Season 13: Speculation and Spoilers

[NeverLate]

1 hour ago, HeyThere83 said:

Awww Rachel and Peter seem the most naturally couple-like to me.

I thought so at the very start, but Bryan seems to have captured her heart, plus the chemistry those two have is off the charts. That can't be the only thing, so I suspect they have had long talks that we aren't privy to.I hope everyone finds their happy..life is short.

[SnapeCharmer]

Well, I'm torn. Before Rachel's season I had never watched The Bachelorette, and prior to Nick's season, I hadn't watched The Bachelor since 2010 . I gave up due to the tone and exclusivity of the show. When all the chatter about Jubilee started trending, and after I watched seasons one and two of Unreal, my suspicions about The Bachelor franchise were cemented; it's a heavily manipulated show that sells fake reality. It clearly isn't geared toward my demographic. But when I learned Rachel got the first impression rose during Nick's season, out of curiosity I tuned back in. Logically, I knew that it was all smoke and mirrors - an answer to the charges of racism that gained speed after the Jubilee drama. The storyline was clear from the start of Nick's season. Rachel was going to be the first Black lead on a Bachelor show. In one way it was good for symbolism's sake, but how its played out - not so good. Her show has followed the same trend as the other seasons, and the message that puts out is not one I'm comfortable with. Oh well, we can chalk it up to entertainment at the expense of others. She'll get her entertainment career out of it, so will Bryan, Peter, Eric, and Dean. But as an African-American woman this doesn't endear me to the franchise. Nor does it accurately represent the challenges and triumphs of black women in the dating scene in a real, just light. So I will not be tuning in to future seasons. Look forward to the day when reality television gets back to its roots (season 1 Real World style). True social commentary that makes you think and challenges you beyond your myopic point of view.

Edited July 22, 2017 by Siggystardust

[NeverLate]

7 hours ago, Siggystardust said:

Well, I'm torn. Before Rachel's season I had never watched The Bachelorette, and prior to Nick's season, I hadn't watched The Bachelor since 2010 . I gave up due to the tone and exclusivity of the show. When all the chatter about Jubilee started trending, and after I watched seasons one and two of Unreal, my suspicions about The Bachelor franchise were cemented; it's a heavily manipulated show that sells fake reality. It clearly isn't geared toward my demographic. But when I learned Rachel got the first impression rose during Nick's season, out of curiosity I tuned back in. Logically, I knew that it was all smoke and mirrors - an answer to the charges of racism that gained speed after the Jubilee drama. The storyline was clear from the start of Nick's season. Rachel was going to be the first Black lead on a Bachelor show. In one way it was good for symbolism's sake, but how its played out - not so good. Her show has followed the same trend as the other seasons, and the message that puts out is not one I'm comfortable with. Oh well, we can chalk it up to entertainment at the expense of others. She'll get her entertainment career out of it, so will Bryan, Peter, Eric, and Dean. But as an African-American woman this doesn't endear me to the franchise. Nor does it accurately represent the challenges and triumphs of black women in the dating scene in a real, just light. So I will not be tuning in to future seasons. Look forward to the day when reality television gets back to its roots (season 1 Real World style). True social commentary that makes you think and challenges you beyond your myopic point of view.

As Simon Cowell calls it, that bloody rose show..? isn't going to change. Its light and fluffy and staying that way. I love Rachel though, best bacherlotte in a long time. Reality TV is rigged, fake, and scripted. I happen to enjoy it.;) 

[In2You]

15 hours ago, Siggystardust said:

Well, I'm torn. Before Rachel's season I had never watched The Bachelorette, and prior to Nick's season, I hadn't watched The Bachelor since 2010 . I gave up due to the tone and exclusivity of the show. When all the chatter about Jubilee started trending, and after I watched seasons one and two of Unreal, my suspicions about The Bachelor franchise were cemented; it's a heavily manipulated show that sells fake reality. It clearly isn't geared toward my demographic. But when I learned Rachel got the first impression rose during Nick's season, out of curiosity I tuned back in. Logically, I knew that it was all smoke and mirrors - an answer to the charges of racism that gained speed after the Jubilee drama. The storyline was clear from the start of Nick's season. Rachel was going to be the first Black lead on a Bachelor show. In one way it was good for symbolism's sake, but how its played out - not so good. Her show has followed the same trend as the other seasons, and the message that puts out is not one I'm comfortable with. Oh well, we can chalk it up to entertainment at the expense of others. She'll get her entertainment career out of it, so will Bryan, Peter, Eric, and Dean. But as an African-American woman this doesn't endear me to the franchise. Nor does it accurately represent the challenges and triumphs of black women in the dating scene in a real, just light. So I will not be tuning in to future seasons. Look forward to the day when reality television gets back to its roots (season 1 Real World style). True social commentary that makes you think and challenges you beyond your myopic point of view.

You cannot come into an already long established show expecting changes and for it to make a statement about social injustice. This is just not and will never be that kind of show. What you want to see will never play out on reality tv. You're better off hoping someone writes a drama series about it.

Edited July 23, 2017 by In2You

[Wings]

18 hours ago, F. M. said:

I thought so at the very start, but Bryan seems to have captured her heart, plus the chemistry those two have is off the charts. That can't be the only thing, so I suspect they have had long talks that we aren't privy to.

