Kyle Richards: Pantene Poster Girl

[GreatKazu]

I'm not bothered at all by somewhat spoiled children. It's spoiled husbands that irk me, and the thing with Mo (and Vince) not being trusted to keep their own children annoyed the hell out of me. But not my marriage. They all seem happy so more power to them.

Anyway, I like Kyle. I only started watching BH a few months ago on Hulu to prepare for the new season with Eileen who I grew up watching on Y&R. But I remember long before that, I would hear about Kyle from BH and her hair and her beautiful family. When other howives across franchises were getting divorced, filing for bankruptcy, etc, Kyle from BH was often spoken of as an example of someone who was the real deal. Other than the brief mean girl thing at game night, I've enjoyed watching her and I hope she can cut Kim out of her life and REALLY start enjoying her many blessings. That I'd like to see.

 

 

Children being spoiled don't bother me until those children grow up to be like Max Todd who think they can have money handed to them any time they want and expect to run a business without any education or experience. I have witnessed parents doting on their children in many ways. Rich parents and working-class parents. It is not just a rich family situation.

 

Did you watch all the seasons of BH or just the last couple of seasons? Welcome to the BH crowd!

[Vicky8675309]

ridethemaverick, on 11 Apr 2015 - 7:16 PM, said:

I'm not bothered at all by somewhat spoiled children. It's spoiled husbands that irk me, and the thing with Mo (and Vince) not being trusted to keep their own children annoyed the hell out of me. But not my marriage. They all seem happy so more power to them.

Anyway, I like Kyle. I only started watching BH a few months ago on Hulu to prepare for the new season with Eileen who I grew up watching on Y&R. But I remember long before that, I would hear about Kyle from BH and her hair and her beautiful family. When other however across franchises were getting divorced, filing for bankruptcy, etc, Kyle from BH was often spoken of as an example of someone who was the real deal. Other than the brief mean girl thing at game night, I've enjoyed watching her and I hope she can cut Kim out of her life and REALLY start enjoying her many blessings. That I'd like to see.

The incompetent husbands comments just seemed like a old joke that fell flat since it was sexist but not offensively sexist imo. I wouldn't call Mo a spoiled husband since he works while Kyle is the home-maker. Mo always came across as a hard worker imo but I really don't know.

I also like Kyle and also hope she cuts Kim out of her life and really start enjoying her life.

Eileen is a fabulous addition to the show.

Edited April 12, 2015 by Vicky8675309

[WireWrap]

I just don't find it cute or endearing that a 17 or 18 year old young woman has never been responsible for washing her own clothes. Nor do I find it cute talking about her $ 500 a week allowance at college when she has a meal plan. There are a lot of adults who work full time and don't have that income. Even if I could afford the luxury of providing that for my child, I wouldn't do it. My girls knew they had to work and save money to spend at school. We provided their tuition and their meal plan and after that, they were expected to earn their spending money.

I did my sons laundry when he lived at home, I did not teach him how to do the laundry until he bought his own home and was getting ready to move out after he finished college. LOL

If she didn't, she wouldn't have made it a storyline. Lisa Vanderpump made it clear that Max will have to earn his way and I might be wrong but, she is wealthy too.

Yep.

Why do you watch?

Max is not in college either and he is living on his own while learning the family business from the ground up. Big difference IMO. LOL

[AnnA]

I stopped doing my sons' laundry when they were both  in high school.  It wasn't because I planned it though.  Their rooms were so messy with clothes everywhere.  When I asked them for their laundry and found clean, folded clothes mixed in with the dirty laundry, I decided it was time for them to take care of it themselves.  Doing it once was enough;  doing it twice wasn't happening.

[ridethemaverick]

Children being spoiled don't bother me until those children grow up to be like Max Todd who think they can have money handed to them any time they want and expect to run a business without any education or experience. I have witnessed parents doting on their children in many ways. Rich parents and working-class parents. It is not just a rich family situation.

Did you watch all the seasons of BH or just the last couple of seasons? Welcome to the BH crowd!

Oh I binge watched them all! And then thought damn, I've been missing out. BH is now my favorite.

[Otherkate]

I just don't find it cute or endearing that a 17 or 18 year old young woman has never been responsible for washing her own clothes. 

 

Sorry. I think I turned out okay though. 

 

Re: Mo not being capable of making a sandwich etc - I agree it was supposed to be funny but Kyle just isn't able to pull off funny very often.

Edited April 12, 2015 by Otherkate

[motorcitymom65]

Why were people (viewers of the show) unhappy when Kyle outed Kim's alcoholism? Was it the "outing" in general or how it was done (during an argument) or some other reason why people were upset with Kyle and the limo scene? I'm sure this has been already discussed-sorry- but I just found this forum this year and was curious. If there are links to old discussions about it then that would be helpful (genuinely curious and don't really get the anger…I think I am too biased).

Personally it didn't bother me when Kyle exposed Kim's alcoholism during the argument in the limo. I think it is because one of my brothers is an addict (alcohol and drugs) and the only way I can now cope with him is by disengaging since I learned that arguing accomplished nothing except upsetting myself. I could relate to Kyle since I could see how a little alcohol could make her more disinhibited and then make the mistake of engaging with and arguing with an addict (throw in fucked up family dynamics/history and having to interact for the show which is paying you) …and it devolves into a messy argument caught on film. At least my brother isn't a narcissistic asshole.

With Kim's personality disorder exposed, does anyone's opinion of Kyle and the limo scene change? Imagine all the crap Kyle had to deal with over the years. I think she is finally getting some insight on Kim and on herself (enabling and behavior patterns similar to victims of domestic violence) and I really hope she disengages from Kim. I sometimes get frustrated with Kyle (START SPOILER**: she kind of defended Kingsley or downplayed the seriousness of Alexia's injuries**END SPOILER) and how she gives in to Kim but then I actively tell myself she is like a victim of domestic abuse who seems to chose to stay with the abuser and then defends and makes excuses for the abuser.

