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S09.E10: The Wedding

Tara Ariano

By Tara Ariano
in Will & Grace [V]

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SparklesBitch

SparklesBitch

I liked this one, but it left me wanting to give Will a giant hug, and I’m not even a hugger. I think the whole nitpicking thing makes sense for why the relationship supposedly broke up. Will’s a perfectionist, and he’s picking out of love, but it can totally get to be too much. I can relate because my ex did the same thing and it ultimately drove me crazy. 

But on a shallow note, awwww Vince!! I always liked him and loved him and Will together. 

The utter ridiculousness of Karen’s scavenger hunt with Ivanka Trump cracked me up, including the little digs at them she got in. 

The cop falling in love with Jack was so goofy, but it worked for me. 

My favorite jokes were Jack with the whole “is that guy standing like that because of his nightstick or his.....nightstick?” and Grace answering Will’s “what could go wrong in 2 minutes?” with “ask every girl who ever got pregnant at her prom.” Lol! 

  • Love 10
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mtlchick

mtlchick

I have to give it Megan for not breaking when the monkey was pushing his hands down on her boob. 

 

There was something about the timing and the editing that was really distracting me.  But Bobby Canavale makes it worth it. 

  • Love 2
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Annber03

Annber03

20 minutes ago, SparklesBitch said:

I liked this one, but it left me wanting to give Will a giant hug, and I’m not even a hugger. I think the whole nitpicking thing makes sense for why the relationship supposedly broke up. Will’s a perfectionist, and he’s picking out of love, but it can totally get to be too much. I can relate because my ex did the same thing and it ultimately drove me crazy. 

But on a shallow note, awwww Vince!! I always liked him and loved him and Will together. 

I wanted to give Will a hug, too. I also liked him and Vince together. That ending was bittersweet. 

But I did like that he was able to get proper closure on things, and he and Vince could part on good terms. And Vince and Ryan do look cute together, so there's that.

Jack's whole storyline cracked me up, as did the "toasts" everyone was giving later. 

  • Love 5
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Irlandesa

Irlandesa

The third episode in a row that I really liked.  I laughed out loud a few times in this one.

First, I don't know why Jack was at church but all the zingers surrounding church, including my favorite "old testicle" made me giggle. 

I liked that when we found out the reason that Vince and Will broke up that it was based on a very believable character trait that could lead to someone deciding that they had enough.  Will, Grace, Jack and Karen do this kind of thing all the time that it's their norm but it's not everyone's normal. 

I also thought Jack looked really good in this episode. 

  • Love 7
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SmithW6079

SmithW6079

I didn't care for this episode. Will was a dick, and the self-serving toasts were embarrassing.

I don't think I was watching the show by the time Will was dating Vince, so seeing him made no impact on me.

The little cop Jack hooked up with was adorable. I've seen him before, but my DVR cut out before I could find out the actor's name. Does anyone know? 

  • Love 1
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giovannif7

giovannif7

Will and Grace making someone else's wedding about themselves is standard for them, and it's very unappealing. Other than that, I loved this one. I was kinda hoping for a reappearance of Vince's (formerly) underaged nephew that both Grace and Karen made out with at Thanksgiving, but I'll take what I can get.

I couldn't tell - was the cop that said in his toast that he was forced to go to mandatory sensitivity training the same guy from the original police sensitivity training episode that had Will and Jack trading homophobic insults?

I loved that they threw in a nod to the original series ending with Vince and Will acknowledging to each other that they'll always think of themselves as ex-husbands.

  • Love 6
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Gothish520

Gothish520

Pretty solid episode all around. Vince was always a little too high-strung and insecure for my taste, but it was good to see him again, and it's good that Will got closure on their relationship. 

The toasts were funny, and Jack was hilarious as always. Karen's bit was great as well.

  • Love 3
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Snow Apple

Snow Apple

(edited)

This one made me sad. but I'm still going to think the original is real with Will and Vince happily married with their son Ben. This is just fanfiction or skits written by Jack for his new show, ha ha.

Edited by Snow Apple
  • Love 8
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Cherpumple

Cherpumple

7 hours ago, giovannif7 said:

I was kinda hoping for a reappearance of Vince's (formerly) underaged nephew that both Grace and Karen made out with at Thanksgiving, but I'll take what I can get.

