S08.E10: Unhappy Holidays

[sasha206]

53 minutes ago, Mya Stone said:

As your resident Berkshire County resident (and amazing mod) - a small reminder. 

 

 

Stop getting personal. 

My favorite Ramona moment!  Heck, Ramonja were so hot that trip!  Loved them.

[Midnight Cheese]

26 minutes ago, oakville said:

Carole seems to be eating in every scene that she is in. I would love to get Dorinda's recipe for lasagna. She is such a gracious hostess. She decorates, cooks & makes everything Nice!. I would love to be a guest at her home. !

I noticed the variety of books Dorinda had -- I wonder if Hannah and Richard and John added to her collection.  She had a photo-atlas of the Sudan, a giant book on the artist Charley Harper, and a room with lots of cubby shelves, stuffed with books, which looked like older novels and bestsellers - just a ton of variety and interests.  Doro got a kosher lasagna and a regular lasagna, or made them!  Her mother made it nice with her cake!  There was morning bacon until Ramona fucked it up!  She bought everyone comfy pajamas!  It was really all perfect, but for inviting Carole and Bethenny (<- dis bitch with her saying Dorinda failed in her hostessing.  She RUINS everything.  The worst.)

[straightshooter]

In my truly humble opinion, what Bethenny reeeeeealllly hates about LuAnn is that she is secure with herself and has remained a fairly confident woman regardless of her life circumstances at any given time.  I think it's slowly sinking in to Bethenny that no matter how much money/power/fame/plastic surgery/business success she has, she is still insecure.  She's having a tough time swallowing that pill.

LuAnn consistently carries herself well, and Bethenny is quite challenged in that department.  

In reality, (I know, I know!) it's actually very sad.  

[Almost 3000]

1 hour ago, straightshooter said:

The most cruel words I've heard on this show to this day were said way back when on the bridge by Ramona to Bethenny.  

Interesting how perception can be so different. Although delivered by Ramona in her typically tactless way, I thought that was incredibly truthful and it could have been a light bulb moment for B. I guess because Ramona is most like me of all the housewives I rarely find her truth bombs cruel. Other wives say the same type of things in their talking heads or behind someone's back, so... On the other hand Ramona trying to hit another HW with an oar was unconscionable.

[Trooper York]

Quote

The comments about Carole and ambition are interesting.  Now, of course she owes Aviva and the rest of we observers nothing, but -- it's so freaking hard to get published, by major houses, and to have notable editors work with you, to land regular columns in print publications.  Why in the holy hell would she let her focus seem to dwindle to this degree, when she probably has decades of work and life ahead of her, and isn't (and I am NOT no-kid-shaming) raising a family or doing volunteer work out of her ass or something?  It's just a little baffling, especially after Aviva's vicious attacks.  I am curious, I guess. 

The right answer is usually the simple one. Lets face facts.  Carole is a talentless sack of crap who is too lazy to write and most likelly had someone else do the work for her. When did you see her actually do anything on this show? Write something? Cook something? Throw a party that wasn't pizza and M&M's. There is no great mystery as to why she didn't produce any work. She can't.

She is the spokes model for useless wannabe octogenarian would be hipster douche nozzles.

I hope she disappears up Bethenny's ass  like a confused gerbil. Hey maybe that's the basis of Bethenny's health scare.  An impacted bowel.

[Alonzo Mosely FBI]

1 hour ago, Mondrianyone said:

It is hard to get published by a major house, but it's a whole lot easier if you're a famous person--or fame-adjacent like Carole was.  And it was especially easier in the years following JFK Jr.'s death, which kind of revived the whole Camelot nostalgia.  I worked on a book by one of his friends, who was someone that nobody had ever heard of (and it was a book that had literally no merit).  They were practically hunting people down who had the most tenuous connection to JFK Jr. and handing out book contracts like pizzeria flyers.  So maybe Carole, who hadn't spent years in the trenches (the trenches of developing skills as a writer, not the TV-news-producing trenches), didn't have a clear sense of what a gift she'd been handed and thought it was something she'd always be privileged with in the future.  And since she didn't have to work toward it in the past, assumed she wouldn't have to work for it in the future.  I don't know.  People think they're entering some sort of magic circle that they'll never be evicted from.  It kind of looks as if she's in the process of being delivered from that delusion.

 

That is so interesting thank you for sharing. I have often thought the money train has stopped rolling for her and she needs this job. She may indeed be getting evicted from that magic circle. 

[StevieRocks]

2 hours ago, straightshooter said:

I totally agree.  IMO, Ramona is actually the meanest one in the bunch - yep, even meaner than Bethenny.  The difference is that we've come to regard Ramona as a gnat and even though she is constantly making noise, we listen to less and less of her.  Now that Bethenny is HBIC, she's trying to tone certain things down but will still sling anything the brings her closer to the top.  Kiss that ass, Ramona! 

The most cruel words I've heard on this show to this day were said way back when on the bridge by Ramona to Bethenny.  

100%. Crazy Eyes is one of the vilest, most soulless people on the planet. Filled with bullying nastiness--and you're right; she's such an inarticulate moron that it's easier to dismiss her. I didn't think she could possibly become any more revolting, but now that she's LITERALLY mimicking everything SkinnyCow says and bullying from the sidelines, she's even more gross. This is a 60-year-old hag who is fighting for space in SkinnyCow's ass, and has the audacity to shake her Crazy-Eyed head and suggest that others are stupid?? Unbelievable. When she and SkinnyCow were calling Jules, "special needs," <real nice, btw>, I thought, "Really, Crazy Eyes? You're an incoherent, hateful, bumbling simpleton, and you're going to sit there beside Debo from the movie "Friday," and insult someone's intelligence?? Okay. At this point, if SkinnyCow/Debo said that Mario was right to cheat on her, she'd agree and bark up with some ignorant, incomprehensible supporting arguments to validate it.  What a sad old sea hag.

