S02.E13: The Tameness Of The Wolf

[Tara Ariano]

Family tensions rise as Lucious throws his energy into directing an emotional music video, which recreates a traumatic interaction with his mother. Meanwhile, Tiana and Laura unleash a vicious rivalry over the spotlight on the Mirage a Trois tour, forcing Hakeem to mediate between the two divas.

[SimoneS]

I really liked this episode. They surprised me as much as they surprised Cookie with that party. I am glad I liked Cookie’s red shoes, but I don’t think that it worked with that dress. “Don’t you write that, I’ll beat yo ass.” Bwah. Cookie still cracks me up.

 

Terrence and Taraji were so good in this episode, but stay away from Lucious, Cookie. He is still evil as hell. I was so glad Andre when confronted his hypocritical ass. Oh Rhonda, Anika is not sane.

 

I missed Tiana. I hope we get to see more of her. She has a kick ass body. I liked her telling off Laura. I didn’t like that Hakeem had them together backing up his act. I am not sure about Hakeem marrying Laura. Is Tiana still in love with him?

 

I didn’t know that Frieda was even still around. I actually liked the song she did with Jamal. At least, Cookie has a conscience about Hank Gathers’ murder unlike Lucious.

Edited April 14, 2016 by SimoneS

[Primetimer]

But only for a little bit.

Read the story

[mtlchick]

Man, Chris Rock was one and done this year and yet he still has ramifications.  I really didn't see the daughter reveal coming. 

 

What a horrible way for Andre to learn the truth about his grandmother. 

 

Meanwhile...Hakeen you eeediot.  (face palm.) 

 

Overall, the second half of the season is going a LOT better than the first half.  I'm glad production figured out not everything needs to happen at break neck speed.  Just focus on a few story lines per episodes and it's easier to keep track AND makes it enjoyable.

[wanderingstar]

"Tell your girl to fall back!" Aaaah, I love you, Tiana!

 

What a delicious episode.

 

I liked seeing Hakeem and Jamal working together again.

 

Hakeem & Laura engaged? I don't see that ending well at all.

 

Poor Andre. Lucious continues to be trash. Instead of validating Andre, he tells his son he's embarrassed by him. Ugh. 

 

Anika inviting Rhonda to stay with her is so soapy. Love it!

 

I continue to love the music this season. I really liked the Jamal/Freda collaboration in this ep.

Edited April 14, 2016 by Gillian Rosh

[Queena]

I enjoyed the first half of the season, but I'm really enjoying the second half of the season.

I'm sorry, but I really feel sorry for Lucious. Growing up the way that he did, I can't help but feel a little sorry for him. I'm hoping that his Mother is still alive.

Edited April 14, 2016 by Queena

[tennisgurl]

Lucious might still be evil incarnate, but he really has had a crap life. My heart breaks for him as a little kid, but as an adult? He is still an awful dad, husband, and all around person. His scene with Andre was just heartbreaking. Poor Andre. At least it seems like he is going to the doctor. But, every once in awhile, I do actually feel bad for Lucious. I can get how he got to be such a ruthless asshole of a human being. 

 

Oh Hakeem. You are making so many bad life choices, I cannot even keep track.

[Luciano]

Man, Chris Rock was one and done this year and yet he still has ramifications. I really didn't see the daughter reveal coming.

It was already told to the audience (Lucious sought Freda out after hearing about her from Gathers) but it was news to Cookie. I had forgotten about that connection, though.

Lucious really wanted some Cookie after seeing her reassure the little boy actor in the video. Run, Cookie, run!

Tiana's gorgeous and makes Laura fade into the background.

[TrininisaScorp]

Damn if I don't feel sorry for Lucious!  Terrance really sells the pain.  But, he continues to handle Andre, probably the son who needs the most nurturing and has gotten the least, as poorly as possible. 

 

I continue to love Taraji and what she continues to color Cookie with.  Yes, she's over the top and her one-liners are still gold, but when she goes in, you feel it.  Her take charge of the video scene was powerful, her pleasure at all her sons being there for her birthday was lovely and her shock about Gathers was well done.  Taraji just brings it.  I flove her.

 

I love Hakeem's continued trait of never really being able to do the right thing.  This thing with Laura is going to fail and he did a spectacular job of pissing off Tiana.   

 

Oh Rhonda, that bitch is crazy. Run, girl, RUN!  I hope in true soap fashion, she sees something at Anika's place that makes her remember the attack. 

 

I'm loving this half of the season so much more already.  It's pacing is much more similar to the first season and the music has been hot.

Edited April 14, 2016 by TrininisaScorp

[Actionmage]

I guess that where Tiana is Cookie's "daughter", Freda gets to be Luscious'? Only we know he's got nothing good directly planned for her.

 

Still, I agree that Luscious needed to make BBBB about his story. He's still a freakin' millionaire; he can't have Becky or some other person call Freda? Save her the trip to wherever?

 

Porsha? Keep keeping it real with Cookie! Pie is indeed acceptable for birthdays. Just make sure the birthday person likes it though. *G*  I have no idea what the penny thing Porsha was starting to explain was about, but if someone here could explain it, I'd appreciate that. TIA.