I don't think Kyle intentionally "plays the victim or martyr". I guess I will know next season since she should be clued in by Kim's behavior this season and should realize she needs therapy (learn how to internally and externally deal with her sister….)

Kyle outing Kim never changed the way I felt about her. It was jarring, stunning and the most real shit I had ever seen go down on TV at that point. I found it to be emotionally draining. Did I think she should have done it? No way. Did I understand it? Completely. I did something similar to my own drunk father at a family wedding years ago. Some people in the family didn't speak to me for years, but he also never killed anyone while driving drunk so at least I can sleep at night. 

 

I always found the reaction from fans somewhat shocking. If Kyle would have planned to out her sister on national TV I could get behind folks being outraged. But it wasn't planned. It all seemed so organic to me, so real. Real like we don't see that much of on Reality TV. I just figured that maybe there were a lot more people than I imagined that had never been pushed to such a place. It made me so jealous that there are folks who don't live with so much turmoil and stress in their lives, or who are just better at coping in general, that they could never imagine saying something that they would regret later. Haven't most people said something that they strongly regret saying later? At the end of the day the reaction by people, and the way they held on to that anger and judgement for so many years, became more shocking to me that the actual reveal by Kyle.  

[BlackMamba]

Kyle has the potential of being a fun girl but Kim brings it down. If only Kim gets fired Id love to see how Kyle stands on her own without having to babysit or be in a storyline with her sister. But I doubt Kim will go anywhere so why Im pressing my luck.

[SCS]

 

I always found the reaction from fans somewhat shocking. If Kyle would have planned to out her sister on national TV I could get behind folks being outraged. But it wasn't planned.

But you don't know this. How can you claim Kyle's actions weren't planned? Because Kyle, after the fact and after the backlash, said so?

[GreatKazu]

Kyle has credibility. Kim? None whatsoever.

[motorcitymom65]

But you don't know this. How can you claim Kyle's actions weren't planned? Because Kyle, after the fact and after the backlash, said so?

Because it made no sense that she would do that. Especially right after when we heard from Lisa and Taylor that they had been asked to keep these things private. If she wanted Kim exposed than why ask people to protect her? Why not let someone else say out loud what they all thought was going on? It looked to me like someone who lost control, who was at the end of their rope. If she had wanted to make a thing out of Kim's addiction, she had had many times when she could have revealed it, or even insinuated it. When Kim was late, or when she was being so flaky about moving all the time. She never did. It was clear to me that she lost control and more clear to me that she regretted it.

[LotusFlower]

Kyle outing Kim never changed the way I felt about her. It was jarring, stunning and the most real shit I had ever seen go down on TV at that point. I found it to be emotionally draining. Did I think she should have done it? No way. Did I understand it? Completely. I did something similar to my own drunk father at a family wedding years ago. Some people in the family didn't speak to me for years, but he also never killed anyone while driving drunk so at least I can sleep at night. 

 

I always found the reaction from fans somewhat shocking. If Kyle would have planned to out her sister on national TV I could get behind folks being outraged. But it wasn't planned. It all seemed so organic to me, so real. Real like we don't see that much of on Reality TV. I just figured that maybe there were a lot more people than I imagined that had never been pushed to such a place. It made me so jealous that there are folks who don't live with so much turmoil and stress in their lives, or who are just better at coping in general, that they could never imagine saying something that they would regret later. Haven't most people said something that they strongly regret saying later? At the end of the day the reaction by people, and the way they held on to that anger and judgement for so many years, became more shocking to me that the actual reveal by Kyle.

I don't know what this says about me, but I never faulted Kyle for outing Kim's alcoholism, and this was when I wasn't nearly as sympathetic to her as I am now, as well as before I started to actively dislike Kim. Maybe because I never attached great shame to alcoholism or addiction of any sort, or maybe because I know alcoholics and watch shows like "Intervention" that have taught me that hiding it is so harmful - to both the addict and their loved ones. I understood why Kim was angry at Kyle, but fans seemed to want to tar and feather her, and her apology tour seemed ridiculous to me. But I guess she was dealing with reality tv show issues as well as real life ones. It adds a whole other element to what you say and do.

You were really brave to do what you did with your family situation. And your feelings on drunk driving is exactly why I was so disgusted with that meathead Joe Giudice joking that he drove drunk "lots of times," and actually relieved for the citizens of NJ when his license was finally revoked two weeks ago.

[Vicky8675309]

Kyle outing Kim never changed the way I felt about her. It was jarring, stunning and the most real shit I had ever seen go down on TV at that point. I found it to be emotionally draining. Did I think she should have done it? No way. Did I understand it? Completely. I did something similar to my own drunk father at a family wedding years ago. Some people in the family didn't speak to me for years, but he also never killed anyone while driving drunk so at least I can sleep at night.

I always found the reaction from fans somewhat shocking. If Kyle would have planned to out her sister on national TV I could get behind folks being outraged. But it wasn't planned. It all seemed so organic to me, so real. Real like we don't see that much of on Reality TV. I just figured that maybe there were a lot more people than I imagined that had never been pushed to such a place. It made me so jealous that there are folks who don't live with so much turmoil and stress in their lives, or who are just better at coping in general, that they could never imagine saying something that they would regret later. Haven't most people said something that they strongly regret saying later? At the end of the day the reaction by people, and the way they held on to that anger and judgement for so many years, became more shocking to me that the actual reveal by Kyle.

Great points/observations!