Now that you've reminded me of that episode, I would have loved to see all of Vince's family back. They were all such fun!

Did I mishear, or did Will keep saying that he and Vince had been together for five years? And hadn't they only recently broken up at the start of these new episodes? I know they're ret-conning stuff, but that number doesn't make sense any way you slice it. 

  • Love 3
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janie jones

janie jones

11 hours ago, Tanichka said:

Grace needs a new hairdresser - her hair has a very bad color job, frizzy & over-processed.  And what was with that dress?  Could it BE more unflattering.

I was actually noticing that Grace looked like she had normal person hair.  Karen, on the other hand, I'm hating her hair pieces.  They're really sloppy-looking, and she used to be very put together.

  • Love 1
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Jillybean

Jillybean

This episode was just plain unfunny.  I hate the do-ver from the series finale. And it's just nearly impossible to buy these almost 50-y-o being roommates.

Wardrobe continues to loathe Debra Messing by placing her in the fugliest dress imaginable. I agree about her hair -- I was wondering what has happened to it. It looked fine at the Golden Globes, so why is she letting them tease it out into a mess?   I can't figure out if Grace's appearance is a hot mess by design, or what. She looks terrible for no reason. 

  • Love 7
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Tanichka

Tanichka

9 minutes ago, Jillybean said:

I can't figure out if Grace's appearance is a hot mess by design, or what. She looks terrible for no reason. 

I was wondering, too, it Grace is supposed to be unkempt after her divorce trauma.  I thought she looked good in a previous episode with Nick Offerman.  The black outfit was very flattering.  As for Karen - I try not to pay too much attention - she's so annoying.

Oh, yeah - Jack is staring to look really pathetic.

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BingeyKohan

BingeyKohan

Has there been a Grace-centric story yet? The only one I can really think of was when HC Jr made his return appearance. She's been a supporting player in the A or B stories of other cast members otherwise, it seems. I wonder why that is.

  • Love 2
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Gothish520

Gothish520

30 minutes ago, BingeyKohan said:

Has there been a Grace-centric story yet? The only one I can really think of was when HC Jr made his return appearance. She's been a supporting player in the A or B stories of other cast members otherwise, it seems. I wonder why that is.

I'm hoping for some good Grace plotlines. I'd like to see her start dating someone - Will too for that matter. I want more of the entire cast interacting as well. But overall I'm still loving the ride.

  • Love 6
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Gothish520

Gothish520

4 hours ago, Cherpumple said:

Now that you've reminded me of that episode, I would have loved to see all of Vince's family back. They were all such fun!

Did I mishear, or did Will keep saying that he and Vince had been together for five years? And hadn't they only recently broken up at the start of these new episodes? I know they're ret-conning stuff, but that number doesn't make sense any way you slice it. 

Will and Vince had broken up once and only got back together in the last season. Since a good portion of that season technically never happened, Will and Vince could've gotten back together at any time in the past 11 years. Same with Grace and Leo.

1 hour ago, Tanichka said:

I was wondering, too, it Grace is supposed to be unkempt after her divorce trauma.  I thought she looked good in a previous episode with Nick Offerman.  The black outfit was very flattering.  

I thought she looked great in the previous two episodes, but I wasn't crazy about her hair in this one. I love the color, but I prefer waves/curls to the blown-out look.

  • Love 1
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iMonrey

iMonrey

I really liked this episode. None of Season 9 has been great so far, compared to the earlier seasons, but some episodes - like this one - give me a warm, fuzzy feeling because they sort of tie up loose ends with guest stars from the original series. It was great seeing Vince again and Bobby Cannavale really nailed it, in terms of recreating that same character with all his foibles and insecurities. It felt very familiar. 

Naturally, there's the problem of continuity and just how much of Season 8 has been retconned, since Vince and Will ultimately wound up in a long-term commitment and had a child together per the Season 8 finale. But this felt organic to their relationship as well. 

It's too bad they couldn't have gotten some of the actors who played Vince's family in the Thanksgiving episode but there was a nice running gag about Vince's aunt versus his mother that suggested they were all off-camera somewhere.

Most of all, I absolutely loved the story with Jack hooking up with the closeted cop. (His "test" of asking what everyone's favorite TV show was cracked me up.) And all the self-serving toasts felt very much like Classic Will & Grace. Overall it was one of the best of Season 9. 

