S01.E10: Night

[Tara Ariano]

Quote

Serena Joy confronts Offred and the Commander. Offred struggles with a complicated, life-changing revelation. The Handmaids face a brutal decision.

[Pachengala]

I've been hanging on as this show moves further and further from the book, but the moment it wants us to pretend that Serena Joy could or would harm Hannah in retaliation is the moment it's lost me completely. I'm out, Season 2. 

Edited to add that I'm pretty sure I saw Marco Rubio on the council overseeing Warren's trial. Which seems fitting. 

Edited June 14, 2017 by Pachengala

[Umbelina]

Episode is up on Hulu.

[Shaynaa]

The directing and set design on this show is amazing.  The visuals with all the red robes were stunning.

I have a hard time seeing Moira getting across the border that easily.  I have a hard time seeing how she made it out of Boston without hitting a check point.  How come she doesn't have a family?  Not a single relative out there?  Nobody?  Emily had a family that got away.  Why does Moira's identity have to just be June's friend?  POC being treated like this isn't new but I always hate seeing it.  Her scene with Luke was very nice.  His acting, not so much.  I loved that neither of them mentioned June even though both were thinking of her.  That moment was all about Moira's liberation and they were going to give it to her.

So refugees have better access to healthcare than a hell of a lot of people in the present united states.  So, the package that was smuggled to June.  On one hand, it doesn't seem that valuable.  Just letters.  Surely enough people have gotten out to clue people in on what is really going on.  On the other hand, those are first person accounts for all to read if they can get them out of the country. 

When they came for June, what did Nick whisper to her?  Are we supposed to understand?  It sounded like mumbling.

[prettyvegas]

7 minutes ago, Shaynaa said:

When they came for June, what did Nick whisper to her?  Are we supposed to understand?  It sounded like mumbling.

I had to turn on my CC because I couldn't hear him. He said, "Just go with them. Trust me."

[Umbelina]

OH WOW.

Whatever minor quibbles I may have?

 

Fuck 'em.

That was spectacular.

[Deputy Deputy CoS]

Preemptive protest of any and all future attempts to redeem Serena Joy. That woman is a monster with no salvageable soul.

[Umbelina]

1 minute ago, Deputy Deputy CoS said:

Preemptive protest of any and all future attempts to redeem Serena Joy. That woman is a monster with no salvageable soul.

She is, but I did feel her pain as well.  I loved seeing her speak up to Fred!

Also, Fred would prefer to keep his hands, so he's sucking up to her now.

[Tinfoil Hat]

Surprised that Mrs Putnam had enough clout to be able to insist on a harsh punishment for Warren. That was really gross.

During the stoning I was expecting that they would throw and intentionally miss. I was waiting for that, but how it happened worked, too.

When june was being hauled off by Guardians, I wonder why SJ didn't mention June's pregnancy.  I loved when SJ was telling Fred off, and how everybody knew the fetus wasn't his.

Edited June 14, 2017 by Tinfoil Hat
Wrong name

[Brn2bwild]

I liked Ofglen 2.0 realizing the new society had extremes even she wasn't willing to accommodate.  I hope she'll be all right.

[Umbelina]

Spoiler

 

No spoiler up there, they reformatted and I can't remove that tag.

No mention of Mexico and this could have been the finale of the series. YUP, that entire plot line was simply to give Luke a boffo, "he's a freedom fighter!" reintroduction.  My minor quibble.

That's done.

I wonder if they weren't given that second season if it would have had just one additional scene...from the book, book spoiler below...

Spoiler

the epilogue.

That would be an easy cut to make in order to continue for the second season, and a smart way to go.

Loved the music tonight too.  I'm pleasantly surprised at how good it all was.  June got her voice overs back, the women got to stop acting like complete sheep (all of them except Aunt Lydia!) and it was tense and keep my attention. 

Should Aunt Lydia have had them shoot June on the spot?  As a matter of control I mean, I think the others would have probably gone ahead with the stoning.  When you face absolute death, not just beatings and maiming, I don't know how many would have stood strong.  Lydia didn't know June was pregnant.  Then again, she couldn't kill all of them.  Interesting dilemma, she let them all see her sweat. 

First and nearly last acts were just spectacular, the middle was very good too.  Watching Moira be treated like a human being again, and her shell shock at that, was so moving.  It's happening right now in Canada, with some kind people welcoming refugees.  They couldn't possibly have known that back when they wrapped shooting early fall or late summer.  Talk about timing for a TV show!

Edited June 14, 2017 by Umbelina

[AnswersWanted]

Heavy.

This episode was so heavy to me, weighted down with so much that had been building up over the past nine episodes.

The imperfections of this show keep it grounded, to me, because life itself isn't perfect. It isn't cookie cutter. it is flawed and ugly at times, and then it can be beautiful and tranquil. This episode had all those elements and then some.

 

June's breakdown over Hannah was...a wrecking ball on my already tattered emotions thanks to this show. Elisabeth had a melt down for the ages and it was so well down, so real and believable. The way the spittle flew from her mouth as she cursed Serena in every way she knew how, her tears and sobs, and then the look of pure hatred she directed at her tormentor was plain amazing.

Serena Joy is such a desperate, disgusting human being. The way she keeps clinging to her "faith" as if that will actually save her, or somehow fix her reality, she is a joke. And using Hannah to try and keep June in line was chilling.