Yes, it was very real and shocking. Sometimes I question how real the show is but then I think about Kim & Kyle and am actually shocked at how real this reality show is. It took a few seasons but I feel like we are seeing the most real Kim and Kyle (Kyle has always been consistent; flawed by likable & relatable). I was surprised by the hate/dislike towards Kyle back then and even more shocked that people cling to that hate and try to justify it now even though we the real Kim. I can understand if someone finds her annoying (I don't) but to actively hate her after seeing what she deals with is a bit much. I don't think one should have to have dealt with an addict or personality disorder (or both combined) to empathize with Kyle. I guess I am just being naive or letting my personal experience as a former enabler bias me.

The dog bite situation really drives home the reality of this show. Kim is being sued. Alexia was hospitalized (as was Kay Rosario). Kim and Kyle didn't speak or see each other for several months and are public figures active on social media (not sure about Kim but her kids probably are). Kingsley's bite wasn't during filming but it was/is brought up at the reunion and it just highlights the Kim/Kyle relationship/personalities…and supports their portrayal on the show (validates it imo). But people still like Kim and hate Kyle. So strange

[ryebread]

I'm not raising my son to be an incompetent husband in the kitchen or laundry room.  Kid has done his own laundry since 8th grade, cleans his own bathroom and can cook an omelet better than me.  He spends maybe 3 hours a week on these chores, non-complainingly I might add.  Worth it for the awesome roof over his head. LOL

 

I don't think not knowing how to do laundry or cook by college is a big deal but those are life skills he'll already have when he's going to be away from home for the first time and will be busy learning the big life skills.  I know he won't be going to job interviews wrinkled or hungry.

 

Do I think Moe really doesn't know how to change a lightbulb? He probably does.  But Kyle thinking it's hilarious to joke about her husband being useless around the house is kind of an insult, imo.  Maybe it's just more of Kyle feeling like she has to do all for all people.  That's her role.  Good for her?  But every Sunday morning I get an omelet and a great pot of coffee made by my 16 year old.  His future wife is gonna loooove me.  Love, love, love.

[GreatKazu]

But you don't know this. How can you claim Kyle's actions weren't planned? Because Kyle, after the fact and after the backlash, said so?

The same can be said of anyone's opinion or feelings here. On the previous page someone posted "the FACT that Kyle thinks it is cute that her child doesn't know how to wash clothes". Is that indeed a fact? Was that person there with Kyle and had a conversation with her to hear Kyle give her actual thoughts?  It is a feeling and/or opinion.

 

Limo-gate:  I think in this situation, some of us have been in that exact situation where an addict had to be outed and it was done during a moment when it wasn't planned. I think we can identify with what Kyle did. It was one of those "end of the rope" feelings where we had just had enough and to hell with what others think of us when we speak the truth. IMO Kyle could not fake that. Not even Kim. That shit was real. Kyle had no idea how Kim would arrive to Taylor's party. Hell, Kyle probably thought she wouldn't show up as she had done many times before.

 

Back to the laundry topic. Kim herself mentioned she does her kids' laundry. When her daughter visits her, she mentioned how she brings home a huge laundry bag. I think Kim said it is what she loves to do? Not sure of her exact words.

 

I think it is just ridiculous that a parent can be considered bad for not showing kids how to wash clothes by a certain age. I guess the Todds are extremely bad parents for having a child like Max who is asking for hand-outs. [sarcasm]

[ryebread]

I stopped doing my sons' laundry when they were both  in high school.  It wasn't because I planned it though.  Their rooms were so messy with clothes everywhere.  When I asked them for their laundry and found clean, folded clothes mixed in with the dirty laundry, I decided it was time for them to take care of it themselves.  Doing it once was enough;  doing it twice wasn't happening.

LOL.  My final straw happened after I'd spend hours doing laundry.  Only to find my laundry baskets filled the next day with dirty stuff he hadn't brought to the laundry room.  This happened 3 or 4 times and then his education began. The best part of him doing laundry?  When my clothes are in the dryer, and the timer goes off and I don't feel like getting up to get the shirts out before they get wrinkled?  He's perfectly capable of getting them out and hung up.  Now for that reason alone, why on god's green earth wouldn't you teach your kids how to do laundry?? LOL

[GreatKazu]

LOL I leave clothes in the dryer. Drives my spouse nuts to hear the buzzer go off and I don't go retrieve the clothes. Does he get them? Hell no. I don't iron clothes. Everyone is more than capable of doing that for themselves.

[SCS]

Kyle has credibility. Kim? None whatsoever.

But this has nothing to do with the question posed, ie, did anyone's opinion of Kyle change post-outing Kim's drinking. Kim had left the party and was seated in the limo with Adrienne and Martin. Kyle, with a camera crew in tow, popped her head into the limo, snapped, "what are you doing, Kim?" and then the world exploded. Kyle's credibility goes only as far as people are willing to accept.

[SCS]

The same can be said of anyone's opinion or feelings here.

Why yes -- however, the poster to whom I was responding seemed adamant that Kyle's actions were unplanned.

On the previous page someone posted "the FACT that Kyle thinks it is cute that her child doesn't know how to wash clothes". Is that indeed a fact? Was that person there with Kyle and had a conversation with her to hear Kyle give her actual thoughts?

You should probably ask the person who posted. I have no idea. Edited April 12, 2015 by steelcitysister

[WireWrap]

I'm not raising my son to be an incompetent husband in the kitchen or laundry room.  Kid has done his own laundry since 8th grade, cleans his own bathroom and can cook an omelet better than me.  He spends maybe 3 hours a week on these chores, non-complainingly I might add.  Worth it for the awesome roof over his head. LOL

 

I don't think not knowing how to do laundry or cook by college is a big deal but those are life skills he'll already have when he's going to be away from home for the first time and will be busy learning the big life skills.  I know he won't be going to job interviews wrinkled or hungry.

