S02.E08: Grotesque

[Muffyn]

The episode in which we learn that Nick has been sporting stringy, greasy gross-looking hair for a long time.  What?  Are you saying that wasn't the point of this far from scintillating episode.   

[Nashville]

In comparative retrospect, this episode made eating that half-jar of habanero salsa at 3am look like a fucking great idea.

[ZoloftBlob]

" I was so happy in the preview when Alicia ( I think that is the sister's name) finally said, "He CHOSE not to come with them to her hatchet faced mama". In this world where people have lost their loved ones left and right, Nick could give two shits about the woman who raised him and a sister who probably lost out, because mommy was always obsessed with precious Nick." You know I'd love to see Nick killed off for no other reason than to see if Madison can actually cope without having to chase after Nick. Alicia has a pretty fair point about Nick choosing his path...

[riverheightsnancy]

15 minutes ago, ZoloftBlob said:

" I was so happy in the preview when Alicia ( I think that is the sister's name) finally said, "He CHOSE not to come with them to her hatchet faced mama". In this world where people have lost their loved ones left and right, Nick could give two shits about the woman who raised him and a sister who probably lost out, because mommy was always obsessed with precious Nick." You know I'd love to see Nick killed off for no other reason than to see if Madison can actually cope without having to chase after Nick. Alicia has a pretty fair point about Nick choosing his path...

Yeah, Madison is hopelessly codependent, which is not healthy for addict recovery (back in the regular world). I am curious about the husband. Was he clinically depressed? Was it Madison's RBF that did it? Inquiring minds need to know. Is Nick older or younger than Alicia? 

[Nashville]

1 hour ago, riverheightsnancy said:

Yeah, Madison is hopelessly codependent, which is not healthy for addict recovery (back in the regular world). I am curious about the husband. Was he clinically depressed?

He may have been before - but with Madison in his rear view mirror now, I doubt he still is.  ;)

 

Quote

Is Nick older or younger than Alicia? 

Older.  Nick's already flunked out of community college - and if you recall back to the beginning, Alicia was something like a high school junior/senior.  Remember Sharpie-drawing boyfriend who got bit?

Edited August 23, 2016 by Nashville

[riverheightsnancy]

9 minutes ago, Nashville said:

He may have been before - but with Madison in his rear view mirror now, I doubt he still is.  ;)

 

Older.  Nick's already flunked out of community college - and if you recall back to the beginning, Alicia was something like a high school junior/senior.  Remember Sharpie-drawing boyfriend who got bit?

I don't remember the detail about community college with Nick. I knew that Alicia was either a Junior or Senior because she mentioned something about scholarships or acceptance to really good schools because of her grades. I admit, I zone out sometimes during this show. ;) 

[Nashville]

19 minutes ago, riverheightsnancy said:

I don't remember the detail about community college with Nick. I knew that Alicia was either a Junior or Senior because she mentioned something about scholarships or acceptance to really good schools because of her grades. I admit, I zone out sometimes during this show. ;) 

Goes back to Season 1 and a Nick/Alicia back-and-forth over which was the "favorite" kid.  One of Nick's points: Alicia was the favorite because she was the straight arrow daughter  getting college scholarship offers, while he was the junkie son who had flunked out of community college.

[nachomama]

I don't want to argue with Nashville. He remembers too much. "YEAH FINE! That ONE time I left the kid on in the car seat on top of the car when I drove away. ONE TIME AND YOU NEVER LET ME FORGET. He bounced. You can barely tell, it's not like he's got a hyooooge forehead now or a drug problem"

[Nashville]

Yeah - tell that one to my old lady next time I forget her mother's birthday.  :D

Edited August 23, 2016 by Nashville

[MissScarlett]

So, I guess this episode gave us more insight into Nick as a character. Funny thing is... we kinda already knew these things about him. They didn't show us anything new. Did they retcon his father's death? I thought he was playing board games in the living room and that his dad's death was what pushed him to spiral into drugs? Or maybe that was a different show.

When the zombies tore the dogs apart and Nick smiled ... it creeped me out a little. It was almost like he was thinking that the zombies saved him.

