S04.E10: The Trial of The Flash

[Trini]

Quote

BARRY FIGHTS FOR HIS LIFE - As Barry's trial for the murder of Clifford DeVoe begins, Iris and Joe must decide how far they are willing to go to keep Barry out of prison.

[Trini]

Producer preview:

[scarynikki12]

It’s always nice to see former DA Robinette. 

[Rachel RSL]

Cecile: Who's this guy you're kissing?

Mrs. DeVoe: Whatev, my husband was cool with it.

Jury: Sounds legit. GUILTY!

This show drives me crazy sometimes. And is Cecile the worst lawyer ever? She had no further questions? How about asking for details of when they met? Details about his father's illness? Calling him in to testify? Hell, calling his (probably not dead) father in to testify? And don't even get me started on the jury totally buying her explanation. Not one single person thought it was even slightly shady that she's hooking up with a hot, young dude right after her husband was murdered? Come ON. 

[Guest]

I'm sure the judge telling Barry that he had to show up for sentencing when he had not yet been convicted had no sway in the jury's mind whatsoever.

[Jediknight]

That trial was ridiculous, and Cecile is not a good lawyer.

No way in hell would Barry get put in gen pop.  He's a CSI who put away some of those prisoners, and it was a high profile case.  He'd get put in a separate wing.

[Lantern7]

Geeeeeeeeeeeez, that was depressing. I know, we know Barry didn't kill a wheelchair-bound genius, but it looks so "real" from an outside perspective. And he's in the same fucking cell that held his father when he was wrongfully imprisoned. Barry Allen may not be the fastest man alive from neck up, but he doesn't deserve the level of shit reserved for Oliver Queen.

Not much else to add . . . Ralph got a great character moment talking Joe out of planthing evidence. The "villain" was a poor schlub that didn't want to hurt anyone. And we found out threatening impending mass puppy death can be used to bring out Killer Frost.

Best guess how Barry circumvents his sentence? Well, he knows one other double of himself. Maybe find eight or more and rotate? Or find an evil Barry and stick him in there?

Quote

No way in hell would Barry get put in gen pop.  He's a CSI who put away some of those prisoners, and it was a high profile case.  He'd get put in a separate wing.

Right. Learned that from Oz.

Edited January 17, 2018 by Lantern7

[DearEvette]

That was the worst excuse for a trial. I am sitting here giggling about how terribad Cecile was as a defense lawyer.  Not to mention all the interruptions, the awful legal procedure.  Cecile didn't even try to produce any reasonable doubt and her closing argument consisted of "Barry Allen is a nice guy." 

[phoenics]

The trial was so ridiculous that I couldn't take it seriously.  That Westallen moment was sweet but how was Barry able to make it so Iris could understand him at super speed?  The writers handwaved it, but ... I guess I'll just squee over it and ignore the plot hole - although I do hope they explain this somehow... is it gonna be like Superman and the aura that extends a short distance from him?

I just don't like how Barry just gave up.

And can Barry AND Iris get some recording devices?  Iris could have had Marlize dead to rights and Barry could have had DeVoe dead to rights.

I hate it when the writers don't let people be smart except the villains.

This episode felt like a placeholder.

[bmoore4026]

10 minutes ago, phoenics said:

I hate it when the writers don't let people be smart except the villains.

But, then it wouldn't be The Flash

[Whodunnit]

Those jurors are morons. Barry has no priors and Cecile created reasonable doubt when she showed that the woman had a hot young lover. Should have been a hung jury.

[tennisgurl]

Well, we know one thing for sure...Cecile is the worst lawyer EVER. Are you sure about this relationship, Joe? This lady did such a half assed job defending your son that he is going to jail for the rest of his life. If he isn't murdered horribly in gen pop in the first three days. Seriously, I've seen some stupid TV trials, and that one was just all kinds of ridiculous. It really did feel like everyone went in thinking this was all a formality, and Barry would get thrown in jail no matter what, especially the judge, and Barry's own damn lawyer! Also, how dumb are those jurors? "Oh, the wife had a hot piece on the side she was making out with a few days after her husbands death? And now she says her husband was cool with it? SOUNDS LEGIT!" And Cecile just went with that? Really? Annalise Keating would have had Mrs. D breaking down and admitting her guilt in 15 minutes! 

