S07.E13: Here's Where We Get Off

[Meredith Quill]

Quote

Tearful farewells, emotional tributes, new beginnings. Say goodbye to the women of Litchfield in the series finale.

[kieyra]

I skipped to the last two episodes for now.

The biggest twist for me was Aleida killing (I think? right?) Daya, after Daya started dragging Aleida’s other daughters into the drug business. (Daya’s dead, right?)

The closing scenes, and farewells during the credits, were very nice. 

There were a few more positive notes than I expected, but also of course a lot of downer stuff. But it was nice that Taystee didn’t kill herself, that Nicky is taking on Red’s role (and is clean for now), and that Gloria got out. It’s also nice that skipping to the end, I didn’t have to see Badison at all. 

It would have been nice if the evil guard didn’t become warden, but I guess they had to keep things real. 

Edited July 27, 2019 by kieyra

[HollyG]

I think it ended pretty well. I'm disappointed that Piper is still with Vause, but not surprised. I was hoping she would make a life with the new woman. But I think Larry was accurate in his assessment of Piper. She is always looking for something different....exciting, less ordinary. And Vause provides that for her.

Sad that P-Tuck died. I'm glad that Taystee didn't. She has found her place within the prison and hopefully will continue to pursue a new hearing/trial. And I hope Cindy will continue to build a relationship with her mom & daughter. 

I will always love Suzanne. I loved her friendship with Pussey and Taystee. They were the heart of the series for me. Poussey's death broke me. I feel bad for Lorna, but she really does belong in Florida. And it's good that Nicky is taking Red's place... gives her purpose. Happy that Gloria is reunited with her family. And it's good that Maria is accepting of her ex's new girlfriend and that they seem committed to all working together to provide a stable home for the baby.

I was sorta expecting Aleida to make a physical move on Dayanara. But that was shocking. I do believe she is dead. It looked like she broke her windpipe. It doesn't look good for Karla either... after being left out in the desert alone.

It was nice to see a lot of the people that have been missing for the last couple of years... even Pornstache. 

I'm glad Badison was sent away early in the season. Couldn't stand her!

Cheers to OITNB. I didn't always love you, but I will still miss you.

Edited July 27, 2019 by HollyG

[Chaos Theory]

I really loved the conversation Piper had with Larry.. This great woman represents the same thing Larry represented in season one but all Piper could think about was Alex.  Larry was essentially right about Piper.  I liked that the show could portray the character of Piper Chapman and not always be cruel about who she was.   Was she always the easiest character to like?  No of course not but I commend the show for not doing the easy thing and getting rid of her.

I really like how Nicky grows into the new Red.  I think that had been the Story the whole time and it made sense to me.  

I am also really glad that the show kept Daya dark and had to have Aleida  do something drastic to stop the monster she herself help create even though she herself was hardly perfect.  Even in the beginning Aleida was a crap mother.  I remember feeling really sorry that someone like Daya had such a bad mother in season one.  What  I liked is that Aleida is still a crap mother but she did try to protect a child who isn't ruined by prison.

i am also glad the show resisted giving Taystee a fairytale happy ending. It was unlikely she would be able to overturn her case so I found her figuring out a way to live a life inside prison a better ending for her character.

Vauseman forever!!!!      

Edited July 30, 2019 by Chaos Theory

[PeterPirate]

I liked the new version of the theme song.  I always found the original version a bit shrill.

I think that was Taryn Manning (Pennsatucky) singing while Taystee looked at the GED certificates.

Maria has been my favorite since the start. I am very pleased with the way her story finished up.

All in all, it was a respectable wrapup of the show.

[Sentient Meat]

I don't know if it's because it's lean times for the television viewer right now, but I found the final season really moving.  I liked pretty much everything except Piper and Alex and the ridiculously clumsy metaphor of using the Chicken Run Hamsterdam to represent the Stanford Experiment nature of human beings.  It's not that I dislike Piper or Alex as characters... I enjoyed their interactions with other characters in the show... it's just they didn't really have anything interesting to say about them that couldn't have been better explained by Jason Biggs character's take.

I really hope they find a way to bring this back.  With such a huge cast it's probably impossible and I wouldn't want to see a half ass spinoff show up on Freeform... but we really need this show right now, at least until there's a regime change.

If they don't... thank you so much to the cast and production for 7 wonderful seasons.

[Blue Plastic]

I liked Piper and Larry's conversation.  It kind of put a bow on that relationship for me.  It was good for Piper to hear Larry's assessment of her pattern in romantic relationships after they had been broken up for almost her entire sentence, so it's coming from someone who knows her well but no longer has any particular emotional stake in her life or a bone to pick with her, so she knows what he said isn't coming from a place of anger.

I was disappointed that Piper stayed with Alex instead of Zelda (?), but I thought it was interesting that Larry asked her what "new PIper" would do because you could look at her decision either way.  Maybe staying with Alex was "old Piper" looking for an unconventional life, but maybe it was "new Piper" trying to honor her "prison marriage" and make it work even though they'll still be apart for at least another 3 years, instead of just bailing because things got tough.