[straightshooter]

1 hour ago, Almost 3000 said:

Interesting how perception can be so different. Although delivered by Ramona in her typically tactless way, I thought that was incredibly truthful and it could have been a light bulb moment for B. I guess because Ramona is most like me of all the housewives I rarely find her truth bombs cruel. Other wives say the same type of things in their talking heads or behind someone's back, so... On the other hand Ramona trying to hit another HW with an oar was unconscionable.

Yep, I'm amazed at how many times see things exactly opposite the way another might see them.   Certain personalities and actions are surely polarizing.  I respect your perspective and I can see how you would feel the way you do.  (I actually forgot about the oar and that whole thing)  I'm also amazed at the way Ramona STILL gets away with her hit-and-run comments and attacks.  Her theatrics this season have been amusing to me, though - after the urge to slap her has passed.  

The way I saw the comments during their conversation on the bridge, Ramona was kicking someone who was down - right to their face, and hard.  To tell someone "you have no one" when it's not entirely untrue just seemed beyond cold to me.   It was pretty brutal, even if Bethenny is...the way she is. 

In my eyes, (during their respective worst moments) Ramona was mean, and Bethenny was mad .  I'm not saying either of them is more guilty or less guilty, either.  They both suck.

Edited June 11, 2016 by straightshooter
Because true and untrue mean very different things...

[Rainny]

41 minutes ago, Trooper York said:

The right answer is usually the simple one. Lets face facts.  Carole is a talentless sack of crap who is too lazy to write and most likelly had someone else do the work for her. When did you see her actually do anything on this show? Write something? Cook something? Throw a party that wasn't pizza and M&M's. There is no great mystery as to why she didn't produce any work. She can't.

She is the spokes model for useless wannabe octogenarian would be hipster douche nozzles.

I hope she disappears up Bethenny's ass  like a confused gerbil. Hey maybe that's the basis of Bethenny's health scare.  An impacted bowel.

I probably missed something, but, where does Carole's money come from? Is this show her only income now?

[BlackMamba]

7 hours ago, anonymiss said:

I don't like that Omarosa clip because it reminds me I consider her one reality TV person even worse than Bethenny. I've never seen anyone steamroll and badger and have delusions of grandeur worse than O.

I disagree.   I LOVE the clip because it's a woman who isn't going to allow Bethenny to run over her.   Bethenny and Omarosa are one in the same in terms of strong personalities but O won't take no bullshit especially from Queen B. 

Edited June 11, 2016 by BlackMamba

[Petunia13]

On June 9, 2016 at 11:21 AM, ElDosEquis said:

You do know that it wouldn't surprise me if she has some kind of Melisandre thing going with those chokers....

It's not working

[zoeysmom]

1 hour ago, straightshooter said:

In my truly humble opinion, what Bethenny reeeeeealllly hates about LuAnn is that she is secure with herself and has remained a fairly confident woman regardless of her life circumstances at any given time.  I think it's slowly sinking in to Bethenny that no matter how much money/power/fame/plastic surgery/business success she has, she is still insecure.  She's having a tough time swallowing that pill.

LuAnn consistently carries herself well, and Bethenny is quite challenged in that department.  

In reality, (I know, I know!) it's actually very sad.  

There was a moment when Bethenny switch flipped and that was when Luann said she had been asked to write a book.  I don't know if it is an etiquette breach or just being a jealous snot, but Bethenny protector of her business thought nothing of calling Luann out for writing a book on etiquette way back in Season 2.  Just because Bethenny didn't like the idea-or didn't come up with it first doesn't mean it was appropriate. Talk about damaging someone's business.  She and Ramona were jealous.  The book from what I have read is as much about Luann's life. (I read the excerpts on Amazon.) Of course we saw returning Bethenny do the same thing to Ramona about her book.  As Heather said, "Bethenny, she can write a book."

To me there is a difference in etiquette and morals.  A large part of etiquette revolves around discretion being the better part of valor, and making people feel comfortable and holding ones' thoughts unless requested.  White lies and silence are a big part of etiquette.  A non-etiquette beach for Ramona was when Luann asked how she liked the red lace jumpsuit-Ramona measured her comment to, "I need to think about it."  Then there are the countless other times Ramona has acted like a mannerless moron and her husband as well.  A huge etiquette breach is asking about someone's sex life or status of their marriage.  Regardless if it was on Page Six. The answerer should not be deemed ill-mannered for not answering or giving a water down answer or called a hypocrite.  So I think these women have the two things confused.  Etiquette isn't dazzling them with bullshit but certainly someone doesn't have to lower their standards for fear of being called a hypocrite.   Etiquette equals comfort.  Bethenny could have said to Dorinda, "I am uncomfortable with John asking for my phone number, I would prefer you be in the loop."  Instead she went right for the throat with Dorinda and criticized her for trying to sell John. 

It is still consider pretty rude to for a man talk about his sexual partners and in all fairness a woman should not be chatting about all her conquests either.  (See Sonja Morgan and her roster of real and imaginary lovers.)  It was wrong for John in Bethenny and Ramona's eyes to allegedly be talking up his sex life with Dorinda, so why is Luann suppose to give it up?  Carole actually was pretty tactful when asked about her imaginary sexually 18 month relationship with George Clooney, she declined to confirm or deny on camera.    Nobody been busting her chops or calling her a out or a hypocrite for not going into details.

[lunastartron]

46 minutes ago, Rainny said:

I probably missed something, but, where does Carole's money come from? Is this show her only income now?

That's an interesting question.

She got around $700k as an advance in a two-book deal for WG and the essay collection she just blew off. Say 1/3-40% of that actually in her coffers but factor in the fact that initial sales for the novel were in the low four figures (meaning she didn't make the money back by a long shot) and the possibility that she'd have to repay a fraction for tome #2 since she never fulfilled her obligations.

Anthony's dad was famously bankrupt. After years upon years of trying to nail down a wealthy husband, Lee did make away with millions when Herb Ross divorced her shortly before his passing but those events transpired after Anthony passed.

JFK, Jr. did leave a large trust to be divided among a pretty significant number of family friends, employees, and relatives but I'm not sure if Carole walked away with any of those funds since Anthony - who was originally named executor of the will - passed so close to John and Carolyn.

