B&B: What's Up Today at Forrester Creations? - Daily Chat

[mightysparrow]

6 hours ago, MajesticMariposa said:

Well, I guess I'll be the leader of the Unpopular Opinion club and say that I enjoyed Friday and Monday's episodes. One thing most of us can agree on is that the baby switch storyline was awful, but I'm really confused by some of the replies that say Steffy should't have the feelings she's having because she was never Beth's mother. I completely disagree with that. She was a mother for 8 or however many months the baby was there. Beth was taken away from her the exact day that she found out about it. She had no time to process. Her "sort of a mother" comment was made from shock, not malice. So, yeah, it is like losing a child. She didn't fight for custody of Beth, she let her go. Hope was acting crazy just barging in the cliff house yesterday. Both episodes have showed me that she sees Kelly as an inconvenience--that look she and Brooke shared today really drove that home, and she looked uncomfortable when Kelly was in the living room. Brooke and Hope have been in charge of everything, making decisions for Liam and everyone for a while now, and it's not okay. She has shown selfish tendencies. Steffy's doesn't deserve to get slapped in the mouth or whatever. Also, I'm not sure what the quotes around "fans" is about. I am a fan of Steffy and JMW because I like the character and the actress. It has nothing to do with Taylor or HT.

Side note: I've also been enjoying Thomas and am tired of everyone putting all the non-Buckingham blame on him when he was one of the last people to discover the secret.

Just thought I would add a different perspective. This board is my favorite for most of my shows, but it's seemed a bit hostile for B&B for a while. I don't do "teams," but I also don't see Steffy as horrible. Idk.

There is no question that Steffy suffered when she had to give Beth up.  She cared for Beth as her own daughter for more than 8 months.  That's a big loss.

But let's take a little walk down memory lane, shall we?  Steffy had an infant daughter she was basically raising on her own.  Yet she and her mother decided that she needed another infant.  Steffy claims that it was because she wanted Kelly to have the same experience that she had, growing up with a sister.  A sister that Steffy NEVER mentioned.  If you weren't a long time viewer of B&B, you'd never know that Steffy had a twin. 

When Steffy and her mother talked about adopting a baby, dear departed Phoebe was rarely mentioned.  What WAS mentioned was that the hated LOGANS had won again and both Steffy and Taylor wanted to do something about it.  THAT'S why Taylor was willing to drop 250K to get the first baby that dropped.  Steffy was desperate to get Liam back in her bed and she realized that Kelly wasn't doing the trick.  Enter Phoebe.  As soon as Phoebe entered the picture, poor Kelly barely got any attention at all.  It was all Phoebe, all the time.  Steffy's maternal instincts might have kicked in once she had Phoebe, but that's not what the adoption was about. 

Steffy gets praised for not 'fighting' to keep 'Phoebe'.  Why bother?  She would have lost.  Beth wasn't her daughter and she knew it.  She also knew that if she had taken it to court, then the world would have found out about her mother's role in the adoption.

As for Douglas, it's true that Brooke, Hope and Liam have absolutely NO LEGAL RIGHT to custody.  Douglas has a lot of immediate family.  Two grandmothers in New York and a great-grandfather, grandfather, aunt, and father all in LA.  SO WHERE THE FUCK ARE THEY?

Why haven't Douglas' NY grandmothers made an attempt to bring him to live with them?  Has Eric even MET Douglas? I can't remember ever seeing them together.

When Ridge walked out of Brooke's house, he left his grandson there.  Sure, Brooke said that Douglas was happy where he was, but, as has been repeated over and over and over again, she doesn't have the legal right to decide where Douglas lives.  Ridge took his grimy clothes and left Douglas behind.

Douglas' aunt thinks the Logans are horrible takers.  But she hasn't made a move to take back her nephew.

It's no secret that Douglas was the one who blew the whistle on his father which led his father to abuse him.  But none of his BLOOD family has bothered to do a fucking thing to rescue that child from the EVIL Logans.

And what about Tommy Choo-Choo?  We've seen how he feels about his son.  He's pulling this massive con job on his family, pretending to be a father struggling to get his son back.  By shacking up with a drug dealer?  This guy's a millionaire and even if he doesn't have a dime, his family does.  Not one of the Forresters is willing to pay for a decent place for Thomas to live with his son.  His father hasn't done a single thing to help his son get Douglas back.  Maybe because he knows what an abusive piece of shit his son is.

Douglas is with Brooke, Hope and Liam because the rest of his family has ABANDONED him.  They've left him at Brooke's house and have done nothing to help raise him. Douglas is happy, healthy and secure with the Logans because they're the only people who give a fuck about him.

The Logans have as much legal right to Douglas as Thomas has a right to live in Brooke's house or as much right as Steffy has to Beth.  But the Logans are all Douglas has right now.  I think he's lucky boy.

Edited October 23, 2019 by mightysparrow

[Anna Yolei]

5 hours ago, CountryGirl said:

Again, suggesting Hope should move in there because that's what Steffy wanted. Again, if Steffy were in Hope's shoes, she wouldn't have entertained moving into Hope's home for one second. Of course, she wouldn't have been in Hope's shoes because Hope would have never bought a baby, no questions asked.

Gentle reminder that Steffy was willing to hold up a whole marriage because of the "pain" of her quickie scam wedding to Liam in Aspen was too much to pretend like she was never married with the annulment. Not even when Hope went over to Taylor's to all but Jerry Springer her ass for ruining her wedding did Steffy budge on that.

