S04.E14: Subject 9

[Trini]

Quote

Barry meets a powerful woman whose abilities could help him in his battle with DeVoe (guest star Sugar Lyn Beard). Meanwhile, after learning that DeVoe is targeting everyone who was on the bus, Ralph (Hartley Sawyer) decides he doesn't want to be a hero anymore, his only concern is staying alive. Harry offers to help Joe.

Ralph Hemecker directed the episode written by Mike Alber & Gabe Snyder

[Trini]

Producer preview:

[Primal Slayer]

For the most part it was a enjoyable episode. 

I was very impressed with the beginning. I didn't think for a second that they would deal with speculation that DeVoe was a fake and not trusting Barry so it is great that they went this route!

When we were first introduced to country girl I was all so she doesn't scream but another aspect of the sonic scream lol. Though somehow it always looks better anywhere then Arrow. But then they showed that she can "scream" if she wanted which just made go UGH! I know this must be a very cheap special effect but just stop introducing new people who all have the same offshoot of it.

If they got rid of Cisco being clairvoyant I would be so happy.

You know...Iris could've been doing all of this investigative journalism if Ralph weren't around.

The fight against DeVoe pissed me off because it was one of those scenes where they say "screw common sense" and they just had country girl stand there as DeVoe took over her body. She didn't need a violin to use her powers. She knew this. Barry knew this. Ralph knew this. But everyone conveniently forgot in that scene.

The Wells/Cecile storyline was interesting? It is good to get 2 characters who barely interact, interacting together but just so weird. But how can you give a character telepathy and then be boring by not allowing us to hear the thoughts? That's the funny part of telepathy! 

In his limited amount of time on The Flash, Ralph has already gotten a well rounded storyline. He already had a brief love interest in country girl. He started off as a slag, learned how to be a superhero, gained confidence. If only  they would do the same for Iris and Caitlin and to an extent Wells. 

[mtlchick]

"You nasty."  Hee.  

 

It wasn't a bad episode.  I am starting to tolerate Ralph!  

[Jediknight]

I thought this was supposed to be a fun season.

Can they win against DeVoe, please?  At least let them save one bus meta.

[cambridgeguy]

The violin (was that the same prop Zari used last week?) was dumb - sure, we've seen you use your powers without it but never mind, let's train you to only be able to do it when you're holding a fragile musical instrument.

I had hoped they learned their lesson about Barry doing his best impression of Oliver in obsessive jerk mode.  I also thought we were supposed to get a lighter season - does killing off a successive string of guest stars beat having to repeatedly see Iris get skewered?  Of course Barry instantly taking off his mask was pretty funny, as is the fact that they're still trying to pretend his employment matters.  Iris doesn't seem to have a regular job either so just live off the same income that Caitlin and Cisco are using to pay the bills.

[Primal Slayer]

2 minutes ago, cambridgeguy said:

The violin (was that the same prop Zari used last week?) was dumb - sure, we've seen you use your powers without it but never mind, let's train you to only be able to do it when you're holding a fragile musical instrument.

That part didn't bother me that much. It helped her focus her powers and a good way to take baby steps with it. 

[tennisgurl]

DeVoe is such a piece of garbage, this guy needs to get his ass kicked. I was hoping that maybe the bus metas he killed could be saved, but now that their bodies are apparently deteriorating, it looks like thats less likely. This was a pretty good episode, but wasn't this supposed to be a lighter season? Because watching person after person murdered and used by a meat puppet by a psychopath (with Ralph probably going to become another victim soon) while Barry failing over and over, isn't my idea of lighter. 

I liked Izzy, and she and Ralph had nice chemistry together. Plus, I am a sucker for a fiddle. I was hoping that she would reveal at the end that Izzy was just her stage name, and her real name was Sue. I have definitely warmed up to Ralph, even though I still think he gets too much focus. Cisco's horror at his tacky apartment, and him commenting on the inspirational speeches people on Team Flash always give (do you guys draw straws?) were really funny, and I felt really bad for him when Izzy was taken over. They've found a better balance between him being skeevy and him being a good guy at hart. 

Cecil and Harry bonding was nice. I like Cecil when she isn't being the worst lawyer in the Arrowverse. Which is pretty impressive, considering her competition. 

