S02.E10 We'll Always Have Paris

[Lady Calypso]

Original Airdate: 2018.08.07

Quote

Sutton’s professional dreams come true when she jets off to Paris for Fashion Week, but while there she gains a new perspective on her situation. Jane moves forward with her fertility plan until she learns surprising news about her options and is faced with Ben and Pinstripe’s different solutions. Kat faces pressure from Jacqueline to make their Paris party a success while attempting to reset her relationship with Adena.

[sashayshante]

wait. Wait. WAIT. Jane blows off work to go to Paris and hang with her friends knowing her boss is there, too? Out of nowhere Richard shows up in Paris to profess his love to Sutton when they've barely crossed paths this whole season? Pinstripe offers to pay for Jane to have her eggs frozen? My God, is this show campaigning for Most Unrealistic Writing - Drama Emmy?

And i can't even with Sutton agreeing to leave Paris and ditch her job for a guy.

 

Christ, this show.

Edited August 8, 2018 by sashayshante

[UNOSEZ]

Didn't love it... But it was ok... That said... Sutton toyed with Alex before she went to Richard... Richard toyed with his girl until he went back to Sutton.. And we all know Jane is toying with Ben until she goes back to pinstripe... Not a great look... All these minority placeholders... Adena and Kate.. I mean it made sense what Adena was saying... But I get why Kathy took it hard... Oliver us awesome... And Alex got to speak... So cool 

[KaveDweller]

So Jane thinks it is a good idea to call Sutton while she is on an important business trip, to tell her news that will make her feel bad and that she can't do anything about? Nice. Then she asks Jacklyn to publish an article that could hurt Jacklyn's position with the board just to try and get something she wants. She may not know about that situation, but she had to know things would be bad for Jacklyn if she published it. 

1 hour ago, sashayshante said:

wait. Wait. WAIT. Jane blows off work to go to Paris and hang with her friends knowing her boss is there, too? Out of nowhere Richard shows up in Paris to profess his love to Sutton when they've barely crossed paths this whole season?

And weirder, Jacklyn didn't even seem to care that Jane was there. I can see if Jane took a few days off and Jacklyn was surprised to see it was because she came to Paris, but she can really just fly to Paris and still be on the clock?

I didn't think the Richard thing was so out of nowhere. I feel like it was hinted at with his speech at the funeral about realizing you should be with people who make you feel alive. Sutton didn't think it was about her, but it clearly was. It seemed like they were never over each other and the death of his father pushed him to make a move. I am glad that Sutton was able to get both a personal and and professional win.

I am glad they addressed the issue of funding for freezing your eggs, because last week I wondered how Jane was going to pay for that. But most insurance plans don't cover egg freezing. It isn't just Stafford. Also, and I don't want to sound like I'm not a feminist, but it doesn't really seem fair to compare covering Viagra for men to egg freezing for women. They have different purposes with very different costs. I think insurance should cover it in Jane's case, but I also don't think it is sexist that they don't. I think it is just insurance companies being cheap.

[twoods]

The Viagra and egg freezing comparison also makes zero sense. It would be sexist if egg freezing wasn’t covered but sperm freezing was covered, and both are not because they are very expensive. We’re not dumb, writers. I do wish that fertility procedures were covered by most insurances because they should be.

The Richard reveal was surprising because I thought he was going to marry his girlfriend and Sutton would find another guy next season. I genuinely like both of them because they were always upfront with their feelings and didn’t mess around (Richard was trying to move on after he was dumped but clearly wasn’t ready). See that, Jane? Poor Ben doesn’t stand a chance.

Edited August 8, 2018 by twoods

[dubbel zout]

30 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

it doesn't really seem fair to compare covering Viagra for men to egg freezing for women.  They have different purposes with very different costs. I think insurance should cover it in Jane's case, but I also don't think it is sexist that they don't. 

It is sexist on a broader scale: Men's sexual health is prioritized in ways that women's isn't. Look at the uproar surrounding the ACA requirement that insurance companies cover birth control. It's used for more than to prevent ovulation, but certain companies and institutions are allowed to deny that benefit regardless of its use.

48 minutes ago, KaveDweller said:

So Jane thinks it is a good idea to call Sutton while she is on an important business trip, to tell her news that will make her feel bad and that she can't do anything about?

I don't think Jane ever leaves any urge unacted upon. 

2 hours ago, sashayshante said:

wait. Wait. WAIT. Jane blows off work to go to Paris and hang with her friends knowing her boss is there, too? Out of nowhere Richard shows up in Paris

Poor Alex, stuck back in New York. Though he's probably relieved all the drama is literally an ocean away. LOL.

[GaT]

Aaaaand they're back together. Again. They better not break up Sutton & Richard again because I'm over it.

3 hours ago, KaveDweller said:

And weirder, Jacklyn didn't even seem to care that Jane was there. I can see if Jane took a few days off and Jacklyn was surprised to see it was because she came to Paris, but she can really just fly to Paris and still be on the clock?

