter
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52 minutes ago, Spartan Girl said:

But no surprise his disdain for engineering was for a petty reason.

So true.  As we know, Sheldon can be very petty.  However, I was hoping for a different reason for his full-on hate of engineers & engineering.  I'm not sure what, but that was kind of a 'meh' moment for me.   It was nice to hear Howard's voice though.  

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I finally figured out who Howard is. I’ve watched fewer than five TBBTs.

I’ve had several leg/foot injuries, so I felt bad for June. Needing help for nearly everything is not fun.

I was surprised George visited Sheldon’s professor, but it was good to see he understood the point the professor was making and backed off.

And yes to Missy’s reaction to Sheldon’s study struggle!  

Edited by zoey1996
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16 minutes ago, zoey1996 said:

I was surprised George visited Sheldon’s professor, but it was good to see he understood the point the professor was making and backed off.

I really didn't think about Sheldon's parents speaking to his professors. For an ordinary college student a parent conference would be way out of line but Sheldon's not ordinary. At his age, college or not, a parent may need to reach out.

 

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Yay, Howard!

I'm surprised it took Sheldon so long to figure out his mistake with the bridge design. The Tacoma Narrows Bridge collapse is covered in many undergraduate physics textbooks. I think he started hating engineering because it was the first academic subject in which he didn't excel.

I wonder what's the point of the June scenes. Is Dale going to get back together with her? Or does the show just like working with Reba?

Also, is Zoe Perry doing another project? There's been so little of her in this season.

Edited by chocolatine
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Professor Boucher not putting up with Sheldon's crap was awesome. I've never seen someone make "turn that frown upside down" sound so sinister. 

I normally love Reba on the show, but I agree June's storyline felt weirdly out of place. I don't get why it took up half the episode and we got virtually no scenes with Missy, Georgie and Mary. 

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I didn’t understand the professor’s point. He wasn’t even looking at the designs to see whether Sheldon had factored in wind.  Color me not impressed.  
 

And I really hated the professor and President’s moment of glee over sticking it to a kid.   We know he grew up to be pretty insufferable, and now we know why.  Few adults in his life were ever willing to tell him no; they just like complaining about him behind his back.

I liked hearing Howard; otherwise it was quite a dud of an episode for me.

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The Sheldon/Howard banter was my favourite part of the episode. 

I see Georgie is allowed to eat with the family again. Maybe George is starting to let go of his anger about Georgie dropping out of school. 

 

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7 hours ago, anna0852 said:

I really didn't think about Sheldon's parents speaking to his professors. For an ordinary college student a parent conference would be way out of line but Sheldon's not ordinary. At his age, college or not, a parent may need to reach out.

 

You might be surprised at how many parents of college students are that involved nowadays.

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Overall, I thought it was a good episode.  Just a couple of things felt weirdly out of place for me.  The Dale/June/Meemaw story line was kind of silly and out of rhythm with the episode.  And IRL, I don't think a teacher and president/principal would get such joy out of upsetting a child, albeit, a very annoying child.  Sheldon, although quirky, is quite harmless and I am surprise these grown-ups and professionals allow him to get under their skin.    

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8 hours ago, chocolatine said:

wonder what's the point of the June scenes. Is Dale going to get back together with her?

24 minutes ago, DoYouLikeMutton said:

The Dale/June/Meemaw story line was kind of silly and out of rhythm with the episode. 

It did seem that they were at least setting up a breakup/exit strategy for Dale, but not quite crossing the point of no return. Otherwise those scenes were not worth watching. 
IDK. Did Reba actually break a leg and they had to rewrite around it at the last minute? 

I did not enjoy the adult Sheldon and Howard voiceover banters without being able to see them. I watched every episode of TBBT as they aired, but I never noticed before how similar in pitch and cadence Sheldon and Howard's voices can be. Actually, I think it's that Simon Helberg tends to sync up with whomever he's doing a scene. It's his superpower, but it didn't work for me here. I think naturally Helberg's voice is deeper, but here I had trouble tracking who was speaking.

Simon Helberg is also a master of physical comedy and facial reaction, which we didn’t get here.

I chuckled a few times at young Sheldon in the first part, so I don’t regret watching. 

Edited by shapeshifter
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9 minutes ago, shapeshifter said:

I did not enjoy the adult Sheldon and Howard voiceover banters without being able to see them. I watched every episode of TBBT as they aired, but I never noticed before how similar in pitch and cadence Sheldon and Howard's voices can be. Actually, I think it's that Simon Helberg tends to sync up with whomever he's doing a scene. It's his superpower, but it didn't work for me here. I think naturally Helberg's voice is deeper, but here I had trouble tracking who was speaking.

