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S07.E15: Tell All Part 2

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The couples of 90 Day Fiancé meet for the first time in a dramatic Tell All showdown in New York City. Host Shaun Robinson gets answers to your burning questions as shocking reveals and juicy details are uncovered from this season.

Airs February 17, 2020.

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Natalie has a lot of easy triggers that set her off. Does she have any actual evidence that Mike betrayed her? Probably not. Self sabotage. Have no idea what to believe. No one is perfect. Including her.

It would be nice if Jasmin could connect a bit with Blake’s friends. She does not have to like them. Just a bit of courtesy and small talk. Otherwise, find someone who will let her sip her green tea.

Angela seemed a bit restrained. I suppose no one wanted to get in to a shoving match with her.

Tania, there is more than one soulmate. Doubt you and Syngin will last until you both grow up, find jobs, and make some sort of life outside the shed.

Hope we don’t see most of these folks again unless it is a where are they now show two years from now.

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So, basically the silent treatments and accusations of betrayal was because Mike told Natalie that he slept on his ex-girlfriend's couch and her fiancé wasn't there?!  I am with Robert, if you know that your fiancé is extremely jealous why would you do that?

I enjoyed seeing how nice and supportive the cast was with each other.  See Angela, that is how it's done.  

 

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Natalie seems like a nightmare to date let alone marry . She says that no one can make her feel what she doesn’t feel .. and she says “ would you rather me lie to you ?” 
um.. but it’s ok to force someone to have the same religious beliefs as you ? It’s always the Natalie show . She’s exhausting . 
 

Im not sure why jasmin is blaming her lack of a personality on being from Finland , but she really is the biggest dud . 
that being said , I’d be annoyed too if anytime me and my fiancé / husband hung out with his friends , it had to be at a nightclub /bar . Why can’t they do something different that everyone would enjoy ? ( not that I think Jasmin actually enjoys anything besides scamming gullible Americans . 

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I guess Natalie does not believe platonic friendships can exist.  It would be interesting to see what the best friend looks like.  If she is not a temptress it would be more believable that it was innocent.  It would be super trashy to screw the night before the wedding, and they would both have to be willing to sink that low. 

21 minutes ago, Adeejay said:

So, basically the silent treatments and accusations of betrayal was because Mike told Natalie that he slept on his ex-girlfriend's couch and her fiancé wasn't there?! 

He said they had never been romantically involved, just roommates and friends.

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21 minutes ago, Jaclyn88 said:

Natalie seems like a nightmare to date let alone marry . She says that no one can make her feel what she doesn’t feel .. and she says “ would you rather me lie to you ?” 
um.. but it’s ok to force someone to have the same religious beliefs as you ? It’s always the Natalie show . She’s exhausting . 
 

Im not sure why jasmin is blaming her lack of a personality on being from Finland , but she really is the biggest dud . 
that being said , I’d be annoyed too if anytime me and my fiancé / husband hung out with his friends , it had to be at a nightclub /bar . Why can’t they do something different that everyone would enjoy ? ( not that I think Jasmin actually enjoys anything besides scamming gullible Americans . 

Natalie is a nutjob.  Why on earth would Mike sleep with a dear friend the night before her wedding, we've seen nothing that makes that story at all believable.  As Spike said, that's a level of trashy that's something special.  

Blake's friends need to back off, they can see she's just got here and getting her footing.  Invite her out for something besides a bar/rap show.  Blake needs to never wear those blue contacts again, it looked creepy. Otherwise I find him pretty likable, with an endearing smile.

Emily really does look fine with her "extra" weight, but she doesn't know how to dress herself at all, the outfit she's wearing is so unflattering..  Those ankle booties don't work with that dress at all.  

Surprisingly Grangela looks good, for her, her hair is styled, the botox looks to have settled, and her outfit is fairly restrained, at least the top part.  I'm sure we'll be seeing her again.

Edited by blubld43
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Wow, Shaun Robinson was really reaching for the Pulitizer with her stern "Tell us about the aliens," while leaning. 

Too bad she biffed it on everything else. 

