BiP 4: Speculation & Spoilers

[CindyBee]

Well the gang is leaving soon for Mexico in a couple of days so Reality Steve has some scoop on his blog this morning.  Worth the read, IMHO, just to see the mess that is coming our way as FIVE of Nick girls are leaving real boyfriends behind to be on the show to further their "career" and collect a paycheck.  

Original cast of girls should include:

Jasmine, Corrinne, Raven, Alexis, Kristina and everyone’s favorite single mom, Amanda Stanton.

Guys:

Kaitlyn's season:

Ben Z is finally going to be on;  originally Steve said Dr. Chris Cupcake was going to be on too but has retracted that, saying that Chris didn't get cast. 

JoJo's season:

Robby; is coming on after ghosting Sarah Vendal so maybe she’ll be part of the cast, later on to stir things up. 

Alek

Derek, who broke up with Olivia Cardali to do the show.

Up in the air: Chase and Chad

Rachel's guys:

All are still on the show so won't list them.

Original guys should include Robby and Ben Z.

 

Oh, Carly & Evan’s wedding will be part of the season.  

[Wings]

On 5/31/2017 at 10:33 AM, CindyBee said:

Rachel's guys:

All are still on the show so won't list them.

This is a spoiler thread so go ahead.  I heard Dean was one of them.  What about Corinne and Chad?  

Edited June 2, 2017 by wings707

[nlkm9]

Oh God Amanda. ::shaking head:::

I LOVED Ben Z!!

Edited June 2, 2017 by nlkm9
omit

[CindyBee]

RS said in his blog today that filming started on Saturday.  Just think, Amanda is well on her way to her next engagement.

From what I can gather, the following MIGHT be in the original cast.  (I've noted the girls said to have left a boyfriend at home to extend their 15 seconds of fame and collect a paycheck).

Amanda, Corinne (bf at home), Alexis (bf at home), Kristina (has been dating Jef Holm), Jasmine, Raven

Vinny, Jack Stone, Robby, Ben Z

We will have to see if RS comes up with a full original cast later.  

Calling it now, Amanda makes a play for lawyer Jack Stone.

[DEL901]

41 minutes ago, CindyBee said:

Corinne (bf at home), Alexis (bf at home), Kristina (has been dating Jef Holm), Jasmine, Raven

So, in order to appear on the Bachelorette as Rachel's besties, they had to sign up for Bachelor in Paradise?  Or was this one of the benefits?

[chocolatine]

1 hour ago, DEL901 said:

So, in order to appear on the Bachelorette as Rachel's besties, they had to sign up for Bachelor in Paradise?  Or was this one of the benefits?

I think for those people, any TV appearance is a benefit.

[Wings]

Dull to see so many with BFs.  Though his show is not designed to meet the love of your life there is some hope that a couple might emerge as Carly and Jade have done.  

Spoiler

The Fleiss tweet claiming new bachelor is going to shock tells me a retread or someone from Paradise. 

Edited June 6, 2017 by wings707

[CindyBee]

2 hours ago, DEL901 said:

So, in order to appear on the Bachelorette as Rachel's besties, they had to sign up for Bachelor in Paradise?  Or was this one of the benefits?

Seems like it!

Cast list  is out:

Original ladies are:

Amanda--bleech, Raven (expect her to be engaged at end), Corinne (there for a paycheck), Alexis (same as Corinne), Lacey (who? someone from Nick's season I have no clue on), Kristina (might end up dumping Jef Holm if someone better comes along), Danielle M, Taylor (why!?!?!), Jasmine.

Original guys are:

Derek (yay, his blue eyes are back), DeMario (without Lexi), Nick (the guy that wore a Santa suit on JoJo's season), Robby (bleech), Ben Z!!!, Alex (JoJo's seson), Vinny

RS said Jack Stone is an original but since he's still on Rachel's season, he can't be released yet.

Let the mad race for Neal Lane bling begin!!!

 

Oh I think we should "guess" Amanda's next guy.  I'm sticking with Jack but maybe one of the others like Alex. 

