S09.E07: The Lady in White

[jewel21]

A hidden chapter of Camp Redwood is revealed. The survivors help a stranded hitchhiker.

Airdate: 10.30.2019

[WaltersHair]

Really enjoyed this one. Story threads are finally coming together.

[Chaos Theory]

ETwo major takeaways from this episode.

1.  Lily Rabe can do no wrong.

2.  I really don't get why people don't like Emma Roberts.

Further notes.

Brooke came out of prison a real bad ass.  Of course of all the hitchhikers they pick up they pick up a serial killer but Brooke is a bad ass now so she does quick work of him.  

I really enjoyed the Jingles backstory and of course his mother is probably where the blood curse on the camp comes from.  Her grief and rage over losing her favored son is why the other ghosts are still at the camp.  

Unless something really stupid happens in the next couple episodes 1984 is definetly going in my list of top four seasons.  This has been an incredibly fun ride.  The right amount of comedy, tragedy, drama, and carnage.

So far I have loved every minute of it.

[sashayshante]

Rabe classed up the joint, but she was playing Nora Montgomery, just at a camp. Seeing her reminded me of how great this show used to be and can be when focus is put on the story and not creating roles for Murphy's friends and favorites.

This episode did nothing to further the story and was a great example of Murphy inserting in useless characters just to give his pets roles. Dylan McDermott served no purpose to the story. And now out of nowhere Trevor and Montana have some kind of unrequited love?

Just end this season already. They clearly don't have much of a story and are writing it as they go along.

[sashayshante]

4 minutes ago, Chaos Theory said:

2.  I really don't get why people don't like Emma Roberts.

I mean, aside from the fact she's a marginally talented one trick pony who gets cast in lead roles on TV shows despite her history of being a Grade A bitch on wheels on sets and got away with assaulting Evan Peters because she's Julia Roberts' niece?

The main reason I am so down on this season is because of her, Lourde and Grossman being front and center because Murphy has a hard-on for basic white girls.

[WaltersHair]

Quote

Brooke came out of prison a real bad ass.  Of course of all the hitchhikers they pick up they pick up a serial killer but Brooke is a bad ass now so she does quick work of him.

I thought this was the I-5 killer at first, but he was caught in 1980. He would rearend some poor girl and then pull out a fake police light.

Might be The Green River killer. Same p@rn stache.

[phoenix780]

I spent the episode assuming Dylan McDermott was playing Son of Bloody Face, so I'm not exactly the most alert viewer, but I enjoyed this. I liked the twist, though I should have expected there'd be a mother somewhere in this particular slasher flick. I loved Lily Rabe (why isn't she more prominent in these?). For me, this may be one of their more cohesive and consistently enjoyable seasons. 

I think Emma Roberts is a solid character actress who can deliver snarky dialogue really well. Outside of that I don't particularly believe her, but it's not so bad to me it's distracting. 

At the end, was Mom genuinely trying to help her son? Or, did she just finally figure out how to kill him? 

[Chaos Theory]

I was just thinking that Brooke cutting off the hitchhikers thumbs could be the beginning of her signature Aka Margaret cutting off her victim’s ear.  After everything Brooke has been through and it is equal to Ben (Jingles). A finance kills  people on their wedding day,   Getting attacked by Ramirez,   the camp massacre,  death row.    It wouldn’t be surprising at all if it changes her and Even the supposed final girl ends up being a serial killer.

Edited October 31, 2019 by Chaos Theory

[darkestboy]

First of all, can we please have both Lily Rabe and John Carroll Lynch back as regulars next season? Both of them were absolutely stunning to watch in this episode.

The show shamelessly went all Pamela Voorhees with Lavinia Richter and it worked fantastically. Yup, she was vile to poor Benjamin but she did give him some pointers in the end. I don't even mind the twist with her being responsible for Margaret's original killing spree.

Not surprised that Benjamin killed himself but at least he can get a chance to try and take down Ramirez. I liked the little lesson we got with Montana about ghosts as well. Nice that she spared Trevor too.