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Notice it's when the middle  Goofball saying he hopes Angela doesn't beat up Michael again s when she got triggered and walked off. 

Yea Angela, Sharp might not be able to have you back again if there's another uproar over your violent ways.

Edited by Leilani
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1 hour ago, PityFree said:

Natalie is a lunatic with an overactive imagination. 

Natalie has been shown to be deep into Russian Orthodox teachings and has repeatedly shown a very out-dated and old-fashioned view on the gender roles in a relationship. I don't think it's that much of a leap to see how she could be offended by what happened.

Of course, we don't know the whole story and personally, I don't think Alien Mike is the innocent and sweet lamb that other people do - this is the guy who had a morning tiff with his fiancée and ran out of the house in his pajama pants and slippers to go do a little day-drinking and make a sad little stack of his red Solo cups on his rubber tire table - but I can see how someone with Natalie's views could come to that conclusion. 

Edited by Callaphera
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Jasmine and Blake did socialize with his friends a couple of times not in a bar or club, but she was a cold fish then too. She wasn’t even that happy at her own wedding. Maybe, she had something else on her mind.

Edited by SunnyBeBe
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Natalia is so annoying with her silence in response to questions or deflecting the question back, that alone should motivate Mike to dump her and never look back.

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27 minutes ago, Callaphera said:

Natalie has been shown to be deep into Russian Orthodox teachings and has repeatedly shown a very out-dated and old-fashioned view on the gender roles in a relationship. I don't think it's that much of a leap to see how she could be offended by what happened.

Of course, we don't know the whole story and personally, I don't think Alien Mike is the innocent and sweet lamb that other people do - this is the guy who had a morning tiff with his fiancée and ran out of the house in his pajama pants and slippers to go do a little day-drinking and make a sad little stack of his red Solo cups on his rubber tire table - but I can see how someone with Natalie's views could come to that conclusion. 

I could see being initially put out, but I wonder what it was she thought he should do?  Drive home tired and probably drunk once he found out that the fiancee wasn't going to come home as planned?  

For her to feel betrayed over this a YEAR LATER is silly.  

The only think Mike is possibly doing wrong is that some men get with crazy women because they like being a martyr.  If Mike sincerely gets back with Natalie he may be one of those men.  

But, I also don't judge him for the day drinking. 

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4 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

If Mike wants what Natalie is serving, then he’s as crazy as she is and deserves what he gets. 

This.  At this point, Natalie's mask is completely off and her red flags are at full mast, so ignorance is no excuse.  

Speaking of red flags

 

Edited by RealReality
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1 minute ago, RealReality said:

I could see being initially put out, but I wonder what it was she thought he should do?  Drive home tired and probably drunk once he found out that the fiancee wasn't going to come home as planned?  

Taxi to a motel, most likely. I don't agree with her but I can see her point of view. Especially if she and the best friend got into it like they were dancing around saying. 

 

2 minutes ago, RealReality said:

But, I also don't judge him for the day drinking. 

I judge him for not being able to get over himself long enough to change his pajama pants out for a pair of jeans. Like I said in that episode thread, day-drink all you want, I've done it and will do it again myself. But if you're gonna do it in public, maybe a pair of sneakers and jeans would be better than running away in your pajama pants and slippers. 

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Some insecure people are flattered that a lover is insanely and inappropriately jealous over them. They interpret it as love, when in fact it’s an indication of dysfunction.  These possessive people are out of control, demanding, and impossible to satisfy. They will never accept innocent explanations. Total misery with this malcontents. Go for it Mike. It won’t get better.

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3 minutes ago, Leilani said:

Where's her offense to premarital sex and having a baby before getting engaged to Mike, as part of her  deep Russian Orthodox teaching ?

Maybe that's less of a concern for her and it's more her out-dated view on gender roles that's colouring her opinions of the overnight sleepover.  

Edited by Callaphera
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2 minutes ago, Callaphera said:

Taxi to a motel, most likely. I don't agree with her but I can see her point of view. Especially if she and the best friend got into it like they were dancing around saying. 