 

Do I think Moe really doesn't know how to change a lightbulb? He probably does.  But Kyle thinking it's hilarious to joke about her husband being useless around the house is kind of an insult, imo.  Maybe it's just more of Kyle feeling like she has to do all for all people.  That's her role.  Good for her?  But every Sunday morning I get an omelet and a great pot of coffee made by my 16 year old.  His future wife is gonna loooove me.  Love, love, love.

Although I washed my sons clothes, he did chores daily and he helped me cook/bake everyday. He now does laundry, helps his wife cook and helps clean the house and takes care of the yard/garden by himself. LOL I think Mauricio and the girls help out around the house more than we are told but Bravo only shows us what they want to. I am also sure that LisaV makes tea for Ken without having her help do it for her every time.

[GreatKazu]

But this has nothing to do with the question posed, ie, did anyone's opinion of Kyle change post-outing Kim's drinking. Kim had left the party and was seated in the limo with Adrienne and Martin. Kyle, with a camera crew in tow, popped her head into the limo, snapped, "what are you doing, Kim?" and then the world exploded. Kyle's credibility goes only as far as people are willing to accept.

My response was to this comment in bold:

 

But you don't know this. How can you claim Kyle's actions weren't planned? Because Kyle, after the fact and after the backlash, said so?

If Kyle said it wasn't planned and it was a spontaneous reaction to all that happened, then her credibility speaks for itself for some people. After watching the reunion and seeing how easily Kim lied through her teeth right before scenes were played out, it is clear to me, although I didn't need the proof, that Kim is a 100 percent GD liar.

 

 

You should probably ask the person who posted. I have no idea.

I wasn't asking you. I was pointing out how people are posting their opinions on various topics within this thread. You posted this:

 

But you don't know this. How can you claim Kyle's actions weren't planned?

In response to that above, I posted an example of someone else who had posted a comment and used the word "FACT" in their comment. Of course they don't know for a fact what Kyle is thinking, but it is their opinion.  We only know what these women on the show say and post on social media. Some of them have credibility whereas others don't.  Whether we choose to believe them or not, is a choice. I, along with many others, choose to believe Kyle's action regarding limo-gate was not a planned or scripted scene.

[LotusFlower]

Why yes -- however, the poster to whom I was responding seemed adamant that Kyle's actions were unplanned.

Kyle's actions were unplanned only because we saw how it played out, as well as because she said it was such, and that's why her credibility is an issue. If you don't believe her or trust her credibility, that's your prerogative, but everyone relies on their own judgment. For me, hearing about how the Richards family matriarch raised her daughters to keep secrets hidden, Taylor and Adrienne acknowledging their promise to Kyle to keep the secret private, as well as watching Kyle endlessly sit back and take Kim's abuse, leads me to believe that what happened wasn't planned.

[SCS]

My response was to this comment in bold:

If Kyle said it wasn't planned and it was a spontaneous reaction to all that happened, then her credibility speaks for itself for some people.

Yes, but for some others that credibility eroded long ago.

 

I wasn't asking you. I was pointing out how people are posting their opinions on various topics within this thread.

Ah, thank you for clarifying.

[GreatKazu]

 

Yes, but for some others that credibility eroded long ago.

I understand that. Oh well. We can only surmise with what is given to us on this show and other sources.

 

Sometimes I just want to throw in the towel on this whole show. lol

 

 

thank you for clarifying.

No problem. I sometimes type so fast, I am sure my posts can get confusing.

[BlackMamba]

I just started watching this season! Where did you find old episodes?!

Go to Hulu. Or download then from Amazon or Itunes.

[blueeyed]

But this has nothing to do with the question posed, ie, did anyone's opinion of Kyle change post-outing Kim's drinking. Kim had left the party and was seated in the limo with Adrienne and Martin. Kyle, with a camera crew in tow, popped her head into the limo, snapped, "what are you doing, Kim?" and then the world exploded. Kyle's credibility goes only as far as people are willing to accept.

I for one accept her credibility, I did then and I do now. For me, I never understood all the Kyle hate for the alcoholic comment. Awww, poor damn Kimmie, Kyle should have just let the whole damn world think she stole Kim's damn house.

 

I watched season one and knew Kim was a junkie (I have never believed it was just alcohol) from the beginning. Now that Kim is not as actively using like she did back in Seasons 1, 2, and 3 Kim is just a vile human being. I have nieces and grand-nieces, I would never blame them for MY dog biting them.

 

Personally, I'm glad people are finally seeing Kim for who she really is. I also believe Kyle is human with her own faults, no one is perfect.

[nowcheckthat]

This season has made me see Kyle in a whole new light. I'm re-watching last season (I missed a lot of episodes) and I'm finding Kyle much more likable than the first time around.

Edited April 12, 2015 by nowcheckthat

[Flabbergasted]

If Farrah is any indication of Kyle and Mauricio's parenting then I think she's doing a great job. As far as I know Farrah in living on her own, independent with a very successful career in her own right and she appears to be a nice enough young woman with no drama. So I'm okay with her kids not knowing how to do laundry, it seems they know how to be quite well mannered decent young ladies.

 

I am one of the few that has really liked Kyle unwaveringly from the first episode till date. There have been times where I had to watch her with my hands over my eyes, but I've never really reconciled this "vyle" attention-seeking drama queen people talk about with who I see on screen. In my mind her biggest fault is that she is a people pleaser who desperately wants to be well liked and that tends to get her in trouble. Even with Brandi, I was re-watching a few episodes from the beginning of the season and I was gobsmacked at the transformation in her relationship with Brandi, and it all happened in ONE episode, on ONE day, where they went from sharing confidences in the Limo ride to Eileen's house, to Brandi all of a sudden branding Kyle this evil sister.

[zoeysmom]

I think all of them have that problem minus Lisa and Eileen.