 

Though really, if you think about it, it makes perfect sense to manipulate the Handmaids with their most precious and prized possessions. So many of those women have children, the Regime is well aware of this, so why wouldn't they basically use their offspring as bargaining chips? Be a good Handmaid, produce children, and your kids may one day be returned to you healthy and well, that would be the best incentive in the world for them. But of course Gilead does not care about going about this agenda to make it truly work out to its full potential, the commanders just want free tail without having to deal with a wife giving them "the business" about it.

 

I was sad to see Warren only lose his hand, Should have lost his penis but then again I guess they still want the pos to have kids, though I doubt that baby is his anyway.

I thought at first that they were going to bring the wife out to be stoned because she had ended up murdering the baby in a rage over what Warren did. But no such luck.

They spared Janine a far more peaceful death by her own hand and instead brought her back only to sentence her to one of the most cruel methods of execution imaginable.

When she sadly joked for them to not throw too hard I was done. The tears just kept flowing and didn't stop for the rest of the episode.

 

Ofglen can still use her conscious to do the right thing, good to know. I thought she and June shared a moment when they sounded like bickering school girls telling each other to 'shut up'.

 

I know so much about Moira's escape defies so much logic, frankly I wish they had dedicated an episode to her escape the same way they did with Luke because I think that would have been riveting.

It was one thing to watch Luke, x number of years ago, make his way, but it was still a funny time for the area. Moira was escaping after having been enveloped in Gilead for years. After all her training and brainwashing and torture and rapes and assaults and brutality that she faced as a Handmaid, now to escape, to make a real break for it knowing that this would be her last chance, that if she got caught again hanging from a rope would have probably been the most genteel way for her to leave this place.

 

That is what I would have loved, but I will admit knowing she made it out and has her freedom again just...felt good heh. When Luke came to get her, the way she was at first surprised (June was right) and then she just clung to him like a drowning victim, her weeping so full of everything she'd kept nbottled up being in that place, grief, sadness, anger, despair, joy, relief. It was a moment that kept the waterworks set to 11.

 

I hope Rita keeps her courage and manages to get those precious letters out and to the right people. The overlapping voices telling their stories was just hard to listen to, even though I knew the words were all fiction, they were also all too real.

[The Mighty Peanut]

I'm assuming the episode title was a nod to Elie Wiesel? 

As much as I despise Warren, I hated to hear the clunk of that perfectly healthy hand going to medical waste. The wives do have some power, though. Mrs. Putnam wanted him punished, and so he was punished. 

Speaking of cruel, bitter women exerting their power...SJ is indeed a fucking evil, sadistic motherfucking monster. I kind of liked her doing shots last week. I thought maybe she regretted helping build a world where she herself became oppressed,and was in a powerful but tragic state of denial. Now, I just think she's a gigantic bitch. 

Poor, poor Offred having to see her daughter clothed in that disgusting pink, being groomed to be an obedient portable uterus. That was torture. Serena Joy tortured June.

Commander Waterford is a bimbo. I always hear his words in the voice of Barney from the Simpsons because everything he says is dumb. At least Commander Snowflake knows his ass is sterile and Offred is really Of a better looking guy with a bigger penis. :) 

Lydia can can shove her cattle prod where the sun don't shine. Wtf did she do to June? Shock her with an electric staple? What was that machine? And why would they keep Janine alive just to kill her? Power, I know. But she IS a healthy, viable womb. 

Wow, I didn't intend this to be a massive hate list. What /who I loved: poor, crazy Janine. Her tragically meek request not to stone her too hard broke my heart. So did Moira's reaction to being treated with kindness and respect. I personally didn't have an issue with her being a POC with no family. A lot of people are alone, now. I get the impression Moira is used to saving herself. It's June who took awhile to understand that submission isn't going to get her anywhere. Moira always understood...she just needed a nudge. Not to minimize what they've been through, but the handmaids are lucky to be young and able bodied. 

 

In the book, they shipped old women (including June's mother) to clean up nuclear waste in the colonies. Unsympathetic men were killed. So, I  am guessing a lot of people don't have families any longer. 

 

Edited June 16, 2017 by The Mighty Peanut

[Umbelina]

All the women, once again rocked the hell out of their scenes.  Janeen was as perfect as it was possible to be. 

That was the machine to red tag their ears. 

[LaChavalina]

I guess I'm going to be "that person" who points out that, for Moira to get from Boston area to Ontario, she must have taken a pretty roundabout route. There's also not really anywhere that one could "run" across the border into Ontario because, you know, bodies of water... It's a shame because that took me out of what I thought was otherwise a well-written, well-acted scene at the refugee agency.

I liked parts of this. I assumed everyone in Gilead would have known that June was pregnant, since Serena was out getting baby things. I also assumed that's why they didn't beat her on the spot, as they did with OfGlenn. The amputation scene was too much for me, though.

[Maire]

Praises be to all of you because I was so drained I turned it off with the Nina Symone. I thought that was the end and I'd had enough. Plus I was so afraid nick was going to be the one stoned I had to FF! 

At first I was disappointed they were going to make a season 2 but I can see it. And I love Elisabeth Moss.

[dmc]

So much to discuss:

Serena is the worst...but I loved her busting her husband's bubble...baby is not yours...God thinks you are too weak BOOM!

Please stop with Nick and Offred...I will never want this...it's icky....

They were going to have to stone Janine...your punishment for trying to kill yourself is death...why save her to begin with...to be able to control her death...so f*cked up

Why is that women all of a sudden being nice to Offred (I can't remember her name) in the household...she used to be barely curt...

So Serena knows where her kid is...MESSED up...

Offred's smile to Serena, game set match B*tch wherever they are taking me is better than here. 

Edited June 14, 2017 by dmc

[rubinia]

The girl-power-Nina-Simone-music slo-mo made me cringe.

