S04.E10 Episode 10

[subina167]

So Cole tells Cherry he was coming back for Alison. What made him think that Alison was still in love with him and even wanted him back? She didn't.

[Jax7917]

I don't know . I just don't see what everyone else is seeing with Noah and Helen reconciling . She seems very much in love with him , but he seems very moved on from her . I think Noah needs to just be a bachelor . He is so obsessed with himself and doesn't seem to want to be tied down to anyone . He even pretty much admitted this episode that he wasn't even really in love with Alison ( well he said he wasn't happy with her but that's what I got from that ). I think helen ever going back to him even if he wants her back down the road would be really stupid for her to do . He's a player. 

[Milburn Stone]

19 hours ago, TVFan17 said:

Just in case there is any lingering doubt about Alison being murdered vs. taking her own life.....  

Ruth Wilson was on Sandra Bernhard's Sirius-XM radio show a couple of days ago...Ruth seemed to leave no doubt that Alison was murdered on the show...

If that's an accurate summary of what Ruth Wilson said, then I have to question Ruth Wilson's understanding. (But perhaps the actress needed to believe it was murder to play the scenes convincingly.)

Tonight's episode left me in no doubt that it was suicide. 

[taragel]

You know, that really could have worked well (with a few tweaks to Noah's part maybe) to be the series finale. I do wonder if they filmed it with that in mind. Can't recall when they got a S5 renewal but think it was after it started airing this season.

And now I'm less convinced we're going to have to sit through a boring ass investigation of Ben next year. I mean maybe they'll touch on that but I don't think that's what the whole season will be.  So I expect there'll be a flash forward and whatever these folks get up to will be something new and random (and honestly kind of pointless as it's so far removed from where the show actually started.) 

I really thought it'd be kind of a trip if Helen jumped too and next season was some kind of weird Odd Couple reboot with Noah and Cole.

I appreciate that this show has finally maybe found a funny bone. The Say Yes to the Dress thing from two weeks ago and now Cole running like he was just drafted by the Jets, and the ridiculous bits of Noah and Helen's heart-to-heart ("It's okay, I fucked her too.") 

My one wish for S5: More Whi(t)ney!  I find her megalomania kinda funny, honestly.  (And she's a ballet dancer with a dancer's body, so yes, pretty sure she's always been that thin.) 

[chocolatine]

8 hours ago, LilaFowler said:

I did groan a lot during Noah's segment. Of course the kid in that class was a huge fanboy. Of course the blonde Head of the Department had a secret crush on him and was still enamored. He really is arrogant, isn't he?

And don't forget the female student who said Noah "really knows how to write women" to which Noah humble-bragged what a good listener he is.

I really hate that Sierra is pregnant and I hope after Vik's death Helen has nothing more to do with Sierra, the baby, or Vik's parents. If Priya didn't like Helen, let's see how she deals with the waste of space that is Sierra, the opposite of her smart, humble, and hardworking son in every way.

I don't know if it was Athena's OTT kookiness or the unintentional comedy of Cole running away with the ashes, but Alison's funeral left me completely cold.

[Jax7917]

I'm up for cole and Helen to end up together . They never met so I'm assuming that's a no but can we please give these 2 happiness after seeing them depressed for 4 seasons ? I think Cole feels for Luisa what Alison felt for him ( loves the person but is not in love ).. and Noah feels for himself what every woman feels for him ( in love ) . 

Edited August 20, 2018 by Jaclyn88

[CleoCaesar]

Please tell me I wasn't the only one to yell "Run, Forrest, run!!" when Cole took off with the urn.

I borderline loved this episode. Yes, I could have done without the Princeton scenes entirely. But the Noah and Helen scene was one of the best this show has had. I agree with posters saying Helen seems very much in love with Noah, but he's moved on. Helen saying she doesn't care about Vik's infidelity because she fucked Sienna too (and Noah's giggling reaction) was hilarious. Maura Tierney was so good this episode.

I genuinely thought that Helen was going to jump off the building in the end there.

I need season 5 to feature Whitney being run over by a truck.