The thing about Kyle that bothers me the most and this is very nit picky BUT, the fact that she thought it was so cute that her college bound daughter and husband have never had to learn activities of daily living because either they pay for it to be done or long suffering Kyle has to do everything or that she want to infantilize those around her so they need her just like Kim relishes her daughter bringing home her laundry for mommy to do from college. To me, that is not good parenting.

To me, the household stuff seems like a control issue to me with Kyle. I always get the impression she can't deal with them moving out and on.   She has said they have household help so perhaps the biggest accomplishment for the girls was to get their clothes into the hamper.

 

You know, I don't remember disliking Kyle because of the limo scene - though I do remember find it both shocking and disturbing at the time. I think a lot of people, though, felt that outing family business that way was unforgivable.  

 

For me, I started really disliking both Kim and Kyle because of their antics with Brandi. She was the new girl and their behavior was just incredibly mean and it bugged the shit out of me. I'm over it now though, that's for sure!

I've rewatched Game Night a time or two-what I see in Brandi (and saw the same thing in her buddy Kristen from RHONYC last season) is she came on the scene expecting to be the center of attention.  It was Kim denying her the attention that set her off.  Watching Dana on the Season 2 Reunion I think she illustrated there was a little more bad behavior of Brandi's going on that night we didn't see.  Of course I am biased because I have never seen why Brandi was cast.  Apparently she answered the question this Reunion -for conflict.  Seems to contrived to me. 

 

But this has nothing to do with the question posed, ie, did anyone's opinion of Kyle change post-outing Kim's drinking. Kim had left the party and was seated in the limo with Adrienne and Martin. Kyle, with a camera crew in tow, popped her head into the limo, snapped, "what are you doing, Kim?" and then the world exploded. Kyle's credibility goes only as far as people are willing to accept.

Kyle for the most part during Season 1-won all the polls and people felt for her after the Dinner from Hell episode and Allison duBois.  After the limo incident people began calling her "Vile Kyle' and were so upset she outed a family secret.  She suffered a huge loss in popularity.  So she did suffer the consequences.  The producer of the show even wrote a blog supporting Kyle and stated she begged them to leave the limo scene out.  So that would indicate to me she knew she had screwed up in outing her sister and did not doing it intentionally.  As far as her popping her head in the limo that was also explained they were trying to wrap up shooting and at that time the finale included a group photo and obviously Kim and Adrienne were missing.  So it would seem after she lost it she knew there would be a huge price to pay in the relationship with her sister and production would not help her fix it.

 

My opinion of Kyle didn't change as I felt she was entirely within her rights to bring up Kim's drinking.  Kim is the one who said, "you are only as sick as your secrets."

[Satchels of gold]

My daughter has been doing her own laundry since she was 12 , is that because I am an awesome mom? No it because that's lesswash for me to do and my daughter didn't like my laundry schedule. We all parent according to our own values and what we deem important. Kids who grow up with neglectful parents or alcoholic households often assume the parental role and learn to cook and clean at a young age. Does that make their parents great parents? I think some people will find Kyle just breathing objectionable.

[becauseIsaidso]

 

But this has nothing to do with the question posed, ie, did anyone's opinion of Kyle change post-outing Kim's drinking. Kim had left the party and was seated in the limo with Adrienne and Martin. Kyle, with a camera crew in tow, popped her head into the limo, snapped, "what are you doing, Kim?" and then the world exploded. Kyle's credibility goes only as far as people are willing to accept.

  

I have never liked either Kyle or Kim since day one, and have always seem them as equally able to go from zero to nasty in a nanosecond. Kim has simply not bothered to try and hide her nastiness..

 

As I was watching limogate unfold, it struck me as Kyle making a snap decision to seize the moment and take full advantage of being handed the opportunity to out Kim. I feel certain she knew, even as she pointed her finger and yelled Kim's 'secret' for all to hear, that she would take considerable heat for her actions, but felt the overall benefits could easily be worth it. I have never heard/read anything to indicate it as a set up. I believe Kim's deer-in-the-headlights expression as Kyle ranted on was one of total disbelief that Kyle actually, finally, went 'there'. On Camera. To a national TV audience. That is the moment when the battle lines were drawn. Payback is a bitch, and the bitch's name is Kim.

 

I have always felt Kyle's whiney, croaky, sobby voice saying how much she loves her sister, how she only ever, ever wanted to protect her sister, how she only did xyz because someone was trying to come between sisters, etc, etc, etc. has been her way of deflecting any attention away from her/Kyle's real feelings about Kim and, instead, painting Kyle as the good sister, the long-suffering sister, the martyr who has been pushed to the limits of endurance. But Kyle has let her cover slip often enough in smug comments, smirks, sarcastic TH's, and rapid fire finger pointing to give a very broad hint of her true colors, if not make them abundantly clear.

 

Although I have at times watched the escalating confrontations between the sisters with something bordering on disgusted amusement, nothing over the life of the franchise has changed my opinion of either sister in a positive direction. They have both sunk in my estimation and I have finally reached the point of quitting this show (as I did ATL and NJ) because of the continued presence of people whose behavior I can not in any way tolerate or consider entertaining - meaning Kim and Brandi. Kyle, at least, exhibits some control over her inner bitch and could possibly be tolerable if the other two were gone. The other two have no redeeming qualities that I can discern and no number of cast changes can get me to tune in again if they are both still there.

[Cranky One]

Another bad parent here! My 19 year old got a crash course in August in the dorm's laundry room on how to do laundry. I finally told my 22 year old 2 weeks ago that he's doing his own laundry. I did show him how to use the machines because I know he'd somehow manage to break something. He still has a pile of dirty clothes that he never got around to washing.