 

I understand that Laura's more sane family had to feel better than the scene at Luscious', but Hakeem? You haven't seen them go off on each other. Plus? Being nice to a guy that's your daughter's boss and/or date is different from actual son-in-law. They may not be instantly welcoming to that much change.

 

Poor Tiana, though. Granted, she's the headliner, but she's having to deal with a n00b opening act- an one that's dating her ex and their boss-- as well as compromising on stage time while on the road. To top it off, Hakeem proposes to Laura with fans and paps right there, at the backdoor of the venue she just headlined.  Hakeem needs Becky to take over broom duties from Cookie. Jamal can sit and giggle at the scene.

 

I think that Freda and Jamal may have one of the cooler potential friendships. Their parents caused no end of pain to each other (well, until Luscious met Frank again....) Their music could help them get past their respective father ish , as well as Luscious ish, which can be different things, depending on the issue at hand.

 

The little kid who rapped-- was he found in the our the show had that went around looking to find talent? I know there was a stop in the DFW Metroplex, but I don't remember hearing about it afterwards.

 

Oh, Rhonda! I hope you only need to stay a couple of days. Andre can rent a nice hotel suite close to Empire HQ until you can unload the mansion. Or sell it to Anika. *g*  Like Queena, I hope Luscious' mom is still alive. I also hope Andre is the one to find her and that she is well. Andre needs to have a win and having a family member doing good and thriving is something Luscious would deny him if Luscious had the power. (So look out for Thirsty clocking your moves, Dre, if you do that.)

 

I think I will never not find the Hakeem logo funny. That that version seems to be permanent ( at least until Lu or someone else takes over) only tickles me more. I love it.

[Rowan]

I giggle each time I see Hakeem's profile in the logo.

Poor Andre. Luscious's sons are just extensions of his legacy, and Andre is mostly an embarrassment to him. So cold. I can't root for him, not even for surviving that nightmare of a childhood. He's so heartless.

I still love Cookie, though.

[Dee]

Lucious is the worst.

 

That said the cast is really bringing it during the back half of this season, especially the T Trio (Taraji, Trai & Terrence) and even the weaker actors in the cast like Bryshere, Jamila and Serayah are turning in solid performances.

 

I remain glad at Rhonda being featured more. Kaitlin Doubleday imbues Rhonda with the best reaction shots to her family's insanity.

 

I'm also glad that Anika is being re-woven back into the family. I called it at the end of last season that as soon as the rest of the Lyons found out she was pregnant, she'd be back in the fold.

 

For an unknown, Bre-Z is a natural, and her & Jamal's track was pretty great.

 

Sad that there was no Thirsty this week but I'm glad Becky and Porsha are proving adept as assistants. Porsha & Cookie's pie exchange and Becky reading Laura were definitely highlights of the night.

Edited April 14, 2016 by Dee

[Queena]

I guess that where Tiana is Cookie's "daughter", Freda gets to be Luscious'? Only we know he's got nothing good directly planned for her.

Still, I agree that Luscious needed to make BBBB about his story. He's still a freakin' millionaire; he can't have Becky or some other person call Freda? Save her the trip to wherever?

Porsha? Keep keeping it real with Cookie! Pie is indeed acceptable for birthdays. Just make sure the birthday person likes it though. *G* I have no idea what the penny thing Porsha was starting to explain was about, but if someone here could explain it, I'd appreciate that. TIA.

I understand that Laura's more sane family had to feel better than the scene at Luscious', but Hakeem? You haven't seen them go off on each other. Plus? Being nice to a guy that's your daughter's boss and/or date is different from actual son-in-law. They may not be instantly welcoming to that much change.

Poor Tiana, though. Granted, she's the headliner, but she's having to deal with a n00b opening act- an one that's dating her ex and their boss-- as well as compromising on stage time while on the road. To top it off, Hakeem proposes to Laura with fans and paps right there, at the backdoor of the venue she just headlined. Hakeem needs Becky to take over broom duties from Cookie. Jamal can sit and giggle at the scene.

I think that Freda and Jamal may have one of the cooler potential friendships. Their parents caused no end of pain to each other (well, until Luscious met Frank again....) Their music could help them get past their respective father ish , as well as Luscious ish, which can be different things, depending on the issue at hand.

The little kid who rapped-- was he found in the our the show had that went around looking to find talent? I know there was a stop in the DFW Metroplex, but I don't remember hearing about it afterwards.

Oh, Rhonda! I hope you only need to stay a couple of days. Andre can rent a nice hotel suite close to Empire HQ until you can unload the mansion. Or sell it to Anika. *g* Like Queena, I hope Luscious' mom is still alive. I also hope Andre is the one to find her and that she is well. Andre needs to have a win and having a family member doing good and thriving is something Luscious would deny him if Luscious had the power. (So look out for Thirsty clocking your moves, Dre, if you do that.)

I think I will never not find the Hakeem logo funny. That that version seems to be permanent ( at least until Lu or someone else takes over) only tickles me more. I love it.

I had a nice giggle when I saw that the show was still using it. Go Hakeem! Lol

I agree, Andre needs a win. He needs something positive to happen, and stick to him and his wife.

Since when did Rhonda and Anika become besties?

[RCharter]

Tiana's gorgeous and makes Laura fade into the background.

Seriously...where is Laura's staircase?  All the fabulousness on this show and they are keeping her around?

 

I guess she is going to be Hakeem's big loss once BBK shows up with her baby!

