Jill, Derick & the Kids: Moving On!!

[babyhouseman]

4 hours ago, JennyMominFL said:

I'm sorry, but it's a screwed up religion to believe that 13 yo kids will burn in hell for not believing in your brand of god. I just don't understand what the Duggars find good in the god they believe in.

I went to a private Christian school in NC through seventh grade, and they showed us a film about going to hell. I think I was 11 or 12. I was naive at the time and wasn't bothered by it. As an adult, I can see more clearly now. That was over 30 years ago. 

[JoanArc]

I'm just over here cringing that Jill is being obtuse about the birth. No matter how nice a birth plan she types up, shit will happen. She can't just wish herself to a perfect birth. 

[lascuba]

Jill was like 2 weeks overdue with Israel, and afterwards she hinted at how she hated how people online and IRL kept commenting on how she was still pregnant. I'm not at all surprised she hasn't announced her due date. 

[LilJen]

2 hours ago, floridamom said:

For people who view babies as direct gifts from God, they sure don't take good care of them in utero or after they're born.

Well, no. The important part is that you GET the gift. It's the getting pregnant that shows how righteous and deserving you are! Screw all that using the brain, reason, and common sense God gave you.

[IntoTheMystic]

5 hours ago, lascuba said:

Jill was like 2 weeks overdue with Israel, and afterwards she hinted at how she hated how people online and IRL kept commenting on how she was still pregnant. I'm not at all surprised she hasn't announced her due date. 

Oooh, interesting. Can you remember what she said or where she said it? I like when they subtlety snark but they don't understand the subtlety part. 

[GeeGolly]

Jessa has also probably explained to Jill that their social media sites will get more hits if she's vague and secretive.

[lascuba]

7 hours ago, IntoTheMystic said:

Oooh, interesting. Can you remember what she said or where she said it? I like when they subtlety snark but they don't understand the subtlety part. 

It was an article where Jill gave advice for/about pregnant women and new moms, and she said something to the effect that when you see a pregnant woman to not comment on how she's still pregnant. I remember the various forums were nuts during Jill's last month of pregnancy, and since she had announced her pregnancy before the pee on the stick had a chance to dry, it felt like she had been pregnant a year. I figured then that she would delay announcing her next pregnancy and/or not announce the due date. 

ETA: Found it. https://www.christiantoday.com/article/jill.duggar.offers.pregnancy.advice.to.fans.of.kate.middleton/53177.htm

I forgot the Kate Middleton angle. 

Edited June 18, 2017 by lascuba

[Marigold]

Michelle has had a few VBAC births.  In a HOSPITAL.  i really hope that Michelle can function adequately enough to tell Jill to go to a hospital for safety reasons.  

[SnarkyShark]

On 6/17/2017 at 5:32 AM, dorcastrilling said:

Catholic here, parochial schools. I was confirmed in second grade, the age of accountability at the time was 7. My much younger brother was not confirmed until 7th grade, so accountability age had been raised by then. I think it has gone back down, but not sure what age they confirm in the church now.

I was confirmed in eighth grade, and it is not offered before then in my area. People will also be confirmed during high school.

[Christina87]

17 hours ago, babyhouseman said:

I went to a private Christian school in NC through seventh grade, and they showed us a film about going to hell. I think I was 11 or 12. I was naive at the time and wasn't bothered by it. As an adult, I can see more clearly now. That was over 30 years ago. 

Ooooh that's scary! We never watched a video on that, but I remember watching an anti-smoking video in middle school, which disturbed me more than I have ever been in my life. I made up my mind then to never touch a cigarette. Win for them, but disgusting video!

 

i did confirmation in 6th grade, and I loved it! I was more cynical and occupied with other things by 8th, so maybe doing it earlier is a good idea! Confirmation is a really cherished memory for me, including the retreat we went on, where the boys kept calling our room in the middle of the night until we took the phone off the hook and put the receiver in the drawer! It's so sad that the duggars will never even have good, clean Christian fun like that with non-related people their own age!