  • Love 6
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bichonblitz

bichonblitz

2 hours ago, Jillybean said:

This episode was just plain unfunny

I cringed all the way through it! Will's high pitched screeching and fast talking was too much for me and I usually love Will. Not liking what the writer's are doing to him. 

  • Love 2
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Madding crowd

Madding crowd

This reboot has been mostly a miss for me including this episode. There was nothing really for Karen or Grace to do and Karen seems more likely to shriek about a filthy animal than to walk around with a monkey on her designer dress. The Vince story was difficult since we have to believe a different story than was shown in order for it to work. I also thought Vince seemed old and tired, compared to Eric McCormack who always looks so good. I did like Jack's story with the policeman, but I wonder if we will ever see Jack actually be in love.

  • Love 8
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Jillybean

Jillybean

3 hours ago, Madding crowd said:

 I did like Jack's story with the policeman, but I wonder if we will ever see Jack actually be in love.

That would surprise me as he's essentially a man-baby written for laughs.  I know everyone loves Jack and Karen but I've never understood the affection for Karen. She's a complete caricature.

  • Love 3
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iMonrey

iMonrey

Quote

Yup, I totally agree. Ole' Bobby Cannavale is looking a little long in the tooth.  

Disagree. Doesn't look to me like he's aged a bit. Eric McCormack is the one who looks older IMO. 

  • Love 3
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festivus

festivus

I think they all look good. I'm an old fart myself though so...

Also, I liked Grace's dress. The episode: not so much. The only thing I really found funny was The Wire thing and then the toast that the older cop gave. 

  • Love 2
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SparklesBitch

SparklesBitch

2 hours ago, Jillybean said:

I know everyone loves Jack and Karen but I've never understood the affection for Karen. She's a complete caricature.

Speaking as someone who adores Karen, I think for me it’s because she started as a caricature and stayed that way. She was always over the top and sort of ridiculous, but with just enough heart in small moments (see her sadness over losing Rosario) that you can almost see why more “normal” people like Will and Grace would spend time around her. I think that if she had started out as a perfectly average joe kind of character, all endearing yet layered and complex and then she slowly became an over-the-top caricature, it would have driven me crazy (example: my girl Jackie on Roseanne). So, I enjoy Karen for what she is, an over the top hilarious caricature who says and does things that regularly make me laugh out loud. 

Also, I love me some fan fiction and there are some great stories out there that explore Karen more deeply.....I personally love the idea that her showy, loud, somewhat offensive at times, personality is largely an act. 

And lastly, I think Megan Mullally is pretty hilarious no matter what she does, so that may be influencing my opinion of Karen a bit. =) 

  • Love 17
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indeed

indeed

Didn't Vince make detective by the end of original run?...which I found hard to believe at the time.  So, no big deal they changed that if they did.  Just not sure if I'm remembering right.

The old cop looked familiar - not the one Vince and Will went to lunch with when Grace had just broken up with Leo and Will couldn't manage to get through the meal without it being all about Grace and his need to "help" her, but another one (from Vince's storyline) in the old show?  

Yeah, what was Jack doing in church?!

Glad to see Vince was still friendly with all of them and still working on his soap.  Now if they had just worked in a gloves joke....

I thought BC looked good.  Appropriately aged. EM looks maybe not so naturally aged.  Grace is...getting better.  

Karen was pretty much wasted, I mean, filler, IMO in this episode.  

  • Love 2
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DXD526

DXD526

Sort of a rough episode. So apparently Will is kind of an annoying dick as a boyfriend? Would explain why he's had so few of them over the years. A good looking guy in good shape and with a good job shouldn't have so much trouble finding companionship.

It was never explained why Jack was in church; it almost seemed like they had a few jokes for that, and just threw them in. It was funny, especially Grace telling him he's "gonna hate Leviticus!"

  • Love 3
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Fiero425

Fiero425

On ‎1‎/‎18‎/‎2018 at 10:44 PM, SmithW6079 said:

I didn't care for this episode. Will was a dick, and the self-serving toasts were embarrassing.

I don't think I was watching the show by the time Will was dating Vince, so seeing him made no impact on me.

The little cop Jack hooked up with was adorable. I've seen him before, but my DVR cut out before I could find out the actor's name. Does anyone know? 