"You nasty"

[jmonique]

28 minutes ago, Jediknight said:

I thought this was supposed to be a fun season.

Can they win against DeVoe, please?  At least let them save one bus meta.

The Flarrowverse writers don't seem to know how to balance out a season. I used to love this show, but I can't take the constant losses against the omnipotent villains. It's no fun.

Plus, every single person playing DeVoe is just awful.

[kirinan]

16 minutes ago, jmonique said:

The Flarrowverse writers don't seem to know how to balance out a season. I used to love this show, but I can't take the constant losses against the omnipotent villains. It's no fun.

I'm finding that now with Damien Darkh on Legends of Tomorrow. He ALWAYS wins. I compared it to Sylar on Heroes in my post on that thread today; I stopped watching Heroes after the first season because I hated that the good guys never won. You've gotta have some hope to stick with a story, IMO. Unrelenting darkness and loss is not a good way to win over viewers. Again, IMO.

I wish they could find a way to save Izzy. I liked her, and I really liked the way things were going with her and Ralph. And of course, find a way to get rid of DeVoe, who I've hated since his first appearance. I think somehow his wife will turn against him (no spoiler; just a guess) and that will enable them to defeat him.

And I agree with everyone who wonders what happened to the so-called lighter season. These producers have a very odd definition of the word "light." 

Edited February 28, 2018 by kirinan

[WindofChange]

1 minute ago, kirinan said:

And I agree with everyone who wonders what happened to the so-called lighter season. These producers have a very odd definition of the word "light." 

The problem is if you're going for a 'light' season then you can't have the main baddie killing people left and right the way they're doing it now. Not only does the killing cancel out the 'light' but the killing loses its sense of severity with the 'lightness' which undermines the whole story. 

[Primal Slayer]

19 minutes ago, jmonique said:

The Flarrowverse writers don't seem to know how to balance out a season. I used to love this show, but I can't take the constant losses against the omnipotent villains. It's no fun.

Plus, every single person playing DeVoe is just awful.

S4 of Arrow was suppose to be lighter if I remember correctly and then they killed someone off, put someone in a wheelchair, kidnapped a child lol. 

[UNOSEZ]

I guess I'm in the minority cuz I couldn't stand izzy.. I was actually relieved when I thought she was just gonna be killed for her powers.. But then she just switched bodies... Hopefully devoe as izzy isn't as annoying... Other than that.. Meh episode... Shame how they've given Ralph so much screentime and story.. But couldn't do that for wally or caitlin... 

[ottoDbusdriver]

1 hour ago, Primal Slayer said:

The fight against DeVoe pissed me off because it was one of those scenes where they say "screw common sense" and they just had country girl stand there as DeVoe took over her body. She didn't need a violin to use her powers. She knew this. Barry knew this. Ralph knew this. But everyone conveniently forgot in that scene.

1 hour ago, cambridgeguy said:

The violin (was that the same prop Zari used last week?) was dumb - sure, we've seen you use your powers without it but never mind, let's train you to only be able to do it when you're holding a fragile musical instrument.

 

The violin really was dumb.  Like really, really dumb.  Was the violin also exposed to dark matter on the bus and could somehow focus sound waves as a weapon ?  No, because it's a violin.

Izzie acted as if she lost her powers when the violin strings broke, and then just stood there dumbfounded.  Come on.

Ralph knew Izzie for what, a day, may be two, but she's supposed to be his lost love.  Give me a break.

DeVoe continues to amass all the powers a la Sylar from Heroes -- and in the process becomes a less and less interesting villain in the process.

[thuganomics85]

So, Barry is out of prison and gets a warm welcoming in the form of no longer having a job!  Actually, I'm kind of surprised the show even acknowledge that there would be those who suspect something fishy is going on due to the metahuman element, but that still kind of sucks for Barry.

Izzy was decent and the actress did pretty good for what I'm pretty sure was her first television role, even if her accent was clearly one of those typical exaggerated "what Canadians all think southerns sound like" types, and she and Ralph were entertaining enough, but considering that they only just met in this episode, its hard to really get invested enough about her death/Devoe taking her over and how it effects Ralph.  While there is a spark there, Ralph is already acting like she was the love of his life or something.  Just feels like a cheap way remind everyone how evil Devoe is and that has clearly already been established.

