S25.E06: Week 5: Disney Night

[scenicbyway]

Does Max not understand he needs to suck it up for a few more weeks?  His interaction with Vanessa at the judges table was hard to watch.  We get it, you don't like each other.  She's atleast able to put a smile on her face when the cameras are on.  He's just a whiny mess.  With being injured last season and his drama this season, I have a hard time believing he'll be asked back or to do anything on tv.

[PBGamer89]

1 minute ago, Lady Calypso said:

They did it constantly with Normani last season. Not the constantly in the last half of the show (I forgot how often she actually went first) but the slobbering all over her. Remember that stupid salsa that was really a thirty second hip hop number and no criticisms happened there? Once they have their frontrunner, they plow deep and can't find the criticisms to make them better dancers; instead, they promote the idea that they ARE already amazing. Now, I'll leave it at that because that kind of discussion should be in the General Gabbery topic. But just coming back to this season with Jordan, they're basically doing the same thing with him. 

Just saying that it's not a pattern yet that the females will always get third place. That only happened last season, and it's not quite set in stone that it'll happen this season. The voting matters, and Lindsey might actually have more fans than Jordan, which will help tremendously. Maybe Jordan's getting high scores BECAUSE he's not getting quite enough votes. 

I'm trying to hold out hope for Lindsey here because I do want her to get to the finals and I'd love for her to win over Jordan. 

Though, looking back at Rashad's scores for Disney week, he got a 7 and he managed to win. Sometimes, the high scores don't match the place that a contestant finishes. 

Yet Normani got twice the hate Jordan will ever get.

I'm just seeing constant love for Jordan and Frankie and Lindsey gets the "oh she was good too i guess".

I just don't like the current narrative from last season where the women get shafted and underscored and the men get away with basically anything.

[LotusFlower]

1 hour ago, stonehaven said:

One more comment to add...I noticed that Maks and Vanessa's pre-taped package had very LITTLE rehearsal footage of the two of them..perhaps, they didn't have that great of time last week?

Same thought.  Actually I don't think they had ANY interaction in the package.  You know things are bad when a cartoon has to be produced to put together a rehearsal package.  

Maybe Maks doesn't show up at all.  Maybe Alan rehearses with Vanessa, and Maks just waltzes in* on game day.

* see what I did there?   :)

Edited October 17, 2017 by LotusFlower

[suebee12]

50 minutes ago, stonehaven said:

One more comment to add...I noticed that Maks and Vanessa's pre-taped package had very LITTLE rehearsal footage of the two of them..perhaps, they didn't have that great of time last week?

What I noticed was that while Vanessa was dancing in one direction in the pre-dance Max was doing his moonwalk and facing away from her....like he was in a world of his own!

I also thought that Nick would be going home...certainly hope he does after tonight. He was sleepwalking through that dance. I didn't think he put any effort into it at all and for that matter Peta looked bored also!

[spanana]

9 minutes ago, PBGamer89 said:

No because it meant that even with a women winning, you had a male celeb get twice the pimpage she got, regardless of whether he lost. The fans loved James each week, yet you don't know how many times I saw such criticism and hatred for Laurie each week. Some even saying the lost Canadian vote made James lose, a fact some people still spew 1 year later. So even when a women wins, it gets questioned constantly.

Last I'll say on it since we are getting off topic, but this is also very subjective. I personally don't think James got 2x the pimpage of Laurie.  The judges and everyone loved all over Laurie as the second coming as well, so I think the pimpage was a lot more even than many think.  However James needed more just by virtue of many had never heard of the guy whereas most already knew Laurie's name coming straight off the Olympics.  Laurie was the frontrunner from the day the cast was announced and there was never a doubt in my mind she was winning.  I also think there is a difference between judges pimping and public perception.  I can go also go on the internet and find hatred of anyone and everyone that has ever been on DWTS, usually at the hands of whoever their main competition was that season.  Sure, I'm sure there was some criticism of Laurie.  But in their seasons I could also go online and find criticism of Alfonso or Riker or Corbin or any number of male "ringers".  Or last season I could find plenty of hatred of Rashad and David, generally at the hands of Normani's fans.  Normani got plenty of hate too, no denying that, but I'm not going to pretend I didn't see Rashad and David being called every name in the book as well.  It all depends on where you look.

