Kyle Richards: Pantene Poster Girl

[SCS]

The Executive producer built the show around Kyle and her friends so she is the central character

I don't know if this is accurate. I guess it's a matter of perception: you and others feel Kyle is the central character on this show; I and others don't. So it goes.

[AnnA]

The Executive producer built the show around Kyle and her friends so she is the central character just like Jeana on OC, Jill on NYC, Lea Black on MIami.  Don't know who the central character was on NJ but I am guessing it was Dina.  Even this year it was Kyle  who had the connect to the newbies.

 

That may have been the way it was but it's not like that now.  I never watched Miami so I can't comment on Lea Black but the others, i.e., Jeana and Jill are long gone so they're not the central characters either.  We see Jeana from time to time but she's irrelevant to the OC.  Building a show around something doesn't mean it's going to stay that way forever.

[Watermelon]

I think you all are having two different conversations: Who is the center of the show and who was the center of casting.  One of them would be a fact that shouldn't be too hard to determine.

[zoeysmom]

I don't know if this is accurate. I guess it's a matter of perception: you and others feel Kyle is the central character on this show; I and others don't. So it goes.

It is not a matter of perception it is a fact.  The Executive Producer, who produces RHOC as well, saw Kyle on E's True Hollywood Story: Paris Hilton.  He approached Kyle and she delivered Lisa, who in turn brought Adrienne who brought in Taylor and Kyle added Kim and Camille.  They touched on it today in the Season 2 Reunion.  This is not a state secret just how the show was put together. 

 

Whether she remains the central character I think varies from year to year-she certainly garnered the most minutes of aired footage this year.  I think Vanderpump is regularly the most popular.  Brandi is the most desperate.  Kim is the one with the fewest original storylines.

[zoeysmom]

That may have been the way it was but it's not like that now.  I never watched Miami so I can't comment on Lea Black but the others, i.e., Jeana and Jill are long gone so they're not the central characters either.  We see Jeana from time to time but she's irrelevant to the OC.  Building a show around something doesn't mean it's going to stay that way forever.

Of course not but as long as they stay on the show I think it is pretty reasonable to state the are the central character.  Teresa Giudice rose to be the big draw on RHONJ.  I look at who has the most parties and events as the central character.  Kyle I think had the White Party, the BBQ, the Gay Mixer, the yacht trip.  She is also the only one to be on good terms with the returning RH-Camille, Taylor and Adrienne.  Yolanda had the best event-the Amsterdam trip and her dinner.  Lisa had the tea and surprise party.  To me that is what makes the central character and why someone like a Brandi wants to knock her down.

Edited April 11, 2015 by zoeysmom

[SCS]

The Executive Producer, who produces RHOC as well, saw Kyle on E's True Hollywood Story: Paris Hilton. He approached Kyle and she delivered Lisa, who in turn brought Adrienne who brought in Taylor and Kyle added Kim and Camille. They touched on it today in the Season 2 Reunion. This is not a state secret just how the show was put together.

.

And this history does not make Kyle the central character or the "center" of the show as said upthread -- it makes her the first hired. Again, perception. And opinion. That's fine. Can you imagine how dull it would be if we all saw things the same way? Edited April 11, 2015 by steelcitysister

[LotusFlower]

And this history does not make Kyle the central character or the "center" of the show as said upthread -- it makes her the first hired. Again, perception. And opinion.

As Watermelon said, it's not just casting, it's storyline. Kyle has been a central character to the show and various storylines throughout every season since day one. No one else has, save LVP (maybe), but she's distanced herself a bit this year, probably due to Vanderpump Rules.

[BlackMamba]

IMO, Kathy does not really take Kim's side as much as she dislike's the bad press (despite her own children's questionable behavior)

 

I said in the EP21 thread.  I don't think Kathy takes side Kim necessarily.  She might enables and keeps some kind of peace with Kim like everyone else does in their family so Kim won't turn into some snappy turtle.  I think in private Kathy tells Kim and Kyle individually what they are doing wrong in their relationship.  But as we've seen Kim loves to tell a lie, spin and try to make it seem like she has this big support system in "The Great and Wonderful Kathy Hilton."  She uses to piss off Kyle and make Kyle into the black sheep between the three.  No, Kyle has said that Kathy and her have issues but I don't think it's solely Kim as we're lead to believe.  It has a lot more to do with their husbands and that Mauricio is taking potential elite clients away from Rick.  I'm sure before Mauricio left the Hiltons company, because they weren't trying to put him up in company, I bet good money Kathy tried getting Kyle to talk Mauricio out of it, but it was no dice.  These sisters, all three, were brought up on competing with one another even though it could hurt them in the long run.  That's my theory.

