S01.E06: Auditing

[AZChristian]

1 hour ago, wings707 said:

Rinder said, one day he googled COS and expected to see all the good they have been doing online.  Ha!

His high position made it possible to access a computer.  I would like to know how many have this ability.  Will they, can they block the words that will bring them to info? If that is possible I bet it being done now.  Are sea Org people allowed to have cell phones?  

Many live outside of their compound and can do this.  I wonder how many have done this and laying low?  How much info can one ignore?!

So many questions. 

I read in one of the books recently that all members with computers were sent a software CD to help them set up their own websites, which they could link to the main Co$ website to proselytize.  What wasn't mentioned by the Co$ was that if you uploaded that software onto your home computer, it had an automatic filter to block you from non Co$ sites.

[Rlb8031]

On 1/4/2017 at 0:43 AM, lordonia said:

I don't think it's as prevalent now with young kids joining the Sea Org, but you'd think the damned government could have prosecuted Scientology for multiple violations of child labor laws sometime in the last 30 years. The Federal Fair Labor Standards Act states that children under 14 may not be employed.

Did Aaron and his brother have social security cards, earnings statements, and tax returns? Not that $50 a month or whatever pittance they got would even reach the level of needing to file. I wonder if the Sea Org simply paid them cash under the table? That's also illegal.

Aaron Smith-Levin commented on Tony Ortega's site that he and his brother were simply "under the radar" as far as dropping out of school since, they moved to another state. Nobody in the government cared, or knew. Do truancy officers even exist any more?

I think that the church gets around this by saying that someone has chosen a life of religious instruction. It would be the same as someone going to seminary. You don't get paid for being there, although once you complete your studies you may get a small salary in an assigned position. Aaron and Collin were both studying to be auditors, so the fact they were 14-15 wasn't an issue. What is more interesting is that the city of Clearwater clearly isn't requiring kids under the age of 16 to attend school. I'd love to find out whether these kids are enrolled in Scientology schools or what the situation is, but Aaron seemed to indicate that school wasn't even a consideration for him.

[cmfran]

4 hours ago, green said:

Yes I've been in the plant where they make them.  I posted about it in another thread here.  I worked there one summer in college when they made dash gages for Ford but they lost that contract to a factory in Mexico.  They kept themselves afloat with a skeleton crew of less than 30 I'd guess by landing the official exclusive contract to make e-meters. 

I didn't know that in advance when I saw a job opening for a QC tech/tester there some years later but got a tour and heard all about it during same during the interview.  They are nothing but cheapo, low end voltmeters. Anything set to mV scale is going to cause wild fluctuations on the scale when you hold positive and ground same as one you could buy at a Radio Shack (is that chain even in business anymore?).  It is all bunk.

Thanks for the info - very helpful. I don't know why the show hasn't explained this. They've spent a lot of time talking about "auditing," but haven't once talked about what the e-meter actually is.

[Brattinella]

54 minutes ago, AZChristian said:

I read in one of the books recently that all members with computers were sent a software CD to help them set up their own websites, which they could link to the main Co$ website to proselytize.  What wasn't mentioned by the Co$ was that if you uploaded that software onto your home computer, it had an automatic filter to block you from non Co$ sites.

That handy setup CD probably had a cute little key-logger in it.

[iMonrey]

Quote

if you ask a member of ANY other legitimate religion (Christian, Muslim, Jew, Buddhist, Amish... even the other ones that sometimes don't get taken seriously, like Mormons) WHAT exactly they believe, they can tell you!

Not necessarily. There are a lot of "devout" people who don't really know what's in the bible, for instance. This is purely anecdotal but in my experience a lot of Catholics are content to assign the responsibility of reading the bible to their priest so he can tell them what's in there. 

I think a lot of this show speaks to religion in general and why people embrace it. But clearly the show is not interested in bashing religion as a whole, which is no doubt a big part of why they steer clear of specific details about Scientology and its core tenets. It's a show that says "the church is doing these awful things," not a show that says "this religion is SO dumb." Because the latter would be a very different show and would open an unwanted can of worms regarding religion in general.

[3girlsforus]

3 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Not necessarily. There are a lot of "devout" people who don't really know what's in the bible, for instance. This is purely anecdotal but in my experience a lot of Catholics are content to assign the responsibility of reading the bible to their priest so he can tell them what's in there. 