Edited June 6, 2017 by CindyBee

[DEL901]

http://ew.com/tv/2017/06/06/bachelor-in-paradise-season-4-cast/

 

Looks like the new cast is announced.... including DeMario (but not including any other Rachel rejects)

[chocolatine]

2 hours ago, CindyBee said:

Oh I think we should "guess" Amanda's next guy.  I'm sticking with Jack but maybe one of the others like Alex. 

I don't think she'll go for little Alex. I have a feeling she'll zero in on Ben Z - he seems like a good guy, but not the brightest, so he might fall for her act.

[ByTor]

5 hours ago, CindyBee said:

Taylor (why!?!?!)

So she & Corinne could fight...gee, how original.  On a positive note, no repeat of Ashley or Jared...or those damn twins.

[Wings]

28 minutes ago, ByTor said:

So she & Corinne could fight...gee, how original.  On a positive note, no repeat of Ashley or Jared...or those damn twins.

Ohhh god yes on this!  

[chocolatine]

55 minutes ago, ByTor said:

On a positive note, no repeat of Ashley or Jared...or those damn twins.

The names released today are just the original cast, no? So any of the above could still show up later in the season.

[ByTor]

8 hours ago, chocolatine said:

The names released today are just the original cast, no? So any of the above could still show up later in the season.

Please don't ruin my excitement! ;-)

[Lamb18]

My prediction: Raven and Santa Claus Nick. We'll see.

[CindyBee]

3 hours ago, Lamb18 said:

My prediction: Raven and Santa Claus Nick. We'll see.

Yeah I wouldn't be surprised if Santa Claus Nick ends up being the new Tanner, the "regular guy" that ends up getting engaged.  Either that or he'll enjoy his Mexican vacation on ABC's dime and return to the real world. 

Other guys I can see getting engaged: 

Robby, you know he'd propose to a pinata if he thought that would increase his air time

Vinny, we saw how he falls fast and hard last season

 

Edited to add that RS said in his blog this morning that Jack is not part of the original cast after all.   Must be holding him back, along with Iggy & Diggy, two others from Rachel's season that are suppose to be on. 

Edited June 7, 2017 by CindyBee

[CindyBee]

RS tweeted out this afternoon that production has stopped on Bachelor in Paradise;  that's why contestants have been on social media as they got their phones back.    Doesn't know why filming stopped but believes it will resume.   I'll be sad if I don't have my BiP fix come August.  

[Canada]

2 hours ago, CindyBee said:

RS tweeted out this afternoon that production has stopped on Bachelor in Paradise;  that's why contestants have been on social media as they got their phones back.    Doesn't know why filming stopped but believes it will resume.   I'll be sad if I don't have my BiP fix come August.  

I wonder where in Mexico they're filming.  Just saw a headline online that two severed heads were found near Cabo San Lucas.  Wonder if they're close to there and maybe that's why?

[CindyBee]

40 minutes ago, Canada said:

I wonder where in Mexico they're filming.  Just saw a headline online that two severed heads were found near Cabo San Lucas.  Wonder if they're close to there and maybe that's why?

E! News is saying "misconduct" is the reason why the show was shut down and the cast sent back to the US:

http://www.eonline.com/news/860375/bachelor-in-paradise-production-suspended-amid-misconduct-allegations

RS said in his last tweet he'll have more details soon;  I'm sure his phone is blowing up right now with all kinds of wild rumors, he just needs to figure out what is real and what isn't.

[CindyBee]

Ok, here are Steve's tweets on the situation, the show has been cancelled!

MAJOR SPOILER): From I've been told, the show has been cancelled. They're done. Everyone's being sent home. (1/3)

DeMario & Corinne are the contestants in question. Details are still sketchy, but this is not a good situation (2/3)

I'm not at liberty to throw accusations out. But yeah, drinking, sex, cameras, etc. You get the picture. (3/3)

 

That's just awful that they ruined a fun, fluffy summer program.   Oh well, more time to watch whatever.   