I feel like the Waterfords would have put up more of a stink about their pregnant handmaid being taken away.

10 minutes ago, dmc said:

Why is that women all of a sudden being nice to Offred (I can't remember her name) in the household...she used to be barely curt...

Rita? The Martha? Because Offred is pregnant.

[chocolatine]

7 hours ago, The Mighty Peanut said:

I'm assuming the episode title was a nod to Elie Wiesel? 

  Reveal hidden contents

In the book, they shipped old women (including June's mother) to clean up nuclear waste in the colonies. Unsympathetic men were killed. So, I  am guessing a lot of people don't have families any longer. 

 

No, that was the title of several sections of the book.

Of course Putnam only lost his hand, under general anesthesia and sterile conditions, while poor Janine got death by stoning ("Not too hard, OK?" Such a great character.) It was good to see Fred get overridden by the higher-ranking Commander though. He's not as powerful as he thinks he is.

I loved that Ofglen 2.0 was the first to defy the stoning orders. She may be a "believer" but she's not a monster.

Evil bitch SJ wants a baby oh so badly, but not so much that she won't smack June around as punishment for being forced to go to Jezebels. "I won't hurt your baby if you don't hurt mine" - I hope next season sees her brought to justice.

Moira just walking into Canada was improbable, but her shell-shocked reaction to finally being treated with kindness and respect just about killed me. 

Great finale and I can't wait for next season!

Edited June 14, 2017 by chocolatine

[Whimsy]

36 minutes ago, dmc said:

So much to discuss:

Serena is the worst...but I loved her busting her husband's bubble...baby is not yours...God thinks you are too weak BOOM!

Please stop with Nick and Offred...I will never want this...it's icky....

They were going to have to stone Janine...your punishment for trying to kill yourself is death...why save her to begin with...to be able to control her death...so f*cked up

Why is that women all of a sudden being nice to Offred (I can't remember her name) in the household...she used to be barely curt...

So Serena knows where her kid is...MESSED up...

Offred's smile to Serena, game set match B*tch wherever they are taking me is better than here. 

I don't know why- I like Nick.  I know I'm in the minority on this one.

I think Rita was happy that Offred was pregnant hoping that some of the tyranny would end now that there's a baby.  Maybe she was thinking SJ would be in a better mood.

[dmc]

16 minutes ago, GenL said:

I don't know why- I like Nick.  I know I'm in the minority on this one.

I think Rita was happy that Offred was pregnant hoping that some of the tyranny would end now that there's a baby.  Maybe she was thinking SJ would be in a better mood.

I don't think it's Nick so much as the situation.  The choices someone makes when they have no choice are different if they were actually free.  So it just seems gross. 

[catrox14]

I can buy Moira making it across the border. I figured she crossed a frozen pond into Canada.

[Anela]

10 hours ago, Umbelina said:

She is, but I did feel her pain as well.  I loved seeing her speak up to Fred!

Also, Fred would prefer to keep his hands, so he's sucking up to her now.

So that's who that was. I should have realized that. I was afraid that they'd done that to Janine, as if stoning her wasn't bad enough. 

2 hours ago, rubinia said:

The girl-power-Nina-Simone-music slo-mo made me cringe.

I feel like the Waterfords would have put up more of a stink about their pregnant handmaid being taken away.

Rita? The Martha? Because Offred is pregnant.

I wonder if they aren't supposed to know that she's pregnant yet. Serena had an illegal pregnancy test. I don't know how long it's been since she got her period that last time, though. 

I did like seeing Serena spit all of that truth at her husband, but I loathe her now. The reminder that she helped to write the laws that got them there, as well as got all of those people killed beforehand. By the time we got to her torturing June with her daughter - her being so close, and threatening to hurt her if anything happened to June's baby - no. What. A. Bitch. 

Waterford blaming his wife for his own sins - I could compare him to a certain someone who never takes any responsibility for his own actions. She had sex with her husband, so she was at fault for waking up his lust? Nope, he was breaking the rules before that, and he could have said no. He could have sent her away. They're both monsters. 

Poor Moira, not knowing how to react when she was treated with kindness. As that guy was handing her the phone and everything else, I wanted to tell him to ease up, back off a bit. I guess they had to get that out of the way, so that she could go and really decompress and deal with everything that's happened to her. Her happiness at Luke being there, having put her down as family, had me crying again - which started when Serena had June locked in that car. 

I'm glad that it was Ofglen to be the first to say no to the stoning. Poor Janine, trying to be brave and cheerful in the face of what was to be her murder. Lydia wiping tears away, but still going through with it - I wonder if there's anything that she would say no to. 

I would have liked to have seen Emily again. We still don't know if she was killed, or imprisoned. Sent to do whatever it is everyone else is sent away to do. What happens to Janine now? 

[Stiggs]

I don't care if Moira took a hovercraft to Canada - I was just happy to see her make it. I cried through all of her scenes - when she saw the license plate, when she was so shell-shocked going through the refugee system, and when she wept into Luke's hug. Samira Wiley kills me. They have made some insanely amazing casting choices on this show. I am so glad they cast Samira as Moira. She 100% captured the spirit of the character and ran with it like a champ. I'll forgive OITNB now, since I get to see Samira here. :) I don't really like or not like Luke, but I LOVED him the moment I realized he remembered to put Moira on his family list. He likely cares for her, but I think he put her on there because he knows how much June loves her. And I'm going to stick with that story in my head because I like that. :) Also, I know Gilead has been around for years, but it still made me queasy to see America refugees. "It can't happen here," could wind up being our epithet. We're a young country. Anything could happen here. 