The Harry/Cecile stuff was kind of random, but it was fun at least.  No Joe at all though, so I guess Jesse L. Martin had the week off?

As much as I'm enjoying Hartley Sawyer, it really feels like the Ralph character has suddenly become more significant and important to the stories than Iris, Caitlin, and even Cisco.  Are the writers just stuck in a rut when it comes to everyone but Barry?

I think it's pretty clear that when TPTB meant this season would be "lighter", they really meant "Oh, sure, we'll still have plenty of deaths, tragedies, and the heroes getting their asses handed to them each week, but there will be more jokes this time!" 

[ruby24]

The way they're building up Ralph so much, I KNOW that he will be inhabited by Devoe last so that he can get his old face back, and everyone will think Ralph is dead for the last five or six episodes or something. Then Ralph will somehow come back because he'll be able to survive inside DeVoe due to his powers.

[Maverick]

 I was just glad the episode description was wrong and we didn't get another round of Ralph not wanting to be a hero.  Not did he not try to run, but he gave the 'weekly inspirational speech'.  

 Other PLOT and STALLING and STALLING THE PLOT I don't know why Devoe didn't grab Ralph too.  But then again, I don't understand why the original plan was to have all of the bus metas in Iron Heights (and how was that going to work with Ralph?) before zapping them.  If he can use his flying chair he stole from The Voice to pop out of his pocket universe anywhere and use his Flash energy prison to hold them, then why did he collect all the powers within 15 minutes of them being created?  Speaking of pocket universes, Iris girl if you're going to hang with the nerds you're gonna have to watch some Star Trek.

[bettername2come]

Is this the first ep Joe's missed? I think they played it well. It was fun to see Cecile with Harry, and I was amused/confused that he kept referring to her by full name and title. I liked Izzy, accent aside, and liked the subtle pun of having a fiddlers last name start with "bow." Her song was better than you typically get for "this song was created for a one-off character on a show that's never done country music." She and Ralph were kind of cute. He kind of won me over telling her to look at him. I wish there were a way to get her back. Devoe has never seemed more evil to me than when he took over Izzy's body and then walked away taunting Ralph about getting back to his wife.

[UNOSEZ]

I guess with the success of black panther and black lightning... The head honchos of the flash caved and let Candice Patton have a 2 second blk girl moment with that "you nasty". 

[tennisgurl]

Honestly, why does Barry even have a secret identity at this point? He tells pretty much everyone he meets anyway!

[statsgirl]

If Ralph gets taken by Devoe and never comes back, it will redeem the season.  They're doing a wonderful job of writing for Ralph, comes on as a jerk, gradually gets redeemed as you feel more sympathy for him, then his heart is broken as Devoe takes over the love of  his life that he's known for a few days? hours? How will he get through this?

Good writing, guys. Now if you could only do the same for characters I've been waited for four years to get equal development, Caitlin, Iris and poor Wally.  They shouldn't need another meta on the team when they had the under-used Wally and a ton of unmined storyline for Caitlin.

Overall one of the better episodes.  I liked Cecile playing off of Harry and I liked Izzie although at this point it looks like they're auditioning for the role of who gets to stay the season's Big Bad. I'm also tired of the constant "Barry tries too hard/fails/needs a pep talk". They've got to get a new schtick other than Barry's flat learning curve.

I had to miss a part of the episode.  Did they say whether Iris is still pulling a salary now that Barry doesn't have a job?

[Lantern7]

In brief:

Singh: Allen, you're suspended. Besides, that means you can spend all your time as the Flash. Which I do not know about.

Thinker: Just going to scheme, come close to girl-on-girl with the missus, and showcase another actor doing a South African accent.

Izzy: Well, we done had a Shade, we got a Thinker, now we got us a Fidd-

Cisco: NO. MY JOB.

Ralph: Time for me to show more character evolution and a bit of warmth.

Caitlin: Speaking of warmth . . . no Killer Frost this week. Yay!

Barry: *takes off mask*

Viewers: *roll eyes*

Barry: Basically, I'm gonna be a driving asshole about this, because I really want to take DeVoe out. And that was before he framed me for murder.

Cecile: I still have mind-reading powers, and DeVoe will more than likely take over my body. After the baby, of course.

Harry: I'm here this week because my daughter doesn't need me, and I have to make friends . . . that are my age! Oh, and my breakthrough with Cecile leads me to something that will stop DeVoe! It will work!