It was sad to see Nicky lose her "prison family," but she'll be okay.  Red will not and it didn't look like Lorna was ever going to improve, either.  Nice OTOH to see Suzanne cope surprisingly well with the loss of most of her friends and realize that people will come and go and she can deal with it.

HATED seeing Evil Guard become the new warden, but I guess it's realistic.  In my imagination he gets run over by a bus at some point soon!

Really surprisingly enjoyed how stable Fig and Caputo's relationship was all season.  I used to kind of hate them together but now they seem to be in it for the long haul.

Pennsatucky's death really affected me.  Loved Suzanne and the guard singing Mountain Dew jingles at her memorial.  Sad to see that she passed her GED test but never knew it.

Taystee was one of my favorites if not my favorite and I wish I didn't have to imagine her in that prison forever.

This season had a lot of sadness but it affected me more than I was expecting so I "liked" - appreciated? - it more than I thought.  I was expecting it to be kind of a throwaway season but I thought they made pretty good points with the sad things that happened and still sprinkled enough nice things (Suzanne "growing up," Fig-Caputo, happy ending for Blanca and her boyfriend, Alex ending up with some of the old crew in Ohio, etc) to balance it and sprinkle in some lightness with the large helping of dark realism.

I too thought Aleida killed Daya.  It could be taken either way I suppose, but Aleida seemed pretty determined to save her younger daughters.  It was interesting how Aleida contributed so heavily to Daya ending up as she did but was also determined to protect her younger children.  She couldn't seem to see that because of her own actions her younger children would have been sucked into the drug selling world eventually, with or without Daya's contribution.

Sorry to have written such a novel, but it really affected me.  I freakin' CRIED for several minutes during this episode, and I almost never do that unless there's something sad about animals involved!

Edited July 28, 2019 by Blue Plastic

[kieyra]

Randomly and I could be wrong: due to Piper’s voiceover at the end about clean slates, and something about their body language during the final prison meeting, I kind of took it that Piper was just visiting Alex in prison as a friend. Maybe I misread it, or it was intentionally ambiguous.

[CloudySky]

I think I spent about 3 episodes bawling my eyes out. This show always gets to me.

Maybe it went by too fast so I didn't notice, but was Maritza on that credit behind the scenes reel? Sad if she wasn't.

I really loved this season. The only things that bothered me was the open cell phone use that went completely unnoticed. And the fact that it was a max prison, but there was no difference between that and where they were before.

I knew they had beef, but I didn't remember exactly what happened between Red/Frieda and Gloria/Maria so I was a bit clueless during those scenes.

It would have been nice to see one of the good guards got the warden job but I suppose that's not realistic.

[funnygirl]

I hate that Hellman is warden. I know often times in "real life" bad people get rewarded, but couldn't the show just have him, if no one else, be held accountable for the crap he's pulled? Because, believe it or not, sometimes bad people have to suffer consequences. I'm not saying he gets killed, but being fired isn't out of the realm of narrative possibility. 

It just pisses me off that we have to watch the ladies get handed a bad deal time and again. And I get it, that's the show and they're prisoners and society doesn't make it easy for folks on purpose, but this is also fictional and I just don't think that wanting some of the real bad guys to get some sort of punishment - or at the very least not get rewarded and promoted to a leadership position! - is asking for too much.  

Edited July 28, 2019 by funnygirl

[funnygirl]

double post

Edited July 28, 2019 by funnygirl

[Sentient Meat]

2 minutes ago, funnygirl said:

I hate that Hellman is warden. I know often times in "real life" bad people get rewarded, but couldn't the show just have him, if no one else, be held accountable for the crap he's pulled? Because, believe it or not, sometimes bad people have to suffer consequences. I'm not saying he gets killed, but being fired isn't out of the realm of narrative possibility. 

It just pisses me off that we have to watch the ladies get handed a bad deal time and again - and I get it, that's the show and they're prisoners and society doesn't make it easy for folks on purpose - but this is also fictional and I just don't think that wanting some of the real bad guys to get some sort of punishment they actually deserve isn't asking for too much.  

Hellman is warden because this is a cautionary tale about the current political climate under which we all live.  It's inconceivable that he could be running that facility to a decent person yet people like he and Litvack are currently in power... not the Tamikas and the Caputos.

The show is a call to action and although it would be nice to see them live happily ever after it wouldn't make sense given the existential threat the current administration poses to our country and the world.

[Sakura12]

That got to me more than I thought it would. I'm glad at least some had a happy ending, mostly Blanca since she's free to go wherever she wants. Taystee

found a purpose for her life sentence helping others have a head start financially when they get out. And Nicky's the new Red, helping junkies and running the kitchen. I'm glad she finally realized that she couldn't help Lorna. She has a mental illness that wouldn't be fixed by just being her friend. From where they are Florida is the best place for her. 