I hope Ofglen is okay - and she was very brave to speak out, especially given that she likes this gig better than her old one. And I think June spoke up because she feels protected by her pregnancy. 

I keep bringing up casting - the actress portraying Jeanine hit all the right notes. Her character could have been too over the top or cartoony, but she did a really great job. 

The same with the actress playing Serena Joy - who is a fucking sociopath. Or worse. I don't even know how to categorize her. But damn it, the actress playing her does a good job at showing signs of being human. I clapped when she told off her disgusting husband. And for a second when she and June were in the car, and I realized that was Hannah, I thought that Serena was giving June some sort of reward - like, your daughter is alive and well, or hug your daughter for 5 minutes - something. Then when I remembered what show I was watching, I just got sick. Bravo to Elizabeth Moss in that scene - well, in all of her scenes. She's great. 

Still not sure if Nick is in love with June or just wants to protect his spawn. He has feelings for June, for sure, but I got the impression he was the rapey turkey baster for more than just June, and that there were a few little Nicks running around Gilead. So I'm not sure about all of that. 

"They shouldn't have given us uniforms if they didn't want us to be an army," was perfect. Can't wait for next season. I wish it could start tomorrow. :) 

[Umbelina]

2 hours ago, dmc said:

I don't think it's Nick so much as the situation.  The choices someone makes when they have no choice are different if they were actually free.  So it just seems gross. 

I don't hate Nick.  I think people don't want this show to have a love triangle, kind of a cliche trope to sink to that level.  For some odd reason though, it's not bothering me as much as I thought it would, IF that is where they go.  They are not in any kind of normal situation here, and I don't have a problem with either of them developing feelings for one another, because after years of insane society and cruelty and pain?  You finally have someone relating to you as a person?  Seems pretty logical to me, for both of them.

3 hours ago, dmc said:

So much to discuss:

Serena is the worst...but I loved her busting her husband's bubble...baby is not yours...God thinks you are too weak BOOM!

Please stop with Nick and Offred...I will never want this...it's icky....

They were going to have to stone Janine...your punishment for trying to kill yourself is death...why save her to begin with...to be able to control her death...so f*cked up

Why is that women all of a sudden being nice to Offred (I can't remember her name) in the household...she used to be barely curt...

So Serena knows where her kid is...MESSED up...

Offred's smile to Serena, game set match B*tch wherever they are taking me is better than here. 

The stoning was for endangering a child, not trying to kill herself.

I think the show has shown a nice snapshot of that Martha, and explains it all.  She was distant from June because she had been close to the previous Offred, and was obviously devastated when she hung herself.  Her own child was dead, so having another child born was important to her.  She's, in spite of herself trying to remain distant, become closer to June anyway.

Mainly though?  June had no other options.  Who else could she possibly tell about the letters?  Sooner or later they would be found, so this gamble was worth it.  In spite of everything, she really doesn't know if she can trust Nick.  She doesn't know if this is escape or death right now.  The Martha was the only option to save all those women's words.

All of the Serena/June interactions were stellar in Night!  Major payoffs there. 

[Eyes High]

I've made this joke before, but I couldn't help but be reminded: "No one is to stone ANYONE until I blow this whistle!"

Didn't Moira have a girlfriend mentioned in one of the flashbacks? Angie or something? It bothers me that we never found out what happened to her.

Loved Serena vs. June. That Hannah scene was sadistic, although I agree that if June thought about it for five minutes she would realize that Serena had no power to harm Hannah.

 

Quote

I guess I'm going to be "that person" who points out that, for Moira to get from Boston area to Ontario, she must have taken a pretty roundabout route. There's also not really anywhere that one could "run" across the border into Ontario because, you know, bodies of water... 

Yes, it would make more sense for her to cross into Quebec from Vermont. Heck, maybe she did cross into Quebec from Vermont but was like "Fuck that" and continued on into Ontario thus her sigh of relief when seeing the Ontario licence plate. Maybe Handmaid world Quebec finally managed to separate from Canada, who knows? 

Speaking of which, I laughed at seeing that the words "Yours to discover" on the licence plate weren't enough to tip her off as to the province. Americans.

Edited June 14, 2017 by Eyes High

[Umbelina]

31 minutes ago, Stiggs said:

I don't care if Moira took a hovercraft to Canada - I was just happy to see her make it. I cried through all of her scenes - when she saw the license plate, when she was so shell-shocked going through the refugee system, and when she wept into Luke's hug. Samira Wiley kills me. They have made some insanely amazing casting choices on this show. I am so glad they cast Samira as Moira. She 100% captured the spirit of the character and ran with it like a champ. I'll forgive OITNB now, since I get to see Samira here. :) I don't really like or not like Luke, but I LOVED him the moment I realized he remembered to put Moira on his family list. He likely cares for her, but I think he put her on there because he knows how much June loves her. And I'm going to stick with that story in my head because I like that. :) Also, I know Gilead has been around for years, but it still made me queasy to see America refugees. "It can't happen here," could wind up being our epithet. We're a young country. Anything could happen here. 

I hope Ofglen is okay - and she was very brave to speak out, especially given that she likes this gig better than her old one. And I think June spoke up because she feels protected by her pregnancy. 

I keep bringing up casting - the actress portraying Jeanine hit all the right notes. Her character could have been too over the top or cartoony, but she did a really great job. 

