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S02.E10: Little Mustachioed Shit


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(edited)

That was a beautiful scene between Lorna and Nicky.  Nicky sees Lorna for the crazy mixed up girl she is and still loves her.  

 

Hi Alex.  Welcome back.

 

Red gives good advise.   REVENGE!!!!!!! 

 

Bye Pornstache.

 

Well it looks like Red is getting back some of her people.  

Edited by ChaosTheory
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(edited)
That was a beautiful scene between Lorna and Nicky.  Nicky sees Lorna for the crazy mixed up girl she is and still loves her.

It was very sweet and also kind of a relief to hear Morello acknowledge that she's got problems.  

 

Also really lovely was the scene between Nicky and Red when she handed over the heroin.  I actually teared up then, I think mostly out of relief that Nicky didn't use it and happiness to see her get such support.  

 

At this point I am so fearful for Poussey.

Edited by smrou
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Suzanne is frightening as the muscle. Lorraine Toussaint is amazing; Vee is so manipulative. The ostracizing of Poussey has me turning on Taystee ever since Vee rewrapped her around her little finger.

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I cant see Vee making it thru the season without getting shanked. She is just too  much of a disruptive sociopath to  continue on. So wondering who might kill her, if that is indeed the way it goes. Red? Poussey? And if her true self is shown, maybe Taystee or Suzanne?

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I'm thinking Suzanne might be the most likely candidate, but there's really no telling.

 

Kinda sad that nobody attended Healy's group session.  He's not a bad guy, though he's done some screwed up things and self-admittedly has rage issues.  He at least has a conscience.  I keep waiting for Pennsatucky to snap though, and revert back to psycho. 

 

I've been binge watching this season, and just remembered there was a board here, and some other people might share my obsession.  *LOL* 

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That was a beautiful scene between Lorna and Nicky.  Nicky sees Lorna for the crazy mixed up girl she is and still loves her.  

They're both such sweet characters; I'm glad they have each other.

Suzanne beating up Poussey horrified me. I don't know if it was because it was especially violent, or because I absolutely love Poussey, or because I have a soft spot for Crazy Eyes and hate to see her be violent...but it was horrifying to me.

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I'm glad that Christopher came to the prison and confronted Morello if that's what it took for her to get a shot of reality and admit that she has a problem.

I like that Piper figured out Polly was the one Larry slept with. Loved Red's revenge advice. Don't screw with Red! I'm still undecided about Piper's decision not to tell Red the truth about her place.

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I think Piper's heart was in the right place because there is nothing Red can do about the restaurant while she's in prison and knowing that it's closed would just break her heart. But realistically, you know that it's just a matter of time before Red finds out and then she's going to be really angry that Piper lied to her.

 

Didn't Christopher say that he did report it but the police didn't believe him?

Yes, he did say that. Although I find it sad, I also find it realistic. There are so many stories of women who have restraining orders against violent ex-boyfriends/ex-husbands who call the police when these men are standing outside of their homes and they are told things like, "We can't do anything until he actually violates the restraining order and comes within X number of yards of you." In Christopher's case, I would guess the police told him that she was in prison so there was no way it could have been her and that it was probably just neighborhood kids being stupid. It's really terrible to see how much she has terrorized him and his girlfriend/fiancée/wife. I know we are supposed to sympathize with her since she is the character we know, but from his point of view, she has followed them when they were on vacation, planted a bomb, and broken into his home (despite the fact that he had already moved twice by the time of the hearing we saw in the flashback). I would be angry and terrified.

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When he said the police didn't believe him; I was baffled that there wasn't some sort of investigation. Wouldn't her prints be all over the house? And since she took a (disgusting) bath, possibly her DNA? 

 

Though honestly, I think it is weird that he visited her in prison. That seems way too likely to encourage her (though thankfully this did the opposite). Doesn't he have to get onto a list? Or did he just assume he'd be on it because of her delusions?

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When he said the police didn't believe him; I was baffled that there wasn't some sort of investigation. Wouldn't her prints be all over the house? And since she took a (disgusting) bath, possibly her DNA? 

