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Avengers: Infinity War (2018)


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(edited)
11 hours ago, wingster55 said:

Ragnarok had Thor lose multiple IQ points just for "comedy". And it couldn't even decide the tone. Wacky over the top bits where Goldblum and the actor who played that rock guy tried to be funny but just weren't, coupled with Hela destroying Asgard (and killing the Warriors Three in a all to brief scene). Uneven. The first two had humor but knew how to keep an even tone. 

Similar to Black Panther most recently. 

Critics loved it because of their massive MCU bias (see the reactions to the very similar BvS and Civil War). 

 

A opinion I totally disagree with. I loved Ragnarok and consider it to be the best Thor movie. Thor matured and showed that he has the potential to a much better king than his father. As for Black Panther, as far I am concerned it is one of the best superhero movies ever produced. It definitely had the most talented cast. Both movies set a high bar for all superhero movies. I can't wait to see what Avengers Infinity War gives us. 

Edited by SimoneS
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4 hours ago, Dandesun said:

The point is that for as much derision as IM3 gets, I really enjoyed it and I thought it contributed to Tony's story in a much more meaningful way than, say, IM2.

I definitely liked Iron Man 3 more than IM2 which I was disappointed in when I saw it in the theater. Now though I kind of like it a little more. It's still my least favorite of the trilogy  but once I looked at it as a "superhero as rock star" story it became more interesting because Tony is the first superhero whose secret identity was publicly known and the movie fully explores the ramifications of that.

27 minutes ago, wingster55 said:

For a movie titled "Captain America" we sure didn't get as much as one expected. There was always tension, but not much friendship. The viewer was supposed to be sad at the rift between Cap and Iron Man...but unlike the comics there was no strong friendship to be sad about. Unlike say, Steve and Nat. 

And most of the other characters that were in that big airport battle scene...what was their motivation? Scott Lang was just thrown in because...of reasons. Same with Peter and Clint. Why were they there? Peter didn't even seem to know what the issue was. 

It was a clash between two of the strongest personalities of the MCU and each were able to recruit other heroes to their side in basically a personal over opposing ideologies. Some were doing out of friendship to the Steve or Tony, their stance on the Registration Act, some out of revenge, Peter and Scott were the fanboy hero worshippers. Clint owed Wanda a debt. 

 

40 minutes ago, wingster55 said:

BvS was built off a lot of the public's fear and distrust of Superman. It's logical for people to be wary of that in this day and age and want him to have...restrictions/be accountable (oh snap). Especially as his arrival was followed by Zod. The "Martha moment" was silly, yes. 

Not just silly. Batman  was basically: "You're mom has the same name as mine! I guess you're NOT a threat to humanity after all!"

 

29 minutes ago, wingster55 said:

Finally Steve was way too calm about Bucky's decision to go into stasis in Wakanda. 

What was the alternative? It was either be in prison or a fugitive. At least it WAS Bucky's decision In Wakanda he's safe and can possibly recover until they find a way to completely undo his brainwashing.

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(edited)
23 minutes ago, VCRTracking said:

At least it WAS Bucky's decision In Wakanda he's safe and can possibly recover until they find a way to completely undo his brainwashing.

Yep, definitely... and which Shuri and her superior medical technology was able to do given the BP end credit scene. I definitely would have liked a little more onscreen coverage of that, but it's easy to connect the dots we did get and Steve reacted exactly as I thought he would, including his death stare when he was standing with T'Challa at the end thinking about what he'd do to anyone who tried to get to Bucky while he was vulnerable.  And then the supplemental material we got in the prelude comic was extra yummy icing on the cake.   

Edited by Wynterwolf
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1 hour ago, wingster55 said:

BvS was built off a lot of the public's fear and distrust of Superman. It's logical for people to be wary of that in this day and age and want him to have...restrictions/be accountable (oh snap). Especially as his arrival was followed by Zod. The "Martha moment" was silly, yes. 