And I'm supposed to believe she'd been OK with sharing mommy duties if the situation was reversed? Not on your life. And no matter all the godawful things Steffy had done to Hope, if Hope were pulling that kind of thing on her, I'd slap her to.

Which on that note (and because I'd be remiss not to, given that rant) the way she and Brooke are going about the Douglas situation is assbackwards stupid. No, you can't just claim custody for funsies, not even in a situation where there has been clear neglect at a minimum as there has been here. At least dig up some evidence about the ghost machine or pull up some video on a conveniently-placed nanny can to forward to CPS, FFS. 🤦 Their hearts on in the right place but if they're gonna do stupid shit, be smart about it.

4 hours ago, TeamGabi said:

I usually detest when people who say "if you don't like the show stop watching it"

I mean...to an extent. Its one thing to shake your head in embarrassment or hell even to hate watch, and another thing entirely to create a whole culture around "critical" consumption like some other online fandoms have  *cough* Star Wars *cough* Anything popular on Tumblr in the last five years *cough*

Personally, it's solely for the community and commentary that I'm even still here, but I have no shame in cutting bait when a show gets boring or too insulting to my intelligence cuz life is too short and I only have so many hours in a day...and there's a whole lotta things I can entertain my time with. I did it Glee, did it with Riverdale and finally, finally doing it with B&B.

Admittedly it does hurt a bit because I've practically grown up with this show--Steffy and Phoebe were the first legacy children I watched be born in real time in 1999!--and I want better for Show than its had this past season. It's just way too dark and dreary.

[Skarzero]

10 hours ago, Anna Yolei said:

Its one thing to shake your head in embarrassment or hell even to hate watch, and another thing entirely to create a whole culture around "critical" consumption like some other online fandoms have  *cough* Star Wars *cough* Anything popular on Tumblr in the last five years *cough*

Yeah that's kinda my point with Logan haters, unlike other online fandoms I come across, they aren't even being critical (most of them anyways) they are just mad af cos they feel Hope and her family get their way all the time and therefore we are wrong and they're right. Not much to it other than that. And I know online fandom culture makes people uncomfortable but it is pretty easy to make a case for why something is being criticized(not always). I'm a media studies major most of what we do is critique media (mostly News & Social media excluding Tumblr for obvious reasons XD) and there's nothing wrong with that so far, and on the other hand somethings just deserved to get dragged lmao 

Edited October 23, 2019 by TeamGabi

[Waldo13]

More 🐂💩. Zoey is correct, you can’t steal another person’s child. Lurch, is trying to set thing up so he can be with Douglas like old times. Yeah right, in Vinnie’s apartment with Zoey.  Nice of Vinnie to move out so Zoey can move in.  

It’s now Raggedly’s turn to pass judgement on someone else parenting skills like Katie did with Bill.  I’m not defending Lurch, but to me, Raggedy also wants to punish Lurch.  Raggedy loves Douglas, but she is being selfish, like Stuffy, for wanting more than one child at the expense of another person. 

[Skarzero]

1 hour ago, Anna Yolei said:

Personally, it's solely for the community and commentary that I'm even still here, but I have no shame in cutting bait when a show gets boring or too insulting to my intelligence cuz life is too short and I only have so many hours in a day...and there's a whole lotta things I can entertain my time with. I did it Glee, did it with Riverdale and finally, finally doing it with B&B.

Oh yeah I'm staying too this forum is so refreshing! And the comments have me ROLLIN!! XXXDDD I'm glad you told me about it B&B is over for me too. Y&R I tune in on the episodes that Phyllis and Summer or Adam isn't SB verbal punching bag so yeah.....lmao

Edited October 23, 2019 by TeamGabi

[LittleIggy]

6 hours ago, Gam2 said:

Um, how is it possible for Brooke to find a lawyer who will write custody papers taking Douglas away from his dad and giving him to Hope and Liam??!! Brooke has no legal right to do any damn thing in regards to that little boy. Who the hell does she think she is? This show just gets sorrier and sorrier every day.

Well, considering you had a lawyer (Carter) who thought buying a baby from someone in a hotel room was legal and above boards...🙄

[CharlizeCat]

If there was ever a time to do a Bill is Kelly's real father reveal ... it's NOW!

[Skarzero]

4 minutes ago, CharlizeCat said:

If there was ever a time to do a Bill is Kelly's real father reveal ... it's NOW!

 

[Anna Yolei]

9 hours ago, TeamGabi said:

 

You laugh, but honestly that poor kid is more Thorne than Thorne ever was, and she's not even out of diapers. 

At least if it came out she were Bill's kid, she'd be the apple of his eye and there'd be no issue of divided loyalties as she gets older, except the usual pitting the children against one another over the business thing....which I hope Billy would learn not to do after Liam and Wyatt but it's Bill and no one learns a damn thing.

Edited October 23, 2019 by Anna Yolei

[Cool Breeze]

So, it’s perfectly normal for Douglas to call Hope “Mommy” months after his real mother died?  Kids don’t transfer emotions and attachments that easily.  Although, on this show, where baby “Phoebe” apparently didn’t give a backward glance to the only mother she’d known her whole life, I guess anything’s possible.  
 

And it’s not a problem at all for Liam and Hope, who just became an actual hands-on parent a couple months ago, to “adopt” another child so soon after they reunited with their first child?  Didn’t Steffy get dragged for doing pretty much the same thing?

[ByTor]

7 hours ago, mightysparrow said:

But let's take a little walk down memory lane, shall we?  Steffy had an infant daughter she was basically raising on her own. 

And doing a LOT of laundry!