 

Porsha? Keep keeping it real with Cookie! Pie is indeed acceptable for birthdays. Just make sure the birthday person likes it though. *G*  I have no idea what the penny thing Porsha was starting to explain was about, but if someone here could explain it, I'd appreciate that. TIA.

 

 

I feel like Porsha was saying her grandma liked to get nickels, put them in a sock and beat people with them.  So, you get six dozen pennies...put them in a sock and maybe use it when you can't find a broom?

[CofCinci]

I was hoping that Camilla didn't die but it's a soap opera so perhaps she'll pop up again to crash Hakeem's wedding.

What's up with Tiana's longing gazes towards Hakeem? Are those two going to hook up again? They're wasting Tiana this season, BTW.

This felt like a filler episode. There are too many cast members. I suspect a killing soon.

[SimoneS]

I think that season finale is going to be "Who murdered Anika?" The truth has got to come out that she push Rhonda down those stairs and everyone will be out for blood.

 

I remain glad at Rhonda being featured more. Kaitlin Doubleday imbues Rhonda with the best reaction shots to her family's insanity.

 

Kaitlin is underrated. She deserves much for more love for the great performances she gives as the exasperated Rhonda. Her reaction shots are classic.

[Tikichick]

I swear I saw the anvil fall when Rhonda said she was so glad to be saying with someone who isn't crazy for a change.

 

I did spend a good deal of the episode repeatedly counting after Cookie and Porsha discussed the birthday cake.  "Make sure it's enough for five?"  Cookie, her three sons, their dubious daddy, plus unfortunate daughter in law = six every time I do the math in my head.

 

Can't shake the feeling that the end of Mimi/Camilla was incredibly rushed for reasons that make no sense to me.

[Biggie B]

Please refresh my memory: did Hakeem dump Tiana for Camilla, or did Tiana dump him? I can't quite recall how their relationship ended, but I'm sorry it did. I feel as if Tiana is the only woman who can go toe to toe with Hakeem - she's his equal on many levels, and they'd be an awesome power couple. She's drop dead gorgeous as well! I, too, wonder why she gave such a longing look at Hakeem. Does she still desire him? That's why I want to remember how they broke up. Was that a look of regret or one of unrequited love?

 

No good will come of Hakeem and Laura's engagement. Anika's pregnancy will see to its demise.

 

The showdown between Lucious and Andre was rough! As soon as Lucious admitted being embarrassed by Andre, I feared for the worst - this will push Andre to the outer limits. No amount of prayer or medication is going to help him, I fear. And I totally get Rhonda's reaction - she loves Andre but has been consumed by his issues for so long. I don't think she wants their marriage to end, but she needs a break and some support of her own. Unfortunately, Anika is NOT the appropriate person to turn to! Will Rhonda see a pair of red-soled shoes at Anika's house, triggering some flashbacks?

 

Sad that there was no Thirsty this week but I'm glad Becky and Porsha are proving adept as assistants. Porsha & Cookie's pie exchange and Becky reading Laura were definitely highlights of the night.

Agreed^^^!!

[Tikichick]

I don't understand the Tiana story at all.  Hakim was smitten with her before.  Professionally they were put out there as a couple.  She preferred to play in another league and was only putting up with Hakim for business I thought?   Maybe the writers are a little fuzzy on the past plotlines like I am?

[Neurochick]

I'm glad they ditched that Mimi/Camilla storyline, too many guest stars clutter up the story.  I have really been happy with the episodes the second half of the season.  Focus on the characters they have, not all these guest stars. 

 

I don't think Tianna is interested in Hakeem.  She's concerned about her career.  Now that Hakeem is engaged to Laura, where will that leave Tianna?

 

I also could get why Hakeem proposed to Laura, his family is SO dysfunctional that when he saw a father who was actually happy for his daughter's success, it made Hakeem realize that not all families are as fucked up as his.  Hakeem wants a functional family, so he sees marrying Laura as a step toward that.  Of course it won't work once he finds out Anika is pregnant.

 

And I really love that "Look But Don't Touch" song.  I have no idea what shit Laura and her girls were singing.

Edited April 14, 2016 by Neurochick

[darkestboy]

I liked the episode exploring more into Lucious's past and while I don't want Cookie to take him back, they do work well together in certain respects.

 

Freda was better used and I liked her working with Jamal in this episode. Cookie realising who she was though, that was a good note to end on.

 

Andre really does seem like he's heading for a breakdown each episode and Lucious didn't help matters during that confrontation either.

 

Rhonda, don't trust Anika. That's it really.

 

Hakeem and Laura's engagement won't last though. I also think the writers need to figure out what they want to do with Tiana, but other than that this was a brilliant episode, 9/10

[mtlchick]

 

And I really love that "Look But Don't Touch" song.

 

I think it's my favourite song from this season outside of the one with Pitbull.

[One Tough Cookie]

Someone help me out, please.  I thought I had seen every episode but I was really puzzled by the short cene in the beginning with Camilla drinking the poison?  What episode was that?

[Neurochick]

Someone help me out, please.  I thought I had seen every episode but I was really puzzled by the short cene in the beginning with Camilla drinking the poison?  What episode was that?

 

In the end of the last episode, she drank the poison, at Lucious' suggestion.