[ginger90]

"Israel doesn't even know how blessed he is !" ??? 

https://www.instagram.com/p/BVfMTeYFFac/

[88Keys]

On 6/17/2017 at 10:47 AM, Churchhoney said:

The thing is, though, these days Calvinism seems to be creeping all around. Derick's been Southern Baptist his whole life and goes to Ronnie Floyd's Cross Church still, when he's in Arkansas, and I don't think they've gone Reformed yet, have they? At least not openly. It's only been a few years since Floyd was SBC president......

Nevertheless, this stuff is in the air, and Derick's certainly been picking it up, although I wonder whether he even knows for sure what Calvinists are and how they're different from other brands. And you're really seeing pieces of Calvinism in what to me, anyway, are all sorts of surprising places, including the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary, where longtime head Albert Mohler appears to have glued a big chunk of Calvin onto his beliefs. So it's getting a lot harder to separate Calvinists from others in the U.S. these days, I think. You've got evangelical churches of all kinds that are picking up Calvinism, megachurches and so on. 

It sees odd to me that it's becoming so popular, but I think it's clear that it is in the cultural atmosphere big time, today, and much much more so than in the recent past. It's all over the internet, too. 

No, you're right- bits of it have seeped into many churches.  I think the ones who have embraced it the most are the Independent Fundamentalist Baptist (I think that's what they're called) and the Family Integrated Church.  I thought Southern Baptists were generally against Calvinism, so I'm also surprised that some seem to have latched onto it.  As for why it is popular, the people I know who have turned Calvinist seem to think that they've found some new, deeper revelation of who God is and what it really means to be a Christian, even though this stuff has been around for hundreds of years.

And I guess I shouldn't totally blame it on Calvinism.  The Duggars have been brought up with Gothardism, and have been affiliated with Vodie Bacham, Doug Philips, the Botkins, etc.  It's a toxic mix of Calvinism, legalism, and patriarchy.  That's another reason I genuinely feel bad for Jill.  She's been taught this her whole life. Those who say she should just "educate herself" need to realize that this is an EXTREMELY performance-based mindset.  She probably feels that, if she steps out of line, God will punish her, or will choose not to bless her family or something like that.  I see the other girls making tiny, tiny steps towards more independence, but Jill just seems terrified to move.  I know intelligent, rational people who have gone down this path later in life, and it turned them into people I don't recognize.  Jill has never known anything else.  :(

[ariel]

1 hour ago, ginger90 said:

"Israel doesn't even know how blessed he is !" ??? 

https://www.instagram.com/p/BVfMTeYFFac/

Izzy is blessed that he doesn't look like his father.

[tabloidlover]

I'm not sure how he's so blessed with two fuckwits as parents.    Even if he were so very blessed, he wouldn't realize it because he's a fucking toddler!!  Jill is a moron.

[queenanne]

"Well, I should hope not, Jill.  Toddlers are supposed to be luxuriating in hammocks of 100% safety, security, and unconditional love.  They're not supposed to be consciously thinking anything about how they're treated.  Good treatment is their due as wholly dependent bundles of need."

[Temperance]

If it was anyone else, I might think she was throwing shade at JB. But Sweet Jill would never do that. 

Edited June 18, 2017 by Temperance

[GeeGolly]

I wonder if Jill realizes how everything they say about Izzy is negative? She could have written Happy Father's Day. Izzy is so blessed to have you as a dad!

[BitterApple]

Should an 18 month-old be cognizant of his blessings? I know Jill's an idiot and I can't take her writing at face value, but as GeeGolly noted, it's interesting how everything she writes concerning Izzy has an air of negativity around it. 

[queenanne]

1 minute ago, Temperance said:

If it was anyone else, I might think she was throwing shade at JB. But Sweet Jill would never do that. 

Yeah, problem with this scenario is, we've seen illustrated many times before, this particular shining example of the SODRT is too stupid to know what words mean.  She probably *does* mean something very much like what @tabloidlover said.  She's just not smart enough/too deeply steeped in Fundy buzzspeak, to know how you arrange words to say "Happy Father's Day to a great father who interacts so nicely with his child!", or anything approximating a normal human compliment.