1 hour ago, Cool Breeze said:

Didn’t Steffy get dragged for doing pretty much the same thing?

I don't feel like Steffy did the same thing.  Steffy purchased a baby as a back-handed way to get her ex-husband back.  Hope wants custody of a sweet little boy who is afraid of his crappy father, and Hope & Douglas love each other.  And may I say, I hate that all of this is happening anyway, when Thomas & Douglas came to LA after Caroline died, those 2 were super cute with each other, but for some dumb reason they had to go & turn Thomas back into the psycho who set fire to Rick's house.

[TigerLynx]

As Liam quite rightly pointed out, he is already trying to be a father to Kelly and Beth, and Douglas has other relatives who might want custody.  Notice who Brooke and Hope sent out of the room so they could try to persuade Thomas to sign the papers - Liam.  This isn't about Thomas and Douglas, or Liam.  It's about what Brooke and Hope want, and they don't care what anyone else thinks or wants which is going to blow up in Hope's face when Liam waffles back to Steffy.

[ByTor]

2 hours ago, TigerLynx said:

Douglas has other relatives who might want custody.

Then they should come forward and say so, but nobody has yet.

[TigerLynx]

6 minutes ago, ByTor said:

Then they should come forward and say so, but nobody has yet.

Ridge has been telling Brooke that Douglas belongs with Thomas.  If Thomas were to give up his parental rights, which I don't think will happen, that could motivate Douglas' other relatives to step forward.  Either way, this is not going to go well for Ridge/Brooke or Liam/Hope.

I have no clue why Brooke wants Ridge, but I have no doubt the minute Ridge hooks up with Shana, Brooke will want Ridge to move back in.

Liam will get tired of Hope's nagging, and hang out with Steffy claiming it's for Kelly and Beth.  Then when Liam decides he wants to hook up with Steffy again, it will be revealed Bill is Kelly's father.

Then Brad Bell will bore everyone for months writing about Shana/Ridge/Brooke and Liam/Steffy/Hope with a side of Sally/Wyatt/Flo thrown in.

Kill me now.

[ByTor]

Just now, TigerLynx said:

  If Thomas were to give up his parental rights, which I don't think will happen, that could motivate Douglas' other relatives to step forward

If/when that happens, then yes, Brooke & Hope (well, Hope, it's really not Brooke's concern) should step down.  Until then, I'm fine with them looking out for that little boy.

1 minute ago, TigerLynx said:

Then Brad Bell will bore everyone for months

No matter what he writes about he'll be boring us for months 😞 

[CountryGirl]

Nodding my head along to the SOMEONE needs to be looking out for Douglas' best interests and right now, the only people doing that are Brooke, Hope and Liam.

Ridge, apparently, wants Caroline's son to endure further abuse from his father because he refuses to believe what his son has become. Even though he despised Thomas so much for raping his beloved Caroline that he kept the truth about Douglas a secret, claiming him as his own.

And Steffy, who spouted off her "you're basically dead to me" rant to Thomas in his hospital room is suddenly wanting to circle the family wagons. Because she cares so much about her nephew? Nope, because those damn Logans are involved and she can't have that.

Do I think Hope and Brooke's sole motive here is Douglas' well-being? Nope, I have no doubt there is a teeny tiny part of them seeking justice against Thomas for his part in gaslighting Hope and his own son. And I can understand that. But their main motive and what's counts is that they truly wants what's best for him and it's clear Douglas loves and trusts them.

And yes, if Grandma Karen and Grandma Dani were to step forward, then of course they would be the logical choices to take custody of their grandson but they have not lifted one finger to be there for him and don't tell me they're in the dark about what their grandson's father has been up to. Because I'm sure Karen's brother Bill has filled her in.

So if not them, then who, exactly, should step in? Or apparently, since it's evil Brooke and evil Hope, Douglas should be left to twist in the wind and at the mercy of his father so we can look forward to more of this:

And a big fat NO to the premise that Hope is doing the same thing Steffy did with her insta-fauxdoption. I mean, it makes me chuckle and all that there would even be a comparison here.

Um no, she has known and cared for Douglas for months and she is going about this with actual legal documentation and with a good case for Thomas being an unfit parent. Night and day here. 

To quote Brooke: "So you expect us to stay quiet while he verbally abuses his son!" Well, Brooke will not be quiet and Hope will not be quiet and I hope anyone who witnesses a child being abused - in whatever fashion as ABUSE is ABUSE - will not be quiet and will stand up and fight for that child and their right to be safe and loved and cared for.

Period.

[Anna Yolei]

32 minutes ago, CountryGirl said:

To quote Brooke: "So you expect us to stay quiet while he verbally abuses his son!" Well, Brooke will not be quiet and Hope will not be quiet and I hope anyone who witnesses a child being abused - in whatever fashion as ABUSE is ABUSE - will not be quiet and will stand up and fight for that child and their right to be safe and loved and cared for.

Preach! 👏👏👏👏

Edit: and yeah I agree that taking custody of a child in current danger under less than idea circumstances is in no way compatible with adopting a baby six months after you gave birth. Even if Hope ultimately doesn't win custody, just knowing there's someone in his corner is going to make all the damn difference.

Personally his NYC grandmothers would be the ideal choice to raise him IMO but as others have said, they aren't stepping up for whatever reason even after Thomas skipped town and left the boy with Brooke and Ridge. So sure, like Liam and Hope care for him...or maybe just Hope. I get and understand he's got a second child to think about, but she doesn't live with him full-time and she's in no danger of being abused by Steffy. 