 

I judge him for not being able to get over himself long enough to change his pajama pants out for a pair of jeans. Like I said in that episode thread, day-drink all you want, I've done it and will do it again myself. But if you're gonna do it in public, maybe a pair of sneakers and jeans would be better than running away in your pajama pants and slippers. 

Sequim doesn't sound like the type of place where you'd get a cab with any ease.  I don't know, I guess he could have waited forever for a cab, paid expensive cab fare to a hotel he doesn't have money for.  But you're right, he could have done that. 

I suspect she and best friend likely got into it AFTER Natalie lost her mind that Mike spent the night there.  Natalie seems bonkers and she was very scant on details, so I think it's possible she confronted the friend or said something.  

I don't drink period, but with that level of insanity and dysfunction going on I might have just left in whatever I was wearing too.  Like one of those horror movies where you're yelling at someone just to get out of the house before someone stabs them!  I think Natalie had locked herself in the bathroom and I'm not sure Mike wanted to go and change in Mama's bathroom.  

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10 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

If Mike wants what Natalie is serving, then he’s as crazy as she is and deserves what he gets. 

Let's not forget he was once married to a woman who left him for another woman so his selection in mates is questionable.

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6 minutes ago, Callaphera said:

Maybe that's less of a concern for her and it's more her out-dated view on gender roles that's colouring her opinions of the overnight sleepover.  

I don't know, outdated gender roles would dictate that a woman is a slut if she sleeps with a man without benefit of marriage.  

It does seem like these outdated gender roles only work to her advantage.  I mean, if the man is the boss of the relationship, shouldn't she be taking up HIS alien religion and not trying to change him?

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15 minutes ago, RealReality said:

Sequim doesn't sound like the type of place where you'd get a cab with any ease.  I don't know, I guess he could have waited forever for a cab, paid expensive cab fare to a hotel he doesn't have money for.  But you're right, he could have done that. 

I thought they said the wedding was out-of-town but I could be wrong. Either way, it doesn't really matter - whatever happened between the two of them, she appeared to be upset and he appeared to be pooh-poohing her opinion because they don't seem able or willing to look at it from the other's point of view. 

 

11 minutes ago, RealReality said:

I don't know, outdated gender roles would dictate that a woman is a slut if she sleeps with a man without benefit of marriage.  

It does seem like these outdated gender roles only work to her advantage.  I mean, if the man is the boss of the relationship, shouldn't she be taking up HIS alien religion and not trying to change him?

That's not necessarily true. It doesn't mean her views are all-encompassing and every single view is outdated - she might have made her peace with premarital sex in a committed relationship but can't wrap her head around opposite sex friendships that lead to overnight stays. Maybe Alien Mike really is the (alien) angel that he's being painted as. I just don't think it's as obvious as she's foreign, therefore she's playing a game/trying to come to America/she's crazy and Alien Mike is American, white, and male so we give him more of a pass in the situation which is, IMO, an unconscious bias that comes up with this show (not specific to your post, just in general). He has an eerie, even keel to his emotions that just isn't natural. I'm not saying she's the bastion of sanity - personally, I think she's nuttier than a fruitcake - but I don't think he's as innocent in the situation (no, I have nothing concrete to back it up, but when have we ever needed evidence to back up a claim here *cough Juliana is clearly a prostitute cough*). 

Edited by Callaphera
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13 minutes ago, RealReality said:

Sequim doesn't sound like the type of place where you'd get a cab with any ease.  I don't know, I guess he could have waited forever for a cab, paid expensive cab fare to a hotel he doesn't have money for.  But you're right, he could have done that. 

I suspect she and best friend likely got into it AFTER Natalie lost her mind that Mike spent the night there.  Natalie seems bonkers and she was very scant on details, so I think it's possible she confronted the friend or said something.  

I don't drink period, but with that level of insanity and dysfunction going on I might have just left in whatever I was wearing too.  Like one of those horror movies where you're yelling at someone just to get out of the house before someone stabs them!  I think Natalie had locked herself in the bathroom and I'm not sure Mike wanted to go and change in Mama's bathroom.  