DeVoe: Unless I have Kilg%re's powers.

Harry: Unless she has Kil- . . . well, I'm going to hang myself now.

DeVoe: And you thought Damien Dark was an insufferable prig. At least he has charisma.

Ralph: Izzy, look at me! I love you! I'm not really saying that, but we have a bond, and I want to be here when you di-

DeVoe: TTTTTTAAAARRRRRRNATION!!!! Oh, bugger. I am a hotter female, but it's going to be difficult to lose this accent.

Cisco: Maybe we should use "Mega Man" instead of "Thinker." Y'know, because she kills people and steals thei-

Team Flash: *death glare*

Cisco: Hey, I have a potential way to track DeVoe!

Barry: Ralph, I'm sorry that I basically worked Izzy so hard, and basically served her up to DeVoe on the cleanest silver platter. I think she would've been slightly safer if we left her alone.

Ralph: Hey, we're Team Flash. And you're going to be my unofficial partner because you're no longer employed. Not that you really had a day job to begin with.

Barry: FUCK! I can't do the opening narration anymore!

Ralph: Like you've been doing that lately?

Barry: Good point.

Edited February 28, 2018 by Lantern7

[Jediknight]

3 hours ago, kirinan said:

I'm finding that now with Damien Darkh on Legends of Tomorrow. He ALWAYS wins.

At least with Darhk, Legends is still balls to the wall insanity and fun, and McDonough is having a blast chewing the scenery.

[Trini]

First off; this episode was kind of a marketing fail? It didn't match the description, or the tone of the promo. The subplot was with Harry and Cecile - not Joe, who wasn't there at all, which I'm pretty sure is a first. The blurb about Ralph was the opposite.

I think this was actually a lot better than I thought it was going to be going in, despite DeVoe winning yet again, but more on that later.

Edited February 28, 2018 by Trini

[twoods]

Poor Izzy. I really liked her and wanted Team Flash to win once against Devoe. I also wanted Ralph to finally get a love interest, so bummed that won’t happen. 

Devoe’s wife can’t hide her hesitation towards him because of Dominic’s telepathic powers, so either she’s back on his team again or she’s hiding it pretty well. I wonder if she will be the one to bring him down. 

Cecile and Harry were refreshing. I still love this show because of the characters, and it was nice to see Harry frustrated and  insecure while Cecile was there to support him.

Edited February 28, 2018 by twoods

[Acceleration]

2 hours ago, ruby24 said:

The way they're building up Ralph so much, I KNOW that he will be inhabited by Devoe last so that he can get his old face back, and everyone will think Ralph is dead for the last five or six episodes or something. Then Ralph will somehow come back because he'll be able to survive inside DeVoe due to his powers.

Urgh. 

This is probably What’s gonna happen, which is why the reminded us that Ralph is one of the bus metas. 

These writers truly do suck. They have so many compelling original characters but can’t seem to be able to write for them so they move on to their next plaything and Also seem to think that this version of Ralph is charming or deserving of all this propping. 

[cambridgeguy]

I think Devoe is saving Ralph for last because Ralph's body won't deteriorate like the others.  So collect all of the other powers first, then make the final transfer into Ralph and walk off without needing to worry about dying within a few days.  This doesn't explain why Devoe doesn't snatch him and keep him locked up but maybe he's cocky enough to think it won't make a difference.  It certainly hasn't mattered so far so maybe the confidence is justified.

[DearEvette]

Episodes like this are why a 22-24 episode season are not a good thing sometimes.  It is just a lather, rinse, repeat.  Team Flash figures out what they need to to thwart DeVoe, they rush headlong into doing stuff without any really planning, and he hands them their asses.  I think this was the weakest episode of the season.  I didn't care at all for Izzy or her lightning fast relationship feels with Ralph.  

The Becky Sharp actress was great as Becky.  As the villainous DeVoe she is laughable.  She just doesn't have the gravitas or the voice to carry off menacing.

Also why is Team Flash so smart but so dumb?  How do they not know DeVoe has access to the powers of the people he possess?  They should know that because of Dominic.  Why didn't they cop to the fact that because he had that tech guy's power that he could short out or cause a virus to mess up the cranial inhibitor thingy?