[Armchair Critic]

1 hour ago, Jaclyn88 said:

I'm up for cole and Helen to end up together . They never met

They did meet once, it was at the Lockhart Ranch when Whitney was seeing Scotty (Cole's brother), Cherry asked them not to turn Scotty in and Cole held a gun on Noah.

[Adultosaurus]

2 hours ago, Gem 10 said:

Yes, I agree.  I was so pissed that Athena had Allison cremated.  She belonged with Gabriel, in the ground.  Athena is a stupid, nutso woman.

I think it's nutso to put ppl in the ground.

[LoveLeigh]

39 minutes ago, Adultosaurus said:

I think it's nutso to put ppl in the ground.

I think the cremation of Alison sort of told us that her death is a closed issue. I now do not think that season 5 will in any way investigate Alison's death as anything but suicide. Why she did it may never be answered because it probably was murder.  

I think season 5 will be a time jump ahead and they will be back in NY. Anton and Sierra will be written out. Helen and Noah will be back together, Cole will be with Luisa and who knows what Sarah Treem will concoct. 

There is only one thing of which I am certain. The series will end in some way with many dangling stories and no closure. That is her style. She did it with the last episode of In Treatment so who knows what Paul Weston is doing these days. 

Edited August 20, 2018 by DakotaLavender

[Gemini Gipsy]

12 hours ago, Bitsy said:

The bandaid was part of one of the Season 1 episodes.  Alison hurt her finger and had to use one of dead Gabriel's leftover children's bandaids.  It was a little anvilicious.

Vik didn't want to raise a child, he just wanted to have a child of his own to live on after he was gone.  I think Sierra's news was something to comfort him on his deathbed.  Turning septic usually means you are close to the end.  I don't think any of Helen's hopes ride on Vik living longer, she just wants to do right by him.  

I agree. They made it clear his time for choosing treatment has passed and it normally is at this point. Especially when they use the word metastatic and the septic. Guessing all of his organs are shutting down.

My BFF just died of MBC a few months ago and this is exactly how it went down it was hard for me to watch. 

A denial of treatment,  not knowing how painful it would be, a moment of regret "should u have had the treatment"  they clearly did their research here.

I cant tell if Helen's smile at the end was coy, genuine happiness, deviousness? Maybe a mixture of all. None the less powerless. Hoo

5 minutes ago, Gemini Gipsy said:

I agree. They made it clear his time for choosing treatment has passed and it normally is at this point. Especially when they use the word metastatic and the septic. Guessing all of his organs are shutting down.

My BFF just died of MBC a few months ago and this is exactly how it went down it was hard for me to watch. (Meaning this epi was hard to watch because it was done so damn well and close to reality)

A denial of treatment,  not knowing how painful it would be, a moment of regret "should u have had the treatment"  they clearly did their research here.

I cant tell if Helen's smile at the end was coy, genuine happiness, deviousness? Maybe a mixture of all. None the less powerful.

 

Sorry for double post having issues on phone with this site tonight 

Edited August 20, 2018 by Gemini Gipsy
Something went wrong?

[LoveLeigh]

11 minutes ago, Gemini Gipsy said:

I cant tell if Helen's smile at the end was coy, genuine happiness, deviousness? Maybe a mixture of all. None the less powerless. Hoo

I think her smile was genuine happiness. I think she was happy to be alone and looking forward to her future free of all her male baggage. 

[athousandclowns]

13 hours ago, Bitsy said:

The bandaid was part of one of the Season 1 episodes.  Alison hurt her finger and had to use one of dead Gabriel's leftover children's bandaids.  It was a little anvilicious.

Vik didn't want to raise a child, he just wanted to have a child of his own to live on after he was gone.  I think Sierra's news was something to comfort him on his deathbed.  Turning septic usually means you are close to the end.  I don't think any of Helen's hopes ride on Vik living longer, she just wants to do right by him.  

I agree sepsis in pC is usually related to a bowel blockage needing  a stent which also can become blocked causing sepsis. 

Think it's  too late to start any treatment. 

I called it on the pregnacy when they went off to the retreat.

since I fell asleep half way through will watch again. 

[izabella]

On 8/19/2018 at 2:08 AM, yourmomiseasy said:

Maybe I missed something, but it seems like all the scenes from last episode on the previouslies were from part 2. 