Other than that, I actually did like the non trial parts of the episode. The captain got some good scenes, and I really felt for him, there were some cute Iris/Barry moments, and it was all well acted by everyone, so it wasn't totally awful or anything. But that trail was so crap, and Barry being thrown into the same damn prison his own father wasted away in? Thats just...not good viewing.

I also thought Ralph had a good episode. He really toned done the sexist jokes and "wackiness" and was snarky, but mostly focused on helping out, and they used his PI skills better than they have before. And his speech to Joe was a really good moment where he showed some real self awareness. Also, asking a guy to literally do the thing that ruined his life a few years ago? Not cool Joe. I know your desperate, but damn. 

It was mostly a pretty depressing episode, but I did laugh at Killer Frost coming when Cisco and Harry told him that puppies were in danger. Puppies Caitlin! 

Edited January 17, 2018 by tennisgurl

[Whodunnit]

While it's nice to get more evidence than "oh look, she has a lover" any lawyer who has worked their way up to DA (and thus have a record of many wins) should have been able to do follow up questions that helped discredit that woman, etc. I'm now half convinced Cecile slept her way to the top. BAD writers!

[RedVitC]

Real quick reaction for now:

That went a bit fast...but I liked it. I wish defense had put up a better fight, though. Give the viewers hope that they might say innocent, only to hit them with the guilty. And yeah, lol at everyone buying Marlize's story about the other man.

Loved the Barry and Iris moments and I'm glad The Flash' identity wasn't revealed.

Poor Barry, and in Henry's cell too :(

[scarynikki12]

I have to give the DA credit for finding the only twelve people (well, thirteen counting the judge) in Central City who don’t know Barry’s the Flash. 

[UNOSEZ]

I think the show woulda been better served not showing the trial... I mean I knew he was gonna end up in jail... They coulda had some small flashbacks to one or two moments... But showing so much felt silly... Also.. Where the Hell was Wally?.. He better show up next episode.. Or berlanti better just do a spin-off with him and Jax on adventures cuz this is ridiculous now.. Also.. I'm ready for whoever Jessica Parker Kennedy us going to be to show back up and help somehow... Anywhoo off to watch blk lightning 

[catrice2]

And this season is supposed to be better?  This episode was a joke, and next week with Ralph does not look any better.  Really...he is the moral voice for Joe?  Now Mrs. Freeze just comes and goes?  Cisco...annoying as usual......Barry walking out on his own closing arguments?  Iris was even boring....it was almost like CP was saying ,"are these words coming out of my mouth?" 

[tennisgurl]

25 minutes ago, scarynikki12 said:

I have to give the DA credit for finding the only twelve people (well, thirteen counting the judge) in Central City who don’t know Barry’s the Flash. 

Yeah I mean, I just always assumed that everyone in Central knew who Barry was, and they were just acting like they didn't to be polite...

[bettername2come]

I liked this one. The trial seemed to go way too fast. I was surprised it was just one ep and done. I mean, they convicted Barry before Oliver's even gone to trial. Can Barry speed people up with him like that in comics? My guess is no.

My first thought is that Barry should make a time remnant to share the sentence with. But then it's 50/50 chance on whether he'll save the world or try to murder Iris, so probably a bad idea.

I liked the meta of the week and his complete obliviousness to his situation. Nice to see non-evil metas. I was yelling at Cisco to just breach the guy to a dead planet from the beginning. They shouldn't have needed Barry for that. Cisco and Caitlin's powers should've worked better together. I hate the Killer Frost comes and goes angle. I wish they'd continued Caitlin's "I have become something else" stuff from the end of last season. Even if I enjoyed seeing them threaten puppies to bring out Killer Frost.

[ruby24]

Sure hope Cecile's a better prosecutor than she is a defense attorney, because she SUCKED. She literally did not present a defense for Barry at all. It would have been better for her to stay on the prosecution's team and sabotage it from the inside.