It remains a mystery why we are not shown more real moments.  The out takes and deleted scenes give us brief glances that could be included.  

Edited July 23, 2017 by wings707

[Wings]

There are 3 things of interest left.

• Men Tell All 
• Rachael's family reactions to the final 3. 
• Does she have sex with both Peter and Bryan or just Bryan and will we be able to tell.

The rest is manipulated filler.

[NeverLate]

3 hours ago, wings707 said:

It remains a mystery why we are not shown more real moments.  The out takes and deleted scenes give us brief glances that could be included.  

I agree. I guess TPTB don't think we'd be interested. I have heard them say, we had a long talk about religion, for some thats very important. Maybe the real moments don't go well with the fantasy MF seems to love? 

[SnapeCharmer]

10 hours ago, In2You said:

You cannot come into an already long established show expecting changes and for it to make a statement about social injustice. This is just not and will never be that kind of show. What you want to see will never play out on reality tv. You're better off hoping someone writes a drama series about it.

I did not expect anything, prior to this season. As I clearly stated, I stopped watching the show in 2010. Until...the franchise itself claimed to be changing when they made Rachel the Bachelorette and continuously injected race into the story line. Under the guise they were/are doing something socially significant. They could've kept their light and fluffy white show for another ten plus years and no one outside of its established fanbase would have cared. Media has power. Pop culture for better or worst shapes larger ideas that act out in our daily lives. With great power comes greater responsibility and all that jazz. But aside from that, I'll bet that you don't see my point of view and I probably will never see yours. We come from two different places  of thought and experiences.

Edited July 23, 2017 by Siggystardust
corrections

[catrice2]

2 minutes ago, Siggystardust said:

I did not expect anything, prior to this season. As I clearly stated, I stopped watching the show in 2010. Until...the franchise itself claimed to be changing when they made Rachel the Bachelorette and continuously injected race into the story line. Under the guise they were/are doing something socially significant. They could've kept their light and fluffy white show for another ten plus years and no one outside of its established fanbase would have cared. Media has power. Pop culture for better or worst shapes larger ideas that act out in our daily lives. With great power comes greater responsibility and all that jazz. But aside from that, I'll bet that you don't see my point of view and I probably will never see yours. We come from two different places thought and experiences.

I totally agree.  A franchise like this should never have edited itself to in anyway be perceived as addressing race.....especially not in the way that they did it.  I don't know that anyone expected the show to address social injustice, but just hoped that it would not continue to foster negative stereotypes.  There was a happy medium, or a "same old same old" approach that they could have taken, but they put themselves in a different position when they decided to play games with casting and several other things.   I don't know why everyone keeps focusing on Lee.  There were so many stereotypes and undercover slights to several groups of people that it is just mind boggling

[NeverLate]

Just now, catrice2 said:

I totally agree.  A franchise like this should never have edited itself to in anyway be perceived as addressing race.....especially not in the way that they did it.  I don't know that anyone expected the show to address social injustice, but just hoped that it would not continue to foster negative stereotypes.  There was a happy medium, or a "same old same old" approach that they could have taken, but they put themselves in a different position when they decided to play games with casting and several other things.   I don't know why everyone keeps focusing on Lee.  There were so many stereotypes and undercover slights to several groups of people that it is just mind boggling

I paid little to no attention to Lee. He was on the show, he was shown to be a bigot imho.That's all I need to see, any deeper and it would have been a docudrama..and thats not what this show is. Any race that goes on this show, knows what to expect..

[SnapeCharmer]

1 minute ago, catrice2 said:

I totally agree.  A franchise like this should never have edited itself to in anyway be perceived as addressing race.....especially not in the way that they did it.  I don't know that anyone expected the show to address social injustice, but just hoped that it would not continue to foster negative stereotypes.  There was a happy medium, or a "same old same old" approach that they could have taken, but they put themselves in a different position when they decided to play games with casting and several other things.   I don't know why everyone keeps focusing on Lee.  There were so many stereotypes and undercover slights to several groups of people that it is just mind boggling

Yes. there's more going on than just the Lee issue. Many have discussed it on here. Prior to my first post, I avoided getting into those discussions, because I know how these topics go. Also, my point about social commentary in my first post was not specifically about the Bachelor Franchise taking on those issues. It was simply a remark about how I wish reality television in general got back to its roots. It hasn't been anything close to what the Real World started as, a true social experiment. Without all the production manipulation for entertainment value. 

3 minutes ago, F. M. said:

I paid little to no attention to Lee. He was on the show, he was shown to be a bigot imho.That's all I need to see, any deeper and it would have been a docudrama..and thats not what this show is. Any race that goes on this show, knows what to expect..

Yeah it isn't significant to you, I get that. But for me, it is significant.

[catrice2]

3 minutes ago, Siggystardust said:

Yes. there's more going on than just the Lee issue. Many have discussed it on here. Prior to my first post, I avoided getting into those discussions, because I know how these topics go. Also, my point about social commentary in my first post was not specifically about the Bachelor Franchise taking on those issues. It was simply a remark about how I wish reality television in general got back to its roots. It hasn't been anything close to what the Real World started as, a true social experiment. Without all the production manipulation for entertainment value. 

