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S04.E03: Raddoppiarlo


kariyaki
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At least Doctor Senator sees the longer play with a possible Fadda civil war 

I’m not liking the season very much. We’re more than 25% through, and I feel like the story hasn’t started. Dr. Harvard and his bigotry seem more sinister than the gangsters, and I’m rolling my eyes at some of the acting. I don’t feel like calling out anyone specifically, but I’m hoping main characters start dying soon. The only part I am enjoying is trying to figure out where the people fit in the Fargo universe. 

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So, has Timothy Olyphant managed to already make "Deafy" one of the coolest Mormons ever?  Because I really can't think of any Mormon characters from any show I have watched that is cool has him!  I'll be first to admit that Olyphant seem to be diving into his Raylan Givens style of characterization here, but I honestly can't complain.  He's already become my favorite character so far (followed by Rabbi and Doctor Senator.)  I just hope he'll be here for the long haul, despite only being considered a guest actor.

Enjoyed this more than the previous two episodes, even if I kind of figured it was heading towards various unpredictable events likely being the cause of an eventual gang war.  First, Gaetano tries to go around his brother to take out Loy's oldest son, only for it to fall apart since Rabbi has something that resembles a moral compass.  Then the two escape convicts rob Loy's establishment, leading to him and the rest of the Black Syndicate thinking that was also part of the Italian Mafia's plan.  Call me crazy, but I doubt this is going to end with Loy and Josto reaching out to one another and realizing that all of this was just a simple misunderstanding!

Crazy Nurse Lady apparently just wants people to me more direct and forward with her.  And if that somehow ends with her giving the head of the Italian Mafia a handjob while singing to him, then so be it!

While I don't find Chris Rock horrible here, I am starting to think that he lacks the menace and intensity that I feel like Loy needs.  Granted, Jason Schwartzman isn't either of those either, but I feel like Josto is suppose to be insecure and kind of wimpy.  But for Loy, I keep feeling like he would be more interesting if someone like, say, Mahershala Ali or Idris Elba was playing him. 

Edited by thuganomics85
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3 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

But for Loy, I keep feeling like he would be more interesting if someone like, say, Mahershala Ali or Idris Elba was playing him. 

Then he would be a total badass [Blade] and the crew would be spineless and dull....

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Every time Gaetano and/or Josto are on screen I just lose interest. Neither the characters nor their actors are doing it for me, while everyone else I am at least mildly intrigued by and want to see where they're going. 

I'd watch an entire show just about Doctor Senator's life.

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The only gangsters I care about in the slightest are Rabbi and Doctor Senator.

And honestly, the Oraetta character isn't doing it for me, either (even though Jessie Buckley is very good). It's like the writers entered a bunch of crazy quirks into a computer and let it write all her scenes.

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I watched this episode in the light of day rather than half asleep when it was released on Hulu--which just robbed me of sleep--so I was able to follow the action.
It also helped not having it be two long episodes.

The meaning of the episode title, "Raddoppiarlo" is "the price of the ticket has doubled" (collinsdictionary.com/us/dictionary/italian-english/raddoppiare).

Ben Wishaw has never disappointed in any performances where I've seen him. They always seem to be roles that leave the viewer wanting more. I wonder if that's deliberate on his part with regards to the type of roles he accepts, or if it's just the shows I've seen, e.g., The Hour.

I haven't really followed Timothy Oliphant, but I do enjoy his role here.

Jessie Buckley as Oraetta Mayflower continues to amuse.
Who did she really intend the pie to be eaten by and for what outcome?

Salvatore Esposito as Gaetano Fadda reminds me of younger Vincent D'Onofrio. I wonder if the actor has studied D'Onofrio's work, or if it's just the similar phenotype.

I appreciate that Chris Rock and Jason Schwartzman are treating this as the ensemble cast that it is.

I agree with those whose favorite character is Glynn Turman as the oft-underappreciated genius, Doctor Senator.

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I am stunned at just how awful this production is.

It's one indulgent and incoherent scene after another.  The one guy who was real was the police captain.  Nobody else of any import can be or react in any sane manner.  Maybe Lemuel, who bested his dad in front of everyone.  Yeah, that's how a mob boss runs - he lets his son call him out as a fool in front of his outfit.  Cannon's pontifications are so much blather.  Hawley wants us to only consider deepest truth.  Any and all conscious motivations are all an illusion.

If everything is about wickedness and evil, there is no point to living.  None.

There is pretty much no point to this series.

Since I am human and I am fascinated by train wrecks, I'll keep watching.

 

Edited by Lonesome Rhodes
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Quote

Zelmare and Swanee help the Smutnys with their debt.

So they're planning to give up some of the money? If the Smutneys pay off their debt with bills that have been washed and dried and still smell like vomit, they'll get a whole new set of problems.