It felt like no one was even trying, and frankly, the stakes are low because Barry really can just come and go as he pleases from jail, it's not like he's really trapped in there. I enjoy DeVoe's droll lines constantly taunting Barry about his own triumph and all knowing greatness. It especially makes me giggle because Barry rarely responds to them, which does make him look kinda dumb, lol.

Edited January 17, 2018 by ruby24

[HunterHunted]

1 hour ago, Rachel RSL said:

Cecile: Who's this guy you're kissing?

Mrs. DeVoe: Whatev, my husband was cool with it.

Jury: Sounds legit. GUILTY!

This show drives me crazy sometimes. And is Cecile the worst lawyer ever? She had no further questions? How about asking for details of when they met? Details about his father's illness? Calling him in to testify? Hell, calling his (probably not dead) father in to testify? And don't even get me started on the jury totally buying her explanation. Not one single person thought it was even slightly shady that she's hooking up with a hot, young dude right after her husband was murdered? Come ON. 

Cecile is an abysmal lawyer. And Team Flash decided their New Year's resolution was to never miss a day taking their stupid pills. No further investigation of Devoe or the guy whose body he hijacked. No plausible alternate theory as to what might happened. Barry is a CSI who has helped to convict tons of criminals. Sometimes criminals will retaliate against the people who helped convict them. Central City is filled with people who can do impossible things. Barry has worked, in his official job, with STAR Labs and the police to capture and convict metahumans. Is it really a stretch to think that a metahuman was targeting Barry or Joe? It's happened before and there are police records of this. Jeebus, Cecile! Additionally, Barry is the owner of STAR Labs. Cecile could have proposed an alternate theory of a metahuman targeting Barry because of their bitterness over accident. 

I liked Joe's moment with Ralph, Singh's moment with Joe, and even Marlize's uncomfortable moment with Devoe. There were good moments, but that trial just sunk things completely.

[miracole]

Whatever, now Barry doesn't want people to know he's The Flash. As others have said Marlize just being able to say "Yeah my hubby was fine with my hot young boy toy. Promise!" and Cecil not being able to bring it with better questions on that front was horrible.  There is no way a jury should have convicted him after that piece of evidence. I like the way the prosecuting lawyer and judge looked incredulous when Cecil said the defense rests.  They almost looked like they wanted to give her help because she  was just sorry. What the judge said about that being the most heinous crime he's ever seen or whatever was dumb. I know they just needed that to juxtapose it with Singh's speech but still it was over the top.  Even if the Jury convicted Barry, as a judge of sound mind there is no way he should have thought there was no reasonable doubt. If they weren't going to even try they shouldn't have shown the trial. 

Also I wish they would try to find out more about Dominic.  It sucks that he got the Get Out treatment and no one's trying to find out about his real life or if the real Dominic is still in there somewhere.  Bump Barry going to a prison he can leave anytime he wants. Someone needs to find some justice for Dominic(unless they did this in the first 15 minutes of the show which I missed).

[Lady Calypso]

Man, there was so little attempt to defend Barry in any way, and the judge's final thoughts as he convicted Barry, though was there to parallel Singh's praise of The Flash, was just harsh, and made little to no sense. This becomes the problem where writers write for plot or a specific scene, rather than something that makes sense. 

The Barry/Iris moment in court was nice, though also questionable. How did he do that? And is it going to be a one time deal? 

Also, Cecile shouldn't be able to have defended Barry. I'm still bugged by that. 

I was ok with the episode, but I didn't really enjoy it. I was flipping between this and another show and I felt like I got the gist of the episode from the parts I did watch.

[Jack Kerouac]

Quite possibly the worst episode of the series. Perhaps of ANY series.

And yes, beyond there being NO WAY Cecile should have been defending Barry, she is the worst lawyer ever. I mean, Barry has grounds for appeal just based on how incompetent she was.

Edited January 17, 2018 by Jack Kerouac

[tennisgurl]

I am almost waiting for the twist that Cecile is actually working with the Thinker, or was manipulated or blackmailed, or isn't actually Cecile, and is a shape shifting meta in disguise or something. She seriously seemed like she was deliberately trying to throw the trail and get Barry sent to jail. 

