Wonder Woman (2017)

[icewolf]

‘Wonder Woman’: Female and Older Moviegoers Powered Box Office, New Study Shows
http://variety.com/2017/film/news/wonder-woman-study-box-office-1202488262/

“‘Wonder Woman’s’ audience evolved in a similar manner as most blockbusters but with some trends notably magnified,” noted Matthew Liebmann, Movio’s senior VP for the Americas. “While the female and 50+ segments of the audience generally grow over the course of the run, ‘Wonder Woman’s’ female audience nearly reached parity with the male audience by the third week.”

He noted that strong reviews and word-of mouth drove its impressive performance after opening weekend. Liebmann told Variety that it’s unprecedented for a superhero tentpole movie to reach male-female parity at any point of its run — due to propensity of male moviegoers to support those titles. The average superhero movie draws a 62% male audience.

“Even ‘Star Wars: The Force Awakens,’ which had a strong female lead with Daisy Ridley, never got closer than 56-44 male,” Liebman said.

He noted that the audience share for moviegoers over 50 increased from 12% to 22% over the first weeks — 20% higher than other tentpoles. And 22% of “Wonder Woman” viewers are infrequent moviegoers (who see one to four films a year), compared to a 16% average for that group.

Movio’s data also showed that average number of admissions per purchase for “Wonder Woman” was well above average.

“That says to me that there was an increase in parents taking their children to see the film,” Liebmann added. “It wasn’t just the female audience that made this film a hit.”

Wonder Woman having a large female audience was expected, but it has also been getting older audiences and more of those people that usually don't go see movies in theaters to see it. Pretty cool!

Edited July 7, 2017 by icewolf

[starri]

On 7/5/2017 at 1:02 AM, VCRTracking said:

One of the things that made Lynda Carter such a great Wonder Woman was she was as kind as she was beautiful. There was such warmth behind those blue eyes.  Gadot conveys just as much behind her brown ones. 

I know this comment puts the comparison directly in the realm of the physical, but as much as the costume may be designed for titillation, there's something to be said that both of them were capable of wearing it and still managing to look like they could kick ass.

I think Susan Eisenberg, who did Diana on Justice League Unlimited, doesn't get enough credit.

And having generally crapped on JL:  War, there was one legitimately sweet moment with Diana, where a little girl who's a fan and tells her that she wants to be like Diana when she grows up, Diana gets a big smile on her face and tells her "I would welcome your sisterhood."

[Kromm]

4 hours ago, starri said:

I know this comment puts the comparison directly in the realm of the physical, but as much as the costume may be designed for titillation, there's something to be said that both of them were capable of wearing it and still managing to look like they could kick ass.

It may be an unpopular opinion, but I never thought that Lynda Carter looked like she could kick ass, in or out of that costume. That's not a criticism to me, just a perception. Her version of Wonder Woman fighting was a 70s version, where it didn't have to look realistic to be entertaining. Not that Carter was a wimp, but it's not the same looking at someone in merely in good shape, who most of the time was subject to obvious cutaways to stunt doubles anyway vs. someone who went through the training regiment they say Gal went through, who was already athletic anyway, and who when they did sub-in stunt doubles, they did so with far better technology. 

Carter's greatness in the role had nothing to do with asskicking, in other words, and was more about fun. It aligned with the campy 60s and early 70s version of the comic quite well. Whereas this version with Gal is more about the modern comic, albeit with lots of nods to the Golden age.

[Jac]

I loved this movie with the exception of the final fight. The idea that she gets the strength to continue fighting Ares from what is essentially the idea of romantic love for Steve diminishes a lot of the films positive messages about feminism for me, also the fight was just way too long and cookie cutter to hold my interest. 

Other than that, it was the female-led superhero movie I've been waiting for. 

Edited July 9, 2017 by Jac

[MarkHB]

10 hours ago, Jac said:

I loved this movie with the exception of the final fight. The idea that she gets the strength to continue fighting Ares from what is essentially the idea of romantic love for Steve diminishes a lot of the films positive messages about feminism for me, also the fight was just way too long and cookie cutter to hold my interest. 

Other than that, it was the female-led superhero movie I've been waiting for. 