I don't really like this "zombies are people too" story arc that they are forcing on us. When they showed Lizzie having those same thoughts on TWD, they painted a picture that she was... well.. crazy. So are we to assume that Nick is crazy too? I want him to snap out of it.

My hope for Nick is that despite his addiction, he will be able to emerge onto this new world as a bad-ass survivor and leader.

He's sort of an odd duck. He has these moments of selflessness where he is going out into the wild to find people, food, resources, etc. Those are the moments where he seems to care very deeply about his mother, sister and the group. Then, there's the other side of him that is completely irrational, impulsive and selfish. He's quietly extreme. 

If they showed him to be "sensitive" to the zombies because his dad and girlfriend died... they are missing the mark with me. Everyone knows someone who has died. Everyone has experienced death at some point in their life. That doesn't mean there's an automatic connection to the dead. If anything, there is more to fear about death in this new ZA world-- knowing that there is a possibility that you won't be at rest when you die.

They split the group up too early, imo. They should have given us at least a 2nd season with all of the characters together so that we could get a good idea of the group dynamics and also to help us develop some kind of attachment. 

The mid-season finale was decent but boy am I missing Daniel and Strand. 

I feel that this Nick-centered episode didn't quite live up to expectations.

Oh well... at least Luciana (hope that's her name) and the pharmacist / doctor dude seemed interesting.

[JackONeill]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Nick does know that the Walkers would tear him into bits if he weren't wearing the latest in Walker-sheik: Blood and guts?

I can maybe see, in a twisted way, his identifying with the Walkers. They didn't do anything to warrant people caving in their skulls (well, except for the fact that they just bit off Aunt Sally's face). And here Nick is, having a father who was a sleepy-head, so I can see him turning to drugs and Walkers. I mean, seriously, what a rat-bastard father!

You know what Nick needs is a good whumping from Carol. Or, better yet, let him go walking down the highway with 30 Walkers while singing Magic Carpet Ride, then a thunderstorm open up and (a la Rick and Glenn) have all the blood and guts wash off. Then, we'll see what his new BFFs do.

[BetyBee]

1 hour ago, MissScarlett said:

Did they retcon his father's death? I thought he was playing board games in the living room and that his dad's death was what pushed him to spiral into drugs? Or maybe that was a different show.

 

I remember this too.  I had the definite impression that they were playing board games when they learned about the Dad's death in a car accident. 

[ChipBach]

On 8/22/2016 at 3:45 PM, NaughtyKitty said:

My TV went to colored bars too! (So Cal??)  I missed about 5 minutes but I am not in the mood to go back and watch it all On Demand with no FF button

That would have been a welcome addition to the show for the rest of the country.  I felt like color bars would have improved the story line.

[Janimo]

That was so boring. Thanks to y'all for your comments here. Much better than the actual show!!!
I did kinda like Luciana and the doc, but that's about it.
Gawd, why do I keep watching this boring piece of crap?

[Gobi]

So much bad about this episode, most of which has been mentioned already. Some random thoughts.

Was I the only one taken aback during  the flashback when Nick found out  his father was dead, because I had  forgotten that Travis wasn't his father? Yeah, that's how little  I'm involved with this show.

Nick travels along an empty highway, and the first two cars he finds were in a head-on collision. What are the odds?

He's 100 miles from Tijuana, then after a lengthy two day detour  he's back on the highway only 40 miles away. Kid can hike.

Nick is apparently a walking dead whisperer.

The two banditos are killed, and Nick moves on without taking their guns and ammo. I get that he doesn't want to hurt his dead playmates, but maybe there's some more banditos out there to consider.

Am I the only one who thinks of a different "F" word when seeing FTWD?

[Raven1707]

The Sunday Cable Ratings are in for “Grotesque”:

"Fear the Walking Dead" began the second half of its second season at the top of Sunday's cable ratings — but at the bottom of its series numbers.