I liked that the meta of the week wasn't evil, and didn't even seem aware of what he was doing until the last few minutes, when his powers were totally taking over. Its nice to change up the Evil Meta formula sometimes, and they've done a pretty good job of doing that lately. Plus, they didn't really have time to introduce a new villain with all of the trial stuff going on. 

Edited January 17, 2018 by tennisgurl

[GHScorpiosRule]

2 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

I've seen some stupid TV trails,

Ummm, it’s trials.? 

God this episode hurt my criminal justice heart. I knew it was going to be bad when the ADA said he would prove “beyond all doubt” that Barry was guilty...and the repeated lines of referring to Barry as being a cop. Which he’s NOT. A CSI is a tech. They don’t carry guns, cuffs or question suspects, no matter what those CSI shows tried to sell.????

Cecile is the WORST. Not all defense lawyers have their clients testify BUT still present a fucking defense-character witnesses, try to show the evidence as circumstantial. Call the new love to the stand and impeach him. Ask for a continuance to find his real life father. 

The only positive was seeing Paul Robinette, even if it was implied in his previous appearance that he might be shady.

A whole lotta ??????at all those inmates calling Barry a cop or that they were going to get him, since you know, he’s not a cop. 

And judge was stoopid too. Barry showed emotion and what he said about “having to go” because someone needed his help (even if that was beyond ridonkulous), demonstrated he wasn’t thinking about himself. And that he wasn’t remorseless or heinous.

So many people overdosed on their Stupid Pills as @HunterHunted stated above.

Edited January 17, 2018 by GHScorpiosRule

[wilnil]

2 hours ago, phoenics said:

That Westallen moment was sweet but how was Barry able to make it so Iris could understand him at super speed?  The writers handwaved it, but ... I guess I'll just squee over it and ignore the plot hole - although I do hope they explain this somehow... is it gonna be like Superman and the aura that extends a short distance from him?

Yeah, that was a really convenient time to discover he could do that. Thing is, though, I'd figured Barry's connection to the speed force must somehow extend to protect the people he's trying to save; otherwise every time he yanked someone out of danger and sped off to deposit the person on the sidewalk, it would be a race to see whether the person would be killed by whiplash-induced broken neck or by the general crushing G-force from Barry's 0-to-400-in-half-a-second acceleration. So for that moment of rescue, we have to assume the would-be victim's body is sped up to match Barry. (At least if the show still wants to have some nodding acquaintance with the laws of physics.)

[quarks]

Credit where credit is deserved. This episode did something that four seasons of Arrow couldn't: make Laurel Lance look like a skilled attorney. In comparison.

Look, Arrowverse showrunners. Most of us are about the same age, which means we all started thinking of heading to Hollywood at about the same time - that is, when L.A. Law was on. So I get why you keep having these episodes that try to zip through an entire murder trial in one episode, with at least two more plotlines per episode. I watched the same show. But L.A. Law could get away with that stunt because it was focused on the law.  (It also helped that many of their trials weren't murder trials.) You guys can't, because your episodes are focused on Oliver running around shooting arrows into people or Barry and Cisco stopping people from turning into nuclear bombs.

Look, all else aside from the issues mentioned above:

1. People are falling over from radiation sickness all over the city, and yet, the trial goes on without a hitch?  (In Arrow's equally ridiculous trial of Moira Queen, the "everyone is getting sick" subplot did affect the trial.) Why the hell is the courthouse still open?

2. The prosecutor mentions, and the city police chief confirms, that Barry just happened to go off on a Czech retreat just when the Flash happened to be gone.

3. Barry very publicly stands up and announces that he has to leave his own trial. Even though people are now dying and it's urgent, he and Cecile then waste time arguing about his bail, and then he zips off. MOMENTS LATER the Flash appears and saves the day - in an event that we know, based on the end of the episode, was heavily publicized. Nobody draws a connection.

4. We see paper flying around and the usual speed effects right after Barry/Iris have their little Speedforce moment. After that, Iris suddenly goes from stalking up to the judge to make a major announcement, to swallowing and just saying, er, my husband is innocent. Ok, apart from the the fact that the jury should have noticed the breeze that came up just then, since this was all dramatic enough to make them pay attention, none of them found that change of tone in the least bit suspicious?

