S03.E02: Double Trouble

[JocelynCavanaugh]

After a bottom surgery consultation, Jazz and her parents process the troubling diagnosis; Jazz confronts her friend Mya's brother, who struggles to accept Mya's transition; Jazz unwittingly finds herself on a date with a transgender boy.

[writejenn]

Poor guy Jazz was on the date with. I don't think Jazz has the maturity to date yet. I'm wondering if the lack of any puberty has simply left her unable to experience normal teenage butterflies and excitement about dating? She can be so bubbly and funny at times, and other times she just shuts down and self sabotages herself :(

[Diane M]

Was Shane transgender?  How about Matt?

[Bastet]

Someone needs to pass Jeanette a dictionary, so she can get a refresher course on what empty means.

[writejenn]

39 minutes ago, Diane M said:

Was Shane transgender?  How about Matt?

Both guys on the skating outing were transgender. That's why jazz and her friend made the "biological ladies first" joke and held the door open for the guys when they entered the skating rink. 

[jacksgirl]

Just like during the premier,  I worry about Jazz's emotions and mental health. She was not kind to her"date", knew she wasn't, and tossed down her phone while her mom grilled her. Hope she is seeing a mental health professional. On the flip side, kudos to her family for keeping two remotes in the right place. Oh, and Jeannette needs a job.

[biakbiak]

8 hours ago, writejenn said:

She can be so bubbly and funny at times, and other times she just shuts down and self sabotages herself :(

So she is exactly like many cisgendered teenage girls (and women) I know. 

[IOU Payne]

^^ That was me in high school.  TBH, I never had a date until I hit college.  I was socially awkward and just not ready to date at that age.  Not all kids are, despite the mythology of high school sweethearts, etc.  I caught up, when I hit college.  Don't put pressure on Jazz to date until she is ready.  It may not make for good TV, but the Jennings family has a track record of honouring "To thine own self be true" and this is no exception.

[Ina123]

I'm going to sound like a terrible person but I think Jazz's first impression of Shane was "eww" and that's why things went badly. I think she was turned off from first sight by his appearance. Re-watch the episode and focus in on her reaction to meeting him.

Later she couldn't communicate this to her parents because it would expose her own prejudices. There's no denying she did not want to be with him. I don't think it was awkwardness over just the idea of dating.

Then again, I could be laying my own prejudices onto Jazz. I'm seriously turned off by those ear lobe expanders and tattoos and any piercings. But I'm an old gramma fuddy-duddy.

[SunnyBeBe]

I tend to agree with Ina123.  I'm not sure that Jazz was ready for a blind date that did not meet her expectations.  I've had it happen to me, but, I was older and able to roll with the punches.  Later, I could laugh it off.  But, Jazz isn't mature enough yet. She makes too much of it in her mind.   I also think that Jazz is sort of spoiled.  She seems to think that things have to go the way she wants and if not...there's hell to pay.

Of course, I recall when the show first started.  Her bio female friend circle consisted of young teens that she hung with and shared interests.  There was the issue that they called her on and that how she would not talk to, hang out with, or socialize with their peer males.  She would just shut down when it came to boys and it was an issue with them.  That is the reason she thought they excluded her.  Now, according to what she says, she is not close to that circle anymore.  I suspect that played a big part.  

I'm glad they are getting more opinions on the surgery prospect.  Three or more is a good idea. Still, by waiting until she is 18, there could be even better technology in a a couple of years. 

Was there something going on with that young man's ears?  I couldn't tell what it was.  Were his lobes stretched? I could see how that might have thrown her off. 

[Bellalisa]

Also the cameras following her on this date was a big reason she was very uncomfortable. Even if makes me wonder how Mya and the brother all agreed to have their get together filmed. It is all so awkward. But having a film crew follow them into the ice skating rink? How is it supposed to unfold naturally? 

I agree she didn't like him but really I think a lot of her frustration was that it was all there for the whole world to see.