If Show is leaning in to what a great, moral, upstanding guy Liam is, now would be a very good time to display that generosity. Stand up to Thomas now that he's gotten Hope back and don't be the Liam who covered for Steffy's Caroline lie.

Edited October 23, 2019 by Anna Yolei

[ByTor]

53 minutes ago, CountryGirl said:

So if not them, then who, exactly, should step in?

Bill!!!  I think Douglas would do an excellent job at putting him in his place when he needs it 🙂 

[RuntheTable]

Oh Show, how you try my patience. 

Right out of the gate let's establish that casting shade on the victims, and making them look mean and evil, in no way diminishes or changes anything about what the actual criminals did. 

Lets take Brooke and Hope for example. Making them look like two desperate, greedy, uncaring, revenge seeking harpies, in no way changes my feelings towards Thomas. He can cry till dooms day about how he needs his son, but lookey here mother fucker, I saw you abusing that boy. Yelling at him. Calling him a backstabber and a jerk. Confusing him by saying he should not have told the truth. Does any of that mean he should be adopted by Hope and Liam? No. What is does mean however, is that you don't deserve that adorable child in your life. At least until you get some medical help from someone other than your nutty mother, and after you exhibit that you have changed your attitude towards your son. In the mean time Tommy Choo Choo, you can just fuck the hell right off. 

Having said that, I am annoyed beyond belief with Brooke. I have said before that I don't buy into the idea that the next of kin is always the best choice for orphaned children, but they should still be involved in any decision making. I think Karen and Dani would be good with Hope and Liam. Douglas is happy with them, he is thriving, he adores Beth, he has stability, but most importantly, he feels safe. Bill would also give the thumbs up. Ridge would be against it of course, because Brooke must pay for standing firm against Flo, Shauna and Thomas. She must pay for side eyeing his budding friendship with Shauna. She must pay for standing up for her daughter and her granddaughter. She must pay for not worshiping Ridge, and for pushing her own agenda. Steffy would fight it too because Logans and all. Wyatt probably would not care, he is far too busy waffling. And then there is Liam; everyone, including Thomas, keeps forgetting that Liam is Douglas's cousin. But I do detect some doubts where Liam is concerned. Brooke and Hope are so focused on getting Douglas away from Thomas, that they have lost sight of the bigger picture. Liam already has two children he is splitting time with. I really think if they had approached it differently, that even crazy ass Thomas would have agreed. Maybe a temporary custody arrangement, until Thomas can get his self fixed. Get someplace permanent to live. Get employed. 

Which leads me to how big Thomas's gonads are. He just invites someone to live in someone else's apartment? I know they were playing it like Vinnie wasn't really living there full time, but this is the first we have heard of that. Up till now, Vinnie has been there all the time, harping on Thomas for not cleaning up after himself, and eating all the food, and being a bum in general. But who cares if Vinnie is there one day a week or seven; it is not Thomas's apartment, he is not on the lease, he has no place offering a room to anyone. Such a Marone move. 

I am so annoyed with Show. You drug that horrid SL out for months and have given the fans nothing for their staying power. So Reece is in jail? Wow, let me gather myself. Back in LA, his co-conspirator is gaining traction in her redemption efforts. Girlfriend had the ace in the hole by being a kidney match for Aunt Katie. Flo's future is looking bright now. Katie looks like she is going to cave, and Wyatt's divining rod is leading him away from Sally's hot ass to Flo's watering hole. Also back in LA, all the victims of his crime are now becoming the criminals in an effort to prop the fucking Marone/Hayes Gang. I DON'T CARE WHAT THE LOGANS HAVE DONE! They haven't run anyone over after drinking, or clocked any relatives upside the head with tire irons, or pushed anyone into electrical panels, or run young women off the road to their death. They also haven't stranded folks in gondolas, or lied about Boinkberries, or fucked their father-in-law, then come home and remarried their spouse. 

Giving kidneys doesn't make it right. Having daddy fight your battles, and make horrible decisions to keep your sorry ass out of jail, doesn't make it right. At this point I don't know what would make it right, because there has been so much more baggage piled on. 

Deep, deep, Tom Mother Fucking Fuckery. 

Edited October 23, 2019 by RuntheTable

[TigerLynx]

I think I am about to defend Liam with this post, which annoys me almost as much as if I was defending Ridge or Brooke, but here goes:

Liam made valid points about Douglas' other relatives and the state of Brooke's marriage to Ridge.  That's not saying Liam and Hope couldn't adopt Douglas, although it wouldn't be nearly as easy as B&B would have us believe, but Liam was simply trying to point out some facts that he, Hope, and Brooke should discuss before going full steam ahead.  Neither Hope nor Brooke wanted to listen to him.  Just like Hope didn't want to listen to Liam when he didn't want to end their marriage.  That's a problem.

Edited October 23, 2019 by TigerLynx

[CountryGirl]

46 minutes ago, ByTor said:

Bill!!!  I think Douglas would do an excellent job at putting him in his place when he needs it 🙂 

Now you know I would love great-uncle $ Bill stepping in as well.

I might die of the cuteness though. 

[mightysparrow]

1 hour ago, CountryGirl said:

And a big fat NO to the premise that Hope is doing the same thing Steffy did with her insta-fauxdoption. I mean, it makes me chuckle and all that there would even be a comparison here.

Um no, she has known and cared for Douglas for months and she is going about this with actual legal documentation and with a good case for Thomas being an unfit parent. Night and day here. 