I don't think it was the idea of romantic love that really gave her the strength to continue.  Yes, it was partly her realization of his love for her when she realized he was saying goodbye, but she also recognized his heart that enabled him to sacrifice his life to destroy the bomber, and she also saw the Oddfellows* huddling in mutual embrace, out of ammo and awaiting their ends as brothers-in-arms; at least three different kinds of love that helped her see that humanity's capacity for love was, in fact, still stronger than its capacity for destruction, and that they were, in fact, what was worth saving.

 

* - The team of Sameer, Charlie and the Chief is christened "the Oddfellows" in the comic Wonder Woman: Steve Trevor #1, available in digital and possibly still in print at a friendly neighborhood comics store near you :) .

[starri]

On 7/7/2017 at 1:49 PM, Kromm said:

It may be an unpopular opinion, but I never thought that Lynda Carter looked like she could kick ass, in or out of that costume

I don't exactly mean that she looked like she could go around beating guys up.  It's more that she could wear this skimpy costume and still manage to project "superhero" while doing so.  Gal, whose job was by no means easy, had an advantage in that the contemporary costume is supposed to be evocative of armor.

And being able to make that projection isn't easy.  I don't know if you've ever seen the failed David E Kelly pilot, but Adrianne Palicki, who I adore and who was a great Mockingbird, can't quite pull it off.

Part of the problem was that Lynda didn't have a female stunt double until she insisted they hire one.  And Gal has great legs, but even with the frenetic cuts, I could tell when they were using the double, because that woman was built like an MMA fighter.

[GHScorpiosRule]

Not to mention that Gadot was pregnant  during the making of this film, so couldn't do the stunts.

[Ceindreadh]

2 hours ago, GHScorpiosRule said:

Not to mention that Gadot was pregnant  during the making of this film, so couldn't do the stunts.

AFAIK, that was only during the re-shoots and not during main production. 

[HunterHunted]

On 6/22/2017 at 11:33 AM, ChelseaNH said:

Maybe she meets Steve's grand-nephew...

Hey, it's good enough for Captain America and Sharon Carter.

She's a museum curator in the present day. I would much rather have her paired with an academic or even a person in social services. Diana is so clueless about how man's world works. It would be interesting to see Diana experience the world not through a soldier or warrior's eyes and during peace time.

[Sandman]

21 hours ago, HunterHunted said:

Hey, it's good enough for Captain America and Sharon Carter.

Actually, I think it's kind of icky there, too.

[HunterHunted]

4 minutes ago, Sandman said:

Actually, I think it's kind of icky there, too.

It was a joke. I think Cap and Sharon is super weird. She was raised hearing her great aunt's stories about Cap. She is assigned to monitor him undercover. It reads like she's an obsessed delusional stalker.

[icewolf]

It was a joke. I think Cap and Sharon is super weird. She was raised hearing her great aunt's stories about Cap. She is assigned to monitor him undercover. It reads like she's an obsessed delusional stalker.

I don't know why there HAS to be a love interest. The Wonder Woman show had her working with Steve Trevor's son who looked exactly like his father, and they were just friends. It worked better that way.

[Sandman]

1 hour ago, HunterHunted said:

It was a joke. I think Cap and Sharon is super weird.

Oh, that came through -- I just couldn't resist. Then again, obsessive delusional stalker behaviour might be considered an asset qualification in the unholy mess that is S.H.I.E.L.D. :)

Edited July 10, 2017 by Sandman

[HunterHunted]

1 hour ago, icewolf said:

I don't know why there HAS to be a love interest. The Wonder Woman show had her working with Steve Trevor's son who looked exactly like his father, and they were just friends. It worked better that way.

There really is no need to have a love interest for any of them at least within the boundaries of the final act big battle. "Ares is about to unleash unspeakable horrors on the earth. Knowing that Steve loved me has given me the power to defeat Ares." "Oh no! The horribly mutated monster is about to lay waste to everything! Where is that woman I've made out with?"

I'd have to rewatch the movie, but I wish Diana's final realization of power had been a montage of Steve, the Oddfellows, and the Amazons. And perhaps I would have liked for Diana to see more women in the modern world.

[ChelseaNH]

I didn't see it as "Oh, Steve loves me, grr, I'm powerful!"  Ares was convincing her that the world was better off without people and all their flaws, that humanity was only going to destroy themselves and the world around them.  Steve reminded her that people weren't all horrible, not (only) because he was capable of love, but because he was capable of sacrifice.