Agree. There may be more to this and am not sure that Mike is a choirboy, but Natalie wants him to change his fundamental beliefs and she does not seem to be flexible at all. If this is that important to her, she should cut her losses and find somebody who shares her faith. I am not even sure that a belief in God would be enough for her. Bottom line is she doesn't trust him - and she's bonkers.

I lost count of the times I told Tanya to STFU tonight. She just couldn't keep her yap shut, and she's full of it.

I think Grangela missed her calling as an evangelist. She was relishing that performance.

I feel kind of bad for Jasmin. I think she is an extreme introvert and that makes her socially awkward. If she was a drinker, she might loosen up. I think being Finnish is just a lame excuse. And as a non-drinking introvert myself, i can understand her discomfort,  but she really should make some small effort. I thought it was telling that she said she would be willing to hang out with the friends during the day. And maybe she doesn't drink for a reason.

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Emily realized that those ankle boots didn’t do her any favors. In my personal opinion, those short boots belong in the same category as cold-shoulder shirts and clam diggers, as in, NO ONE looks good in them. They should be outlawed.

Take a step back and imagine Natalie being a mother. Scary, right? Tania is a head case but Natalie is a psycho. I wouldn’t trust her with an infant.

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I think Angela and the goofballs are friends, and this was an act.

I think Natalie's craziness is not an act.

 

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The short boots work with jeans or an ankle length pant. Few people can pull them off. It is the same with mid-length boots/booties that come maybe halfway up your leg. Unless you wear pants, they look really stupid on folks who do not have long legs. Same with the Stuart Weitzman thigh high type boots. I am too short for them and they look like waders on me.

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1 hour ago, Callaphera said:

I thought they said the wedding was out-of-town but I could be wrong. Either way, it doesn't really matter - whatever happened between the two of them, she appeared to be upset and he appeared to be pooh-poohing her opinion because they don't seem able or willing to look at it from the other's point of view. 

 

That's not necessarily true. It doesn't mean her views are all-encompassing and every single view is outdated - she might have made her peace with premarital sex in a committed relationship but can't wrap her head around opposite sex friendships that lead to overnight stays. Maybe Alien Mike really is the (alien) angel that he's being painted as. I just don't think it's as obvious as she's foreign, therefore she's playing a game/trying to come to America/she's crazy and Alien Mike is American, white, and male so we give him more of a pass in the situation which is, IMO, an unconscious bias that comes up with this show (not specific to your post, just in general). He has an eerie, even keel to his emotions that just isn't natural. I'm not saying she's the bastion of sanity - personally, I think she's nuttier than a fruitcake - but I don't think he's as innocent in the situation (no, I have nothing concrete to back it up, but when have we ever needed evidence to back up a claim here *cough Juliana is clearly a prostitute cough*). 

But it does always seem to be that her "traditional" beliefs are always at Mike's expense and never at her expense.  She is fine with the religious rules that SHE breaks, but she is firm and inflexible on any departure from the rules that Mike makes.  It's hypocritical.  He is expected to be a more observant of her religious rules than she is.  

I absolutely don't think Natalie is playing a green card scam to get to America.  I don't believe that for a nanosecond and I agree with you there.  I think the Ukraine has a very uneven ratio of men to women.  Add to that that Natalie is in her 30s and a single man who wants a family could pick a younger woman.  Add to that that Natalie has a bunch of boxes she needs to check off.  Add to that that she is nuts.  With all those factors I think she is dating outside the Ukraine because she has to.  I don't think she is targeting the US at all.  

I will say that I find it odd that Sequim Mike is still hellbent on being with Natalie.  I mean, at this point, when the tell all is filmed, the show has finished airing, right?  If so, tons and tons and tons of women, local, domestic and abroad are hitting him up.  He is, IMO, a tall, good looking guy, seems financially responsible, wants to have a family, and be makes pancakes.  So, I know lots of women are reaching out. 

So the fact that he still wants to be with this nutbird might signal that he enjoys this dynamic and likes being a martyr.  And I find that equally manipulative.  