[Ina123]

3 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

Was there something going on with that young man's ears?  I couldn't tell what it was.  Were his lobes stretched? I could see how that might have thrown her off. 

Those were ear lobe expanders. They start small and gradually place bigger ones in to expand the hole. To each his own, I guess.

My best friend's grandson has them. She has actually told him it disgusts her. He just calls her old-fashioned. I'm not a fan of man-buns, either. Hence the fuddy-duddy issue.

When you are experienced enough you have learned how to ditch a dud blind date without so much hard feelings. Jazz is just so young.

[SunnyBeBe]

Yes, it was on camera, but, Jazz strikes me as someone who speaks her mind.  If she didn't want to be on camera, she'd say so.  I take it that she thinks that his show is helpful to other trans teens.  And it may be.  I know that I see a lot of prejudice and hateful attitudes about trans people in general.  I've often read that viewers see this public thing driven by Jazz's mother.  I'm not so sure.  I can't see how they would convince Jazz to do it, if she wasn't on board.  It seems like too much information out there, for my taste.  I would think that the show would have already brought in enough money to pay for Jazz's surgery.  Maybe, that's enough.  

[kidznpupz]

Just wondering - has anyone considered that Jazz may not be attracted to guys? This is the way many lesbians I know reacted to dating. Maybe guys are not her thing - but girls are? Time will tell I guess.

[SunnyBeBe]

I saw a young lady on Botched trying to get her lobes repaired after lobe expanding.  She regretted it, because, it was causing her distractions on her job and interfering with her career goals.  They were able to help her and she was quite pleased.  It must be pricey though, to get a good surgeon to do it.  

I may be old fashioned, but, it's not appealing to me.  I realize it's a personal choice, but, to me, that should should something that only happens after age 18.  I've seen people on tv with them, say that they smell bad.  

Edited June 29, 2017 by SunnyBeBe

[SunnyBeBe]

18 minutes ago, kidznpupz said:

Just wondering - has anyone considered that Jazz may not be attracted to guys? This is the way many lesbians I know reacted to dating. Maybe guys are not her thing - but girls are? Time will tell I guess.

Yes, that's what Ina123 said above.  It could have been that simple, but, Jazz doesn't seem to know how to go with the flow.  You don't have to make so much out of it.  I suspect that she didn't want to lead him on.  And then, there's the thing about why did my friend set me up with someone who is not my type.  You can feel a little betrayed.  

Years ago, one of my very best friends, who I had known from childhood, (so she knew me well) set me up on a blind date.  We were to double date with her and her boyfriend.  In preparation, she told me how great this guy was (she worked with him for over a year)  was and how she was so excited and so looking forward to us hitting it off.  So, as it turns out, this guy was the exact opposite of what I was about.  There was nothing about him that appealed to me.  We were polar opposites on religion, politics, social issues, environment, food, nutrition, education, etc.  I'm more of an uptown girl.  This guy chewed tobacco.  lol   I like to dress up and go out on the town, dancing and drinking champagne.  This guy wore oversalls to a dinner of barb-b-que.  I liked pop and rock music. He liked blue grass.  I'm not sure a worse match could have been made!  But, I was old enough to go out and be nice, laugh at his jokes and just make the best of the evening.  He paid and I was appreciative.  I think we both knew that there would not be another date.  

What confused me, is what was my good friend thinking?  I told her that we were not compatible, but, thanked her.  I never went on another blind date! lol 

Edited June 29, 2017 by SunnyBeBe

[TomGirl]

Since there have been previous discussions regarding if/when kids experience sexual feelings, I thought I'd post this link.  Sorry if this is the wrong place to do that...

http://www.advocatesforyouth.org/publications/201

[Dobian]