I think a lot of this show speaks to religion in general and why people embrace it. But clearly the show is not interested in bashing religion as a whole, which is no doubt a big part of why they steer clear of specific details about Scientology and its core tenets. It's a show that says "the church is doing these awful things," not a show that says "this religion is SO dumb." Because the latter would be a very different show and would open an unwanted can of worms regarding religion in general.

I think it would be much less effective that way as well. If someone wants to believe that they can improve themselves by holding on to cans and confessing their "bad thoughts", it's their right. If they want to believe in Xenu, again that is their right. It's the financial, physical, and emotional abuse that is wrong and illegal. Best to focus on that. 

[shelley1234]

3 hours ago, 3girlsforus said:

You can really see this in the beginning of the letter Rinder's daughter wrote, the one linked in this thread. She goes on and on about hereditary medical issues in his family (diabetes, heart disease) and then says she feels it's only fair to warn his new wife about it. Who the hell does that? It read like she was going to warn his wife that Rinder had been accused of molestation or murder or something. But no, his grave sin was having diabetes in the family. To a Scientologist, that reflects on the person. Sickness isn't a function of being human. It's a function of not being a good enough Scientologist. 

She also said in that letter how horribly sick and fat Rinder looked.   Me?  I saw Rinder when he was in London trying to stop Sweeney from doing his expose (where he just got out from the hole) and he looked like a gaunt zombie.  His face has filled out, he has color and I think he personally looks great.  I'd take current Mike Rinder any day of the week vs. the older version of Mike Rinder, on just a physical level.  

20 minutes ago, cmfran said:

Thanks for the info - very helpful. I don't know why the show hasn't explained this. They've spent a lot of time talking about "auditing," but haven't once talked about what the e-meter actually is.

Because the e-meter is just a trick.  It gets people to talk and do what they want them to.....the auditor can keep asking for more because of the e-meter and keep pressing.  It's just a way to keep it going and make the person holding the cans think that the auditor is seeing or experience something that they aren't.  

[AZChristian]

23 minutes ago, shelley1005 said:

She also said in that letter how horribly sick and fat Rinder looked.   Me?  I saw Rinder when he was in London trying to stop Sweeney from doing his expose (where he just got out from the hole) and he looked like a gaunt zombie.  His face has filled out, he has color and I think he personally looks great.  I'd take current Mike Rinder any day of the week vs. the older version of Mike Rinder, on just a physical level.  

I agree, Shelley.  From what I remember from recent reading, Rinder was living in that "prison" near Hemet during that time frame.  He was probably subsisting on rice, beans, and leftovers delivered to the group in a bucket (with no eating utensils).  When they needed him, they took him out, cleaned him up, put him in nice clothes and sent him off.  He was hoping to earn his way into not going back to the hole.  

[dcubed]

As for how the people we have seen are doing so well outside of CO$ without a formal education, I think it is because of the sample of the CO$ population we are seeing.  These were people at some of the highest levels of the organization, that have already proved themselves to be if not book smart, then at least street smart, negotiation skills smart, and tactically smart.  They were exposed to people on the outside because of their positions, exposure that could have helped them when they left (and some certainly had family on the outside to help them as well).  Their positioning skills were finely honed.  These traits may very well have contributed to why they were the ones that left.  They were savvy enough to see the wolf was wrapped in sheep's clothing.  Some, like Rinder, may have realized that he was the wolf and couldn't live with himself anymore after he continued to examine his faults in auditing sessions.  Just as Leah alluded to, what CO$ taught them may ultimately hurt CO$.

[SunnyBeBe]

I suspect the show may steer clear of the COS tenants (MINUS THE ABUSES), because, it may seem then that it's their teachings of faith that are under attack. As wild as some things seem, they may be a tenant of their faith.  I mean, Baptist churches teach that Holy Communion, you are eating the flesh of Christ and drinking his blood.  Well, that's how they taught us.  I'm not sure about how other denominations handle it.  It' probably sounds pretty bizarre if you really examine it.   The show may not want to go there. 