I just watched; was pretty hot for diminutively challenged! I laughed for the 1st time at this episode! I love Vince and I figured Will ran him off! He treated him like a child! ;-)

  • Love 1
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Fiero425

Fiero425

3 hours ago, Blakeston said:

I found it hard to have much sympathy for Will in this episode. Taking someone aside at their wedding to ask them "Why can you commit to this person and not me?" is just...there are no words.

This is why I never really was a big fan, just watching periodically! All the characters are so self-absorbed it's hard to like them! In every situation it has to be about them; even at a funeral it's about their feelings or how they look! They're all caricatures of half-real people; esp. Karen and Jack! They're living in their own little world of reality! ;-)

  • Love 1
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Princess Lucky

Princess Lucky

On 19/1/2018 at 7:12 PM, iMonrey said:

I really liked this episode. None of Season 9 has been great so far, compared to the earlier seasons, but some episodes - like this one - give me a warm, fuzzy feeling because they sort of tie up loose ends with guest stars from the original series. It was great seeing Vince again and Bobby Cannavale really nailed it, in terms of recreating that same character with all his foibles and insecurities. It felt very familiar. 

Naturally, there's the problem of continuity and just how much of Season 8 has been retconned, since Vince and Will ultimately wound up in a long-term commitment and had a child together per the Season 8 finale. But this felt organic to their relationship as well. 

It's too bad they couldn't have gotten some of the actors who played Vince's family in the Thanksgiving episode but there was a nice running gag about Vince's aunt versus his mother that suggested they were all off-camera somewhere.

Most of all, I absolutely loved the story with Jack hooking up with the closeted cop. (His "test" of asking what everyone's favorite TV show was cracked me up.) And all the self-serving toasts felt very much like Classic Will & Grace. Overall it was one of the best of Season 9. 

I agree with all of this. This episode was a keeper for me. Bobby really "found" Vince effortlessly and Vince was also written perfectly in character (that whole "did I make detective?" bit especially cracked me up). And the toasts were 100% typical Will & Grace. I would have been shocked if they had been able to put their own feelings aside and actually say something nice and appropriate. Making it all about them is practically what they do. I do think there's a fine line between "this is a sitcom so the more extreme moments serve to create hilarity" and "these people are assholes" but W&G has never crossed that line for me, I still like all four of them and find them endearing.

On 19/1/2018 at 7:35 PM, Madding crowd said:

The Vince story was difficult since we have to believe a different story than was shown in order for it to work. I also thought Vince seemed old and tired, compared to Eric McCormack who always looks so good.

I agree, I couldn't tell if some of their lines were winks to the audience (like Vince talking about marriage and commitment with Will) or not, but it was kind of weird trying to figure out what we were supposed to "know" (despite Jack's best efforts to feed us some exposition about what was retconned early on). Still, both Vince and Will were written in a believable way, and it was all bittersweet without being too sad, so I liked it. And I agree on Bobby looking a little older, though still totally hot, of course. Apparently Eric has about 7 years on him, and easily looks 10 years younger, so yeah, their age difference also looked a little off compared to what I remembered, heh.

Also, Debra Messing has found her groove, which is good. I'm actually excited about the remaining episodes. The revival may not be amazing, but there's always something to enjoy even about the episodes I didn't particularly like. I just love having this show back.

  • Love 8
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iMonrey

iMonrey

Quote

Didn't Vince make detective by the end of original run?...which I found hard to believe at the time.  So, no big deal they changed that if they did.  Just not sure if I'm remembering right.

Yes - he was fired (for trying on gloves), and then he and Will broke up. Then later Will ran into him at a restaurant and it turned out Vince was working undercover, so I'm guessing he had to be a detective at that point, right? Or do regular beat cops work undercover?

Quote

 EM looks maybe not so naturally aged.  

Yeah - they've all had work done but something about Eric . . . doesn't look quite right to me.

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msrachelj

msrachelj

On 1/19/2018 at 12:46 PM, bichonblitz said:

Yup, I totally agree. Ole' Bobby Cannavale is looking a little long in the tooth.  

yeah. it sucks that people have to age or die. sarcasm. only saying that because i've been hearing and personally being exposed to it in real life. 