5. Meanwhile, Barry learns that yet again, he's the only person that can save Central City from specific metahuman threats - Killer Frost and Cisco couldn't stop Nuclear Dude from going Nuclear. Only Barry could. And he does, saving thousands if not millions of people. And yet, rather than realizing from this that hey, given that metahuman threats keep popping up in the city, maybe he actually needs to be here to save the city, he sticks with his "oh, if I let people know the truth, my family will be a target." So it's perfectly fine for thousands of people to die while you're behind bars, just as long as your family is safe? 

Sure, for some characters (and real life people) that would be fine, but Barry, you're supposed to be a hero. 

[phoenics]

2 hours ago, scarynikki12 said:

I have to give the DA credit for finding the only twelve people (well, thirteen counting the judge) in Central City who don’t know Barry’s the Flash. 

*slow clap*

[phoenics]

This was just a completely plot driven episode to get to 1) Barry being thrown in jail and 2) that stupid Judge/Singh double speech at the end.  They made everyone STUPID to get us to that point.  Not enjoyable at all.  The writers really fell asleep at the wheel.  What a let down.

Worse - there are a LOT of fans watching this week that are literally only there for Black Lightning - my FB timeline has exploded with folks who NEVER watch The Flash and they're watching only as the ramp up to BL - and the Flash writers give us this sad plot driven mess that makes The Flash look not good.

Sad.

[HunterHunted]

1 hour ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

Cecile is the WORST. Not all defense lawyers have their clients testify BUT still present a fucking defense-character witnesses, try to show the evidence as circumstantial. Call the new love to the stand and impeach him. Ask for a continuance to find his real life father. 

Not actually presenting a defense is a legitimate and valid trial strategy. It probably would have been the best strategy for Barry considering that most of his character witnesses would be prosecution witnesses. Given that, Cecile needed to go hard on EVERY. LAST. PROSECUTION. WITNESS. Cecile should have asked where Marlize was in the hours leading up to the discovery of DeVoe's body. And Dominic. She should have questioned Captain Singh about whether a police officer had ever planted evidence at a crime scene, which would bring up Ralph and create reasonable doubt. She could have questioned Captain Singh about the many times a metahuman has targeted both the police and private individuals. We've had telepathic gorillas, multiple evil speedsters, a genius scientist who framed Henry Allen, and a gigantic walking shark. It's not out of the real of possibility that any of those could explain why DeVoe's body was in the apartment. Cecile's sole argument prior to the picture was "Heeeeey, Barry's a good guy." Yeeeesh.

Edited January 17, 2018 by HunterHunted

[Rachel RSL]

1 hour ago, miracole said:

What the judge said about that being the most heinous crime he's ever seen or whatever was dumb. 

Yeah, I rolled my eyes at that comment too. That's one of the most heinous crimes he's ever seen? Has he only been a judge for a week or something?

1 hour ago, Lady Calypso said:

The Barry/Iris moment in court was nice, though also questionable. How did he do that? 

It was so annoying when Barry simply said "I don't know." It's like the writers aren't even trying anymore. Yes, we're watching a fantasy superhero world so we need a little suspension of disbelief but when writers create a fictional world, they also establish parameters of that world and, as fans, we expect them to stay within the parameters they've created. You can't just make up new stuff and wave it away with an "I don't know". 

[phoenics]

10 minutes ago, Rachel RSL said:

Yeah, I rolled my eyes at that comment too. That's one of the most heinous crimes he's ever seen? Has he only been a judge for a week or something?

I just snort laughed.

[Trini]

Like WHY do they try and do these famous comic book arcs without actually doing them??  I'm not knowledgeable enough to nitpick all the law/court stuff, but clearly this was all to get Barry to prison. What a waste of potential, and Mark Valley. Whatever stories they have planned for Prisoner Barry better be AMAZING. (Oh, I couldn't even type that with a straight face.)

There were a few good moments though. The superspeed scene with Barry and Iris was touching; and I can handwave that Barry could do that with her because of their special connection to each other. But the West-Allens really need a break, SIGH

Also Ralph's speech to Joe. I'll give him credit; now he's had one useful scene. Still doesn't need to be on the team, though.