That was really strange, "Jane, come to Paris" "OK, be right there", what job lets you just go somewhere like that? Like it's no big deal.

Is Adena gone? Please?

That was the season finale, wasn't it? I don't see the episode called that anywhere, but it seems to be.

[retrograde]

Ugggh, so much stupid in one episode:

• Jane just ditching her job and going to Paris with no money (even with flights covered, there are still expenses!)
• Kat sticking her nose into her girlfriend's work. It's not your business! 
• Pinstripe sticking his tongue down Jane's throat despite her having a boyfriend. Now I hate him. 
• These apparently fashion-mad women went to Fashion Week and attended precisely one event -- their own?
• Sutton ditching the most important event of her career for dull Richard, ugh. 
• Richard apparently wasting that other woman's time
• Sutton going to a wake when she had a flight to catch. I don't care if it was a red eye, you need to be there two hours ahead and allow a good hour for travel time to any New York airport. It made me very stressed!

[KateeBar]

Okay, fine. The Richard and Sutton thing was stupidly written but...I like Sutton a lot overall, so I liked her getting her version of a happy ending. And at least they've made her good at her job, despite that dumb idea of leaving fashion week for a dude. Come on show. 

 

I am really disappointed with how they wrote Jane this whole season. She became such a self-centered brat, I don't know how she would keep friends. And why do they have to perpetuate the idea that a smart, nice guy like Ben is dull and the cad is the right guy? 

 

And Kat. I just want the Adena storyline to be done so she can get something fresh to work with. 

[Jillybean]

The best part of this episode was Kat finally having something not work out for her. Adena deserves better. I never understood what she saw in Kat.

Jane jetting off to Paris at the last minute on Kat's miles is just another eye-roll worthy moment in the depiction of a workplace where even the assistants can come and go as they please. Ridiculous. Not to mention that Jane is apparently permitted the freedom to write about anything she wants at any time, from anywhere, and with no editing.

Sutton is awesome, but it was so disappointing that she would leave Paris to go see Richard., engagement" or not. It's not as though it was his wedding day. Sigh. I enjoy the relationship between Oliver and Sutton.

Loved the mention of Go Fug Yourself. I checked their Twitter and they were pretty excited when a viewer tweeted them about it.

Edited August 8, 2018 by Jillybean

[UNOSEZ]

1 hour ago, KateeBar said:

And why do they have to perpetuate the idea that a smart, nice guy like Ben is dull and the cad is the right guy? 

This X 10000... Im so tired of this... Ppl don't have to be so rigid with  archetypes...  Ben is thoughtful.. Accomplished.. Caring.. Etc... But most importantly wgenbit came to Jane he didn't mess around with her... He made his intentions clear.. He was all in... Even his solution to her egg problem was practical yet super romantic and Jane looked at him like he asked to eat her hair or something... Where as pinstripe seems to be this carbon copy of a character I've seen on many of the shows I watch ( emotionally immature  light hearted smarmy oversexed handsome white guy)  who the female seems inexplicably drawn too even tho his qualities are severely lacking.. Who then thanks I guess to the female( usually because he's falling in love)  starts changing some of his ways.. And she chooses him and they have a tumultuous relationship.... Now I dunno if its just that I'm not the Target demo for a lot of these shows ( mid 20s straight  biracial male)  or if this is something that the vast majority of the women who watch these shows want.. But it is tiring

[sashayshante]

To be fair, it is more realistic for someone Jane's age to be drawn to a Pinstripe over a Ben. Jane is wildly immature and self-absorbed and Ben is, well, neither. jane's too easily threatened by someone with it all together because she's a mess. Pinstripe is a trope in the same way Jane and Ben are. He's the smarmy but good-hearted guy with commitment issues that's great in bed. (Big) Jane is the neurotic, self-centered immature Manhattan girl. (Carrie) Ben is the handsome but boring guy every woman knows she should settle down with  but doesn't. (Aidan)

[jenrising]

Ben deserves better than Jane.

[UNOSEZ]

@sashayshante thanks.  Tho sex and the city was a bit before my time I get the gist of what ur saying... And the point about Jane being so wrapped up in her messed up self  that her picking pinstripe for all the wrong reasons makes sense... But I fear the show won't present her decision that way... I'm scared they'll go with something lame like... He makes me feel alive or something cheesy along those lines... for TRUE WUV " instead of it really being... " I'm being young and dumb and going against my own self interest because pinstripe is easier.... 

Also is Ben really that boring I mean they did get it on in the bathroom of a public eatery... 

[dubbel zout]

I forgot to mention that I was so annoyed Richard told Sutton about the board considering ousting Jacqueline. That's not information he should be sharing with her. I get it was a surprise to him, but it's his job to be discreet.

Joanna Coles recently resigned from Hearst. Of course the show was written long before she made her decision (it was likely precipitated by the appointment of a new president, with whom she reportedly never got along), but it's fun to speculate. I doubt Jacqueline/Melora Hardin is going anywhere, though. Jane needs her mommy figure to continually save her butt.