Man, poor Dogget, I knew she was going to end up passing the test and OD'ing before she found out. She really did improve the most but couldn't get past the dumb hick thing she's heard her whole life. I really enjoyed Susanne and Doggett's friendship, she also really helped Susanne grow more than her other friends did. 

Fig really turned around since dating Joe, she learned to care about the inmates enough that she helped one get an abortion by giving her dream of IVF. Although that little girl they will adopt is adorable with her song about smoking weed. She's perfect for them. 

2 hours ago, CloudySky said:

Maybe it went by too fast so I didn't notice, but was Maritza on that credit behind the scenes reel? Sad if she wasn't.

The actress has another show where she's a main cast member, I assume that's why she wasn't there for the final episode. From watching her on that show, she's a really good actress being she's playing a woman with dissociative identity disorder and each personality has their own super power. I'm a fan now, so I was happy to see her show up and sad how it ended for her. Especially since it mirrors her real life. 

I hope Aleida killed Daya, she was so annoying and wasn't going to change. Although I don't think killing her would stop her other kids from getting into the drug business. Are they still living with Hopper? 

Larry really had Piper pegged down perfectly and of course she refuses to see it. I don't know how I feel that she's still waiting for Alex. I kind of hoped she would finally move on. Alex's whole storyline was to hook up with the military guard so she didn't really get much too do. I guess it kind of worked out for her getting transferred to the prison where the others ended up. I did like seeing everyone else for the final time. 

Then the worst guard getting to be Warden is realistic but horrible. Either way this show had it's up and downs but otherwise it had a great run and good ending. I can't say that about a lot of shows, so they should be proud. 

[TiredMe]

I was assuming Daya is dead but was hoping someone else here would definitively confirm it. I don’t like the ambiguous ending.

i wanted Piper to go after Zelda. Frankly Alex was toxic to Piper. 

Overall im glad there were a few happy endings in there because after Pensatucky died last episode, I was feeling terrible. 

My MVPs of the season were Nicky, Taystee and Caputo.

I wasn’t a fan of every season but I’ll miss this show. 

[MrsR]

I'm really hoping Daya is actually dead. I haven't been able to stand her since season 1.  

Good to see everyone else. Yipee kay ay motherfucker!

Odd that they showed Pornstache but not Bennett. Or that poor schmuck who killed Poussey. 

Red and Lorna turned so tragic. And Dogget, jeeze, that was grim. 

Really don't care or worry about Piper and Alex. I never saw this as a love story.

Blanca and Gloria was refreshing. I like to think that Maritza's skills worked for her in Columbia as well.

Adios Orange.

[kickedinthehead]

On 7/27/2019 at 10:48 AM, HollyG said:

It was nice to see a lot of the people that have been missing for the last couple of years... even Pornstache. 

So THAT's who the guy banging drums with the little girl (Daya's daughter/Pornstache's... adopted sister?) at the end was -- thank you! He looks so different without his "porn stache"; and despite having watched every episode of this show, I honestly had no idea who he was or why they were showing him. At first I even thought he was that weird CO who needed to microwave his popcorn just so back in Season 6. But no, of course, it was "good old" Mendez. Well, at least he seems to be a good "father"/brother? (And, hey -- we never did find out what happened to Bennett, did we? Though the first couple of times I saw that stupid "You've got mail" guard in ICE, for some reason, I thought HE was Bennett?!)

Anyway, goodbye, OITNB. Honestly, I spent much of my time over the years "hate watching" rather than watching as some adoring fan (especially with the previous two seasons, and awful Season 3). But while there were many subplots and characters that either didn't interest me or actively annoyed me, and relationships that I couldn't care less about (hello, Piper and Alex) -- this show definitely had its moments. I have to admit, I will miss it. And Season 7, while depressing as all heck, also had some excellent and genuinely compelling stories. Especially Taystee and Pennsatucky's. Wow. When Taystee opened that envelope from Tamika... well, I think only a Hellman could watch that and not feel anything.

On that note: RIP, Pennsatucky. I went from despising her in Season 1, to liking her better than most of the other inmates (I did also enjoy Lolly, and maybe a few others with smaller roles; and many of the more important characters were okay or at least tolerable in smaller doses). But Pennsatucky, as has been pointed out, changed for the better. 

If only she hadn't sat at that table and overheard Daya and her minions (speaking of -- if Aleida killed you, Daya, then don't RIP... rest in turmoil, or rot in h*ll or whatever else is appropriate for horrid Daya. Her character was pretty much the opposite of Pennsatucky's as far as growth and such; except I didn't like Daya better than most of the other inmates at the beginning of the show -- I just found her boring back then).

Black Cindy was another character who (slowly) grew on me. She should have listened to her mother a few episodes ago and stayed, but at least they seemed to end things on a hopeful note.

Morello and Red? I'm not really sure what to make of their final scene together, and their storylines were both also very sad, but ... they have each other? And Nicky seemingly taking over Red's role is a good ending for her, considering the circumstances.