[Lady Calypso]

Just now, spanana said:

Last I'll say on it since we are getting off topic, but this is also very subjective. I personally don't think James got 2x the pimpage of Laurie.  The judges and everyone loved all over Laurie as the second coming as well, so I think the pimpage was a lot more even than many think.  However James needed more just by virtue of many had never heard of the guy whereas most already knew Laurie's name coming straight off the Olympics.  Laurie was the frontrunner from the day the cast was announced and there was never a doubt in my mind she was winning.  I also think there is a difference between judges pimping and public perception.  I can go also go on the internet and find hatred of anyone and everyone that has ever been on DWTS, usually at the hands of whoever their main competition was that season.  Sure, I'm sure there was some criticism of Laurie.  But in their seasons I could also go online and find criticism of Alfonso or Riker or Corbin or any number of male "ringers".  Or last season I could find plenty of hatred of Rashad and David, generally at the hands of Normani's fans.  Normani got plenty of hate too, no denying that, but I'm not going to pretend I didn't see Rashad and David being called every name in the book as well.  It all depends on where you look.

 

4 minutes ago, PBGamer89 said:

Yet Normani got twice the hate Jordan will ever get.

I'm just seeing constant love for Jordan and Frankie and Lindsey gets the "oh she was good too i guess".

I just don't like the current narrative from last season where the women get shafted and underscored and the men get away with basically anything.

I'm going to take both of these very insightful answers to another thread, because it's getting off topic now.

[McManda]

30 minutes ago, PBGamer89 said:

Yet all 24 seasons have only given us two female/female top 2. Each other has been male/male or female/male.

Wait a second, this is a misleading statement. 

Quote

You wanna give me the only two times we had all female finalists and the gazillion other times there's been only 1 female finalist or the numerous more times we got male/male top 2.

Less than you would think, actually.

In 24 complete seasons, 16 have had a male/female final two, 5 have had a male/male final two, and 3 have had a female/female final two. That's not an overwhelming bias toward men.

(I'd actually say that the male/female final 2 argument doesn't hold any water and should be not taken into account in this argument because there's equal representation between the genders.)

And of the male/male final two, the last time it happened was last season, 24, but before that it was in season 13, with JR Martinez and Rob Kardashian (Ricki Lake and Hope Solo were 3rd and 4th respectively, so it's not like it was stacked to male there, either), and before that was season 4 with Apolo Ohno and Joey Fatone (Laila Ali was 3rd). 

It's far more statistically likely that you end up with a mixed gender finale than not.

And as far as winners go, we're at 13 female and 11 male.

Women might get individually judged harder on this show ... but it doesn't seem to skew overall numbers to be in the favor of men as a population.

Edited October 17, 2017 by McManda
A more direct answer

[Kira53]

14 minutes ago, PBGamer89 said:

With the constant slobbering over the guys and refusing to get real with Jordan or even put him towards the beginning of the show. He's been 6th twice and after that each time, even dancing last twice already, I doubt it now especially now that her scores have been lower than they should be all season. Girl hasn't gotten one completely deserved score any week. Always at least a point or two too low or more.

The more this happens week to week, the more the audience gets brainwashed that she's not good enough to win.

 If Jordan was the first dancer, I'd watch and then I might just turn the DVR to something else. I saw the very first show the first season and I've watched every show since then but I'm getting bored.  I no longer always listen to the judges sometimes I rush past the rehearsals and just watch the dance.  I have even fast forwarded through a few dances recently.   I really do enjoy coming here to see what other people are thinking about the contestants. I enjoy Jordan and Lindsay partnership but that's about it lately.  

[PBGamer89]

Including male/female there have been far more male celebs in the top 2.

[NeverLate]

18 minutes ago, scenicbyway said:

Does Max not understand he needs to suck it up for a few more weeks?  His interaction with Vanessa at the judges table was hard to watch.  We get it, you don't like each other.  She's atleast able to put a smile on her face when the cameras are on.  He's just a whiny mess.  With being injured last season and his drama this season, I have a hard time believing he'll be asked back or to do anything on tv.

 

8 minutes ago, Kira53 said:

 

No, he doesn't get it.

 

I loved Frankie tonight, it was great!