The Brooke and Donna team up was great but Bruce was a dull wannabe baddie and Dylan McDermott felt wasted compared to the excellent Rabe.

Other than that, I can't wait to see how this is going to end, 8/10

[hoodooznoodooz]

30 minutes ago, Chaos Theory said:

I was just thinking that Brooke cutting off the hitchhiker’s thumbs could be the beginning of her signature, aka Margaret cutting off her victim’s ear.  After everything Brooke has been through, and it is equal to Ben (Jingles). A fiance kills people on their wedding day. Getting attacked by Ramirez, the camp massacre, death row. It wouldn’t be surprising at all if it changes her, and even the supposed final girl ends up being a serial killer.

I think that Brooke suffered a lot, as an adult, but may have had a decent childhood. Benjamin’s childhood was traumatic. He has more of an excuse to misbehave.

[AnimeMania]

I would probably say this would be my favorite season (I should wait to the end though). It is simple and made sense. There doesn't seem to be a lot of loose ends or story lines thrown in just because they would be sensational. Don't dazzle me with BS, tell me a solid story first, then feel free to hide it in your supernatural fog. I really couldn't comprehend any of the other seasons before this one. The closest I think I got was Cult.

I enjoyed the episode, things seem to be reaching a dramatic climax. I would be more than happy if I found out that Billy Idol was Satan and I watched everybody in the camp get slaughtered to "Rebel Yell" MORE, MORE, MORE!, more, more, more.

[farmgal4]

I loved this episode and this season!  I look forward to watching every week, and I’m going to be sad when this season ends.  I have a real soft spot for Jingles, and I hope he reigns victorious in the end.

[WednesdayAddams]

I have nothing to add except that I felt this episode was 20 minutes long. It went by really fast!

[Bruinsfan]

2 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

I would be more than happy if I found out that Billy Idol was Satan and I watched everybody in the camp get slaughtered to "Rebel Yell" MORE, MORE, MORE!, more, more, more.

Rick Springfield was on the concert flyer and he's already played Lucifer as a rock star on TV. I'm just sayin'...

[AnimeMania]

10 minutes ago, Bruinsfan said:

Rick Springfield was on the concert flyer and he's already played Lucifer as a rock star on TV. I'm just sayin'...

Ramirez would never pledge his soul to a "One-Hit Nu-Wave Clown" like Rick Springfield.

[iMonrey]

Quote

Seeing her reminded me of how great this show used to be and can be when focus is put on the story and not creating roles for Murphy's friends and favorites.

It's funny you should say that because I think this was the first episode of this season I found pretty enjoyable. I don't know if it's largely due to the flashback with Lily Rabe or the addition of Dylan McDermott or a combination of both. But I do agree the season lacks talent in the acting department.

Obviously they can do a successful season without a heavy hitter like Jessica Lange, or Evan Peters, or Sarah Paulson, or Kathy Bates, or Dennis O'Hare. But I don't think the show can cut it without ANY of them. Emma Roberts and Billie Lourde just don't cut it as leads. Neither does Leslie Grossman. All of them are fine in supporting roles but this season feels like amateur hour and this episode reminded me why.

My one nitpick is that the roller disco thing was totally superfluous to the story and nothing but a brazen and lazy attempt to add more 80s kitsch to the show. I know they had to work McDermott in there somehow but that was a silly way to do it. Neither Brooke nor Donna was in a particularly roller-boogie frame of mind.

Edited October 31, 2019 by iMonrey

[Chaos Theory]

Person ally I think the lack of Sarah Paulson,  Jessica Lange, Evan Peters etc has actually breathed new life into the show.  Maybe because last season was the only season I haven’t watched through and even though Sarah Paulson is my favorite on the show focusing on her so much has begun to have the same effect the show had when it focused so much on Jessica Lange.  I got kinda annoyed with the show.   I love the show because it is an ensemble and there is no one actor the series  can’t survive without.   This season (which is the best the show has been in years) proves that at least.

[sadie]

2 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

Ramirez would never pledge his soul to a "One-Hit Nu-Wave Clown" like Rick Springfield.