[Sandman]

I agree; I don't think it was Diana's personal experience of romantic love that made the difference, but the realization that humanity is not only self-destructive and capable of evil, but self-sacrificing and capable of generosity, nobility and empathy.

[Bruinsfan]

I still wish that realization had resulted in a way to defeat Ares that didn't involve nuking him after 30 minutes of David Thewliss shouting "I WILL DESTROY YOU!!!1!" while his videogame avatar fought Diana.

[stealinghome]

I agree with the above comments. I thought it was Diana's romantic love for Steve that caused her to be able to escape the metal shackles and go on the rampage that ended with her holding the tank above Dr. Poison, but her final defeat of Ares stemmed from her knowledge and acceptance of humankind's dual nature: capable of great evil but also great good. Steve was kind of the face of that recognition for her, because of his sacrifice, but it was a broader realization on her part.

Which, iirc, is pretty much what Diana's final monologue in the present lays out as well--that she protects humanity because of their capacity for goodness, even though the capacity for evil is there as well.

[benteen]

Wonderfully in-character response to Wonder Woman passing Deadpool at the box office....

 

Edited July 11, 2017 by benteen

[Sandman]

4 hours ago, stealinghome said:

 ... but her final defeat of Ares stemmed from her knowledge and acceptance of humankind's dual nature:

And a recognition and acceptance, I would say, of her own nature as well. Throughout the movie, Diana was shielded (by others' choices) from a full understanding of exactly who and what she was, a deception that included the pretense of a God-Killer Sword; understanding and surpassing her own capacity for destruction, and recognizing her true relationship with and resemblance to Ares, is part of what allowed her to claim her true birthright ("Goodbye, brother") and stop Ares.

Edited July 11, 2017 by Sandman

[MarkHB]

37 minutes ago, Sandman said:

a deception that included the pretense of a God-Killer Sword

When I went back and rewatched it, I noticed that no one ever tells Diana that the sword is the God-Killer weapon; they just let her make that assumption.

[Sandman]

But the sword does hang in a place of some prominence, along with other weapons important to the Amazons. They may not give it that name, but there's an implication (which which might never be made explicit, but it's not specifically countered, either) that the God-Killer is a physical object. (I've seen references online to the Sword's being "the fake God-Killer" which to me kind of misses the whole point of the movie, or one of them, at any rate.)

Still, it's a good catch, and yet another reason for me to go watch it again (do I need more?).

Edited July 12, 2017 by Sandman
"Not" is pretty important sometimes.

[Bruinsfan]

The way Diana was chopping through support columns with it without bending the thing or blunting its edge, I assume it was some kind of divinely blessed/magical weapon (just not up to the task of killing the god of war himself). I had the impression it was featured in a central place of prominence for the explicit purpose of being a decoy to avoid anyone suspecting that Diana herself was the weapon Zeus left the Amazons to kill Ares.

[Hanahope]

So if Ares was to be believed, that only a god can kill another god, and Antiope knew Diana was a god, why did Antiope jump in front of a bullet heading toward Diana?

And yeah, kindof have to wonder wtf was Diana during WW2?  I just can't imagine her sitting by and doing nothing.

[HunterHunted]

6 hours ago, Hanahope said:

So if Ares was to be believed, that only a god can kill another god, and Antiope knew Diana was a god, why did Antiope jump in front of a bullet heading toward Diana?

And yeah, kindof have to wonder wtf was Diana during WW2?  I just can't imagine her sitting by and doing nothing.

I like to believe that Antiope jumped in front of the bullet because no one was really sure about a god killing a god with these newer weapons.

I'm hoping that they co-opt some of Kevin Grevioux' Odyssey of the Amazons, which is about the Amazons traveling the world to find other legendary warrior women like the Valkyries and the Dahomey Amazons. So I can see Diana being oblivious about WW2 if she's off in one of these hidden places, especially because she's not allowed back in Themiscyra.

[EyewatchTV211]

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/wonder-woman-box-office-superhero-movies-1020621

[stealinghome]

Quote

I like to believe that Antiope jumped in front of the bullet because no one was really sure about a god killing a god with these newer weapons.