The show earned a 1.6 rating in adults 18-49, down three tenths of a point from its last episode in April and a series low. [3.864 million viewers]

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2016/08/23/sunday-cable-ratings-aug-21-2016/

And here are the Live + Same Day Ratings for Season 2 so far:

04-10-16 "Monster" 6.674 million
04-17-16 "We All Fall Down" 5.581 million
04-24-16 "Ouroboros" 4.726 million
05-01-16 "Blood on the Streets" 4.803 million
05-08-16 "Captive" 4.414 million
05-15-16 "Sicut Cervus" 4.486 million
05-22-16 "Shiva" 4.388 million

08-21-16 "Grotesque" 3.864 million

[millahnna]

I found the flashbacks particularly heartbreaking, not because of Nick's father's death but because of his girlfriend from rehab. The way the last flashback led directly into how we found Nick in the pilot wasd just neat. I guess she never did get to read that book.  I keep forgetting to look up the actor playing her and said it is the same chick as in the pilot, though. 

[frogzapper]

21 hours ago, MissScarlett said:

So, I guess this episode gave us more insight into Nick as a character. Funny thing is... we kinda already knew these things about him. 

...[deleted to save space]...

I feel that this Nick-centered episode didn't quite live up to expectations.

Oh well... at least Luciana (hope that's her name) and the pharmacist / doctor dude seemed interesting.

I agree with everything MissScarlett said and with everyone else who commented on what a snooze fest this episode was! And on top of the boring-ness, they had to throw in stupidity like those gangster guys getting torn up by the slow-moving walkers when they could have easily jumped in their jeep and driven away! It's like their feet were cemented to the ground or something - a truly facepalming moment, ugh! And I thought it was stupid of Nick not to keep his meager supplies & water all packed up and ready to grab-n-go while he was sleeping in that abandoned building when the lady with the bat came after him. I'm sure there were other moments of stupidity that I could list here...

One of my biggest problems is that I still don't really like or feel invested in any of the (remaining) characters on this show yet. Strand is interesting, but I'm not sure he's enough. I had hopes for Nick for a while, but if he's going to continue on this path then ugh, I don't think I can follow him. Maybe as Miss Scarlett said, Luciana and the doctor guy will be more interesting, I hope.

It's only my love for TWD that's keeping me coming back each week in the hopes that this show will get better...

[ghoulina]

2 hours ago, Gobi said:

Was I the only one taken aback during  the flashback when Nick found out  his father was dead, because I had  forgotten that Travis wasn't his father? Yeah, that's how little  I'm involved with this show.

I was taken aback because it seemed so recent, and I wondered how long Maddie and Travis were supposed to have been together. 

 

2 hours ago, Gobi said:

Am I the only one who thinks of a different "F" word when seeing FTWD?

NOPE. 

[Giselle]

I'm only watching this for Strand. I like his character and I'm curious how he would survive. The others can be eaten at any time, really don't care about them.

Poor puppies!

[Peanut]

So this show is only fun if I can snark along live with you guys.  But I thought maybe if I just read the thread while I watched, that it would help. 

 

Nope.  I got to the dogs,  turned the show off and deleted it from the DVR.  

 

It's sad when a show is so bad you can't even hate watch it properly.  

[SnarkyTart]

I watched the show live on Sunday.  I keep coming back to this thread, thinking I should have something to contribute.  Nope, still nothing.  The episode was so underwhelming that I simply have nothing to say about it.

[LocimusPrime]

• Nick sux. Hate his hair, his attitude, the way he runs. Wth was he thinking walking through Mexico w just a back pack. No weapons. 
• I don't understand what he's looking for, right now I really don't care. 
• The three amigos in the jeep didn't make sense. They where smart enough to make sharp hand weapons to kill the walkers but dumb enough to climb out of the jeep to shoot at the herd. 
• The new compound looks like a huge flea market with a wall around it. 
• It seems that Nick just doesn't give a dang about his family anymore, cause if he did he would want to be with them to protect them in the apocalypse. 

[BasilSeal]

On 23/08/2016 at 11:16 PM, MissScarlett said:

When the zombies tore the dogs apart and Nick smiled ... it creeped me out a little. It was almost like he was thinking that the zombies saved him.