I think the very first scene they showed us was Allison sitting at the shore during the daytime wearing that same shirt (or dress?) from the night in her apartment.  When was that scene of Allison on the beach?  I don't remember it.

[weaver]

By the way, my memory is failing me.  When did Cherry become such a caring and articulate parent?  (and give Mare Winningham a chance to strut her stuff beautifully?)

Edited August 20, 2018 by weaver

[Guest]

4 hours ago, CleoCaesar said:

I genuinely thought that Helen was going to jump off the building in the end there.

 

I thought it was pretty amusing that a nurse was ready to basically fist fight Helen because she showed up at the door of Vik's hospital room without a visitor badge but yet she could somehow magically wander the hospital unsupervised to find the (apparently unlocked) door to the roof without any bothering to stop her from doing that. I mean, when I visit a hospital, I usually get lost 2-3 times on my way to wherever I'm going in there—and generally have to stop and ask some volunteer for directions. I can barely find an x-ray room let alone where to gain full, unfettered access to the hospital's roof. 

[Toodleoo]

9 minutes ago, Giant Misfit said:

I thought it was pretty amusing that a nurse was ready to basically fist fight Helen because she showed up at the door of Vik's hospital room without a visitor badge but yet she could somehow magically wander the hospital unsupervised to find the (apparently unlocked) door to the roof without any bothering to stop her from doing that. I mean, when I visit a hospital, I usually get lost 2-3 times on my way to wherever I'm going in there—and generally have to stop and ask some volunteer for directions. I can barely find an x-ray room let alone where to gain full, unfettered access to the hospital's roof. 

 

She knew where it was from all her time on ER. 

[Razzberry]

With kids like the Solloways god knows Helen had every reason to jump.  Perhaps the smile could be attributed to relief that Sierra is fulfilling Vik's Make A Wish  (for whatever hairbrained reason) and Sierra will have to deal with this woman?

[EtheltoTillie]

2 hours ago, athousandclowns said:

I agree sepsis in pC is usually related to a bowel blockage needing  a stent which also can become blocked causing sepsis. 

Think it's  too late to start any treatment. 

I called it on the pregnacy when they went off to the retreat.

since I fell asleep half way through will watch again. 

The pregnancy plot turn had all the surprise of a thousand anvils. 

[weaver]

19 minutes ago, GussieK said:

The pregnancy plot turn had all the surprise of a thousand anvils. 

I know it was suggested here and elsewhere, but I never thought the writers would actually go there.  

[Milburn Stone]

2 hours ago, GussieK said:

The pregnancy plot turn had all the surprise of a thousand anvils. 

I think, absent our knowledge of how very important having a child is to Vik, it might be soap-opera-ish. But with our knowledge of that fact, it becomes a ray of salvation for him in an otherwise very dark landscape. Albeit a ray tinged with its own ironic darkness for Helen. I found it moving.

The theme of childlessness--and facing the moment when it's too late to feel anything but regret for one's choices, which was something else going on with Vik in his hospital bed confession to Helen--was set up at the beginning of the episode, when the writing professor/old flame confessed to Noah that not having children was the regret of her life. For her, there is no Sierra.

The scene with Noah and Helen looking back brought it home. Blinkered by our often very wrong subjectivity, we, all of us, make our choices based on insufficient, faulty, or delusional information. Only later do we perhaps understand what went wrong, and even then we have no guide for the future other than the flawed subjectivity that got us where we are in the first place. And then we die. But we might as well celebrate it, because that's what we got.

Edited August 20, 2018 by Milburn Stone

[Jax7917]

Viks mom is very creepy . She's like a cartoon character , not an actual person and every time she's around it feels more like a horror movie than a show drama . 

[Lozu68]

14 hours ago, Razzberry said:

I was shocked, not only how low Princeton's standards have fallen, but at this line.  Didn't think the writers were familiar with the concept..

That line cracked me up...I say it to my elementary school students all the time!