Jackie, I believe, left low seven-figure-amounts to Lee's kids but that was over two decades ago.

So . . . Carole's equity probably derives mostly from that apartment, which would have appreciated, like, astronomically since the purchase.

Edited June 11, 2016 by lunastartron

[breezy424]

As much as I don't like Carole this season, I have liked her in the past.  Maybe it's because I like Heather.  Anyhow, Carole had a very successful career in an industry that is hard to break into and one that is cutthroat.  I give her kudos for that.  Unfortunately, Carole got hit with a ton of emotional bricks with the cancer and death of her husband.  And the totally unexpected death of John and Carolyn who both she and her deceased husband were very close to.  Talk about shell shocked.  Some people may have thrown themselves back into what they were doing previously.  Others may, after reflection, decide they may want to take their life in a different direction.  If she is happy in her present career, who is anyone to criticize it.  I don't think Carole is rich by any means but she gets by.

Her relationship with Beth and how she portrays herself as a person is totally different and I don't like her now. 

[DelicateDee]

15 hours ago, lampwick said:

From B's perspective, Sonya's Tipsy Girl was an attack on her business.  Since Sonya thought it was okay to do that, B decided to attack Sonya's business and see how she likes it.  Sonya's "business" is being on the show;freeze her out, and she can negatively affect Sonya's business.  Sonya is getting a taste of her own medicine.  

Uumm, very interesting perspective.  Although I wouldn't say it was an attack so much as it was piggybacking off her brand.   Which in Sonja's mind was a compliment.  Whether B has the power to get Sonja booted or not, I feel she was in her rights to decide she didn't want anything to do with Sonja after the Tipsy Girl debacle.  Let the chips fall where they may, but unlike what a lot of posters are saying, I'm not so sure that Bethenny has all this power that others seem to think she has.  

[zoeysmom]

46 minutes ago, lunastartron said:

That's an interesting question.

She got around $700k as an advance in a two-book deal for WG and the essay collection she just blew off. Say 1/3-40% of that actually in her coffers but factor in the fact that initial sales for the novel were in the low four figures (meaning she didn't make the money back by a long shot) and the possibility that she'd have to repay a fraction for tome #2 since she never fulfilled her obligations.

Anthony's dad was famously bankrupt. After years upon years of trying to nail down a wealthy husband, Lee did make away with millions when Herb Ross divorced her shortly before his passing but those events transpired after Anthony passed.

JFK, Jr. did leave a large trust to be divided among a pretty significant number of family friends, employees, and relatives but I'm not sure if Carole walked away with any of those funds since Anthony - who was originally named executor of the will - passed so close to John and Carolyn.

Jackie, I believe, left low seven-figure-amounts to Lee's kids but that was over two decades ago.

So . . . Carole's equity probably derives mostly from that apartment, which would have appreciated, like, astronomically since the purchase.

Here is where JFK's money went:  http://nypost.com/1999/09/25/from-uncle-john-with-love-carolines-kids-are-tops-in-jfk-jr-will/  Nothing for Carole or Anthony.  Jacqueline left Anthony $500,000.00 that went into a trust and paid in annual annuities for 10 years.

[Knuckles]

3 hours ago, Mondrianyone said:

People think they're entering some sort of magic circle that they'll never be evicted from.  It kind of looks as if she's in the process of being delivered from that delusion.

Thank you for this. It explains a great deal. I find Carole to be utterly vacuous, and am stunned at the way she treats deadlines and even her editor. She never seems to be writing, or even concerned about her work...instead she drifts along, with no apparent direction unless following in the wake of Beth. She has nothing of interest to say, scrapping with Luann seems to be her effort to gain some screen time, but what has she contributed that is of any interest to viewers. Fortune-tellers? Really? I get that Bethenny needs a back-up, so it looks as if she has a friend, but almost any random person would offer more interest to the viewer than Carole. 

[DelicateDee]

14 hours ago, Almost 3000 said:

Sadly, after seeing her Kraft shaker I'd bet her recipe is a store bought major brand sauce in a jar (because that's classier than a can) like Classico or maybe Newmans (fits her politics) and no pre-boil noodles. Toss a couple of eggs in the mozzarella, layer, repeat. 

I don't think she even did that much putting it together.  Completely store bought and reheated.  I think I saw her removing some store bought appetizers from their box and onto a tray, too.  Plus, when they dug into it, it was so mushy looking, dead giveaway that it was store bought.  That being said, I have no issue with it as I could get down with some (certain) store bought lasagna.  Heck, now I want some lasagna !!  I think I'll have to put my own 'killa' recipe lasagna together this weekend.

[Trooper York]

Carole brings nothing to the table other than an attitude that is not matched by her accomplishments. She is worthless and should be replaced. She is Bethenny's accessory. Sort of like Luann's chunky necklace.

if you wedged it way up your ass.

[breezy424]

I don't think Beth's current behavior is any vindication for Kelly B.  Kelly was wacko weirdo.  Period.  She is (was) a self centered snob.  I think it was in the first scene that we saw her, she literally skipped away while leaving a party. 

Scary Island was ridiculous.  How many times did she correct Beth and say that she was a cook, not a chef.  That's not someone who feels intimidated by someone.  Kelly was always quite adamant about her 'opinions'.  She just wasn't used to people not placating her because Kelly lives in her own little fantasy world of being 'special'. 

Beth also lives in that same fantasy world of being 'special'  but the only thing Beth did to Kelly was give her some reality.  Too bad no one is giving that to Beth.  Heather tried but she ended up with a season of getting one package and a minute spot for her son achieving his tenth birthday after having a liver transplant while an infant.  A remarkable achievement and that's what TPTB gave her.

The ratings may be up four years later but Beth thinks it's because she's so special.  She's so hung up on herself that she doesn't get it's because she has become the housewife that viewers love to hate.  Is that going to help her 'brand'.  I don't know.  I kind of doubt it but I think Beth is desperate.  Does Andy care?  Nope.  It's about ratings.  Not people. 