[Empress1]

Has it really been less than a year since Cookie got out? She said this was her first free birthday in 17 years. A LOT has happened in that time.

 

I can see why Hakeem wants to marry into a loving, functional family. His ain't. Laura bores the FUCK out of me though, and we all know Anika's baby is going to mess that all up.

 

Serayah is in the main cast credits but she barely has anything to do. I wish the writers would figure that out.

 

I don't understand (well, I do: plot contrivance) why Andre just left Rhonda there. She wanted to leave, said so, and he told her to stay and just peaced? Huh?

 

I'm looking forward to Anika and Cookie being in the same room again. We haven't heard "Boo Boo Kitty" in a minute.

[Grace19]

I like hakeem/laura, but i have a feeling it won't end well, they might even kill off laura. Hakeem/tiana were nice in season one, if this storyline leads to a jayz/beyonce kind of power couple, i'm all for it. Now writers bring in the baby drama and anika's craziness, lol.

[Dee]

I don't understand the Tiana story at all.  Hakim was smitten with her before.  Professionally they were put out there as a couple.  She preferred to play in another league and was only putting up with Hakim for business I thought?   Maybe the writers are a little fuzzy on the past plotlines like I am?

 

Hakeem & Tiana were an actual couple before he found out she had a side relationship (India) like he did (Camilla). When Tiana found out about Hakeem & Camilla, she was not thrilled but refused to let Hakeem's dalliances screw up her burgeoning career.

 

After the truth about Tiana's relationship with India was brought to light, a devastated Hakeem pressed further into Camilla's embrace as Tiana floated to the background for a few episodes.

 

When Billy Beretti began poaching Empire artists after Boo Boo Kitty jumped ship, Tiana was one of the first Empire artists Creedmoor tried to woo over to their side (via Anika). Luckily, Hakeem, Porsha and Chicken were able to stall Anika long enough to allow Cookie to make a semi-successful plea for Tiana to remain with Empire.

 

Tiana expressed her reservations about staying with Empire because she was under the mistaken belief (via Anika) that Empire wanted to dump her since she and Hakeem were no longer an item.

 

However Cookie made the case to Tiana that Creedmoor wasn't invested in her career beyond exacerbating Lucious & Beretti's feud. Cookie also stressed to Tiana that Empire was a family run business, and as a veteran Empire artist, Tiana was an important part of the extended Lyon family.

 

Tiana then opened up about her regrets about how she and Hakeem's relationship ended and her desire for them to resume their status as "power couple." Hakeem, maturely, informed her that though he wanted her to remain at Empire he couldn't be in a relationship with her again because he was in love with Camilla.

 

After their meeting at the restaurant it was later revealed that, in spite of her initial misgivings, Tiana decided to remain with Empire.

Edited April 14, 2016 by Dee

[Biggie B]

Thanks, Dee, for the Tiana recap! I remember most of it but definitely not all.

[gazebo]

Oh Lucious!  You fucking, evil asshole!  After managing to piss off Jamal and Hakeem, he finally succeeds in pissing off Andre, the smart son, the one he relied on to make major financial decisions!

 

What's cool about Terrence Howard is that one moment he makes me feel so sad and sorry for him and the next moment he does some assholy thing and I'm angry and hating on him all over again!

 

What a shitty childhood Lucious had.  A crazy mother who tried to kill him and then killed herself and left him to fend for himself.  And Lucious becoming a drug dealer when he was still a young boy in order to survive.  That is one fucked up sad childhood and I wouldn't wish this on anybody. 

 

I found the scenes of the video shoot for Lucious music video to be rather disturbing.  I liked how Lucious talked to the young boy actor.  You can see he was trying so hard to convey his feelings and it was very hard for him and then Cookie comes and makes it all better for that boy and Lucious.  Very nice scene.  Cookie understand Lucious more than anyone else.  She apparently is the only one that can still tolerate Lucious for a long period of time. 

 

Boy!  Andre sure put two and two together real quick just by watching Lucious' music video for a few minutes!  His asshole dad always blamed him for his mental illness and acted like Andre was a freak, a weirdo.  All along Lucious knew his mom was mentally ill and passed it along to his innocent son, and he still blamed Andre!  I wish Andre would've punched out Lucious right there and then at Cookie's birthday party.  Lucious is not a stupid man, but his refusal to acknowledge mental disease is infuriating!

 

I didn't expect this, but I was actually shedding tears when I saw Lucious' video and Andre's reaction to it.  I just found it all to be profoundly sad.

 

And.....Rhonda goes fleeing straight to Boo Boo Kitty!  This is such a bad idea!  I can't wait until everyone finds out that Anika is knocked up by Hakeem!

 

I think Tiana has acknowledged the fact that her romance with Hakeem is done and over with.  Her face looked really calm when she saw Hakeem kissing Laura.  Hakeem looked at Tiana and Tiana kind of nodded and smiled a little.  Yep, I think it finally hit her that Hakeem is really done with her.

Edited April 14, 2016 by gazebo

[dirtypop90]

I thought Tiana was bisexual. Her and Hakeem both had side things going on, but Hakeem couldn't handle hers and so they broke up.