Also great Lindsey/Mark Jordan/Lindsay Rikki/Artem

Edited October 17, 2017 by NeverLate

[LizDC]

I thought it was kind of odd that Rainbow Connection/Muppet Movie are considered Disney now even though they weren't a part of Disney when the movie was released 38 years ago.   Maybe the next Disney night can include some Star Wars music? 

All my votes went to Drew and Emma.

Edited October 17, 2017 by LizDC

[McManda]

4 minutes ago, PBGamer89 said:

Including male/female there have been far more male celebs in the top 2.

A male/female final two shouldn't be part of your argument because there's equal representation in the genders. It might be relevant in a final three comparison, but that could go on forever. Do you stop at third? Fourth? Fifth?

In the end, there are 48 finalists (top 2). 26 have been male, 22 have been female. Not an overwhelming bias, imo.

Edited October 17, 2017 by McManda

[Andie1]

9 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

Now, I'll leave it at that because that kind of discussion should be in the General Gabbery topic. But just coming back to this season with Jordan, they're basically doing the same thing with him. 

Absolutely not.  Normani didn't learn any ballroom dances, compare Foxtrots for example she did everything but the prescribed dance..  You can't take away from Jordan that he's learning and implementing actual ballroom content.  If there's a rap solo in the midst of a Foxtrot you can't keep doing feather steps, but Lindsay was very creative choreographing a step sequence that imho did not take away from the dance at all.

[UncleChuck]

Lindsey's foxtrot with Mark was really beautiful, and one of the few dances that I watched a second time.  But I cannot believe that TPTB did not assign her to be TinkerBell.  Lindsey IRL looks more like that little fairy than any girl I can imagine. 

[NeverLate]

4 minutes ago, LizDC said:

I thought it was kind of odd that Rainbow Connection/Muppet Movie are considered Disney now even though they weren't a part of Disney when the movie was released 38 years ago.   Maybe the next Disney night can include some Star Wars music? 

All my votes went to Drew and Emma.

That was a great dance, song and costumes!!! I also voted for him

[McManda]

1 minute ago, UncleChuck said:

But I cannot believe that TPTB did not assign her to be TinkerBell.

Does Tinkerbell have any known songs? Or more to the point, why can't I come up with any songs from Peter Pan?

[smiley13]

At least one of the boring ladies is gone, so now can we get rid of the wrestling chick?   They raved over her dance, that was nothing special to me.  On the other hand, Lindsey was amazing!

[suebee12]

1 minute ago, PBGamer89 said:

Including male/female there have been far more male celebs in the top 2.

OK, is it just me? I like to watch the dancing...don't care what the sex of the dancer is, if I like the dance! I really get tired of all the arguing about if someone is judged differently because they are male or female, a ringer or not. I like to come here and read what folks think of the dances themselves. We know how the judges judge, so I like to see how fans feel about a certain dance. Everyone has a favorite or two, so of course, we are prejudiced. This year I enjoy Lindsey and Mark, Lindsay and Jordan, Frankie and Witney and I am really starting to like Drew...he seems to be having fun!

 And in my heart, James won his year! Heck, he is a race car driver and he just seemed to own the floor! He should start acting or something when his racing days are over! I liked that he came from no where to dance and he put his heart into it. I think this is why people like Frankie and Drew...they are having fun and because they are, so are we!

Sorry this is disjointed but I am so tired of reading about ringers, men against women, etc. Just sit back and enjoy who you enjoy and have fun!

[Lady Calypso]

2 minutes ago, Andie1 said:

Absolutely not.  Normani didn't learn any ballroom dances, compare Foxtrots for example she did everything but the prescribed dance..  You can't take away from Jordan that he's learning and implementing actual ballroom content.  If there's a rap solo in the midst of a Foxtrot you can't keep doing feather steps, but Lindsay was very creative choreographing a step sequence that imho did not take away from the dance at all.

I can agree with this. I was just talking in terms of Normani/Jordan getting nothing but praise and really high scores by the judges, whether they deserve them or not. I thought Normani performed well with what she was given, even when it had nothing to do with the style of dance. That's not on her; that was on Val. Jordan's getting good content, but he could always use a little more criticism, if not to help him get better. 

I just rewatched Lindsey and Mark's dance. Seriously beautiful and deserved a higher score. But nooooo, apparently only Jordan could have the perfect ten. 