Edited January 5, 2017 by SunnyBeBe

[Slovenly Muse]

6 minutes ago, iMonrey said:

Quote

if you ask a member of ANY other legitimate religion (Christian, Muslim, Jew, Buddhist, Amish... even the other ones that sometimes don't get taken seriously, like Mormons) WHAT exactly they believe, they can tell you!

Not necessarily. There are a lot of "devout" people who don't really know what's in the bible, for instance. This is purely anecdotal but in my experience a lot of Catholics are content to assign the responsibility of reading the bible to their priest so he can tell them what's in there. 

That's not what I mean, though. Sure, some people don't know the particularities of what's in the Bible, but they know, in general, what their religion believes: God, Jesus, sin, etc. The contents of the Bible are there for all to see, regardless of whether or not you choose to read it thoroughly. If you walk into a church off the street and ask a priest to explain their religion to you, just a basic outline of the tenets of their faith, they are usually able and willing. Heck, there's a Bible in most hotel rooms! Because Christian organizations WANT you to read it, and know and understand what they believe and why. But the actual RELIGION aspect of Scientology is so obscure that you have to reach one of the high OT levels before they even tell you what it is they (and now you) believe. The PRACTICE of Scientology (auditing) is all you actually know until you are finally let in on the RELIGION behind the practice - that Galactic Overlord Xenu came to this planet to throw a bunch of people into volcanoes and blow them up, and now we are all possessed by the spirits of dead aliens that prevent us from developing superpowers... THAT is the mythology, the religion of Scientology, and it is a carefully-guarded secret. South Park finding out about this and making an episode about it was a huge deal. When you've finally ascended to the level where you are to be let in on the secret, they take you out on a boat to the middle of nowhere, release the files from a locked briefcase, and swear you to secrecy about what you've learned.

I mean (please forgive me, Catholics, this is only a thought-experiment, no offense meant!), can you imagine joining the Catholic church, going to confession for EIGHT YEARS, unburdening yourself of things you feel bad about, living by strict rules you don't fully understand, thinking this confession thing is really helping you to let go of things that are holding you back, examine your feelings and motivations around certain actions, and live a healthier and happier life (basically going to therapy and calling it church)... identifying as a Catholic, giving everything you have to the church, purging your social circle of everyone not involved in the church, and making the church your entire life... only to be told after nearly a decade that you have earned the right to know what the church believes, taken out to the middle of nowhere and secretly informed by a priest (who takes the first Bible you've ever seen out of a locked box to allow you a temporary glance) that the reason you've been confessing your little wrongdoings for so long is because... Genesis, Original Sin, virgin births, Satan, pillars of salt, arks full of animals... and that cracker you've been eating every week is really THE BODY OF CHRIST?! What I mean to say is that REAL religions don't do this! They give you a Bible or other holy scripture upfront, and make their religious beliefs the core, the really important part, of their experience and identity as a member of that religion. Sure, people are very susceptible to not reading things fully and letting others tell them what they believe based on personal bias, which is why we have religious crusaders fighting to protect marriage from those sinners who want to marry someone of their own sex, but somehow do NOT spend time fighting to protect Wal-Mart from polyester, or Christian neighbourhoods from the scourge of Red Lobster. But that's not the same thing as actively withholding the spiritual tenets of a religion from its followers until they are adequately indoctrinated. That is messed up!

5 minutes ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I suspect the show may steer clear of the COS tenants (MINUS THE ABUSES), because, it may seem then that it's their teachings of faith that are under attack. As wild as some things seem, they may be a tenant of their faith.  I mean, Baptist churches teach that Holy Communion, you are eating the flesh of Christ and drinking his blood.  Well, that's how they taught us.  I'm not sure about how other denominations handle it.  It' probably sounds pretty bizarre if you really examine it.   The show may not want to go there. 

I think you're right on the money there. It's one thing to examine what a church DOES that is harmful, but when you start criticizing what a church believes as a way of discrediting them... well, that's a bit like (Oh, jeez, sorry again, Catholics! I'll pick on someone else next time!) It's a bit like criticizing the Catholic church's sexual abuse scandal by ridiculing the church for believing in the virgin birth. It may sound improbable to those who don't believe it, but it's not actually the PROBLEM in this situation. The harm being done to innocent children, and the church's failure to prevent it, is the problem. Practical, not spiritual.

Again, Catholics, so sorry. If I were Catholic, I'd feel really guilty about this post.