 

Though honestly, I think it is weird that he visited her in prison. That seems way too likely to encourage her (though thankfully this did the opposite). Doesn't he have to get onto a list? Or did he just assume he'd be on it because of her delusions?

Wasn't it mentioned in Season 1 that he visited her once before?  I could've sworn someone (Nicky?) said he visited her when she was first incarcerated.  Of course, that could have been a lie Lorna told.

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I loved seeing Alex's tattoo pop out from underneath the sheets before we even saw Laura's name in the credits.  Yes, baby, welcome back!  Come to mama.  Don't ever leave me again.

 

And once again we get glimpses that Piper was not then or ever really some naive shrinking violet taken in by Alex's schemes.  Interesting to see she went after her.  I loved her moments with Polly where she put it all together.  I really think Taylor's an expressive actress who doesn't get much credit for being both as subtle and versatile as she is.  This was a great episode for her and her emotional rollercoaster.  I'm trying not to get too excited by my suspicion that they're writing Larry out with this move.

 

I think Piper's heart was in the right place because there is nothing Red can do about the restaurant while she's in prison and knowing that it's closed would just break her heart. But realistically, you know that it's just a matter of time before Red finds out and then she's going to be really angry that Piper lied to her.

Yes on both counts.  Telling Red the truth would have served no purpose other than to make her miserable.  There's nothing she can do about it where she is.  When/if she finds out though, she's going to be pissed at Piper's white lie.

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Wow, after these last few episodes, Taystee and Crazy Eyes have really gone down the ranks in my esteem.  I know it's supposed to be because Vee's a manipulative bitch, but I just can't with the way they are treating Poussey and the drug running and all of that.  I think Vee and her henchmen are in for a big downfall by season's end, and I can't wait, because it's gross seeing her get her way so handily.

 

The Morello/Nicky scene made me tear up.  And Nicky/Red.  I've really enjoyed Nicky's presence this season, even if she hasn't had a huge storyline or role in a lot of the happenings of the prison.  It's so impossible to pick favorites on this show, but she's up there for me.

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(edited)

She sure seemed happy to play the naive shrinking violet in court.

Well, "play" being the operative word.  My point was [and it was late] that once again we see that Piper wasn't really the lamb to Alex's wolf as she sometimes seems to want to style it.  She did actually deploy a demure manner with her in the bar when she clearly was looking for her, but she did so in a way that was completely calculated.

 

The Morello/Nicky scene made me tear up.  And Nicky/Red.  I've really enjoyed Nicky's presence this season, even if she hasn't had a huge storyline or role in a lot of the happenings of the prison.  It's so impossible to pick favorites on this show, but she's up there for me.

Same.  I've always liked her, but even more so this season.

 

Also it occurred to me while watching last night that Samira Wiley might be my season mvp.  They've given her a lot more to do this season and she's really stepped up and knocked it all out of the park.

Edited by bravelittletoaster
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Yes, Samira Wiley has been awesome this season too!  They've definitely bumped up her, Taystee, and Suzanne's screen times this season, but unfortunately, she's the only one who has come across better for it.  I haven't given up hope that the others can't be redeemed by the end of this season or next season maybe (I still have two episodes to watch), but so far they've just been jerks to everyone by falling in line with Vee.

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I'm really curious to see how Taystee comes out at the end of the season.  Just because to me they've gotten pretty far away from what everyone seemed to love about that character in season 1.  And I'm not saying she can't change [for better or worse], but it was an interesting choice.  But then other characters have changed significantly, too, Pennsatucky being among the most notable to my mind.

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When Pennsatucky came out of the SHU so different, I thought it was because they had been medicating her but she seems to have (mostly) maintained her calm since then so maybe all that time in solitary really did help her change. There are still moments when I see brief flashes of her old self but she seems much calmer and less crazy this season.