The same with the actress playing Serena Joy - who is a fucking sociopath. Or worse. I don't even know how to categorize her. But damn it, the actress playing her does a good job at showing signs of being human. I clapped when she told off her disgusting husband. And for a second when she and June were in the car, and I realized that was Hannah, I thought that Serena was giving June some sort of reward - like, your daughter is alive and well, or hug your daughter for 5 minutes - something. Then when I remembered what show I was watching, I just got sick. Bravo to Elizabeth Moss in that scene - well, in all of her scenes. She's great. 

Still not sure if Nick is in love with June or just wants to protect his spawn. He has feelings for June, for sure, but I got the impression he was the rapey turkey baster for more than just June, and that there were a few little Nicks running around Gilead. So I'm not sure about all of that. 

"They shouldn't have given us uniforms if they didn't want us to be an army," was perfect. Can't wait for next season. I wish it could start tomorrow. :) 

Ofglen lost several teeth and probably went on to further torture, but I don't know if they will kill her now, since all the housemaids refused.  (Which is why I asked that question in my other post, SHOULD Aunt Lydia have acted differently/more ruthlessly, she lost control of that crowd completely, things may not go well for her now either.)  Had Lydia told them to shoot June, she would still have other housemaids who weren't defying her/the state, because I don't think they would want to die.  It's a tough call, had Lydia acted swiftly and decisively, what would have happened?  I'm just thinking of Lydia like a Captain on the field in battle when a soldier refuses to "CHARGE!" or whatever, trying to keep all the troops from disobeying orders is exactly what Lydia's job is.  She failed.  Off to the Colonies! ???

June didn't feel protected.  June was over it.  No one knew she was pregnant except Mr and Mrs Commander and Nick and the Martha.

So did I at first, just letting June see her daughter seemed like a reward to me!  Then it all went sideways, beautifully!

I don't think Nick has had any say in much of anything in Gilead either, so I don't consider him rapey.  Aside from that, after the first time, June went to him.  My guess is some love, yes, but also admiration.  If I'm correct in my guess that Nick is in Mayday?  He's risked a lot here to save her.

 

13 hours ago, Shaynaa said:

The directing and set design on this show is amazing.  The visuals with all the red robes were stunning.

I have a hard time seeing Moira getting across the border that easily.  I have a hard time seeing how she made it out of Boston without hitting a check point.  How come she doesn't have a family?  Not a single relative out there?  Nobody?  Emily had a family that got away.  Why does Moira's identity have to just be June's friend?  POC being treated like this isn't new but I always hate seeing it.  Her scene with Luke was very nice.  His acting, not so much.  I loved that neither of them mentioned June even though both were thinking of her.  That moment was all about Moira's liberation and they were going to give it to her.

So refugees have better access to healthcare than a hell of a lot of people in the present united states.  So, the package that was smuggled to June.  On one hand, it doesn't seem that valuable.  Just letters.  Surely enough people have gotten out to clue people in on what is really going on.  On the other hand, those are first person accounts for all to read if they can get them out of the country. 

When they came for June, what did Nick whisper to her?  Are we supposed to understand?  It sounded like mumbling.

Everyone in Canada has better access to Health Care than a huge chunk of the USA. 

I heard it clearly, but apparently some struggled.  I loved that finally a whisper really was a whisper.  He said (first part) something like "Just go with them." and then "Trust me."

16 minutes ago, Eyes High said:

I've made this joke before, but I couldn't help but be reminded: "No one is to stone ANYONE until I blow this whistle!"

Didn't Moira have a girlfriend mentioned in one of the flashbacks? Angie or something? It bothers me that we never found out what happened to her.

Loved Serena vs. June. That Hannah scene was sadistic, although I agree that if June thought about it for five minutes she would realize that Serena had no power to harm Hannah.

I don't know if they she was just the latest girlfriend?  Thinking back to that flashback, I got the feeling Moira played the field a bit.  Hard to remember.  However, lots of dead bodies in Gilead, and people shipped off to the colonies, and Moira is in shock right now.  More names may come to her later.  Good point though.  Ditto with Luke.  If I was in either position, there would be a lot of names I'd give them, not just family, but several close and a couple not so close friends that I cared about.

It increased the drama for the scene though.  It's also quite possible that others they might consider "family" are already dead.

Edited June 14, 2017 by Umbelina

[Primetimer]

Tara's not a crackpot. She just thinks this most feminist of TV series needs to quit confining its violence to female victims.

View the full article

[Kuther2000]

18 minutes ago, Eyes High said:

 

Didn't Moira have a girlfriend mentioned in one of the flashbacks? Angie or something? It bothers me that we never found out what happened to her.

I think Moira's girlfriend's name was Odette. She got rounded up at a lesbian club I believe.  I don't think Ofglen 2 was ever a true believer. She just saw a better opportunity for herself as this and not a drugged out coke head. You hear about it all the time with cults. They assist people with having a better situation; however it's still a cult.

[Umbelina]

24 minutes ago, PreviouslyTV said:

Tara's not a crackpot. She just thinks this most feminist of TV series needs to quit confining its violence to female victims.

View the full article

Very good points in this review, and I do agree with most/many of them, as is pretty obvious by my posts in the later half of this season, and in Palimpsest. 

I still did love this episode though, for the most part, it didn't bug me at all, unlike several other episodes, which fit what you are saying exactly.

Except there is no way I would use a rock against a guy with a machine gun, who is also stronger, and better fed than I, and who just knocked another housemaid's teeth out with one crushing punch.  I have a stronger sense of self preservation than that.  :)  Still points made.