While it is understandable that the public would be afraid of Superman, it's ridiculous that this is Batman's response. The reason this is dumb is because Batman is a lot more pragmatic than that. BvS seems to mostly imply that Batman is pissed because of how many people died during Man of Steel. He seemingly forgets that the Kryptonians wanted to terraform the planet and kill 7 billion people. Secondly, Batman does precious little sleuthing into the dangers of Superman besides breaking into Lex Luthor's servers. Furthermore, he seems to have missed any info about Lex setting up Superman and Lex's plans to create Doomsday. It's unconscionable how little detective work he does. So given just how intellectually lazy BvS makes Batman, the "Save Martha" moment is this weird 180 shift that never should have swayed someone as fanatical as Batman was depicted with no contrary information about Superman. I didn't like that Batman was a bit of a fanatic, but that he missed that he was being played by Luthor really irritated me. And that he never sought out other sources of information, I mean come on. He's supposed to be smart and he was pretty dumb in this film.

Also as a billionaire industrialist, he should have had more mechanisms to steal info from Luthor than sneaking into a server during a gala. There's no way that Wayne Industries didn't have technology and defense contracts that couldn't have allowed him a backdoor to that info. 

And as always, "Save Martha" is dumb.

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3 hours ago, SimoneS said:

Thor matured and showed that he has the potential to a much better king than his father.

I saw no maturity. Was it when he was all cheerful after his father died? When he knocked himself out with a ball? 

 

3 hours ago, SimoneS said:

As for Black Panther, as far I am concerned it is one of the best superhero movies ever produced. It definitely had the most talented cast.

I'm sorry, I seem to have given the impression that I didn't like Black Panther. No, I fucking loved it. Easily the best of all the ones we've mentioned, and a movie that knows how to balance tone. 

3 hours ago, Wynterwolf said:

At least it WAS Bucky's decision In Wakanda he's safe and can possibly recover until they find a way to completely undo his brainwashing.

Bucky nor Cap knew how safe he was. Cap warned against intruders coming for Bucky..I don't think he was aware how badass the Dora etc are. 

 

2 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

While it is understandable that the public would be afraid of Superman, it's ridiculous that this is Batman's response. The reason this is dumb is because Batman is a lot more pragmatic than that. BvS seems to mostly imply that Batman is pissed because of how many people died during Man of Steel. He seemingly forgets that the Kryptonians wanted to terraform the planet and kill 7 billion people. Secondly, Batman does precious little sleuthing into the dangers of Superman besides breaking into Lex Luthor's servers. Furthermore, he seems to have missed any info about Lex setting up Superman and Lex's plans to create Doomsday. It's unconscionable how little detective work he does. So given just how intellectually lazy BvS makes Batman, the "Save Martha" moment is this weird 180 shift that never should have swayed someone as fanatical as Batman was depicted with no contrary information about Superman. I didn't like that Batman was a bit of a fanatic, but that he missed that he was being played by Luthor really irritated me. And that he never sought out other sources of information, I mean come on. He's supposed to be smart and he was pretty dumb in this film.

Also as a billionaire industrialist, he should have had more mechanisms to steal info from Luthor than sneaking into a server during a gala. There's no way that Wayne Industries didn't have technology and defense contracts that couldn't have allowed him a backdoor to that info. 

Huh...I can't really argue against that. 

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(edited)
33 minutes ago, wingster55 said:

I saw no maturity. Was it when he was all cheerful after his father died? When he knocked himself out with a ball? 

He was not cheerful after his father died. He straight up wanted to murder Loki until Hela showed up. Also being mature doesn't mean your immune to "fails". Search "Kelsey Grammar falls off stage" on YouTube.

Edited by VCRTracking
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(edited)
7 hours ago, wingster55 said:

I saw no maturity. Was it when he was all cheerful after his father died? When he knocked himself out with a ball? 

Thor obviously wasn't cheerful after Odin died. He was devastated and as he was about to take out his fury on Loki, Hela showed up. We then saw him praying for Odin in the prison, but he had to fight for his life and escape to save Asgard. And he still was able to communicate directly with his father after his death so as painful as his death was, he did not lose Odin forever. Their relationship moved from one plane of existence to another. Thor did mature by the end of the movie. Great movie. I have re-watched it three times and every time, I see something new.