Yeah it isn't significant to you, I get that. But for me, it is significant.

No, I understood what you meant.  I have never been a big fan of reality television and I don't know that I ever watched more than a few episodes of different seasons of the Real World, but I know what you mean.  If I were to to watch reality tv, I would be more drawn to that than to something like the Real Housewives or this franchise that seems to just keep wanting to manufacture things to up the drama and fan the flames with different viewer groups.  The Real World may have as well, but in the few episodes that I can remember, (at least in the early seasons) it just seemed more organic with situations that would naturally occur if YOUNG people from varied backgrounds had to live together in a different city.   It just seems to have an ugly tone to it that I don't find enjoyable.  Also the Real World was typically very young people starting out in life and the shows I referenced are supposed to be older, more sophisticated and/or educated just saying really childish stuff and engaging in juvenile behavior. 

 I typically watch Reality Competition shows, but skipped even the Top Chef seasons when they focused on drama of who didn't like each other or there was fighting among contestants.   Same with Project Runway, any of the season where they have "groups" or people against other I check out.  

[NeverLate]

31 minutes ago, Siggystardust said:

Yes. there's more going on than just the Lee issue. Many have discussed it on here. Prior to my first post, I avoided getting into those discussions, because I know how these topics go. Also, my point about social commentary in my first post was not specifically about the Bachelor Franchise taking on those issues. It was simply a remark about how I wish reality television in general got back to its roots. It hasn't been anything close to what the Real World started as, a true social experiment. Without all the production manipulation for entertainment value. 

Yeah it isn't significant to you, I get that. But for me, it is significant.

I'm not going to get into it, but you don't know what is, or is not, significant to me in my everyday life.

[In2You]

When did the franchise declare they were changing simply because they cast Rachel? Cuz I remember alot of pimping the first black bachelorette but I don't remember them declaring to take a stand against racism and stereotypes.

[Bugs Meany]

10 hours ago, In2You said:

When did the franchise declare they were changing simply because they cast Rachel? Cuz I remember alot of pimping the first black bachelorette but I don't remember them declaring to take a stand against racism and stereotypes.

No, but they did make the bizarre claim that they announced her early because they wanted to find her a great group of guys. Then they cast a guy who they definitely knew had posted racist tweets. That should tell you how delicately they treated the race issue.

[SnapeCharmer]

On 7/23/2017 at 4:48 PM, catrice2 said:

No, I understood what you meant.  I have never been a big fan of reality television and I don't know that I ever watched more than a few episodes of different seasons of the Real World, but I know what you mean.  If I were to to watch reality tv, I would be more drawn to that than to something like the Real Housewives or this franchise that seems to just keep wanting to manufacture things to up the drama and fan the flames with different viewer groups.  The Real World may have as well, but in the few episodes that I can remember, (at least in the early seasons) it just seemed more organic with situations that would naturally occur if YOUNG people from varied backgrounds had to live together in a different city.   It just seems to have an ugly tone to it that I don't find enjoyable.  Also the Real World was typically very young people starting out in life and the shows I referenced are supposed to be older, more sophisticated and/or educated just saying really childish stuff and engaging in juvenile behavior. 

 I typically watch Reality Competition shows, but skipped even the Top Chef seasons when they focused on drama of who didn't like each other or there was fighting among contestants.   Same with Project Runway, any of the season where they have "groups" or people against other I check out.  

Me too. Survivor was my favorite, but I haven't watched it in a while. Same with the Amazing Race, Design Star, and Master Chef....pretty much any of my former faves. This is the first time I've watched a reality show in a while. Not to say there weren't times I delved into the ratchet side of RTV. I had some guilty pleasure like  Real World, Big Brother UK/AU/US. But that is as far as I delved on that end of the reality television spectrum.

[SnapeCharmer]

On 7/23/2017 at 4:32 PM, catrice2 said:

I totally agree.  A franchise like this should never have edited itself to in anyway be perceived as addressing race.....especially not in the way that they did it.  I don't know that anyone expected the show to address social injustice, but just hoped that it would not continue to foster negative stereotypes.  There was a happy medium, or a "same old same old" approach that they could have taken, but they put themselves in a different position when they decided to play games with casting and several other things.   I don't know why everyone keeps focusing on Lee.  There were so many stereotypes and undercover slights to several groups of people that it is just mind boggling

I watch Unreal, I don't know if you do too. But a lot of viewers complained about the second season due to the focus on race, and how certain things played out. However the real "tea" of that season is how the production characters manipulated racial issues for entertainment. How they sought out the "Blactivist" and the ignorant proud southern white girl with bigoted views, knowing conflict would ensue (and stoked that conflict). I believe something very similar happened with the Lee situation. They knew his social media posting history, sought him out, and cast him in the show for divisive purposes. The thing that bothers me most is that Rachel went along with that crap by keeping him so long. That's one of a few things that turned me off of her. 

Another side point about Unreal is how during the first season, they showed producers manipulating Home Town visits. When I watched Dean's hometown visit I could not help but think of Unreal. In the first season, one character was set up to be humiliated during her home town visit. What it showed was that, as soon as producers find something they can exploit, they do. This is what frustrated me about Dean. If he caught how production tried to coax him into a soundbite against Lee, how could he not see the glaringly obvious way they were manipulating his family issues for entertainment? Why would he subject himself (and his family) to that?