[ginger90]

30 minutes ago, GeeGolly said:

I wonder if Jill realizes how everything they say about Izzy is negative? She could have written Happy Father's Day. Izzy is so blessed to have you as a dad!

Exactly my thought.

[Churchhoney]

23 minutes ago, BitterApple said:

Should an 18 month-old be cognizant of his blessings? I know Jill's an idiot and I can't take her writing at face value, but as GeeGolly noted, it's interesting how everything she writes concerning Izzy has an air of negativity around it. 

It strikes me that this could be an unconscious reaction to having been very ill treated herself as an infant and toddler.

I know there are other possible reasons -- numerous, probably -- for people to have such negative knee-jerk reactions to little kids and to lash out at babies and so on. But I have such responses, and so do other members of my family. And I'm quite sure in the case of my family where they come from. They're pretty clearly buried revenge responses from being treated that way ourselves. 

I'm aware enough to be conscious of these feelings and their origins when I have them and to have learned ways to handle them. But Jill is not a conscious or a smart person. She's never had counseling, or therapy, or conversations with open-minded and honest friends; she's never read any books about this kind of stuff; and she's been fully educated to be deep in denial of their having ever ever ever been anything wrong with the Duggar childhood. And she still lives deep in the family that started this mess -- if indeed this is the source of it for her. Maybe it is, maybe it isn't, of course. But some of us do react that way later to childhood mistreatment. 

[Mollie]

I think they mistreat Izzy.  This is what they do to him when he cries:  they tie him up so that he can't move and then laugh at him while they take pictures.  Loving parents would comfort their child.  Not so, the Dillards.

 

[Lunera]

19 minutes ago, Mollie said:

I think they mistreat Izzy.  This is what they do to him when he cries:  they tie him up so that he can't move and then laugh at him while they take pictures.  Loving parents would comfort their child.  Not so, the Dillards.

 

I'm getting claustrophobia just looking at these pictures. He is too old to be swaddled, who in their right mind would post pictures of their child like this?! 

Edited June 18, 2017 by Lunera

[Marigold]

17 minutes ago, Mollie said:

I think they mistreat Izzy.  This is what they do to him when he cries:  they tie him up so that he can't move and then laugh at him while they take pictures.  Loving parents would comfort their child.  Not so, the Dillards.

 

Unless there is some context to this picture that makes sense, this is sick behavior.  Jill is very damaged and so is Derick.  Those two are gonna seriously snap one day. I hope not!  But they just appear so disturbed. 

[Arwen Evenstar]

No, not The Screaming Grub again!!! That's just appalling.  You swaddle a baby to comfort him/her--not to the point they're so uncomfortable that they scream their lungs out.

[ginger90]

He was around 9 months old. Jill ended up deleting those pictures.

[Churchhoney]

8 minutes ago, ginger90 said:

He was around 9 months old. Jill ended up deleting those pictures.

And hopefully she never did anything similar again. ... Wonder if it's possible to learn from public reaction that you're doing something mean and nutso? I mean, clearly she didn't know before the public reaction -- and honestly, I can't hold that against her, given what I know of myself and others -- but is it possible that you could learn from public response? Or hear the public response and try to find out whether they're right and you're wrong? It does seem unlikely to me that a Duggar would actually go through a process of thought and change like that. But I want to believe it's possible. For all their sakes. 

[farmgal4]

3 hours ago, ginger90 said:

"Israel doesn't even know how blessed he is !" ??? 

https://www.instagram.com/p/BVfMTeYFFac/

FFS.  Oh, how I hate these assholes.

[Lunera]

Derick made 2 posts for his father. None for Blob.

[farmgal4]

18 minutes ago, Lunera said:

I'm getting claustrophobia just looking at these pictures. He is too old to be swaddled, who in their right mind would post pictures of their child like this?! 