[EtheltoTillie]

4 hours ago, Giant Misfit said:

I thought it was pretty amusing that a nurse was ready to basically fist fight Helen because she showed up at the door of Vik's hospital room without a visitor badge but yet she could somehow magically wander the hospital unsupervised to find the (apparently unlocked) door to the roof without any bothering to stop her from doing that. I mean, when I visit a hospital, I usually get lost 2-3 times on my way to wherever I'm going in there—and generally have to stop and ask some volunteer for directions. I can barely find an x-ray room let alone where to gain full, unfettered access to the hospital's roof. 

I thought the nurse was too heavy handed, just so they could wedge in the pregnancy announcement.  Hospitals no longer adhere strictly to the "next of kin" rule for a variety of reasons, particularly under circumstances like this where they already know who Helen is and she has regularly been admitted to the room under all kinds of dire conditions.  She said she was his wife to get past the gatekeeper, but she said it hesitantly, because she is not really his wife, I think we have figured out from hints.  If there has been anything explicit one way or another, maybe someone could point it out.   (However, I still have it in for the mean nurse who wouldn't let my husband in to see me in the middle of the night when I was recovering from surgery a few years go.  He's actually an attending physician at the hospital and had his badge.  She was a piece of work.)

Edited August 20, 2018 by GussieK

[HOTNTX53]

Were Helen and Vik married? I remember very distinctly, at the beginning of this season, looking for rings on them both, and seeing none. I've heard Noah say "Helen's boyfriend", yet I've heard others call Vik her husband.

I think that smile of hers on the roof was probably one of the few genuine smiles that she has had in many years of darkness, pain, hurt and regret. Not to mention that she won't have to deal with that viper bitch mother of Vik's. She felt free and ready for the next phase of her life. I do think that she and Noah will be back together when the series ends.

Honestly, this should have been the series finale. There's really no where to go that will hold our interest for another season of 10 episodes. They could have had an epilogue that updated what's going on in each of the characters lives today.

Ben had a whole lot of nerve showing up to Alison's memorial service after murdering her!!! And yes...I do believe that he killed Alison exactly as depicted in her POV #2.

I also called Sierra getting pregnant by Vik as soon as she hopped on top of him after the Porsche car ride. I'm guessing the baby will give meaning and purpose to her life. She was basically a neglected celebrity's kid that was given things like a nice house and material things, but she was looking for love and a reason for existing.

Probably the best season since Seasons 1 and 2.

[Maximona]

I liked the Princeton segment.  For one thing, it was nice to see that Donna went on to have a literary career after President Bartlet went back to New Hampshire.  For another, I liked Anton's "contradictions" piece.

I've always been a bit perplexed when I read these boards and nobody seems to understand why so many women throw themselves at Noah.  Noah is a writer.  Not just a successful writer but also (we're told) a really excellent writer.  It's kind of like being a rock star for people who read a lot and write themselves.  Hey!  Padma Lakshmi didn't marry Salman Rushdie because she liked his mustache.

Like all professions that are essentially vanity parades, Noah preens a great deal of the time. But since his bread and butter is based on accurate observations of the human condition, he's also able to see things clearly when he needs to.  The brief scene in the cemetery between Noah and Cole was interesting:  Noah was not willing to lie to himself about his happiness with Alison; Cole is willing to dedicate the rest of his life to lying about how happy Alison made him although (based on what I saw in the show's first two seasons) this is patently untrue.

And Cole's question to Noah, "Why'd you do it?" robbed Alison of all agency, turned her into an object that Cole and Noah were fighting over like two dogs.  

I personally would not trust someone who decamped from the funeral with his dead X-wife's ashes to go on a roadtrip with a kid I loved, but I guess Luisa didn't really have a choice.  Gotta say, Luisa is some kind of saint.  If I were her, I'd be going back to Ecuador with every last cent of the Lobster Roll $$$$.  I'm sure Ecuador is a great place if you're crazy rich.

I loved Helen in the final segment of the triptych!  I loved that she called Whitney a bitch; I loved that she slugged Sierra with her purse!  I loved the little moment between Noah and Helen after she muttered, "And I fucked her, too."  The two of them still speak the same language no matter how much water has threatened to take down the bridge.  The entire conversation between Noah and Helen in this segment is quite moving, in fact.  I love that the gift Noah gives Helen is the ability to tell Vik (finally?) that she loves him.