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Nicky reminds me so much of Rayanne on My So-Called Life. In the case of Nicky's friendship with Morello, I love that she acknowledges her level of crazy but doesn't judge her for it and accepts her the way she is.

Interesting comparison!  I can see it, though for me Rayanne had a way of sowing chaos wherever she went that was sometimes a little hard for me to take (much as I loved her character) and I don't get quite that same thing from Nicky.  They both have the characteristic of being extremely personally damaged but constantly finding humor in life and showing real kindness to friends. 

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(edited)

I think the main similarity I see between them is that they are usually very honest. When Nicky had that conversation with Lorna, it reminded me of Rayanne talking to Sharon in the bathroom and saying, "It's refreshing, isn't it?"

I see Nicky as a more mature version of Rayanne who is no longer as impulsive and self destructive. Rayanne would have done that heroin, not handed it over to Red.

Edited by ElectricBoogaloo
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A lot to applaud in this episode, especially the heartfelt scenes already mentioned.    Oddly I found myself liking Pornstache at the end.   Given everything happening among the inmates at that prison, he seemed almost ... innocent ... by comparison.   "And no soft cheese!"  Pablo Schreiber deserves a lot of credit for that role. 

 

P.S.  Two or three heartbeats after Suzanne attacked Poussey, the camera framed Vee standing against the bathroom wall wearing a Mona Lisa smile.   And suddenly I flashed back to the show "Angel."  Remember the character Jasmine?  

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(edited)
When he said the police didn't believe him; I was baffled that there wasn't some sort of investigation. Wouldn't her prints be all over the house?

 

 

As Nicky told Piper:  "Nobody likes to do extra work"    Morello was safe and sound in Federal prison.  The cops didn't want to waste taxpayer dollars and their own time on what CLEARLY was a man with an ax to grind.    So Christopher went to the prison and confronted Morello which I thought was a great scene because it finally got her to open her eyes.  "He isn't the man I thought he was.  He's so mean"    Hey whatever works...work it.  

Edited by ChaosTheory
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If this season ended up with Vee being beaten by the inmates I'd be happy. What an evil human being. 

 

I really liked Pornstache's reaction when he found out about Daya's baby. In fact, I'm oddly touched. He really didn't give a fuck about anything else but Daya and the baby. Bennet looks like a wimp now.

 

I'm so glad Nicky gave the heroin to Red. I'm proud of her too. And now Red has ammunition to take Vee down (hopefully). Perfect.

 

I think Piper made such a dumb mistake with Red. She should have said that she didn't have time to go to Red's restaurant. 

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I'm really over Daya.  I don't know what she's expecting, but all these head games she's playing with Bennett are nuts.  Someone needs to sit her down and tell her to quit with the "Happily ever after" and face reality.

 

Oh, and I'm over Bennett too.

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Bravelittletoaster: I'm really curious to see how Taystee comes out at the end of the season.  Just because to me they've gotten pretty far away from what everyone seemed to love about that character in season 1.  And I'm not saying she can't change [for better or worse], but it was an interesting choice.  

 

I agree. I think Danielle was surprised as well. In interviews she seems a bit nervous about how fans responses will be. I think she expected Taystee to remain close to the character she was in season 1. I kind of feel bad for her, but I got the vibe that she was scared that fans wouldn't like her/her character after this season, but that doesn't seem to be the case. I've seen a few comments about fan's opinions of Taystee going down, but I think most people seem to understand she was being manipulated, right?

 

This is her first big job, so I can see why she would have some qualms about her character changing so much. But I think it allowed her really showcase what a wonderful actress she is. 

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So Christopher went to the prison and confronted Morello which I thought was a great scene because it finally got her to open her eyes.  "He isn't the man I thought he was.  He's so mean"    Hey whatever works...work it.

 

I had a little bit of a problem with that scene and the outcome. I've never been stalked (or stalked anyone, for that matter), but from what I thought I understood, I thought you were never, ever supposed to engage or confront the stalker--when a person is stuck in that mode, they view any attention as 'good'. Like the way she was grinning and simpering at him in court. 