One more addition: I HATED that the women stole all the macarons from the fertility clinic. What a trio of assholes.

Edited August 8, 2018 by dubbel zout

[sashayshante]

1 hour ago, dubbel zout said:

One more addition: I HATED that the women stole all the macarons from the fertility clinic. What a trio of assholes.

 

This so hard. If they were at some snobbish uppercrust party, go for it. But to steal from a clinic? Yeah, that's gross. 

[Guest]

Well, that was an underwhelming finale, and not just because they queerbaited us with Sutton all season and then flung her back into Richard's arms (since when are they some star-crossed couple? They were always written as a sexy office fling.) It was weird that Alex was advising Jane on whether to tell Sutton about Richard's "engagement" given his own romantic history with Sutton, but I think the writers forgot they hooked up. For a second, I thought Alex would comfort Sutton at the end of the ep and they'd wind up having sex instead. They have much better chemistry imo, but the show has apparently decided that men of color can only be beta males.

Kat and Adena are exhausting. Pretty, but exhausting. They've burned through 5 seasons of plot for them in one season, so I guess the only thing left is to break up - but there will still be drama because Adena just got her Visa! The first half of season 3 will be them awkwardly avoiding eye contact in every lesbian bar in NYC. Great. Loved Kat's soiree outfit though.

Jane...the less said about Jane, the better. Of course only Jane would not only have two dudes vying for her love, but also eagerly willing to cover a $12,000 elective fertility procedure. Time may be running out on her eggs, but she sure has one magical vagina! 

[UNOSEZ]

45 minutes ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

It was weird that Alex was advising Jane on whether to tell Sutton about Richard's "engagement" given his own romantic history with Sutton, but I think the writers forgot they hooked up. For a second, I thought Alex would comfort Sutton at the end of the ep and they'd wind up having sex instead. They have much better chemistry imo, but the show has apparently decided that men of color can only be beta males.

It was really weird.. Especially cuz Alex didn't bring it up.. ( Jane is too self involved to care that she's asking the guy who was super into Sutton.. Whle Sutton kinda just played with then decided she really wanted Richard) but he never even mentioned it.. And I thought ok maybe they are just pretending it didn't happen... But then I remember early in the season that other fashion girl was getting at Sutton claiming she was only moving up and getting work cuz she slept with Alex ( who she then kinda backed away from as even a Platonic friend.. At least for a while until she needed his advice again) .. And then when she was telling Oliver about not being able to share her big moment he asked if it was Alex... So the show doesn't seem to want us to forget.. They just don't plan on doing anything with it.. Other than having Alex pop in every once in a blue to say somn helpful or smart

[Guest]

1 hour ago, UNOSEZ said:

And then when she was telling Oliver about not being able to share her big moment he asked if it was Alex... So the show doesn't seem to want us to forget.. They just don't plan on doing anything with it.

Yeah throwing in the detail of Oliver thinking Sutton was talking about Alex felt out of the blue since they haven't interacted at all this season.' They better not bring back their triangle next season, Ben/Jane/Pinstripe is boring enough. ?

Speaking of Jane/Pinstripe, wtf was that kiss? Was it supposed to be intentionally chaste to show Jane Pinstripe was being respectful of her relationship while kissing her? lol that was hardly a steamy "fantasize about this and leave your boyfriend for me" kiss.

[tennisgurl]

Kat and Adena are super cute...when they get along for about five minutes per episode. I swear, those two are all drama, all of the time. Maybe its best that they split for awhile, or forever. Kat figuring out her sexuality is interesting, but them coming up with increasingly ridiculous ways for them to fight is just a pain to deal with. Just ONE EPISODE without relationship drama with them? 

I cant believe that Sutton was actually going to leave her dream assignment for Richard. I do like Richard and Sutton though, and I love Sutton in general, so I can let it slide this time. Despite the mess up with the book, she is such a hard worker, and I love her passion for fashion. So often, media will make loving fashion out to be frivolous or superficial, and not something creative or empowering to people, so its nice to see how much the show respects how much Sutton loves her work. 

Jane is such a teachers pet. If Jacqueline gets fired, she is going to have a rude awakening when she finds out that other bosses dont let her just jet off to Paris on a whim. Its all felt like a fantasy, not like a show that is generally close to reality and wants to touch on real issues. Poor Ben, he is just too normal and low key to keep up with Jane Drama. I like Pinstripe, but I hoped that they would avoid the cliche and just let Jane move on and be friends with Pinstripe. 

[slaterain]

I was so annoyed when Jane joined them in Paris. I was actually hopeful that for once Jane would be the lone one out. I have really hated her this season and I don't recall thinking that last season. So did the character/writing change or did I just not notice it as much since it was a new show!?!?! I really can't stand her. She gets ZERO consequences. Can't afford fertility treatments? Here are two guys that will help you out. Don't like a locked gun without ammunition in your apartment? Just guilt your friend out of it. (I am anti gun but completely sided with Sutton on this one!) Escape work to help a friend but are so completely trashed that you don't realize all that both friends are going through! I need her to have something happen and stick. I want both guys to realize what a b*tch she is!!! Both Sutton and Kat have called her out on her behavior but she still seems to win every time. UGH!!!