[NeverLate]

11 minutes ago, Lady Calypso said:

I can agree with this. I was just talking in terms of Normani/Jordan getting nothing but praise and really high scores by the judges, whether they deserve them or not. I thought Normani performed well with what she was given, even when it had nothing to do with the style of dance. That's not on her; that was on Val. Jordan's getting good content, but he could always use a little more criticism, if not to help him get better. 

I just rewatched Lindsey and Mark's dance. Seriously beautiful and deserved a higher score. But nooooo, apparently only Jordan could have the perfect ten. 

I like Jordan, he's very good, almost too good for me. Its as if he's not learning, he's already there..

[friendperidot]

Tonight's show. Overall costuming was good. I loved Emma's rainbow dress and even chuckled at Drew's rainbow lining for his tails. I loved Nikki's dress, gorgeous! But I hated the top of Sasha's dress, other than that, the corset and the skirt weren't bad. I look at the costumes. I've sewn almost my entire life and made doll clothes for years, so I love costumes. 

The past 2 Saturday's our local PBS has been showing America's Ballroom Challenge Finals. I have watched it differently this time, not just noticing the costumes but watching the dancers, especially the male dancers. So coming off that, I notice that Jordan has more dance training and probably more talent. I noticed the way he held his head, he gave a couple of little tosses of the head that just comes from dancing. He finishes his hands. I enjoy watching him.

I enjoy Frankie because he is just joy to watch. I thought Witney could have been a little more diplomatic, but I thought he managed to convey sexy just fine. I didn't notice there wasn't a lift, but I was ok. Overall, he seems to act a pretty convincing dance. I thought about voting for a few minutes, but probably won't, it's just a pain to do online. But when he was announced in jeopardy, I knew Sasha was gone. 

I enjoyed Lindsay and Mark, I appreciated that it was pretty straightforward fox trot. Mark has been conforming a little more this season and I'm ok with it. 

I agree that Drew is improving and less awkward in his movements, but I don't care much for his dancing. He seems to be having fun and that may be all that counts. I don't think he will be in the finals.

Terrell was surprised by his 9, he got his 9, so he can go anytime. The rest of them can go in no particular order.

[yourdreamer]

I only watched Frankie, Nick, Vanessa, and TO dances tonight. Frankie was my favorite because he is to me what the DWTS perfect Star is - kinda okay in the first few weeks, has an a ha Dance mid season, has a fumble, and then does very well the last two weeks. I hope. He brings me joy to watch his dance. And last week I appreciated his favorite year was now and enjoying life. His attitude and spirit make me vote for him. 

 

I also love Cheryl. I hope she and TO are friendly to each other. I always want her happy. Their dance was fun tonight, if a bit hard to watch because of troupe and props. 

 

Wasn't impressed with Lachey dances, either one. 

[Lady Calypso]

I watched Terrell's dance. God, the band sucks. They ruined my favourite Disney song. But when I rewound to watch the dance, I thought it was...not good, actually. Not a lot of Quickstep....well, not as much as I hoped. I also noticed that he couldn't quite keep up with the quick movements. 

It definitely didn't deserve a 9, not by a long shot. I really need him or Nick to go next week. 

Watching Drew's dance, I thought that he did well. He is seeming to get better each week. He's way better than Nick or Terrell, at least. 

[Toonces464]

46 minutes ago, LotusFlower said:

Maybe Maks doesn't show up at all.  Maybe Alan rehearses with Vanessa, and Maks just waltzes in* on game day.

* see what I did there?   :)

If you watched Erin's IG story (filmed and posted during the show) Maks is wanting to fill in for Aaron Rodgers. Maybe he's been working out with Rashad to get into football shape. ;D

[calipiano81]

Even though I don't like it, I understand why the judges tend to be stingy with their scores in the first half of the show. Because if you start too high, and if someone later does just as well or better, you have nowhere to go.

BUT...I think that should mean that if certain dances that come later are clearly not on the same level as previous dances, you have to mark them distinctly lower.

I mean, how can you give Lindsey/Mark a '9' for that gorgeous foxtrot and give that same '9' to some of the other dances that came after?

And if Lindsey/Mark had gone in the second half, I really believe they would have gotten a '30' as well.

Edited October 17, 2017 by calipiano81

[Andie1]

11 minutes ago, NeverLate said:

I like Jordan, he's very good, almost too good for me. Its as if he's not learning, he's already there..