I thought (and hoped) they would kill that now handless guy, mostly because I really wanted to see his wife shipped off to the colonies.  For a moment, I was quite hopeful, that she, by demanding punishment to "save his soul" would get him killed, and next season would show her baby removed and then colony life for her!  So, that bummed me out.  I seriously wanted to know what would happen when some useless (to them) woman was no longer a "wife."

Instead the cut off his hand, which hello!  Seems like a tiny punishment in that world.  Women lose theirs for merely reading something.  It did work in one way though, Fred realized Serena may have power after all, didn't want to lose body parts, so had to suck up to her.  Enough though?  Not really.  That dude's death would have accomplished the same thing, actually, it would have put the fear of God (ahem) into him, and we could still see a "wife" with no commander.

I'm still looking forward to next year though.  Atwood is hinting about a sequel anyway, so let's hope they take more of her ideas and nip the Hollywood and SVU stuff in the bud, and turn on the damn lights in scenes. 

Speaking of that, none of the scenes were oppressively dark in this episode.  I wonder if they adjusted it?

Edited June 14, 2017 by Umbelina

[Eyes High]

14 hours ago, Shaynaa said:

So refugees have better access to healthcare than a hell of a lot of people in the present united states. 

 

44 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

Everyone in Canada has better access to Health Care than a huge chunk of the USA. 

@Umbelina nailed it.

I thought Luke's episode hinted that things weren't that great for the refugees--rationed coffee, questionable housing (Luke mentions that they got the power back on in the building where he lives with the mute girl)--although I'm not sure if things aren't that great for Canadians in general in Handmaid world, or whether it's just the refugees who are suffering. The States are Canada's largest trading partner, so if the US economy went belly-up thanks to Gilead, I'm guessing Canada wouldn't be doing so great. I suppose one could argue things can't be that bad if refugees have access to healthcare, but on the other hand, Canadians take access to healthcare pretty seriously.

Moira looking lost and terrified when the caseworker asked her what she wanted to do was a gut punch.

Edited June 14, 2017 by Eyes High

[MathBroccoli]

I watched this hours ago, and I'm still trying to process and recover. I cheered when they refused to stone Janine. It was lovely to seem the Handmaids keep a small piece of humanity. I do wonder if June would have taken over the "I am Spartacus" mantle from Ofglen 2.0 if she wasn't pregnant. I would hope so. 

I couldn't watch the scene with Hannah. When she stepped outside in her pink handmaid junior outfit, I had to look away. Yes, June will realize that SJ can't really hurt Hannah, but June has to know that Hannah can easily become a handmaid when she becomes a teenager. The letters killed me. I truly hope Rita finds a way to pass them along so they end up in the right hands. If Gilead had happened two decades earlier, they would have taken away Rita's son & made her a handmaid.

I loved Moira's journey. I yelped for joy when she wiped away the dirt to reveal Ontario on the licence plate. I will believe any explanation for how she made her escape. I needed a bit of good news. I cried happy tears when she collapsed into Luke.

The actresses on this show all hit it out of the park. 

[HollyG]

Wow, so much happened. Those fucking evil women...Aunt Lydia & Serena Joy. (what a name) And the men. Almost all of them, the council, the guards, even Nick. What is the saying? "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing". So true.

I'm feeling really emotional after this episode. Moira seeing Luke broke my heart. The anguish and relief she felt. Something has started though, a small fire has been lit. I can't believe we have to wait for a year to find out what happens. 

[catrox14]

I was pretty surprised that no one threw out the "let he who is without sin cast the first stone" card at the stoning. And then turn to Aunt Lydia to see if she would have cast the first stone or admit her own sin.  It really did surprise me that wasn't where it went. Aunt Lydia is an interestingly terrible person. I can't figure out her deal.

Like on paper she must read as the literal worst, but Ann Dowd seems to give her a peculiar I dunno, emotional layer.  It confuses me! But good on Ann Dowd for her work!

[Stiggs]

30 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

June didn't feel protected.  June was over it.  No one knew she was pregnant except Mr and Mrs Commander and Nick and the Martha.

Good point. I guess in my head I was thinking she could just yell "pregnant!" if anyone tried to harm her, but it sure wouldn't stop a bullet to the head. 

31 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

I don't think Nick has had any say in much of anything in Gilead either, so I don't consider him rapey.  Aside from that, after the first time, June went to him.  My guess is some love, yes, but also admiration.  If I'm correct in my guess that Nick is in Mayday?  He's risked a lot here to save her.

Yeah - I actually don't see Nick as a rapist. But I was thinking that if he had been ordered to be the sperm doner for handmaids with sperm-less commanders, they would sure feel raped like they do with the commanders. And they never said it, but I got the impression that Serena wasn't the first wife to ask for his services, but I could be way off. I certainly don't feel like he was raping June - even the first time. I think he felt victimized by that as well. And after that, there were feelings going both ways. I'm wondering if he's more concerned for June or his future child - or he could be equally concerned for both. I'd say he's definitely Mayday, which would make me assume that so are the guards who got June? Which makes me wonder about how far Mayday goes - how deep. I am kinda pissed the show doesn't have 10 more episodes, heh. I want to know NOW. :) Nick was taking major risks. My only fear is that next season there will be a love triangle. The Handmaid's Tale doesn't need a love triangle. 

I'm assuming everyone Moira could mark down as "family" is dead. If she had a girlfriend, who knows if she was killed as a gender traitor before or during the red centers. I also think that when she was asked about family, Moira seemed to still be in shock. I don't know if she could remember her own name at that point. And Moira knows where June is, and she obviously didn't think Luke was alive. That was such a powerful scene.  