[Silly Angel]

I'm so mad at this episode, it's difficult to marshal my thoughts, so one quick thing, aside from stealing the macarons. Selfish little post-millennial bitches.

 

If they are so impressed by Adele Marchand's atelier, stop calling it the "a-till-ier." Such a weird pronunciation and both Sutton and Jane used it.

[KaveDweller]

2 hours ago, slaterain said:

I was so annoyed when Jane joined them in Paris. I was actually hopeful that for once Jane would be the lone one out. I have really hated her this season and I don't recall thinking that last season. So did the character/writing change or did I just not notice it as much since it was a new show!?!?! 

I don't know, but I feel exactly the same way about Jane. I didn't have issues with her at all last season and the past few episodes I have completely hated her.

2 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

Jane is such a teachers pet. If Jacqueline gets fired, she is going to have a rude awakening when she finds out that other bosses dont let her just jet off to Paris on a whim. Its all felt like a fantasy, not like a show that is generally close to reality and wants to touch on real issues. Poor Ben, he is just too normal and low key to keep up with Jane Drama. I like Pinstripe, but I hoped that they would avoid the cliche and just let Jane move on and be friends with Pinstripe. 

We already saw Jane struggle when Jacqueline wasn't her boss at that other magazine. She was shocked her article got edited and then surprised that her boss expected her to defend her own story. And she totally ignored what she was supposed to do and got herself fired because she expected no consequences like she had at Scarlett.

Sutton seems to be the only one who really works hard at her job, so I was surprised she was going to leave Paris. But I did like Oliver being supportive of her. He seems like a good boss who still makes his employees work hard and answer for their mistakes.

[Cranberry]

I was going to write a big post, but then I read the Autostraddle recap and agreed with pretty much all of it, so I'll recommend that!

I'll just say that last season Sutton was my least favorite of the girls because I found all the Richard drama boring and tiring, and this season she was my favorite character on the entire show because she made the tough choice to break up with him and work hard to achieve her fashion-related goals, and was consequently way more fun/interesting to watch. I do not like this whole, "My achievements are meaningless without a man to share them with" attitude, and I didn't like how Oliver of all people told her to leave the most important fashion-related event of her life thus far to chase after a man.

[dubbel zout]

9 hours ago, Cranberry said:

I do not like this whole, "My achievements are meaningless without a man to share them with" attitude, and I didn't like how Oliver of all people told her to leave the most important fashion-related event of her life thus far to chase after a man.

I know. I appreciate him wanting Sutton to have a life outside of work, but her talent isn't going to mean much if she never has a chance to use it because she's too busy mooning over Richard.

[NutMeg]

16 hours ago, Cranberry said:

I was going to write a big post, but then I read the Autostraddle recap and agreed with pretty much all of it, so I'll recommend that!

I'll just say that last season Sutton was my least favorite of the girls because I found all the Richard drama boring and tiring, and this season she was my favorite character on the entire show because she made the tough choice to break up with him and work hard to achieve her fashion-related goals, and was consequently way more fun/interesting to watch. I do not like this whole, "My achievements are meaningless without a man to share them with" attitude, and I didn't like how Oliver of all people told her to leave the most important fashion-related event of her life thus far to chase after a man.

Well, basically, it boils down to the girl with the most love drama being the most boring, and I'd add the one with the most real-life-past-drama integrated into her work life being the most insufferable. So, writers, please bring us more work situations, and leave the historical pathos to a minimum. Yes, they have a life outside the office, and we should see some of it, but really, I'm more interested in their work life, whatever form it takes (employed, freelance, etc.), and on how the magazine survives in this new era.

And for the record, I've loved seeing Sutton getting better and better at her job. Not sure how I feel about Jane's articles, and no idea what Kat does all day (at her job).     

[Moxie Cat]

The macarons! Ben! Sheesh, what this show is driving home is how immature these girls are most of the time. 

Great comparison with Sex and the City. I was a huge Aiden fan, and also feel that Ben deserves better than Jane. She is incredibly immature compared to him.

i loved Sutton's realization that Richard loved someone else (deep! Mature! Moving on!)....until he didn't.

Last year, after the finale, I thought, yeah, probably not watching this next summer. I have the same thought now, but I'll probably cave.

[Guest]

On 8/9/2018 at 1:58 AM, Cranberry said:

I do not like this whole, "My achievements are meaningless without a man to share them with" attitude, and I didn't like how Oliver of all people told her to leave the most important fashion-related event of her life thus far to chase after a man.