Oh, and I do wish that someone would tweet or say to Beth that her Skinnygirl stuff is crap.  I would have LOVED it if Lu tweeted back, "Have your tasted your Skinnygirl Margarita?".  Compared to Heather's Yummy, Beth's shape ware is also crap. 

[breezy424]

4 minutes ago, DelicateDee said:

I don't think she even did that much putting it together.  Completely store bought and reheated.  I think I saw her removing some store bought appetizers from their box and onto a tray, too.  Plus, when they dug into it, it was so mushy looking, dead giveaway that it was store bought.  That being said, I have no issue with it as I could get down with some (certain) store bought lasagna.  Heck, now I want some lasagna !!  I think I'll have to put my own 'killa' recipe lasagna together this weekend.

I don't have any problem with Doris ordering food either.  I give her props (and I don't even really like her) for ordering kosher for Jules (even though Jules is really 'sort of kosher') 

She also gave each guest a gift (pj's?)  and then arranged for Santa who gave the girls personalized wine glasses.   She may have given them Kraft Parmesan cheese but overall she was a very good hostess in that department.  It's too bad she didn't stand up to Beth and tell her that Beth crossed a line in how she was treating another guest in her house. 

[DelicateDee]

14 hours ago, ottergirl said:

I agree.  And I keep being reminded of the very first WWHL after her first episode back, when a caller said to Andy that Bethenny seemed like Jill Zarin, and Andy was visibly upset and surprised. I think he finds Bethenny charming and delightful, as she does herself, and neither one of them can understand the backlash. 

I also remember that in Season 3, in the Bethenny vs. Jill debacle, and then on Scary Island, the viewers (including me) were all very pro-Bethenny, and she said constantly, "The viewers get it. The viewers see it."

Yes, they do, Bethenny. How do you like that now?

Totally agree. You said in one short paragraph what I took about 3,500 words to convey. The power dynamic is wrecking the show, and even more because production is trying to cover it up. Like I said, I'm all in for a show about how women navigate crazy power dynamics, and how one woman wields incredible power, but the edit is trying to tell a different story - about how a brave, plucky truth-teller calls out bad behavior around her - and they're telling not only the wrong story, but they're telling a lie. And what gets me even more hyped up is knowing that the reunion will never address this, but will double down on the original narrative, and try to convince all of us that Bethenny (poor, sick, plucky, single, fibroid-riddled Bethenny) is like us.

Spoiler alert: Bethenny, you're not like us.

One other small thing that occurred to me.  I was reading Shonda Rhimes' book A Year of Yes, and she talks about how because of her insecurity, she was starting to freak out about being asked to appear on Kimmel Live. But she realized, as she was doing it, that this behavior was not acceptable.  As she put it: "The things that you can do when you are at the bottom of the ladder change as you move up. At the top of that ladder, doing many of those very same things makes you an a--hole. I'm being an a--hole."

Bethenny is still acting like she's the plucky, single working class girl speaking truth to power. But that's not who she is anymore, and that's not what she's doing any more.  That behavior that seemed like Greek Chorus now is amped up to where it is coming across as abuse of power. We can see that, Bethenny (specifically the employee hired to read this board) and Andy (aka the production intern). We can see it no matter how you try to cover it up.

And last thing: stop telling us how great the ratings are. Umbelina published a link to the ratings over all the seasons.  They're rising over the course of this season, which is great, but they're still WAY below where they were in Season 4 OR Season 5. They're just starting to get higher than where they were last year. And the lowest rated episodes of all time, since the show got successful? The Bethenny-focused episode last season (All In The Family or whatever) that featured her reuniting with her stepfather and moaning to her therapist; AND Part 3 of the reunion, when apparently many people agreed with me that the reunion was nothing but another episode of Bethenny's talk show, and didn't feel the need to watch it. 

 

13 hours ago, charmed1 said:

No way. Last season, Bethenny said she's never late. That must've been a fluke. 

What event was she late for?   I'm racking my brain for all the events they had and I'm sure I don't remember them all, but of the ones I can remember, (the latest at Dorinda's, last season's Ramona's party finale, Ramona's party last episode, the bra fitting party, Sonja's fake model shopping thing), I don't recall her being late.  

[DelicateDee]

11 hours ago, NewDigs said:

She knew the cameras were there!

That's kinda' sorta' public. lol

But it was also a sleep over where pjs are expected to be worn.   I thought they were cute (on her).  Looked quite comfy.

[BlackMamba]

1 hour ago, Trooper York said:

Carole brings nothing to the table other than an attitude that is not matched by her accomplishments. She is worthless and should be replaced. She is Bethenny's accessory. Sort of like Luann's chunky necklace.

if you wedged it way up your ass.

She should had left the minute Heather left.   Heather and Kristen were smart to ditch the pop sickle stand before Bethenny made them into even bigger targets. 

[DelicateDee]

11 hours ago, Yours Truly said:

Well there's attack as in raise by wolves, baring teeth and causing destruction  and then there's being sarcastic. I agree with Neurochick. Mileage does vary. <shrug>

Yeah, but it wasn't sarcasm.  It was, as said before, rude. 

[ScoobieDoobs]

Oh Carole, Carole, Carole, this is you with Bethenny now, hun.  With Moaner & Dorinda following . . .

How many can fit up Bethenny's asshole?  Hmmmm.  

So is Jules still on this show?  Someone please remind me.  She's such a non-entity, I can't remember.

Edited June 15, 2016 by ScoobieDoobs

[ScoobieDoobs]

10 hours ago, lilshilo said:

I have been loving ALL of the smart comments here so I decided that Andy Cohen should take a look-  Andy clapped back - (is it sad that I am fangirl happy that he replied to my tweet even if it was to swat me down?)

Wow, this is very telling.  It means Satan Andy thinks Bethenny's act is working.  Ugh, just ugh.

This is Bethenny now-

That's it.

[bravofan27]

It's an interesting point that Bethanny constantly ridiculous Luann for her etiquette book, but Luann makes one comment about SkinnyGirl (which she did name btw) and Bethanny goes beserk. I don't buy that Luann tries to sleep with everyone's boyfriends. She may strike up a conversation with guys at bars, but she never once tried to move in on Mario, Jason, or John (gross). I remember once she did sneak off with Harry but let's face it, he wasn't interested in Sonja at all, nor Luann. Luann is taking anyone taken. Luann also has sex appeal, which Bethanny and Carole just don't have. 