To quote Brooke: "So you expect us to stay quiet while he verbally abuses his son!" Well, Brooke will not be quiet and Hope will not be quiet and I hope anyone who witnesses a child being abused - in whatever fashion as ABUSE is ABUSE - will not be quiet and will stand up and fight for that child and their right to be safe and loved and cared for.

Period.

Thank you for this picture of Tommy Choo-Choo's excellent parenting skills to remind those people who think rape and child abuse is acceptable as long as you HATE THE LOGANS.  I know Tommy said he was sowwwwwwwwy, but tell that the Douglas when his stomach starts to ache.

Raping one woman and trying to rape another is okay.  Child abuse is okay.  I really wish Tommy Choo-Choo would raise his voice to a puppy.  THEN the outrage would flow!

49 minutes ago, RuntheTable said:

Oh Show, how you try my patience. 

Right out of the gate let's establish that casting shade on the victims, and making them look mean and evil, in no way diminishes or changes anything about what the actual criminals did. 

Lets take Brooke and Hope for example. Making them look like two desperate, greedy, uncaring, revenge seeking harpies, in no way changes my feelings towards Thomas. He can cry till dooms day about how he needs his son, but lookey here mother fucker, I saw you abusing that boy. Yelling at him. Calling him a backstabber and a jerk. Confusing him by saying he should not have told the truth. Does any of that mean he should be adopted by Hope and Liam? No. What is does mean however, is that you don't deserve that adorable child in your life. At least until you get some medical help from someone other than your nutty mother, and after you exhibit that you have changed your attitude towards your son. In the mean time Tommy Choo Choo, you can just fuck the hell right off. 

Having said that, I am annoyed beyond belief with Brooke. I have said before that I don't buy into the idea that the next of kin is always the best choice for orphaned children, but they should still be involved in any decision making. I think Karen and Dani would be good with Hope and Liam. Douglas is happy with them, he is thriving, he adores Beth, he has stability, but most importantly, he feels safe. Bill would also give the thumbs up. Ridge would be against it of course, because Brooke must pay for standing firm against Flo, Shauna and Thomas. She must pay for side eyeing his budding friendship with Shauna. She must pay for standing up for her daughter and her granddaughter. She must pay for not worshiping Ridge, and for pushing her own agenda. Steffy would fight it too because Logans and all. Wyatt probably would not care, he is far too busy waffling. And then there is Liam; everyone, including Thomas, keeps forgetting that Liam is Douglas's cousin. But I do detect some doubts where Liam is concerned. Brooke and Hope are so focused on getting Douglas away from Thomas, that they have lost sight of the bigger picture. Liam already has two children he is splitting time with. I really think if they had approached it differently, that even crazy ass Thomas would have agreed. Maybe a temporary custody arrangement, until Thomas can get his self fixed. Get someplace permanent to live. Get employed. 

Which leads me to how big Thomas's gonads are. He just invites someone to live in someone else's apartment? I know they were playing it like Vinnie wasn't really living there full time, but this is the first we have heard of that. Up till now, Vinnie has been there all the time, harping on Thomas for not cleaning up after himself, and eating all the food, and being a bum in general. But who cares if Vinnie is there one day a week or seven; it is not Thomas's apartment, he is not on the lease, he has no place offering a room to anyone. Such a Marone move. 

I am so annoyed with Show. You drug that horrid SL out for months and have given the fans nothing for their staying power. So Reece is in jail? Wow, let me gather myself. Back in LA, his co-conspirator is gaining traction in her redemption efforts. Girlfriend had the ace in the hole by being a kidney match for Aunt Katie. Flo's future is looking bright now. Katie looks like she is going to cave, and Wyatt's diving rod is leading him away from Sally's hot ass, to Flo's watering hole. Also back in LA, all the victims of his crime, are now becoming the criminals in an effort to prop the fucking Marone/Hayes Gang. I DON'T CARE WHAT THE LOGANS HAVE DONE! They haven't run anyone over after drinking, or clocked any relatives upside the head with tire irons, or pushed anyone into electrical panels, or run young women off the road to their death. They also haven't stranded folks in gondolas, or lied about Boinkberries, or fucked their father-in-law, then come home and remarried their spouse. 

Giving kidneys doesn't make it right. Having daddy fight your battles, and make horrible decisions to keep your sorry ass out of jail, doesn't make it right. At this point I don't know what would make it right, because there has been so much more baggage piled on. 

Deep, deep, Tom Mother Fucking Fuckery. 

A little louder for the enablers in the back.

In the world of this show, being a 'slut' is worse than being a rapist, a child abuser, a human trafficker and a killer.  Brooke Logan is a 'slut' and since her daughter gets in the way of what the Marones want, she's a 'slut' too.  Or, as the man who raised her says, 'that one'.

Sluts MUST BE PUNISHED.  But not all of them.  The punishment is selective.  Brooke is condemned for sleeping her way through a family, but why don't we just take a look at the numbers.  Taylor has slept with every Forrester man Brooke has, PLUS ONE.  Taylor fucked the son of her lifelong enemy, the woman she has devoted her pathetic life to destroying (while Brooke barely gives Taylor a second thought).  Brooke never fucked Tommy Choo-Choo even though he certainly tried.  So does that make Taylor a 'slut'?

As far as we know, Hope has been with two men, Liam and Wyatt.  Let's glance over to the other side, shall we?  Hauxdilox is definitely following her mother's example.  Quite frankly, I fear for Will's future.

And the Logans have never left somebody on the side of the road to die.

Yet they have to be PUNISHED for daring to get in the way of the Marone/Hayes gang.  Choo-Choo had the nerve to call the Logan women a 'coven', because any women who dare to stand up for themselves are definitely WITCHES.  What do we call the raping, abusing, killers in the Marone/Hayes family?  The Crips and Bloods would admire that crew.