Based on what we've seen these past two eps, I think they're heading back towards Hakeem and tiana eventually because Laura didn't catch on with the audience. Whatever that look was this ep, I felt something coming from both of them, not just Tiana. I think tptb chose to escalate Hakeem and Laura's relationship this quickly so they can blow up the relationship with the Anika reveal. Plus, Tiana is finally getting screen time, and we know these writers have no use for women who aren't in some way involved with a Lyon man.

I like the Tiana character. For one, I think empire records needs a big artist that isn't family and, two, cookie doesn't have a daughter and Tiana never mentions family, so I was hoping they could form a bond. They seemed to be going that way in season one before Tiana was pushed to the back. I wish Tiana would get her own s/l but that ain't happening so I'm fine with them putting her back with Hakeem if that means she'll have a bigger role on the show.

Edited April 14, 2016 by dirtypop90

[represent]

 

I thought Tiana was bisexual. Her and Hakeem both had side things going on, but Hakeem couldn't handle hers and so they broke up.

That's right. 

 

I actually thought she had a small smile on her face as she and Hakeem looked at one another after he proposed to,I forgot her name. She didn't look pissed to me. She looked like oh well, I'm still fond of you, but whatever, that's how she looked to me. 

 

Earlier on when she saw them kissing in the dressing room, she looked a little annoyed, but not by the end IMO.

 

I like Tiana too.

 

Luscious, mental illness, his upbringing...but bottom line, he's just straight up ignorant. With his God Complex, I have no hope of him becoming less ignorant when it comes to mental illness. 

 

Cookie is still everything.

Edited April 14, 2016 by represent

[thuganomics85]

So, I guess Camille really is dead, unless their is some kind of big-ass cover-up going off with the police and whatnot.  Which, I guess with this show, isn't that much of a stretch.

 

Ah, Lucious.  It is so crazy how he can be sympathetic one moment, and then the switch is flipped, and he's suddenly that asshole again.  The music video and him revealing his past to everyone was well done, and I really can't take it away from him that he had a horrible, shitty childhood, and, to his credit, he rose above it and made himself a success (Cookie helped a lot obviously, but he still fought for it.)  But then sure enough, when Andre confronts him about hiding how he had a bipolar mother and how maybe that could have helped him, Lucious goes back to what he does best and belittles Andre for daring to be sick, because that is considered "weak" in Lucious' eyes.  And he still wonders why his sons hate him.  Dick.

 

But, hey!  At least it seemed like Cookie's party ended after they ate!  Usually a Lyons dinner party ends with the food on the floor, so progress!

 

While the Hakeem, Tiana, and Laura stuff was petty and getting close into love triangle territory (you deserve better, Tiana!), I did like that it was focused on the music and how to run concerts, like not going over sets and the opener showing respect to the headliner.  I mean, did Laura really take outfits from Tiana's wardrobe? Who does that?  Of course, silly Hakeem is now proposing to Laura, because her family seems nice, and he is tired of his.  Oh, Hakeem.  Still is probably going to blow up in your face, buddy. 

 

I am glad that Tiana is finally getting more to do.  I hope she doesn't disappear again.

 

I hope they get to the award ceremony soon, because I'm ready for this Lucious vs. Jamal thing to move forward.

 

Ha!  Rhonda thinks Anika is the sane one of this bunch.  Oh, if you only knew, Rhonda.

[Queena]

Oh Lucious! You fucking, evil asshole! After managing to piss off Jamal and Hakeem, he finally succeeds in pissing off Andre, the smart son, the one he relied on to make major financial decisions!

What's cool about Terrence Howard is that one moment he makes me feel so sad and sorry for him and the next moment he does some assholy thing and I'm angry and hating on him all over again!

What a shitty childhood Lucious had. A crazy mother who tried to kill him and then killed herself and left him to fend for himself. And Lucious becoming a drug dealer when he was still a young boy in order to survive. That is one fucked up sad childhood and I wouldn't wish this on anybody.

I found the scenes of the video shoot for Lucious music video to be rather disturbing. I liked how Lucious talked to the young boy actor. You can see he was trying so hard to convey his feelings and it was very hard for him and then Cookie comes and makes it all better for that boy and Lucious. Very nice scene. Cookie understand Lucious more than anyone else. She apparently is the only one that can still tolerate Lucious for a long period of time.

Boy! Andre sure put two and two together real quick just by watching Lucious' music video for a few minutes! His asshole dad always blamed him for his mental illness and acted like Andre was a freak, a weirdo. All along Lucious knew his mom was mentally ill and passed it along to his innocent son, and he still blamed Andre! I wish Andre would've punched out Lucious right there and then at Cookie's birthday party. Lucious is not a stupid man, but his refusal to acknowledge mental disease is infuriating!

I didn't expect this, but I was actually shedding tears when I saw Lucious' video and Andre's reaction to it. I just found it all to be profoundly sad.

And.....Rhonda goes fleeing straight to Boo Boo Kitty! This is such a bad idea! I can't wait until everyone finds out that Anika is knocked up by Hakeem!

I think Tiana has acknowledged the fact that her romance with Hakeem is done and over with. Her face looked really calm when she saw Hakeem kissing Laura. Hakeem looked at Tiana and Tiana kind of nodded and smiled a little. Yep, I think it finally hit her that Hakeem is really done with her.

I'm glad to know that I'm not the only person who cried watching that video. I don't feel that he did Freda dirty for not including her verse. It's a autobiographical song and video. He should pay her, and she should understand. TPH really plays Lucious well.