Edited by SimoneS
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(edited)

Iron Man 2 was awful.  73% at Rotten Tomatoes does show a definite bias for the first film.  I actually liked The Dark World but will definitely admit it's one of the weakest of the Marvel movies and Thor is so completely and utterly devoid of humor that I didn't mind his personality transplant in Ragnarok  He was actually fun and entertaining again.  They decided to spend more time on Tony's wacky hijinks and they failed miserably.  The weak villains also didn't help.  They are no threat whatsoever.  I liked Iron Man 3 a great deal.

Totally agree that the movies have not done a good job establishing Steve and Tony as friends.  At the end of the first Avengers movie, we had seen them put their differences aside and work together.  Age of Ultron should have been where their friendship was built up more strongly but they are again at each other's throats so that by the time Civil War comes around, there's nothing there to destroy.

Edited by benteen
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6 hours ago, wingster55 said:

Bucky nor Cap knew how safe he was. Cap warned against intruders coming for Bucky..I don't think he was aware how badass the Dora etc are.

They knew T'Challa, particularly as an adversary.  They knew how powerful he was (especially after being allowed to see Wakanda itself) and he vowed to them that he would protect Bucky.  Steve trusts his gut with people and he believed he could trust T'Challa.  He wasn't wrong.  

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(edited)
7 hours ago, benteen said:

Totally agree that the movies have not done a good job establishing Steve and Tony as friends.  At the end of the first Avengers movie, we had seen them put their differences aside and work together.  Age of Ultron should have been where their friendship was built up more strongly but they are again at each other's throats so that by the time Civil War comes around, there's nothing there to destroy.

I read this great analysis about Tony and Steve's "friendship." It analyzed the different ways that Tony and Steve referred to their friends.

Steve is much more formal. He'll use a person's surname or title until he becomes friends with them and then he starts using their first names. With James "Bucky" Buchanan Barnes, Steve uses his childhood nickname. In the analysis, they noted that Steve only starts addressing Tony as "Tony" and not "Stark" in Civil War. What this means is that Steve has a very tentative and new friendship with Tony.

Tony is a jokester who uses nicknames for friends, foes, and acquaintances alike. He doesn't have a linguistic way to show that he's friends with someone. The only way you can tell who his friends are is how he treats them. So Tony would see that by putting Steve, Wanda, Vision, and Falcon up in the Avengers facility he has showed that he cares. Another indication is that he's stepped into this liaison role as a buffer between the team and the government. Furthermore, Tony is frequently openly antagonistic with those that he cares about. So being at each other's throats seems pretty typical for being in a relationship with him. For example, he's constantly bickering and undermining Pepper and constantly makes fun of Happy, but he clearly cares deeply about both of them.

The takeaway is that Tony thinks that his friendship with Steve is deeper than it is because he's viewing it under his normal relationship rules. While under Steve's relationship rules, the friendship is pretty shallow. The analyst argued that Tony probably thought he'd been friends with Cap since Avengers and the Battle of New York, while Steve only considered Tony a friend since right before Civil War.

I thought it was an interesting theory and explained the mismatch in their "friendship."

Edited by HunterHunted
Because liaison is a role and not something you use to make a sandwich
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(edited)

I just presume that the characters strengthened their friendships between movies or they are "friend(s) from work" to quote Thor in Ragnarok.

Edited by SimoneS
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The Avengers friendships are weird. None of them seem remotely companionable beyond working as a team.

Neither Bruce or Hulk believe Thor is their friend, Steve & Tony both harbor deep seeded reservations about Natasha, Clint doesn't seem particularly close to anyone except Natasha, Sam is Steve's best friend before all else, Vision is smitten with Wanda, Rhodey tolerates Avengers shenanigans largely because of Tony, etc.

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44 minutes ago, Dee said:

The Avengers friendships are weird. None of them seem remotely companionable beyond working as a team.

Neither Bruce or Hulk believe Thor is their friend, Steve & Tony both harbor deep seeded reservations about Natasha, Clint doesn't seem particularly close to anyone except Natasha, Sam is Steve's best friend before all else, Vision is smitten with Wanda, Rhodey tolerates Avengers shenanigans largely because of Tony, etc.