[Canada]

I'm surprised that Chad wasn't involved.  It must have been pretty bad if it had to stop one of the Bachelor shows.  They're not exactly known for their moderation and decorum.

Edited June 11, 2017 by Canada

[chocolatine]

Ugh, I really liked BIP as my summer trash TV. If we're not getting a show, I hope someone leaks exactly what kind of "misconduct" lead to the cancellation.

[nicgwatchingtv]

Quote

What would have to happen for them to not just kick people off the show (which they LOVE to do) but to cancel production and send the cast home? That's pretty big. Maybe Steve is wrong about that part...but they gave them back their phones? That's pretty close to closing production. Unless it's all a stunt.

i was pointed to Amy Kaufman on twitter on the media thread. Don't know if everyone already knows about that writer, but she has more details about what happened

(https://twitter.com/AmyKinLA)

Quote

 

Edited June 12, 2017 by nicgwatchingtv

[zenithwit]

Something isn't adding up here.  Alcohol-fueled hookups are kinda in BiP's wheelhouse.  I'm assuming there was something about this hookup that crossed the line.  Maybe Corinne and/or DeMario were too drunk to consent?  If it was going down that path, why didn't one of the producers step in? (this isn't a nature documentary after all)  Or maybe that was the problem?  Maybe this producer who filed the complaint wanted to stop Corinne & DeMario and was overruled?  

Although I'm sad BiP was canceled, I hope this situation is properly resolved.

[Scorpiosunshine]

1- Whatever is going on, I hope everyone is alright and no one was harmed, and 

2- NOOO!! Damn it!  Grrrrrr @ the horny, sloppy drunk fuckers who ruined my favorite Summer trash before I could watch them being sloppy, drunk, and horny.

 Also, BAHHH to the lily-livered varmint who doesn't understand that documenting all the hooking up is part of the job description! ??

I sooo look forward to this train wreck show, and it's one of the few trashy shows I still watch, and watch with glee!

Fingers crossed they resume taping. /selfishness 

 

Really, though... I want to know more. With all the drinking and sex that happens on these shows, it seems crazy that a mere hookup caused all this drama. 

[MarkHB]

Here's another article, but it says much of what was in that Twitter stream: https://www.msn.com/en-us/tv/news/exclusive-why-bachelor-in-paradise-shut-down-after-incident-between-demario-jackson-and-corinne-olympios/ar-BBCx13v

It sounds like this producer didn't know what kind of show this was. I would think in most cases the usual warning to the contestants would be, " suits have to stay on,  guys."

[saylubee]

http://m.tmz.com/#article/2017/06/11/bachelor-in-paradise-suspended-demario-jackson-corrine-olympios-oral-sex-pool/

TMZ has DeMario's version.  It sounds like there was some consent issues with both parties being drunk and oral sex.

[bosawks]

I just find it hard to believe that this is what's killing Paradise.

If it is I have to believe someone in corporate was itching to pull the plug, I can completely believe that the show was rapidly becoming more trouble than it was worth......

[Martinigirl]

12 hours ago, nicgwatchingtv said:

i was pointed to Amy Kaufman on twitter on the media thread. Don't know if everyone already knows about that writer, but she has more details about what happened

(https://twitter.com/AmyKinLA)

Sounds as if she got her info from an attorney  - third party complaint filed -

[MarkHB]

EW's latest is that the woman may have been too drunk to consent. Even RS has deleted the tweets that named her.

[hnygrl]

Man, for them to kill the show completely night one it must have been *this* close to being real porn. And no, if you're trashed beyond comprehension, aka black-out-drunk, you seriously can't give consent to being filmed. It's just not possible. You're too drunk. Sounds like (from the gossip I've heard) that some really freaky stuff was going on the the filmers were filming, the producer wanted to break it up cause...drunk...and the powers that be wouldn't let her.

We forget don't we....this show is being filmed. There's hundreds of people there behind the scenes, everywhere. Somewhere, in a control room slash conference room, there's a big deal producer person looking at monitors and drooling, yelling into his/her headset, "ARE YOU NUTS???? STOP??? KEEP GOING OR YOU'RE FIRED!!!!" So they kept filming.