I feel like people are constantly trying to bring Luann down. They have constantly made fun of her as the countess, something that Carole and Bethanny STILL do when they talk about her (refer to her as, "the countess" in a snooty voice). I don't get the constant countess references. Luann isn't bringing it up-- Bethanny and Carole are (and they are the only ones that do it).

If I were Luann, I would immediately stop kissing Bethanny's ass. I would encourage Sonja to do TIpsy Girl, and I would just ignore that Bethanny exists. Bethanny was right-- who would want to talk to someone after calling them a whore and slut? Luann just needs to leave Bethanny and Carole in their huddle-- eventually they will turn on each other. Bethanny is constantly making fun of her-- "they are h'orderves? Do you not ever get out?" She's always making fun of Carole's awkwardness. 

[StevieRocks]

10 hours ago, Trooper York said:

The right answer is usually the simple one. Lets face facts.  Carole is a talentless sack of crap who is too lazy to write and most likelly had someone else do the work for her. When did you see her actually do anything on this show? Write something? Cook something? Throw a party that wasn't pizza and M&M's. There is no great mystery as to why she didn't produce any work. She can't.

She is the spokes model for useless wannabe octogenarian would be hipster douche nozzles.

I hope she disappears up Bethenny's ass  like a confused gerbil. Hey maybe that's the basis of Bethenny's health scare.  An impacted bowel.

Can someone please advise? I'm trying to give this one MILLION likes, but it's not letting me.

[SweetieDarling]

On 6/9/2016 at 1:14 AM, Forcereals said:

My IQ goes down when Jules comes on screen.  She seems nice, but I feel like she's dumber than a rock and doesn't add anything.  I like Dorinda, but I think she's a off--they hightailed it out, not hijacked--I think she's the last person to "save Sonja's feelings," she's just as mental.  Although everyone needs to stop sending textes/Texas...It's TEXTS!

Usually I think Bethenny needs to shut up, and I don't buy into the Carole "I'm just a girl in the city act," (maybe 20 years ago-please also stop with the chokers, 1995 called...) but LuAnn needed to hear about herself.  I am also starting to question LuAnn's taste level.  The jumpsuit and then whatever that hair and fringe sweater were in her TH looked very Married to the Mob/Real House Wives of NJ 1986.

I think the chokers are to hide the fact that we can now see her trachea.  I don't think she likes Jules being the thinnest one on the show.  She seems to have taken it as a challenge.  Either that or Bethenny is sharing her coke adderall SkinnyGirl secrets with her.

[zoeysmom]

7 hours ago, bravofan27 said:

It's an interesting point that Bethanny constantly ridiculous Luann for her etiquette book, but Luann makes one comment about SkinnyGirl (which she did name btw) and Bethanny goes beserk. I don't buy that Luann tries to sleep with everyone's boyfriends. She may strike up a conversation with guys at bars, but she never once tried to move in on Mario, Jason, or John (gross). I remember once she did sneak off with Harry but let's face it, he wasn't interested in Sonja at all, nor Luann. Luann is taking anyone taken. Luann also has sex appeal, which Bethanny and Carole just don't have. 

I feel like people are constantly trying to bring Luann down. They have constantly made fun of her as the countess, something that Carole and Bethanny STILL do when they talk about her (refer to her as, "the countess" in a snooty voice). I don't get the constant countess references. Luann isn't bringing it up-- Bethanny and Carole are (and they are the only ones that do it).

If I were Luann, I would immediately stop kissing Bethanny's ass. I would encourage Sonja to do TIpsy Girl, and I would just ignore that Bethanny exists. Bethanny was right-- who would want to talk to someone after calling them a whore and slut? Luann just needs to leave Bethanny and Carole in their huddle-- eventually they will turn on each other. Bethanny is constantly making fun of her-- "they are h'orderves? Do you not ever get out?" She's always making fun of Carole's awkwardness. 

I don't think Luann is kissing Bethenny's ass-I think she is doing her own version of the Heather disarming smile.  Heather said she employs the smile technique when someone is yelling at her and it worked brilliantly on Ramona. "I am going to be the bigger person here," all the while the two villains are trying to slither away unnoticed.    I look it as tolerating working in a hostile work environment, instead of being bullied into quitting, Luann is going to stand her ground.  (I used the bully word and I think this is an example of adult bullying with the name calling and actually discussing how the words used were designed to keep Luann from her employment.) 

[PhilMarlowe2]

On 6/9/2016 at 10:18 AM, Avaleigh said:

I think Brandi was mostly frozen out before filming of last season began. If Kyle, the Lisas, and Eileen hadn't banded together on that score we probably would have had another full season of that nasty bitch being shoved down our throats.

I agree though, I've never seen a freeze out of this scale.

Kyle and Joyce didn't invite Carlton to the cast trip to Puerto Rico in BH.  I think that's the only time someone has been purposefully excluded from a major cast trip.

[ElDosEquis]

13 hours ago, Trooper York said:

Carole brings nothing to the table other than an attitude that is not matched by her accomplishments. She is worthless and should be replaced. She is Bethenny's accessory. Sort of like Luann's chunky necklace.

if you wedged it way up your ass.

The world's most uncomfortable thong? Right up Methy's alley.

[ElDosEquis]

2 hours ago, zoeysmom said:

I don't think Luann is kissing Bethenny's ass-I think she is doing her own version of the Heather disarming smile.  Heather said she employs the smile technique when someone is yelling at her and it worked brilliantly on Ramona. "I am going to be the bigger person here," all the while the two villains are trying to slither away unnoticed.    I look it as tolerating working in a hostile work environment, instead of being bullied into quitting, Luann is going to stand her ground.  (I used the bully word and I think this is an example of adult bullying with the name calling and actually discussing how the words used were designed to keep Luann from her employment.) 