 

The Executive producer built the show around Kyle and her friends so she is the central character just like Jeana on OC, Jill on NYC, Lea Black on MIami.  Don't know who the central character was on NJ but I am guessing it was Dina.  Even this year it was Kyle  who had the connect to the newbies.

 

Dina was suppose to be Andy's star.  But Dina, while I like her, she's too boring in terms of that show be the star.  I think Jacqueline the one who brought in Danielle.  I think on BH, the EPs probably were going to build the show around Kyle in the beginning but when Lisa V and Camille became fan favs and their stories intrigued the audience more they might had had changed it up.  Not say Kyle is less popular than LVP just she probably the second most popular on BH and maybe a top-15 HW overall.  Kyle and LVP has the most popular pairing in friendship and combined fanbase other than Sonja/Ramona, Teresa/Dina, Vicki/Tamra, and even Kim/Nene.

Edited April 11, 2015 by BlackMamba

[zoeysmom]

And this history does not make Kyle the central character or the "center" of the show as said upthread -- it makes her the first hired. Again, perception. And opinion. That's fine. Can you imagine how dull it would be if we all saw things the same way?

Well who then in your perception is the central character?

Edited April 11, 2015 by zoeysmom

[zoeysmom]

I said in the EP21 thread.  I don't think Kathy takes side Kim necessarily.  She might enables and keeps some kind of peace with Kim like everyone else does in their family so Kim won't turn into some snappy turtle.  I think in private Kathy tells Kim and Kyle individually what they are doing wrong in their relationship.  But as we've seen Kim loves to tell a lie, spin and try to make it seem like she has this big support system in "The Great and Wonderful Kathy Hilton."  She uses to piss off Kyle and make Kyle into the black sheep between the three.  No, Kyle has said that Kathy and her have issues but I don't think it's solely Kim as we're lead to believe.  It has a lot more to do with their husbands and that Mauricio is taking potential elite clients away from Rick.  I'm sure before Mauricio left the Hiltons company, because they weren't trying to put him up in company, I bet good money Kathy tried getting Kyle to talk Mauricio out of it, but it was no dice.  These sisters, all three, were brought up on competing with one another even though it could hurt them in the long run.  That's my theory.

 

 

Dina was suppose to be Andy's star.  But Dina, while I like her, she's too boring in terms of that show be the star.  I think Jacqueline the one who brought in Danielle.  I think on BH, the EPs probably were going to build the show around Kyle in the beginning but when Lisa V and Camille became fan favs and their stories intrigued the audience more they might had had changed it up.  Not say Kyle is less popular than LVP just she probably the second most popular on BH and maybe a top-15 HW overall.  Kyle and LVP has the most popular pairing in friendship and combined fanbase other than Sonja/Ramona, Teresa/Dina, Vicki/Tamra, and even Kim/Nene.

I think Kathy Hilton is also pushing the "it is a private matter", "it has nothing to do with the show", "it is a family matter" agenda with Kim.  I don't think Kathy or Kim are willing to acknowledge that Kim does not have the ability to keep secrets on the show or out of the press.  Take the dog bite the kid missed a month of school and was walking around with a heavy duty bandage job or cast. You can't make the kid live under a rock because Kim does not want to look bad (that ship sailed long ago).  Kim should not be keeping secrets because according to Kim, "you are only as sick as your secrets."

[AnnA]

Well who then in your perception is the central character?

The franchise has changed over the years and I don't think there is a central character anymore. It used to be a pair of HWs (not just one) and their friends. Now it's more about the group and next season I think LisaR will do her best to become involved in everything and be on screen As much as she can.

Edited April 11, 2015 by AnnA

[LotusFlower]

I think across the board the HW shows are always about a group, but one or more kind of breaks out as a leading character. Nene did this on Atlanta, although that's receding, Vicki G. the OG on the OC, Ramona and Jill on NY, Teresa on NJ, and LVP on Beverly Hills. In my opinion, they cast the show around Kyle, and she's key to the franchise, but Lisa is more popular.

[BlackMamba]

The franchise has changed over the years and I don't think there is a central character anymore. It used to be a pair of HWs (not just one) and their friends. Now it's more about the group

 

I see your point here.  BH/ATL/OC are the main ones that come to mind doing alliances each season.  BH especially in season 3 and 4.  If it's 7 women, it will be 4 vs 3 unless they invite a friend.  If it's 6 - it will be 3 vs 3 unless you run into a Kim/Brandi situation.  However on NJ is the most lopsided in alliance.  The first few seasons it was Danielle vs 4 wives.  Then in the later years it was TG vs everyone.  Andy loves it anyhow you slice or dice it - just give him some good tv!  lol.

[BlackMamba]

[motorcitymom65]

I think you all are having two different conversations: Who is the center of the show and who was the center of casting.  One of them would be a fact that shouldn't be too hard to determine.

I agree with this. They can be two completely different things.  They could also be the same.