Big part of Jazz's problems is that she has parents who coddle her and give in to what she wants.  The bottom surgery is "her decision".  Uh, no, it's the decision of the guy with the check book.  If I was told that my daughter's plastic surgery would involve removing part of her colon, my answer would be an immediate and emphatic "No".  Messing around with any part of the digestive tract can have long-term health complications and is not worth the risk IMO.  And the reason Jazz is in this situation is because mom didn't want her to go through the depression of male puberty.  Well puberty is a critical life development and not something you shut off because someone might be depressed by it.  You can't have normal adult relationships without having gone through it.  I honestly think there are certain realities she doesn't get because she has been denied the experience by parents who try to shield her too much.  Which is ironic since they put her on a show where she is exposed to other negative things.  You can't get to have everything your way and not expect consequences.  Mom wants to keep Jazz happy because she is the last kid at home, and I think that affects her judgment.  But it's detrimental to Jazz, and you can see it in how she behaves like on that date.  And when they mentioned that she lost some of her friends from the past seasons, I don't think it's because of the transgender thing, I think she just puts people off.  I get the feeling she can't relate to them in large part because a normal life process that they all went through was artificially shut down in her.

[Caracoa1]

Jazz has a very tough life ahead of her.  I'm wondering if she is accepting that the medical community can only do so much and there are some aspects she will have to accept.  Her mother does appear to coddle her and gives in to her all the time and Jazz appears to get everything she wants.  Does she appreciate the enormous financial undertaking her parents have taken on to help her in her journey?  The reality is without their financial security Jazz would have had to go thru male puberty and deal with the consequences... I do feel for this girl but she does appear very Spoiled.

[Granny58]

On 6/28/2017 at 10:33 PM, writejenn said:

Poor guy Jazz was on the date with. I don't think Jazz has the maturity to date yet. I'm wondering if the lack of any puberty has simply left her unable to experience normal teenage butterflies and excitement about dating? She can be so bubbly and funny at times, and other times she just shuts down and self sabotages herself :(

I never would have considered that, but now that you say it.....Yes!  When I was a little girl the thought of kissing boys was "icky."  When I was a teen, however, things had DEFINITELY changed.  Guess those hormones are there for a reason.  

[SunnyBeBe]

The other night, she said that she considered herself PAN.  I think that means that you are attracted to people from all sexual orientations.  Please chime in, if that's not correct.  

I would think that they have conferred with experts about the hormone therapy.  Certainly, other young people have undergone this therapy.  There should be older children who would be able to demonstrate how this therapy worked for them.  Still, if Jazz were to change her mind, couldn't she stop taking estrogen and let her testosterone kick in?  

Edited June 30, 2017 by SunnyBeBe

[Sew Sumi]

She's been very vocal about not wanting to go through male puberty. I guess they didn't really understand the ramifications of that when she was put on estrogen therapy, but you'd think a doctor would have at least told the parents about the drawbacks w/r/t bottom surgery down the line.   

[Madding crowd]

I don't like Jazz' mother; she seems so eager for Jazz to do things like date so she can get attention for herself. Why can't she just let things proceed naturally? I think Jazz is feeling appropriate about dating for her age. I went on my first date at 15, but I didn't have any type of steady boyfriend for at least two more years. I know Jeanette means well, but there is also a part of her that seems to revel in being different, and getting the opportunity to 'present' situations to various people. For example, there is no reason for her to be talking about bottom surgery with her mother's friends. Even though Jazz is very candid, it is still her story.

On a curious note: Jazz looks like she is Hispanic to me and not Jewish like the rest of the family. Doesn't mean anything and not saying anything negative. Just noticing. 

[MegD]

Perhaps it's just me, but I really dislike the "bully" side of Jazz we got to see this go around. When she went with Mia to confront Mia's brother and girlfriend. She assumed (incorrectly) that it was because he didn't approve of Mia's life. She didn't seem to process that perhaps, it was because her brother was struggling with the loss of his brother and coming to terms with his "new" sister and was loaded for bear against him. Even her father's request to not attend because it wasn't her business was ignored because Jazz is going to do what she wants when she wants. I think a lot of this stems from Jeannette's constant coddling of her. What Jazz wants, Jazz gets, every time. It's making her come across as a mean girl. I have to wonder if that's why she's been kind of excluded from her group of friends.