 

There was a recent case of a missing woman, Teleka Patrick, who was obsessed with a quasi-celebrity pastor. The pastor had restraining orders on her. Teleka was later discovered to have, sadly, wandered into a lake and drowned*, but she had been tweeting to the pastor with several different twitter accounts, which were discovered in the course of the search for her. There were thousands and thousands of tweets, and I read a lot of them. It was fascinating and extremely sad, not least because she herself was a newly-graduated psychiatric intern. Anyway, my point here is that even though the pastor rebuffed her at every turn, because of her delusion, she assumed he was being forced (by powers unknown) to publicly deny their relationship while secretly still loving her from afar. I thought this was somewhat common, especially with celebrity stalkers. 

 

Shorter version: I don't think "I'm really mad, stop stalking me!" ever actually works on someone that far gone. I expected Morello to bounce back from it and say something like "It's that new wife of his, she made him say all those terrible things to me. He doesn't really mean it."

 

(*Due to her mental illness, it's a little more complicated than that, but outside the scope of this forum. Fascinating and sad case, though, good article here including some example tweets.)

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 I've seen a few comments about fan's opinions of Taystee going down, but I think most people seem to understand she was being manipulated, right?

Historically, that's never been a legitimate excuse for bad behavior.    Taystee KNEW what was going to happen to Poussey.   Her expression a moment before it happened telegraphed that clearly.   Good ol' Taystee stood by and said/did nothing while a maniac (and yes, I think Suzanne is a bonafide maniac) kicked the shit out of her best friend, and worse, while that friend was drunk and unable to fight back.

 

I find it interesting that Sophia is virtually the only black woman who hasn't entered Vee's sphere of influence, for either good or bad. 

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I get the sense that Vee likes people's sexuality to be pretty black and white and also conventional.  I don't think she's ever even acknowledged Sophia's presence, has she?  I don't know if it's more from Sophia avoiding her, or Vee freezing her out though.

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Kinda sad that nobody attended Healy's group session.  He's not a bad guy, though he's done some screwed up things and self-admittedly has rage issues.  He at least has a conscience.

 

 

Didn't he stand aside and watch while Tucky attacked Piper with a potentially lethal weapon? Didn't he sneer and then walk away while Piper begged for his help? I think he's a pretty bad guy, especially considering that keeping these women safe is his job

 

I've seen a few comments about fan's opinions of Taystee going down, but I think most people seem to understand she was being manipulated, right?

 

 

Sorry, but an adult being manipulated does not excuse horrific, sociopathic behavior. Standing aside and allowing that lunatic to beat her best friend half to death is completely, utterly inexcusable. I don't blame the actress for being nervous about how Taystee2.0 would be received, because I don't even recognize her. I see nothing likable about this new character they're calling "Taystee." If they had to have this new person on the show, I wish they would have left Taystee alone and cast another actress to play her.

 

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Historically, that's never been a legitimate excuse for bad behavior.    Taystee KNEW what was going to happen to Poussey.   Her expression a moment before it happened telegraphed that clearly.   Good ol' Taystee stood by and said/did nothing while a maniac (and yes, I think Suzanne is a bonafide maniac) kicked the shit out of her best friend, and worse, while that friend was drunk and unable to fight back.

 

I find it interesting that Sophia is virtually the only black woman who hasn't entered Vee's sphere of influence, for either good or bad. 

 

 

I get the sense that Vee likes people's sexuality to be pretty black and white and also conventional.  I don't think she's ever even acknowledged Sophia's presence, has she?  I don't know if it's more from Sophia avoiding her, or Vee freezing her out though.

Mrs QF and I were discussing this after last night's episode. I think it's that Vee likes people who conform to easily checked off boxes, and who are in need of her "guidance". I thought it was a homo/transphobia thing, but then Mrs QF pointed out that Vee had no problem with Suzanne, and then we decided it's probably more that Poussey and Sophia aren't going to fall for Vee's tricks. We saw that Poussey had a loving family and fairly middle class upbringing with lots of education and travel as an Army brat, and Sophia is quite secure in who she is. Neither have easy weaknesses for Vee to exploit, and neither are terribly useful to Vee-Poussey was probably slightly more useful, which is why she was given so many chances to join their gang.