 

LOL I leave clothes in the dryer. Drives my spouse nuts to hear the buzzer go off and I don't go retrieve the clothes. Does he get them? Hell no. I don't iron clothes. Everyone is more than capable of doing that for themselves.

 

Thank God for the Wrinkle Release function on my dryer! I use it so much, that I've been known to turn it on without any clothes in the dryer! lol! My idea of ironing is a either a spray bottle of water and/or those wrinkle release sprays. Suzie Homemaker, I am not!

 

Back to Kyle...I argue like she does. I don't have that quick thinking and I fly off the handle easily. Nothing that I'm proud of, but that's me. Out off this whole group, I'd probably be friends with Kyle first. I like her. Shoot me.

[beaker73]

I think Kyle lets her emotions get in the way of her words and approach to debates/arguments. If she were less emotional, then she would likely be able to debate/argue in a logical manner. She doesn't seem unintelligent or "dumb" (probably average IQ).

It seems that she gets wrapped up in her emotions and at the same time has to think about what she says so she doesn't get flack from her sisters (and ingrained since childhood). I imagine it is difficult to be emotional and feel compelled to filter (cover up how horrible Kim is as a "human being" and Kim's addictions)…add in trying to argue and it's a mess.

I agree. I do not consider Kyle dumb or unintelligent simply because she has some difficulty expressing herself when she's upset. This is a little bit of a sore point with me as I can be a lot like Kyle in this respect. I am an emotional person who hates confrontation. My thoughts and emotions will swirl around in my brain and I don't always express myself the way I want.

[beaker73]

Why were people (viewers of the show) unhappy when Kyle outed Kim's alcoholism? Was it the "outing" in general or how it was done (during an argument) or some other reason why people were upset with Kyle and the limo scene? I'm sure this has been already discussed-sorry- but I just found this forum this year and was curious. If there are links to old discussions about it then that would be helpful (genuinely curious and don't really get the anger…I think I am too biased).

Personally it didn't bother me when Kyle exposed Kim's alcoholism during the argument in the limo. I think it is because one of my brothers is an addict (alcohol and drugs) and the only way I can now cope with him is by disengaging since I learned that arguing accomplished nothing except upsetting myself. I could relate to Kyle since I could see how a little alcohol could make her more disinhibited and then make the mistake of engaging with and arguing with an addict (throw in fucked up family dynamics/history and having to interact for the show which is paying you) …and it devolves into a messy argument caught on film. At least my brother isn't a narcissistic asshole.

With Kim's personality disorder exposed, does anyone's opinion of Kyle and the limo scene change? Imagine all the crap Kyle had to deal with over the years. I think she is finally getting some insight on Kim and on herself (enabling and behavior patterns similar to victims of domestic violence) and I really hope she disengages from Kim. I sometimes get frustrated with Kyle (START SPOILER**: she kind of defended Kingsley or downplayed the seriousness of Alexia's injuries**END SPOILER) and how she gives in to Kim but then I actively tell myself she is like a victim of domestic abuse who seems to chose to stay with the abuser and then defends and makes excuses for the abuser.

I don't think Kyle intentionally "plays the victim or martyr". I guess I will know next season since she should be clued in by Kim's behavior this season and should realize she needs therapy (learn how to internally and externally deal with her sister….)

I think a lot of viewers were upset at the outing in general--as in, " How dare she air her sister's dirty laundry on tv!?!?" Personally, I didn't dislike Kyle because of limogate (I actually began disliking her in S2 because of her shitty treatment of Brandi believe it or not).

I didn't grasp that Kim had an addiction while watching S1. I just thought she was a little odd and socially awkward. I recently rewatched the S1 finale party argument that lead up to limogate. Kim was nasty and it was so obvious to me now that Kim was fucked up. It's amazing how your perception of old scenes change knowing what you know now.

Anyway, my opinion is that Kyle did not plan to out Kim. She was angry, emotional, embarrassed and Kim had just flung the good 'ol "You stole my goddamned house!" at her. It was unfortunate and Kyle has definitely paid for it. Kim will never forgive her for it. Some fans will never forgive her for it. She'll probably have a hard time forgiving herself for it.

[motorcitymom65]

Another bad parent here! My 19 year old got a crash course in August in the dorm's laundry room on how to do laundry. I finally told my 22 year old 2 weeks ago that he's doing his own laundry. I did show him how to use the machines because I know he'd somehow manage to break something. He still has a pile of dirty clothes that he never got around to washing.

 

 

 

How great would it be if parenting were so easy? Teach your kids to do their own laundry and they will get good grades, stay off drugs, not get pregnant, become productive citizens and thus you will be a great parent. That would be awesome and if that were the key I would get in line. I don't think it works that way. I'm a bad parent as well. My kids learned to do their own laundry very late in their teens because the thing they wanted to wear wasn't clean and I was at work. I don't think I ever taught them much, except for the odd occasion when I might walk in to see them contemplating adding bleach to their darks. I have had to remind them to clean out the lint thingy or not overcrowd the washing machine, but for the most part this simply doesn't seem like a critical life skill to me or the sign of good parenting. But then I have someone come in every other week to clean my house because I would just rather not do it. This means that when I broke a glass last year I didn't know where the vacuum was. I knew we had one because I had seen it, but had no clue where it would be kept. Luckily my kids knew (the garage, which still seems like a strange place to keep it). I am still going to keep telling myself I am a good parent. 

[thewhiteowl]

I can't put my pointing finger on why but I never did warm to Kyle. That doesn't mean I think everything she says and does is a lie or wrong. Just because Kim has taken a blowtorch to her own reputation and I am firmly on Kyle's side in this also doesn't mean I think she has morphed into a perfect person. I think she treated LisaV badly and got what she deserved there and I am glad they are beyond it and are friends again although I would not want to be Kyle if she fails to "have LisaV's back" on the mean streets of BH yet again. lol 

[Higgins]

I applaud Lisa for making Max work his way up the ladder in the family business, but he's 22 or 23 years old and has an apt. and two cars. I somehow doubt he's affording that on his busboy salary. Bottom line - rich parents - on this show and in real life - give their kids money, sometimes even spoil them.