Jeannette has been studying at the Amy & Matt Roloff school of the empty nest as well. You have 3 years minimum before you'll have an "empty nest." I suspect that she'll be pressuring Jazz to stay somewhere local.

[jacksgirl]

I would encourage Jazz to finish high school and as a senior, really investigate bottom surgery, then make a decision and take a "gap" year to have the surgery and recover completely. Then she can go off to college if she choses. In fact, I think a lot of high school seniors would do well taking a gap year to work (or travel if you have $$$). I think another year of maturity before college would benefit many teenagers.

Edited July 1, 2017 by jacksgirl
Of and it are 2 different words

[ClareWalks]

The gap year idea is a good point, I wonder why they don't mention the possibility on the show. That way she could focus wholly on recovery. Otherwise she will have to do a lot of the post-op stuff while in high school, like the dilating she mentioned, which would probably be awkward no matter where she was when she did it.

[Morgalisa]

That conversation at the dinner table where Jazz was asking her father about how far he could see into her mom's vagina was one of the funniest things I have ever seen. That's the Jazz I love.

[brilliantbreakfast]

On 6/29/2017 at 0:28 PM, kidznpupz said:

Just wondering - has anyone considered that Jazz may not be attracted to guys? This is the way many lesbians I know reacted to dating. Maybe guys are not her thing - but girls are? Time will tell I guess.

Well this is where transgender starts to blow my mind a bit.  My view is that I don't have to "understand" or "get" it.  My nephew has a friend who was born in a female body but identifies as "he", and if he wants to be "he", I really don't care and I'm happy to oblige.  But the whole issue of "Who are they attracted to?  What does it mean to be straight and transgender?  Gay and transgender?  If Jazz is attracted to women, does that make her a lesbian?  Or a straight male?" Then I remind myself again that it's none of my business and that both gender and sexual orientation may be far more fluid than us older folks ever realized, and that each person has to sort it out for "themself".

22 hours ago, Madding crowd said:

On a curious note: Jazz looks like she is Hispanic to me and not Jewish like the rest of the family. Doesn't mean anything and not saying anything negative. Just noticing. 

I disagree.  I think Jazz looks just like her father, as do the boys.  Ari looks like both her father and mother.  (And does it make me a bad person that I think Jazz' dad is really attractive?)

[possibilities]

Jazz has hormones. She's got adult levels of estrogen. And the other trans teens at the skating double date were perfectly capable of having "those feelings" and experiencing dates. I think whatever Jazz was feeling socially in that situation is not about hormones.

[Caracoa1]

The Jennings family must be well off financially.  They live in a beautiful home, have 3 kids in college, a transgender teen on expensive medication with bottom surgery coming up in next couple of years.  I hope Jazz realizes how truly blessed she was to be born into this family.

[possibilities]

I wonder how much of the money comes from doing the show, though.

[LadyE]

I love Jazz, and her sense of humor (especially the dinner scene)  but I felt so sorry for Shane.  He was trying so hard to be nice to her and she was so rude to him.  I hope she was a bit nicer to him when the cameras stopped rolling.  

[Morgalisa]

Yes, poor Shane. Seemed like a nice guy and Jazz was very rude to him. That girl has a lot going on and being a teen and transitioning has got to be tough.  Love her though. I was surprised that Shane had a mustache and deep voice, but was very slender in body. I thought the testosterone would cause more muscle development.  Anybody?

[ClareWalks]

56 minutes ago, Morgalisa said:

Yes, poor Shane. Seemed like a nice guy and Jazz was very rude to him. That girl has a lot going on and being a teen and transitioning has got to be tough.  Love her though. I was surprised that Shane had a mustache and deep voice, but was very slender in body. I thought the testosterone would cause more muscle development.  Anybody?