Liam DOES already have two children so the idea of adding another one probably isn't that appealing.  But how much actual parenting time does Liam REALLY do?  According to Hauxdi, Liam hadn't seen Kelly since he walked out of the beach house with Hope and Beth.  So I doubt Liam would be do much of the heavy lifting of caring for Douglas.

Ridge hasn't lifted a grimy finger to do anything for his grandson.  He's too busy badmouthing his wife with Shauna, a woman his mother would stroke out over the very thought of her precious boy screwing.  Stephanie might have started out hating Brooke but she grew to love and respect her.  Stephanie would NEVER respect Shauna.  Which is why Ridge deserves her.

The only people Douglas has standing between him and his raping, child abusing, killer father is that COVEN.  Brooke and Hope definitely have ulterior motives.  I don't blame them.  Ridge took away their RIGHT to face the people who sold Beth LIKE FURNITURE in court to protect his son.  He didn't give a second thought to the pain his wife and 'that one' endured.  Why shouldn't they want to get a little revenge while they protect that beautiful little boy?

As far as I'm concerned, Katie needs to get better fast, so that Bill can attend to other things.  Brooke needs someone in her corner who will fight as dirty as the Killer Marones do.

[TigerLynx]

What does the men who Taylor and Brooke have had sex with have to do with Douglas' custody?  Ridge and Eric have also slept their way through a family, and Eric and Thorne are constantly getting involved with Ridge's exes.

There is no reason for Brooke and Hope to be rushing Liam or Thomas into signing anything.  It would be very easy for them to contact Karen and Bill first, and then proceed.

Brooke's mad because Ridge didn't support her (no surprise there, Brooke has met Ridge hasn't she), and she's rushing Liam and Hope into something, Liam isn't sure about.  Would it kill Hope and Brooke to at least listen to Liam?  I don't think so.

Beside Liam's very reasonable points about getting custody of Douglas, perhaps Liam is also wondering if Hope is going to bail again at the first problem.  Which would possibly leave Liam trying to co-parent with Steffy, Hope, and Thomas.  Who wouldn't want to sign on for that headache?

Edited October 23, 2019 by TigerLynx

[Skarzero]

3 hours ago, RuntheTable said:

I am so annoyed with Show. You drug that horrid SL out for months and have given the fans nothing for their staying power. So Reece is in jail? Wow, let me gather myself. Back in LA, his co-conspirator is gaining traction in her redemption efforts. Girlfriend had the ace in the hole by being a kidney match for Aunt Katie. Flo's future is looking bright now. Katie looks like she is going to cave, and Wyatt's divining rod is leading him away from Sally's hot ass to Flo's watering hole. Also back in LA, all the victims of his crime are now becoming the criminals in an effort to prop the fucking Marone/Hayes Gang. I DON'T CARE WHAT THE LOGANS HAVE DONE! They haven't run anyone over after drinking, or clocked any relatives upside the head with tire irons, or pushed anyone into electrical panels, or run young women off the road to their death. They also haven't stranded folks in gondolas, or lied about Boinkberries, or fucked their father-in-law, then come home and remarried their spouse. 

Giving kidneys doesn't make it right. Having daddy fight your battles, and make horrible decisions to keep your sorry ass out of jail, doesn't make it right. At this point I don't know what would make it right, because there has been so much more baggage piled on. 

Deep, deep, Tom Mother Fucking Fuckery. 

*Mic Drop* 

2 hours ago, mightysparrow said:

Thank you for this picture of Tommy Choo-Choo's excellent parenting skills to remind those people who think rape and child abuse is acceptable as long as you HATE THE LOGANS.  I know Tommy said he was sowwwwwwwwy, but tell that the Douglas when his stomach starts to ache.

Raping one woman and trying to rape another is okay.  Child abuse is okay.  I really wish Tommy Choo-Choo would raise his voice to a puppy.  THEN the outrage would flow!

*Mic Drop* 

Also Holy Shit yes, apparently the Pro-Logan Torture crew have lower standards than their faves do. Apparently all it takes to be a good/interesting character is to slut shame Brooke and tell the "truth" about the Logan family. Shauna and Thomas were being hated on pretty much by everyone until they started targeting the Logans so now it's time to roll out the welcome mats for those two lying, soul crushing criminals.

2 hours ago, mightysparrow said:

Ridge hasn't lifted a grimy finger to do anything for his grandson.  He's too busy badmouthing his wife with Shauna, a woman his mother would stroke out over the very thought of her precious boy screwing.  Stephanie might have started out hating Brooke but she grew to love and respect her.  Stephanie would NEVER respect Shauna.  Which is why Ridge deserves her.

Ridge is starting to become a bigger disappointment/embarrassment than Prick Newman on Y&R. If Noah did half the crap Thomass did Prick would gladly alienate him from the family and his children if Noah had any. He beats up Adam over trying to be a father to his OWN boys. Ridge stop enabling your trash kids because you think that you found your balls in disrespecting your wife and your step-daughter who you used to treat like your own daughter until your jealous bitch bio daughter started endlessly whining about it by constantly reminding anyone who would listen who Hope's bio DEADBEAT dad was,like it mattered anymore.   

Edited October 23, 2019 by TeamGabi
I'm gonna start calling him Thomass from now on

[RedRockRosie]

3 hours ago, RuntheTable said:

I am so annoyed with Show. You drug that horrid SL out for months and have given the fans nothing for their staying power.