[Jael]

I complained about the jarring music cues back in Episode 3 and it was better for a while but there were two in the finale that were absolutely ridiculous. Someone here is scoring for comedy -- "Feeling Good" and "American Girl" would have made me laugh if I weren't so furious.

This is a good show. Not flawless, but good. And the music choices come as close to ruining it as any music possibly could.

Edited June 14, 2017 by Jael
Edited to correct song title: thanks, Eyes High!

[rubinia]

2 hours ago, Anela said:

I wonder if they aren't supposed to know that she's pregnant yet. Serena had an illegal pregnancy test. I don't know how long it's been since she got her period that last time, though. 

I'm pretty sure Rita knew. She asked Offred how she was feeling and it seemed to be directed more at the pregnancy than the bump on her head.

[Eyes High]

9 minutes ago, catrox14 said:

Like on paper she must read as the literal worst, but Ann Dowd seems to give her a peculiar I dunno, emotional layer.  It confuses me! But good on Ann Dowd for her work!

I think that layer, or part of it, is that Ann Dowd makes us believe that Lydia thinks that she's doing all this out of love and concern for the girls. She makes us believe that Lydia truly believes that she's acting in the girls' best interests, even when she's beating them, humiliating them, or heading up their executions. 

Fantastic acting, of course. Love Ann Dowd!

 

5 minutes ago, Jael said:

I complained about the jarring music cues back in Episode 3 and it was better for a while but there were two in the finale that were absolutely ridiculous. Someone here is scoring for comedy -- "Feeling Good" and "American Woman" would have made me laugh if I weren't so furious.

This is a good show. Not flawless, but good. And the music choices come as close to ruining it as any music possibly could.

I'd say when the music is good, it's very, very good--"The Sun's Gone Dim" for Emily's joyride was brilliant--but yeah, when it's bad, it is truly awful. "Feeling Good" is a song I associate with bad commercials. Not the great Nina Simone's fault, of course, but there you have it.

It was "American Girl," not "American Woman," but your point still stands.

Edited June 14, 2017 by Eyes High

[catrox14]

4 minutes ago, Eyes High said:

I think that layer, or part of it, is that Ann Dowd makes us believe that Lydia thinks that she's doing all this out of love and concern for the girls. She makes us believe that Lydia truly believes that she's acting in the girls' best interests, even when she's beating them, humiliating them, or heading up their executions. 

Fantastic acting, of course. Love Ann Dowd!

Agreed. That's a great explanation and it makes sense.

[Anela]

16 minutes ago, rubinia said:

I'm pretty sure Rita knew. She asked Offred how she was feeling and it seemed to be directed more at the pregnancy than the bump on her head.

I meant everyone else, outside of the household. 

[Stiggs]

Ann Dowd has rocked everything she has ever done - but she has really out-done herself with Aunt Lydia. The little moments of emotion she showed during the non-stoning showed Aunt Lydia was still human. I like to think she's not going to punish anyone, but...this show. She will. 

I kind of liked the use of "American Girl." It worked for me. 

Oh, so if Warren's "maximum" punishment is getting his hands cut off, then what the hell does one of the Sons of Jacob have to do to swing from the wall? Are there strikes? And part of me kind of loves Mrs. Warren for insisting her husband lose his hands. Fred showed that he has a few brain cells still working when he went home and kissed Serena's ass. She has more than enough proof to get Fred's hands cut off. She'd still be able to maintain her lifestyle (though would Fred keep the same status?) and get her revenge on a man she so clearly despises, but so clearly deserves. She's a piece of shit who deserves to rot in Gilead with another piece of shit. 

And I wonder if, being both an Eye and in Mayday, if Nick had any clue about where to find Hannah? I want them to do a sweep and grab her up on their way out to freedom. Because I refuse to believe any other thing is going to happen. I need a somewhat "happy" ending. As happy as anything can be on this show. Praise be, bitch! LOL. 

[Umbelina]

34 minutes ago, Stiggs said:

Good point. I guess in my head I was thinking she could just yell "pregnant!" if anyone tried to harm her, but it sure wouldn't stop a bullet to the head. 

Yeah - I actually don't see Nick as a rapist. But I was thinking that if he had been ordered to be the sperm doner for handmaids with sperm-less commanders, they would sure feel raped like they do with the commanders. And they never said it, but I got the impression that Serena wasn't the first wife to ask for his services, but I could be way off. I certainly don't feel like he was raping June - even the first time. I think he felt victimized by that as well. And after that, there were feelings going both ways. I'm wondering if he's more concerned for June or his future child - or he could be equally concerned for both. I'd say he's definitely Mayday, which would make me assume that so are the guards who got June? Which makes me wonder about how far Mayday goes - how deep. I am kinda pissed the show doesn't have 10 more episodes, heh. I want to know NOW. :) Nick was taking major risks. My only fear is that next season there will be a love triangle. The Handmaid's Tale doesn't need a love triangle. 

I'm assuming everyone Moira could mark down as "family" is dead. If she had a girlfriend, who knows if she was killed as a gender traitor before or during the red centers. I also think that when she was asked about family, Moira seemed to still be in shock. I don't know if she could remember her own name at that point. And Moira knows where June is, and she obviously didn't think Luke was alive. That was such a powerful scene.  

Try waiting 32 years, as those of us who read the book when published have!

31 minutes ago, Jael said:

I complained about the jarring music cues back in Episode 3 and it was better for a while but there were two in the finale that were absolutely ridiculous. Someone here is scoring for comedy -- "Feeling Good" and "American Girl" would have made me laugh if I weren't so furious.

This is a good show. Not flawless, but good. And the music choices come as close to ruining it as any music possibly could.