Teenage boys tend to be pretty skinny, though (except for the rare specimen generally found on a football team). Maybe after 18 years old his body will "fill out" a bit. 

[VioletNevermind]

I finally got around to watching this episode. ARGH, this family and show frustrate me so much.  In one scene, we have that idiot doctor referring to Jazz's underdeveloped genitals as an "itty-bitty scrotum" (I hated him) and in the next, her mother mentions the fact that Jazz has no friends at school.  Have any of them even considered that this show may be alienating Jazz from her peers?  The parents of Jazz's classmates may have advised them to steer clear of her.  Things have happened and been said on this show that I can't imagine would be comfortable for the vast majority of teens, especially those dealing with special situations, as Jazz is.  I genuinely like Jazz.  My daughter is her age; they share many of the same personality traits and a certain flair for the dramatic.  My heart breaks for Jazz every time I watch this show because I fear that she has a very, very tough road ahead of her.  She's extremely fortunate to have obviously well-to-do parents, plus a reality TV show that has to be profitable for them.  Surely they're viewing the money from the show as a way to finance the pricey surgery; who wouldn't?  I'm all for Jazz having the surgery or anything else that she may want to do to make her as comfortable as humanly possible in her own skin.  However, if I were her parents, I would put my foot down and force her to wait another couple of years until she's 18 and can make the sound, legal, adult decision to have the "bottom surgery" (I loathe that term) of her own volition.  That would also give her time to grow a bit more, if possible.  Even if she had to take a gap year between high school and college to recover from the surgery, it's better than risking flunking out freshman year and never returning because she can't handle the recovery in conjunction with taking college classes.  

Someone needs to pump the brakes here and it sure doesn't look like Jazz's parents are going to be able to summon the nerve to tell her no.  Jeannette's inability to deny Jazz has done her no favors.  Her transgender experience has been far, far more positive and insulated than that of most others, which I'm grateful for, for her sake.  Hwoever, there are times while watching this show that I'm not sure Jazz is fully aware of that.  It comes across during moments like the ice skating trip, when I thought she acted terribly to that poor guy who accompanied her.  It couldn't be more clear to me that Jazz is neither ready to date, nor does she know exactly whom she wants to date.  Both are completely fine, especially at her sensitive age, but I can't shake the feeling that this show is forcing Jazz into situations that would be better experienced in a more organic, natural way.  The reality TV meat grinder has left many people in its wake, with lasting negative effects.  Jazz has enough problems to deal with without being forced to perform for the cameras in situations a bunch of idiot TLC producers dream up.  A couple of yearly specials would serve the same purpose as full seasons of shows.  I just worry that the whole family will be sorry one day for continuing this show.  When Jazz's behavior frustrates me, I remind myself that, at the end of the day, she's still just a kid.  Then, the next scene is one where they're discussing her genitals on national television and I'm horrified for her all over again.  Lots of mixed emotions every Wednesday night. 

Edited July 4, 2017 by SuzyLee

[orangeiguana]

TLC has been grinding out "gender reveal" parties for the little people shows and millions-of-people-family shows. There have been quite a few news stories about transgender people in everyday life having children, and surely this will come up in this or another show. I wonder how they will handle that?

[Scarlett45]

I thought Jazz's outing with Mya, Mya's brother and girlfriend was an interesting part of the episode that wasn't discussed here. 

Mya seems like a sweet girl, I think she's got a better perspective on how "regular folk" are going to adjust to her transition compared to Jazz. I am not blaming Jazz for growing up in such a supportive family (nor should she feel guilty for that), but I did like how Greg reminded Jazz he did not want her hanging out with people that are transphobic for her own safety (something Jazz didn't think of). I don't think Mya's family would hurt Jazz or Mya, BUT while I acknowledge the change in pronouns is an adjustment, you're on camera dudes- at least try! I think Mya's brother is angry is little brother is gone and doesn't want to try right now. It may take him years to get over it. I think he does want a relationship with Mya but he feels cheated that she took away his little brother and gave him a little sister and he doesn't now how to handle that. 