Well they did save him, to be fair. There's a symmetry in the narrative here between the bandits that try to kill nick being eaten by the herd, and the dogs which attack him also suffering a similar fate. I think we're also supposed to draw a parallel between the dogs which attack out of primitive instinct and men who commit violent acts simply because in this lawless world they can.

I actually quite like this show, I think much of the hostility towards it stems from the fact that many expect it to be a clone of The Walking Dead but with different people in it, when it's actually a very different show in tone and content. It even looks different because it's shot in such bright light as opposed to the dingy gloom of TWD.

[Lady Iris]

Luciana reminds me of Kate from Lost. I miss that show.

[Ouisch]

Glad to see that I wasn't the only one distracted by Nick's receding hairline. I told Mr. Ouisch that if they're trying to present Nick as this show's rebel-heartthrob, they'd better find him a Hair Club for Men in Tijuana. The whole emo teen angst storyline had me rolling my eyes so often they almost got stuck in the upward position. Since there's no heroin available or local gang-bangers to stay out past curfew with or other ways to royally cheese off his mother, Nick decides to cozy up to anyone mom doesn't like and then adopt their personal philosophy. Like Celia, who treats the walkers like the people they were before they turned. So now Nick decides anyone who kills walkers is the monster, not the walker. Sort of like when a high school sophomore discovers Ayn Rand. 

 

I would also love to know who makes Nick's clothes - the blood-and-gore covered ones that magically wash completely white again under a shower spray with nary a can of Oxy-Clean in sight.

[Nashville]

3 hours ago, Lady Iris said:

Luciana reminds me of Kate from Lost. I miss that show.

Please do me a favor and never mention that name again.

[Peanut]

6 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

I actually quite like this show, I think much of the hostility towards it stems from the fact that many expect it to be a clone of The Walking Dead but with different people in it, when it's actually a very different show in tone and content. It even looks different because it's shot in such bright light as opposed to the dingy gloom of TWD.

Well, I'm glad someone likes it.  But my hostility towards the show is because of its bad writing, bad acting, bad plotting....all of which I probably could have forgiven if they had even attempted to give us what they promised: the downfall of society during the zombie apocalypse.  Instead, we got "nine days later" and now we're wandering around the Mexican desert.  All righty then. 

[Nashville]

12 minutes ago, Peanut said:

Well, I'm glad someone likes it.  But my hostility towards the show is because of its bad writing, bad acting, bad plotting....all of which I probably could have forgiven if they had even attempted to give us what they promised: the downfall of society during the zombie apocalypse.  Instead, we got "nine days later" and now we're wandering around the Mexican desert.  All righty then. 

That total skip of the societal collapse almost broke me from the show right there.  That's the meat I was watching for.

[nodorothyparker]

That's pretty much where they lost me.  If you're not going to have interesting characters, acting, or writing, you damn well better have some other huge draw that people are wanting to see, like oh, maybe how the world ended.  Instead, we got the same wooden characters sitting inside chain link nine days later.

[Raven1707]

7 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

I actually quite like this show

Don't tell anyone, but I like it too. (It'll be our little secret, eh?)

Edited August 25, 2016 by Raven1707
Pfft! I don't need no stinking reason!

[JackONeill]

Can you imagine the conversation between someone who is just now waking up in a hospital (let's call him Rick) and one of the characters from FTWD (let's call him Fear):

Rick: "I just woke up, but you guys have been out there for a few weeks. What's it like?"

Fear: "Well...there's not as much...traffic."

"But you lived in LA. That's a big city. What was going on there?"

"Well, we were behind a fence with a bunch of soldiers for the first several days."

Rick: "But then you moved on to San Diego, then Baja. That's a long way. It must have been grueling. Did you drive a camper? Those things are so unreliable."

Fear: "Uh, no. We were on a luxury yacht. But one time things got dicey -- we had to catch our own fish!"

Rick: "So, you don't even know what the Living Dead is?"

Fear [pause]: "So, that's what those slow-moving dudes are? I thought they were stoned pot-heads!"