The "hang on to yourself" strategy is brilliant when you are confronted with any idiot who is looking to pull your chain.

Another sure fire way to get someone to fuck off is when they begin their rant and tell YOU what you are doing 'wrong', wait until they stop for a breath then ask them "Help me understand what I am doing wrong and tell me how to correct my behavior"....This will force them to stop and think about WTF they are talking about and while they flounder, you can make your escape.

People who are quick to offer their opinion and 'help' really don't have a clue.

[ElDosEquis]

Quote

If I were Luann, I would immediately stop kissing Bethanny's ass. I would encourage Sonja to do TIpsy Girl, and I would just ignore that Bethanny exists. Bethanny was right-- who would want to talk to someone after calling them a whore and slut? Luann just needs to leave Bethanny and Carole in their huddle-- eventually they will turn on each other. Bethanny is constantly making fun of her-- "they are h'orderves? Do you not ever get out?" She's althways making fun of Carole's awkwardness. 

Carole should talk to LVP about getting close to a wild fucking animal and being inside the radius of the chain around Methenny's neck. The first casualties are always the owners - they have to get close enough to feed and water the animal?

Edited June 11, 2016 by ElDosEquis
Well, if you want to know the truth, I screwed up....

[RedheadZombie]

21 hours ago, Avaleigh said:

As if I needed another reason to despise Bethenny. Now she's so hated that people are feeling sorry for the awful Kelly Bensimon and the idea is that Kelly was just some innocent, fragile, and overwhelmed victim of Bethenny's after all of the shit that she pulled? Is this the world we live in? (Sorry, I just recently got a bit of a RHOC fix.)

Kelly was right up there with Jill and Aviva in terms of being an unlikeable jerk and her gummy bear cartwheel bullshit didn't disguise for a second what a crazed delusional lunatic she revealed herself to be. Her accusations of bullying still make my blood boil. As if her 'I'm up here, you're down here' isn't on page 3 of The Bitchy Popular Girls Manual. She would say one thing and the idea in her mind was that everyone should simply ignore the stupid stuff she said and should have only taken her word seriously or literally when she deemed it to be appropriate. 

Nothing will ever make me side with Kelly on the 'this is you, this is me' and it wasn't just her being a dity airhead that was annoying. She didn't strike me as being particularly kind at all and she was frequently playing the victim. She was insulting and she gave Bethenny zero reason to be friendly towards her especially on Scary Island. She also thought that she knew better than Bethenny about Bethenny's culinary accomplishments. 

I thought and still think that Kelly was insufferable. Bethenny is acting like an asshole this season but I disagree that Kelly's behavior from past seasons is somehow redeemed, understandable, or at all logical. Bethenny had every right to be frustrated with Kelly's nonsense.

I saw very little of the seasons including Kelly.  But I do remember how kind Sonja was to Kelly on Scary Island.  And I remember a later scene in which Kelly was belittling and mocking Sonja's home.  I also saw the reunion that season and how insane Kelly was.  Claiming one thing and immediately denying it.  Then her whole spiel about Scary Island being a teaching moment for her girls to learn about bullying.  Ugh.  Do.not.like.

[RedheadZombie]

21 hours ago, Umbelina said:

http://www.evine.com/b/fashion/the-countess-collection/

You too can have Luann's jumpsuit!  It's on clearance for a low low price of $38.09!!

Wow, her prices are really low.  A blouse with a 2 star rating is $6.99.

Wow.  That's some really hideous stuff.  I suspected they would be low quality when I heard they weren't from the top two home shopping channels.  I doubt Luann did much other than lend her name, but they're quite unattractive.  A few pieces have good ratings, so that's something.  I've always suspected Luann's modeling career was exaggerated, and her modeling for her collection confirms it.  Good for her that she's able to make some money off of her fame for the show.  Too bad she didn't get a better deal like Lisa Rinna has, but then Rinna had fame outside the show.

What's going on with Luann's entertainment line?  I'm not sure if that's what she calls it, but we saw some of it a couple of seasons ago.  Someone took one of her plates and frisbeed it into a pool.  That line seemed higher quality than the clothing.

[WireWrap]

51 minutes ago, PhilMarlowe2 said:

Kyle and Joyce didn't invite Carlton to the cast trip to Puerto Rico in BH.  I think that's the only time someone has been purposefully excluded from a major cast trip.

Yes, they didn't invite her to PR but she was invited to PS and they didn't refuse to film with her. Sonja wasn't invited to Dorinda's because of Bethenny, Bethenny refuses to film with her and 

Spoiler

Bethenny, with the others blessings, decides to not invite Sonja on the Mexico trip

. This type of freeze out has not occurred on any other HW show across the entire franchise before, never. 

[RedheadZombie]

18 hours ago, sasha206 said:

My favorite Ramona moment!  Heck, Ramonja were so hot that trip!  Loved them.

It has to be followed closely by Ramona and Sonja googling "white trash" after Aviva labelled them such.  One of my all time favorite moments across the four franchises I've watched!

[Rainny]

16 hours ago, lunastartron said:

That's an interesting question.

She got around $700k as an advance in a two-book deal for WG and the essay collection she just blew off. Say 1/3-40% of that actually in her coffers but factor in the fact that initial sales for the novel were in the low four figures (meaning she didn't make the money back by a long shot) and the possibility that she'd have to repay a fraction for tome #2 since she never fulfilled her obligations.

Anthony's dad was famously bankrupt. After years upon years of trying to nail down a wealthy husband, Lee did make away with millions when Herb Ross divorced her shortly before his passing but those events transpired after Anthony passed.

JFK, Jr. did leave a large trust to be divided among a pretty significant number of family friends, employees, and relatives but I'm not sure if Carole walked away with any of those funds since Anthony - who was originally named executor of the will - passed so close to John and Carolyn.

Jackie, I believe, left low seven-figure-amounts to Lee's kids but that was over two decades ago.

So . . . Carole's equity probably derives mostly from that apartment, which would have appreciated, like, astronomically since the purchase.