[Ravello]

I don't believe for a minute that the parents were not informed what would happen as a result of the testosterone blocking med.  I would bet they signed informed consents detailing what would happen.  Jazz was neutered, rendered sterile and the family would have been told.  Jazz did not go through puberty and never developed secondary sexual characteristics. 

I am astounded the family put the story on national TV, right down to discussions about anatomy, physiology, biology, sex drive.  If the motive is making money (of course it is) Quit filming and have Jeanette get a job. She appears well educated and should be employable.  

I am tired of this mother expressing outrage at social media comments.  Doesn't she realize going on a reality show and revealing intimate details will be controversial?   Mom seems to be in a hurry for Jazz to undergo body mutilating surgery that is irreversible and not a panacea for gender dysmorphia.  Discussions of colon vaginoplasty should shock the parents into putting their foot down and just saying no.  Jazz is 16 years old and not mature. 

[Caracoa1]

I think when Jazz was 11 yrs old and they began hormone blockers; they knew the consequences.  At 11 yrs of age though they had to be more concerned with Jazz's emotional health and the potential of severe depression and suicide.  Well the day has arrived and they are now dealing with the consequences of their decision.  Jazz has infantile/ child size genitals and you can only do so much to make an adult functioning vagina.  Has Jazz realized that even with today's technology science can only do so much to make her a woman?  I feel for this girl and want her safe but it sounds like she hasn't accepted science does have it's limitations.  

[TwirlyGirly]

44 minutes ago, Ravello said:

<snip> Mom seems to be in a hurry for Jazz to undergo body mutilating surgery that is irreversible and not a panacea for gender dysmorphia.<snip>

I am comfortable and identify with the gender I was assigned at birth, and I assume the same is true for you as well. It is not true for Jazz, who feels female in every way except when she looks down and sees male genitalia.

If either one of us were to wake up tomorrow in the same situation, I'm confident we would not consider having surgery to make our genitalia correspond to our gender "mutilating" - as a matter of fact, I suspect surgery to correct what to us would be considered a disfigurement would be necessary and a priority.

As for the surgery being a "panacea," you're right - it's not. That's why it's usually one of the last things a transgender person does in the course of a very long, and structured  process - a process which includes intensive therapy to ensure the individual is really experiencing gender dysphoria and understands the permanence and possible dangers of surgical intervention.

Jazz has been in the process of transitioning since the age of five. She is now 16. IMO, this process is not something either she, or her parents, have taken lightly.

[greekmom]

10 hours ago, Scarlett45 said:

I thought Jazz's outing with Mya, Mya's brother and girlfriend was an interesting part of the episode that wasn't discussed here. 

 

I didn't enjoy the whole discussion with Mya's brother and the fact he uses male pronouns for Mya.  Just for the fact that you are confronting this guy on tv. Who knows how cray cray he can get and hurt someone. 

[okerry]

You would think that Jazz and, especially, her parents, would have been fully informed of what would happen with the puberty blockers; but these people are so deeply in denial, so immersed in magical thinking and sometimes outright delusion, that I could believe they would just hear what they wanted to hear and ignore the rest.

They all seem convinced that the doctors will somehow pull off a miracle and there's no need for Jazz or the family to understand anything. It will just happen. Uh, no. I'd love to think that this is all scripted for the cameras, but I just don't think it is. I think these people really are that deep in denial.

[ItsHelloPattiagain]

Quote

Also the cameras following her on this date was a big reason she was very uncomfortable. Even if makes me wonder how Mya and the brother all agreed to have their get together filmed. It is all so awkward. But having a film crew follow them into the ice skating rink? How is it supposed to unfold naturally?

I live in the general area where all these locations are filmed. Everything is weirdly staged. There's a very nice ice skating rink and arena that's probably less than ten minutes from where the family lives. Instead they went to a different rink that's 30-40 minutes away from their town where I'm guessing these kids have never been. So they are in an artificial location trying to make it NOT awkward. 