Further demonstrates to me that majority of those cast on these shows from the leads to their potential mates are in it for fame and to further their respective careers; most likely in entertainment. Fame at all cost I guess. Too bad it doesn't work out for most of them.

[Canada]

This is the Bachelor franchise.  It's never been about anything other than giving young-ish people lots of alcohol and an outlet for their stupidity.  It's about causing drama and getting press coverage and an increase in their viewers.  That's it.  There's never been anything realistic or altruistic about it.  It's not about love or equality.  Anyone who watches for those reasons is going to be sadly disappointed.

[SnapeCharmer]

On 7/23/2017 at 5:09 PM, F. M. said:

I'm not going to get into it, but you don't know what is, or is not, significant to me in my everyday life.

Fair enough. But your original response carried a dismissive tone. Maybe that wasn't your intention. On that note, take care.

[NeverLate]

3 hours ago, Siggystardust said:

Fair enough. But your original response carried a dismissive tone. Maybe that wasn't your intention. On that note, take care.

Sorry, it wasn't meant to be, its just this forum isnt ( for me)  a place to carry on a meaningful conversation, when it entails a fluffy trashy show..  that's all :)

[truthaboutluv]

I think this season's AFR is going to be interesting. I don't foresee a Nick and Vanessa awkwardness since Rachel has maintained her giddy, gushiness about how amazing her fiance is and how happy she is. But I'm starting to get the feeling that she is a little irritated at all the Bryan hate and backlash on social media and particularly all the Peter fawning and is beyond ready for the season to be over. She and Bryan seem to be reaching the "no chill" phase, making comments that are not very subtle at all and wow, her People Magazine blog couldn't scream any louder, "here is why I picked and am engaged to Bryan and not Peter". Also, Astrid from Nick's season who is one of Rachel's closest friends from the season, basically blew the whole thing even more. She did so well for an almost 30 minute interview but literally in the last two minutes, she talked about how Rachel and her fiance are going to have an engagement party in Dallas after the season wraps and then another in Miami. 

Edited July 25, 2017 by truthaboutluv

[CindyBee]

Poor Astrid, giving it away.  Luckily anyone with half a brain knows its Bryan now, especially with all the watch wearing going on by Bryan and Rachel and what she's been saying in the media.

And agree, Rachel is sooooooo over this season and the Peter love that its actually quite amusing.  And I don't think she's going to warm and fuzzy to Peter come "After the final Rose", esp after her "shady" tweet last night.  Should be a good show for once.  

[nutty1]

Here is the link to the Astrid interview.....it's the last minute.

 

[leighdear]

Wow, that was incredibly stupid of that chick to say that.  Though I don't imagine too many people saw that interview.   

And those painted-on eyebrows are unbelievably distracting.  How can these women think that's attractive?

[dom16]

All I want out of this ATFR is for Rachel to call Peter out on his very obvious Bachelor audition. You're not ready to propose to her, but you'll suddenly muster up the strength to propose to some 24 year old event planner from LA in a few months? It sucks for her that she's getting all the blame/criticism when he's the one that's been stringing her along.

[gator12]

No one is stringing Rachel along, since she pick Brian since the first kiss on day one. Beside Rachel wasn't all that different from Peter on Nick season. 

[leighdear]

And the producers would never allow that kind of conversation on the air. They only allow the beat-downs, freak outs, meltdowns and tantrums that THEY create and script.  Nobody that goes off book gets their rants aired unless it specifically fits what story the producers have already created.  

[Venee]

The winner is clearly Bryan (wow Astrid way to go eyeroll)  The next Bachelor should be Blake K ! I don't think Peter wants to be "The Bachelor" as much as people think he does.

https://www.buzzfeed.com/terripous/an-ode-to-blake-k-the-bachelorette-contestant-who-went-home?utm_term=.kxKdGoadQ#.vhovkV2vZ

Edited July 26, 2017 by Venee

[waving feather]

12 hours ago, nutty1 said:

Here is the link to the Astrid interview.....it's the last minute.

 

Wow. Is this the first time a friend of a contestant spoiled the show completely without even realizing it? Like, I don't think she even noticed that she said "Miami" but the host definitely noticed and was fumbling at the end. I feel bad for both of them but yeah, these Bachelor Nation girls need more interview training. Rachel, on the other hand, has been very good at playing with her words and being on guard with interviewers from getting it out of her.

[truthaboutluv]

3 hours ago, gator12 said:

No one is stringing Rachel along, since she pick Brian since the first kiss on day one. Beside Rachel wasn't all that different from Peter on Nick season. 

YMMV but I don't think she picked Bryan from day one. I've said this before but I actually do think this was a season where the lead didn't zero in on their pick from Night One. She was definitely very, very attracted to Bryan but I think she really did like Peter and she seemed really happy after their first one on one. I just think things stalled because dude was giving the woman nothing. It was all push and pull with him. Give a little to keep her interested, only to take ten steps back.  