So Jesse L. Martin had the day off.  But it had the nice effect of having Harry and Cecile interact and that was great.  The actress does have some nice comic timing.  And I loved how he always called her 'DA Cecile Horton.'

It feels like after such a strong start of the season, they are beginning to lose control of the story.  It always happens around this time which is why I think a slightly smaller episode order might help them write more tightly.  There is a plan, I can tell, but it is being needlessly spun out.

[benteen]

6 hours ago, Trini said:

First off; this episode was kind of a marketing fail? It didn't match the description, or the tone of the promo. The subplot was with Harry and Cecile - not Joe, who wasn't there at all, which I'm pretty sure is a first. The blurb about Ralph was the opposite.

I think this was actually a lot better than I thought it was going to be going in, despite DeVoe winning yet again, but more on that later.

 

Yeah, definitely a marketing fail.  I was relieved this wasn't another plot where Ralph didn't want to be a hero.

That being said, I thought this episode was not very good.  Izzy surprised me when she managed to get that inhibitor on Devoe's head.  But as soon as Devoe destroyed it, Izzy lost all intelligence.  You are about two inches from Devoe...SONIC SCREAM HIM IN THE FACE!  Good lord, she should have been able to take Devoe down in a second.  But instead, she decides to just stand around doing nothing as Devoe takes ten hours to gloat to Barry and Ralph.  Then Izzy decides to run instead of doing anything with her powers.

Barry being an obsessive jerk again...what a shock.

I like the actress being Becky but she was TERRIBLE as Devoe.

The Harry/Cecile storyline was awful, with Cecile being annoying as hell and Harry being devolved by the writers into someone who can't even hold a conversation with anybody.  Seriously, TC is great but I have no idea what they're doing with him here.  Harry is about one step above a grunting caveman at this point.

On the plus side, I liked he last scene with Ralph and the idea of Barry joining him as a detective.

The people of Star City wondering if Devoe has really come back to life?  Wow, they are actually smarter than I thought so bonus points there.

Edited February 28, 2018 by benteen

[Bats27]

 I see that the show is continuing the trend from Season 2 and 3 of starting out with a potentially cool/interesting villain, only to make them less so as time goes on.  Because I'm getting less and less interested in DeVoe by the episode.

Also I thought that this season was supposed to be "lighter" and more "fun" than the last two?  Because if anything, it's MORE dark and depressing.

It's amazing how they continue to underuse Caitlin so much, even with Killer Frost now being on the good side (mostly).

 

And we're also continuing the trend of "make your villain so god-tier powerful and punk out the heroes every time, and then pull a lame/unconvincing Deus ex Machina plot point out of your butt at the last minute to finally win."  Stop doing that shows (all of you, not just this one).

[RedVitC]

I enjoyed the episode. Some quick points

-To me 'light' doesn't mean nothing bad happens (especially if they're comparing it to season 1 which had some very dark themes and events despite the general lighter tone), but that despite bad things happening not every scene is super serious. So for me this absolutely feels like a lighter season.

-They just had a win against Devoe with getting Barry out of jail, which according to Marlizes reaction first in court and then when she was talking to Devoe was definitely not part of his plan. So I didn't mind them not winning the day in that sense, even though I liked Izzy. They could have built up the Ralph and Izzy relationship a little more over several episodes if they wanted to give him a more personal stake in the fight. Not that I didn't believe it, and I can see it making him more determined to fight Devoe, but they were playing it slightly heavy on the love angle even though they'd just met.

-I was expecting a Harry and Joe plot, but I wasn't disappointed by the Harry and Cecile plot. + tie in to the main plot

-The Barry and Iris scenes were really, really nice. These types of scenes work really well for them. Sweet and intimate. (but they should have been working on and told everyone about that cerebral inhibitor from the moment they heard the name Devoe)

-I don't think Barry was being a jerk, or let me rephrase that, I think his desire to push through and save Izzy to this extreme was understandable. I was surprised and glad they didn't just gloss over the emotional effect it must have had seeing the other bus metas die before his eyes. Barry has actually grown a lot this season and he's been quite wise and giving out advice to a lot of people, but they can't and shouldn't make him just immediately emotionally ok with everything. So for me it was nice to see his mini arc this episode.