Thank you. I always thought she must have inherited a substantial amount of money from her husband because she so easily blew off that 2nd book, like she didn't need the money. That and the fact that she never seems to worry about it or work at anything

[Avaleigh]

19 hours ago, Yours Truly said:

Ummm okay she was being annoying so what..? That means a random person who doesn't know u well can start in on you with some really aggressive bullshit and then start mocking u to someone else right in ur face? Yeah that's how nasty and mean people handle a situation and u know what last season this season bethenny ever after the talk show etc etc rests my case and I'm not even gonna bother cause sure yeah Kelly had her annoying moments but guess what we are seeing just how wrong Beth can be ON A REGULAR BASIS. Beth's bullshit shouldn't be condoned cause some of her prey annoys. 

One last thing, I totally thought it was within reason BUT articulated badly by Kelly about her reasoning behind just slapping her name onto charities if she's not really active in it. I actually thought it was a good point to make. Showed that she doesn't want to be pretending she's such an advocate but yet doesn't commit to much time to it whereas she's got her particular charities she truly involved in.. MMV obviously especially when Kelly's involved.. 

At the end of the day as it usually is in the case of Beth and her prey Kelly was for the most part harmless and her eviserstion completely unnecessary. 

It wasn't just about Kelly being annoying and I disagree that Kelly was some harmless, fragile butterfly that the ogre Bethenny or anyone else went out of their way to stomp on.

Kelly was rude, she was the opposite of kind to the other women, and felt that she was above everyone. She was late, inconsiderate, hypocritical, full of criticism, and impossible to follow. 

The gummy bear stuff is a minor example but it's easy to use because it's an example of Kelly making a production of how she's one way "I don't eat processed foods, [gross]" only to show that she does in fact eat processed foods. Her reaction when called on it is to be hostile and defensive like it's the other person who's stupid for not getting that she doesn't eat processed food unless it's a "fun" processed food. Is that really something that the average person isn't going to snark on especially when they're on a reality show? Kelly could have said, 'Haha, you're right, I can't resist the lure when it comes to candy' or something along those lines but her response is to be defensive rather than thinking, 'Okay, fair enough, I said another thing that doesn't really make sense.'

I loved when Bethenny asked her when they're supposed to know if they should take her word on something because I was wondering the same damned thing. It wasn't like it was one time where Kelly was inconsistent and Bethenny and the others kept harping on the gummy bears. It was something that Kelly would do all of the time and a person had no idea if they're supposed to take what she says seriously or not.

Kelly showed how mean and nasty she was but she isn't smart, she isn't a good listener, and she isn't articulate, so her attacks on Bethenny only served to make her look ridiculous, delusional, and silly.

One point that isn't made by the people who think that Kelly was some innocent victim of mean girl Bethenny is how Bethenny reacted when Kelly had her meltdown. Not only did she back off when she realized she was dealing with an unhinged lunatic, but she actually encouraged the others to back off too. She felt it was wrong to continue to go in on someone she suspected might in fact be mentally ill. 

This wasn't some one woman show where Bethenny was the only one commenting on Kelly's ridiculous and nonsensical behavior either. They all saw it and Ramona flat out told Kelly that she was completely "nuts".

Regarding Ramona, I agree that she has a cruel streak and it's in her to twist the knife when she has the opportunity. I personally think she's getting off on watching Sonja and Luann tapdance to keep their jobs and think she enjoys watching all of the arrows being sent their way courtesy of Bethenny and Carole. She's practically salivating. At the same time she's smart and aware enough that she'll be next on Bethenny's hit list if Sonja and Luann are cut. It's not like she's forgotten about the Ramonacoaster or the SingerStinger. I think that's why she's been (minimally) supportive of Luann in these episodes rather than throwing 100% of her weight behind Bethenny and Carole. 

[zoeysmom]

2 hours ago, PhilMarlowe2 said:

Kyle and Joyce didn't invite Carlton to the cast trip to Puerto Rico in BH.  I think that's the only time someone has been purposefully excluded from a major cast trip.

I think that was response to Carlton's disinviting Kyle to her husband's event and then inviting Mauricio to come without her.  The Joyce angle was Carlton delighted in putting a spell on Michael and then when the guy got sick backpedaling about being a good witch.

Alexis Bellino was excluded from the Mexico trip because she had no sense of humor about being the human sacrifice in Costa Rico. 

[Duke2801]

20 hours ago, sasha206 said:

Heck, Ramonja were so hot that trip!

Hot? Errr....maybe?  Amusing? Mostly.  Super-duper wasted? Definitely!

[ButterQueen]

22 hours ago, zoeysmom said:

From Ramona's brother's mouth:  http://pagesix.com/2014/04/03/real-housewife-cheated-more-than-husband-wifes-brother/  Ramona may want to rethink her attacks. 

I just don't believe this.  I don't think men were lining up, I don't think Mario cried at her feet....I can't stand her, but she is just too awkward being single.

[sasha206]

1 hour ago, RedheadZombie said:

It has to be followed closely by Ramona and Sonja googling "white trash" after Aviva labelled them such.  One of my all time favorite moments across the four franchises I've watched!

YES!  I'm embarrassed to admit I've rewatched that episode multiple times!  I also loooooved Ramona's lunch date with Aviva after when she strolls in with sunglasses and keeps them on for the first few minutes.

 

http://www.bravotv.com/the-real-housewives-of-new-york-city/season-5/videos/whats-white-trash

[RedheadZombie]

4 minutes ago, sasha206 said:

YES!  I'm embarrassed to admit I've rewatched that episode multiple times!  I also loooooved Ramona's lunch date with Aviva after when she strolls in with sunglasses and keeps them on for the first few minutes.

 

http://www.bravotv.com/the-real-housewives-of-new-york-city/season-5/videos/whats-white-trash

Sonja:  "Well a hillbilly can make people feel welcome ....... welcome to my trailer ......". 

[sasha206]

35 minutes ago, RedheadZombie said:

Sonja:  "Well a hillbilly can make people feel welcome ....... welcome to my trailer ......". 

This is why I love Sonja!