Oh but we have gotten something.....we have Liam running back to Steffy taking Beth for secret visits to see her first Mommy. We have Hope being put on the defensive about her relationship with Liam and being made to feel bad for wanting a say as to who Beth is with. We have Tom-ass getting away with everything he did to control Hope & in the process abuse his sweet son. And don't forget, we've now got Brooke acting like her MIL Stephanie telling everyone what to do & how to live...& so much more. I mean the gifts just keep on coming, right?**

**FYI The above is written totally in a super bolded & all caps sarcastic font.

And this is exactly why I have taken this crap show off my DVR, This is not even story telling. It is straight up torture with never any payoff.🤬

Edited October 23, 2019 by RedRockRosie
Hit save before I was done. See what this show does to me ?​🤪​

[TigerLynx]

Steffy looks better with her hair pulled back from her face.

Oh Hope, if you only knew what Thomas was saying to Zoe about you like two minutes ago.

[ByTor]

25 minutes ago, RedRockRosie said:

We have Hope being put on the defensive about her relationship with Liam and being made to feel bad for wanting a say as to who Beth is with.

As well as being made to feel bad for wanting her daughter who she did not willingly give up back.  After watching Steffy & her smug, smug face has me done, I like soaps as an escape, I don't watch them to get angry.  Oh, and I love this little gem from JMW...I like to think she's an actress, she is nothing like Steffy, but hmmm...

[Anna Yolei]

2 hours ago, TigerLynx said:

What does the men who Taylor and Brooke have had sex with have to do with Douglas' custody?  Ridge and Eric have also slept their way through a family, and Eric and Thorne are constantly getting involved with Ridge's exes.

It shouldn't, but it goes to the bigger point that everything Team Logan does is wrong and needs to be bashed over Brooke's head, while Team Hayes have skated on five murders or murder attempts between them and show still wants to paint them as victims.

1 hour ago, TeamGabi said:

Ridge is starting to become a bigger disappointment/embarrassment than Prick Newman on Y&R. If Noah did half the crap Thomas did Prick would gladly alienate him from the family and his children if Noah had any. He beats up Adam over trying to be a father to his OWN boys

He did what CountryGirl stated above (albeit in the douchebaggiest way that was difficult to sympathize with): he stood up to stop two children from being used in a scheme by someone who was only there for his own interests. As soon as Adam lost custody to Christian for good--a child he let Nick think was his and bond with for years to save his own ass with a woman he now loathes--he dropped that kid like a hot potato and after his last scheme blew up, he skipped town, leaving Nick and Chelsea to pick up the pieces with Conner.

I can't say Nick is *that* much of a saint (he did buy Summer a new car after totalling the one she crashed into Adam's and the jury's still out on Faith) but in this instance he was right for the wrong reasons and I'm not remotely sad Adam lost.

Which is still far more than Ridge has done, which is at best a glaring oversight give the Caroline story and hiding Douglas from him. He sure could shield Douglas when it was a means to hang onto his trophy wife but now that there's nothing in it for him, fuck 'im amirite? I feel like old Ridge might have still tried to support Thomas raising his kid but would've at least acknowledge guilt for keeping him away from his son once before as a motivator. That, I could understand even if I disagreed with it. Ronn Moss always had a knack making Ridge as the mediator in a lot of sticky situations.

Edited October 23, 2019 by Anna Yolei

[TobinAlbers]

The show could've given Hope a leg to stand on as far as custody of Douglas had they leaned into Thomas's obsession with Hope becoming Douglas's mother and surprised her with the wedding gift of adoption papers which she signed and Thomas immediately filed and paid to have rushed through.  Then in all the hullaballo over the reveal of Beth and Thomas going "oops over the cliff' everyone forgets until Hope remembers that she's only a few weeks out from the adoption being completed and tries to distract/stall Thomas by dragging her feet on the divorce. 

In any case, Zoe is a damn fool to even entertaining Thomas after all the crap she knows he pulled. Then again when she first came on she was a little nutty as well so...birds of a feather.

[TigerLynx]

Liam was making sense when he told Brooke that Douglas has been staying with him and Hope, Thomas at this point hadn't objected and Brooke shouldn't have rocked the boat.  Thomas didn't get all fired up to go get Thomas until he got tipped off about the adoption papers.

Brooke has a point about Thomas being dangerous, but Liam was also right when he thought they should continue to let things ride.  The longer Thomas is away from Douglas, and the longer Douglas stays with Liam and Hope, the better chance they have to make a case for abandonment.

First, however, they really should have contacted Karen and Bill because them being on Liam, Hope, and Brooke's side would have worked in their favor.  Although, I don't know why Karen would want her grandchild around any of these idiots.

Now, Thomas can go wave those papers at Ridge and Steffy, Ridge and Steffy can protest and be the bad guys, and Thomas can be all, "I want Hope to be Douglas' mother, but my family does not want me to sign away my rights, woe is me, I'm poor psychopath, what should I do?"

Brooke is making rookie mistakes here.

[Foghorn Leghorn]

What happened to Ridge being Douglas’ father? Is that supposed to happen soon I wonder....or are they waiting for the adoption to go through then have Ridge beg for custody?

[CountryGirl]

Yep, Thomas is still Psycho. Just in case anyone forgot this or anything. 

Speaking of, Liam is wanting to slow Brooke and Hope's roll regarding Thomas (Liam's own personal hero) but is all freaking out over Hope being alone with Thomas in the cabin.

I don't disagree with his concerns about Hope but she is a grown woman.

Douglas is FIVE.