What else? Even though I hadn't really missed the characters in Ohio since the end of Season 5 -- and especially not Big Boo  (of course, her one line would be about "taking a dump"; ugh) -- I suppose it was good to see them again, if only for a split second. (The Sankey and Soso scene, though, was very... odd.)

Dixon = Glad they remembered his friendship with Pennsatucky, and based only on what we actually saw of him onscreen, he did show some growth throughout his time on the series, but... uh, did the writers forget about his coversation with Bayley in the Season 4 finale? (Maybe he was "only saying" he did those terrible things in the Middle East in some horrifically bad attempt to make Bayley  feel better at the time, and didn't actually do them?) I'm not sure why they suddenly tried to turn him into this "lovable teddy bear" type of character, without even addressing his (pre-riot) past (minus the one throwaway line with Maria in the group). But if nothing else, showing him sing with Suzanne in the finale was a nice callback to when he sang for that ridiculous "Got Talent" episode back during the riot.

McCullough = who cares. 

Hopper = mostly who cares (however, I did fleetingly wonder what will happen to Aleida's kids now).

Larry = whatever.

Karla = her phone call with her sons a couple of episodes ago was another VERY well-done (if incredibly sad) moment, but as far as her scene in the finale -- well, I wish they'd either left it out entirely, or just showed her risking her life by making the trip again, and left it at that. It would have been powerful enough, and illustrated how determined she was to follow through on her promise to her boys. But I didn't need to see Karla break her ankle and be left (likely to die) in the desert to realize that crossing the border is incredibly dangerous.

Good for Blanca, though (and good for Flaca, for also showing some growth and thinking about others instead of her makeup or whatever).

So I take it the Caputos... er, Caputo and Fig (they might as well have been married by the end) adopted that little girl? Good for them, too.

And finally, good for Suzanne. She was far from my favorite character in the first six seasons (despite having some of the more interesting flashbacks) but was surprisingly okay in this final season. That egg on Pennsatucky's pillow. 😞 But it was nice to see her and Taystee join forces for the Poussey fund. (Oh, yeah... uh, good for Judy King. And for Luschek, too, I guess.)

That's all I can remember for now... oh, sorry, except for one more thing, and then I'll end this rambly post. Kudos to the music supervisor; with Linda Ronstadt, Sam Cooke, etc., the song choices were quite effective this season.

Edited July 28, 2019 by kickedinthehead

[ExplainItAgain]

We saw almost everybody! That was so great - I was so happy to see glimpses of Leanne and Angie, Yoga, Gina and Norma, Boo, Chang, Soso, and all the others.

I didn't even recognize Pornstache at the end.

That was a pretty good ending. I was worried all 12 hours of the season that it wasn't really leading anywhere, but I think they managed to wrap most things up pretty nicely.

Nicky's always been my favorite character and I loved her ending as the new Red (complete with red lipstick!). Taystee found her purpose and I agree her case would probably never be overturned, but she still got a good ending. Judy King helping a girl out!

Suzanne grew up, which was the best possible ending for her. Unfortunately no help for Red or Lorna but at least being in Florida will help them.

I'm not typically a crier, but I cried when Penn got her GED.

[kieyra]

Thanks to whoever mentioned (maybe not in this thread) that they did a new version of the opening credits song by Regina Spektor. I like her, but yeah it gets so shrill. Netflix probably had stats on how many people clicked “skip intro”. But anyways, I wouldn’t have stopped to listen to it if it hasn’t been pointed out here.

Edit: can anyone tell me if Red is legitimately mad at Frieda at the end, and if so for what? Or is it her dementia? I couldn’t bear to watch most of her scenes.

Edit2: Here is the real world charitable fund mentioned at the very end. It’s only at $20k so far, so get over there.

https://www.crowdrise.com/o/en/campaign/pwf/pousseywashingtonfund

Edited July 28, 2019 by kieyra

[tomsmom]

Two things: 

1. One of the kids with Pornstache was Daya’s daughter but who was the other?

2. Did Fig have the abortion? If so then why try and adopt?

[ExplainItAgain]

4 minutes ago, tomsmom said:

Two things: 

1. One of the kids with Pornstache was Daya’s daughter but who was the other?

2. Did Fig have the abortion? If so then why try and adopt?

I think the other was a doll. It was quite realistic looking, haha.

She got the abortion pill and gave it to the detainee who was trying to home remedy her own. She couldn't really go for IVF after that so I assume they changed direction and went the adoption route.

[kieyra]

Yep, it’s a doll. (Had just watched that scene.)

[tomsmom]

42 minutes ago, ExplainItAgain said:

I think the other was a doll. It was quite realistic looking, haha.

She got the abortion pill and gave it to the detainee who was trying to home remedy her own. She couldn't really go for IVF after that so I assume they changed direction and went the adoption route.