Edited February 28, 2018 by RedVitC

[Primal Slayer]

9 hours ago, UNOSEZ said:

I guess with the success of black panther and black lightning... The head honchos of the flash caved and let Candice Patton have a 2 second blk girl moment with that "you nasty". 

This episode was produced before those became hits/we're released.

[GHScorpiosRule]

Horrid episode. Or maybe I'm just tired of all the villains winning all the damn fucking time with no wins for the heroes, be it on this show, Arrow or Legends. I'm just fucking sick of it.

One would think that Barry had been charged with and convicted of killing a COP, the way all the cops at CCPD were giving him a wide berth, the cut direct and being less than thrilled to see him back. Instead of a megalomaniacal asshole. And Barry's endearing and charming smile was back on his face too, as he entered the station. Everyone but Singh can just FUCK OFF. I don't CARE that DeVoe's original body is gone; he is still alive. And if the stupid mayor and the people aren't sure because, METAS! Then those same idiots should have been skeptical about the murder charge, because METAS! Can't have it both ways.

I was less than impressed with Izzie and the actress's accent were just nails on a chalkboard for me. Is that her natural accent? And that song of hers they kept playing? Reminded me of Carrie Underwood's "When He Cheats." Just some of the...melody?

I will sit at my table for one happily, and say I didn't think Barry was being an obsessive asshole. I'm going to cut him some slack for thinking that he needed to push Izzie/train Izzie because she was able to hurt DeVoe. And I have to disagree with whoever stated up thread, that she would have been okay if not for Barry's interference. No, DeVoe had already found her and would have killed her, as we saw DeVoe as Becky watch her on their screen, and how DeVoe needed Izzie's body, because Becky's was falling apart.

The scenes with Cecile and Harry were just ridiculous and I feel bad for Cavanaugh.  What has this show done to this character? He wasn't the stuttering, ragey fool back in season two. And I must have missed something, because why does Jessie "hate him" again?

And yeah, Izzie was an idiot for just standing there and letting DeVoe take over her body and kill her.

[marketdoctor]

Quote

I was less than impressed with Izzie and the actress's accent were just nails on a chalkboard for me.

I liked her singing (the song they mostly used, "Something Bad's About to Happen", was a Carrie Underwood/Miranda Lambert duet.)  I didn't like her accent either, in part because she was trying to sound like what she thought southern people should sound like, rather than what a real accent is.  (Accents are tricky, and there a lot of country singers that sound American or Canadian, or in the case of Keith Urban, Australian, and that comes off as much more authentic.)

I was hoping Izzie's accent would go away when DeVoe took over.  Or that she'd sound blast her way out of it. 

 

I liked how the cops weren't all trusting of Barry, but sad about the leave of absence.

[GHScorpiosRule]

36 minutes ago, marketdoctor said:

I liked her singing (the song they mostly used, "Something Bad's About to Happen", was a Carrie Underwood/Miranda Lambert duet.)

Aha! So no wonder it sorta sounded familiar!

 

36 minutes ago, marketdoctor said:

I liked how the cops weren't all trusting of Barry

I didn't. Like I stated above, they were acting as if Barry had been charged with killing one of their own. And why distrust him? He's worked with them for years, before he was the Flash, and perpetually tardy CSI, but he was respected and good at what he did. He was known to be honest. These cops knew him; knew his character, so to act like he was some kind of leper or murderer, not only didn't sit well with me, but I just rolled my eyes. 

Of course, if they'd done a better job at his "trial" and had more than just Singh testify about him, maybe he wouldn't have been convicted. Oh, wait. Yes he would, because PLOT!

[benteen]

Agreed.  They did act like Barry had killed one of their own.

[marketdoctor]

Quote

I didn't. Like I stated above, they were acting as if Barry had been charged with killing one of their own.

This was at least partially a direction fail.  If I were the cops who burst in seeing Barry standing over possibly-dead DeVoe with a knife, I'd be very skeptical.  If I were someone who put a bad guy behind bars from evidence he provided, I'd be supportive.  If I were both, I'd look confused instead of resentful.  It didn't bother me that there was some friction and doubt--but I see your point as well, some loyalty would have been more appropriate.

You could get to the same place by having BARRY decide to take leave, rather than bring any more skepticism on the Department.  That would have also helped the members of the department who know he's The Flash* know he's tracking down the real killer, and didn't escape when he could have.