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5 minutes ago, RealReality said:

But it does always seem to be that her "traditional" beliefs are always at Mike's expense and never at her expense.  She is fine with the religious rules that SHE breaks, but she is firm and inflexible on any departure from the rules that Mike makes.  It's hypocritical.  He is expected to be a more observant of her religious rules than she is.  

To be fair, I find almost all religion/religious beliefs to be hypocritical in the way they're applied by the people who believe in them - Natalie also believes that if you don't have her particular God, you don't have a moral compass. But Mike would be completely different so long as he at least paid lip service to her God. Disparities in strict religious views like she supposedly has and like he doesn't have are always going to cause hypocritical imbalances, IMO. (I'm coming at this from an atheist/non-Church of Stargate: SG1 Complete Series box set point of view who married someone with the same views so I dunno, I could be talking out of my ass.)

 

8 minutes ago, RealReality said:

I will say that I find it odd that Sequim Mike is still hellbent on being with Natalie.  I mean, at this point, when the tell all is filmed, the show has finished airing, right?  If so, tons and tons and tons of women, local, domestic and abroad are hitting him up.  He is, IMO, a tall, good looking guy, seems financially responsible, wants to have a family, and be makes pancakes.  So, I know lots of women are reaching out. 

So the fact that he still wants to be with this nutbird might signal that he enjoys this dynamic and likes being a martyr.  And I find that equally manipulative. 

I wonder if this is a case like Cesar and Maria where Sequim/Alien Mike (I'm torn on my favourite descriptor for him) believes that he deserves the (in his opinion) hot foreign blonde woman as opposed to the maybe 7-or-8 cute brunette that flirts with him over the salad case at the local grocery store. Or maybe he's burned his bridges/has a reputation with the locals. Maybe he throws raging Coast to Coast AM listening parties/keggers that the town finds distasteful. I definitely find it odd that someone who on the surface seems so "normal" needs to go to another country to find love - something just ain't right there. 

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8 minutes ago, Callaphera said:

To be fair, I find almost all religion/religious beliefs to be hypocritical in the way they're applied by the people who believe in them - Natalie also believes that if you don't have her particular God, you don't have a moral compass. But Mike would be completely different so long as he at least paid lip service to her God. Disparities in strict religious views like she supposedly has and like he doesn't have are always going to cause hypocritical imbalances, IMO. (I'm coming at this from an atheist/non-Church of Stargate: SG1 Complete Series box set point of view who married someone with the same views so I dunno, I could be talking out of my ass.)

 

I wonder if this is a case like Cesar and Maria where Sequim/Alien Mike (I'm torn on my favourite descriptor for him) believes that he deserves the (in his opinion) hot foreign blonde woman as opposed to the maybe 7-or-8 cute brunette that flirts with him over the salad case at the local grocery store. Or maybe he's burned his bridges/has a reputation with the locals. Maybe he throws raging Coast to Coast AM listening parties/keggers that the town finds distasteful. I definitely find it odd that someone who on the surface seems so "normal" needs to go to another country to find love - something just ain't right there. 

LOL

a) good point on the potential Cesar/Maria dynamic.  Sequim Mike seems so down to earth that I hadn't considered that, but it's a possibility.  

b) I would 100% attend a coast to coast am rager.  I suspect the average coast to coast listener knows how to party like it's 1999 or 4999, which is a year most of them can teleport to.

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7 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I think I need to lay off this show for a while. Last night I dreamed that I married a total stranger that I just met.  At the alter I noticed that he was much shorter than me and also pretty pudgy! Lol I told myself it would be okay. My only concern was that I didn’t yet know his name!!! Lol I know...it’s bizarre. 90 Day overload!

I can one up you. I dreamed about Angela... 😬

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1 hour ago, Christina said:

 

There is no one trained in mental health who would diagnose someone from watching them on tv, especially a show known for frauding and creative editing, but since I don't have that training I have no problem doing so.