I guess the producer person had a bad case of morals afterwards (bad for THIS show) and quit. And sued. On behalf of the people being filmed.

They said they showed them the footage the next day (the sexy drunk ones) and they had no idea they did that. Nether one had any memory of the ordeal in question. Black-out-drunk people cannot give consent.

They went one too far. I hope this ain't the end of the show. I hope it comes back. But with rules. Still a good time-waster, but I don't want anybody feeling violated like that. Imagine if that footage gets out? Can you imagine the bounty on that footage by the porn sites? 

Man, I feel bad for her. Her boyfr...well...ex boyfriend now, her PARENTS. Sheesh.  BiP went too far.

[MakeMeLaugh]

I wonder if the main parties were shown the footage the next day to get after-the-fact consent from them and one of them called his or her father first and that was the end of that. 

This incident is so gross to me and so creepy (and it's on one of the Big 3 networks, not an MTV spring break undercover or whatever that used to be--no wonder Warner Bros. pulled the plug) that I cannot even dignify it with the puns that are screaming to be made about it. Go away, BIP and Fleiss and Bachelor Nation, and take your "Fantasy Suite" with you, by the way. I'm thinking back to when Kaitlyn was the B'ette and Nick and she hooked up on their one-on-one date--that was a day of plenty of hard liquor and she was probably past the point of informed consent, but Show just kept filming and recording the audio during Nick's foreplay at the bar and then outside the hotel room. Not a high morals bar here; had the parties on BIP given consent to their hookup being filmed, what next?

Edited June 12, 2017 by MakeMeLaugh

[booboopbedoo]

Well there goes my Summer fun!

They give them booze and encourage hookups and then say "OH NO!! That is sex!"

Hypocrites  

[Padma]

Good they shut it down because this problem sounds really bad. The "consent issue", to me, sounds as if the woman didn't feel she consented to the sex she was forced to have. Perhaps it was filmed--meaning, now, BiP filmed evidence of a crime.  I feel terrible for the girl if its true and the guy (we already know both names) could have his life unfairly ruined if it isn't. What a mess.

[backformore]

3 hours ago, booboopbedoo said:

Well there goes my Summer fun!

They give them booze and encourage hookups and then say "OH NO!! That is sex!"

Hypocrites  

Who are the hypocrites?   it seemed like the producers wanted it to happen, one person was uncomfortable with it, and Corrine decided it was not consensual. 

[booboopbedoo]

They showed them the video in the morning and neither one remembered it or doing it

[lonestar]

I'm reading Corrine has already hired an attorney for her lawsuit.  I don't understand how, if they were both so drunk, why she or anyone would be blaming him? Both of them did it after willingly consuming too much alcohol.

[MakeMeLaugh]

She won't sue Dimario, she will sue the show for not only pushing the hookup, but also for allowing it to happen (and allowing copious quantities of alcohol), not stopping it, and worse, filming it. Show did the same thing to him, and will quietly settle with both imo. Because it's the show that looks really really bad.

IMO the show is supposed to be the grown up here. No one wouldn't blame the kids if one of them was in that blackout condition and was filmed as he drowned in the hot tup, we'd ask why no one stopped it. Or if one beat the crap out of someone else while a production crew stood by and watched. Just because they all sign waivers doesn't mean the show can skate on responsibility. 

[Mabinogia]

1 hour ago, MakeMeLaugh said:

No one wouldn't blame the kids

Except these are not kids. They are probably around the same age as most of the "grown-ups" on the production staff. I know Corinne acts like an infant but she was not the youngest person on the show, and she is old enough to be aware of the consequences of her actions. Let's face it, this show has been on for about half these people's lives. They should be more savvy by now. But she played with fire, as did DeMario, and they got burned. There is no way they were the first. She's just the first one to think she's not responsible for putting herself in a dangerous situation. You do risky shit, like drink until you can't remember anything, you should take responsibility for what happens. I've been there. I'm not judging the drinking till you black out as much as the blaming others for what happened.