[nachomama]

I sorta feel like this was Robert Kirkmans revenge. They changed too much stuff on walking dead for him so he's all "k Ima get one and run it completely my way and people gonna love it!" And then they didn't. And he's all "but but but ... I am the walking dead!!!!!" KAAAHHHHHHNNNN 

[DropTheSoap]

So many chances for Nick to die and it just wouldn't happen. Color me disappointed. 

[rab01]

3 hours ago, nachomama said:

I sorta feel like this was Robert Kirkmans revenge. They changed too much stuff on walking dead for him so he's all "k Ima get one and run it completely my way and people gonna love it!" And then they didn't. And he's all "but but but ... I am the walking dead!!!!!" KAAAHHHHHHNNNN 

None of this show feels like Kirkman's work to me. The characters are unlike any others of his that I've read.  If it's his revenge, my guess as to the internal dialogue would be -- "So you think my stuff is too juvenile and soap opera-ish? Fine, I'll give you a blended family of realistically unlikable people and show you that I can be an adult.  Nah, nah, nah, nah, nah."

[shanndee]

Oh my. I completely forgot that the show had come back. I finally watched it. 

I wonder how long I can hate-watch a show?

When the scout of the new group said. "but he's dying" I yelled "LET HIM!!" Yup. Still want Nick (...and his entire family)  dead. Daniel and Strand better be back next episode.

smh. 

[shanndee]

On August 22, 2016 at 10:21 AM, riverheightsnancy said:

I cried more and harder dumping my kid off at the dorm for Freshman year last Friday than Madison did when Nick went to go it alone. She just has no connection to Nick or Alicia. Flat, boring acting. 

Is it me, but do you think that the writers are trying to show the genesis of a sociopath like the Governor or Neegan with Nick's storyline? He did smile when the dogs got taken down. We haven't seen that too many times. When the horse got taken down, Daryl and Aaron were upset, but realized that there was little that they could do, and there was no smiling. I think that if the show could illustrate how people just on the fringe of society, people who tend to not want to follow societal norms and rules and how this set of circumstances and their views on the world, could create a constellation in which the sociopath is created, then I think Nick is our candidate. The smile said a lot to me. I could see him being some kind of bizarre leader of Zombie worshipers that do something or other. 

 

Wow, that it good! I like it. I just wish that the show had tried, even once, to make Nick a likeable character so that I might care a little about the genesis.

I am really impressed that you put that much effort into trying to give this episode a purpose. I like your idea...I just wish I cared about the character.

Well done! :) 

[piequinn35]

What the heck was that?! It was all Nick :/

And that little Mexican community will be gone before this season ends coz any main cast is a walking disaster magnet  :))

Boringgggg and I don't wanna see any animals getting killed/eaten!

[Gobi]

1 hour ago, shanndee said:

 

Wow, that it good! I like it. I just wish that the show had tried, even once, to make Nick a likeable character so that I might care a little about the genesis.

I am really impressed that you put that much effort into trying to give this episode a purpose. I like your idea...I just wish I cared about the character.

Well done! :) 

That is interesting. In TWD, we have occasionally seen people using zombies for their own purposes (usually evil). Seeing someone  trying to establish a mixed human/zombie community with good intentions might be refreshing. Yeah, this show won't go there.

[BasilSeal]

7 hours ago, piequinn35 said:

I don't wanna see any animals getting killed/eaten!

But you're ok with people getting eaten, right?

[Lamima]

Since i saw mention that this episode was similar or trying to be similar to the Revenant I decided to finally watch that movie. Um, WTH was all the hubub about that movie????  Few hours I will never get back. Can someone explain what I am missing since it won so many awards? At any rate, very fitting it was a waste of my time...much like Fear TWD is.

[Nashville]

6 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

But you're ok with people getting eaten, right?

If you're tuning into this show - yeah, probably.  :>

[BasilSeal]

1 hour ago, Nashville said:

If you're tuning into this show - yeah, probably.  :>

well quite, but why then baulk at some animals getting theirs? I mean the majority of us actually eat animals ourselves, albeit we do generally cook them first and get someone else to do the killing bit, where as the majority of us don't eat other humans.