 

I have always thought about Kyle as the central figure of the show (yes, even more than Lisa V) because Kyle has always basically acted like the Welcome Wagon on this show. I don't know if this role was assigned to her, or if it is just her personality. She films with pretty much everyone, and generally she does it first with the new girls. She didn't bring Taylor on the show, but she filmed with her alone the most. She introduced Marissa and filmed with her alone. She was the first one to film solo with both Joyce and Carlton. Heck, even Yolanda, who knew Lisa V first, filmed solo with Kyle (when they did the Master Cleanse) before she filmed solo with anyone else including Lisa V or Brandi.  The rule doesn't always hold true, but even if she doesn't film with them first, she will always film with the new girls early on. This is far different from someone like Lisa V, who has a very different personality. I cannot think of a single new HW - save for Lisar who she already knew - that Lisa V has ever filmed with solo prior to really getting to know them. She just doesn't do it, and from what I have read this is a key element for any newbie on the show. They have to rely on the existing HW's to contact them and schedule time to film with them, since a newbie rarely reaches out in the beginning. They can do some early one-on-one stuff where the audience gets to know their family, but at some point they need have scenes where they interact with the others in small groups, which means they need someone willing to work with the new girls. This has always been Kyle and I this is why I think she is really the central figure on the show. 

[zoeysmom]

The franchise has changed over the years and I don't think there is a central character anymore. It used to be a pair of HWs (not just one) and their friends. Now it's more about the group and next season I think LisaR will do her best to become involved in everything and be on screen As much as she can.

Depending who comes and goes next year I think it is entirely likely Lisar would be gunning for top dog.  She just had to stop though with all the wishy washy talk and people pleasing.  No more glass smashing.  I will be interested to see who they bring in-I am assuming more actresses because it worked this year.

[IKnowRight]

I agree with this. They can be two completely different things.  They could also be the same.

 

I have always thought about Kyle as the central figure of the show (yes, even more than Lisa V) because Kyle has always basically acted like the Welcome Wagon on this show. I don't know if this role was assigned to her, or if it is just her personality. She films with pretty much everyone, and generally she does it first with the new girls. She didn't bring Taylor on the show, but she filmed with her alone the most. She introduced Marissa and filmed with her alone. She was the first one to film solo with both Joyce and Carlton. Heck, even Yolanda, who knew Lisa V first, filmed solo with Kyle (when they did the Master Cleanse) before she filmed solo with anyone else including Lisa V or Brandi.  The rule doesn't always hold true, but even if she doesn't film with them first, she will always film with the new girls early on. This is far different from someone like Lisa V, who has a very different personality. I cannot think of a single new HW - save for Lisar who she already knew - that Lisa V has ever filmed with solo prior to really getting to know them. She just doesn't do it, and from what I have read this is a key element for any newbie on the show. They have to rely on the existing HW's to contact them and schedule time to film with them, since a newbie rarely reaches out in the beginning. They can do some early one-on-one stuff where the audience gets to know their family, but at some point they need have scenes where they interact with the others in small groups, which means they need someone willing to work with the new girls. This has always been Kyle and I this is why I think she is really the central figure on the show.

Agreed, and this certainly explains Vicki's attitude and actions on the OC. She thinks she is the Queen Mother.

Kyle acts like a true hostess/welcome wagon while Vicki, who should act accordingly, acts as a doorman to the newbies. Vickie likes to haze the new girls first to see if they belong in "her" sorority. I think that's why many dislike Vicki. The only time we've seen Kyle behave more like Vicki is when Brandi was a friend of the HWs, season 2.

[motorcitymom65]

Agreed, and this certainly explains Vicki's attitude and actions on the OC. She thinks she is the Queen Mother.

Kyle acts like a true hostess/welcome wagon while Vicki, who should act accordingly, acts as a doorman to the newbies. Vickie likes to haze the new girls first to see if they belong in "her" sorority. I think that's why many dislike Vicki. The only time we've seen Kyle behave more like Vicki is when Brandi was a friend of the HWs, season 2.

Exactly. This is why Vicki can never really ever be the central person on that show. I know that she wants to think that she is, but she just doesn't have the personality for it. What they need is someone who can and will film with most anyone. Someone who gets down and dirty in the drama, but can move forward after it blows up. Vicki wants to think of herself as Lisa V, but she is not. Lisa V generally holds the newbies at arms length, but she isn't cruel about it. Lisa V rarely does a lot of one-on-one filming with a HW, save for the one or two that she is close too.  When she had Kyle as her friend in S1 and S2, we never saw her film alone with another HW, except for Adrienne (the chicken washing scene comes to mind). Outside of that it is always the group stuff. In S3, she was mostly with Brandi, and occasionally with Kyle. I think that this works for her. She is busy and probably not that interested. Lisa doesn't need to be liked by everyone. Kyle tends to like for people to like her, which is why I think she handles the newbies the way that she does. 