Omg a doll!!! Lmao 🤦🏻‍♀️ So she wasn’t really pregnant...Duh! I swear I was so confused! That’s why I love this site! Thanks ❤️

[Sentient Meat]

5 hours ago, tomsmom said:

Two things: 

1. One of the kids with Pornstache was Daya’s daughter but who was the other?

2. Did Fig have the abortion? If so then why try and adopt?

You can feel like you shouldn't bring more people into a fucked up world, yet also want to care for someone who is already here.

I think that was her thinking.

What sucks about this thought process... although noble... is that good people are bringing less kids into the world... while the thoughtless continue to bring more and more... creating a stupider and more terrible world overall.

[nomodrama]

I wish I had commented on every episode thread but I never found the time. The show is done now and I left feeling so deflated. I know this is show about women in prison and it is supposed to be realistic but dayum.....is it depressing. I'm not trying to be naive but I guess I just do not want to believe that some of the stuff that happened on this show actually do, that the guards are that immoral, that the system is so f'ed up. I need to go watch some Disney cartoons or something for a while. 

From season 1 I have absolutely despised Piper and my feelings did not change. She was just the worst up until the very end. Her relationship with Alex was cringe worthy. And Alex....for all the talk about how Piper needed to be with her because she craved an exciting life....is such a boring wet blanket. Even the way she talks is lazy. Maybe those two deserve each other because they are so awful. Larry had her so pegged at the end. I actually have a sister just like Piper, she's always trying to tie herself to anything that will make her life seem more exciting. She's always doing stupid stuff to feel like she's cool and special, maybe that is why I can't stand Piper. 

Daya was such a disappointment. Poor Doggett, Lorna and Red. Their endings were heartbreaking. And poor Taystee, having to go thru so much, so glad she found a purpose and made a difference in women's lives. I'm glad Nicky was left with something to do, and took on Red's role. Suzanne was always a favorite of mine, I'm glad she had some growth, but continued to be quirky self. 

Throughout the series I lost all concept of time, as in how much time went by in the 7 seasons! I can't remember what half of the inmates did to end up in jail. What did Gloria do? Flaca? There were just too many characters to keep track. 

The farewell video at the end made me cry. I will miss this show despite it all. 

[Ceindreadh]

@nomodrama I think only about two to three years has passed. 

Piper says she was in prison for 18 months and was on probation for what, 6 to 12 months?  Or would she only have been on probation until her original release date.  

[DrSpaceman]

On ‎7‎/‎27‎/‎2019 at 1:48 PM, HollyG said:

I think it ended pretty well. I'm disappointed that Piper is still with Vause, but not surprised. I was hoping she would make a life with the new woman. But I think Larry was accurate in his assessment of Piper. She is always looking for something different....exciting, less ordinary. And Vause provides that for her.

I disagreed with this assessment. 

For one Piper and Vause I have never been convinced are "soulmates" and they have zero chemistry together as romantic partners onscreen

But beyond that, Piper has always struck me as a poser more than anything.  She wants to be viewed as different and unique and not your typical white-bread Connecticut rich girl, but then when she actually has to live that life, she can't do it long term.  She likes the money and nice things and everything that goes with the rich girl life.  She wants the best of both worlds, which obviously can't happen.  When she was with Vause in college or after college, she was connected to money and comfort as a result of the drug dealing.  She wasn't slumming it.  She was traveling around the world and taking advantage of the access to everything nice that goes with that lifestyle.  She wasn't backpacking it around Europe living or living in hostels, struggling to make it. 

I give that relationship 6 months after this show ends, max, Piper will be wanting all the rich girl niceties and will be back complaining about how hard things are for her.  That won't last

Doggett was the biggest surprise of the last season.  Didn't see that coming.  Saw her going back to drugs, but didn't see her death.  Of course I knew she would end up passing her test anyway, how it always works in TV shows. 

Could also see it coming they were going to leave her in the woods when she broke her ankle/foot whatever.  No ones coming back for her.  She is dead. 

A decent last season.  And a great idea for the charity fund from the show, I plan to donate

[DrSpaceman]

Also, I know its based on truth, but fictional, but some parts of the story are pretty unrealistic.

For one, you would never hire a twenty-something year old with no prior experience running any type of prison to run a federal max penitentiary. 

Also, you get thrown in a max federal pen for getting busted selling off brand counterfit jeans at a local mall?  It was at one store.  This wasn't a nationwide counterfit bust.  That was a small time operation, best I could tell. 

And with all the problems at the prison, why do you keep hiring from within for the warden position?  Maybe bring in someone from the outside?  But then maybe no one else wants that job because of its corporate and insider reputation

10 hours ago, nomodrama said:

Throughout the series I lost all concept of time, as in how much time went by in the 7 seasons! I can't remember what half of the inmates did to end up in jail. What did Gloria do? Flaca? There were just too many characters to keep track. 