I think Helen smiles at the end of the episode because she's in that place that we all stumble into every once in a while where she sees her life as if she's looking at it from somewhere very far above (actualization of the looking-down-at-the-city metaphor) and marveling at its complexity. 

Great finale to an extraordinarily strong season.

[Guest]

10 hours ago, Milburn Stone said:

If that's an accurate summary of what Ruth Wilson said, then I have to question Ruth Wilson's understanding. (But perhaps the actress needed to believe it was murder to play the scenes convincingly.)

Tonight's episode left me in no doubt that it was suicide. 

Alison was murdered. There's a link in this post from the "How Did Alison Die?" thread with an interview with Sarah Treem who confirms it. 

I did get a good chuckle in the scene last night where Helen goes to wake a sleeping Sierra and she pokes at her with her finger as if she were poking an animal she saw on the side of the road to see if it were still alive.

[weaver]

I think based on Sarah Treem's statement we won't see any investigation next year of Alison's death.  What would we want to see except Alison, and Ruth Wilson is not filming any more scenes.  I do find it hard to believe it was not a topic of conversation with Cole and anybody else, like his mother, perhaps, in last night's episode.  

Edited August 20, 2018 by weaver

[Blakeston]

22 hours ago, Giant Misfit said:

That Anton's prose is worthy of Princeton admission has lead me to believe I should wandering the halls of Harvard. 

It doesn't matter that he committed plagiarism, apparently. All that matters is that, when asked to write a sketch of a fictional character, he chose to blatantly describe the distinguished guest lecturer instead - and publicly humiliated him by basically calling him "the psychopath who's fucking my mother."

Universities go wild for students who do that!

1 hour ago, HOTNTX53 said:

Were Helen and Vik married? I remember very distinctly, at the beginning of this season, looking for rings on them both, and seeing none. I've heard Noah say "Helen's boyfriend", yet I've heard others call Vik her husband.

Sarah Treem clarified on Twitter that Helen and Vik were never legally married.

[Milburn Stone]

1 hour ago, Giant Misfit said:

Alison was murdered. There's a link in this post from the "How Did Alison Die?" thread with an interview with Sarah Treem who confirms it.

Many times regarding many shows on this site (and on TwoP before it), I've repeated the same mantra: I give zero weight to what showrunners, actors, directors, etc., say about what their work means, and 100% weight to what's contained in the actual work. Creators (in their external communications) can mislead, intentionally or not, or may not even fully understand what they have put on the page or on the screen. That is not to say that my interpretation is law. Only that it is no less correct than Sarah Treem's. And I say that with the utmost awe for her work of art, which created my understanding.

Edited August 20, 2018 by Milburn Stone

[Gemini Gipsy]

1 hour ago, HOTNTX53 said:

Were Helen and Vik married? I remember very distinctly, at the beginning of this season, looking for rings on them both, and seeing none. I've heard Noah say "Helen's boyfriend", yet I've heard others call Vik her husband.

I think that smile of hers on the roof was probably one of the few genuine smiles that she has had in many years of darkness, pain, hurt and regret. Not to mention that she won't have to deal with that viper bitch mother of Vik's. She felt free and ready for the next phase of her life. I do think that she and Noah will be back together when the series ends.

Honestly, this should have been the series finale. There's really no where to go that will hold our interest for another season of 10 episodes. They could have had an epilogue that updated what's going on in each of the characters lives today.

Ben had a whole lot of nerve showing up to Alison's memorial service after murdering her!!! And yes...I do believe that he killed Alison exactly as depicted in her POV #2.

I also called Sierra getting pregnant by Vik as soon as she hopped on top of him after the Porsche car ride. I'm guessing the baby will give meaning and purpose to her life. She was basically a neglected celebrity's kid that was given things like a nice house and material things, but she was looking for love and a reason for existing.

Probably the best season since Seasons 1 and 2.

I think Sierra getting knocked up was the sloppiest and most predictable writing to date. Even my husband who does not watch it, but catches a scene here and there, a whole epi now and then saw it coming. 

 

I agree it was the best season since the start, and sure as hell a far cry from last season. That almost deterred me completely but I took a chance this season, Glad I did!