And the showdowns with Iris/Marlize and Barry/DeVoe were nice and tense, but the "Mwahaha, you're too dumb to know my Plan, I've already won" spiel is getting old.

It's looking like Marlize might be the weakspot for DeVoe. She's not as into this body swap as he is. Still hoping Dominic can be brought back somehow.

Wally better be showing up next week! Come on....

Also Singh has to know -- the Flash disappearing right when Barry goes to jail? Throw me a bone, show!

Edited January 17, 2018 by Trini

[ottoDbusdriver]

1 hour ago, tennisgurl said:

I am almost waiting for the twist that Cecile is actually working with the Thinker, or was manipulated or blackmailed, or isn't actually Cecile, and is a shape shifting meta in disguise or something. She seriously seemed like she was deliberately trying to throw the trail and get Barry sent to jail. 

 

Or the judge is one of the metas formed on the bus when Barry returned from the SpeedForce.

[notagain]

This may have been the worst plot driven episode of television I have ever seen, and I once watched Scandal and The Walking Dead. Obviously the writers want Barry at the prison, it would have been better to have denied him bail and jail him until the trial. 

 

I'm the only one who thought Captain Singh was going to reveal he's the Flash?

Edited January 17, 2018 by notagain

[nilyank]

Team Flash is supposed to be filled with smart people right?

I go back to the last episode when Barry stood around and allowed the cops to find him over the dead body and did nothing. It's not like he the Flash and a skilled CSI to use his abilities in both to remove a ton of the evidence in his apartment that linked him to the murder including the dead body. Oh wait he is.

I also don't know why Barry wouldn't admit that he was the Flash. All his greatest enemies know his identity immediately. And I would hope that most of Team Flash could take care of themselves with the minor criminals running around town.

[ruby24]

4 minutes ago, notagain said:

This may have been the worst plot driven episode of television I have ever seen, and I once watched Scandal and The Walking Dead. Obviously the writers want Barry at the prison, it would have been better to have denied him bail and jail him until the trial. 

This would have been a much better idea. Plus, I don't think too many murder suspects are allowed out on bail anyway.

Edited January 17, 2018 by ruby24

[Trini]

+ 1 for showing Caitlin holding Iris' hand in court, evidence of the supposed friendship between the women.

- 99 for Killer Frost (who ended up not being that useful) only coming out to help by yelling at and goading Caitlin.

And while Barry wasn't disappearing into the speedforce or anything, I thought the reactions to the guilty verdict were too subdued.

[Bats27]

These shows don't do legal stuff well. Oliver's trial, Moira Queen's trial (and Laurel being assigned to it despite a MASSIVE conflict of interest), this, etc. They all come across as ridiculously contrived and forced. And anyone who watches five seconds of Law & Order or CSI could figure that out.

Honestly Barry getting arrested at all was contrived (I still don't buy that he couldn't have gotten himself out of that situation), and this is even worse unfortunately.

And the fact that they don't even bring up the whole "I'm a CSI, why the heck would I kill someone in the most obvious way possible and implicate myself" thing at all is the most contrived of all.

 

Also if Barry is the worst criminal that this judge has ever seen, and that murder was the worst that he's ever seen as well, then that judge must not have seen a lot of murder cases. 

[thuganomics85]

Damn, this might have been some of the dumbest shit I have ever seen!  And considering some of the past episodes (like almost all of last season), that is really saying something.

Cecile truly might be the worst defense attorney of all time.  She never once put any real effort into fighting the prosecutor's witnesses or motivations.  Marlize just casually claims the kiss with "Dominic" is no big deal because DeVoe was totally down with it?  And all Cecile does is simply scamper away.  Not even a line about how it is interesting that DeVoe just happens not to be alive to collaborate this.  I'm not saying it would have worked (I think this jury was going against Barry no matter what), but she didn't even try and build a good defensive case.  Just was all "Barry's a nice guy, I swear!  Ignore that I'm currently pregnant with his adopted dad's baby!  I'm not at all compromised!" about it.  She's either an idiot or secretly in league with DeVoe.  I can't buy any other explanation.