Most of us would also concede that no matter how much e like animals and want them to be treated humanely, that human life is more valuable. So i find it interesting why it's a common thing, and i include myself in this, that people find animal deaths in film and TV more affecting that the deaths of human characters.

[Haleth]

Maybe I'm an eternal optimist but I still think Nick could be the most interesting character on the show, given better writing.  Instead of fighting the dead he uses them as cover to survive.  That's not something we've seen with original recipe WD (other than Michonne briefly).  He's still more interesting than the rest of his family.  Bring back Daniel and Strand, dump boring Maddie and Travis, and we could have a show.

[Iguessnot]

I was cleaning up my DVR and I started watching this episode again. I had totally forgotten I missed the first 30 seconds, and by golly it was a doozy. Nick wakes up (laying on a mattress), looks around and sees two dead people, one with flies buzzing around a large facial gouging. However they are cradled together and have a blanket over them as though their deaths took place while sleeping. The lady from the ranch tells Nick they were friends who she saw two days ago and they were fine. How in the hell does this scene make sense? Nick did not drop like manna from heaven onto his mattress in this home, so why are they suggesting these people who were sleeping just five feet away from Nick are new to the scene. In this world we have death, walker, dispatched walker. When did the metamorphosis take place with these two peacefully arranged persons with Nick seemingly unaware? 

Lastly, when we first see the bodies, the older dude has his head hanging down the first step, which seems an awkward way to sleep. His face is towards the ceiling. Also the blanket is only across the hips of the younger boy, so we have a full back view. In the next shot, the guy's head is no longer on the stair. He is laying on the floor, facing his friend who is fully covered with the blanket, with only his scalp showing.

[Iguessnot]

Oh my God, I'm watching after Nick bids adieu to Juan and the lady, he looks back into the house and the young boy has turned over under the blanket and we can see the right side of his face. They really couldn't handle the staging of one little scene?

[Nashville]

11 hours ago, BasilSeal said:

well quite, but why then baulk at some animals getting theirs? I mean the majority of us actually eat animals ourselves, albeit we do generally cook them first and get someone else to do the killing bit, where as the majority of us don't eat other humans.

Animals work off simple instinct; they can't know any better but to end up in a biteworthy situation, so they end up being victimized by the limited skill set Nature has provided them.  They have no choice in the matter.

Humans, on the other hand, work off informed conscious choice - so when they get bit, it's usually because of bad choices.  Harder to feel much sympathy for someone when their own actions put them in harm's way.

 

Quote

Most of us would also concede that no matter how much e like animals and want them to be treated humanely, that human life is more valuable.

The older you get, the less that statement is an absolute.

[millennium]

Maybe the only thing that could make me hate myself more than I already do for watching this shit show would be to spend another half hour or whatever watching that smug douche Hardwicke talk about it.

I prayed for Nick to catch a bullet in his five-head as he tried so hard to look badass.

[xaxat]

On 8/24/2016 at 3:30 PM, Raven1707 said:

The Sunday Cable Ratings are in for “Grotesque”:

"Fear the Walking Dead" began the second half of its second season at the top of Sunday's cable ratings — but at the bottom of its series numbers.

The show earned a 1.6 rating in adults 18-49, down three tenths of a point from its last episode in April and a series low. [3.864 million viewers]

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2016/08/23/sunday-cable-ratings-aug-21-2016/

And here are the Live + Same Day Ratings for Season 2 so far:

04-10-16 "Monster" 6.674 million
04-17-16 "We All Fall Down" 5.581 million
04-24-16 "Ouroboros" 4.726 million
05-01-16 "Blood on the Streets" 4.803 million
05-08-16 "Captive" 4.414 million
05-15-16 "Sicut Cervus" 4.486 million
05-22-16 "Shiva" 4.388 million

08-21-16 "Grotesque" 3.864 million

Mid season hiatus for a show with only moderate fan interest?

Brilliant programming strategy!

[JackONeill]

Maybe they took a break so everyone could get scruffy-looking, you know, beards for men and unshaven legs for women.