Exactly! Oliver would've said, "Dry your tears, Red. You have the rest of your life to live out your Sex and The City drama, but Paris Fashion Week waits for no man." Especially galling that that exchange came directly on the heels of her impressing Oliver and the designer, which would've been a great catalyst for Sutton to finally start believing her own potential and realize she has so much more to gain in Paris by focusing on her work than moping over Richard (who is a particularly bland work fling once you strip away the sexiness of secrecy and not at all the Prince Charming the show apparently decided he is). And I know that heart-to-heart was meant to highlight the evolution of genuine friendship between Sutton and Oliver, but no fashion editor at any magazine ever would allow their right-hand man to leave Fashion Week even for a death in the family, much less to go live out their childish notions of romcom fantasy.

Also, these girls and this show really acted like flying from New York to Paris was as cheap and easy as hopping a bus from Manhattan to the Bronx. How many characters this ep arbitrarily chose to cross the Atlantic on a whim and were there by the next scene? Upper crust indeed. 

Edited August 10, 2018 by Guest

[dreamcatcher]

I had no idea this was supposed to be a season finale. I was so in love with this show last year but this season was mediocre at best. I don’t really feel like the story progressed at all. If anything, we only saw Sutton growing and they undid it with this finale (and I’m a Richard fan).

[Megan]

Why does Oliver call Sutton Red? She's blonde... is there some other reason that I missed?

[TVForever]

1 hour ago, Megan said:

Why does Oliver call Sutton Red? She's blonde... is there some other reason that I missed?

I think her hair WAS more red last season.

[Aliconehead]

There was a discussion in another thread that Oliver once said she would look good as a redhead and the nickname was born

[Megan]

41 minutes ago, TVForever said:

I think her hair WAS more red last season.

 

36 minutes ago, Aliconehead said:

There was a discussion in another thread that Oliver once said she would look good as a redhead and the nickname was born

Weird. They could easily make her a red head.

I kept thinking well, may be her hair is reddish... but it's totally not at all.

Edited August 12, 2018 by Megan

[CurlyATX]

On ‎8‎/‎10‎/‎2018 at 4:18 PM, SnarkEnthusiast said:

Dry your tears, Red. You have the rest of your life to live out your Sex and The City drama, but Paris Fashion Week waits for no man."

If she wants to reveal her feelings she can, but it's not like once the engagement ring is on Jessica's finger then that's it- time's up.  It was so cheesy... the spinning camera, etc.  And Sutton HAS someone to share it with- her friends.  She can't even have a BM without them knowing.  

I was so irritated by her placing her notebook near the tub.  Who does that? I only bring magazines that I don't care about in the tub, not an iPad or my WORK notebook.  

Most clinics I've been to will clearly let you know that you have a big ole payment due at the start, especially if it's not covered by insurance.  The stealing the desserts was so dumb.  It reminded me of some other show where they steal the lamp or something.

Anyone else want to see Kat and Jane fall on their ass? I really wanted Jacqueline to tell her that her article wasn't correct- it was biting the hand that feeds, very one-sided, and wasn't something that all readers could relate to.  This isn't a personal blog it's a magazine.  

If my husband had reached out to my ex-boyfriend at all, I'd have lost my stuff.  Perhaps the reason Adena isn't "creative" is because she's got visa worries looming over her.  And she has a lover who is a total baby.  

And Ben... it is so unfair.  The "test" at the end of who'd you tell isn't fair to the boyfriend who isn't being used emotionally.  It's not like Ben has ever been anything but supportive to Jane.  

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, CurlyATX said:

If she wants to reveal her feelings she can, but it's not like once the engagement ring is on Jessica's finger then that's it- time's up.  It was so cheesy... the spinning camera, etc.  And Sutton HAS someone to share it with- her friends.  She can't even have a BM without them knowing.  

I was so irritated by her placing her notebook near the tub.  Who does that? I only bring magazines that I don't care about in the tub, not an iPad or my WORK notebook.  

Most clinics I've been to will clearly let you know that you have a big ole payment due at the start, especially if it's not covered by insurance.  The stealing the desserts was so dumb.  It reminded me of some other show where they steal the lamp or something.

Anyone else want to see Kat and Jane fall on their ass? I really wanted Jacqueline to tell her that her article wasn't correct- it was biting the hand that feeds, very one-sided, and wasn't something that all readers could relate to.  This isn't a personal blog it's a magazine.  

If my husband had reached out to my ex-boyfriend at all, I'd have lost my stuff.  Perhaps the reason Adena isn't "creative" is because she's got visa worries looming over her.  And she has a lover who is a total baby.  

And Ben... it is so unfair.  The "test" at the end of who'd you tell isn't fair to the boyfriend who isn't being used emotionally.  It's not like Ben has ever been anything but supportive to Jane.  

LOL the BM thing reminds me of the gross shitting Skype call on Broad City - complete with muting the plopping sounds. I think the idea of racing to beat the engagement is because it's apparently more taboo to cheat with someone who has a fiancé because they're considered almost married and a fiancé is perceived as more legitimate than a girlfriend because you've officially committed to them, but that's kind of an arbitrary distinction considering the majority of people of these girls have made out with have already had girlfriends or they themselves have been in relationships at the time of the original hookup. (paging Jane and Pinstripe) Cheating with someone you know has a fiancé is unsympathetic, but cheating on your boyfriend to kiss a hot milquetoast dude is sexy and titillating! It's weird that they drew that line for Richard of all people because his fiancée is the definition of a disposable background character, but maybe that's why they didn't want to waste time on keeping that love triangle going.