I had this problem as well, keeping track of the characters and how much time had passed over the series.  I think it was only like a year and a half, based on Piper's comments about how long she had been in jail.  Which seems like an awfully short time for all this to happen

[kieyra]

13 minutes ago, DrSpaceman said:

And with all the problems at the prison, why do you keep hiring from within for the warden position?  Maybe bring in someone from the outside?  But then maybe no one else wants that job because of its corporate and insider reputation

Worth a read:

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2016/06/cca-private-prisons-corrections-corporation-inmates-investigation-bauer/

Undercover reporter at a privatized corrections facility. It's from a few years ago now, so I assume things are even worse now.

A quote from part of the intro:

Quote

“Well, I think you’ll like Louisiana. I know it’s not a lot of money, but they say you can go from a CO to a warden in just seven years! The CEO of the company started out as a CO”—a corrections officer.

Edited July 29, 2019 by kieyra

[HollyG]

53 minutes ago, DrSpaceman said:

I had this problem as well, keeping track of the characters and how much time had passed over the series.  I think it was only like a year and a half, based on Piper's comments about how long she had been in jail.  Which seems like an awfully short time for all this to happen

I thought for sure it was at least 4 or 5 years, but when they showed Pornstache at the end playing with the child, the baby (Daya's?) seemed to be a toddler. (2-ish or a bit less?) So with the 9 mo pregnancy, less than 3 years. ???

[Sakura12]

1 hour ago, DrSpaceman said:

Also, you get thrown in a max federal pen for getting busted selling off brand counterfit jeans at a local mall?  It was at one store.  This wasn't a nationwide counterfit bust.  That was a small time operation, best I could tell. 

Maria was sent to a minimum security prison for the counterfeit jeans, that's where they all where in the earlier seasons. They were sent to Max for the riot.  

[DrSpaceman]

1 hour ago, Sakura12 said:

Maria was sent to a minimum security prison for the counterfeit jeans, that's where they all where in the earlier seasons. They were sent to Max for the riot.  

I guess that is where I am confused and would have to rewatch to figure it out.  They had all the same characters in a minimum security prison and then transferred them all?  I don't recall how it all worked. 

[Sakura12]

Most were sent to Max because it was just down the hill. The rest were sent to Ohio where Alex was sent. 

[Ceindreadh]

42 minutes ago, DrSpaceman said:

I guess that is where I am confused and would have to rewatch to figure it out.  They had all the same characters in a minimum security prison and then transferred them all?  I don't recall how it all worked. 

17 minutes ago, Sakura12 said:

Most were sent to Max because it was just down the hill. The rest were sent to Ohio where Alex was sent. 

And judging by the visitors area when Piper visited Alex, the Ohio prison looked to be minimum security - or at least lesser security than max. 

[kathe5133]

I think those who took part in the riot got sent to Max.  The rest were relocated to other minimum security prisons throughout the country.

[SevenStars]

4 hours ago, DrSpaceman said:

Also, I know its based on truth, but fictional, but some parts of the story are pretty unrealistic.

For one, you would never hire a twenty-something year old with no prior experience running any type of prison to run a federal max penitentiary. 

Also, you get thrown in a max federal pen for getting busted selling off brand counterfit jeans at a local mall?  It was at one store.  This wasn't a nationwide counterfit bust.  That was a small time operation, best I could tell. 

 A 16yr old black boy was accused of stealing a bookbag, got sent to Rikers, a hardcore prison, spents yrs in Rikers without a trial before investigation proved he was innocent and he was released. He killed himself when he got out because of what he suffered in Rikers. He is just one of many. So I have no problem believing Marie could have been sent there for what she did. But she was sent to max for participating in the riot.  

[Ceindreadh]

2 hours ago, kathe5133 said:

I think those who took part in the riot got sent to Max.  The rest were relocated to other minimum security prisons throughout the country.

Flaca and Maritza spent the duration of the riot together but then got separated on the outside. (Flaca to Max and Maritza to somewhere else). 

Unless Maritza didn’t end up in max because she was clearly close to her release date?  

[ShortyMac]

Wow, this was a lot.

RIP, Pennsatucky. Life dealt you a shitty hand, and I’m sorry. You deserved better. And damn it, she ended up passing the GED!! The song at her memorial, and Dixon joining in was touching.

Wow, Luschek. Didn’t know you had it in you to not be a complete asshole. Took balls to own up to the phone smuggling and try to help Gloria on his way out.

So sad for my Red. Love you forever. One of my favorite TV characters of all time. I kind of got a chuckle out of her remembering her beef with Frieda. Red singing to Lorna. Love it.

So glad for Blanca, that she could get bonded out of the detention center to fight her criminal case. And Blanca is free! With her green card! Yes! A bit of justice! YES! Diablo!! YES!!!! They’re together in Honduras…

Chang!! So good to see her. Sucks that she’s detained by ICE, now.

Good for Taystee, trading the drugs back and giving back the key. I love her connecting with Judy King, and the fund in Poussey’s honor. That was a cool tie-in.

Glad Gloria got out after all. Always liked her, like Red, and her maternal nature. LOVE that she gave Maria her donkey book to read to Pepa.