 

*  All but three.

[Bats27]

Yeah how poorly the whole frame-up/trial plotline was handled REALLY undercuts things here as well.  I agree with that.

[VCRTracking]

3 hours ago, marketdoctor said:

I liked how the cops weren't all trusting of Barry, but sad about the leave of absence.

Me too. I liked that everything wasn't smooth sailing after Barry was freed. Barry's also not a cop so he isn't part of the "brotherhood".

I liked Izzy. Maybe it's those years of watching Mama's Family reruns, but the exaggerated Southern accent never bugged me. It is weird Devoe still spoke with it when he took over her body, but I guess it explains why when he was in Becky's he spoke in a more effeminate lilt.

This is mean, especially since I'm not a tall guy but all the short comments made by Izzy about Becky-as-Devoe were amusing to me.

Ralph is probably going to end up with Sue in the future so I knew him and Izzy weren't happening but it was till sad to see him watch her be killed essentially. I also understand Ralph being upset. Yeah, he didn't know her that long but he still liked her and from what we've seen he hasn't had a great social life.

Loved Cecile and Harry's storyline. She's become very enjoyable and her dealing with Harry's grumpiness was fun.

I think they've made Barry and Iris a believable as a married couple. Yeah it started off weird with them growing up together like siblings and him pining away for her while he was with Eddie but she's become a great support for him.

Edited February 28, 2018 by VCRTracking

[GHScorpiosRule]

53 minutes ago, VCRTracking said:

I liked that everything wasn't smooth sailing after Barry was freed. Barry's also not a cop so he isn't part of the "brotherhood".

He may not have been a cop, but he worked with them; provided the evidence they needed to put the bad guys away. He wasn't like Ralph, who planted evidence or was dirty. So I can't say I agree with this. Maybe if he was a new guy and this happened shortly after he started. 

I'll just sit at my table for one.

[VCRTracking]

20 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

He may not have been a cop, but he worked with them; provided the evidence they needed to put the bad guys away. He wasn't like Ralph, who planted evidence or was dirty. So I can't say I agree with this. Maybe if he was a new guy and this happened shortly after he started. 

I'll just sit at my table for one.

They probably took Ralph's side. I remember on the old Flash show Barry was derided for being in a lab while the cops did the "real work" on the streets.

[GHScorpiosRule]

1 minute ago, VCRTracking said:

They probably took Ralph's side. I remember on the old Flash show Barry was derided for being in a lab while the cops did the "real work" on the streets.

But Barry on this show has never been looked down on or treated this way. On the contrary, it's been the opposite. 

[VCRTracking]

3 minutes ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

But Barry on this show has never been looked down on or treated this way. On the contrary, it's been the opposite. 

I don't remember him interacting with any cop besides Joe or Eddie or Singh so that's why I believe the attitude.

[Trini]

14 hours ago, Trini said:

First off; this episode was kind of a marketing fail? It didn't match the description, or the tone of the promo. The subplot was with Harry and Cecile - not Joe, who wasn't there at all, which I'm pretty sure is a first. The blurb about Ralph was the opposite.

Thought about this some more -- maybe this was the first post-Kreisberg episode to get an overhaul? These things can be written months in advance. (Doesn't explain them not sending out an updated version, but still.)

[statsgirl]

1 hour ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

I'll just sit at my table for one.

Table for two.  He may not  have been on the front lines with the cops but they should have been very familiar with him because they would have been there guarding the crime scene as he did his job.  Also he's married to a cop's daughter so there's that connection.

[tennisgurl]

4 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

I'll just sit at my table for one.

Table for three please. Barry not only has worked with cops for years gathering evidence to put criminals behind bars, and has always shown them nothing but respect, but he is the adopted son of a respected detective, and married his daughter, and its clear that he wasn't in any way guilty of the murder. Barry deserved better from those guys. At least Singh was still sympathetic towards him. He even called him Barry for once, instead of Allen.