Also, I know a lot of people have compared him to Rachel during Nick's season but I think in fairness to Rachel, her issue during Nick's season seemed to be a fear of being hurt if she opened up and yes, she was skeptical at first about the process working. Peter's issue just seems to be that he doesn't believe at all that a proposal at the end of the whole thing is right and will not budge on that and two, which is the most important part in my opinion, he is not into her. Rachel was into Nick in my opinion. She may not have been in love with him but she was into him. I don't even get that from Peter for Rachel. 

Also, for the many saying that Rachel should pick Peter regardless because it should only matter who she loves and not how not into her he is because "well he's hot" (people don't say that part but I think it's understood), I saw an interview with Rachel where she said something I found very interesting and sad actually. She said the conversations and issues with Peter made her feel the way she felt with many ex-boyfriends, where she was told all these amazing things about herself, "you're smart, you're beautiful, you're amazing" but at the end she was still not good enough to commit to. That to me said it all. If a person makes you feel that way, cut them loose.

Edited July 26, 2017 by truthaboutluv

[waving feather]

Bryan was one of her favorites (maybe Top 5?) but I don't think she zeroed in on him early on like some of the other Bachelorettes. In the beginning, after their first date, she actually appeared very into Peter and I think she had him in her Top 2/3 from that point forward. He was definitely making hometowns then. I only saw the change in Rachel towards Bryan on their second one-on-one date. I think he started being her favorite only from that point forward.

[Ohwell]

13 hours ago, leighdear said:

And those painted-on eyebrows are unbelievably distracting.  How can these women think that's attractive?

I will be so glad when that trend is over.

[truthaboutluv]

And Peter has made his first Instagram shilling post. But I'm sure he was absolutely on this show for purely genuine reasons and will be passing up The Bachelor offer when it comes. 

[Kira53]

9 hours ago, truthaboutluv said:

YMMV but I don't think she picked Bryan from day one. I've said this before but I actually do think this was a season where the lead didn't zero in on their pick from Night One. She was definitely very, very attracted to Bryan but I think she really did like Peter and she seemed really happy after their first one on one. I just think things stalled because dude was giving the woman nothing. It was all push and pull with him. Give a little to keep her interested, only to take ten steps back.  

Also, I know a lot of people have compared him to Rachel during Nick's season but I think in fairness to Rachel, her issue during Nick's season seemed to be a fear of being hurt if she opened up and yes, she was skeptical at first about the process working. Peter's issue just seems to be that he doesn't believe at all that a proposal at the end of the whole thing is right and will not budge on that and two, which is the most important part in my opinion, he is not into her. Rachel was into Nick in my opinion. She may not have been in love with him but she was into him. I don't even get that from Peter for Rachel. 

Also, for the many saying that Rachel should pick Peter regardless because it should only matter who she loves and not how not into her he is because "well he's hot" (people don't say that part but I think it's understood), I saw an interview with Rachel where she said something I found very interesting and sad actually. She said the conversations and issues with Peter made her feel the way she felt with many ex-boyfriends, where she was told all these amazing things about herself, "you're smart, you're beautiful, you're amazing" but at the end she was still not good enough to commit to. That to me said it all. If a person makes you feel that way, cut them loose.

 I think that Rachel had already centered on getting a proposal most definitely from chipmunk cheeked Bryan given that he expressed physical touch (one of her language love languages) in an extreme way the minute he met her and he seemed to be clear that he loved being on camera and might want the benefits of getting married to the bachelorette.

If she actually did want Peter, I think she made a very strategic mistake. Peter needed to receive the watch or at least not to see Bryan get the watch. A cautious person would be even more cautious once such an expensive watch was given. And Peter is a cautious person.  The fact that she had a matching watch?  Come on why would he propose? Peter seems to me to be the kind of guy that needed a definite proof that he was number one.   And that still wouldn't have guaranteed a proposal at the end of the show.  I believe she could've given Peter the watch and Bryan would still have proposed.  But Rachel gave Bryan the watch to seal the deal in that she was not willing to have any uncertainty about having a fiancé at the end of the show.

So I think she went with the definte proposal since her goal was an engagement not necessarily a marriage. Perhaps she sees this is the best way to move into her career in sports entertainment which is something she's been pursuing since law school. So Bryan is probably a steppingstone and a failed engagement wouldn't be that surprising in the world of the bachelorette/bachelor. The important thing is to get that job in sports entertainment on camera.  Besides, if she gets that on camera job which I'm sure she will, if(when) her engagement fails she'll be in another strata to meet the right guy.   If they can stay together and possibly even get a paid for wedding that's a good option too.   Personally I really think the whole bachelor show and then when she got the opportunity for the bachelorette was all about getting that sports camera live job that she's been take chasing since law school.  it's a great audition tape.  I didn't see her on the bachelor so all of this projection is just based on seeing her on this show.   It just seems to me that most people do the show with ambitions that it will improve their career options and or money on Instagram or some other social media platform. 

[CindyBee]

1 hour ago, truthaboutluv said:

And Peter has made his first Instagram shilling post. But I'm sure he was absolutely on this show for purely genuine reasons and will be passing up The Bachelor offer when it comes. 

I'm very sad it wasn't teeth whitener but FabFitFun is usually where they all start.   If he does gummy hair bears, I'll laugh my ass off.

[truthaboutluv]

21 minutes ago, CindyBee said:

I'm very sad it wasn't teeth whitener but FabFitFun is usually where they all start.   If he does gummy hair bears, I'll laugh my ass off.