Unfortunately, based on listening to Katie Stevens talk at a panel a few weeks ago, the firing fiasco at Incite was considered Jane's first big failure and one that Kate apparently had to push for in the writers room, so God only knows what Mary Sue dreck had been originally written for her this season. I'm sure next year will end on the cliffhanger of her choosing which of her five platonic sugar daddies she will choose to buy her a vacation home in the Hamptons.

Kat is like dating an eighth grader, but Adena hasn't been impressing me either with her shadiness. Although I don't think it would work for me personally, I was happy to see a healthy open relationship portrayed on TV without the usual tired jealous drama (even if they picked fights over everything else), so the sudden reveal that Adena basically persuaded Kat to have an open relationship to get away from her and get more work done felt very cheap and undercut the schmoopy hyper-emotional love vibe we got last season.

Ben is hotter, more committed, stable, supportive, and probably makes more money, but Pinstripe will win because he's white and a smug asshole, which is interpreted as "edgy" and "challenging." 

[Jadzia]

On 8/8/2018 at 7:57 AM, Jillybean said:

Jane jetting off to Paris at the last minute on Kat's miles is just another eye-roll worthy moment in the depiction of a workplace where even the assistants can come and go as they please. Ridiculous.

And apparently she already has a passport so we didn't have to spend an episode going to Jane's hometown so she could get one. LOL.

[Catfi9ht]

Well, so that episode happened. What a disappointing season and a lackluster season 2 finale.

Lots of great examples from everyone above, and I'm glad I'm not the only one who noticed how self-absorbed and manipulative Jane was written this season. I won't pile on with everything I hated about Jane during this episode (cough*usedlessinsteadoffewer*cough), but I'll focus on what seems to be the big topic at the moment for her. 

If Jane is supposed to be risk averse and a planner, why would she think she had to immediately freeze her eggs at 25 instead of researching, planning, and budgeting that out? The whole fertility/family planning dilemma seemed to be so rushed that it was completely out of Jane's character. Had Jane researched it, and the show attempted to explore that plot line, they could have written subplots across multiple episodes about exploring the issues of women's health including debunking myths and disparities that continue to exist today. @dubbel zout's example above of birth control versus Viagra is a perfect comparison instead of freezing eggs and Viagra which was the horrible comparison the show made instead. What a wasted opportunity to intelligently communicate to younger women using the voice of younger women about something extremely important and relevant (i.e, women's health).

Overall, I was wondering why the show's voice seemed to change from season 1 to 2, but then I just read in the media thread that there was a new show runner this season. Judging from each of the show runners' past work, I can definitely see their individual styles and the differences between the seasons are a perfect match for how each of those women write.

My husband laughs at me because I'm a total TV writer nerd, especially when it comes to show runners. When a new show is announced for someone I admire, I will give a show more of a chance even when I'm not interested in the premise. When I like a show, I figure out which of the individual writers on that show develop episodes I like better than others and get excited when my favorites appear in the credits. 

Back to this show, I definitely think season 2's voice is less mature than season 1's which makes me incredibly disappointed. Watching season 2 of this show made me feel too old to identify with the characters that I liked getting to know in season 1 so I don't think I'll be back for season 3.

As always this board is a blast. Thanks for all your thoughtful comments and insights!

[CurlyATX]

1 hour ago, Catfi9ht said:

Back to this show, I definitely think season 2's voice is less mature than season 1's which makes me incredibly disappointed. Watching season 2 of this show made me feel too old to identify with the characters that I liked getting to know in season 1 so I don't think I'll be back for season 3.

My husband was thrilled I am no longer watching shows with characters set in high school (looking at you Pretty Little Liars).  I don't know anything about show runners so I'm going to have to do some research. 

A few years ago I binge watched a few episodes of "Girls" and the entire time was scratching my head why these girls acted so dumb.  It made me wonder if I was this stupid in my 20s.  Season One, I really liked this show, especially with the interracial dating.  Now, it feels so clichéd.  I just want more Alex, Ben and Oliver (maybe they can meet in the closet).  

I didn't notice it, but I see that all the disposable lovers are POC... now I feel sad.  

[GaT]

On 8/9/2018 at 6:11 PM, Moxie Cat said:

Last year, after the finale, I thought, yeah, probably not watching this next summer. I have the same thought now, but I'll probably cave.

Me too, &then I completely forgot this show existed until it showed up on my DVR again. Probably do the same thing next year.

On 8/10/2018 at 3:13 PM, dreamcatcher said:

I had no idea this was supposed to be a season finale. 

I found this so strange, I had to look up how many episodes there were this season to figure out that this was the season finale. Were they keeping it a secret? 