This!

I've only seen a few episodes of TBBT, so I didn't recognize Howard's voice (in fact, didn't know whose voice it was until reading the discussion here) and both voices sounded very similar to me.  So the whole beginning voiceover banter was lost on me, although others here seemed to enjoy it. 

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5 hours ago, Mediocre Gatsby said:

It made no sense to me that the professor kept ripping up Sheldon's designs unseen unless the problem was that they were submitted early. 

The professor has an eye for engineering, so it probably took just a glance at Sheldon's work to see that it was wrong. 

 

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Disappointed. That's the reason that Sheldon hates engineering? 

That's his initial reason, and as the voiceovers says, it was Sheldon's dislike for Howard on a personal level that continued it.

Spoiler

Plus on The Big Bang Theory it turns out Sheldon has a very legitimate gripe against Howard and not just because he's an engineer

 

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3 hours ago, Browncoat said:

You might be surprised at how many parents of college students are that involved nowadays.

Speaking as a college academic advisor for the last 20+ years, I often joke that I spend more time talking to parents than I do the actual students!  So I definitely buy Sheldon’s dad going to the school because sadly it has nothing to do with Sheldon’s age. It’s just what a lot of parents do.

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46 minutes ago, MooCat Pretzel said:

 So I definitely buy Sheldon’s dad going to the school because sadly it has nothing to do with Sheldon’s age. It’s just what a lot of parents do.

That's embarrassing! When our son went to college, we all went to a day of orientation (parents separately).  We had to listen to a little lecture about not being helicopter parents.   I think they said there are 3 types of parents:  The ones who drop their student off on move in day and drive away, never to be seen again!;  The ones who are helicopter parents who are a little too involved;  And I think the third was the ones who tried to live the college experience through their son/daughter.  I'm not sure on that one.  We didn't fall into any of those categories, so we just sat there and snickered at the parents who did!!  

1 hour ago, AD35 said:

That's his initial reason, and as the voiceovers says, it was Sheldon's dislike for Howard on a personal level that continued it.

I can't remember the exact reason given on TBBT.  I guess I shouldn't be surprised that his reason was from something so petty.  Sheldon can't stand it when he isn't the smartest person in the room.  He really got his comeuppance from the Engineering professor, and it was quite funny!  

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1 hour ago, ChitChat said:

I can't remember the exact reason given on TBBT.  I guess I shouldn't be surprised that his reason was from something so petty. 

To be fair to Sheldon Howard was a total jerk in the early seasons of BBT.  They redeem him somewhat when he meets and marries Bernadette but Howard was never written as particularly likable!

Edited by SusannahM
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14 hours ago, anna0852 said:

I really didn't think about Sheldon's parents speaking to his professors. For an ordinary college student a parent conference would be way out of line but Sheldon's not ordinary. At his age, college or not, a parent may need to reach out.

I agree with this. By 17 or 18 someone in college should have the maturity and the people skills to deal with a professor without going to thier parents for help (it's okay for the student to talk to parents to figure out what to do, what to say, how to approach the issue, but not for the parents to call or be in the room with the professor). However, Sheldon is around 12. There is a massive difference in maturity and people skills between a normal/average 12 and 17 year old. It is not fair to expect a 12 year old to be where a 17 year is in terms of maturity and people skills. 

Today parents of college students are more involved than they have been in the past and probably should be. 

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13 hours ago, Crs97 said:

And I really hated the professor and President’s moment of glee over sticking it to a kid.   We know he grew up to be pretty insufferable, and now we know why.  Few adults in his life were ever willing to tell him no; they just like complaining about him behind his back.

I don’t know about that.  It might be the other way around - at some point, probably early enough in his life, Sheldon was already so insufferable that the adults found it easier and more productive not to tell him no.  It’s only his parents’ responsibility, and maybe his schoolteachers’, to raise him.  Other people have their own things to do and often it’s easier to just nod to get a Sheldon out of the way so you could focus on those.  So yes, his parents might have made him insufferable the way you suggest, but I wouldn’t blame his college professors and administrators.  Especially since Boucher did tell him no, and I think Linkletter did too.  It didn’t seem to help.