Nah I think the the gummy hair stuff is the more from the women from the franchise. 

 

Quote

If she actually did want Peter, I think she made a very strategic mistake. Peter needed to receive the watch or at least not to see Bryan get the watch. A cautious person would be even more cautious once such an expensive watch was given. And Peter is a cautious person.  The fact that she had a matching watch?  Come on why would he propose? Peter seems to me to be the kind of guy that needed a definite proof that he was number one.   And that still wouldn't have guaranteed a proposal at the end of the show.  I believe she could've given Peter the watch and Bryan would still have proposed.  But Rachel gave Bryan the watch to seal the deal in that she was not willing to have any uncertainty about having a fiancé at the end of the show.

I've seen so many comments focusing on the watch regarding Peter's behavior but YMMV, I don't buy that. I called Peter not being into Rachel from their first one on one. Peter has seemed arms length with Rachel all season. It didn't start when she gifted Bryan with a fancy watch since that didn't happen until well into the season. Long before the watch he was kissing her while having his hands clasped to his chest, where she had to lean up into him and let's never forget her having to ask him to kiss her. 

I don't get how she should have given him the watch to show him he's Number 1 and even then he still might not have proposed but it would be more acceptable. At the end of the day, yes this is a relationship between two people but who is the lead here exactly? And I feel like that mentality is the exact type of attitude I've gotten from Peter.  Like he is the lead and Rachel has to come to him and compromise to his feelings and his wants. And she gets judged about wanting an engagement like she is annoying for focusing on that even if she made it clear that's what she wanted from the beginning. 

And if Peter was so upset about not being number 1 when Bryan got that watch and it strengthened his resolve to not propose, then leave. But again, how would he be the next Bachelor? Reading comments online, I just can't help feeling like for many viewers this season became about Peter and not Rachel. So Rachel needed to adjust to what Peter wanted, make Peter feel special, don't dare make it seem like she is into Bryan or anyone else might possibly be more important than Peter because she should know that is unacceptable. And I'm sorry but say what? In the words of Beyonce, "boy, bye."

Edited July 26, 2017 by truthaboutluv

[In2You]

Is Peter selling Flat Tummy tea yet?

[waving feather]

I thought FabFitFun is just for ladies? Lol. I haven't looked but are the men from the Bachelor franchise shilling FFF boxes as well? Because he has a promo code and all.

[CindyBee]

1 hour ago, In2You said:

Is Peter selling Flat Tummy tea yet?

No but that's probably next.  Either that or those sunglasses that everyone does too.   

 

1 hour ago, waving feather said:

I thought FabFitFun is just for ladies? Lol. I haven't looked but are the men from the Bachelor franchise shilling FFF boxes as well? Because he has a promo code and all.

I haven't seen any of the guys sell FabFitFun before but there could have been someone as I really only follow a few souls on twitter now and the shilling tends to take place on Instagram.

[SnapeCharmer]

Nick's season is the first I've watched of The Bachelor in a long while and this is my first season watching The Bachelorette. But I have never in the past noticed the kind of fanaticism that's happening with Peter. Not for this show. What the hayle is it about him? Is it the salt and pepper hair? I don't get it at all. 

[JenE4]

3 hours ago, Siggystardust said:

Nick's season is the first I've watched of The Bachelor in a long while and this is my first season watching The Bachelorette. But I have never in the past noticed the kind of fanaticism that's happening with Peter. Not for this show. What the hayle is it about him? Is it the salt and pepper hair? I don't get it at all. 

As I mentioned before, I don't know where this fanaticism is happening; sure isn't around here. But there are ALWAYS guys that people go CRAZY over. We barely heard Juan Pablo say 3 words and they made him the Bachelor because everyone was gaga over the hot guy in the background. And people STILL go on and on about how Arie was the hottest thing since...um, toasted sliced bread, lol...or something. Every season people come out in full force that THIS will be the year they finally make Arie the Bachelor. 

[DEL901]

I wonder if some of the fanaticism started because Reality Steve declared him the winner, people got invested and then he changed his declaration?

[Madding crowd]

I'm crazy about Peter because I think he is the hottest guy to be on the show in a long time. And I like his personality. Bryan does nothing for me. We all have our own tastes.

[truthaboutluv]

54 minutes ago, DEL901 said:

I wonder if some of the fanaticism started because Reality Steve declared him the winner, people got invested and then he changed his declaration?

It started before the changing spoilers. I remember many people who were following spoilers waiting with bated breath for Reality Steve's spoiler of who was Final 1 and wanting desperately for it to be Peter. When RS posted the first spoiler, all it did was just increase the growing obsession that had already started and for some just solidified their feelings. 

 

Quote

As I mentioned before, I don't know where this fanaticism is happening; sure isn't around here. But there are ALWAYS guys that people go CRAZY over. We barely heard Juan Pablo say 3 words and they made him the Bachelor because everyone was gaga over the hot guy in the background. And people STILL go on and on about how Arie was the hottest thing since...um, toasted sliced bread, lol...or something. Every season people come out in full force that THIS will be the year they finally make Arie the Bachelor. 