 

I hope they have something substantial and interesting that can follow this season. I would think so, otherwise why bother? (then I am reminded of last season and my heart sinks)

 

They can start by killing off that wench of a daughter, Twitney. 

[HOTNTX53]

Did anyone else catch the 2 different years of death on Gabriel's headstone in the cemetery?

At first it was 2008-2013, then a few minutes later it was 2008-2012!

[preeya]

14 minutes ago, HOTNTX53 said:

Did anyone else catch the 2 different years of death on Gabriel's headstone in the cemetery?

At first it was 2008-2013, then a few minutes later it was 2008-2012!

It's called a goof. Who cares!

[scrb]

11 hours ago, taragel said:

You know, that really could have worked well (with a few tweaks to Noah's part maybe) to be the series finale. I do wonder if they filmed it with that in mind. Can't recall when they got a S5 renewal but think it was after it started airing this season.

And now I'm less convinced we're going to have to sit through a boring ass investigation of Ben next year. I mean maybe they'll touch on that but I don't think that's what the whole season will be.  So I expect there'll be a flash forward and whatever these folks get up to will be something new and random (and honestly kind of pointless as it's so far removed from where the show actually started.) 

I really thought it'd be kind of a trip if Helen jumped too and next season was some kind of weird Odd Couple reboot with Noah and Cole.

I appreciate that this show has finally maybe found a funny bone. The Say Yes to the Dress thing from two weeks ago and now Cole running like he was just drafted by the Jets, and the ridiculous bits of Noah and Helen's heart-to-heart ("It's okay, I fucked her too.") 

My one wish for S5: More Whi(t)ney!  I find her megalomania kinda funny, honestly.  (And she's a ballet dancer with a dancer's body, so yes, pretty sure she's always been that thin.) 

I really think they could have ended the show right with this episode.

Noah's POV was nauseating and cringe-inducing, the way that professor and class was stroking Noah's ego.  So Anton upset him and drove him to go to the funeral?

If next season has more of that, they really should spare the viewers.

Cole tries to be decent to Luisa.  He seems resigned at the end.  Maybe Joanie will keep him going or maybe wanting to nail Ben will drive his story next season.

Helen's POV makes her life to be a shit show.  Horrible parents, horrible in-laws, horrible kids, horrible husbands.  There were times in the earlier season where she came off as a bitch, which in some ways made it understandable why Noah ran away.  But in this episode, it's like they want to make her a martyr, losing another spouse, having a monster of a daughter then finding out Vik cheated.

But she doesn't care and she beats herself a little bit that she "used" Vik.  I think she feels free now, free of the miserable in-laws, the crazy neighbor and now Vik.  She doesn't owe him anything any more.  In fact, she'd laugh like mad when she thinks about Vik's parents dealing with Sierra, the mother of their grandchild.

I guess it's a bit of revisionism, that Helen isn't this controlling bitch who drove Noah to Alison.  She's put up with a lot of shit yet tried her best with Vik.

 

Since the show is called The Affair, season 5 will be more easy sex for Noah, Cole and probably Helen too.  Let's have them wreck more marriages!  Or the way it'll be shown is that they will have affairs with people whose marriages were really over anyways.

[Jax7917]

20 minutes ago, HOTNTX53 said:

Did anyone else catch the 2 different years of death on Gabriel's headstone in the cemetery?

At first it was 2008-2013, then a few minutes later it was 2008-2012!

I noticed that too ! Please don't tell me they can have different perspectives on when the kid died . 

[taragel]

1 hour ago, Maximona said:

The brief scene in the cemetery between Noah and Cole was interesting:  Noah was not willing to lie to himself about his happiness with Alison; Cole is willing to dedicate the rest of his life to lying about how happy Alison made him although (based on what I saw in the show's first two seasons) this is patently untrue.

One thing that's always interested me about Cole and Alison's relationship that the show always glossed over is that they were high school sweethearts, which means they were together for about 15 or so years. That's a long time. I think if Helen had died instead of Alison, Noah might be acting just as Cole is now (since she's "The One" for him, per his own words.)