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"He's a sensitive boy and your...whatever your whole vibe is." I am sure the professor and the president aren't the first teachers who would find some delightful schadenfreude at his misfortunate in being late for class. Of course Sheldon's hatred of engineering is something ridiculously petty, even if he would later on mostly just be annoyed by Howard because he's Howard, not because of his job. Speaking of, hi Howard!

You really can see why Sheldon is so insufferable so often, especially as an adult, almost every adult in his life lets him get away with everything.

Of course Sheldon even wears his Nobel Prize when he's sitting around just narrating. The engineering plot had a lot of laughs, but I thought everything with Meemaw and Dale was pretty pointless, even if I am always happy to see Reba. I would have much rather checked in more with Mary, Georgie, or Missy. Although Missy gleefully watching Sheldon struggle with homework was pretty great.

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10 minutes ago, tennisgurl said:

You really can see why Sheldon is so insufferable so often, especially as an adult, almost every adult in his life lets him get away with everything.

George really is the only one setting consistent boundaries and consequences. Mary and Meemaw tend to cave and the teachers just want him to shut up.

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1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

I thought everything with Meemaw and Dale was pretty pointless, even if I am always happy to see Reba. 

I thought the Meemaw/Dale/June triangle was interesting, it seemed very true to life.  Shows how complicated adult relationships can be, like being divorced but still caring for that person like a family member.

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8 hours ago, ChitChat said:

That's embarrassing! When our son went to college, we all went to a day of orientation (parents separately).  We had to listen to a little lecture about not being helicopter parents.   I think they said there are 3 types of parents:  The ones who drop their student off on move in day and drive away, never to be seen again!;  The ones who are helicopter parents who are a little too involved;  And I think the third was the ones who tried to live the college experience through their son/daughter.  I'm not sure on that one.  We didn't fall into any of those categories, so we just sat there and snickered at the parents who did!!  

We had an overnight summer orientation thing and the parents were put in a completely different part of the dorm from the future students. I have no idea what they did with the parents when they weren't with us. I was three hours away; my parents came out for parents weekend and stuff like that, but mostly I only saw them when I went home for breaks. As far as I know the only contact they had with the school was for money stuff. (And I have a late birthday so I was still a minor when I started college, too.)

I would expect a 12 year old's parents to be more involved, though.

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12 minutes ago, ams1001 said:

I would expect a 12 year old's parents to be more involved, though.

I agree.  I was thinking that maybe the professor could've given him a hint as to what the problem was, but in the end it was better for Sheldon to figure it out on his own. 

Sometimes everybody rushes in to help him and he's got to learn to deal with certain problems on his own before calling in the cavalry!!  His Dad has been saying that for awhile now.  

I loved the Professor's pithy comment about the only math that will matter when the tunnel collapses is how many dead bodies are in there.  Ain't that the truth!   

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4 hours ago, rmontro said:

I thought the Meemaw/Dale/June triangle was interesting, it seemed very true to life.  Shows how complicated adult relationships can be, like being divorced but still caring for that person like a family member.

Same here.  I preferred that storyline to the one involving Sheldon and the math prof.  He was an unmitigated ass.  I don't care what he thought he was trying to prove with the way he was treating Sheldon (and incidentally I would presume all the other students as well) but he handed out an assigment on the first day or so of a freshman class and expected superlative work from students he had not yet even begun to teach.  

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1 hour ago, SusannahM said:

I don't care what he thought he was trying to prove with the way he was treating Sheldon (and incidentally I would presume all the other students as well) but he handed out an assigment on the first day or so of a freshman class and expected superlative work from students he had not yet even begun to teach.  

I see your point, but Sheldon was pretty pompous in thinking that he could finish that assignment so quickly.  I know that he's still a young boy, but intellectually he's advanced for his age, and sometimes needs to be taken down a notch or two.  

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19 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Of course Sheldon even wears his Nobel Prize when he's sitting around just narrating. The engineering plot had a lot of laughs, but I thought everything with Meemaw and Dale was pretty pointless, even if I am always happy to see Reba. I would have much rather checked in more with Mary, Georgie, or Missy. Although Missy gleefully watching Sheldon struggle with homework was pretty great.

It's part of their plan to rename the show "Old Meemaw" and eliminate the rest of the cast.

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15 hours ago, ChitChat said:

but in the end it was better for Sheldon to figure it out on his own. 

My first boss was like that - decided it would be better for the women to figure it out on our own while he helped the one male associate.  Only later did he discover that the women worked it all out very logically that accidentally got him the right answer the first time (so he didn’t bother to check our method or listen to us), but was actually an incorrect method for future issues.  He was pretty embarrassed later on as we blithely continued “solving” stuff.  So sure, leave Sheldon to figure it out with absolutely no guidance and count the bodies then.