He doesn't know any ballroom or latin, he's learning it,  and because he looks great doing it, not stiff or tentative makes it more enjoyable for me to watch.  I'm tired of the same old "underdog" stories.  How long is the show going to beat that dead horse?  I want to be entertained and so far I get that from Jordan.

[Emily-D]

I understand it can be frustrating watching the judges (well basically thirsty CAI) overscore the men (hello Terrell) but let me tell you Lindsey has a huge chance of winning this. I’d be willing to bet she’s getting more viewer votes than Jordan right now. Those two along with Frankie will 100% be the top three but Lindsey has a darn good chance of taking it. Especially as she has the best pro on the entire roster in her corner.

[McManda]

5 minutes ago, calipiano81 said:

BUT...I think that should mean that if certain dances that come later are clearly not on the same level as previous dances, you have to mark them distinctly lower.

The judges waver between judging couples against other couples and judging couples against themselves. It just depends what kind of mood they're in and what fits their narrative for that week.

Sometimes it's "that was your best dance ... 10!" and sometimes it's "that was the best of the night ... 10!" and it's frustrating. You can't have it both ways, show!

[PBGamer89]

7 minutes ago, Emily-D said:

I understand it can be frustrating watching the judges (well basically thirsty CAI) overscore the men (hello Terrell) but let me tell you Lindsey has a huge chance of winning this. I’d be willing to bet she’s getting more viewer votes than Jordan right now. Those two along with Frankie will 100% be the top three but Lindsey has a darn good chance of taking it. Especially as she has the best pro on the entire roster in her corner.

Based on what? I'm looking at a "whose your favorite couple" poll right now and Jordan has the most, followed by Frankie and Lindsey with a measly 15%.

I hope they eventually score her appropriately. Each week she's underscored. Her Jive should've gotten the first 10's, last week should've been at least a 27 or 28, tonight should've been a 30 and even her Salsa should've gotten a 9.

[NeverLate]

16 minutes ago, Andie1 said:

He doesn't know any ballroom or latin, he's learning it,  and because he looks great doing it, not stiff or tentative makes it more enjoyable for me to watch.  I'm tired of the same old "underdog" stories.  How long is the show going to beat that dead horse?  I want to be entertained and so far I get that from Jordan.

Oh me too. He just so polished, and tonight I preferred Frankie, that's all 

[MsJamieDornan]

1 hour ago, Toonces464 said:

If you watched Erin's IG story (filmed and posted during the show) Maks is wanting to fill in for Aaron Rodgers. Maybe he's been working out with Rashad to get into football shape. ;D

In his dreams.  We wont let him step foot in Wisconsin. And, I'm sure Rashad has better friends to hang with.

Edited October 17, 2017 by MsJamieDornan

[Andie1]

18 minutes ago, PBGamer89 said:

Based on what? I'm looking at a "whose your favorite couple" poll right now and Jordan has the most, followed by Frankie and Lindsey with a measly 15%.

Those polls would have Normani on the top each week and look what happened.

[marykat71702]

1 hour ago, PBGamer89 said:

Including male/female there have been far more male celebs in the top 2.

OMG, let it go! A few people have pointed out that there has been a pretty even mix of male/female winners, and the male "ringers" got backlash just like the female "ringers" have. Heather was a different story--she was a backup dancer for Beyonce and was hired on Glee to choreograph, which makes her a professional in my book and as such should never have been on the show!

[Andie1]

1 hour ago, crowceilidh said:

but something seemed to shake him and he lost it a bit. 

Yeah it was uneven.

Edited October 17, 2017 by Andie1

[marykat71702]

Is it just me, or is it kind of boring when they announce the first two couples in jeopardy and then say that everyone else is safe. Didn't they use to mix it up a little?

[PBGamer89]

Just now, marykat71702 said:

Is it just me, or is it kind of boring when they announce the first two couples in jeopardy and then say that everyone else is safe. Didn't they use to mix it up a little?

They used to announce each couple that safe but with the time constraint at the end they only have time to say the jeopardy couples. until they get less couples they'll do it this way

[TheOtherOne]

I never vote, but I almost want to throw one--or a few--Vanessa's way for being stuck with that petulant brat. But then that might mean she's stuck with him longer... Guess it's a good thing I'm too lazy to expend the effort. I feel bad for her though.

[marykat71702]

Ok, on to the dances...