"If I don't come back, I'm dead or in jail" means "I would never abandon you."

 

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I wonder if Timothy Olyphant's character is to be the "moral" compass of this season like Keith Carradine and Patrick Wilson in seasons 1 and 2.  I kind of hope that the Fadda family does devolve into a civil war between the two brothers as I don't really care for those characters.  So far I don't really see a clear story outside of two rival gangs.  Like others, I think the story should be a bit more developed at this point.  

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I like Rabbi Milligan's moral compass.  Or just common sense.  OF COURSE, there would be a major war if they killed the eldest Cannon.  Good thing he and Doctor Senator are around.

The scene with Orietta and Josto had me laughing.  Especially the choice of music.

I'm all about giving Timothy Olyphant some more screen time, even if it's just Raylan as a Mormon.  

Not really liking Salvatore Esposito's method of acting.  I get that he's supposed to be unstable, but he overacts his role.  I find myself drifting off when he's on screen.

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All of the talk about seeing the devil and the devil whispering in peoples ears makes me wonder if Lorne Malvo will show up again. 

This episode was better than the last two, I think I am getting a bit of a better idea of what is happening and who is who. Timothy Olyphant arrives and is already a blast, and his give and take with the corrupt cop is already interesting. Especially as Olyphants characters, while seemingly an honest officer, is also rather prejudiced, and in a very specific kind of way, while the corrupt cop in the Faddas pocket tells him to shut up with all the comments about people with darker sin being more sinful or whatever. Plus him telling him that his apparent OCD was a sign of the devil in him probably didnt endear him to him very much. Still, I dont think that Olyphants character is a bad guy, and might be this seasons good guy in the law enforcement world. 

Rabbi Milligan and the amazingly named Doctor Senator are definitely my favorite characters so far, especially as they seem to be the smartest people on their respective sides. Doctor Sentator could tell right away that there is drama between the Fadda siblings, and Rabbi could clearly see that not only is killing the eldest Cannon pretty terrible, its also a stupid idea that would needlessly escalate things to a full gang war. I especially like the scenes with the younger Cannon and Rabbi Milligan,they have a weird kind of sweetness that the rest of the show lacks. Normally in Fargo we have tons of criminals and weirdos and murderers and seemingly normal people with dark sides all over the place, with their screwball schemes leading to disasters, but this season has a lot more emphasis on the criminals and weirdos. 

Robbing the Cannons? To get money money to pay them back again? Brilliant idea, rob the violent criminal syndicate! Brilliant! Plus is anyone connected the dots and realized who they were and who they are related to, it would just make everything worse.   

Edited by tennisgurl
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10 hours ago, Blakeston said:

And honestly, the Oraetta character isn't doing it for me, either (even though Jessie Buckley is very good). It's like the writers entered a bunch of crazy quirks into a computer and let it write all her scenes.

Agree. I groan when she comes on the screen. I hope we see some direction from her besides killing. Maybe she can help dopey criminal beat his more violent brother. 

1 hour ago, madmax said:

Not really liking Salvatore Esposito's method of acting.  I get that he's supposed to be unstable, but he overacts his role.  I find myself drifting off when he's on screen.

If he is the crazy violent brother, I kind of like him. But his character is being restrained. They need to let him off leash.

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20 hours ago, ElectricBoogaloo said:

Tim Olyphant back in a cowboy hat AND playing a marshal? Hell yeah! I don’t even care if FX is blatantly pandering. I’ll take it if that means I get some Raylan Givens every week!

Or as Boyd Crowder would say, “Raaaaaaylan Givens!”

Gitaeno looks like a big malevolent baby to me, acts like one too. I love Ben Whishaw’s Rabbi. He can really identify with Satchel’s plight.

Flatulence is a recurring theme this season, eh?

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22 hours ago, thuganomics85 said:

Call me crazy, but I doubt this is going to end with Loy and Josto reaching out to one another and realizing that all of this was just a simple misunderstanding!

Well, it seems like most of the violent bloodbaths and season-long revenge arcs on Fargo stem from simple misunderstandings, don't they?

In Season 1, Moses Tripoli (fka Hanzee Dent) sent Mr. Numbers and Mr. Wrench after Lorne Malvo when he killed Sam Hess - assuming Sam was killed for "business" reasons.  No, it was entirely personal! Just messing with Sam for being a bully to Lester. Or being a bully & jerk in general.

Season 2: the Gerhardts assume their son Rye was killed by the KC Mob as part of their takeover scheme.  No, he death was a simple car accident, covered up by Peggy and Ed (the "Butcher of Luverne"!) Blumquist.  The Gerhardts declare all-out war on Ed as well as the KC guys, including Mike Milligan (fka Satchel Cannon?  Probably!) No worries; Mike survives to get his very own office with his very own IBM Selectric typewriter at the end.