[phoenics]

I really loved this episode. The Jamal/Freida song was HAWT!! And the scenes in the hood with the kids and Jamal/Hakeem were awesome! Loved it.

And the Lucious story part had me all emotional on his and Cookie's behalf. Of course we already knew who Frieda's dad was, but Cookie didn't know yet... that was a great reveal. By the reaction on Twitter though I wonder if some fans forgot that she was Gathers' daughter? Lucious and the fans knew, lol. Only Cookie didn't.

Now to the more problematic part of the story. I don't know if I'm just really sensitive about racial politics in TV after that Sleepy Hollow finale, but I'm REALLY REALLY irritated at seeing Tiana pushed into the background for Laura, or seeing Hakeem proposing to Laura as though that will be the epic romance. It reeks of colorism. What - we only get one black woman romance on this show? It's a show with a diverse cast yes, but a predominantly black cast. It's sad when the only black/black romance is Cookie/Lucious. It feels like colorism to me - as though executives/writers thought Tiana wasn't marketable enough. Nothing against the actress who plays Laura - but the character is boring and honestly her portrayal of her is wooden and dull. And she's still a horrible performer. Salma Hayek wannabe.

On a predominantly black show, 2 of the straight sons on the show essentially devote themselves to women who aren't black. If this was a "mainstream" (you know what I mean) show, they wouldn't hook US up like that. I can't just ignore this in light of the racial landscape of tv and how black women are marginalized. Hakeem is no prize, but I'm still sick of seeing it. I have actually grown to like Rhonda right now (her hair and makeup this episode was really, really perfect), and Laura is nice enough (just boring as hell)... I'm just sick of the pervasive message that black girls/women don't get the epic love that is so continuously reinforced in our media. And with the black women they have - are any of them dark skinned who AREN'T complete stereotypes?  (Becky/Porsha)  On THIS show it doesn't have to be that way, but it's still steeped in colorism.

 

I also felt some kind of way seeing Rhonda over-represented in the Cover Girl Ad (they show her twice as opposed to all of the other black women only shown once). These things MATTER.

On another note, really happy to see Porsha and Becky back - especially Porsha with her country ass. Her mistaking "Peonies" the flowers with Pennies (and her reference to her grandmother rolling up nickels in a hanky to cold cock someone) was hilarious!!!

Oh and Lucious is totally going to sleep with that reporter - just when Cookie walks in or something... whoops. But predictable.

Edited April 15, 2016 by phoenics

[Ohgeez]

Doesn't it seem like kitty boo boo has been pregnant for a while now. In the scenes for next week she appears to be wearing a mid drif shirt when they announce her pregnancy

[phoenics]

One more thing:  WHO is doing Cookie's makeup?  It's flawless!  I mean - completely natural looking, soft focus perfect FLAWLESS.  And very true to her skin tone too.  Her makeup at the end of the episode was amazing.  I literally froze it just to stare at it.  Red lip, hint of blush, nude/bronze shadow with black liner and mascara - but just really radiant skin.  Wow.

 

I feel like it's the best her makeup has looked all season.

[Luciano]

Oh and Lucious is totally going to sleep with that reporter - just when Cookie walks in or something... whoops. But predictable.

 

I was half-expecting him to sleep with the actress who played his mother in the video because that man has all sorts of issues.

[TobinAlbers]

For some reason I think we're in for a twist with the reporter. Rather than be a conquest for Lucious, she'll end up being his long lost half sister hell bent on revenge for some reason.

Man, it is messed up that Frank in a weird way gave Lucious his big break to sell drugs to get him off the streets and be able to ultimately earn the money to start Empire, but then Cookie goes down, years later ultimately snitches on Frank to get out so then he goes down, and then Lucious finally kills him in prison to protect Cookie with the parting shot that Lucious would 'take care' of his daughter in any way you want to interpret it. No good illegal deed goes unpunished?

I think Andre told Rhonda to stay at the house because he knew he was in no frame of mind to be around even her at that moment. Basically just like she later said she needed space from him to Annika, right then he needed his space. Why she didn't call an Uber I have no idea.

It was beyond adorable that the family initially put aside their differences to come together for Cookie's birthday as well as her reaction to them all there for her. But seriously Cookie had to know that showing the video would not lead to anything good. Lucious doesn't reconcile, he deflects to protect himself and his pride. I get she wanted the boys to know how rough Lucious had it and how in many ways he's still that damaged little boy-except he's perpetuated that toxicity and is now the perpetrator against his kids the same way his mother was against him- except he's in his right mind unlike his mother.

[Eolivet]

Agreed that this was a great episode. I love the family drama. I love the crazy, dysfunctional, slightly codependent relationship between Lucious and Cookie. Whatever their character flaws, I believe Howard and Henson are magic together.

 

Glad to see Anika back -- cannot wait to see how that plays out!

 

To me, Cookie finding out that Freida Gatz was Frank Gathers' daughter was the kind of jaw-dropping "OMG nooooo" moment the first season was so good at. The show has definitely found its groove again.

[RCharter]

Phoenics, you bring up a good and very interesting point about colorism.  Thank you.  I'm waiting for Laura's staircase, because she annoys me.