[beaker73]

I didn't read Kyle's blog but I did see the posts quoting her saying:

 

"I would like to ask you all, regardless of what your opinion is, to please be kind on social media. There are no winners here. No "teams.” This is my family, regardless of what problems we have right now."

 

That statement didn't earn her any brownie points in my book.   IMHO it shows she's even dumber than I thought she was.  If that's how she really feels, she needs to stop being on reality TV.

All she was asking was for people to not be assholes on Twitter, FB, etc. I personally don't think that makes her dumb.

[Almost 3000]

The Executive producer built the show around Kyle and her friends so she is the central character just like Jeana on OC, Jill on NYC, Lea Black on MIami.  Don't know who the central character was on NJ but I am guessing it was Dina.  Even this year it was Kyle  who had the connect to the newbies.

Thank you for remembering that Jeana was the original connector on the OC. Vicki kinda took the crown from by placing the the OG of the OC tiara on her yellow locks.

[BluishGreen]

I agree and yet I still view Kyle as a dumb dumb in general. She is not able to get from point A to point B in a concise manner when trying to have a conversation. She is good for a general gabfest, and being an emotional mess at other times, but not resolving issues. I was struck by this during one of the reunion segments. I think that LisaR, LisaV and Brandi were going at it. The Lisa's were laying out the issues in a point A to point B manner. Then as soon as there was a slight lull in the talking Kyle took that opportunity to say Ableee Ablooo Ablaaa and just spoke jibberish that didn't move anything forward. 

 

I think there is a difference between being a "dumb dumb", as you call it, and being articulate. Verbal acuity is a skill that intelligent people often have, but being inarticulate or having difficulty expressing your thoughts in an emotional situation is not the same as being dumb, IMO.

Being forceful and directive in an argument takes some kind of ability, no doubt about it.   Kim is both of those things-- but is there anyone, in this world or the next,  who would ever call Kim Richards smart? 

[SCS]

I am going to stop saying dumb because I just looked up the meaning and it doesn't mean what I wanted it to mean. I do think that Kyle has a limited capacity for saying what needs to be said when she is trying to make a point. It's not the way she speaks, it is the thoughts she is mangling.  When the Lisa's and Eileen, even Joyce (I really miss her this year) are presenting their thoughts, I can see clearly a straight line from beginning to end, and I understand the result they are seeking. With Kyle, Kim and Brandi, I just see loopy lines wandering around aimlessly. 

 

I should have known dumb was not the appropriate word, since hearing loss and deafness are abundant in my family. I am cringing at that. Blerg.

How about this: "Kyle lacks the intellectual and verbal capabilities to express herself clearly, concisely, and effectively."

[Vicky8675309]

I think Kyle lets her emotions get in the way of her words and approach to debates/arguments. If she were less emotional, then she would likely be able to debate/argue in a logical manner. She doesn't seem unintelligent or "dumb" (probably average IQ).

It seems that she gets wrapped up in her emotions and at the same time has to think about what she says so she doesn't get flack from her sisters (and ingrained since childhood). I imagine it is difficult to be emotional and feel compelled to filter (cover up how horrible Kim is as a "human being" and Kim's addictions)…add in trying to argue and it's a mess.

[zoeysmom]

I think there is a difference between being a "dumb dumb", as you call it, and being articulate. Verbal acuity is a skill that intelligent people often have, but being inarticulate or having difficulty expressing your thoughts in an emotional situation is not the same as being dumb, IMO.

Being forceful and directive in an argument takes some kind of ability, no doubt about it.   Kim is both of those things-- but is there anyone, in this world or the next,  who would ever call Kim Richards smart? 

I think because Kyle had had a few moments where she has spoken in anger and been blunt she tries way too hard to keep her colouring within the lines. In Palm Springs, she was quite articulate when she wanted to talk about the house then Kim flipped her lid.  When Kyle wanted to defend Lisar, she threw out the Brandi allegations too quickly without laying a proper foundation.  So all that was focused on was "intervention".  When she uses therapy speak, "may I speak my truth" and other phrases it appears she is drawing from within to try and deal with Kim in ways that were successful in counseling.  Kim when she gets upset-especially over the dog bite she gets some for of verbal diarrhea and won't allow another comment to come in. 

 

I do think Kyle is a bit slow in building her foundation and gives the appearance of not being too bright.  When really she just wants to behave like most of us do in real life.  Usually we tell out side before getting mowed down. 

 

It does make me laugh when Kyle says something like-"I am going to leave," Kim parrots it back a bit louder.

[Higgins]

I think all of them have that problem minus Lisa and Eileen.