Meanwhile, Barry is hilariously all "I can't reveal that I'm the Flash because it would be dangerous to everyone I love!" to Iris.  Christ, Barry.  You know how many untrustworthy people already know you are The Flash?  Or all the people you randomly tell and it ends up working out easily?  Now your suddenly concerned by all of this?  Ha, now that's a good joke!

I actually did love Barry just bailing out of the closing arguments.  I was almost ready for him to break the 4th wall and say "Look, guys!  We're only at episode ten of this season.  I'm clearly going to be found guilty no matter what and sent to jail for a few episodes to stretch things out.  Lets quit wasting time and I'm going to stop a nuclear explosion, instead of twiddle my thumbs waiting for the results to something that I and the rest of the viewers clearly know the answer too."

But, hey, they got the original Human Target to play the prosecutor!  Poor Mark Valley.  Is this the best you can do?

At least the stuff with Fallout was a bit better, since he actually wasn't trying to harm people and it made him more tragic.  Sure, it still ended with Barry just running circles around him, but hey, that's The Flash!  Also, Caitlin's basically just an Icy Hulk, apparently, since all she needs to turn is to get angry.  Which Cisco/Harry excel at doing, to say the least!

Ralph's scene with Joe about planting evidence was probably one of his better moments at least.

Anyway, this episode is dumb and I suspect the "Barry in prison" arc will be just as dumb.  Unless Snart and Mick show up and stage a good old "Prison Break" for him!

[Trini]

1 hour ago, Trini said:

Also Singh has to know -- the Flash disappearing right when Barry goes to jail? Throw me a bone, show!

Actually, you know what? The fact that Singh was cool with Barry's "sabbatical" and 72 tardies, I'll take that as my 'bone'. :)
But I still would love if they straight say if he knows or not.

[TDT]

5 hours ago, tennisgurl said:

I am almost waiting for the twist that Cecile is actually working with the Thinker, or was manipulated or blackmailed, or isn't actually Cecile, and is a shape shifting meta in disguise or something. She seriously seemed like she was deliberately trying to throw the trail and get Barry sent to jail. 

 

3 hours ago, ottoDbusdriver said:

Or the judge is one of the metas formed on the bus when Barry returned from the SpeedForce.

If they actually go with either one of these for the season finale i'd be shocked..(and Joe,naturally would be devastated if it were the first one..)

Come to think of it maybe THIS plot shouldve been saved for the next big multi-show crossover,and that Barry and Iris wouldve enlisted the help of Oliver/Arrow,Kara/Supergirl and the Legends to figure out who's trying to frame him

[benteen]

Barry, over a hundred people already know your secret identity (and that is a very conservative estimate) so you might as well just let the rest of the city no the truth.

Good lord, that was the dumbest trial of all-time.  Two months from the murder to the trial in typical TV show time, Barry being allowed to just get up and leave, the jury just buying that story about the boy toy...just terrible.

Not much more to say about Cecile except I wondered if Barry would use an incompetent lawyer defense to get the conviction thrown out.  He'd have solid grounds for it.

Iris is also a journalist btw who is supposed to investigate this kind of stuff and the show literally forgot about this.

Props though for making Barry's constant lateness and absences a trial point.  That was legitimately damning against him.

Who would have guessed but Ralph had the very best scene tonight when he convinces Joe not to plant evidence. 

Edited January 17, 2018 by benteen

[Jediknight]

10 hours ago, catrice2 said:

And this season is supposed to be better?  This episode was a joke, and next week with Ralph does not look any better.  Really...he is the moral voice for Joe?

I thought it made sense for Ralph to be the moral voice for Joe.  All this season, he's blamed Barry for getting fired, when he was the one that planted evidence.  He's blasted everybody, and had an insane amount of self-pity, but working with Team Flash has helped him realize that it was nobody else's fault.  It made sense for Joe to hear it from Ralph, and that despite the DeVoes being guilty, it's the wrong thing.

[bettername2come]

5 hours ago, Trini said:

Actually, you know what? The fact that Singh was cool with Barry's "sabbatical" and 72 tardies, I'll take that as my 'bone'. :)
But I still would love if they straight say if he knows or not.