[Jamoche]

5 hours ago, iMonrey said:

I suspect they are trying to avoid insulting anyone who is or ever was a member of the church, so they steer clear of the minutia of the belief system so it doesn't sound like they're basically saying "Yeah, it's dumb, you'd  have to be dumb." Instead they emphasize the brainwashing aspect of it as a way of justifying a lot of it.

That was our approach back in the 90s - if you want to get out and join the Free Zone, no problem; it's the abuses like Lisa McPherson that we care about. Some of the ex-CoS said that attitude helped them rethink the CoS - we weren't the anti-"freedom" Suppressive People boogiemen they'd been warned about.

[Jamoche]

1 hour ago, Brattinella said:

That handy setup CD probably had a cute little key-logger in it.

They weren't that sophisticated. They took an off-the-shelf net nanny package and put their own words in it; you can find the technical details here: http://www.xenu.net/archive/events/censorship/ - one person installed it and used a packet sniffer to make sure it wasn't doing anything other than block stuff.

The sales pitch on it was that if every CoS member created a webpage, it would attract so many new members! They were pretty boring cookie-cutter sites.

[shelley1234]

48 minutes ago, AZChristian said:

I agree, Shelley.  From what I remember from recent reading, Rinder was living in that "prison" near Hemet during that time frame.  He was probably subsisting on rice, beans, and leftovers delivered to the group in a bucket (with no eating utensils).  When they needed him, they took him out, cleaned him up, put him in nice clothes and sent him off.  He was hoping to earn his way into not going back to the hole.  

Yeah, Mike told that tale in the Going Clear documentary.....when going over his last encounter with Sweeney.  They showed those clips of Rinder and Sweeney battling and god, he looked so so bad.  Even in the Scientology "We Are The World" mock video....I think Rinder looks a million times better now than he did then.  

[3girlsforus]

I am starting to forget where I have heard or read things because I've been reading so much, but I could have swore that I read that LRH actually never viewed his teachings as theology or doctrine but encouraged the terms because of the protections afforded a religion. That would be one reason to hide the real ideas. Because they really aren't a theology in the first place. 

[goldensglitter]

4 hours ago, DrSparkles said:

OH yeah. Meant to say earlier that when Adam (?) was crying last night (well, I watched it last night), it gutted me. I started crying with him at some point. Those were some deep, for-real man tears. And then talking & crying?! Dude. I had a hard time falling asleep last night.

I am totally with you there, and I rarely cry.  I think I need to step away from this CO$ topic, it is very unsettling.  Will I step away, ahhhhh maybe not.  Keep coming back to it.

[princelina]

20 hours ago, Jade Foxx said:

Just wondering what would make a person lean more into Scientology,  vs.  let's say, Buddhism, or even the Hippie movement? Not the indoctrinated kids, I'm talking about the "free-willed" adults.  

My guess would be people who are seeking "something more" but believe that God and traditional religions are superstitious, nonsense, etc. and they are too smart for that.  Instead they are told they are learning "technology" to help them become their "ideal selves" - the idea of becoming godlike themselves, but in a rational and scientific manner, and then using what they have learned to "save the planet."  Leah says something rational-sounding about it in the opening segment, and I have heard Tom Cruise wax eloquent about it in some of his more bizarre interviews.  Then what actually becomes their "god" is the organization that they have to give all of their time, money, relationships, etc. to, but they don't realize it until it is too late.

17 hours ago, lordonia said:

Here's a link to Monday's What Went Down segment with Rinder and Leah talking about how difficult it is to get rid of Scientology thought patterns and beliefs. It's when he mentioned working on his lack of compassion.

Rinder's current wife has an interview segment and does say she was a Scientologist for 36 years. Even counting from 10 years old and being out for at least 5 years, that's one effective skin regimen.

With regard to Leah saying her instinct as a Scientologist was to help the woman on the beach ... hell no. I don't doubt Leah's sincerity, but to Scientologists, a drunk woman asking to buy drugs is considered to be a degraded being who is in that condition because of her own evil. Interacting with her would be putting Leah's salvation at risk.

My thought was that by "help her" she would have recommended that she get herself to the nearest Scientology center!  If you've seen the interview of Mr. Cruise in the black turtleneck, at one point doesn't he giggle about passing a car accident and "KNOWING you could help those people" - but he doesn't mean by stopping and calling 911!