Right, and just like any other thing these people do on camera, it is open for analysis and criticism. From my perspective entitlement is a huge problem with this generation.

I can't put my pointing finger on why but I never did warm to Kyle. That doesn't mean I think everything she says and does is a lie or wrong. Just because Kim has taken a blowtorch to her own reputation and I am firmly on Kyle's side in this also doesn't mean I think she has morphed into a perfect person. I think she treated LisaV badly and got what she deserved there and I am glad they are beyond it and are friends again although I would not want to be Kyle if she fails to "have LisaV's back" on the mean streets of BH yet again. lol 

Exactly.

[kitticup]

I'll be honest. I was one of those people that felt Kyle was way out of line for limo gate. I thought she was horrible and felt so bad for Kim. In my defense, I have never had any real interactions with addicts. From my perspective, I thought that Kim was sober and trying to put her life together. I thought she didn't feel comfortable interacting with Kyle's friends and really wanted to stay out of the drama. I thought that Kyle was trying to drag Kim into her fight with Camille. I didn't know or understand the history between the Richards sisters.

Now I have learned my lesson: you really don't know what is truly going on with these women. Kim is vile because she shows absolutely no regard for anyone. She is awful and it is clear that she was using and probably still is. Her behavior whether sober or under the influence is bizarre. I know longer think of her as shy and slightly awkward. I find her sense of humor very weird and uncomfortable. I felt so bad that LisaR had to put up with Kim in that sex shoppe. I wonder if Kim has a mental illness besides narcissism.

As for Kyle, I feel for her. It seems she has tried to help her sister but there is part of her that is very angry with Kim (understandably so). I did think she let her anger get the best of her in limo gate. I still fault her for getting almost physical. Just as LisaR let her temper get the best of her in Amsterdam. Kim brings that out in people I think because everyone bends over backwards for her and she refuses to treat others well.

Kyle should walk away fromKim. If Bravo has Kim back, they should make very clear that no one will be covering up for her anymore. I know I wouldn't if I was one of the other housewives. I would make clear that I will keep everything about her behavior while filming and not talk about what she does when we are not filming. So if she doesn't want anyone commenting on her bizarre behavior she needs to stop acting like she is under the influence of some substance. I would also make clear if Kim wants to bring up things not related to filming ie my family -- her family is fair game and then I would ask her how Chad was doing.

Edited April 12, 2015 by kitticup

[Higgins]

There are a lot of children who turned out okay from a lot of backgrounds. That wasn't my point. MY point was that Kyle used this a storyline, YES, a storyline, because she thought it was funny, or endearing, or showed what a wonderful mother she is or what a wonderful provider Mauricio is. As in "Look, how funny, I have coddled my family so much that they are somehow inept in the basics of activities of daily living." She put it out there because she wanted to because she thought it made her look good. I don't think that failing to incrementally allow your adolescent children to take on responsibilities they are capable of is cute or funny. Whether it be that you can do it better or quicker. These are the things we are supposed to be teaching. If they are capable of doing something for themselves, they should.

Edited April 12, 2015 by Higgins

[LotusFlower]

Right, and just like any other thing these people do on camera, it is open for analysis and criticism. From my perspective entitlement is a huge problem with this generation.

I hate entitlement, too, and I've long argued that allowing the HW's kids, especially teenagers, to be filmed is a losing proposition all the way around. Because kids are kids, and all parents are imperfect. But once the parents (the HW's) make the decision to film, they're all fair game.

Your turn to share why you watch this show! Pls. spill.

[What Fresh Hell]

MY point was that Kyle used this a storyline, YES, a storyline, because she thought it was funny, or endearing, or showed what a wonderful mother she is or what a wonderful provider Mauricio is. As in "Look, how funny, I have coddled my family so much that they are somehow inept in the basics of activities of daily living." She put it out there because she wanted to because she thought it made her look good. I don't think that failing to incrementally allow your adolescent children to take on responsibilities they are capable of is cute or funny.

I disagree with all of this. It wasn't a storyline, just an aside. She seems like a great mom to me.

[Higgins]

I watch for the fascinating sociology. What has become of our culture?. The way women tend to interact, the fame-whoredom that has become so prevalent that families will play out their private struggles for money in front of millions. The look at me factor. I find it all fascinating and of course the reactions to it all on here are great entertainment. So I think I watch to discuss these things with all of you!

Edited April 12, 2015 by Higgins

[LotusFlower]

I disagree with all of this. It wasn't a storyline, just an aside. She seems like a great mom to me.

Agreed. Her dysfunctional relationship with Kim? Storyline. Opening her store? Storyline. Sending Alexia off to school? Storyline. Scenes of Kyle laughing as Mauricio tries to make a sandwich, or talking about the kids/Mauricio and laundry? Total filler.

I watch for the fascinating sociology. What has become of our culture?. The way women tend to interact, the fame-whoredom that has become so prevalent that families will play out their private struggles for money in front of millions. The look at me factor. I find it all fascinating and of course the reactions to it all on here is great entertainment. So I think I watch to discuss these things with all of you!

Agree with all of the, too! Esp. the famewhore and look-at-me parts. Sometimes it astounds me, in a "is it worth it?" kind of way. Do you want to be famous that badly? And I guess the answer is yes. That's why I'm positive ALL the ladies will be back, if invited. They become addicted to the cameras, the notoriety.

Anyway, thanks.