 

It's pretty fascinating and I am very excited to watch the rest of the season given how heavy the underlying theme of race has been. This show makes me wish I was still in college and taking "Intro to Women's Studies" again, because you could write one hell of a paper on race and class and how they dissect people on this show. 

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(edited)

Just rewatched the scene. What happened is Poussey was throwing up in the bathroom from being drunk and Vee, Black Cindy, and another woman we don't know were brushing their teeth/at the sinks. So Black Cindy was there. Poussey gets up and starts yelling at and hitting Vee, Cindy runs away, and then Suzanne comes from another shower stall it looks like and pulls Poussey off and starts beating her up at the direction of creepy looks from Vee. I remember watching it and thinking it was good Taystee wasn't there, only because it would have made her even worse. Though it does look bad that she heard about it and didn't reach out to Poussey. But I would really hope that if she had been there, she would've done something. 

 

Just rewatched and Cindy didn't actually leave-she watched. But I think her flashback confirmed she definitely was not one of the more more sympathetic prisoners/can be selfish. I'm not surprised she watched. 

 

Also, I noticed Taystee also developed this attitude of "well, we're all criminals anyway so it doesn't matter what we do because we're already in jail." While I don't think that's a good excuse at all, I think it's how she justified her actions. 

Edited by AmyTinaMindy
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I had a little bit of a problem with that scene and the outcome. I've never been stalked (or stalked anyone, for that matter), but from what I thought I understood, I thought you were never, ever supposed to engage or confront the stalker--when a person is stuck in that mode, they view any attention as 'good'. Like the way she was grinning and simpering at him in court.

 

 

I think that's probably true, but I also suspect that many stalking victims don't do exactly what the experts recommend. If you're mad, you may not be able to detach enough to avoid the confrontation.

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When he said the police didn't believe him; I was baffled that there wasn't some sort of investigation. Wouldn't her prints be all over the house? And since she took a (disgusting) bath, possibly her DNA?

 

I bought it. I mean no one was hurt and there was minimal property damage. The prime suspect is locked up, and the guard who supervised her in the van was fired. As far as DNA goes you hear all the time about crime labs being so understaffed, that there is a DNA backlog for rape cases. Not sure running DNA on a breaking and entering case would be a priority at all.

 

I really liked Pornstache's reaction when he found out about Daya's baby. In fact, I'm oddly touched. He really didn't give a fuck about anything else but Daya and the baby. Bennet looks like a wimp now.

 

I fully expect Daya to be totally into Pornstache's display since he basically did everything she wants Bennet to do. I bet there will be more of her guilting Bennet in the coming episodes and more of me being annoyed by it.

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Oddly I felt bad for Christopher and Morello. He had every right to confront her, though at the same time I felt bad the way he did it. I still feel she needs serious psychiatric help and prison is not the answer for her.

And in another odd way, now it seems the tide has turned with Pornstache getting arrested and his declaration of love, since everyone knows the real father, Pornstache doesnt look so bad.

really want to see something horrible happen to Vee

The first episode set up Piper making a choice to lie or tell the truth and now we see her making that choice over and over in many episodes. This time lying to Red

I still have a problem with Piper's portrayal and character. The show, and the character, seem to be trying to make the argument that her good girl facade was just that, a facade all along, she had everyone fooled and was really a bad girl, just the opposite of the opening when we thought she was "good girl" who got caught up in a bad situation. I get the point they are trying to make, she has made mistakes just like the other girls in there. They all had some good and bad things in their life and made choices. However I think they are trying to go too far from on extreme to the other. They are trying to make it out now like Piper was always this devious person who was just suppressing her bad side the whole time. Thats not really true either though and the truth is more in the middle. Its true she is more self aware now of how she made her own mistakes, which is good. However a childish prank as her "revenge" really shows how as much as she seems to be viewing herself as a Red/Vee type who is vindictive and cunning, she really is not. There is just another side to her that she suppresses most of the time because it can get her into trouble.