 

10 hours ago, SunnyBeBe said:

I don't think we can put a label on all people who get caught up in the COS, however, I think that it does appeal to a certain mindset.  I'm not even sure if maturity has anything to do with it.  As a child, I sat in a fundie audience looking around to see when my parents would see the thing for the farce it was, get up and walk out.  Sadly, they joined in and stayed.  For years, I was the child in the family, but the only one who saw the truth.  And that's why the COS has their own education goals.  Fundies wanted private church schools, home schools, fundie colleges or NO higher education.  You can't have people reading too much or using their own brains/

Does anyone know if any of the COS member's children now attend a COS day school or are they allowed to attend public schools? I suppose that if you have to attend COS seminars all day, you don't have time to go to a regular college. If so, how do they get high paying jobs that support the organization? 

Aaron said that when he and his wife were "declared" his kids were kicked out of their school - so I took that to mean that they were in a school for Scientology kids, because his kids are still little.  I would assume that had he stayed, they would have joined the sea org or been sent to some other training when they became teenagers.

37 minutes ago, 3girlsforus said:

I am starting to forget where I have heard or read things because I've been reading so much, but I could have swore that I read that LRH actually never viewed his teachings as theology or doctrine but encouraged the terms because of the protections afforded a religion. That would be one reason to hide the real ideas. Because they really aren't a theology in the first place. 

I don't know where I heard this or even if it's true, but I remember hearing that LRH had said there are 2 ways to become super rich:  the first is (I forget) and the second is to create your own religion.  I repeat, I don't have a source or even know if it is true, but it's in the back of my mind throughout each episode I watch :)

Edited January 6, 2017 by princelina

[AZChristian]

Quoting:  “You don't get rich writing science fiction. If you want to get rich, you start a religion.”  L. Ron Hubbard

[Wings]

Davis Koresh and the Branch Dividians have some similarities with COS.  Different but operating under a deranged dictator.  COS looks like summer camp in comparison, but it is never wise to measure abuse.  

http://www.nytimes.com/1993/05/04/us/growing-up-under-koresh-cult-children-tell-of-abuses.html?pagewanted=all

Quote

The incident began when the ATF attempted to raid the ranch. An intense gun battle erupted, resulting in the deaths of four government agents and six Branch Davidians. Upon the ATF's failure to raid the compound, a siege was initiated by the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI), the standoff lasting 51 days. Eventually, the FBI launched an assault and initiated a tear gas attack in an attempt to force the Branch Davidians out of the ranch. During the attack, a fire engulfed Mount Carmel Center. In total, 76 people died,[8][9] including David Koresh.

Above quote from this link. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waco_siege

My point in mentioning this is, authorities did step in and likely will for COS too, when they focus on the children.  That is the ticket in.  That is driving Leah's train.  She is smart and knows damn well that is the only thing that can bring this to its knees.  She cares about the kids, deeply and also knows that this is the only place where authorities would rally.   Adults are free to believe as they choose.  

[3girlsforus]

23 minutes ago, princelina said:

 

I don't know where I heard this or even if it's true, but I remember hearing that LRH had said there are 2 ways to become super rich:  the first is (I forget) and the second is to create your own religion.  I repeat, I don't have a source or even know if it is true, but it's in the back of my mind throughout each episode I watch :)

Yes!!!! This is part of the story I was thinking of. He said that and then say they needed to make Scientology a religion. 

[Wings]

1 minute ago, AZChristian said:

Quoting:  “You don't get rich writing science fiction. If you want to get rich, you start a religion.”  L. Ron Hubbard

I think he was brilliant.  Mentally skewed and genius.  Many set out to make millions and most fail; they aim for commerce, the usual road.  His vision was on the mark.  Sick fuck, yeah.  And think how many authors seek, crave, dream to have their book published.  He did that with apparent ease for numerous publications.  Not easy.  

Look at Hitler.  Successful in his plan.   IQ can take you where you choose. 

I have been lost in many rabbit holes today.   What a trip!  Tom Cruise is crazy.  Google, megalomania , sociopath and short man/small dick.  I really did go there.  No really I did!  I am obsessed to bring this cult to its knees. 