Season 3 (forgettable as it was): Ray Stussy sends his parolee, Maurice, to rob his brother Emmitt, in Eden Prairie.  Maurice gets stoned on the drive, lets the address blow out the window, and ends up robbing/killing Ennis Stussy in Eden Valley.  Thus getting Ennis's stepdaughter Gloria, the Eden Valley cop, on the case. Hijinks ensue.

Simple misunderstandings leading to violent bloodbaths is the recurring thread all through this series. And we wouldn't have it any other way!

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On 10/5/2020 at 11:05 AM, Blakeston said:

And honestly, the Oraetta character isn't doing it for me, either (even though Jessie Buckley is very good). It's like the writers entered a bunch of crazy quirks into a computer and let it write all her scenes.

(There must be an "ie" in her name). Does anyone think they told her to walk like the Joker's "nurse" in Batman The Dark Knight?

I'd love to see her and Deafy have a conversation on heresy and Christianity. They 'magically' seem to share the same opinions on The Souls of Black Folk.

Edited by Eulipian 5k
corrected Batman title
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With the death of the "boss mang" so early and abruptly, there is a "Prizzi's Honor" thing going on with the Fadda family.

BTW: is Gaetano Italian or American? He's the younger brother so why/when did he go to Italy to fight for DJT,  Il Duce?

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31 minutes ago, Eulipian 5k said:

With the death of the "boss mang" so early and abruptly, there is a "Prizzi's Honor" thing going on with the Fadda family.

BTW: is Gaetano Italian or American? He's the younger brother so why/when did he go to Italy to fight for DJT,  Il Duce?

Are we sure Gaetano & Josto have the same mom?? 

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Overall, I am enjoying this season very much. I guess I'm basing it on how much I really hated season 3, like, everything about it. I didn't even enjoy the Carrie C*** character.

But the one problem I'm having with this season, as well-done as it is, is that there is no one to clearly root for. No Molly, no Lou, not even Mike Milligan or Peggy and Ed, whom you root for in a weird way.

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I think Rabbi and Doctor Senator are the essential characters of the season.  And, perhaps the nurse will take out other people through various misunderstandings.  Like an above poster I don't know what she was trying to do with the pie (give the whole family diarrhea?  to what end?).  

I hope that the story develops a bit more in the next episode. 

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3 hours ago, cpcathy said:

there is no one to clearly root for. No Molly, no Lou, not even Mike Milligan or Peggy and Ed, whom you root for in a weird way.

Oh, now don'tcha think Mike Milligan is already there?  Up in the Faddas' attic with his protector, the "Rabbi"?

Quote

Are we sure Gaetano & Josto have the same mom?? 

...and/or dad?

I'm thinking he might be the child of a mistress who stayed behind in "the Boot" when Donatello and his legitimate family came over. He's pretty young; maybe still in utero at the time?  We don't know how long the Faddas were in America before the 1934 son exchange.

Quote

 Like an above poster I don't know what she was trying to do with the pie (give the whole family diarrhea?  to what end?).  

Probably to make the family sick - so good old Nurse Oraetta can come over and "take care of" them! Because she's obviously a manipulative person who likes to stir things up. Homicide-hero complex?  Munchausen by proxy?

Ipecac is actually a very potent emetic (induces vomiting!), not really a laxative.  But I guess Swanee ate practically the whole damn pie and it just came out both ends!

Ipecac is pretty much an obsolete drug now, as there are better ways to counteract poisonings or overdoses.  But up until the 1970's/ or even early '80's, many households kept a bottle of it in case a child swallowed something harmful.  I certainly did when I had small children. Never had to use it, fortunately.

Edited by The Wild Sow
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On 10/6/2020 at 11:08 AM, cpcathy said:

 

But the one problem I'm having with this season, as well-done as it is, is that there is no one to clearly root for. No Molly, no Lou, not even Mike Milligan or Peggy and Ed, whom you root for in a weird way.

I'm rooting for Ethelrida!  And for Rabbi and Satchel.  I get the feeling I'm alone in liking Chris Rock's performance - his speech to the panhandler was great.

I get the feeling that they want us to see Gaetano as the big bad - like Malvo or Varga - and I'm not buying that.

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This season has been rough so far. I agree with a lot of the posts in this thread. 

Gaetano is super distracting. His acting is distracting, his crazy eyes are not working for me. 

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7 minutes ago, hurrrz said:

Gaetano is super distracting. His acting is distracting, his crazy eyes are not working for me. 

He's playing a villain straight out of the movies of his period. When he's older he'll have a proper mustache to twirl.

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13 hours ago, meep.meep said:

I get the feeling that they want us to see Gaetano as the big bad - like Malvo or Varga - and I'm not buying that.