Victoria and Val--it was fun, but I don't agree that they were totally in sync. What exactly is Jazz, anyway? Are there certain moves that are supposed to be performed like in other dances,or is it pretty much "do whatever  you feel like doing"?

Vanessa and Maks--seemed like there was a lot of waltz content, but I did notice she seemed off balance a couple of times.

Lindsey and Mark--I liked it., she seems to be finding her groove. What the heck was on her head, though?!

Drew and Emma--I think he gets the "most improved so far" award. I found their dance enjoyable.

Sasha and Gleb--I just don't feel like she actually danced a whole lot, it was more like "step here, pose. Now step over here, pose". Not sad to see her go.

Nick and Peta--He's got heart, and you can tell he's trying. I felt like this was one of his better efforts. 

Terrell and Cheryl--He's also improving, but I can't see him going much farther.

Frankie and Witney--I love watching him, he seems to put his all into every dance. I hope he makes it to the finals.

Jordan and Lindsay--He is an absolute gem! His dancing is incredible, and he just seems like a really down-to-earth, humble person who appreciates the chances and opportunities he's been given.

NIkki and Artem--Not really cool to give them a song from a movie no one has seen yet, you automatically lose any sentimental connection there might be as with other dances/songs. That being said, I had no idea what style of dance that was supposed to be. Found out later it was jazz. Umm, okay?

[OnceSane]

If it didn't happen in this episode, it doesn't belong in this thread.  Stay on topic, please.

[Callaphera]

After the bit with Maks and Grumpy Dwarf, and the oddly edited package (no seriously, were they even in the same zip code in some of that?), and the "subtle" "digs" from one of the judges about how when they work together as a team or whatever the hell it was they were blathering about, I'm calling it: there's no actual tension between Maks and Vanessa. It's manufactured crap to drum up interest in the show.

It just seems a little too on the nose now, y'know?

[MsJamieDornan]

14 minutes ago, Callaphera said:

and the "subtle" "digs" from one of the judges about how when they work together as a team or whatever the hell it was they were blathering about, I'm calling it: there's no actual tension between Maks and Vanessa. It's manufactured crap to drum up interest in the show.

I'm not sure what to think. He does seem very distant when they are getting the judges opinions and scores. I think whatever happened backfired, and he knows it didn't work. I thought I could see defeat in his face tonight. But that could be my imagination.

Also, if something really happened, I'm pissed Maks did it when Vanessa's and his own wife were on the same show.  They didn't deserve that.

Edited October 17, 2017 by MsJamieDornan

[Uke]

2 hours ago, Andie1 said:

Except that Lindsay's creative "steppin " sequence really isn't hip hop. It's a cool twist, that goes with the sequence in the song, but it never loses the Foxtrot feel, imho.

Whatever you want to call it, "steppin'" or "hip hop", it doesn't matter that it's a cool twist that goes with the song.  The point is, Len calls out others for exactly that: non-Foxtrot steps (or whichever dance was assigned) even though the music calls for a transitional segment.  But for the favored couple he laughs it off as "forgiven".  In fact, for the non-favored couple, he usually reams out the pro AND penalizes the score by a point or two. 

[MsJamieDornan]

2 hours ago, scenicbyway said:

Does Max not understand he needs to suck it up for a few more weeks?  His interaction with Vanessa at the judges table was hard to watch.  We get it, you don't like each other.  She's atleast able to put a smile on her face when the cameras are on.  He's just a whiny mess.  With being injured last season and his drama this season, I have a hard time believing he'll be asked back or to do anything on tv.

But didn't you hear him tonight? It's his show!!!! lol

[Andie1]

39 minutes ago, Uke said:

Whatever you want to call it, "steppin'" or "hip hop", it doesn't matter that it's a cool twist that goes with the song.  The point is, Len calls out others for exactly that: non-Foxtrot steps (or whichever dance was assigned) even though the music calls for a transitional segment.  But for the favored couple he laughs it off as "forgiven".  In fact, for the non-favored couple, he usually reams out the pro AND penalizes the score by a point or two. 