[TeapotDiva]

Slovenly Muse, I found your analogy to be brilliant!  And as a Catholic, I was not offended in the least!

[pinguina]

Slovenly Muse, I thought your comparison was a good one too!  

I found Aaron not ever reconciling with his brother so sad!  All because he was told that Collin was no longer deserving of his family due to his leaving the cult.   If  anyone leaves Catholicism  we do not "disconnect" from them.  It's kind of funny that years ago my cousin and aunt choose to leave Catholicism.  My mom was very upset about it.  She even went to talk to the priest about not talking to her sister ever again. The priest counseled her to never give up on her relationship with her sister, not because she might return to the Church but because she (my aunt) was family and a family has great history.  

I found myself thinking of the mother of Aaron and Collin.  How terrible that she never got to see or be with her son again.  I just can't fathom the pain she must feel to know that it was withing her power to do something and yet didn't.  I hope she has found some peace and finds that her relationship with Aaron, his wife, and her granddaughters helps her.  

Not meaning to go off topic (but I have read so much stuff that it's all floating around in my head) but I just read an article about a woman and her friend who were curious about Scientology. (They were both Christians) So they went in and were asked to fill out a form with 200 questions.  The questions seemed geared to identify people who liked to follow orders and were unsure of things.  They also got to hold the tin cans and watch a variety of videos.  At the end the woman was told that she was sometimes nervous and had difficulty getting along (I think that was the second thing) and wouldn't she like to be better.  She told the guy that she was totally fine with that!  He couldn't understand her being comfortable with those traits.  Towards the end of the article she made a comment about them - the three people she and her friend talked to all seemed to have had a limited education (they told her about their schooling) and seemed unsure (again they said to her "Before Scientology I....) about themselves.

[sistersledge]

I've been reading along and find myself getting sucked in as well! Thanks to this board I also read jenna and Leah's book, but I still have this question. Jenna talked about it more but I'm just watching this episode and they're talking about Colin being 'brought back' by his mother. What does that mean? He was forced physically?  Convinced? What kind of father lets his son return to this shitshow? When they say brought back what exactly do they mean. How do you brow beat a 14(?) year old - I guess his mom convinced him? 

[shelley1234]

47 minutes ago, wings707 said:

 

I have been lost in many rabbit holes today.   What a trip!  Tom Cruise is crazy.  Google, megalomania , sociopath and short man/small dick.  I really did go there.  No really I did!  I am obsessed to bring this cult to its knees. 

I'm crazy bananas obsessed with this shit show too.  I keep joking with co-workers that I'm gonna go down to the Scientology Center and check myself in.....and experience the crazy from the inside out.  Who wants to come with me???  Kidding.  Kind of.  Let's go.  

[spiderpig]

2 minutes ago, shelley1005 said:

I'm crazy bananas obsessed with this shit show too.  I keep joking with co-workers that I'm gonna go down to the Scientology Center and check myself in.....and experience the crazy from the inside out.  Who wants to come with me???  Kidding.  Kind of.  Let's go.  

Is there room in your phonebooth for me?   I'll bring the barley water.

[shelley1234]

1 minute ago, spiderpig said:

Is there room in your phonebooth for me?   I'll bring the barley water.

Of course there is room for you......YES!!!  WE'RE GONNA SAVE THE PLANET!!!  

 

 

 

*By save the planet, I mean save the planet from the cray cray of Scientology.*  

[AZChristian]

37 minutes ago, shelley1005 said:

I'm crazy bananas obsessed with this shit show too.  I keep joking with co-workers that I'm gonna go down to the Scientology Center and check myself in.....and experience the crazy from the inside out.  Who wants to come with me???  Kidding.  Kind of.  Let's go.  

We're driving from Phoenix over to L.A. in March for a quick vacay.  I've convinced Mr. AZC to make a detour on the way home so we can drive down the road through the middle of the compound near Hemet.  

[Wings]

Deleted. Poorly worded due to Scotch. :^) I will take another stab at my point later. Lol

Edited January 6, 2017 by wings707

[shelley1234]

11 minutes ago, AZChristian said:

We're driving from Phoenix over to L.A. in March for a quick vacay.  I've convinced Mr. AZC to make a detour on the way home so we can drive down the road through the middle of the compound near Hemet.  