Totally agree, and I feel the same way about Oraetta. It seems like they're trying to recapture the chaotic quirkiness of Peggy Blumquist from season 2, and it's not working for me. For all her ridiculousness, Peggy had a clear goal ("actualization") and we got to see various parts of her life that showed why she felt unsatisfied. By contrast, after three episodes Oraetta just seems quirky for the sake of quirkiness, and I have absolutely no idea what she's really thinking and what her motivations are. I want to like her, but I just can't yet.

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What always anchored Fargo was the humor and heart, from Marge Gunderson, Molly, Lou and Hank, Gloria, and how they dealt with crime.  Cutting out something so fundamental to Fargo is weird, but beyond that I find it substandard as a whole.  Farts now pass as humor.  The Coens should pull the plug before it gets any worse.

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I'm done. The story doesn't interest me much and neither do the characters. I might have tried to hang in there a few more weeks to see if it picked up, but I disagree vehemently with the writers' firm belief that farting and vomiting and greatly magnified chewing sounds are Fun!! It just annoys me and if a huge vomiting scene hits while I'm eating something while watching I get really pissed. Are these writers sixth grade boys?

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On 10/7/2020 at 2:37 PM, hurrrz said:

This season has been rough so far. I agree with a lot of the posts in this thread. 

Gaetano is super distracting. His acting is distracting, his crazy eyes are not working for me. 

This times 1,000! His crazy over exaggerated crazy eyes was so distracting I had to fast forward past his scenes and probably missed something the writers want me to know but good gosh! Its like something out of a bad acting class where the teacher says “act deranged” and this was the best the untalented hac could come up with.  

I agree with the others that I’m struggling to keep watching, the story is just all over the place. We’ve got escaped comic book convicts (another case of horrible over acting), the mortuary family, kid swapping, crazy murderous nurse, handjobs in cars, mafia vs black syndicate vs. internal mafia fight, Mormon deputy, dirty cop, race relations, evil Wasp doctor, I mean ugh.  The only scenes I enjoy are the Rabbi and there’s not enough of him. I find myself constantly checking the time. 

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On 10/4/2020 at 11:38 PM, Kiddvideo said:

I’m not liking the season very much. We’re more than 25% through, and I feel like the story hasn’t started. 

I feel the same way.  Too many characters, too much backstory, nothing that is really anchoring my interest.  Feels more like Miller's Crossing than Fargo in tone, and I wasn't a huge fan of MC.

On 10/5/2020 at 3:25 PM, Lonesome Rhodes said:

I am stunned at just how awful this production is. ...

Since I am human and I am fascinated by train wrecks, I'll keep watching.

I'm there with you! Not quite ready to abandon Noah Hawley yet, but he is surely trying my patience.

On 10/8/2020 at 3:53 PM, Pike Ludwell said:

I'm done. The story doesn't interest me much and neither do the characters. I might have tried to hang in there a few more weeks to see if it picked up, ...

Ditto.  This storyline sounded so promising when I first read about it, but the execution has been puzzling, to say the least.

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On 10/5/2020 at 9:46 PM, Ottis said:

Agree. I groan when she comes on the screen. I hope we see some direction from her besides killing. Maybe she can help dopey criminal beat his more violent brother. 

Me, too. It’s like this character wandered in from a different series. Her connection to the rest of the story is taking too long to establish. I’m tired of her and her poisoned baked goods. 

On 10/5/2020 at 10:33 PM, LittleIggy said:

Gitaeno looks like a big malevolent baby to me, acts like one too. I love Ben Whishaw’s Rabbi.

Ben Whitshaw makes anything interesting and that includes this season of Fargo. He has already done so much with relatively little screen time. Doctor Senator is great but I wouldn’t expect less from Glynn Turman.

Gaetano and his growing presence in this story may cause me to abandon this show. He is a caricature. I’m finding nothing interesting about his interpretation of a crazed, violent mobster. It’s been done before and done better. Perhaps this is Hawley’s “comic relief.” Regardless, I’m not enjoying it.

On 10/9/2020 at 10:50 AM, sadie said:

I agree with the others that I’m struggling to keep watching, the story is just all over the place. We’ve got escaped comic book convicts (another case of horrible over acting), the mortuary family, kid swapping, crazy murderous nurse, handjobs in cars, mafia vs black syndicate vs. internal mafia fight, Mormon deputy, dirty cop, race relations, evil Wasp doctor, I mean ugh.  The only scenes I enjoy are the Rabbi and there’s not enough of him. I find myself constantly checking the time. 

Well said. Right now, this is a big jumble of characters and storylines. Lots of quirky characters do not necessarily make a great story. This seems like a lot of style over substance. As others have said, not one character embodies the heart of the story. 

Edited by Ellaria Sand
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