Diana is also only a demigod, so while she can kill a god, it would be taking a big chance to assume that only a god could kill her in turn. I'm sure Antiope didn't want to risk it.

fwiw, Patty Jenkins said somewhere that a bullet COULD kill Diana, though I think she said that Diana could survive some gunshot wounds that the average mortal would die from.

[VCRTracking]

[Kromm]

On 7/11/2017 at 11:59 AM, Sandman said:

I agree; I don't think it was Diana's personal experience of romantic love that made the difference, but the realization that humanity is not only self-destructive and capable of evil, but self-sacrificing and capable of generosity, nobility and empathy.

 

On 7/11/2017 at 11:06 AM, ChelseaNH said:

I didn't see it as "Oh, Steve loves me, grr, I'm powerful!"  Ares was convincing her that the world was better off without people and all their flaws, that humanity was only going to destroy themselves and the world around them.  Steve reminded her that people weren't all horrible, not (only) because he was capable of love, but because he was capable of sacrifice.

Wonder Woman doesn't have quite the same definition problem with gaining strength through love as many female characters, because the ability to love is a core aspect of her characterization. With some strong female characters when you namecheck "love" as a contributing motive it takes away from their other motivations. With Wonder Woman it IS her main one already, inherently. True, it's not necessarily "romantic love", but with her character "love" just kind of seems to be love, without a delineation. 

But the point that Steve was demonstrating love which is made above is a key one. She gained strength perhaps by being loved even more than loving. If expressing love is supposed to be something which cuts a female character down and hurts their empowerment, what does it say when it's a male character doing it? Steve, in this case? And yet he was selfless and self-sacrificing. Which is another expression of love. Except it's an expression of love for humanity rather than for a romantic partner. That's the lesson she learned. That mankind was capable of this. A lesson that basically proved her mother's claim, that they did not deserve her, incorrect.

[MarkHB]

Apparently, Warner Bros. is planning to announce a release date for Wonder Woman 2, and confirm that Patty will be directing it, at SDCC this week.  The Warner Bros. Pictures panel will be Saturday at 11:30 Am PDT (2:30 Pm EDT).

[Sandman]

On 2017-07-14 at 1:29 AM, VCRTracking said:

Do the Amazons have a word for "verklempt"? Because, golly. I'm just ...

It doesn't ...

They're all awesome, is what.

[stealinghome]

7 hours ago, MarkHB said:

Apparently, Warner Bros. is planning to announce a release date for Wonder Woman 2, and confirm that Patty will be directing it, at SDCC this week.  The Warner Bros. Pictures panel will be Saturday at 11:30 Am PDT (2:30 Pm EDT).

Fantastic news! I mean, it definitely has felt like more of a question of when, not if, but still--nice to have it (quasi-)confirmed!

[Lantern7]

In case you don't watch Conan, here's his trip to San Diego taking a detour towards Themiscyra.

[VCRTracking]

[GreekGeek]

I finally caught this on Friday. Apart from reading some D.C. Comics as a kid (though not WW, for some reason), I was unfamiliar with the backstory. I loved the earlier parts, with Steve on Themiscyra and WW in London, since I really enjoy "fish out of water" stories. The battle scenes were good until they became a CGI showdown. I thought Dr. Poison would have turned out to be Ares in disguise. It would have been an interesting twist to have both the superhero and the Big  Bad be female. Apart from Aliens, when has that ever happened? (Yes, I know Ripkey isn't a superhero.)

In any event, I thought the Ares vs. WW showdown weakened the overall message about humankind, which is that there is no Big Bad, but that we're all potentially a Big Bad (or a hero). What did killing Ares accomplish, since Hitler, nuclear bombs, and other horrors are yet to come? I like the idea that without WW, things would have been even worse.

[TigerLynx]

I loved this movie.  I didn't expect to.  So I was very pleasantly surprised that it was so good.

I thought the point of Ares was for Wonder Woman to realize that yes humans can be horrible all on their own without influence from anyone else, but they can also be good and make the right choices.  This may sound mean, but I don't want Steve Trevor to come back to life somehow, and if they do give Wonder Woman another love interest, I want them to be human to.

I liked all the Amazons for the brief time we saw them.

The franchise movies seem to be hit or miss.  I've liked some of the Avengers, some of the X-Men, and some of the Justice League.

The only parts of Superman vs Batman I liked were the scenes with Wonder Woman.  I still laugh at Superman, "Is she with you?" Batman, "No, I thought she was with you."