So, Aleida will have another fucked up kid, selling drugs. I don’t even feel bad that she killed Daya. Fuck Daya. I think that was a call-back to Daya’s asthma.

Could have done without seeing Larry again. Didn’t feel necessary to see more of this from Piper.

I’m glad that Cindy was able to reconnect with her mom and daughter. I hated seeing her be homeless.

Oh, Karla. I knew when we saw her, that something bad would happen. Tragic.

What a great twist, that Fig and Caputo are adopting a child. I love it. I never thought I would end up liking Fig.

Since we can’t have everything good, of course Hellman would be Warden.

Love seeing Nicky take the lead in the kitchen and help inmates detox, like Red. Fuck yeah. Full circle moment.

THANK GOD, we finally saw Boo, Yoga Jones, the other one, Gina, and Norma! And Ang and Leanne.

Janae! Soso!

Surprise addition of CO Bailey being okay in the end. I like it. That was him, correct? With the baby in the kitchen?

I am glad that Piper is moving on and that she and Alex are still together and not giving up on each other.

Fantastic seven seasons. Orange Forever.

[ExplainItAgain]

3 minutes ago, ShortyMac said:

Surprise addition of CO Bailey being okay in the end. I like it. That was him, correct? With the baby in the kitchen?

That was Pornstache with Daya's baby! Can you believe it? Barely recognized him!

[ShortyMac]

2 minutes ago, ExplainItAgain said:

That was Pornstache with Daya's baby! Can you believe it? Barely recognized him!

Oh, shit! I knew he didn't look like Bailey! Thank you!

[Brn2bwild]

Note to Game of Thrones creators: this is how you write a satisfying bittersweet final episode.

Despite no clear sign that Taystee will be vindicated, she has found peace and a way to persevere and even thrive behind bars.

So it looks like Piper enrolled in law school... no doubt intending to eventually go into criminal law.  I'm going to fanwank that Tamika also goes to law school and becomes a public defender, who then eventually runs for office.  She's smart and telegenic enough.  Then she uses her influence to reopen Taystee's case, as well as shed harsh light on the private prison system.

Edited July 30, 2019 by Brn2bwild

[zibnchy]

I'll admit I cried at the end.

I'm hard pressed to remember another relatively high profile show, that lasted more than a few seasons, where the ostensible "star" was such a non-factor. On her best day the character of Piper was annoying. Mostly she was just boring. Her big "love" with Alex was boring. McCullough had soooooo much more chemistry with Alex than Piper ever did. In the end Piper's story was just really not an integral part of the plot of the show. They could have written her out of the last three seasons and I doubt anyone would have noticed. I guess I really disliked Piper.

Surprised how happy I was to see Ang and Leanne again.

This was Red's story. And Nicky's and Lorna's and Gloria's and Maria's. And Blanca's amazing story. Mostly, it was Taystee's story. I was really afraid we were going to lose her. That prison will be a better place with her in it. (I mean, unless she gets some press and a great new lawyer and manages to get a new trial.) I would watch a Taystee Jefferson spin-off.

I mostly hate watched the last couple of years but I thought this was a good final season. I'm glad I stuck with it. Maybe I'll rewatch one day, now that I know I can skip all Piper scenes without missing anything.

Edited July 30, 2019 by zibnchy

[PeterPirate]

2 hours ago, Brn2bwild said:

Note to Game of Thrones creators: this is how you write a satisfying bittersweet episode.

Despite no clear sign that Taystee will be vindicated, she has found peace and a way to persevere and even thrive behind bars.

So it looks like Piper enrolled in law school... no doubt intending to eventually go into criminal law.  I'm going to fanwank that Tamika also goes to law school and becomes a public defender, who then eventually runs for office.  She's smart and telegenic enough.  Then she uses her influence to reopen Taystee's case, as well as shed harsh light on the private prison system.

I would like to have seen Piper writing a book about her experience.  

Edited July 30, 2019 by PeterPirate

[Andyourlittledog2]

Piper going to law school makes no sense. Unless other states' bar allow felons to be licensed attorneys. As far as I know a conviction means disbarment for an attorney so I don't know why that wouldn't impede passing it in the  first place and becoming licensed.

[zibnchy]

1 hour ago, Andyourlittledog2 said:

Piper going to law school makes no sense. Unless other states' bar allow felons to be licensed attorneys. As far as I know a conviction means disbarment for an attorney so I don't know why that wouldn't impede passing it in the  first place and becoming licensed.

I looked it up. I can't really verify if the source is reliable BUT apparently most states will allow a felon to be licensed after passing the bar. After the bar exam all license applicants (even non-felons) must pass a test and convince a board that they are fine upstanding citizens. So if they show they have been rehabilitated, they can practice law.

But this is fictional so Piper is probably studying Martian Law on the Moon campus.

[Andyourlittledog2]

Quote

I looked it up. I can't really verify if the source is reliable BUT apparently most states will allow a felon to be licensed after passing the bar. After the bar exam all license applicants (even non-felons) must pass a test and convince a board that they are fine upstanding citizens. So if they show they have been rehabilitated, they can practice law.