To answer your question:  No one.  No one but a fucking POS monster would do that to a child, much less take a picture and then post it on social media.  I shudder to think what goes on behind closed doors that no one knows about.  All you have to do is look at the bags underneath that poor baby's eyes to know that something is not right in his world.  The only time I've ever seen a pic of him looking truly happy was the one taken by his paternal grandmother when he was staying at her house.  If he were my grandchild and I found out that swaddling shit was going on, I would be raising 10 kinds of hell with those two idiots.

[Churchhoney]

11 minutes ago, Lunera said:

Derick made 2 posts for his father. None for Blob.

Good call, Derick. May all the other Duggar-in-laws do the same.

[JoanArc]

FWIW I'm in Nurse Practitioner school -   Friday I had a midterm in child development and have been reading a lot lately about child abuse. Words to the effect of "you don't even realize all we do for you!" were one of the signs of potentially abusive parents. I say potentially; there's still a hell of a lot you'd have to do to convince me Jill is a abuser, but I gives me shivers. I think Jill's really starting to unconsciously mirror what went on with Michelle and her kids - and it's not pretty. 

None of the Duggar parents is going to be great. I'm glad Jessa's kids are clean and pretty, but God help them when they learn 'no'. Josh's kids are only nice becuse of Anna's influnce. Baaaaabe will be Pissing Preacher 2.0. I can't even imagine hos Joy or Joe will handle kids. Sad situation all around, and this si with the most money and support they will ever have. Wait till it gets to be Lord of the flies time.

[Gemma Violet]

Derick's dad reminds me of John Tesh.  Must be the hair.

[Annb67]

35 minutes ago, farmgal4 said:

FFS.  Oh, how I hate these assholes.

I'm so sick of them throwing shade at an innocent toddler. The tone they use is that of resentment. You assholes had him, take care of him and love him. Stop having kids,  you don't like them. And Derrick, big damn deal you took the kid to a park. You talk shit about him 24/7. You're a grifting loser, Izzy is anything but blessed to have you two fucktwits as parents.

[Churchhoney]

20 minutes ago, Gemma Violet said:

Derick's dad reminds me of John Tesh.  Must be the hair.

I think it's more than the hair. Something about the smile and the tilt of the head strike me is Teshish as well. 

[Genevrier]

Derek was an attractive child. What has happened to him since then?

[Mollie]

15 minutes ago, Genevrier said:

Derek was an attractive child. What has happened to him since then?

Derick had really skinny arms compared to his younger brother in that picture.  His build isn't at all like his dad.  If he has Marfan syndrome, he inherited it from his mother, not his father.   

[Sew Sumi]

1 hour ago, ginger90 said:

He was around 9 months old. Jill ended up deleting those pictures.

Two and a half words for Jilly Muffin and the swaddling: pack 'n play. 

Izzy was certainly crawling by then, and she posted not one but TWO separate instances when she thought it was appropriate to swaddle him, once even with bloody shoes on his feet. This surpasses the horror that is Blanket Training. At least those babies can still move. I think one of the pictures was taken on a bed. I get not wanting him to fall off. Put him somewhere else! Like I said, Pack 'n Play, bouncer, something...

[Marigold]

44 minutes ago, Annb67 said:

I'm so sick of them throwing shade at an innocent toddler. The tone they use is that of resentment. 

We should make a list.  We forget all the disgusting posts until one of us reminds the other. 

My fav:

 Jill: I'm putting safeguards into place.  (while holding her infant son)

1 minute ago, Sew Sumi said:

I get not wanting him to fall off. Put him somewhere else! Like I said, Pack 'n Play, bouncer, something...

It's worse...he is old enough to roll.  What if he ROLLED off the bed, onto the floor and his arms are freaking stuck in that swaddle?  

He could also roll onto his face and suffocate. 

Swaddling is only for really little infants...if they even look like they can roll, you don't swaddle! 

[Fostersmom]

Derick looks exactly like his mom and his brother looks just like their dad. You'd think he'd want to be the best father possibly since he obviously considers his dad to have been awesome. Instead we have a jackass who seems to resent his TODDLER and sees evil in an 18 month old. Is it wrong I hope Jeremy calls him out for his patenting skills too? 