The thing about Kyle that bothers me the most and this is very nit picky BUT, the fact that she thought it was so cute that her college bound daughter and husband have never had to learn activities of daily living because either they pay for it to be done or long suffering Kyle has to do everything or that she want to infantilize those around her so they need her just like Kim relishes her daughter bringing home her laundry for mommy to do from college. To me, that is not good parenting.

[Otherkate]

Meh. My old-fashioned Italian mother didn't teach me how to do my own laundry either, though I could cook just about anything. I learned the hard way when I got to college and attempted to do my own laundry and just threw everything together, ending up with pink tops that had formerly been white. My boyfriend at the time was the one who ended up explaining the proper way to do laundry. I had literally just never had to think about it, much less do it. Before my little brother went off to college I told my mom to show him how to do his own laundry. I guess it's not the greatest parenting, but it wasn't the worst thing really. My parents did a pretty good job otherwise. It's kind of a stereotype, but a lot of moms talk about their kids bringing home their laundry to be done. They do it in that joking way that lets you know - oh this kid, still needs his/her mom! For a lot of moms I think it's just something they hold on to so that they don't have to really let go all the way yet. Kyle definitely seems like the type who would have a hard time letting go - but she's certainly not alone in that.

Edited April 11, 2015 by Otherkate

[parisprincess]

I think because Kyle had had a few moments where she has spoken in anger and been blunt she tries way too hard to keep her colouring within the lines. In Palm Springs, she was quite articulate when she wanted to talk about the house then Kim flipped her lid.

 

I think Kyle was able to communicate her thoughts very well in Palm Springs because she's had to have this same argument 100 times.  How many times over the years has she had to listen to Kim accuse her of stealing HER goddamn house?  Kyle could probably have that conversation in her sleep.  I don't know about anyone else, but I often think of things I should have said after an argument, but was too upset and emotional to articulate my thoughts in the way I would have liked to at the time.

 

I know a lot of people who weren't taught how to cook, do laundry, etc. when they were young.  Although it was an eye-opener for them when they had learn to take care of themselves, I wouldn't call it bad parenting.  There are far more important things to teach kids than how to separate the whites from the colored clothes.   

[Satchels of gold]

And in that same scene we see 6 year old Portia making a sandwhich. She isn't telling Portia "let mommy do that".

[Vicky8675309]

Why were people (viewers of the show) unhappy when Kyle outed Kim's alcoholism? Was it the "outing" in general or how it was done (during an argument) or some other reason why people were upset with Kyle and the limo scene? I'm sure this has been already discussed-sorry- but I just found this forum this year and was curious. If there are links to old discussions about it then that would be helpful (genuinely curious and don't really get the anger…I think I am too biased).

Personally it didn't bother me when Kyle exposed Kim's alcoholism during the argument in the limo. I think it is because one of my brothers is an addict (alcohol and drugs) and the only way I can now cope with him is by disengaging since I learned that arguing accomplished nothing except upsetting myself. I could relate to Kyle since I could see how a little alcohol could make her more disinhibited and then make the mistake of engaging with and arguing with an addict (throw in fucked up family dynamics/history and having to interact for the show which is paying you) …and it devolves into a messy argument caught on film. At least my brother isn't a narcissistic asshole.

With Kim's personality disorder exposed, does anyone's opinion of Kyle and the limo scene change? Imagine all the crap Kyle had to deal with over the years. I think she is finally getting some insight on Kim and on herself (enabling and behavior patterns similar to victims of domestic violence) and I really hope she disengages from Kim. I sometimes get frustrated with Kyle (START SPOILER**: she kind of defended Kingsley or downplayed the seriousness of Alexia's injuries**END SPOILER) and how she gives in to Kim but then I actively tell myself she is like a victim of domestic abuse who seems to chose to stay with the abuser and then defends and makes excuses for the abuser.

I don't think Kyle intentionally "plays the victim or martyr". I guess I will know next season since she should be clued in by Kim's behavior this season and should realize she needs therapy (learn how to internally and externally deal with her sister….)

[GreatKazu]

I think all of them have that problem minus Lisa and Eileen.

The thing about Kyle that bothers me the most and this is very nit picky BUT, the fact that she thought it was so cute that her college bound daughter and husband have never had to learn activities of daily living because either they pay for it to be done or long suffering Kyle has to do everything or that she want to infantilize those around her so they need her just like Kim relishes her daughter bringing home her laundry for mommy to do from college. To me, that is not good parenting.

Yikes! Pretty darn harsh IMO or is it only because it is Kyle that is being discussed?

 

I know plenty of parents (like me) who didn't, for one reason or another, show their kids how to wash clothes. A lot of parents I grew up around were all about putting their kids education first. Those families worked in the fields and they didn't want their kids to live that life. Those parents did everything they could for their kids so they could keep their attention on homework and work towards a scholarship. Those kids today are professionals, having graduated from colleges and universities. They eventually figured out how to wash clothes. 