[Raja]

11 hours ago, GreekGeek said:

I finally caught this on Friday. Apart from reading some D.C. Comics as a kid (though not WW, for some reason), I was unfamiliar with the backstory. I loved the earlier parts, with Steve on Themiscyra and WW in London, since I really enjoy "fish out of water" stories. The battle scenes were good until they became a CGI showdown. I thought Dr. Poison would have turned out to be Ares in disguise. It would have been an interesting twist to have both the superhero and the Big  Bad be female. Apart from Aliens, when has that ever happened? (Yes, I know Ripkey isn't a superhero.)

 

Catwoman, Halle Berry versus Sharon Stone. You didn't say it had to be good.

Edited July 31, 2017 by Raja

[DisneyBoy]

So I am very late to this party...and I'm WW fan.

 

 

I thought it was solid.

 

Gal was passable. Good at points, very weak in others. There were two close-ups where she had to deliver lines (arguing with her mother after the council meeting and one with Steve) where she had zero conviction. She's lucky this movie mostly demanded her to furrow her brow and catwalk in a wind tunnel. I saw none of this" muscle" she supposedly put on. For all the flack the classic outfit gets, Gal's frame was far more impractical.

All the armor in the movie had about 85 details too many, except the lovely civilian clothes. I hated WW's wedge heels. Even the cameras tried to avoid showing them.

And speaking of cameras....how can anyone follow the fight choreography? Can we please stop with the 300-esque slow-mo-ing? And the CGI...great Hera! SO. MUCH. CGI.

I'm bummed there was no visual language for the Lasso of Truth. Chris Pine did a great job of selling it's abilities, but still. I had no clue how she was getting it to do the things it was doing.

Ditto with the bracelets.

The mythology was really boiled down to Zeus = good and Ares = bad. Bummer there. If they want to do more sequels God villains or at least supporting cast would be nice to have around. Is the idea now that ALL of the Pantheon is dead?

Etta stole the show for me. I love that character and she was well-done here. Wish we got more.

Steve was better than I thought he'd be. Not as charismatic as Nathan Fillion in the animated film, but appropriately old fashioned. I believed this was a guy from the first world war era (mostly).

Ares was...okay? I hated him being killed and his armor felt thrown together and I didn't get why they kept the actor with the moustache for every scene when he could have taken many forms. I wonder who they'd hoped to get for the part. Anthony Hopkins or another A-lister perhaps?

Hippolyta was okay. I wasn't as moved as I think I should have been when she said goodbye to Diana.

I really missed Phillipus.

I can see that they cut the bullets and bracelets competition for time, but I missed it none the less.

I liked Dr. Poison initially, but the actress revealed herself to have no clear voice for the character in subsequent scenes. She came across a little cheesy when they gave her too much screen time. I can't decide whether I'm disappointed they didn't do more with her or think they used her just enough. She's one of the villains I don't know that much about so I guess I was hoping to see more of her, but I don't think it would have been appropriate for her to be in big fight scenes or anything.

I didn't especially love the Three Amigos. I like that a Native American...I'm sorry native Canadian actor made it into the film, but I'm really not too sure what he was doing there in London. Maybe that screen time could have been given to Etta?

I had a stupid huge grin on my face at the first sight of Paradise Island. Just seeing that on the big screen made me very happy. It's waterfalls made no sense though.

 

I really respected how the film developed the concept of Diana as a naive girl taking on the world. That was a through-line in the whole movie and they sold it really really well, with Steve patiently not arguing the business about Ares being behind the war and Diana slowly having to come to the realization that humanity is not so easily swayed. In a way it takes a lot of power away from the Gods - who in her comics are traditionally very powerful and influential - but it sends the message that the onus is on us to make up our own minds about whether or not we will do good or evil or make war or peace. I can't think of a better message for a Wonder Woman movie.

I have to say again how much the fight choreography bothered me. I'm so tired of seeing people do nonsensical sideways backflips for no good goddamn reason.

I really liked that Diana and Steve Took a boat from Paradise Island to London. The invisible jet or plane never made too much sense to me in a boat is something the Amazons would have obviously had. I think the script made good use of that time with them there contemplating their differences.

 

It could have been really cheesy, but I think his final words to Diana - obscured from by the aftershock of the explosion - about wanting more time with her and then followed up by his giving her his father's watch really worked.