But this is fictional so Piper is probably studying Martian Law on the Moon campus

Well that's disturbing. Thanks for looking it up. If Piper makes it I pity her poor clients. I think she'd make an awful attorney.

[DB in CMH]

3 hours ago, zibnchy said:

I'll admit I cried at the end.

I'm hard pressed to remember another relatively high profile show, that lasted more than a few seasons, where the ostensible "star" was such a non-factor. On her best day the character of Piper was annoying. Mostly she was just boring. Her big "love" with Alex was boring. McCullough had soooooo much more chemistry with Alex than Piper ever did. In the end Piper's story was just really not an integral part of the plot of the show. They could have written her out of the last three seasons and I doubt anyone would have noticed. I guess I really disliked Piper.

Surprised how happy I was to see Ang and Leanne again.

This was Red's story. And Nicky's and Lorna's and Gloria's and Maria's. And Blanca's amazing story. Mostly, it was Taystee's story. I was really afraid we were going to lose her. That prison will be a better place with her in it. (I mean, unless she gets some press and a great new lawyer and manages to get a new trial.) I would watch a Taystee Jefferson spin-off.

I mostly hate watched the last couple of years but I thought this was a good final season. I'm glad I stuck with it. Maybe I'll rewatch one day, now that I know I can skip all Piper scenes without missing anything.

Yes, it truly was Taystees story. What An amazing job the actress did.

[Chaos Theory]

Taystee really annoyed me over the last few seasons so I was worried the show would drown in her drama.   Regardless of what characters you love or not this show has always worked best as an ensemble.  Personally I would have felt something missing if Piper was gone.  I really did like her story considering she was always the one I identified most with.  Let’s face it if I went to prison I would be a lot like Piper Chapman.  Not a bad person but more interested in my own issues then everyone else’s.   I think the show was saying through Piper that if she was having issues outside prison walls and she actually did have people to lean on pissed off at her as they were, how hard it must have been for Taystee who had no options once she got kicked out of the place she was living.  Crime or homeless which would have put her back in prison anyway.  I really liked how they told Piper’s story without making her look like a pretentious idiot which this show liked to do at its worst moments which only annoyed me.  

i really liked the story with the camps.  It was a part of the plot without taking it over and drowning the final season.  How all the kitchen staff reacted and tried to help.   Having it end with them still working there and helping where and how they can while Nicky runs the kitchen.

Daya was definitely someone prison made worse.  Didn’t she enter prison with Piper and everyone get kind annoyed that her big story was falling for a guard?  How far she went from beginning to end. 

Same with Pennsatucky who was a villain in season one but by the end I was dang near tears because she really had changed for the better. 

Edited July 30, 2019 by Chaos Theory

[gryphon]

I've waited for a few days after bingeing (sp?) to reply.  I am good with the finale-I think I liked Blanca and Diablo the best at the end.  Happy ending, yay!!  They just looked like personified love.

I still have to fast forward all Caputo parts.  He just creeps me out. 

I am ok with Piper/Alex.  I was truly bummed that Pennsatucky died and I hated her at the beginning.  The hoodies and the Dew Song were a nice tribute.  

[Armchair Critic]

I didn't realize that was Pornstache! until I read it here.

Aleida said she was 37, maybe she was lying but she must have had Daya at a young age. The ages are kind of weird anyway, at one point Daya said something about "you millennials" when she is one too, also Piper's dad talked about her being a millennial but I guess she would be on the older range of a millennial.

Glad to see Luscheck fired, he could be funny but he was such a jerk, but I guess at least he finally stepped up.

I liked that the makeup seemed more natural this season, in fact Daya's skin was quite broken out.

I thought the guard that got Daya pregnant was an ass for abandoning her but after seeing how her family ended up now I can't blame him.

The theme song was a different version on the last episode.

Too much time spent on the Egyptian girl who was Nicky's love interest and the woman who became friends with Blanca when we already have such a large cast.

Edited July 31, 2019 by Armchair Critic

[SevenStars]

21 minutes ago, Armchair Critic said:

I didn't realize that was Pornstache! until I read it here.

Aleida said she was 37, maybe she was lying but she must have had Daya at a young age. The ages are kind of weird anyway, at one point Daya said something about "you millennials" when she is one too, also Piper's dad talked about her being a millennial but I guess she would be on the older range of a millennial.

Glad to see Luscheck fired, he could be funny but he was such a jerk, but I guess at least he finally stepped up.

I think Aleida was doing sex work as young as 14 yrs old, so it makes sense that she might have had Daya when she was just a child herself. It feels so wrong saying this because a child should never be a sex worker. 

Anyway, Aleida, along with Day are consider millennial, 37/38 is the cut off age, I think. Which is why it annoys me so much when the media and others act like millennial are teenagers. Just because some of us are "rebelling" against the ugly, shitty things others before us have created/cause, doesn't make us teenagers.