[MakeMeLaugh]

1 hour ago, Mabinogia said:

Except these are not kids. They are probably around the same age as most of the "grown-ups" on the production staff. I know Corinne acts like an infant but she was not the youngest person on the show, and she is old enough to be aware of the consequences of her actions. Let's face it, this show has been on for about half these people's lives. They should be more savvy by now. But she played with fire, as did DeMario, and they got burned. There is no way they were the first. She's just the first one to think she's not responsible for putting herself in a dangerous situation. You do risky shit, like drink until you can't remember anything, you should take responsibility for what happens. I've been there. I'm not judging the drinking till you black out as much as the blaming others for what happened.

I'll change "kids" to "twenty-somethings" for you but I stand by the rest of it. Show picked apoarently well-known nitwits, paid them (so they were technically "employees"), directed them to hook up (and probably to drink and strip--show won't want that footage shown in court), continued providing free alcohol past the point of inebriation, filmed the whole time, and let it continue. We're not talking about a party at someone's house that someone captured on a cell phone and posted to youtube.  So yeah, I blame the people who had a huge commercial interest in the outcome for doing nothing to protect the "kids/twenty somethings/employees" from a situation the show itself created. Not calling the kids innocents but in this case, imo it's totally on the show. Imo the show and Fleiss and Warner Bros and ABC have nothing to gain by fighting this--and the show itself called her a fan favorite so she has some sympathy out there--so they are boxed in.

Thinking about this whole mess makes me need to take a shower, so I'm done posting about it. 

Edited June 13, 2017 by MakeMeLaugh

[ByTor]

7 minutes ago, MakeMeLaugh said:

Thinking about this whole mess makes me need to take a shower

Seriously!

[fib]

I think its important to remember that the show creates a culture of apparent safety: no strangers around, everyone has been std tested and psych approved, your producer is "your friend" looking out for you.   

Then they use that apparent sense of safety to get the participants to go further than they otherwise might, and ply them with mass amounts of alcohol.  

Similar to why frats get in trouble when something terrible happens at parties they host, Bachelor production is hosting a party where they knowingly let things get out of control and supply the booze. And then keep serving booze when people should "have their keys taken away".  Fleiss and co has some responsibility here.  And I think that is why Corinne is suing. 

Note: she is not likely saying she has NO reaponsibility, but that the party hosts have some too.  Especially since they are the sober ones on scene.  

[JenE4]

I'm still confused as to what's "the case" here. It doesn't seem that Corinne is claiming sexual assault, correct? She just feels that someone on production should have stopped her from drinking and/or publically hooking up with DeMario? I would have more empathy if she was sexually assaulted of course! But if it's just--you "let" me get drunk and have sex--sooooooooo... that's the entire premise of the show and happens with multiple couples every summer! I mean, I'm absolutely on the side of the victim and would NEVER take on a "she was asking for it" kind of mentality. My point is--as far as we know--she is not charging DeMario with rape or sexual assault. If she were, my opinion would be the complete opposite! Unless production spiked her drinks or something, I'm not sure how she has any case against them for providing drinks that she chose to drink. And unless they were using hidden cameras--which does happen and MAY be the case here--it's also not really their "fault" for filming what she was doing in a public area in front of cameras. I mean, sure, the dynamic of the show sets up this kind of stuff to happen, but she's still accountable for her own actions--you need to know your OWN limits and not expect that someone else is going to intervene on your behalf--especially when from their perspective she appears to be a willing participant. Would it have been nice for them to do so? Sure. But are they REQUIRED to do so? I'm sure the contracts leave them open to NO liability with the expectation that ANYTHING you do or say during the course of filming can and may be used. Anyway, I don't really want to rush to judgment here. I'm completely open to seeing the fault against the show. Just from what little we know, I'm not sure what made this scenario different from any other. For example, last year, they kicked out Chad when he got too aggressive in the pool with Lace. Why didn't they blame production then? Same scenario with having had WAY too much alcohol and what started out as a mutual hook-up went wrong over the course of the night.