80’s nerd here who worked at a record store. Springfield had a lot of top 10 hits and albums. Don’t hate on the Rickster. (No hard feelings Animemania 😊)

[AnimeMania]

15 minutes ago, sadie said:

3 hours ago, AnimeMania said:

Ramirez would never pledge his soul to a "One-Hit Nu-Wave Clown" like Rick Springfield.

80’s nerd here who worked at a record store. Springfield had a lot of top 10 hits and albums. Don’t hate on the Rickster. (No hard feelings Animemania 😊)

Stated in the context of the story.

[sashayshante]

5 hours ago, iMonrey said:

It's funny you should say that because I think this was the first episode of this season I found pretty enjoyable. I don't know if it's largely due to the flashback with Lily Rabe or the addition of Dylan McDermott or a combination of both. But I do agree the season lacks talent in the acting department.

Obviously they can do a successful season without a heavy hitter like Jessica Lange, or Evan Peters, or Sarah Paulson, or Kathy Bates, or Dennis O'Hare. But I don't think the show can cut it without ANY of them. Emma Roberts and Billie Lourde just don't cut it as leads. Neither does Leslie Grossman. All of them are fine in supporting roles but this season feels like amateur hour and this episode reminded me why.

For me, there's a glaring lack of an intellectual component to the story. Every season - even Roanoke - had a theme and underlying story that was threaded through out each episode. I can deal with mediocre acting if there's a point to the story. People accused Apocalypse of being all about fan service - and it was to some degree - but there were layers to the story. An entitled white man-child and his equally entitled male cohorts were all threatened by women in power and felt entitled to that same power despite their lack of qualifications. Last night I really tried to apply some kind of running theme to this season. Was it our fascination with true crime? Was it a statement about social media and duality and how the mask we show publicly is rarely congruent to the one we wear privately? Give me something to justify watching this crap! I'm also beyond irritated at how nobody seems to be questioning Ryan Murphy's decision to repeatedly cast Emma Roberts. It's a slap in the face to every survivor of abuse. I'm tired of Murphy's claim to be an ally when he's blatantly providing an abuser with opportunities. That's the antithesis of the #metoo movement and he's enabling it.

[txhorns79]

The music festival is supposed to take place in 1989, right?  I had thought Kajagoogoo had their hit in the early 80s, and would have been well past their sell by date in 1989.  The same with Flock of Seagulls.     

[AgentRXS]

On 10/31/2019 at 9:11 AM, darkestboy said:

First of all, can we please have both Lily Rabe and John Carroll Lynch back as regulars next season? Both of them were absolutely stunning to watch in this episode.

Please! They worked so great together . John Carroll Lynch has been the saving grace for me this season. I was so happy to see Lily Rabe show up. It was refreshing to see actors that actually have range share scenes together for once.  I love Cody Fern, but he is stuck carrying the Junior League around. Emma Roberts and Billie Lourd are getting better, but they are still pretty bland to me.

[Robert Lynch]

If there is a biopic on the Andrew Sisters, Lily Rabe should definitely play Patty.

[Mattipoo]

Lily Rabe was great as Lavinia. I could feel all her hatred and sorrow through her performance.

Love the 80s soundtrack especially the Kajagoogoo song! So sad that lead singer was slaughtered!

Leslie Jordan is a hoot! Such a great comedic actor.

[Robert Lynch]

Seeing Doogie Howser, M.D was such a trip down memory lane.

[JennyMominFL]

On 10/31/2019 at 3:17 AM, sashayshante said:

I mean, aside from the fact she's a marginally talented one trick pony who gets cast in lead roles on TV shows despite her history of being a Grade A bitch on wheels on sets and got away with assaulting Evan Peters because she's Julia Roberts' niece?

Her father is an ass. she never had a chance

[Bruinsfan]

16 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

The music festival is supposed to take place in 1989, right?  I had thought Kajagoogoo had their hit in the early 80s, and would have been well past their sell by date in 1989.  The same with Flock of Seagulls.     