I feel like I know what the writers are going for but they just miss the mark a bit. And it also makes me feel the Piper character is often portrayed as inconsistent because they swing her from on extreme to the other in her young/old scenes, either all "good" and innocent or all "bad".

Piper for me is not the most interesting character on the show though, so it doesn't detract too much from the overall product.

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(edited)

I think for me all her flaws and idiosyncrasies just make her human. She's not a bad person masquerading as a good one or vice versa because no one is. She has moments where she really shines and others where she falls flat on her face. I don't see the portrayal of Piper as inconsistent so much as natural. We're all alternately decent and shitty people depending on what moment you catch us in.

Edited by bravelittletoaster
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I do understand why the police didn't do more when Morello broke into Christopher's house. When I was burgled, there was a hand print in the dust on my coffee table (don't judge, I was working a lot of overtime at the time) and they refused to do anything.

 

I am wondering what Red will do with the knowledge that Vee is selling heroin.

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Lying to Red was dumb, but very Piper.  Or rather, that specific lie; she should've just been apologetic about being unable to get away from family and over to Queens.  While I totally get why she didn't tell Red the market was closed, it won't be pretty when Red finds out the truth.

 

The scene between Nicky and Red was my favorite of the episode.  I was majorly worried for her as she was struggling with the drugs, and so proud of her when she went to Red.  It took a lot of strength, both to give up the drugs and to admit she couldn't handle it by herself, and Red was so sweet and maternal with her.

 

My first thought was that Poussey was going to get caught, either with her homemade hooch or drunk afterwards, but what happened was even worse.  We know that she's protective of those she cares about, and taking them away from her can make her incredibly angry, so it was only a matter of time.  It was just so painful - my heart broke for her when she blew up at Vee and when Suzanne attacked her.  At the same time, though, I felt awful for Suzanne when she started hitting herself afterward.  I know that being manipulated by Vee doesn't absolve these girls, but Suzanne really is more vulnerable than the others.

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Great episode..after watching what I felt like was a few slow moving episodes.  But I get some Piper and Alex. :) and all the story lines seemed to move ahead.  Still waiting to see how I feel about the change in Suzanne and Taystee.  Suzanne was always a little off, but I felt like a good soul deep down.  Maybe she is who she follows.  Loving Poussey this season. Great acting and great storyline.  I'm wondering if Piper will ever be able to just get Alex out of her system.  Will there be a straw at some point. I need to finish up the next three episodes!!

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One interesting take home point for me in this episode on the subject of Alex and Piper was that I think I'd always believed that Alex's early pursuit of Piper was more of a one way street. More top-down as it were. But then we see that after their initial encounter Piper pursued and seduced her. This episode made it clear to me at least that their addiction to each other has always been mutual. This episode kind of puts the lie to Piper's description earlier in the season as herself as the lamb to Alex's wolf. That hardly seemed the case in flashback.

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(edited)

Yeah, BLT, I was happy to see that the pursuit was not one sided.  That Piper was aggressive with Alex and it was totally a turn on.  But the flash forward of Piper not reading the letters.  The flash forward of Piper being aware of the hold that Alex has on her.  (And the hold that Piper has on Alex, from Alex's point of view.)  Sometimes the volatility settles down and works itself out.  Sometimes the volatility blows up everything.  But I love the volatility and love that LP is back for season three.  Ten episodes into season two and I realize how much more I like the show with that undercurrent of their crazy relationship as a constant.    

 

A few one offs that cracked me up.

 

Polly's response to the bag of shit on fire..."I deserved that"

 

Piper's comment to the reporter.."Get me an iPhone, so I can take pictures and play Candy Crush"

 

And of course, What kind of lesbian are you? "The boob touching kind" 

 

Taylor Schilling is wonderful to watch!

Edited by SaabStory
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