Get a cardboard cutout of Leah and put it in the car.  

[jrlr]

10 minutes ago, shelley1005 said:

Get a cardboard cutout of Leah and put it in the car.  

LOL - Love it!!!!!

[spiderpig]

11 minutes ago, shelley1005 said:

Get a cardboard cutout of Leah and put it in the car.  

and duck.

[jrlr]

Anybody ever see Elmer Gantry?  

[Ina123]

Just saw a tweet on twitter by Mike Rinder. He seems to be hinting more episodes to come perhaps as specials.

[Diane Mars]

18 hours ago, wings707 said:

Rinder said, one day he googled COS and expected to see all the good they have been doing online.  Ha!

His high position made it possible to access a computer....

Wasn't it Miscavige's Dad, who received a kindle or something like that from David (lol), and he discovered randomly that it had in internet access ? And that he then went on google to see all the good things people were saying about CO$ ?

[aamankwah]

On 1/5/2017 at 9:55 AM, SunnyBeBe said:

I don't think we can put a label on all people who get caught up in the COS, however, I think that it does appeal to a certain mindset.  I'm not even sure if maturity has anything to do with it.  As a child, I sat in a fundie audience looking around to see when my parents would see the thing for the farce it was, get up and walk out.  Sadly, they joined in and stayed.  For years, I was the child in the family, but the only one who saw the truth.  And that's why the COS has their own education goals.  Fundies wanted private church schools, home schools, fundie colleges or NO higher education.  You can't have people reading too much or using their own brains/

Does anyone know if any of the COS member's children now attend a COS day school or are they allowed to attend public schools? I suppose that if you have to attend COS seminars all day, you don't have time to go to a regular college. If so, how do they get high paying jobs that support the organization? 

What kind of fundie group? Like the Duggars? Dude, you should do like an AMA on this forum, you understand what living in a cult-like situation is more than the rest of us.

[Wings]

42 minutes ago, Diane Mars said:

Wasn't it Miscavige's Dad, who received a kindle or something like that from David (lol), and he discovered randomly that it had in internet access ? And that he then went on google to see all the good things people were saying about CO$ ?

I am having trouble keeping facts straight.    Thanks.  I can hear Ron saying that now. 

[bubbls]

You know, after watching this I've concluded I'm far too cheap and far too lazy to ever be a scientologist. The only thing  want to spend that kind of time and money on are things I like such as knitting or my family. I don't care about saving the planet or even improving myself if it's this costly in time, effort, and money. 

[DangerousMinds]

1 minute ago, bubbls said:

You know, after watching this I've concluded I'm far too cheap and far too lazy to ever be a scientologist. The only thing  want to spend that kind of time and money on are things I like such as knitting or my family. I don't care about saving the planet or even improving myself if it's this costly in time, effort, and money. 

Yes, I find myself impressed with these people's tremendous work ethics, if nothing else.

[bubbls]

11 minutes ago, DangerousMinds said:

Yes, I find myself impressed with these people's tremendous work ethics, if nothing else.

Exactly! I sure wish I had more of that along with their dedication. My house would sparkle, food would be made in the refrigerator, no desperately washing undies Sunday night or coasting to the gas station on fumes. 

 

I forgot got to mention I'm reading Leah's book, and she's talking about working for 12 hours a day in acting THEN devoting at least 2-1/2 hours more to courses. Yeesh. 

Edited January 6, 2017 by bubbls

[RedheadZombie]

Regarding education - I was on ex-Scientology kids last night.  There was a paragraph on the quality of CO$ schooling versus public school.   One of the site runners said she thinks Scientology is superior at teaching reading and writing.  It's in all the other subjects that they fail. 

[DangerousMinds]

23 minutes ago, bubbls said:

Exactly! I sure wish I had more of that along with their dedication. My house would sparkle, food would be made in the refrigerator, no desperately washing undies Sunday night or coasting to the gas station on fumes. 

 

I forgot got to mention I'm reading Leah's book, and she's talking about working for 12 hours a day in acting THEN devoting at least 2-1/2 hours more to courses. Yeesh. 

Yeah, no way in hell I could do this.

[Meadow]

18 hours ago, Slovenly Muse said:

Again, Catholics, so sorry. If I were Catholic, I'd feel really guilty about this post.