I think that's the joke, that the whole festival is a bunch of 80s has-beens that Margaret has hired for peanuts. Hence the show actually killing Kajagoogoo off, rather than just their careers and relevance being long dead by 1989 as they were in the real world. I did love that  Ramirez was collecting on Limahl's literal deal with the Devil for the band's single hit!

Edited November 1, 2019 by Bruinsfan

[Lady Iris]

Hour went by too fast for me this week. Any idea how many eps are left?

[iMonrey]

Quote

I love Cody Fern, but he is stuck carrying the Junior League around.

The only other thing I've seen him in was Apocalypse, but I think this season proves he's very limited in what he can do. (Frankly I'm not buying him as a straight character.)

Am I mistaken or was a cover used for the song "Poison" rather than the original?

Quote

Hour went by too fast for me this week. Any idea how many eps are left?

2 more.

[tennisgurl]

So in the AMH universe, Kajagoogoo was not only murdered by Richard Ramirez, but the lead singer made a deal with the devil?! You know...that lines up. 

Dylan McDermott as a random highway serial killer was random filler, that basically seemed to exist to give him something to do, but it did show how much of a badass Brooke has become in prison, while still not going full on evil. 

Other than that, I thought this was a pretty good episode, its starting to actually come together, with the disparate plot threads aliening, and getting more story as to why Camp Redwood is cursed. We also got some more explanation as to why the ghosts are so murder-y now, and while its not an excuse, its something besides "dead so now evil I guess YOLO" or whatever. Its great seeing Lila Rabe, I thought she nailed angry crazy murder mom, you really could just see so much in her eyes. The seething resentment, the rage, the grief, she is just very expressive in her expressions. 

I am mostly rooting for Jingles at this point, the poor guy has had such an awful life, and he really does seem like he is trying to do better despite all the terrible things that are always happening to him. I hope that he can break the curse and he and his brother can move on to the afterlife. 

The Friday the 13th shout oust were great, with Lily Rabe channeling ghostly 1940s Mrs. Vorhees big time.

Edited November 1, 2019 by tennisgurl

[Bruinsfan]

I don't think Bobby is actually trapped, he died long before Lavinia's murder spree and death that apparently cursed the land.

Brooke's been pretty badass all along, judging from the way she responded to a surprise home invasion by a serial killer with grabbing a cast iron skillet and swinging away. She's been toughened by her experiences, becoming less nice and sweet in demeanor, but that core of You're Next-style competence has been there since the first episode. Also admirable that her basic moral compass still seems to be intact—she's accepted Donna's gestures toward redemption and shown concern for her wellbeing, reserving her vengeance kick for the people who actually deserve it.

[Chaos Theory]

The irony is Bobby is probably or even at the camp.   He died before Mom’s blood curse even began.   It was her murdering the original group of counselors and the dying herself that started everything.   Bobby might have died ugly but he passed over.

[sashayshante]

2 hours ago, iMonrey said:

The only other thing I've seen him in was Apocalypse, but I think this season proves he's very limited in what he can do. (Frankly I'm not buying him as a straight character.)

Watch him in The Assassination of Gianni Versace. If I hadn't seen him in that. I'd think he was mediocre, too. He's been given nothing this season, but in the handful of scenes that did have some meat  (like when he mercy killed Bertie) he's been leagues above the rest of the cast.

I don't think we're supposed to believe he's straight. Between making his character an actor/aerobics instructor and dressing him in short shorts, I think they're intentionally trying to make him the 'totally gay actor playing straight' character from 80's movies.

[kokapetl]

I like Emma Roberts’ character and the way she plays it. It’s refreshing change from the usual slutbag she plays. 

Billie Lourde can’t ever not look bored. 

Leslie Grossman can only play bitch or an idiot and sometimes an idiotic bitch. She brings a little humour from time to time. 

Cody Fern’s outfits get stupider with every passing episode. 

Lily Rabe’s deathly makeup reminded me of Joan Van Ark’s face. 