The music didn't bother me, and I actually liked the choices for this episode.  Then again, it may be partly because I've read the book and there is a book reason for odd music in places.  (already answered in "ask a book reader" thread if you want to know.  So for me, it isn't just show music, like say, perfect songs in whatever other series.

 

ETA @Stiggs  I'm pretty sure he only lost his left hand.

Edited June 14, 2017 by Umbelina

[nodorothyparker]

This would have been a pretty terrific episode if all the scenes had been lit enough to actually see them or I hadn't had to rewind several lines a couple of times and turn the volume all the way up to hear them.  Even then, I still had no idea why Rita was fumbling around the bathtub at the end until the AV Club review told me Offred told her to look there.

So much to unpack in this.  Serena Joy hitting Offred, then standing over her to make her pee on a stick gave me the distinct impression that whether the beating and raging would continue was entirely dependent on what the test showed.  She's pregnant with the holy sought after zygote and can't risk that by continuing to slap her around, so Serena has to resort to emotional torture instead by driving her to parts unknown to show her the first child the regime has stolen from her. That entire scene in the car was breathtaking.

I did enjoy the small comeuppance Commander Fred got in realizing that the rest of his cohorts weren't going to be so willing to blithely dismiss Putnam being guilty of the same things he's done with his whole "boys will boys, hey we're all human" attitude and that this may be the one and only instance where the wife's word actually does count for something.   So after his first go round with Serena, he now has to play nice happy family so she doesn't also talk.   Serena may be a despicable character who inadvertently built her own trap but I'll give Yvonne Strahovski credit for the mostly thankless role she's playing as a woman stewing herself alive in barely contained rage.

The stoning scene made me tear up, and I cannot stress how much I am not someone who does that over TV.  Stoning Janine at this point would be like throwing rocks at an injured bunny, she's already so diminished and broken.  Janine asking them not to throw so hard and then whether Ofglen 2.0 was okay was heartbreaking.  Ofglen 2.0 isn't a true believer as much as a pragmatist in that even with all the restrictions and limits placed on her as a handmaid it's still better than the life she had before.  But even so, there are limits and she hit hers at throwing rocks at the bunny. That seemed to be all it took for June to realize it too.  Following the rules gets her what?  Another nine months of abuse in that house plus however long after she births another child that's only going to be ripped away from her before they ship her on to another house to start the rape cycle all over again.  How long before she's where Janine is now?

Aunt Lydia may actually be the worst of the bunch for me because she's facilitating all of this evil and believes she's doing it out of love and righteousness.

[Stiggs]

1 minute ago, Umbelina said:

Try waiting 32 years, as those of us who read the book when published have!

Preach! It's been about 25 years for me, but I used to tell my BFF I was going to go to Canada and somehow force Atwood to write a sequel, heh. 

 

2 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

ETA @Stiggs  I'm pretty sure he only lost his left hand.

Ah - I wonder what the next step is? The other hand, or do they go for a foot? Or a testicle? Hell, why not an ear? Get creative, boys. 

[Jael]

33 minutes ago, Umbelina said:

The music didn't bother me, and I actually liked the choices for this episode.  Then again, it may be partly because I've read the book and there is a book reason for odd music in places.  (already answered in "ask a book reader" thread if you want to know.  So for me, it isn't just show music, like say, perfect songs in whatever other series.

I read the book as well, and I've read your theory on the jarring music, but if that's what they're going for, it isn't working for everyone. People sauntering confidently in slo-mo to "Feeling Good" makes me think I'm watching "Brooklyn Nine-Nine," and that Boyle's about to slip on a banana peel. (And I love Brooklyn Nine-Nine, but this show is... not that.) 

I agree with others above who say Ann Dowd is killing it as Aunt Lydia -- not a sympathetic character, and easy to depict as pure evil. Dowd is bringing something better. 

[chocolatine]

1 hour ago, catrox14 said:

I was pretty surprised that no one threw out the "let he who is without sin cast the first stone" card at the stoning.

That part must have been redacted from the Gilead bible. There was a similar scene with "blessed be the meek" in an earlier episode - when June told Aunt Lydia the original verse about inheriting the earth, Aunt Lydia beat her with a cattle prod.

[Umbelina]

I liked the music this time, and honestly, for most of the show. ;)

BTW, Ann Dowd just did a great interview, I posted it in the media thread (EYES).

[catrox14]

7 minutes ago, chocolatine said:

That part must have been redacted from the Gilead bible. There was a similar scene with "blessed be the meek" in an earlier episode - when June told Aunt Lydia the original verse about inheriting the earth, Aunt Lydia beat her with a cattle prod.

I was seriously shouting at June to say it since she had said used the scripture you mention above. Lydia also quoted scripture to justify her taking poor Janine's eye.

[Pachengala]

2 hours ago, PreviouslyTV said:

Tara's not a crackpot. She just thinks this most feminist of TV series needs to quit confining its violence to female victims.

View the full article

Thank god for this! I was beginning to think I'm crazy because I thought this ep was the schmaltzy, crap-cherry on top of what's been a rapidly worsening series--a series that started so strong too. It's like the showrunner decided that the source material's just too depressing, darn it, and you know what this Handmaid's Tale needs? Some hope and grrrl power! I was rolling my eyes through the whole thing--'we're an army, yeah!'--and yelling at my poor husband about it. Hope he doesn't have me sent to the Colonies. [/unpopular opinion]

[watch2much]

Can you imagine the added horror June must have felt thinking she would have to turn an infant over to Serena--someone who could be so cruel to her.  Who'd want that person to be a mother of their child?