I'm a fairly devout Catholic with a son discerning the priesthood and I'm not at all offended by your points.  I appreciate your sensitivity very much, though.  I think you make a great point.  If you're addressing the sex abuse scandal, it makes no sense to bring up transubstantiation or Papal infallibility.

So while the Xenu story makes for good late night comedian jokes, I like that Leah's show is sticking to the child abuse, family disconnections, and the imprisonments.  Those will be what brings Scientology down.

[Neurochick]

22 hours ago, 3girlsforus said:

Sickness isn't a function of being human. It's a function of not being a good enough Scientologist. 

To me that is the sickest thing about this cult.  We are all flawed beings because we are human.  That is what this cult doesn't want to realize; sure humans can do better and there's nothing wrong with wanting to attain high spiritual goals, but we all have to remember that making mistakes and stumbling isn't because a person is bad or is thinking bad thoughts, but because that person is a human being, case closed.

[trow125]

Really interesting piece on Tony Ortega's blog today, and it mentions the issues surrounding young Sea Org members that have come up a few times in conjunction with the Aaron Smith-Levin episode:

Quote

 

Serge wasn’t allowed to go to school. “Seventh grade was the last grade I finished. If you went to school, they sent you to ethics. And we were only allowed to go to school on Sunday anyway. One reason I joined the Sea Org was that I thought I’d get schooling. But I got ethics instead.”

Serge told us that instead of going to school, he spent hours on a Scientology “metering course” that took the concept of technical perfection to an extreme degree.

 

[PrincessSteel]

From an (admittedly shallow) entertainment point of view, how are they going to top this episode? I can't imagine a more gut-wrenching story, unless it's Lisa McPherson's, and she isn't around to tell it.

[DangerousMinds]

11 minutes ago, trow125 said:

Really interesting piece on Tony Ortega's blog today, and it mentions the issues surrounding young Sea Org members that have come up a few times in conjunction with the Aaron Smith-Levin episode:

I'm not sure what "ethics" even mean to these people.

[Diane Mars]

37 minutes ago, Meadow said:

... So while the Xenu story makes for good late night comedian jokes, I like that Leah's show is sticking to the child abuse, family disconnections, and the imprisonments.  Those will be what brings Scientology down.

I think that what is making this docu riveting is that it's ONLY dealing with FACTS. No interpretation, no third-party testimonial. Facts, and only facts !

It's like a huge videotaped Knowledge Report adressed to the public, in a pure Sciento way ! I love this kind of big "FU" to CO$... This is the Truth... Hahahahaha !

EDIT : while second guessing my interpretation, yes, I'm sure that the my "KR report" analogy is not far from the truth, and that it was probably an idea of Rinder, because WHO better than him could have had that idea/angle ?

 

20 minutes ago, DangerousMinds said:

I'm not sure what "ethics" even mean to these people.

Here you are :D : http://www.xenu-directory.net/glossary/glossary_e.htm#Ethics

Edited January 6, 2017 by Diane Mars

[SunnyBeBe]

5 hours ago, aamankwah said:

What kind of fundie group? Like the Duggars? Dude, you should do like an AMA on this forum, you understand what living in a cult-like situation is more than the rest of us.

Oh yes.  Fundamental, Independent Baptist.  It's nothing like the Southern Baptists.  It's much more intense.  Jerry Falwell's church Liberty Baptist in VA, was a sister church, except our church frowned on him a little for being too liberal. (I'm not kidding.)  Bob Jones University in Greenville, SC, was an approved college, but, most didn't put a lot of focus on education.  Lucky for me, I had a healthy dose of confidence instilled in me by my grandparents. I knew some kids who didn't fare too well.  I eventually got out and obtained an advanced degree.  

I don't profess to have suffered like some of those in the COS have.  I think we all have our own unique experiences.  I've considered a book, but, I know it will hurt some people.  Still, it needs to be told. 

Edited January 6, 2017 by SunnyBeBe

[Almost 3000]

4 hours ago, Meadow said:

So while the Xenu story makes for good late night comedian jokes, I like that Leah's show is sticking to the child abuse, family disconnections, and the imprisonments.  Those will be what brings Scientology down.

I wonder how conscious this was and if they'll address it.