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11 minutes ago, Tom Holmberg said:

It's part of their plan to rename the show "Old Meemaw" and eliminate the rest of the cast.

I haven't seen every episode this season but the ones I've seen would be aptly renamed The MeeMaw and George Show,  Reading the comments for last weeks episode it does seem like Mary had a larger role but for the most part this season she's had a scene or two, maybe a line or two and that's been it.  I don't know if this is a deliberate choice on the actress's part or not or maybe it's what happens with a large cast and an (it feels like) 20 minute or less show!

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On 11/18/2021 at 11:25 PM, Crs97 said:

I didn’t understand the professor’s point. He wasn’t even looking at the designs to see whether Sheldon had factored in wind.  Color me not impressed. 

I think they did a poor job writing the professor, it made him look more unreasonable than he was teaching Sheldon a lesson. (We don't even really know if Sheldon's final bridge wouldn't have been torn up too.  Mixing the "late rule" with the bridge assignment didn't really work as an ending, for me at least.)

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1 hour ago, SusannahM said:

I haven't seen every episode this season but the ones I've seen would be aptly renamed The MeeMaw and George Show,  Reading the comments for last weeks episode it does seem like Mary had a larger role but for the most part this season she's had a scene or two, maybe a line or two and that's been it.  I don't know if this is a deliberate choice on the actress's part or not or maybe it's what happens with a large cast and an (it feels like) 20 minute or less show!

Is Zoe Perry pregnant or a new mom?  That might be why she's MIA?

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Professor Boucher was awesome, not taking any of Sheldon’s crap and making him work to figure it out in his own. 

I thought he was a crap teacher.  Why would a starter engineering course not teach engineering.    I could see a graduate level student having to figure out problems on their own before approaching the professor, but an intro course?  It's not like the prof covered it in class and Sheldon forgot to apply it to his bridge design.   I think the Sheldon-professor interactions needed a little more context for the prof's actions to be amusing in light of Sheldon's struggles.

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1 hour ago, Frost said:

I thought he was a crap teacher.  Why would a starter engineering course not teach engineering.    I could see a graduate level student having to figure out problems on their own before approaching the professor, but an intro course?  It's not like the prof covered it in class and Sheldon forgot to apply it to his bridge design.   I think the Sheldon-professor interactions needed a little more context for the prof's actions to be amusing in light of Sheldon's struggles.

Agree, the guy was a crap teacher.  Even if you assume that he was only focusing on Sheldon that way because of his arrogance, he was still a crap teacher.  The only way I might let it slide is if he actually covered the wind topic in his lecture, but Sheldon was too sure of himself to listen.  But we were never shown that, so I have to conclude he was a crap teacher.

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4 hours ago, Frost said:

I could see a graduate level student having to figure out problems on their own before approaching the professor, but an intro course?

I'm going with the assumption that the professor taught them more basics than what we saw, but since we didn't see that, who knows!  Maybe the professor was trying to gauge everybody's knowledge of math and engineering.   

 I find it interesting because when my son was 16 he went to a summer engineering camp at a university and they divided up into groups.  Their assignment was to design and build a miniature bridge, which had to hold up to certain specifications.  This from young people who had no clue about such things (other than bridge building with Legos!)  Of course their math skills came into play and they had a lot of fun with the project.   All Sheldon had to do was draw one on paper.  Yes, maybe a hint would've helped, but maybe the professor knew he could figure it out if he really tried.  Sheldon is a whiz at math.  He just needed to study on it and figure it out.  Sheldon needs to learn that he can't run and whine to the university professor every time something doesn't go his way.  He was late to class and was locked out.  He knew better.  

I saw an article today somewhere online in which the writer spoke of his disappointment with the Howard/Sheldon interaction in the narration.  He thought the episode didn't live up to the hype of Howard's actual cameo.  It was better when we didn't know that Kaley and Mayim were going to be on show, so there wasn't any hype to live up to.  I agreed with him.   

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17 hours ago, Frost said:

I thought he was a crap teacher.  Why would a starter engineering course not teach engineering.    I could see a graduate level student having to figure out problems on their own before approaching the professor, but an intro course?  It's not like the prof covered it in class and Sheldon forgot to apply it to his bridge design.   I think the Sheldon-professor interactions needed a little more context for the prof's actions to be amusing in light of Sheldon's struggles.