Edited April 12, 2015 by LotusFlower

[Higgins]

I disagree with all of this. It wasn't a storyline, just an aside. She seems like a great mom to me.

I have said before I think Kyle is a loving mother. I also said my opinion was nit-picky about her parenting. No one is a perfect parent. She put it out there so I commented and added my opinion on the subject.

Agreed. Her dysfunctional relationship with Kim? Storyline. Opening her store? Storyline. Sending Alexia off to school? Storyline. Scenes of Kyle laughing as Mauricio tries to make a sandwich, or talking about the kids/Mauricio and laundry? Total filler.

Agree with all of the, too! Thanks.

So you think those scenes just happened? They weren't planned for some effect?

[zoeysmom]

I think that kind of came back to bite her.  The morning after the dust up Kyle had prepared a nice breakfast for Kim and Kim remarked something about the baby not having to do any work.  So it seems maybe Kyle is repeating the cycle she grew up with.  I hate to say it but wasn't this the same kid that flunked her driver's test?  I know Kyle took a lot of heat for not buying a junker for the kid to learn how to drive in. 

 

The only reason my son started doing his won laundry at 15 is because I found something he should not have had in his pants pockets.  His punishment was having to delay getting his learner's permit for two months-mine was he was going to show me and start doing his own laundry.  My daughter had no desire to learn until she was leaving for college.  She still brings her laundry home and puts her clothes in the washing machine.  The follow through steps are often completed by me.  I find her to be a successful student. 

 

I agree there are times the RH tend to put on airs.  I don't doubt that Mauricio doesn't do his own laundry but I don't think Kyle is the household washer woman.  I guess we are seeing what happens when you do have hired help around the house.

[SwordQueen]

I disagree with all of this. It wasn't a storyline, just an aside. She seems like a great mom to me.

 

Agree with you and LotusFlower.  Some scenes are filmed as "fluff" pieces.  Just silly little asides giving us a peek at something usually less serious and tongue-in-cheek.  That's how I saw the entire segment about "What will the husbands do when the HW go to Amsterdam", too.  Silly filler meant to be silly filler.  Bravo doesn't really do lighthearted all that well on these shows, imo.  I think many of them miss their mark as well as many of the TH the HW do. 

 

My parents must have been both awesome and terrible because I did my own laundry when I was a teen and also cleaned my room, the house, and one of my brothers' rooms, because he was useless when he didn't want to do something and my parents made me do it for him.  So, I guess they were good parents to me but bad to my brother?  I dunno.  I don't think any of those things makes or breaks good parenting, necessarily.  And like others have said, these kids are from wealthier families with money to have things done for them, like housekeepers and groundskeepers, etc.  Does it make Kyle or Lisa a bad parent for not having their kids out in the yard pulling weeds and mowing the lawn?  Not to me.  

[LotusFlower]

So you think those scenes just happened? They weren't planned for some effect?

I think all the HW's, with the exception of Brandi who's not allowed to film her kids, have a lot of those kind of scenes filmed as filler material. I think it's more producer-driven than coming from the HW's, and yea, there's some intent behind it - maybe in a PR/image-making kind of way. Or maybe the kids want a little camera time, and the mom acquiesces. (Or maybe the househusbands!) I just don't see them as actual storylines.

[MatildaMoody]

But you don't know this. How can you claim Kyle's actions weren't planned? Because Kyle, after the fact and after the backlash, said so?

I would think the fact that she convinced her cast mates and production to play along that Kim was just the nutty, but endearing sister, throughout the season would show that it wasn't planned. I remember that scene when they took the private Jet to see the basketball game. The women all toasted with champagne. There were no knowing looks or lingering on Kim's champagne. I think the fact that they all colluded to pretend there was no problem would show that the only thing that was planned was to make Kim appear sober - not to out her at the last minute. Plus, Andy has even said that Kyle begged production not to air that limo scene.

Edited April 12, 2015 by MatildaMoody

[becauseIsaidso]

 

There are a lot of children who turned out okay from a lot of backgrounds. That wasn't my point. MY point was that Kyle used this a storyline, YES, a storyline, because she thought it was funny, or endearing, or showed what a wonderful mother she is or what a wonderful provider Mauricio is. As in "Look, how funny, I have coddled my family so much that they are somehow inept in the basics of activities of daily living." She put it out there because she wanted to because she thought it made her look good. I don't think that failing to incrementally allow your adolescent children to take on responsibilities they are capable of is cute or funny. Whether it be that you can do it better or quicker. These are the things we are supposed to be teaching. If they are capable of doing something for themselves, they should.

H to the ELL, YES!!!

 

Which I feel is a perfect example of her inability to show empathy - IMNSHO, she can not put herself in someone else's shoes because she only sees things in terms of herself.

 

In the 'nature versus nurture' debate that has been ongoing for decades (if not centuries) I have always  been on the side of 'nature'. I see these sisters as an example of that argument.  As far as I know, Kyle has a loving husband, great kids, good friends, and, on top of it all, money....yet still I see those telltale signs of (unnecessary) nastiness.

 

Kim had it all, chose to piss it all away, blame everyone except herself, and has no scruples whatever about displaying her innate nastiness.

[MatildaMoody]

H to the ELL, YES!!!

 

Which I feel is a perfect example of her inability to show empathy - IMNSHO, she can not put herself in someone else's shoes because she only sees things in terms of herself.

I don't know. I think we have seen many things that directly contradict that. Supporting Camille after the divorce. Supporting Brandi after the tampon incident. Supporting Taylor through all of her stuff - even at the risk of her own reputation. Supporting Adrianne after the surrogacy reveal by Brandi. I think that Kyle can and has shown empathy. She definitely stepped outside of herself to help all of those women. I think they would need to show more than a throw away scene about a sandwich and laundry to portray her as unable to show empathy.