[LibertarianSlut]

3 hours ago, Avaleigh said:

Kelly was rude, she was the opposite of kind to the other women, and felt that she was above everyone. She was late, inconsiderate, hypocritical, full of criticism, and impossible to follow.

 

Yes to this whole post, but especially to the part quoted above.

After Kelly called Bethenny a ho-bag on Scary Island, she went back to New York and informed Luann what she'd said, and Lu shut Kelly down completely. Luann said she didn't think women needed the term "ho-bag" in their vocabularies. 

This makes Bethenny's recent attack on Luann and her sexuality all the more unfortunate and unnecessary. Given the opportunity to slut-shame Bethenny, Luann left the whole thing alone, even though she and Bethenny were at odds that season. Lu knows how to make a passive-aggressive dig, and she could have said something to Kelly like, "darling, I know she is pregnant with a child out of wedlock, but that doesn't make her a ho-bag." But Luann didn't go there because she doesn't get off on slut-shaming (if Lu slut-shamed Carole, and I'm not convinced she did, it wasn't a behavior she relished; it was a reaction to highly unique circumstances). 

Maybe Bethenny should think about the way "The Countess" actually treated her, versus this vague feeling of uneasiness and inferiority Bethenny feels she needs to purge when she's around a confident woman such as Luann.

[zoeysmom]

2 hours ago, ButterQueen said:

I just don't believe this.  I don't think men were lining up, I don't think Mario cried at her feet....I can't stand her, but she is just too awkward being single.

I posted it not necessarily for the truth of the matter but to show a pattern in Ramona's family.  When someone gets mad at someone they get very, very nasty and don't think of the consequences.  All of the rumors about Luann for the most part come from Ramona and I think instead of bringing up ancient rumors, or activating past stories she made up, she should reflect on how she felt when her own family went public with such claims. Just because she blows them off doesn't mean others are capable of the same. Her family seems to be a scorched earth kind of family. 

It is funny I didn't necessarily believe the men lined up or Mario on his knees but the cold beer in a frosty mug sounded real. I have always thought Mario hung around until Avery went off to college be it because of his own dalliances or having to live with Ramona.   I do think Ramona and Mario are nasty, megalomanical people and think so highly of themselves they probably threw out how desirable they were to the opposite sex when they argued.   Just like Ramona getting hurt by Luann and the fortune teller-she just assumes everyone wants her man.

I think you are  being kind referring to just a single Ramona being awkward, I find her awkward married or single.  She was probably awkward in-utero. When Ramona was on the Hooters boat she thought nothing of kissing, on camera, a new acquaintance, she has always loved her girls' nights out.  Her latest account of crawling across the table when Luann dislodged her, from a just met man's attention is pretty consistent with a person who collects people and has to be the center of attention. She says she just went to the bathroom, we have no idea how long she was gone but I bet Luann or even the man's story varies.  I just can't believe she sees that behavior as a victory over Luann. I noticed when watching the first two seasons' Reunions both years she said she was bored with others conversations because it did not involve her. 

She is a screwball and at this point I put nothing past her.  The fact she thinks she was owed some kind of conversation with Luann, who she hates and treats terribly, after Luann had ascertained, Ramona and Tom just went out to dinner is very telling. 

So I kind of feel like Ramona should be constantly reminded of rumors about her and her sexual past.  According to Sonja before Mario there were many men in Ramona's life and Ramona agreed. 

[HumblePi]

On 6/10/2016 at 9:41 PM, Alonzo Mosely FBI said:

It is hard to get published by a major house, but it's a whole lot easier if you're a famous person--or fame-adjacent like Carole was.  And it was especially easier in the years following JFK Jr.'s death, which kind of revived the whole Camelot nostalgia.  I worked on a book by one of his friends, who was someone that nobody had ever heard of (and it was a book that had literally no merit).  They were practically hunting people down who had the most tenuous connection to JFK Jr. and handing out book contracts like pizzeria flyers.  So maybe Carole, who hadn't spent years in the trenches (the trenches of developing skills as a writer, not the TV-news-producing trenches), didn't have a clear sense of what a gift she'd been handed and thought it was something she'd always be privileged with in the future.  And since she didn't have to work toward it in the past, assumed she wouldn't have to work for it in the future.  I don't know.  People think they're entering some sort of magic circle that they'll never be evicted from.  It kind of looks as if she's in the process of being delivered from that delusion.

I think we might be just a little hard on Carole and merely because of her last name and relationship with the Kennedy clan. Carole started her career as a journalist at ABC News working for Peter Jennings’ documentary unit, 'Peter Jennings Reporting'. While there she reported on stories in Cambodia, Haiti, India and Israel. She traveled extensively on the Thai-Cambodian border reporting and filming in refugee camps and with Khmer Rouge soldiers for the award-winning documentary titled From the Killing Fields. She was stationed in Israel during the Persian Gulf War and traveled with Israeli military personnel filming the aftermath of Saddam Hussein’s SCUD missile attacks. She also produced stories for the magazine shows 20/20, Primetime Live and DayOne including the story of Vietnam Veteran Bobby Muller’s anti-landmine campaign in Cambodia. Carole was honored with an EMMY award for the segment,

Quote

"I traveled to the Middle East for the first Gulf War on SCUD missile patrol, sat on the Great Wall of China, reported on stories in Haiti and India and in almost every state in America. I covered the War in Afghanistan when it broke out, right after 9/11 and flew there in a C-130 plane with the troops. I traveled with military personnel, ate MREs, swallowed malaria pills, held my breath in the latrines."

She met her future husband Anthony Raziwill on assignment. They got assigned to the same story. A murder case, the Menendez brothers. Lyle and Erik Menendez were two good-looking rich kids who gunned their parents down in their Beverly Hills living room. Anthony Radziwill was an ABC producer on the story, and Carole was sent to work on the team. Her very first book was a memoir, 'What Remains' and it was on the New York TImes Bestseller List for twelve weeks. In 2012 she released her second book,

I reserve judgement on Carole's writing career since I'm not qualified to judge her professionally. I can of course criticize her for her looks, her poor eating habits, and her unforgiving demeanor with Luann.

Edited June 13, 2016 by HumblePi