 

As for me, I have yet to show my youngest how to wash. It is one of those things that is not a priority.  My youngest may not have an idea on how to run a washer, but  sure knows how to whip up some breakfast, clean up the house, and work a computer like it is no one's business.  My oldest children learned to figure out the wash as time went on since the washer pretty much does for itself and is pretty self-explanatory with all those buttons that tell you what each button is for. All that needed to be said was, "Don't mix whites with colors". As a matter of fact, I don't recall any adult telling me how to wash clothes. Just figured it out.

 

 

I know a lot of people who weren't taught how to cook, do laundry, etc. when they were young.  Although it was an eye-opener for them when they had learn to take care of themselves, I wouldn't call it bad parenting.  There are far more important things to teach kids than how to separate the whites from the colored clothes.

 

Agree.

 

 

in that same scene we see 6 year old Portia making a sandwhich. She isn't telling Portia "let mommy do that".

Exactly.

 

 

does anyone's opinion of Kyle and the limo scene change?

My opinion never changed because once she outed Kim, I then realized what it was Kyle was dealing with. Up until that point, I was on the fence as to whether Kim was an addict or if she had some other issue going on.

Edited April 11, 2015 by GreatKazu

[Vicky8675309]

Most washers come with instructions on how to use them (mine has then printed on the inside of the lid). Also detergents come with instructions and clothes have tags that have helpful information.

It's not that difficult to learn how to wash clothes. I don't think this "skill" factors into parenting. I would hope that I was a good enough parent to raise my child so they could problem solve independently (assuming the child does not have MR) and figure out how to wash clothes. On the other hand, I can also see wanting to teach one's child as much as you can and doing laundry is a quick easy task to teach plus it can be a chore or task to earn an allowance, etc…

I don't think teaching or not teaching one's offspring how to do laundry is a factor in parenting.

[GreatKazu]

Most washers come with instructions on how to use them (mine has then printed on the inside of the lid). Also detergents come with instructions and clothes have tags that have helpful information.

It's not that difficult to learn how to wash clothes. I don't think this "skill" factors into parenting. I would hope that I was a good enough parent to raise my child so they could problem solve independently (assuming the child does not have MR) and figure out how to wash clothes. On the other hand, I can also see wanting to teach one's child as much as you can and doing laundry is a quick easy task to teach plus it can be a chore or task to earn an allowance, etc…

I don't think teaching or not teaching one's offspring how to do laundry is a factor in parenting.

Amen. 

 

You know what is bad parenting? Telling your child they are an asshole (Brandi). Being an addict is bad parenting because your focus is on your addiction and not on your children (Kim). Leaning on alcohol and Xanax as a crutch because you can't deal with the shit that life hands you (Brandi). Teaching your kids that it is okay to leave dog feces and urine all over their house without ever picking it up (Brandi). Teaching your kids that if people ever disagree with you that it is okay to scream and yell and tell them to STFU!! (Brandi).  Berating the other parent (Brandi). Teaching your kids that "no" sometimes means "yes" when it comes to sex (Brandi).

[Vicky8675309]

GreatKazu, on 11 Apr 2015 - 3:06 PM, said:

Amen.

You know what is bad parenting? Telling your child they are an asshole (Brandi). Being an addict is bad parenting because your focus is on your addiction and not on your children (Kim). Leaning on alcohol and Xanax as a crutch because you can't deal with the shit that life hands you (Brandi). Teaching your kids that it is okay to leave dog feces and urine all over their house without ever picking it up (Brandi). Teaching your kids that if people ever disagree with you that it is okay to scream and yell and tell them to STFU!! (Brandi). Berating the other parent (Brandi). Teaching your kids that sometimes means when it comes to sex (Brandi).

I wish one of the woman would say that to Brandi when she starts whining about how other people's comments on her behavior hurt her kids. STFU Brandi! It is your own actions and your own words that hurt your children.

edit: delete gibberish

Edited April 11, 2015 by Vicky8675309

[GreatKazu]

If Kyle were to do a tenth of what Brandi has done? Yeah, you know she would be blasted. I am still perplexed at the idea that Kyle has bad parenting skills. If Kyle has bad parenting skills, I'd sure love to know what that makes Brandi and Kim?

 

If Kyle were the addict, she wouldn't garner the sympathy that is given to Kim. If Kyle were the lush, toxic tampon, she would be laughed at, mocked, and be called all kinds of names and be described as a horrible monster. She wouldn't garner any sympathy or be defended the way Brandi has been defended.

Edited April 11, 2015 by GreatKazu

[Otherkate]

Why were people (viewers of the show) unhappy when Kyle outed Kim's alcoholism? Was it the "outing" in general or how it was done (during an argument) or some other reason why people were upset with Kyle and the limo scene? I'm sure this has been already discussed-sorry- but I just found this forum this year and was curious. If there are links to old discussions about it then that would be helpful (genuinely curious and don't really get the anger…I think I am too biased).