Seems like most offices I've been in.  You work kinda well together, but they are certain people you are closer to and would be friends with even if you didn't work there.  There are also people you talk to only because they work there.  Yes, you may go out to the group happy hour or on a staff retreat and have fun, but you're not calling them up on a Saturday night to ask them if they want to go bowling.

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(edited)
22 hours ago, VCRTracking said:

I definitely liked Iron Man 3 more than IM2 which I was disappointed in when I saw it in the theater. Now though I kind of like it a little more. It's still my least favorite of the trilogy  but once I looked at it as a "superhero as rock star" story it became more interesting because Tony is the first superhero whose secret identity was publicly known and the movie fully explores the ramifications of that.

Iron Man 3 could have been a shot for shot remake of Iron Man 2 with all the scenes with whiplash removed and it would have automatically been better than IM2.

Edited by Kel Varnsen
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I think Iron Man 3 is seriously underrated. I like the arc Tony has (even if the end was like, sure Tony, totally done being Iron Man. Sure Jan) and I felt it balanced its comedy better with its drama than Iron Man 2 did. Plus, it had one of my favorite exchanges in the whole franchise. 

Tony fights and blows away several random thugs, then pulls his repulser on the last thug, and the thug just drops his gun and says "Honestly, I hate working here, they are SO weird!", puts his hands up, and runs for it. It cracks me up every single time, and I think of it almost every time I see these random nameless mooks getting blown away by the heroes. Like, are you guys being paid THAT much money?

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‘Avengers: Infinity War’ Hits Tracking With The Potential To Open To $200M+

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The asterisk here is that when films chart this high on tracking, it becomes hard to predict their opening, and we also have to remind you of the cap that April has: its record $100M-plus weekends of Furious 7 ($147M) and Fate of the Furious ($98.7M) occurred over Easter holiday weekends, while The Jungle Book popped to a $103.2M during the middle of the month. Only 5% K-12 and 4% colleges are off during the April 27-29 opening weekend for Infinity War, but school never stopped the kids from fueling a record weekend at the box office. Furthermore there were slightly more schools on break on Infinity War‘s original weekend of May 4 (2% K-12 and 16% colleges per ComScore).

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2 hours ago, Kel Varnsen said:

Also good to see Okoye is still awesome.

That remark from her was funny.  Also, "Where will you be when it ends?"  Noooo!!  I've never wanted to see and not wanted to see a movie so badly.  I knew the day was coming, but damn.  I feel like trying to start a Thank You, Marvel hashtag and send it to various actors and writers and, since I think they deserve all the credit in the world, at least so far, casting directors.  But, I think I've only got, like, 7 followers on Twitter, so....

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(edited)
Quote

Okoye, "When you said that we were going to open Wakanda to the rest of the world this is not what I imagined."

T'Challa, "What did you imagine?"

Okoye, "The Olympics, maybe even a Starbucks."

Bwah! Okoye rocks! I love that she and Wakanda are prominently featured in the promo. 

Edited by SimoneS
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(edited)

‘Avengers: Infinity War’ Will Be Marvel’s Biggest Promo Campaign Yet

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With partners such as Coca-Cola, Quicken Loans, and Infiniti, Avengers: Infinity War is receiving the biggest promo push ever for a Marvel title, with a media value estimated north of $150M.

That figure is bigger than the media goods for Spider-Man: Homecoming ($140M) and last summer’s Guardians of the Galaxy, Vol. 2 ($80M). 

Seven different partners will serve up TV spots inspired by or featuring the film’s characters and themes. Our sources say the Coca-Cola partnership alone is worth an estimated $40M. Many of the partnership campaigns will be live within the next two weeks and will remain in rotation until well past Infinity War‘s April 27 release.

“Some of these partners are new to the family and some have been friends of the studio for years,” said Mindy Hamilton, Marvel’s SVP Global Partnerships & Marketing. “What they all share, though, is a commitment to innovate in their industries and excel at the way they craft their stories. We couldn’t be more excited about collaborating with them in preparation for this historic release.”