 

As for Andre, I'm hoping that he can at least find some solace in the fact that he isn't all alone in his family, he isn't some weirdo, but that he had a grandmother with the same issues he struggled with.  The grandmother on his FATHERS side.  The coldest thing to me was to say that you're ashamed of your dead mother.  Yeah, she had a ton of issues, and your childhood was FUBAR'd, but she had no idea what was wrong with her and it seems like she loved Lucious so much that her guilt made her kill herself because she thought it would help Lucious.

[Queena]

Phoenics, you bring up a good and very interesting point about colorism. Thank you. I'm waiting for Laura's staircase, because she annoys me.

As for Andre, I'm hoping that he can at least find some solace in the fact that he isn't all alone in his family, he isn't some weirdo, but that he had a grandmother with the same issues he struggled with. The grandmother on his FATHERS side. The coldest thing to me was to say that you're ashamed of your dead mother. Yeah, she had a ton of issues, and your childhood was FUBAR'd, but she had no idea what was wrong with her and it seems like she loved Lucious so much that her guilt made her kill herself because she thought it would help Lucious.

I thought that young Lucious took the bullets out of the gun. I was hoping that she was in the mental hospital.

[RCharter]

I thought that young Lucious took the bullets out of the gun. I was hoping that she was in the mental hospital.

I hope so too, you're probably right, because I kept thinking "why wouldn't they just get Kelly Rowland to play his 'video mom?'" But perhaps they are saving her for later as his present day (older) mother.

 

I would love that for Andre because than he could really know that he isn't alone in his family, and that his illness really isn't his fault, and maybe he will be more stringent with taking his meds.

[SimoneS]

But, hey!  At least it seemed like Cookie's party ended after they ate!  Usually a Lyons dinner party ends with the food on the floor, so progress!

 

Bwah! So true.

 

I wonder if hanging around Lucious the reporter will find out the truth about Gathers' death?

Edited April 15, 2016 by SimoneS

[SimoneS]

Now to the more problematic part of the story. I don't know if I'm just really sensitive about racial politics in TV after that Sleepy Hollow finale, but I'm REALLY REALLY irritated at seeing Tiana pushed into the background for Laura, or seeing Hakeem proposing to Laura as though that will be the epic romance. It reeks of colorism. What - we only get one black woman romance on this show? It's a show with a diverse cast yes, but a predominantly black cast. It's sad when the only black/black romance is Cookie/Lucious. It feels like colorism to me - as though executives/writers thought Tiana wasn't marketable enough. Nothing against the actress who plays Laura - but the character is boring and honestly her portrayal of her is wooden and dull. And she's still a horrible performer. Salma Hayek wannabe.

On a predominantly black show, 2 of the straight sons on the show essentially devote themselves to women who aren't black. If this was a "mainstream" (you know what I mean) show, they wouldn't hook US up like that. I can't just ignore this in light of the racial landscape of tv and how black women are marginalized. Hakeem is no prize, but I'm still sick of seeing it. I have actually grown to like Rhonda right now (her hair and makeup this episode was really, really perfect), and Laura is nice enough (just boring as hell)... I'm just sick of the pervasive message that black girls/women don't get the epic love that is so continuously reinforced in our media. And with the black women they have - are any of them dark skinned who AREN'T complete stereotypes?  (Becky/Porsha)  On THIS show it doesn't have to be that way, but it's still steeped in colorism.

 

I also felt some kind of way seeing Rhonda over-represented in the Cover Girl Ad (they show her twice as opposed to all of the other black women only shown once). These things MATTER.

 

When it comes Tiana, I feel like that soapy drama is in play here and that it is difficult to get screen time if you are not part of the Lyons family. Hakeem was with Camilla, then Tiana and Camilla, then Camilla alone, and now Laura. And think the show is building up to Tiana/Hakeem/Laura triangle so hopefully we see more of Tiana. I cannot complain about a young Latina being cast as Hakeem's love interest, especially when I don't think that she is going to last long.  

 

Where I do agree with you about colorism is in the casting of all the women who are potential love interests for the leading men. There seems to be a "brown paper bag" test going on, even with Laura (there is diversity among Latina women). Becky, Porsha, and Frieda have a different look, but none of them are in the running as love interests or any of the leading men. I hadn't noticed that Rhonda got two shots in the Covergirl ad, but that is definitely not a good thing. Seems to me that these are the exact kinds of issues that should be talked about on social media. Both Empire and Covergirl should be put on notice.

Edited April 15, 2016 by SimoneS

[phoenics]

I hope so too, you're probably right, because I kept thinking "why wouldn't they just get Kelly Rowland to play his 'video mom?'" But perhaps they are saving her for later as his present day (older) mother.

He hid the bullets, but didn't she force him to give them back? Or she found where he hid them? I thought something like that happened.

I would love that for Andre because than he could really know that he isn't alone in his family, and that his illness really isn't his fault, and maybe he will be more stringent with taking his meds.

That would be so nice. I felt so bad for him when he got triggered by the video.

[phoenics]

When it comes Tiana, I feel like that soapy drama is in play here and that it is difficult to get screen time if you are not part of the Lyons family. Hakeem was with Camilla, then Tiana and Camilla, then Camilla alone, and now Laura. And think the show is building up to Tiana/Hakeem/Laura triangle so hopefully we see more of Tiana. I cannot complain young Latina being cast as Hakeem's love interest, especially when I don't think that she is going to last long.  