Yes, if this board is your only point of reference regarding the show, the Peter fanaticism will not be obvious because that's just not the kind of discussion that happens here regarding the show. Most of it is snark about everyone. Truth is, if you're not on social media, you will never see that stuff because that is where the crazy truly lives and that goes for everything. If you want to see levels of batshit crazy about any topic - social media is the go-to. 

I don't disagree that there have always been some level of intense fanning for certain contestants. In fact, earlier this season, I did compare the Peter craziness to the Arie fangirling.  I thought Ben Higgins was put on a pedestal as well. I actually disagree about Juan Pablo. I may be in the minority on this but I never bought that there was this swell of fan love and craziness over Juan Pablo. If I recall correctly, I think the lawsuit about the show never having a POC lead had started the year before or so because I remember it started right around the time they made Sean the Bachelor.

Then Des' season didn't really have a huge fan favorite for the next lead. Chris might have made a decent lead but she chose him, people hated Brooks for leaving, some people liked Drew (her Final 2 ) but not overwhelmingly so and viewers weren't going crazy for Michael the lawyer either, who was Final 4. So I think the producers decided to go with Juan Pablo because they figured it would satisfy some with the criticism of their never having a POC as a lead and there had been comments around social media from viewers who thought he was hot. But I personally never saw this massive swell of Juan Pablo fanaticism. 

Back to Peter, and again this is just my observation, but I think what has also made things regarding him so baffling to some like myself, is the level of intensity it's taken on to the point of how hateful things have gotten towards others. Right from the start and the changing spoiler didn't help, there was this Peter vs. Bryan narrative for some. It wasn't just Peter is great. It was Peter equals perfect and Bryan equals everything wrong with a human being. Okay, fine, whatever.  There was some level of Arie vs. Jef during Emily's season, even though the irony was that the two guys in question got along just fine. But Rachel was spared from that because with the dueling spoilers, there was still a chance of it going either way. However, as we're nearing the end and the neon signs that Bryan probably is the Final 1 are shining brighter and brighter, the attacks against Rachel have become vicious. 

She's been accused of being an insult to women, insult to feminism, she has no respect for herself to pick a man who referred to her as sloppy seconds, she's been slut shamed as being obsessed with sex and that's why she chose Bryan, she doesn't deserve Peter anyway, she was never beautiful enough for Peter anyway (she was when the original spoiler said he was F1), etc. etc. After Astrid's slip, someone tweeted to Rachel that Bryan would probably try to fuck one of her girlfriends at their engagement party. It's just become insane. And for me, what I notice is that things have gotten so crazy because many of these people in my opinion have stopped seeing this as being about Rachel and it is all about Peter. 

Edited July 27, 2017 by truthaboutluv

[CindyBee]

35 minutes ago, truthaboutluv said:

Back to Peter, and again this is just my observation, but I think what has also made things regarding him so baffling to some like myself, is the level of intensity it's taken on to the point of how hateful things have gotten towards others. Right from the start and the changing spoiler didn't help, there was this Peter vs. Bryan narrative for some. It wasn't just Peter is great. It was Peter equals perfect and Bryan equals everything wrong with a human being. Okay, fine, whatever.  There was some level of Arie vs. Jef during Emily's season, even though the irony was that the two guys in question got along just fine. But Rachel was spared from that because with the dueling spoilers, there was still a chance of it going either way. However, as we're nearing the end and the neon signs that Bryan probably is the Final 1 are shining brighter and brighter, the attacks against Rachel have become vicious. 

She's been accused of being an insult to women, insult to feminism, she has no respect for herself to pick a man who referred to her as sloppy seconds, she's been slut shamed as being obsessed with sex and that's why she chose Bryan, she doesn't deserve Peter anyway, she was never beautiful enough for Peter anyway (she was when the original spoiler said he was F1), etc. etc. After Astrid's slip, someone tweeted to Rachel that Bryan would probably try to fuck one of her girlfriends at their engagement party. It's just become insane. And for me, what I notice is that things have gotten so crazy because many of these people in my opinion have stopped seeing this as being about Rachel and it is all about Peter. 

 

The crazy surrounding this season is indeed reaching levels we haven't seen since Emily's season with Twitter and Instragram being one big ole love fest for Peter and one big ole hate fest for Rachel/Bryan and its very, very, very disturbing as what is the point of saying the crap that is being spewed towards Rachel just cause she's with Bryan!?!?  

I rarely care about what happens after the finale airs but all this hate is making me a bit annoyed and I do hope that they can put their blinders on and enjoy coming out into the real world and being with their family and friends.   Whether it lasts or not, who cares, I just want Peter's crazy ass fans to leave them alone. 

Edited July 27, 2017 by CindyBee

[truthaboutluv]

Just now, CindyBee said:

Whether it lasts or not, who cares, I just want Peter's crazy ass fans to leave them alone. 

Well hopefully he'll be made the next Bachelor so they'll be consumed with that. Of course that doesn't air until next year. I thought all the "Team Raven" and "you should have picked Raven" comments on Nick's social media every time he posts something with Vanessa was ridiculous but I'm willing to bet that the "You should have picked Peter" sentiments will put those Raven fans to shame any time Rachel or Bryan will post anything with each other. And Rachel said in an interview that one of the first things she wants to do when the finale airs is to finally make an Instagram post with her fiance. It's like good luck with that. Of course, maybe the small contingent of Peter/Rachel fans still holding on are right and this has all been the biggest ruse and foiler season and Peter really is the Final 1. 