Edited by Dee
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On 4/4/2018 at 3:49 PM, Dee said:

The Avengers friendships are weird. None of them seem remotely companionable beyond working as a team.

Neither Bruce or Hulk believe Thor is their friend, Steve & Tony both harbor deep seeded reservations about Natasha, Clint doesn't seem particularly close to anyone except Natasha, Sam is Steve's best friend before all else, Vision is smitten with Wanda, Rhodey tolerates Avengers shenanigans largely because of Tony, etc.

I agree that based on what we've seen on-screen, the Avengers are mostly work friends and nothing more. I would argue that Steve gets over his reservations about Natasha in Winter Soldier--one of the few genuinely emotional moments in Civil War is when she comes to Peggy's funeral and tells him that she didn't really come to change his mind, she came because she didn't want him to be alone--but by and large, part of the reason Civil War falls flat is because most of these people don't seem to have any real attachment to each other. Tony and Steve are at each other's throats 99% of the time they are on screen together, so why am I supposed to be surprised or moved that they're fighting again?

"Maybe even a Starbucks." I died! Best sense of humor EVER (and T'Challa's reaction is priceless).

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Which of These 33 Characters Will Die in Avengers: Infinity War?

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The makers of Avengers: Infinity War are promising that this latest installment in Marvel’s megahit franchise will be the deadliest yet, and with a cast that numbers a few dozen, there is definitely room to cull the superpowered ranks. Which of your faves will likely fall at the gauntlet-clad hand of big baddie Thanos (Josh Brolin), and which are almost certain to survive this intergalactic last stand? Below, we’ve sorted the superheroes and their sidekicks from what we’d consider the safest to the ones who are most in danger of kicking the bucket. Keep in mind that this particular story line will continue over the next year into the untitled fourth Avengers film, so even the comic-book heroes who survive this summer shouldn’t rest on their laurels just yet.

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I'm quite worried for Steve, Tony and (oddly enough) Pepper. I can see them maybe killing Pepper in the NY Battle, which then leads Tony on a Suicide mission.

ETA: If not Pepper than maybe Happy.

Edited by Morrigan2575
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2 minutes ago, Dandesun said:

I am totally prepared for Steve to die except that I am not remotely prepared for Steve to die.

Steve 'died' in the comic, right?  But he was actually just stuck in time or something, and not actually dead?  If he 'dies', that's basically going to be my headcanon and no one's gonna change my mind. **basicallylalalalalaIacanthearyou**

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8 hours ago, Morrigan2575 said:

I'm quite worried for Steve, Tony and (oddly enough) Pepper. I can see them maybe killing Pepper in the NY Battle, which then leads Tony on a Suicide mission.

ETA: If not Pepper than maybe Happy.

I feel like with Tony, they are either going to kill him or send him off happy and contented. Killing Pepper or Happy just sends him into a manpain spiral similar to what we've been watching for a decade. And considering how expensive RDJ is, I think they want to avoid giving Tony too much more story left to tell.

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On 4/11/2018 at 8:17 PM, Dee said:

I think the Black Panther characters are safe. Except, for generic Wakandan warriors who may die, at the hands of Thanos' army. I would like to see Ayo's role role expand more in future Black Panther movies. She was the first Dora milaje that we met in civil war, with her soon to be king, T'Challa. I want to see the Doras, mainly, Okoye, Ayo and Aneka(needs to be cast), team up with the Black widow and go on an adventure. T'Challa probably has a plethora of Doras in Wakanda to protect him and his throne. So, he could let those three go off, on their own, for a bit.

Edited by Apprentice79
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How can I be simultaneously looking forward to a movie so much I want to explode, while also dreading it like getting a root canal?

*breathes into paper bag as I look at lists of characters possibly on the chopping block*.

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'Avengers: Infinity War' Box Office: How Big Is Big Enough?