On 8/9/2018 at 4:02 PM, NutMeg said:

Well, basically, it boils down to the girl with the most love drama being the most boring

And that would be Kat, who has not purpose other than to do what she's not supposed to at work & have drama with Adena.

[Mabinogia]

I liked this show when I thought it was going to be about three really good friends just starting out in their careers and doing what they can to succeed. It's a lot less interesting as junior Sex in the City. 

In season one Sutton was focused on her career in fashion, now she's willing to leave a huge event she was damned lucky to be invited to for a guy. That was kind of the nail in the coffin for me. She was the only one who was living up to what I thought the show was going to be. Now she's just a dick chaser. Jane and Kat are just entitled little brats. 

This show has so much wasted potential. 

[KaveDweller]

6 hours ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

I think the idea of racing to beat the engagement is because it's apparently more taboo to cheat with someone who has a fiancé because they're considered almost married and a fiancé is perceived as more legitimate than a girlfriend because you've officially committed to them, but that's kind of an arbitrary distinction considering the majority of people of these girls have made out with have already had girlfriends or they themselves have been in relationships at the time of the original hookup. (paging Jane and Pinstripe) Cheating with someone you know has a fiancé is unsympathetic, but cheating on your boyfriend to kiss a hot milquetoast dude is sexy and titillating!

Well, it wouldn't even have to be cheating if they are worried about a the technicality of it. Tell Richard you want another chance than wait for him to break up with the woman before you hook up with him. It would be crappy of Richard to breakup with someone he just proposed to, but it would also be crappy of him to propose if he is still hung up on Sutton. So 

Also, couldn't Sutton have just called Richard from Paris?

2 hours ago, GaT said:

Me too, &then I completely forgot this show existed until it showed up on my DVR again. Probably do the same thing next year.

I found this so strange, I had to look up how many episodes there were this season to figure out that this was the season finale. Were they keeping it a secret? 

I saw promos for it calling it the season finale, so I don't think it was something they were keeping quiet.

[dubbel zout]

2 hours ago, KaveDweller said:

Also, couldn't Sutton have just called Richard from Paris?

Or vice versa: Richard could have called Sutton and told her his engagement was dunzo.

[julia1130]

So I will be the odd one out and say that I loved this! So much of it is unrealistic, obviously, but I think more of it (ie the friendships) is eerily accurate.

RE: Jane’s trip to Paris - I always thought that Jane’s job more/less allowed her write from anywhere. She could have said she was thinking about writing about Paris FW. Also, at 25-26 y/o she likely has money in savings for travel - as there are costs in addition to the fight and hotel.

RE: Sutton/Oliver/Richard - I do think it was pretty unrealistic, but not totally out of the question. Sutton had just proved herself as an amazing fashion asst; she did tell Oliver that they were in love and he made her feel special and perfect; Oliver was impressed that she broke up with a guy like Richard for her career; and I think Oliver is at heart a romantic. If I was Sutton, I would have just called Richard... but Oliver basically said her job/future career was secure and she should go -  she is still fairly young so she went for it. 

RE: Jane - the two hot men falling at her feet to solve her egg-freezing problem is totally unrealistic. Her choosing Pinstripe (which will happen) is very realistic to me, and a choice I think is right for someone in their mid-twenties, as long as she doesn’t get pregnant or marry him!

(“ducks”)

Edited August 14, 2018 by julia1130

[Catfi9ht]

13 hours ago, dubbel zout said:

Or vice versa: Richard could have called Sutton and told her his engagement was dunzo.

I didn't think there was ever an engagement. Richard used the custom jeweler to turn his dad's class ring(s) into the new cufflinks Sutton noticed before they headed to the party.

I could use this topic as an excuse to point out how Jane shouldn't have told Sutton because everything Jane assumed about Richard was wrong, but I won't.

The amount of time between Richard's dad dying and Sutton seeing the custom cufflinks was what a week at most? Most custom jewelry takes a couple of weeks after the design is approved. Another reason to not overthink the show I guess.

9 minutes ago, julia1130 said:

So I will be the odd one out and say that I loved this! So much of it is unrealistic, obviously, but I think more of it (ie the friendships) is eerily accurate.

RE: Jane’s trip to Paris - I always thought that Jane’s job more/less allowed her write from anywhere. She could have said she was thinking about writing about Paris FW. Also, at 25-26 y/o she likely has money in savings for travel - as there are costs in addition to the fight and hotel.

RE: Sutton/Oliver/Richard - I do think it was pretty unrealistic, but not totally out of the question. Sutton had just proved herself as an amazing fashion asst; she did tell Oliver that they were in love and he made her feel special and perfect; Oliver was impressed that she broke up with a guy like Richard for her career; and I think Oliver is at heart a romantic. If I was Sutton, I would have just called Richard... but Oliver basically said her job/future career was secure and she should go -  she is still fairly young so she went for it. 

RE: Jane - the two hot men falling at her feet to solve her egg-freezing problem is totally unrealistic. Her choosing Pinstripe (which will happen) is very realistic to me, and a choice I think is right for someone in their mid-twenties.