Personally it didn't bother me when Kyle exposed Kim's alcoholism during the argument in the limo. I think it is because one of my brothers is an addict (alcohol and drugs) and the only way I can now cope with him is by disengaging since I learned that arguing accomplished nothing except upsetting myself. I could relate to Kyle since I could see how a little alcohol could make her more disinhibited and then make the mistake of engaging with and arguing with an addict (throw in fucked up family dynamics/history and having to interact for the show which is paying you) …and it devolves into a messy argument caught on film. At least my brother isn't a narcissistic asshole.

With Kim's personality disorder exposed, does anyone's opinion of Kyle and the limo scene change? Imagine all the crap Kyle had to deal with over the years. I think she is finally getting some insight on Kim and on herself (enabling and behavior patterns similar to victims of domestic violence) and I really hope she disengages from Kim. I sometimes get frustrated with Kyle (START SPOILER**: she kind of defended Kingsley or downplayed the seriousness of Alexia's injuries**END SPOILER) and how she gives in to Kim but then I actively tell myself she is like a victim of domestic abuse who seems to chose to stay with the abuser and then defends and makes excuses for the abuser.

 

 

You know, I don't remember disliking Kyle because of the limo scene - though I do remember find it both shocking and disturbing at the time. I think a lot of people, though, felt that outing family business that way was unforgivable.  

 

For me, I started really disliking both Kim and Kyle because of their antics with Brandi. She was the new girl and their behavior was just incredibly mean and it bugged the shit out of me. I'm over it now though, that's for sure!

[Higgins]

This is the Kyle thread, right?

[Satchels of gold]

When Kyle outed Kim in the limo my first thought was "oh so that's what it is" I knew early on that something was off with Kim but couldn't quite put my finger on what is was exactly. I've always liked Kyle and felt she had probably put up with a lot throughout the years. Having said that, I've always rooted for Kim and hoped she would get sober. Every addict I've ever known once they sober up seem to be sensitive people. I've always had my own theroy that addicts are just too sensitive for this world ( almost like walking around with no skin) . Man did Kim blow my theroy out of the water. Whether she is active in her addiction or not she is a petty, selfish, self centered and malignant.

[nexxie]

When Kyle outed Kim in the limo my first thought was "oh so that's what it is" I knew early on that something was off with Kim but couldn't quite put my finger on what is was exactly. I've always liked Kyle and felt she had probably put up with a lot throughout the years. Having said that, I've always rooted for Kim and hoped she would get sober. Every addict I've ever known once they sober up seem to be sensitive people. I've always had my own theroy that addicts are just too sensitive for this world ( almost like walking around with no skin) . Man did Kim blow my theroy out of the water. Whether she is active in her addiction or not she is a petty, selfish, self centered and malignant.

I've thought the same about addicts being sensitive, but Kim is also a narcissist. Interestingly, from what I've read, many narcissists have created their false persona because they can't bear the pain of early abuse/neglect - so maybe the abandoned true self of a narcissist is/was actually sensitive.

[ryebread]

The thing about Kyle that bothers me the most and this is very nit picky BUT, the fact that she thought it was so cute that her college bound daughter and husband have never had to learn activities of daily living because either they pay for it to be done or long suffering Kyle has to do everything or that she want to infantilize those around her so they need her just like Kim relishes her daughter bringing home her laundry for mommy to do from college.

 

When she said Mauricio couldn't do laundry, make a sandwich or even change a lightbulb, I had an image of Moe standing on a stool trying to screw in a lightbulb, while mouthbreathing. 

This is the Kyle thread, right?

It is.  But I find it safer to begin or end my posts with "I'm not a Brandi fan but Kyle...."   ;-)

 

This also works well if I'm posting something negative about anyone that isn't named Brandi or Kim.

Edited April 11, 2015 by ryebread

[nexxie]

Agreed, and this certainly explains Vicki's attitude and actions on the OC. She thinks she is the Queen Mother.

Kyle acts like a true hostess/welcome wagon while Vicki, who should act accordingly, acts as a doorman to the newbies. Vickie likes to haze the new girls first to see if they belong in "her" sorority. I think that's why many dislike Vicki. The only time we've seen Kyle behave more like Vicki is when Brandi was a friend of the HWs, season 2.

Really good point about the different approaches of Vicki and Kyle. Also, when Kyle was so nasty to Brandi (and she surely was) she was standing with Kim, being a good sister like Kathy. Thank goodness, she's getting more comfortable being the bad sister!

[Trooper York]

The thing is the clueless husband is the staple of sitcoms and comedy since Henny Youngstone said "Take my Cavewoman...please."