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Marvel and Walt Disney double-dipped today in terms of MCU promotion. We just got the official press release concerning the DVD/Blu/4K release of Ryan Coogler’s Black Panther, which will contain featurettes, four deleted scenes, outtakes and a director’s commentary. They also went and released this quick 60-second “Thanks, fans!” video as a reminder that Avengers: Infinity War will debut on (just one week shy of) Marvel’s 10th anniversary, or the 10th anniversary of the domestic theatrical release of Iron Man. So, with Marvel going all-in on nostalgia (which helps avoid spoilers in the final marketing lap), I wanted to run some numbers to see just how big Avengers: Infinity War would have to be in order to measure up to realistic expectations.

For the record, I spent a lot of time in the run-up to Star Wars: The Force Awakens essentially playing down expectations. This wasn’t because I was expecting the film to “fail,” but rather because folks were getting so jump with their “Egad, it’s going to make $300 million on opening weekend and top the global gross of Avatar!” chatter that I wanted at least one voice bringing folks back to Earth. But not only did The Force Awakens open with $248 million and leg it out to $937m domestic and $2b worldwide, but there were still folks after the fact arguing that it should have cleared $3b global. For the record, Avengers: Infinity War does not have to clear $2b to qualify as a hit.

Edited by Dee
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On April 12, 2018 at 5:00 PM, Dandesun said:

I am totally prepared for Steve to die except that I am not remotely prepared for Steve to die.

I do not want Steve to die a sexless virgin. And I'm not just saying that because I want one last shirtless scene.

JFC Marvel, we only got shirtless Steve in one movie! Stop holding out on us!

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In slightly more than a week, Infinity War will be out. If you're trying to do a rewatch of all of the MCU films leading up to Infinity War, you're out of time because that's 38 hours of film for you to hunker down for. To do it it means you are truly obsessed, you are independently wealthy with no responsibilities (congrats!), or you are recovering from a serious illness or surgery (get well soon). For most of us the 38 hour MCU marathon is not feasible.

I think now is the time to revisit some of the video recaps of the MCU considering there are quite a few people who might want to see the film, but aren't MCU obsessed fans. I've seen the films I can't stand (Thor, The Dark World, Iron Man 2, Doctor Strange, and Age of Ultron) more than once. It's pretty safe to say that I'm a fangirl. Not everyone is like me. You may have skipped a film or can't recall details from it because the movie was only ok. Also don't try to make sense of the MCU timeline because it doesn't make sense (as much as people talk about Homecoming breaking the timeline, Doctor Strange is actually the movie that screws everyone up because it occurs over like 6 years, but everyone acts like it's only 6 months in the movie).*

Screen Crush

 

The Devil's Advocate--it's really comprehensive and includes the TV shows

 

Movies in Minutes has pretty comprehensive 4 minute recaps of all of the MCU films, but it will take you about 90 minutes to watch them all.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwOhOMxCC4Bi54W255Sczmg

MCU Exchange is known for their supercuts

 

Marvel Studios 10th Anniversary Tribute by The Captain

 

The Verge

 

Sam Henson's There Was an Idea

*  

Edited by HunterHunted
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The main thing I'm worried about with seeing Infinity War is that I haven't seen Black Panther yet. And wont' see it by the time I see Infinity War (assuming I get off my arse and haul it an hour to see Infinity War in cinema). I'm hoping plot wise there is nothing from Black Panther, and all I have to deal with is a slight 'who are they?' with any Black Panther character.

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22 minutes ago, Bill1978 said:

The main thing I'm worried about with seeing Infinity War is that I haven't seen Black Panther yet. And wont' see it by the time I see Infinity War (assuming I get off my arse and haul it an hour to see Infinity War in cinema). I'm hoping plot wise there is nothing from Black Panther, and all I have to deal with is a slight 'who are they?' with any Black Panther character.

You're probably fine because except for Ayo and T'Challa, no one else who is likely to be in Infinity War, except for Bucky, has met any other Wakandan. There will probably be some introductions. Black Panther is pretty standalone.

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3 hours ago, wingster55 said:

^ Exactly. I put it on the same level as Antman or Dr. Strange plot wise. It's inconsequential in the larger plot. But I'd watch it because it's so damn great. 

Dr. Strange is probably more important because he's walking around with an infinity stone around his neck and he knows how to use it.

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