Even if the dance is exceptional in all aspects?  Hell some old movies that I have watched with famous dancers doing a Foxtrot might have a middle piece where they are tap dancing. I suppose Len would dock that?  Not on your life. Why? because it makes sense to the flow of the piece.  Moreover there were two dancers only on the floor, not a laundry list of troupe members . Let's face it, it wasn't showering in the midst of an Argentine Tango, it flowed and never took me out of Foxtrot.  And these two alone managed at least 4 passes of Foxtrot, with difficult step sequences without anyone going to sleep. That's a lot more than we're used to on this show, so ten seconds of steppin is for me a modern version of someone doing a little soft shoe in the midst of their Foxtrot. It was creative fun and I'm glad it was rewarded..

Edited October 17, 2017 by Andie1

[MsJamieDornan]

6 minutes ago, Andie1 said:

Even if the dance is exceptional in all aspects?

Yes, Len still calls others out.

[Andie1]

Just now, MsJamieDornan said:

Yes, Len still calls others out.

But not tonight.  Len was generous tonight with everyone.

[Uke]

2 hours ago, calipiano81 said:

Even though I don't like it, I understand why the judges tend to be stingy with their scores in the first half of the show. Because if you start too high, and if someone later does just as well or better, you have nowhere to go.

BUT...I think that should mean that if certain dances that come later are clearly not on the same level as previous dances, you have to mark them distinctly lower.

I mean, how can you give Lindsey/Mark a '9' for that gorgeous foxtrot and give that same '9' to some of the other dances that came after?

And if Lindsey/Mark had gone in the second half, I really believe they would have gotten a '30' as well.

What's infuriating about this is that we know the "judges" see all the dances during dress rehearsal or one of the run-throughs before showtime so they can plan their ad-libs.  So they know if an earlier dance is better than later dances but I guess to maintain the charade they start the scoring low and let it build throughout the show. 

11 minutes ago, Andie1 said:

Even if the dance is exceptional in all aspects?  Hell some old movies that I have watched with famous dancers doing a Foxtrot might have a middle piece where they are tap dancing. I suppose Len would dock that?  Not on your life. Why? because it makes sense to the flow of the piece.  Moreover there were two dancers only on the floor, not a laundry list of troupe members . Let's face it, it wasn't showering in the midst of an Argentine Tango, it flowed and never took me out of Foxtrot.  And these two alone managed at least 4 passes of Foxtrot, with difficult step sequences without anyone going to sleep. That's a lot more than we're used to on this show, so ten seconds of steppin is for me a modern version of someone doing a little soft shoe in the midst of their Foxtrot. It was creative fun and I'm glad it was rewarded..

I'm not saying Len is right or wrong, I'm just pointing out what he does and the unfairness of holding some to a strict standard and "forgiving" it for a favored couple.

[Andie1]

2 minutes ago, Uke said:

And if Lindsey/Mark had gone in the second half, I really believe they would have gotten a '30' as well.

It was a pretty, classic routine one that Len tied for top dance of the night.  The other two are more for theatrical dances, that's been obvious for a long time.  Mark usually appeals to Carrie Ann and Bruno.  Tonight was for Len.  

5 minutes ago, Uke said:

I'm not saying Len is right or wrong, I'm just pointing out what he does and the unfairness of holding some to a strict standard and "forgiving" it for a favored couple

But Len gave out 10's twice tonight, so I'm not sure which one is favored.  

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Tonight's performances:

Spoiler

Opening number:

Lindsey & Mark's Pinocchio foxtrot

Vanessa & Maks' Snow White waltz

Victoria & Val's Steamboat Willie jazz

Nick & Peta's Jungle Book quickstep

Sasha & Gleb's Little Mermaid rumba

Drew & Emma's Muppet Movie waltz

Terrell & Cheryl's Lion King quickstep

Frankie & Witney's Pirates of the Caribbean tango

Jordan & Lindsay's Moana foxtrot

Nikki & Artem's Coco jazz

 

 

[ElectricBoogaloo]

Dear show and pros,

Jazz is not a catch all phrase synonymous with freestyle. Being assigned jazz doesn't mean your dance should consist of a mish mash of different ballroom styles. Jazz is an actual dance style/discipline, just as ballet, tap, and samba are. Any ten year old kid who takes weekly dance classes at the local rec center can tell the difference between jazz and a hodgepodge of ballroom. Either do a jazz dance with jazz choreography or eliminate this style from the competition. Judges, please penalize accordingly when the jazz dances don't actually contain jazz choreography so we can nip this shit in the bud.

Thanks,
EB