[DEL901]

If Peter ends up as the Bachelor, it will be interesting to see how the Peter-fandom react to the women, esp F1

[chocolatine]

I'm just baffled by the strong reactions on social media. Neither Bryan nor Peter is a prize in my book. The former is a smarmy mama's boy with dubious professional qualifications. The latter is a dimwit pretty boy with a fear of commitment. I guess if I had to pick one, I'd say Peter is less objectionable, but still, meh.

[CindyBee]

33 minutes ago, DEL901 said:

If Peter ends up as the Bachelor, it will be interesting to see how the Peter-fandom react to the women, esp F1

 

Please, please, please let Peter pick Courtney 2.0 so the fans loose their collective minds and I can enjoy the meltdowns!

[SnapeCharmer]

On 7/27/2017 at 7:51 AM, truthaboutluv said:

It started before the changing spoilers. I remember many people who were following spoilers waiting with bated breath for Reality Steve's spoiler of who was Final 1 and wanting desperately for it to be Peter. When RS posted the first spoiler, all it did was just increase the growing obsession that had already started and for some just solidified their feelings. 

 

Yes, if this board is your only point of reference regarding the show, the Peter fanaticism will not be obvious because that's just not the kind of discussion that happens here regarding the show. Most of it is snark about everyone. Truth is, if you're not on social media, you will never see that stuff because that is where the crazy truly lives and that goes for everything. If you want to see levels of batshit crazy about any topic - social media is the go-to. 

I don't disagree that there have always been some level of intense fanning for certain contestants. In fact, earlier this season, I did compare the Peter craziness to the Arie fangirling.  I thought Ben Higgins was put on a pedestal as well. I actually disagree about Juan Pablo. I may be in the minority on this but I never bought that there was this swell of fan love and craziness over Juan Pablo. If I recall correctly, I think the lawsuit about the show never having a POC lead had started the year before or so because I remember it started right around the time they made Sean the Bachelor.

Then Des' season didn't really have a huge fan favorite for the next lead. Chris might have made a decent lead but she chose him, people hated Brooks for leaving, some people liked Drew (her Final 2 ) but not overwhelmingly so and viewers weren't going crazy for Michael the lawyer either, who was Final 4. So I think the producers decided to go with Juan Pablo because they figured it would satisfy some with the criticism of their never having a POC as a lead and there had been comments around social media from viewers who thought he was hot. But I personally never saw this massive swell of Juan Pablo fanaticism. 

Back to Peter, and again this is just my observation, but I think what has also made things regarding him so baffling to some like myself, is the level of intensity it's taken on to the point of how hateful things have gotten towards others. Right from the start and the changing spoiler didn't help, there was this Peter vs. Bryan narrative for some. It wasn't just Peter is great. It was Peter equals perfect and Bryan equals everything wrong with a human being. Okay, fine, whatever.  There was some level of Arie vs. Jef during Emily's season, even though the irony was that the two guys in question got along just fine. But Rachel was spared from that because with the dueling spoilers, there was still a chance of it going either way. However, as we're nearing the end and the neon signs that Bryan probably is the Final 1 are shining brighter and brighter, the attacks against Rachel have become vicious. 

She's been accused of being an insult to women, insult to feminism, she has no respect for herself to pick a man who referred to her as sloppy seconds, she's been slut shamed as being obsessed with sex and that's why she chose Bryan, she doesn't deserve Peter anyway, she was never beautiful enough for Peter anyway (she was when the original spoiler said he was F1), etc. etc. After Astrid's slip, someone tweeted to Rachel that Bryan would probably try to fuck one of her girlfriends at their engagement party. It's just become insane. And for me, what I notice is that things have gotten so crazy because many of these people in my opinion have stopped seeing this as being about Rachel and it is all about Peter. 

I fully agree. It has definitely become mainly about Peter. I took a peek at their social medias and craziness was all I saw. Just complete lunacy. So many are invested in this as if their own dating lives are on the line. One person actually said as much. Then we cannot ignore the pink elephant in the room: Race. The emotional investment in this is in another stratosphere right now and I think that just points to the sad reality of where society is right now. I'm sorry and no offense to him, but on paper, Peter is not the cream of the crop kind of guy. He's no Prince charming, and based on his performance on this show even less so. In fact, he doesn't even match up well to Rachel for a mate. Neither does Bryan, Eric and a few others cast.

However, set all that aside for a moment and consider the fantasy premise alone. Most of these men couldn't even sell that. Peter being the main culprit. If Bryan wasn't so over-the-top with it, he might have sold it, but he didn't. They couldn't give us the romance! The Disney story. so what's the point? Now, Andrew Firestone may not have been the hottest man to ever lead The Bachelor, but I loved his season because he at least fit into the fairy tale of being affluent, accomplished and most important, ready for love. He played his part well. Peter cannot convince us he cares beyond his next outfit change and camera pose.  I have my issues with Rachel (namely her motives for coming on this show given its track record and whether it was worth it given what has transpired), but I think it's sad how others are attacking her looks and everything under the sun, while giving this basic man a pass.   

Edited July 29, 2017 by Siggystardust
correction