The film also showed us the harsh realities of war and how badly it affect people's lives. I'm grateful that the film didn't try to glamorize things where it easily could have. They really thought a lot about sending home the message that Humanity is capable of great Horrors and that that is ultimately would Diana is fighting against more than anything. Her seeing people suffering and wanting to jump in and help every two seconds also rang true.

 

In a lot of ways I felt like this film took elements from the versions that came before and for a fan like me that made a lot of things feel a little too familiar. If you have watched the Justice League animated series and the Wonder Woman animated film you basically got most of this movie already. I don't suppose that could have been helped and ultimately I'm glad they didn't veer too far from the classic origin just for the sake of being different. That said, the World War 1 setting didn't bother me as much as I expected it would although I have to ask: did people during World War 1 refer to it as World War 1? Did they realize how history would view it as a turning point? I ask because it seems pretty clear that the movie wants to suggest Diana had better participate in this war because it's so big only Ares would have been behind it...

I know it seems like I was really unimpressed with gal, but I think she did all right. It was strange how they were moments though where she looks a lot like Angelina Jolie. I get this ends DC would have cast her as Wonder Woman at a certain point if the stars have aligned correctly. I don't know that she would have done a better job but I could easily see her playing the role in this film and the results being about the same.

Was it just me or did all of the Amazons try to cover for Gal's clearly non-Greek accent by mimicking it?

I kind of hate that in spite of all the work the film did to get things right, a sequel is basically a blank slate. Steve is dead and all the other characters Diana interacted with in this era are dead as well. I suppose they could do a film in a contemporary setting with someone like dr. Psycho or the cheetah but then she's going to have to establish new relationships with new supporting characters all over again.

 

As a Wonder Woman fan, I guess I don't need to say that I find Zeus being her father a touch insulting. It was a much more interesting origin story for her to be the product of a woman's love and a woman's love only. I'm actually kind of pissed we were deprived of the sculpting scene, which is typically quite emotional and moving even when depicted in comics. This film tries to align with Brian Azarello's recent take on Wonder Woman in several ways - by having Zeus be her father and by having her based out of London to name two - and I kind of wish it didn't have to. I'm also a bit perturbed by the idea of Diana being the God Killer and Ares being the so-called God of Truth, or at least referring to himself that way. Hun? Why?

I have to credit the filmmakers at least for creating a really consistent tone. She's a difficult character to write for because they've been all kinds of wacky adventures and so many of her villains have different clashing motifs. This film really did tie everything together and make us feel like we're watching one person's journey into a realistic world.

It isn't really the Wonder Woman film I wanted, but it'll have to do and we could have had much much worse. Overall, the handling of the subject of war and Diana as a naive newcomer were really effective and they did right by Steve and Etta and gave Dr Poison a big boost...that's not bad!

Edited August 2, 2017 by DisneyBoy

[MarkHB]

9 hours ago, DisneyBoy said:

did people during World War 1 refer to it as World War 1? Did they realize how history would view it as a turning point?

I believe it was (and still is, in some quarters) the Great War, as well as "The War to End All Wars".  And given everything else that went on at the time (the Russian Revolution, the first entry of US troops into a European war, the eventual collapse and carving up of the Ottoman and Austro-Hungarian Empires as well as Germany), I'm sure they knew how huge it was.

[Lugal]

I remember seeing a book of photos (from the 1930s) from the war once when I was a kid and the book was titled the World War.  I think they mostly called it the World War.

[DisneyBoy]

Okay, makes sense then. So the Romanov murders happened around the same time? Didn't know that. Need to brush up on my history.

Quote

The Wonder Woman show had her working with Steve Trevor's son who looked exactly like his father, and they were just friends.

I'm pretty sure there were romantic overtures between them in Seasons Two and Three, which I found icky.

The Nostalgia Critic's review points out that no one refers to her as "Wonder Woman" in the film. I hadn't noticed but it's true. I wonder how/if a sequel will address that. Also, since Diana really didn't have a big coming out during the film and was essentially only seen by soldiers (and Dr. Poison), will a sequel feature her becoming a public figure known to the masses? And will they address her immortality? Because this film never explained how that works for her, given this new continuity. In many versions, as an Amazon she relinquishes it by leaving Themscira. But here she's a...demi-Goddess? We assuming Zeus and Hippy boinked? Cause the script just says "he left the child on Themyscira" and Hippy is blonde so...maybe Diana's actual mother is someone else?