(“ducks”)

That's the main reason I love this board; seeing people's different takes/opinions on the same show. :D

[Guest]

20 hours ago, CurlyATX said:

A few years ago I binge watched a few episodes of "Girls" and the entire time was scratching my head why these girls acted so dumb.  It made me wonder if I was this stupid in my 20s.  Season One, I really liked this show, especially with the interracial dating.  Now, it feels so clichéd.  I just want more Alex, Ben and Oliver (maybe they can meet in the closet).  

I didn't notice it, but I see that all the disposable lovers are POC... now I feel sad.  

I mean, if recent TV is any indication, being in your 20s in the 2010s consists of day drinking, high school drama with your friends, and having dudes prematurely ejaculate and ruin your sex. As a 26-year-old, that's not my life at all, especially not post-college. I guess it's supposed to be a commentary on sucking at adulting, but even that world feels infantile, so it bugs me to see 30-year-olds using it. Granted I don't have a normal life at all for my age bracket because I have a significant disability that makes people perceive me as a perma-child, but still, the weird age compression thing we're seeing where everyone 30 and under acts 18 is...odd.

I would absolutely watch an all-male spin-off. Isn't it depressing when racism creeps in re: desirability even subconsciously in an otherwise super progressive writers' room? Even on a show with an interracial, interfaith lesbian/bi relationship at the forefront, white dudes still win out! Relegating Alex to the newly asexual black best friend is especially curious - I watched a YouTube interview with a (former) writer who wrote last season's finale and she said that she specifically wanted to write meatier material for Kat because she was frustrated with how Aisha Dee was only the sounding board for the white characters in her previous role on Chasing Life - ironically, exactly what happened to Alex in S2.  

[dubbel zout]

16 minutes ago, julia1130 said:

Also, at 25-26 y/o she likely has money in savings for travel

She doesn't. Kat and Sutton contributed miles so that Jane could get to Paris.

Not that money is dealt with all that realistically to begin with, but it's been pretty well established that Kat is the only one with any sort of financial cushion, i.e., her parents can bail her out if necessary.

[CurlyATX]

2 hours ago, SnarkEnthusiast said:

I would absolutely watch an all-male spin-off. Isn't it depressing when racism creeps in re: desirability even subconsciously in an otherwise super progressive writers' room? Even on a show with an interracial, interfaith lesbian/bi relationship at the forefront, white dudes still win out! Relegating Alex to the newly asexual black best friend is especially curious

So well put!  I wasn't able to articulate WHY this bothered me so much.  It makes me feel like years ago, I'd never see anyone on TV who looked like me.  Now, we have more POC on tv but the role is either "funny/smart best friend" or "sounding board" or "temporary love interest that makes you go back to the white OTP".  You're right about how much has been missed by the lesbian/interfaith/multiracial relationship with Kat and Adena.  They started hinting at it, but now it's just "Kat's so sexy and attracts all the lesbians".  I'm going to have to snoop around to find those interviews. 

[Guest]

3 hours ago, CurlyATX said:

So well put!  I wasn't able to articulate WHY this bothered me so much.  It makes me feel like years ago, I'd never see anyone on TV who looked like me.  Now, we have more POC on tv but the role is either "funny/smart best friend" or "sounding board" or "temporary love interest that makes you go back to the white OTP".  You're right about how much has been missed by the lesbian/interfaith/multiracial relationship with Kat and Adena.  They started hinting at it, but now it's just "Kat's so sexy and attracts all the lesbians".  I'm going to have to snoop around to find those interviews. 

Thank you! Yeah it's a downer at best. You mean the interview with the writer? It's "Drunk Lesbians Watch The Bold Type" on Youtube lol (it's about 5% insight and 95% gay fangirling)

[KaveDweller]

6 hours ago, julia1130 said:

RE: Jane’s trip to Paris - I always thought that Jane’s job more/less allowed her write from anywhere. She could have said she was thinking about writing about Paris FW. Also, at 25-26 y/o she likely has money in savings for travel - as there are costs in addition to the fight and hotel.

Except we had several episodes this season with Jane talking about not knowing how she was going to pay her rent, not being able to afford to buy food at the restaurant she was hanging out in all day, and all sorts of other financial concerns. That doesn't sound like someone  who has savings for travel.

I agree, it seems like she could write from anywhere, but it seems like the other writers on staff are in the office regularly.

[Moxie Cat]

9 hours ago, julia1130 said:

Her choosing Pinstripe (which will happen) is very realistic to me

I completely agree, plus there was an interview on EW with an EP or showrunner who stated that they were very excited to see where Jane's relationship goes next year. That doesn't sound like Ben to me - we've seen where that relationship went. Pinstripe, for all his flaws, is far more of an equal maturity level to Jane too.

That said, when Kat asked Jane who she would want to tell good news to first, I thought, what a dumb question - because it's not either guy, it's obviously Kat and/or Sutton - which is a whole other problem IRT two guys who you theoretically want to be your significant other!