  • Love 2
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Fiero425

Fiero425

22 hours ago, ItsJessMe said:

My DVR cut off the last couple of lines of the episode.  The last I heard was Will saying Ryan must be really special if Vince could commit to him in just 9 months.  What happened after that?

It's been a couple weeks, but nothing much else happened! Will hugged him, then there was a noise heard! Vince went into COP mode, pulled his gun and started kicking in stall doors coming across Jack and the short cop in one! They ran out; end episode IIRC! ;-)

  • Love 2
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giovannif7

giovannif7

Quote

 

Will:  If you, of all people, can make a commitment after 9 months, Ryan must be pretty special.

Vince:  He is, and I know that. I think I just needed to hear you say it, so thanks.

Will:  Of course. Congratulations.

   (Will and Vince hug)

Vince:  You know, what we had was good....

Will (smiling):  Yeah, it was.

Vince:  and I know I didn't have the guts to make this marriage thing work with you, but for what it's worth, I'll always think of you as my ex-husband.

Will:  Me too.

 

---------------------

and that's where the sound in the stall caused Vince to go into cop mode, etc.

  • Love 1
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ljenkins782

ljenkins782

On 1/19/2018 at 12:12 PM, iMonrey said:

I really liked this episode. None of Season 9 has been great so far, compared to the earlier seasons, but some episodes - like this one - give me a warm, fuzzy feeling because they sort of tie up loose ends with guest stars from the original series. It was great seeing Vince again and Bobby Cannavale really nailed it, in terms of recreating that same character with all his foibles and insecurities. It felt very familiar. 

Most of all, I absolutely loved the story with Jack hooking up with the closeted cop. (His "test" of asking what everyone's favorite TV show was cracked me up.) And all the self-serving toasts felt very much like Classic Will & Grace. Overall it was one of the best of Season 9. 

I have such a soft spot for Bobby Cannavale and his very recognizable voice and Vince is a great character (I didn't watch too many of his episodes back in the original run, I'd mostly tapped out by then). He had a lot of great moments in this one "you always gotta go bitchy" "what am I a monster" but my favorite was definitely him blurting out that he dumped Will because Will didn't like him. Kind of a startling thing to hear, but it's probably true that Will didn't notice how much he was picking at him. That kind of thing can wear on you after awhile. 

Jack had some great moments too, like "all these uniforms are throwing off my 'dar" and "aren't you sweet, dear." 

Karen's plot was my least favorite, I'm finding that this reboot is weakest for me when they try too hard to shoehorn in references to current events. 

Quote

Has there been a Grace-centric story yet? The only one I can really think of was when HC Jr made his return appearance. She's been a supporting player in the A or B stories of other cast members otherwise, it seems. I wonder why that is.

My guess would be that Debra Messing was most reluctant to return and has been noticeably weaker than the rest of the cast. Even her voice is different, she's got a thicker NY accent than she used to and her line delivery is just so bad most of the time. 

I've been watching the old seasons in parallel with the new and there's a definite drop in the quality of her acting. 

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Fiero425

Fiero425

On ‎3‎/‎14‎/‎2018 at 3:52 PM, ljenkins782 said:

I have such a soft spot for Bobby Cannavale and his very recognizable voice and Vince is a great character (I didn't watch too many of his episodes back in the original run, I'd mostly tapped out by then). He had a lot of great moments in this one "you always gotta go bitchy" "what am I a monster" but my favorite was definitely him blurting out that he dumped Will because Will didn't like him. Kind of a startling thing to hear, but it's probably true that Will didn't notice how much he was picking at him. That kind of thing can wear on you after awhile. 

Jack had some great moments too, like "all these uniforms are throwing off my 'dar" and "aren't you sweet, dear." 

Karen's plot was my least favorite, I'm finding that this reboot is weakest for me when they try too hard to shoehorn in references to current events. 

My guess would be that Debra Messing was most reluctant to return and has been noticeably weaker than the rest of the cast. Even her voice is different, she's got a thicker NY accent than she used to and her line delivery is just so bad most of the time. 

I've been watching the old seasons in parallel with the new and there's a definite drop in the quality of her acting. 

Messing may have moved on to serious fare! I still remember her horrendous outing on "Law & Order: SVU!" Never was partial to Grace and had serious reason to dislike her character as a reporter who's sister was victimized by a serial killer! ;-)

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