Edited November 1, 2019 by kokapetl

[ShadowHunter]

On 10/31/2019 at 1:44 PM, Chaos Theory said:

Person ally I think the lack of Sarah Paulson,  Jessica Lange, Evan Peters etc has actually breathed new life into the show.  Maybe because last season was the only season I haven’t watched through and even though Sarah Paulson is my favorite on the show focusing on her so much has begun to have the same effect the show had when it focused so much on Jessica Lange.  I got kinda annoyed with the show.   I love the show because it is an ensemble and there is no one actor the series  can’t survive without.   This season (which is the best the show has been in years) proves that at least.

I disagree because Ryan is still using the same actors lol. New life would have been a complete change in the cast.  This season feels the same as the others it went off the rails a bit.  Crazy weird business as usual.  We just have different leads. 

Lily was great but she is also a S1 veteran.  I agree Jessica got way too much focus between S2-4.  Then Sarah definitely took that spot.  That is true.  

I do agree Emma is better but she is still limited.  Billie looks lost at times lol.  I think Cody is overrated though I do not hear people talking about him this season like they were last season. 

[lightninggirl]

On 10/30/2019 at 11:07 PM, Chaos Theory said:

Unless something really stupid happens in the next couple episodes 1984 is definetly going in my list of top four seasons.  This has been an incredibly fun ride.  The right amount of comedy, tragedy, drama, and carnage.

So far I have loved every minute of it.

Even though I'm  someone who is not really into the Halloween/Friday the 13th slasher-type films (I'm more into hauntings & less into gore), I am absolutely enjoying the shit out of this season. I was 12 years old in 1984 and started high school in the 1985-86 school year, so this is really bringing back fun memories.  I agree it's in the top 4 for me as well.

[lightninggirl]

On 10/30/2019 at 11:17 PM, sashayshante said:

I mean, aside from the fact she's a marginally talented one trick pony who gets cast in lead roles on TV shows despite her history of being a Grade A bitch on wheels on sets and got away with assaulting Evan Peters because she's Julia Roberts' niece?

The main reason I am so down on this season is because of her, Lourde and Grossman being front and center because Murphy has a hard-on for basic white girls.

/golf claps

She got 'better' after she went into jail, but she's still one of the weakest links, period.

[sashayshante]

Emma Roberts never went to jail. Evan Peters dropped the charges. Watching her tween/early twenty-something stans do mental and verbal gymnastics to justify Roberts bloodying Peters' nose and biting his face hurts my head. They keep insisting that he assaulted her, too, so she should get a pass. I'm fine with both of them being cancelled, but at the very least Murphy should stop hiring them.

[iMonrey]

Quote

He died before Mom’s blood curse even began. 

I'm not clear on what exactly is "holding" these ghosts to the camp grounds or that it has anything to do with Jingle's mom. For that matter, they never explained why Murder House had the same issue where people who died on the property were trapped there. Hopefully at some point the show will tie all this together and explain why there are certain places where spirits get trapped.

[txhorns79]

On 11/1/2019 at 11:41 AM, Bruinsfan said:

I think that's the joke, that the whole festival is a bunch of 80s has-beens that Margaret has hired for peanuts.

I may be mis-remembering, but I think she had people on her list like Debbie Gibson who would have been a big get in 1989. 

[AnimeMania]

2 hours ago, txhorns79 said:

I may be mis-remembering, but I think she had people on her list like Debbie Gibson who would have been a big get in 1989. 

Billy Idol

Flock of Seagulls

The Go-Go's with Belinda Carlisle

Debbie Gibson

Dexy's Midnight Runners

Kajagoogoo

Men Without Hats

Rick Springfield

Paul Shaffer

Toni Basil

Thompson Twins

Gary Numan 

[Chaos Theory]

3 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I'm not clear on what exactly is "holding" these ghosts to the camp grounds or that it has anything to do with Jingle's mom. 

My understanding is that it is Jingles mom holding them there.  I think RM did a better job explaining why some people become ghosts and others don’t.   Mom hated counselors  so I can see that hate holding murdered counselors there while other people who died like the cook moved on.  