I think the idea was that the students were given the assignment at the beginning of the course so they could start thinking about it, but it had to be turned in later, after they had been taught things about bridge design.  And Sheldon, of course, thought he could figure everything out by himself and did not need to wait for instruction, so he kept turning his design in early.  Sheldon tried several times, it must have been several days, Boucher must have taught them something during that time, right?  But I agree, the professor’s job is to teach engineering, and what we saw him do to Sheldon was not that.

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3 hours ago, shura said:

I think the idea was that the students were given the assignment at the beginning of the course so they could start thinking about it, but it had to be turned in later, after they had been taught things about bridge design.

That makes sense.  Too bad the writing of the episode was so unclear.

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Boucher did strike me as quite the horse's backside, but the frequently insufferable Sheldon often brings that out in the people who have to deal with him. It would be incredibly frustrating to attempt to teach someone who believes he already knows everything worth knowing, someone who has been coddled his whole life because of his undeniable gifts, and someone who insists upon having his own way, unconcerned and clueless about the impact this may have on anyone else's career or life.

Emotional intelligence matters. So does practical application of knowledge.

It's going to take Sheldon A LOT of years to even consider such concepts without derision.

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6 hours ago, MollyMelrose said:

It would be incredibly frustrating to attempt to teach someone who believes he already knows everything worth knowing, someone who has been coddled his whole life because of his undeniable gifts, and someone who insists upon having his own way, unconcerned and clueless about the impact this may have on anyone else's career or life.

So true.  Didn't Sheldon start off by telling the Professor one of his "fun facts," as if the Professor was clueless?  That didn't endear Sheldon to him like Sheldon thought it did!  

I know there are professors out there who are used to teaching higher level classes as opposed to the Freshman classes.   Maybe that's what he's used to.    I don't see him as an ass, but rather as someone who says what he means, and means what he says.  He had a little bit of a sense of humor, so I don't think he's so bad.  

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On 11/19/2021 at 1:28 PM, Sarah 103 said:

I agree with this. By 17 or 18 someone in college should have the maturity and the people skills to deal with a professor without going to thier parents for help (it's okay for the student to talk to parents to figure out what to do, what to say, how to approach the issue, but not for the parents to call or be in the room with the professor). However, Sheldon is around 12. There is a massive difference in maturity and people skills between a normal/average 12 and 17 year old. It is not fair to expect a 12 year old to be where a 17 year is in terms of maturity and people skills. 

Today parents of college students are more involved than they have been in the past and probably should be. 

I agree with you that parents today are generally overinvolved with their kids in college, I saw the coddling starting 30 years ago when I worked in college admissions and it's only gotten worse.  However I don't agree that parents should just let their kids sink or swim in such difficult situations even at 17, 18, or even 20.  It depends on the situation, though, and I'm not sure how I feel about Sheldon's professor.  There is a massive power imbalance between teacher and student and being slightly older doesn't change anything.  Some teachers will abuse that power no matter how a student defends themselves.  I know this from personal experience with a professor in college who was a gigantic hump worse than this guy with a reputation a mile long.  When I was 19 I was very sick with the flu for the final in his course and missed it, but he was dead set against giving me an incomplete and retest.  I suppose he just wanted to give me an F and call it a day.  I complained to the Dean's office but they acted wimpish about it so I had no choice but to get my parents involved, and thank goodness I did.   I managed to get a B in his course (I should have gotten an A), which was better than the alternative.  As it is, he singlehandedly wrecked up my cumulative index in my major (Philosophy), which would have been a perfect 4.0 if not for him.  I also had to fight for being granted double major status due to a glitch in the school's recordkeeping system (this was back in the '70s when computers were a lot less sophisticated).  I had the written proof of having declared the major, but because it wasn't in their computer system they weren't going to acknowledge the double major.  I fought for myself but it wasn't enough both times without my parents, and I consider myself to have been pretty socially mature for my age and able to handle such situations.  It was the power imbalance that made the difference. I'm sure being a small, attractive young woman over 40 years ago also played a role in how I was treated somewhat dismissively.  

Now in Sheldon's case, the teachers all treat him like an oddity that they are mildly afraid of on the one hand, but who they would secretly love to defeat on the other.  So to a degree Sheldon unknowingly brings such behavior upon himself but that still doesn't make it fair or the professor's behavior justified.  And depending on the situation it also doesn't mean a college student should be expected to deal with it themselves.

Edited by Yeah No
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