[Mollie]

4 minutes ago, Sew Sumi said:

Two and a half words for Jilly Muffin and the swaddling: pack 'n play. 

Izzy was certainly crawling by then, and she posted not one but TWO separate instances when she thought it was appropriate to swaddle him, once even with bloody shoes on his feet. This surpasses the horror that is Blanket Training. At least those babies can still move. I think one of the pictures was taken on a bed. I get not wanting him to fall off. Put him somewhere else! Like I said, Pack 'n Play, bouncer, something...

They prefer the straitjacket approach.  At Izzy's age in those pictures, it isn't swaddling. 

[Marigold]

Just now, Fostersmom said:

Derick looks exactly like his mom and his brother looks just like their dad. You'd think he'd want to be the best father possibly since he obviously considers his dad to have been awesome. Instead we have a jackass who seems to resent his TODDLER and sees evil in an 18 month old. Is it wrong I hope Jeremy calls him out for his patenting skills too? 

I think Derick has mental health issues and so does Jill.  Derick knows his dad was a good dad but does not have the skills to get himself to that "good father" place.  He just can't get it together. 

Those two make me nervous.

[Fostersmom]

3 minutes ago, Marigold said:

I think Derick has mental health issues and so does Jill.  Derick knows his dad was a good dad but does not have the skills to get himself to that "good father" place.  He just can't get it together. 

Those two make me nervous.

They make me nervous too. I hate to say it, but I fear something horrible will happen after another couple of kids. You know neither of them is going to stop after this baby. They both are unhinged now and the second baby hasn't even been born yet. 

[JoanArc]

4 minutes ago, Marigold said:

 Jill: I'm putting safeguards into place.

"I'm making a baby burrito to prevent molestation. You got a better idea, assholes? Now hand a belt to secure it!" -Jill

 

I'll add another one - Jill insisting to the doctor that he sew her up really, really well, so that she could have lots more kids. Like he was just going to half ass surgery until she insisted it be done properly.

 

Honestly, I think if Jill could figure out a way to dump Derick and Izzy, move back into her old dorm room, and be the 14 year old Gilden Child she'd do it without a second thought. I wish she'd gotten a chance t actually grow up before getting married.

[louannems]

4 hours ago, ariel said:

Izzy is blessed that he doesn't look like his father.

In this photo, Izzy DOES look like his father!

[DangerousMinds]

On June 17, 2017 at 6:52 PM, JennyMominFL said:

I was confirmed in 9th grade and I still couldn't really answer for myself. I did it because I had no choice in my family. I didn't mean a word of it. I think it should come when one is an adult.

I never believed in hell at all and it's not really a Jewish Concept either.

Exactly the same here. I just went through the motions because I felt I had to. Didn't believe any of it.

[ariel]

2 minutes ago, louannems said:

In this photo, Izzy DOES look like his father!

Hopefully Izzy will look like his grandfather not caveman Derick.

[Albanyguy]

2 hours ago, Annb67 said:

Stop having kids,  you don't like them. 

They don't realize that liking kids is a requirement for parenthood. After all, Michelle had nineteen and there are only three of  them (Josh, Jessa and Josie) that she seems to have any liking for at all. Yet she still managed to collect her Mother of the Year trophy.

[ginger90]

There's a difference between being a good parent, and being a good enough parent.

[Christina87]

I think Jill's "you don't realize all we do for you" is resentment that they both have, based on their immaturity. I think these two are just so petty that they resent anyone and anything that they think has it "easier" than them. Derrick resented that Jill didn't have to work, while he did. Now, he seems to resent his toddler because he does the basics to take care of him, and the kid isn't tripping over himself to show his gratitude. I feel like both of them feel like any effort they exert is too much, and when they do so, they deserve the world fawning at their feet. This makes sense, because everything Jilly did was praised to high heaven by Boob. 

Also, Boob has many, many, many bad points, but I think he genuinely loves his children as individuals (well, as individual as they're allowed to be). Michelle only loves them when they're babies, except for josh and jessa (she still sees Josie as a baby).