[Padma]

Corinne seems (via television) like the kind of person who -would- lash out at someone else to blame for a situation she regrets. if the woman is drunk and a man has sex with her one could argue it was non-consensual, maybe even assault. But what if both people are very drunk and "in the moment"? What constitutes assault versus consent?

If Corinne charges DiMario with a crime, the tape would be entered as evidence. Likewise, if she sues producers (who surely made everyone sign a very tough release in circumstances where drinking and sex are being encouraged.)

 A strange situation in which participants are adults  and should have some degree of responsibility for their behavior. The show bears responsibility, too but what is it? Privacy? Safety? How much and when should they intervene?

If I were DiMario, I'd be very worried that an event that might have gone uncommented on in his real life could escalate now to something very serious.

[hnygrl]

I don't know if this makes a difference...new details are coming out/leaked almost hourly it seems...

The Producer In Question was/is Corinne's "Best Friend" and was her producer on Bachelor as well.

Maybe that's how Corrine "knew" suddenly....her bestie told her....

What a mess....I guess on a show were immorality and impropriety are encouraged, this was bound to happen eventually. They really should've kept a tighter reign on the storylines...this one just cost a lot of people a lot of money...millions upon millions of dollars down the crapper...forever....no more paradise.

I liked paradise better than the real show, which I mostly watch with the sound off because it's so asinine an stupid. At least paradise knew it was stupid and ran with that...

1 hour ago, JenE4 said:

I mean, sure, the dynamic of the show sets up this kind of stuff to happen, but she's still accountable for her own actions--you need to know your OWN limits and not expect that someone else is going to intervene on your behalf--especially when from their perspective she appears to be a willing participant. Would it have been nice for them to do so? Sure. But are they REQUIRED to do so? I'm sure the contracts leave them open to NO liability with the expectation that ANYTHING you do or say during the course of filming can and may be used.

Any maybe, just maybe, that's why her bestie the producer filed suit? Cause legally, contractually, she couldn't? Thus the third party lawsuit? Now that makes sense...

I repeat...what. a. mess.

[ByTor]

2 hours ago, JenE4 said:

Unless production spiked her drinks or something, I'm not sure how she has any case against them for providing drinks that she chose to drink

I've been pretty much saying the same thing, but then someone on this board  made an analogy to a real-life bartender being liable if he/she continues to serve a visibly intoxicated patron.  I mean, I definitely do not disagree with you, people should know their alcohol limit and take personal responsibility for their actions, but by continuing to provide alcohol the show does bear some responsibility as well.  From what I remember on Nick's season, Corinne's slurred speech was kinda a dead giveaway that she was drunk a lot of the time.

[grape]

i do NOT understand how some can always  know their limits of  drinking. the very first reaction to alcohol is inhibition and to loose judgement.  the student at Penn state knew not any limits, certainly after taking the 1st gulps. he did not know he would die. At the point anyone is black out drunk, it becomes the responsibility of those around the drunk person. too much of this talk sounds dangerously close to blaming the victim. often in sexual assault cases esp. when the victim knows the aggressor, it takes time for the victim to realize he/she was attached at a time he/she could not consent. 

Edited June 13, 2017 by grape

[Mu Shu]

You know, I don't even know who this Demarco guy or Corinne person is, but it sounds like there's a lot of jumping on her side without the facts.   Women can and do assault men.  She just lawyered up first, apparently.

but fuck these losers.  Ruint my show!  Now Carly can't get married, because if it's not televised, it didn't happen!  She'll always be Jan to Jade's Marsha!

Bartender guy probably looked forward to filming, would have been a sweet gig.

losers!

Edited June 13, 2017 by Mu Shu

[booboopbedoo]

I guess she wasn\t ready to share her Platinum Vagina after all!

[ByTor]

30 minutes ago, grape said:

 

i do NOT understand how some can always  know their limits of  drinking.

 

Because people know when they're feeling drunk?  It's not difficult.

Edited June 13, 2017 by ByTor