Or he's a sociopath and Anton was right. :)

Edited August 20, 2018 by taragel

[Former Nun]

1 hour ago, Maximona said:

Padma Lakshmi didn't marry Salman Rushdie because she liked his mustache.

But that, too, is always a possibility!   That Padma always lets us know she's a kinky girl.

[PrincessPurrsALot]

1 hour ago, preeya said:

It's called a goof. Who cares!

In a show that is based on details, goofs are particularly noticeable.  There have been other things viewers could call goofs that were meant to be seen as significant differences in the way people view things.  Does it matter if Alison wore a dress or jeans?  Is the bandaid significant? If we had seen different versions of the funeral, would Cole have said something, then ran off with the urn?  Would Cherry have brought chicken salad or vegan kabobs? Sometimes the details are meaningless; sometimes they tell us something about the characters state of mind.  So was it a goof or did the character feel like the death was more recent? 

[Blakeston]

I can't fathom the production accidentally using gravestones with two different carvings on them. If the numbers were different in the two shots, I think it must have been intentional.

Am I the only one confused about when/if Joanie was told about Alison's death? Everything pointed to her being in the dark about her mother being dead. Cole and Luisa kept debating when to tell her, and Luisa even distracted Joanie at the funeral.

Then at the end of Cole's segment, Joanie asks if Alison will be joining them on the beach, and Cole nonchalantly starts telling her about where some people believe dead people go when they die. And she seems completely unphased.

WTF - was that his way of breaking it to her? It was handled very strangely, IMO.

[PrincessPurrsALot]

It seems they didn't give us the scene when Joanie was told that Alison was dead.  Either that or Cole and Luisa are monsters that took her to her mother's funeral without explaining what that meant.  Then again, that could have happened too!  

[preeya]

13 minutes ago, Blakeston said:

WTF - was that his way of breaking it to her? It was handled very strangely, IMO.

 

Strangely and The Affair go hand in hand.   But yes the Joanie thing was very weird. Also, I can't imagine where he'd be going with her. Doesn't she have school?

Edited August 20, 2018 by preeya

[Milburn Stone]

7 minutes ago, Blakeston said:

I can't fathom the production accidentally using gravestones with two different carvings on them. If the numbers were different in the two shots, I think it must have been intentional.

I tend to agree with you. The only scenario I can envision in which it was just a mistake is one involving a reshoot. They shot the scene, realized in the editing room that they needed more coverage, brought the actors back, discovered they didn't have the prop anymore, and the prop guy re-created it carelessly. But that is so far-fetched that I have trouble believing it even after envisioning it.

As for Joanie, I shared your confusion. Was never clear on whether she even knew the funeral was for her mother. And her seeming nonchalance in her last car scene didn't match up with any child behavior I've witnessed. But maybe child grief experts would say it did! (What do I know?)

[A-Lo]

13 hours ago, Milburn Stone said:

If that's an accurate summary of what Ruth Wilson said, then I have to question Ruth Wilson's understanding. (But perhaps the actress needed to believe it was murder to play the scenes convincingly.)

Tonight's episode left me in no doubt that it was suicide. 

I'm really interested to learn why you believe it was suicide, Milburn Stone.  Not trying to be confrontational or anything, just interested.  Can you explain?

[Diane12251]

On 8/19/2018 at 1:17 AM, casey65 said:

Since they used scenes from Allison’s second POV in the previouslies, including Ben killing her, I’m taking that as confirmation that the second POV was the real one and that Ben did kill her.  Pretty ballsy of him to show up at the funeral, but maybe he thought it would look suspicious if he didn’t.  

Vik’s Mother is so awful, I’m surprised she even called Helen to let her know he was septic.  

Im honestly not surprised Luisa seemed to agree to Cole’s proposition of basically being a nanny and wife in name only in exchange for becoming Joanie’s guardian and possibly getting her citizenship. But I think Cole offered it out of guilt, and because he’s overwhelmed and it’s just easier to have Luisa parent Joanie.  He’s going to regret it sooner than later. 

I agree about them using scenes from Alison's 2nd POV in the previouslies as being confirmation that Ben killed her.  I also agree that it was pretty ballsy of him to show up at the funeral and say what he did.  I really do hope that in Season 5, Cole investigates Ben more and proves that he killed her.  I like the Cole/Noah pairing, too, so if they did that together, that would be great.  