Honestly, I was just super glad that the blurb I read about the episode, that Ralph was going to freak out, again, about being a hero and need yet another pep talk, was wrong, and Ralph didn't backslide again when danger came a calling. Hell, he got to give the pep talk this week! You know, I am kind of in two minds about Ralph. On the one hand, I think he gets too much screen time, while other characters, like Wally, Iris, and Caitlin, have been kinda screwed over when it comes to development. It almost feels like its a backdoor pilot for another show that has gone a SUPER long time. But, on the other hand, unlike when, say, Arrow tries to push the newbies, to the detriment of established characters, I actually do like Ralph, and I think they've done a good job developing his character, and I find him to be genuinely likable these days. I think he adds an interesting dynamic to the group, and I think the actor has consistently done a great job. So, maybe it kind of splits down the middle for me. 

[diebartdie]

On 2/27/2018 at 9:46 PM, kirinan said:

I think somehow his wife will turn against him [Devoe] (no spoiler; just a guess) and that will enable them to defeat him.

I get a very strong vibe from her that she is very heterosexual so is really not loving the fact that her husband has changed his gender? She's not into it at all.

[Trini]

I always like seeing Captain Singh; and I'm glad the actor has been able to make several appearances this season. I liked seeing the CCPD set again - which has been MIA for a while, but I guessing it's not going to be seen as much with Barry on 'indefinite leave' now. (Can we get Julian to come back to fill his position? Please?) I don't know why they don't make more use of CCPD and Barry and Joe's actual jobs when it's a natural fit with Team Flash's crimefighting. Everything at STAR Labs is already old.

Speaking of sets, I thought the West-Allen loft would finally be seen again now that Barry is out of prison. :(

But back to the episode, I'm glad there's some follow-up/consequences to the Trial mess, but Barry losing his job just seems like a lame way to have him at STAR Labs 90% of the time instead of the usual 75%.

So if the additional dark matter damages DeVoe's host, each new power from each body swap/power transfer should weaken him more and more, right? So the problem might take care of itself? But nah- they’ll either forget this detail, or throw in another complication later.

I just really hate this whole body-swapping thing. It seems like we’re going to have to see this same story play out with the remaining metas, and I was already over it when it happened to Dominic.

Other names for Becky!DeVoe: ‘3-foot tall chick', 'little girl', 'pint-sized lunatic', 'evil chipmunk', ‘blondie’.

Nitpick: DeVoe shouldn’t have been able to make Vibe’s gauntlets shoot ,since it’s not the gauntlets themselves that shoot, they just help him focus his power. Other Nitpick: Um, how is DeVoe able to thwart Cisco’s powers?? (I don’t really expect the show to answer that - SIGH) They’ve been sidelining Cisco and his powers all season. It’s annoying.

Well, they’ve worked long and hard to reform Ralph, and while I still think his screen time should be going to… anyone else, I did like him in this episode. I bought his connection to Izzy. I don’t think it was supposed to be seen as some big love story or anything like that; but I could see how he would be affected by her death. Especially when it happened right in front of him and he couldn’t do anything.

I liked Izzy — it’s rare that there’s a female metahuman that isn’t a villain, so even though I saw the death coming, I was still hoping they’d find a way to save her. And Iris got to have a little one-on-one scene with her, so that was nice.

At least Iris tried to stop Barry from revealing his identity! But I don’t think it was actually necessary for the plot. I think it would have worked if it was just Ralph (and Cisco) who revealed himself.

I hate when the show actually shows the solution to a problem, but doesn’t use it. In the last showdown with Izzy and DeVoe, as noted, Izzy could have still used her powers without the violin. But also, if they wanted her to be powerless in that scene DeVoe had that power-nullifying ray that he used in the previous episode. It’s another  directing/writing fail.

I hope that the cerebral inhibitor isn’t just a one and done thing, and that it does get used against DeVoe successfully. The Team needs more wins.

The side plot with Cecile and Harry was cute, Danielle Nicolet is great, and I’m glad their story eventually connected back to the A-plot. However, Harry is basically a parody of himself at this point.

Just about everyone has gotten shortchanged this season at some point, but I think Caitlin is getting the most of it.

I did appreciate the touches of humor in this episode; like them highlighting all the hallway talks! Plus a couple nice Barry/Iris moments. With just a look from Iris, Barry softened up on Cisco - hee! She continues to be the voice of reason.

[catrice2]

I thought this episode......never mind....why bother, the writers are not.

[Cthulhudrew]

Hey! Looks like Buzz McNab transferred to Central City! Does this mean we will get a Psych/Flash crossover sometime!?!?!?

(Pleeeeeeeeeeeeeease! lol)