[Pink ranger]

The three jingle impersonators where not camp counsellors though, they where some townies, but they became ghosts. Mr Jingles wasn’t one either but I guess his mothers hatred of him tied him into her curse. 
 
Dr Hopple and Richard Ramirez ( Satan brought him back) not becoming ghosts fits the pattern though. 

[AnimeMania]

2 hours ago, Pink ranger said:

The three jingle impersonators where not camp counsellors though, they where some townies, but they became ghosts. Mr Jingles wasn’t one either but I guess his mothers hatred of him tied him into her curse. 
 
Dr Hopple and Richard Ramirez ( Satan brought him back) not becoming ghosts fits the pattern though. 

I am not sure that you have to be a camp counselor to be brought back or if Mr. Jingles' mother was the one that started the curse. I don't remember anything that she said or did that might have been the start of bringing people back from the dead.

Spoiler

If the show really wanted to be clever, they would make the little boy Mr. Jingles be the one who starts the curse by doing something to revive his mother from the dead after Little Jingles killed her. Maybe something that was described in that comic book he was reading. Unfortunately, what Little Jingles does, brings back everybody that dies in Camp Redwood, not just his mother. Mama Jingles comes back from the dead and hates Little Jingles so much, that she runs away and Little Jingles never sees her again. Little Jingles hides the body of his dead mother and runs away from Camp Redwood. Young Man Jingles comes back to get a job at Camp Redwood hoping that one day he might see his dead mother again, but that never happens. Instead, after years of working at Camp Redwood, Youngish Man Jingles finds the love of a good Christian, camp going teen girl, Margaret Booth, who Mama Jingles sees is falling for Youngish Man Jingles. There is a little cringe factor of a young teen girl falling for a Youngish Man Jingles, but since it is already part of the story, I have no problem with it. Mama Jingles determines to ruin her son's life by slowly turning Margaret Booth crazy through torture. Margaret Booth quickly becomes the Serial Killer that we know and love today. Now that would be a great story!  The theme of this season is what circumstances make people become Serial Killers.

Mr. Jingles was brought back from the dead by Satan after pledging his soul. That is why Mr. Jingles and Ramirez are able to leave the camp while all the other people who died are forced to stay at Camp Redwood. Dr. Hopple drove her car off of the Camp Redwood property, how far off, I am not sure. Dr. Hopple might have been spared being brought back from the dead. That still doesn't explain how stupid hippy ghost managed to get run over so far away from the camp, before being driven back to camp. This is my biggest plot hole so far.

[sashayshante]

Apparently, Finn Wittrock is appearing in the finale. My bet is on him playing Bobby, either Jingles' brother or son.

[Dobian]

On 10/31/2019 at 6:11 AM, darkestboy said:

First of all, can we please have both Lily Rabe and John Carroll Lynch back as regulars next season? Both of them were absolutely stunning to watch in this episode.

John Carroll Lynch is a fantastic character actor who has been on shows all over the place and always elevates them with his performances.  I remember his turn on The Americans a few years ago.  And I am so glad to see Lily Rabe enter this story.  She has been used so sparingly in some of the recent seasons when she is one of their best actors.

Edited November 3, 2019 by Dobian

[txhorns79]

On 11/2/2019 at 3:50 PM, AnimeMania said:

Billy Idol

The Go-Go's with Belinda Carlisle

Debbie Gibson

Belinda Carlisle would have been a big get too.  I Get Weak and Heaven is a Place on Earth were huge hits in '88 and '87.  Though I think she took a break from the Go-Gos in the mid-80s to go solo. 

[Jsage]

Quote

And now out of nowhere Trevor and Montana have some kind of unrequited love?

This was the one thing that confused me this episode. They definitely seemed like they knew each other well and nothing was explained about how. 

[AnimeMania]

8 hours ago, Jsage said:

This was the one thing that confused me this episode. They definitely seemed like they knew each other well and nothing was explained about how. 

They did spend that magical night "boning" at the lake.

[Pink ranger]

Trevor: First base never felt so good

Chet: You only kissed ?

Trevor: Of course not 

Chet: That’s what first base means

Trevor: Maybe to you