I would bet my savings, both dollars, that Natalie has a diagnosed personality disorder. People love to throw around the term "gaslight" when it doesn't apply, yet Natalie is a pretty textbook example of gaslighting in action. She throws her engagement ring at Mike then demands he apologize to her for not forcing it back on her finger. There is nothing he can do correctly because she's nutso and not operating rationally. She creates issues in her head, doesn't tell him the problem, then gets mad when he doesn't react the way she thinks he should, while he's standing there wondering what is even going on. 

Gaslighting is not her only issue that supports a personality disorder, just one that has been so blatant. I don't even think couples counseling would help here. It may help her see that she is not communicating with him in a way he understands, but it would mostly just result in her deciding it's all his fault for not being a mind reader. At least neither one of them appears to be violent, because this relationship is a crash and burn waiting to happen if they don't stay away from each other.

All of this.  

I spent most of my career working with the mentally ill.  I'm not a Dr., but I'd bet my life you're correct about the personality disorder.  From the minute we saw Natalie, she displayed symptoms, the airport suitcase ride, the clinging to her mom at 35, the way her mother rushes to soothe her when she starts getting upset.  

My guess is she will always be exactly as she is now: childlike and demanding.  I really pray she doesn't get pregnant, I don't think she could handle it.

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39 minutes ago, Jel said:

I see what you all are talking about with the host. Right when she is about to get all the details. she says something like, "Well, there's a lot to unpack here, so lets move on."

Bombshellus interputus.

What is her problem? Too refined" Too polite? Too bored?

 

They should stop showing clips for filler.  The people watching this show know what has been aired.  I don’t think a casual viewer is going to suddenly drop in on the tell all.

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10 hours ago, Adeejay said:

So, basically the silent treatments and accusations of betrayal was because Mike told Natalie that he slept on his ex-girlfriend's couch and her fiancé wasn't there?!  I am with Robert, if you know that your fiancé is extremely jealous why would you do that?

I enjoyed seeing how nice and supportive the cast was with each other.  See Angela, that is how it's done.  

 

That kind of jealousy stuff is bullshit. Its a way of controlling someone. If Mike tolerates it, he’ll end up isolated from anyone and everyone. 
Relationships are built on trust. Trust takes time to build. And it’s a two way street. When Mike DARED to question Natalie about any possible thing in her background or on her K1 application that might be holding things up, she gave  him the death glare and got all  angry and defensive. He needs to run far from her, cancel the K1 and stop all communication. She will do nothing but make his life a living hell. 

3 hours ago, DanaMB said:

I can one up you. I dreamed about Angela... 😬

That’s not a dream. It’s a nightmare. 

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10 hours ago, Spike said:

I guess Natalie does not believe platonic friendships can exist.  It would be interesting to see what the best friend looks like.  If she is not a temptress it would be more believable that it was innocent.  It would be super trashy to screw the night before the wedding, and they would both have to be willing to sink that low. 

He said they had never been romantically involved, just roommates and friends.

This whole story sounds like bullshit and doesn’t make sense.  They both make facial expressions and tell us nothing.  I think it was the religion problem.  She fears their children will come from outer space on a flying saucer.

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10 hours ago, Callaphera said:

Natalie has been shown to be deep into Russian Orthodox teachings and has repeatedly shown a very out-dated and old-fashioned view on the gender roles in a relationship. I don't think it's that much of a leap to see how she could be offended by what happened.

Of course, we don't know the whole story and personally, I don't think Alien Mike is the innocent and sweet lamb that other people do - this is the guy who had a morning tiff with his fiancée and ran out of the house in his pajama pants and slippers to go do a little day-drinking and make a sad little stack of his red Solo cups on his rubber tire table - but I can see how someone with Natalie's views could come to that conclusion. 

I think if they were in the US and had that same argument, he would have gone outside and maybe chopped some wood or done some other chores. He’s stuck in a foreign country, in an apartment in a nonsense argument with a bunny boiler and her old mother, so he went for a walk. He‘a over six feet tall, I’m sure he can handle himself. I call BS on Natalie’s concern for his welfare. She changed her tune because she thought he might leave. 

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