Anyhow, is this take on WW going to live forever, or just a long time...or what?

Quote

What did killing Ares accomplish, since Hitler, nuclear bombs, and other horrors are yet to come? I like the idea that without WW, things would have been even worse.

I don't think the film really answers the question of how WW handled the war following Steve's death. Did she withdraw? Seems unlikely, but there's nothing to suggest she stayed in it. I also get a little uncomfortable when we insert superheroes into World Wars because obviously if they had been there at the time, it would have ended things quicker and we know that didn't happen. I was hoping the script would be smart enough to find an explanation for why Diana was only there for a time...we know Captain America was frozen for decades...but was Di just hiding out in a museum? Chilling with Etta? Back on the island?

And as for Ares...killing him doesn't do anything really. The film (wisely) acknowledges that humanity causes their own suffering so...we know suffering will continue. Honestly, that ending just felt perfunctory. This is why I much prefer Diana respecting her Gods and having to battle Ares' influence on mankind as a mission. Her stabbing or punching him is too easy. He isn't the Joker. He's a GOD. I like how the comics acknowledge that.

Here's a question - why didn't Steve leave a few grenades on the plane and jump out with a parachute before it exploded? Seems doable. It's possible there were no chutes on the plane, but would he have known that before boarding? His dramatic goodbye certainly would have been undercut if he got up into the air, saw a chute and went "hun...guess we DO get more time!"

Edited August 2, 2017 by DisneyBoy

[voiceover]

Finally saw this, and there was a lot to love, even though I'm no comic book fan.  Argued with my escort (12-year old Nephew de Voiceover) about how bored I was by the Amazon sequence, because none of them had a sense of humor (not looking for comedy, but couldn't there have been an older one who rolled her eyes over an argument?).  

He argued that Amazons aren't  supposed to have humor, and I jumped on the Well they're not real so who says they can't be funny? train.  Especially since later on, Diana was.

One of my favorite moments was Diana's epiphany at the climax of the film -- I'd argue that it was in fact the *emotional* climax of her story.  And it was not a case of True Love realized/lost/mourned that pushed her over the edge, though Steve figured prominently in it.

I immediately flashed on the climactic moment from Season 1 of (British version) Being Human: Russell Tovey's George is morphing into his werewolf persona, and Herrick (the vampire villain he must destroy) is mocking him for turning his back on his own humanity. IOW, becoming like the Big Bad he was trying to kill.  But George says, with his last human breath:

"Humanity is about love and sacrifice. This doesn't rob me of my humanity...it proves it!"

In that moment, as her past flashes before her eyes, Diana understands what Steve tried to tell her about the good & bad in mankind.  That embrace of knowledge is what puts her over the top, and gives her the strength to defeat Ares.

[Silver Raven]

Etta Candy is going to get her own short feature.

https://moviepilot.com/p/etta-candy-short-film-wonder-woman-blu-ray-dvd/4344867?

[Bruinsfan]

On 8/1/2017 at 11:56 PM, DisneyBoy said:

 I'm also a bit perturbed by the idea of Diana being the God Killer and Ares being the so-called God of Truth, or at least referring to himself that way. Hun? Why?

To be fair, all we really know for sure is that, at least in that moment, Ares believed he was telling the truth. I can see that he might have thought so, and had to buy in to his own righteousness in exposing humanity's flaws and punishing it for them in order to deal with the fact that he killed most of his family over the argument.

[Perfect Xero]

Ares was able to manipulate the lasso and use it to show Diana flashbacks, which leads credence to the idea that he really was the god of truth.

[ChelseaNH]

He might have been the God of Truth, but he wasn't the God of the Whole Truth...

[VCRTracking]

‘Wonder Woman 2’: Patty Jenkins Signing Historic Deal to Become Highest Paid Female Director in Hollywood

Me: *sighs biggest sigh of relief*.

[Bruinsfan]

Hell yeah!

[stealinghome]

YAS QUEEN.

[Zuleikha]

While that's exciting and I'm thrilled she's getting the pay she deserves, it really makes me wonder about Katheryn Bigelow's paychecks!