And honoring The Flash when he's done similar things other times right when Barry's getting sentenced? That seemed like a sign too. Also, anyone else shocked Barry's only been late 72 times in the last few years? I mean, that's less than once a week.

[benteen]

Yeah, 72 seems like a low number for Barry.

I found the judge saying that Barry was the most remorseless/evil person who had ever been in his courtroom to be ridiculous, especially with the scale of the criminals in this city (Trickster for one).  Now, if he was referring to Barry's crimes against the timeline, I would be in complete agreement.  That being said, it is easy to see why the judge viewed Barry as so remorseless with the way Barry acted at his trial.

[DearEvette]

8 hours ago, Trini said:

It's looking like Marlize might be the weakspot for DeVoe. She's not as into this body swap as he is. Still hoping Dominic can be brought back somehow.

My fervent hope is that this is the case and that the confrontation between the two women foreshadow that it will be Iris who will be instrumental in taking her (them) down.  DeVoe is so hyper focused on Barry and calculating all of Barry's moves that I hope that that means he has simply not factored in Iris and she is the true wildcard/chaos that disrupts his theory.  Since the show has made such a point so far in showing how much of a united team the Devoe's are and also what a united team the West-Allens "we are the Flash" are, then it would be logical that while the husbands are pitting their wits against each other, the wives are too.

When Marlize also made a point about the lengths she would go to to help her husband so I am hoping we'll get to see Iris go some lengths herself.  If the show doesn't do that, then imo, it would be a huge wasted opportunity.

Also it makes me kinda sick that DeVoe is inhabiting poor Dominic.  Poor, sweet, fine ass Dominic.

9 hours ago, quarks said:

Credit where credit is deserved. This episode did something that four seasons of Arrow couldn't: make Laurel Lance look like a skilled attorney. In comparison.

This made me laugh for like 5 minutes straight.  Because it is true.

Edited January 17, 2018 by DearEvette

[Xantar]

One of the most annoying things that comic book writers do is come up with a concept or an end game and then fail to think through the details of how to get there. For example, "Laurel Lance is going to become the Black Canary. Oh, she doesn't know how to fight and her sister is a thousand times more badass? We'll just give her some boxing lessons and then brutally kill the sister." This episode was one of those times. In theory, Barry Allen getting put in the same prison cell as his father is a really neat idea. The problem is not only was the trial a joke of criminal procedure, it also left way too many holes open. I thought of another defense that hasn't been mentioned here:

Why would Barry Allen, reportedly one of the most skilled CSI techs to ever work for the police, kill a guy with premeditation, leave DNA and fingerprint evidence all over the place, and then stash the body where it could be found in a way that would incriminate him? The judge might as well have said, "In my 30 years on the bench, I've never seen a murderer who was sooooo stupid."

I did like Ralph Dibny's speech, though. He's a nicely balanced comic character with some pathos.

[quarks]

10 hours ago, phoenics said:

This was just a completely plot driven episode to get to 1) Barry being thrown in jail and 2) that stupid Judge/Singh double speech at the end.  They made everyone STUPID to get us to that point.  Not enjoyable at all.  The writers really fell asleep at the wheel.  What a let down.

Worse - there are a LOT of fans watching this week that are literally only there for Black Lightning - my FB timeline has exploded with folks who NEVER watch The Flash and they're watching only as the ramp up to BL - and the Flash writers give us this sad plot driven mess that makes The Flash look not good.

Sad.

That, and Black Lightning gave us a number of intelligent, capable black women, with their own agendas and plotlines, all, even the high schooler, portrayed as having the right to make their own decisions or at the very least, contribute to the discussion about decisions that impact their lives. Even the bad guys were like, NO, Stalker Dude, NO.

Meanwhile, over on Flash, Cecile is portrayed as completely incompetent.  And once again, Flash had Iris putting Barry's wants/desires/emotional needs (to feel that he's protecting his family and not committing perjury) above her own wants/desires/emotional needs.  It would be one thing if this was a one time event, but it really, really isn't.  Throw in the scene where black cop Joe has to be lectured on ethics by white ex-cop Ralph and the scene where the Hispanic guy and the woman can't stop the bad guy without the white guy's help, and talk about a study in contrasts. One not in Flash's favor.