 

Where I do agree with you about colorism is in the casting of all the women who are potential love interests for the leading men. There seems to be a "brown paper bag" test going on, even with Laura (there is diversity among Latina women). Becky, Porsha, and Frieda have a different look, but none of them are in the running as love interests or any of the leading men. I hadn't noticed that Rhonda got two shots in the Covergirl ad, but that is definitely not a good thing. Seems to me that these are the exact kinds of issues that should be talked about on social media. Both Empire and Covergirl should be put on notice.

Thank you. I was worried about going in on this issue a little - but it's been bothering me for weeks now and seeing Hakeem propose just pushed me over the edge. Okay - Sleepy Hollow pushed me over the edge, and I finally decided enough was enough.

I HOPE Laura doesn't last long - yes there is diversity in Latina women (a lot!), which is why it's definitely more of a colorism issue for me. I think darker skinned Naomi was only allowed because it's freakin NAOMI CAMPBELL, lol. But other than that all of the love interests are much lighter than a paper bag. Maybe we could throw Jennifer Hudson in the mix on this, but the way they did her makeup, she'd pass the paper bag test too.

It's not like this isn't already an issue with hip hop anyway. When Tiana had her dancers out there I hemmed between being glad that it wasn't just sistas out there getting objectified (because there were white women too) to horrified that some of those women were even on stage when they 1) couldn't dance and 2) were booty shaking with NO ASS and 3) were all passing the paper bag test. I see they are going for a "Beyonce" thing with her - but if Hakeem is supposed to be Jay Z, that's not coming across enough, imo.

About colorism in hip hop and seemingly on this show - the controversy surrounding the casting call for Straight Outta Compton is pretty much what I see going on in the romantic love interest for the straight male characters on this show. http://www.spin.com/2014/07/nwa-biopic-straight-outta-compton-racist-casting-call-skin/

That was one reason I never saw Straight Outta Compton (other than the fact that the group was so misogynistic that I just couldn't do it).

I actually think all casting calls should be explicitly public so we can criticize and scrutinize them and call out this problematic ish immediately - especially that whole "racially ambiguous" crap they do to try to sidestep black women in casting.

[SimoneS]

About colorism in hip hop and seemingly on this show - the controversy surrounding the casting call for Straight Outta Compton is pretty much what I see going on in the romantic love interest for the straight male characters on this show. http://www.spin.com/2014/07/nwa-biopic-straight-outta-compton-racist-casting-call-skin/

That was one reason I never saw Straight Outta Compton (other than the fact that the group was so misogynistic that I just couldn't do it).

I actually think all casting calls should be explicitly public so we can criticize and scrutinize them and call out this problematic ish immediately - especially that whole "racially ambiguous" crap they do to try to sidestep black women in casting.

 

I hadn't heard about that horrible incident with Straight Outta Compton, but I am not surprised. I am glad that I didn't watch the movie either. I agree that casting calls should be public. I would like to see Empire's casting calls for black women. I think that there is the same "brown paper bag" test on Rosewood. I don't usually watch because I don't like the show, but when I have caught some of the episodes waiting for Empire, I noticed that all Morris Chestnut's love interests have the same look. Despite Viola, Danai, and Lupita, etc. making inroads, there is still a lot of work to do. 

Edited April 15, 2016 by SimoneS

[dirtypop90]

I think in this case Laura, Rhonda, and even Michael were cast as love interests simply because tptb thinks that non-black people won't watch a show with an all black cast. Since the family is black, the easy way to diversify the case is to have the love interests be nonblack. Now I think their thinking is just silly. People of all races watch this show for 1. Taraji and 2. Terrance. I don't think the boys' significant others matter, at all, to the audience but I think the tptb believed that they needed to add non-black characters to reach a broad audience and having the boys with non-black women and men was an easy way to do that.

But I totally agree there is a larger issue of colorism in Hollywood but I really think in empire's case the issue is more that the tptb want a diverse cast.

Does anyone remember that article asking why there weren't more Latinos in empire? Tptb responded by giving Hakeem two Latina love interests (Becky g and Laura), bringing Adam Rodriguez on for taraji in replace of Derek Luke, and bringing Michael back for Jamal.

I do think Laura and the girl group were supposed to be long term but the audience didn't take to them so I think they won't return next season but we'll see.

Edited April 15, 2016 by dirtypop90

[Neurochick]

I hadn't heard about that horrible incident with Straight Outta Compton, but I am not surprised. I am glad that I didn't watch the movie either. I agree that casting calls should be public. I would like to see Empire's casting calls for black women. I think that there is the same "brown paper bag" test on Rosewood. I don't usually watch because I don't like the show, but when I have caught some of the episodes waiting for Empire, I noticed that all Morris Chestnut's love interests have the same look. Despite Viola, Danai, and Lupita, etc. making inroads, there is still a lot of work to do.

 

 

I think the problem regarding colorism in this show and others goes pretty deep.  I think it has to do with what someone, a producer or a director, thinks is attractive, if they feel that lighter skinned, or whiter skinned women are more attractive than darker skinned women, that's the issue right there. 

[jtallman]

Didn't we learn earlier in the season that Freda is Frank Gathers' daughter?