 

Kyle is just trying to be funny which she can never pull off. She does seem to be a great Mom and a great wife. Mauricio is a lucky man. He knows it. He acts like it.

 

That is what burns Brandi's ass. No one is going to treat her that way. 

[GreatKazu]

This is the Kyle thread, right?

It is.

 

I responded accordingly, did I not? lol

 

Was it because of my comment here:

 

is it only because it is Kyle that is being discussed?

If so, I should have actually posted, "is it only because Kyle is detested?"

 

I mean, I get not liking Kyle. I'd love to go back to the days ( pre-Brandi) when snarking on Kyle was half the fun of posting. But, as far as disliking someone to the point that I would think their lack of showing their kids how to use a washing machine is a factor in determining they are a bad parent? Not even close. Even if Brandi or Kim didn't teach their kids to use a washing machine, I would not view as being a bad parent.

Edited April 11, 2015 by GreatKazu

[Higgins]

I just don't find it cute or endearing that a 17 or 18 year old young woman has never been responsible for washing her own clothes. Nor do I find it cute talking about her $ 500 a week allowance at college when she has a meal plan. There are a lot of adults who work full time and don't have that income. Even if I could afford the luxury of providing that for my child, I wouldn't do it. My girls knew they had to work and save money to spend at school. We provided their tuition and their meal plan and after that, they were expected to earn their spending money.

[LotusFlower]

Then why are you watching Housewives? It's supposed to be the lifestyles of the rich and famous. Especially the Beverly Hills version.

[GreatKazu]

I just don't find it cute or endearing that a 17 or 18 year old young woman has never been responsible for washing her own clothes. Nor do I find it cute talking about her $ 500 a week allowance at college when she has a meal plan. There are a lot of adults who work full time and don't have that income. Even if I could afford the luxury of providing that for my child, I wouldn't do it. My girls knew they had to work and save money to spend at school. We provided their tuition and their meal plan and after that, they were expected to earn their spending money.

So, now it is not cute or endearing on top of being a bad parent?

 

I guess I watch the show differently, or a different show for that matter, because I certainly didn't come away thinking Kyle thought it was cute that her girls didn't know how to use the washer or when she was discussing the $500 allowance.

 

What did you expect from watching a show about rich people? 

[Higgins]

If she didn't, she wouldn't have made it a storyline. Lisa Vanderpump made it clear that Max will have to earn his way and I might be wrong but, she is wealthy too.

So, now it is not cute or endearing on top of being a bad parent?

 

I guess I watch the show differently, or a different show for that matter, because I certainly didn't come away thinking Kyle thought it was cute that her girls didn't know how to use the washer or when she was discussing the $500 allowance.

 

What did you expect from watching a show about rich people? 

Yep.

Then why are you watching Housewives? It's supposed to be the lifestyles of the rich and famous. Especially the Beverly Hills version.

Why do you watch?

Edited April 12, 2015 by Higgins

[LotusFlower]

If she didn't, she wouldn't have made it a storyline. Lisa Vanderpump made it clear that Max will have to earn his way and I might be wrong but, she is wealthy too.

I applaud Lisa for making Max work his way up the ladder in the family business, but he's 22 or 23 years old and has an apt. and two cars. I somehow doubt he's affording that on his busboy salary. Bottom line - rich parents - on this show and in real life - give their kids money, sometimes even spoil them.

[GreatKazu]

 

If she didn't, she wouldn't have made it a storyline.

LOL That was a storyline? It seemed like filler material to me.

 

 

Lisa Vanderpump made it clear that Max will have to earn his way and I might be wrong but, she is wealthy too.

Shouldn't he be doing that? He is not in college or university. He is living elsewhere where he pays rent, I assume. And, wasn't there mention of him not paying some kind of bills? Perhaps the problem was the Todds enabled their son too much or didn't push him enough and this is why he is a busboy at their restaurant who is expecting his parents to give him a career.

[LotusFlower]

Why do you watch?

The drama/soap opera stuff, the interactions and psychology, and for the Beverly Hills show - definitely the house porn! YOUR TURN!

[ridethemaverick]

I'm not bothered at all by somewhat spoiled children. It's spoiled husbands that irk me, and the thing with Mo (and Vince) not being trusted to keep their own children annoyed the hell out of me. But not my marriage. They all seem happy so more power to them.

Anyway, I like Kyle. I only started watching BH a few months ago on Hulu to prepare for the new season with Eileen who I grew up watching on Y&R. But I remember long before that, I would hear about Kyle from BH and her hair and her beautiful family. When other howives across franchises were getting divorced, filing for bankruptcy, etc, Kyle from BH was often spoken of as an example of someone who was the real deal. Other than the brief mean girl thing at game night, I've enjoyed watching her and I hope she can cut Kim out of her life and REALLY start enjoying her many blessings. That I'd like to see.