[BunnyBlueBrown]

 

Excerpt from the interview 

 

“For anybody who is wondering, Alison did not kill herself, but the tragedy & the irony is that all the people in her life think that she killed herself. The audience is actually the only ones who will ever know the truth”

[Diane12251]

Just read the poll - "How Did Alison Die?"  Then saw a post that said Sarah Treem gives the answer here https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rV5uOBlCrh8

So she says that Alison was, in fact, murdered, but the tragedy is that everyone (on the show) believes she committed suicide and the audience is the only one who'll ever know she didn't.   So does that mean that Ben will never be brought to justice?  I was hoping that in Season 5, he bastard would be caught!!

[Milburn Stone]

38 minutes ago, A-Lo said:

I'm really interested to learn why you believe it was suicide, Milburn Stone.  Not trying to be confrontational or anything, just interested.  Can you explain?

I'll try, although some of it is based on the evidence of the show, and some of it on a gut feeling (which was shaped by some posters here who I found highly persuasive, because their arguments made so much sense to me when I thought about them in the context of everything we've seen prior to the suicide episode).

In the "evidence of the show" category, I'd rate No. 1 the absolute certainty of the detective in his analysis of the case. Season 1 established this detective as a very reliable source. He's not naive or easily fooled. He's thorough. He takes his time. He didn't just fall off the turnip truck. He certainly would have considered the possibility of homicide, and this would have led him to an examination of Alison's apartment, where he would have found evidence of murder had there been any. His analysis of the head wound (and the analysis of the forensic pathologist) was entirely consistent with Alison's being dashed against the rocks of the pier.

Also in "evidence of the show," we have Alison's delusional mental state and breakdown in the days/weeks prior to her suicide. Very little would be required to push her over the edge. And she seemed to be making arrangements for the eventuality. 

And the show has certainly established the evidence, over and over again, that subjective POVs (not just Alison's) can be completely delusional.

Finally, we have the repetition, in the second Ben/Alison scene, of the "Afghani kid with the grenade-less gun" story, which certainly means it was transmuted by Alison from her memory of it from the first scene, because there's no other way the second scene would contain a story so specific and unusual and so like the story in the first scene. (Unless she invented the story in both scenes, i.e., both scenes were fantasy. That could be. But for sure the second scene has to be.)

In the purely "gut feel" category is that the Ben of the second scene just wasn't recognizable as the Ben of any previous sighting on the show. Nor was he even recognizable as a dimensional human being (as opposed to a cliché villain Alison could easily imagine from movies and TV). In the season finale he was the believable Ben again--flawed, weak, but not evil. I suppose you could construct a split-personality psychotic explanation for Ben, but the show has been much more interested in portraying the departures from reality that exist within the normal range of human mental/emotional states, and it strains my credulity that the show would turn itself into a completely different show for one event.

Edited August 20, 2018 by Milburn Stone

[chabelisaywow]

Quote

Cole running away with the urn!  I realize it wasn't supposed to be humorous, but I laughed pretty loudly.

I was half expecting him to fall and spill the ashes and have them all blow away.

[kicksave]

I think this show has run its course and it was a wise decision to end it next season. The Sierra pregnancy was very predictable and when a show becomes predictable, it's basically over. That is why Breaking Bad was so good...always kept you guessing and new plot twists every week. 

[CleoCaesar]

4 hours ago, Milburn Stone said:

Creators ... may not even fully understand what they have put on the page or on the screen. That is not to say that my interpretation is law. Only that it is no less correct than Sarah Treem's.

 

I guess I'll never understand this postmodern (?) approach to text analysis. IMO of course an author is more privvy to the characters he or she created. They literally wouldn't exist without the author, nor would anything that happens to the characters. An author's interpretation of his or her own text will always be the correct one, and certainly more correct than a fan's reading of it. I think it takes a certain amount of arrogance (no personal offense intended, Milburn Stone) to state that someone understands an author's words/character more than the author who wrote/created them. Or that a fan's reading and the author's reading is on the same level of "correctness."

Edited August 20, 2018 by CleoCaesar