I don't remember if this was the episode, because I watched part of an enhanced one, but do teen girls talk about their vaginas? I was a teen girl many moons ago and I had two teen girls plus many of their friends in my house over the years and I don't remember anybody talking about their vaginas. IMHO I would figure girls would be more interested in having boobs rather than worrying about a vagina. 

[nutella fitzgerald]

On 7/3/2017 at 8:15 PM, SuzyLee said:

In one scene, we have that idiot doctor referring to Jazz's underdeveloped genitals as an "itty-bitty scrotum" (I hated him) and in the next, her mother mentions the fact that Jazz has no friends at school.  Have any of them even considered that this show may be alienating Jazz from her peers?  The parents of Jazz's classmates may have advised them to steer clear of her.

QFT. I never thought about it (I guess because I'm neither obese nor a little person) but I definitely wouldn't want my kid anywhere near TLC cameras.

[Scarlett45]

10 hours ago, ItsHelloPattiagain said:

 

I don't remember if this was the episode, because I watched part of an enhanced one, but do teen girls talk about their vaginas? I was a teen girl many moons ago and I had two teen girls plus many of their friends in my house over the years and I don't remember anybody talking about their vaginas. IMHO I would figure girls would be more interested in having boobs rather than worrying about a vagina. 

Yes teen girls talk about their vaginas. Cis Girls probably do less than trans girls because they've always had one so it's not something to aspire to (compared to breasts which grow and change). Also you said you were a teen girl many moons ago- I assume you grew up before the age of internet pornography? As someone who was a part of the first generation of young people who grew up with internet pornography there is more of a concern with how your vulva looks compared to other women, grooming of the pubic area and so on. I was a teen girl a little more than a decade ago, and it wasn't anything I was insecure about but I did talk about it amongst my friends (not obsessively or anything). 

[orangeiguana]

No, talking vaginas is not remotely normal, nor do teen girls have interest in porn.

[Cotypubby]

4 hours ago, orangeiguana said:

 nor do teen girls have interest in porn.

LOL

[MegD]

16 hours ago, ItsHelloPattiagain said:

I don't remember if this was the episode, because I watched part of an enhanced one, but do teen girls talk about their vaginas? I was a teen girl many moons ago and I had two teen girls plus many of their friends in my house over the years and I don't remember anybody talking about their vaginas. IMHO I would figure girls would be more interested in having boobs rather than worrying about a vagina. 

If i recall correctly, the only times my peer group discussed their vaginas as teenagers was a discussion over how to get rid of chiggers (clear nail polish and avoiding fun times in bushes), discussions of how to trim hair for swimsuits, and "I look like this (insert description not viewing), should I look like that?" during sleepovers and far away from prying eyes, boys, parents, or cameras. Boobs were a far more common topic of discussion.

[ClareWalks]

I have no idea if "the kiddos nowadays" talk about porn with each other. I was a teen in the 90s, so our dial-up modem on the household's shared computer was hardly a place to explore the wonderful world of internet porn, so that was out. I did find a magazine in our bathroom one time (I had two brothers I am sure were the culprits), but I would have been mortified to show it to my friends, even though I did flip through myself, LOL. Now that porn is everywhere, kids might discuss it more.

[Scarlett45]

42 minutes ago, MegD said:

If i recall correctly, the only times my peer group discussed their vaginas as teenagers was a discussion over how to get rid of chiggers (clear nail polish and avoiding fun times in bushes), discussions of how to trim hair for swimsuits, and "I look like this (insert description not viewing), should I look like that?" during sleepovers and far away from prying eyes, boys, parents, or cameras. Boobs were a far more common topic of discussion.

Now see I had no idea what a "chigger" was! Learn something new daily. 

 

I think most teens have some type of interest in porn- girls not as much as guys but the curiosity is there.