Elsewhere, Steffy, Madame Co-CEO, finally decided to show up to work today. You would think it was the second coming of Christ.

I can't stand these Fauxerrestors.

Edited October 23, 2019 by CountryGirl

[Anna Yolei]

3 hours ago, ByTor said:

As well as being made to feel bad for wanting her daughter who she did not willingly give up back.  After watching Steffy & her smug, smug face has me done, I like soaps as an escape, I don't watch them to get angry.  Oh, and I love this little gem from JMW...I like to think she's an actress, she is nothing like Steffy, but hmmm...

Eh. It's not like I'd expect her to rail against the show, even if she hated her story. We all saw how mealy-mouth Scott Clifton was after Captive Cabin  and how I'm certain CBS had him doing preemptive damage control over Molly Night.

Still, I wouldn't call anything Steffy's doing in her privileged life "strong." Oh, she let him marry Hope? Sure, she proposed for his lame ass, bit only AFTER finding them canoodling. Wow, such strength my ass.

2 hours ago, TobinAlbers said:

The show could've given Hope a leg to stand on as far as custody of Douglas had they leaned into Thomas's obsession with Hope becoming Douglas's mother and surprised her with the wedding gift of adoption papers which she signed and Thomas immediately filed and paid to have rushed through.  Then in all the hullaballo over the reveal of Beth and Thomas going "oops over the cliff' everyone forgets until Hope remembers that she's only a few weeks out from the adoption being completed and tries to distract/stall Thomas by dragging her feet on the divorce. 

Then Hope would have her agency tied into something or someone other than Liam and we can't have wyminz(tm) thinking on their own, now, can we? 😉

[Skarzero]

1 hour ago, CountryGirl said:

Yep, Thomas is still Psycho. Just in case anyone forgot this or anything. 

Oh hell I really hope they don't try to have Thomass r*pe Hope because that would be disgusting and i'm so tired of women going through that on soaps, it's so traumatizing to watch. I know it happens irl but still it's in poor taste especially since her mother already had to go through that hell and Stephanie too I believe? (Correct me if I'm wrong) Also Caroline so....like yeah B&B don't go there. 

1 hour ago, CountryGirl said:

Elsewhere, Steffy, Madame Co-CEO, finally decided to show up to work today. You would think it was the second coming of Christ.

I guess her showing up for work is supposed to make me chant queen! But in real soaps the CO-CEO is anything but(hence Victoria giving Victor an ultimatum about being CEO at Newman Enterprises, but apples and oranges). Oh well 😕 

[Waldo13]

Lurch is not emotion equipped to be a father?  I don’t think that Raggedy is either.  How many irrational people does it take to cast B&B?  All of them. 

Lurch loves Raggedy. Lurch wants Raggedy. Lurch wants to devour Raggedy. Lurch is a manipulative 💩. Insincere at best. 

Another Big Brother house guest, Jessica, makes her appearance on B&B. 

[CharlizeCat]

OMG! Ridge is a piss-poor mediator. Here is Steffy back at work, dressed like a cross between Elvira and and gangster moll and Sludge is all but drooling over her. (It actually made me a bit nauseous.) What was with the, "I just LOVE watching you work," all about? ICK ... 

He really doesn't know his daughter at all if he thinks that beating her over the head with his broken record, "But we're family ... BS" is going to make her forgive Thomas, he's sorely mistaken.

Man, Thom-ASS was playing Hope like a violin today. And yes ... he is still obsessed. 

Somebody else mentioned this. Another interesting twist would be to have it turn out that Sludge is really Douglas' father after all, but I wouldn't wish that on the poor kid. Sludge acts like he can barely tolerate him. But, he's gotta be better than Thomas.

Still waiting for Brad Bell to pull out that card where Bill ends up being Kelly's father. Now would be a great time. (Repeating this because if we say/think it enough times, maybe it will happen.) /right ... 

[ByTor]

3 hours ago, Anna Yolei said:

It's not like I'd expect her to rail against the show, even if she hated her story.

It doesn't mean she'd have to rail against the show.  She could say "it's fun to play a woman with an edge" or "it's soapy fun playing a character trying to get between her ex and his wife, especially since I'm not like that in real life."  Calling her "strong" is a very weird choice of words for that character, because she's anything but.

[Joimiaroxeu]

I'm confused. Didn't Thomas put Hope on his "out" list? Now he's back obsessed with her again? Zoe, you had one job!

[mightysparrow]

7 hours ago, Anna Yolei said:

It shouldn't, but it goes to the bigger point that everything Team Logan does is wrong and needs to be bashed over Brooke's head, while Team Hayes have skated on five murders or murder attempts between them and show still wants to paint them as victims.

I just get a bit confused sometimes.  It seems to be perfectly acceptable to call Brooke a 'dirty whore' and a 'slut' on a daily basis.  The Logan women are collectively called a 'coven', 'gold-diggers' and everything else under the sun.

But whenever the history of the Marone/Hayes family is brought up, both sexual and criminal, it's a problem.

I agree with @Anna Yolei. Screwing the Green Bay Packers starting lineup (I'm not a football fan but I imagine that's a lot of people), TWICE, will never be as bad as murder/attempted murder, in my opinion.  Consensual sex between two adults isn't equal to running someone over with your car, bashing someone's head in or leaving someone to die on the side of the road like an animal. 

4 hours ago, Anna Yolei said:

Then Hope would have her agency tied into something or someone other than Liam and we can't have wyminz(tm) thinking on their own, now, can we? 😉

Especially not LOGAN women.

[Skarzero]

4 minutes ago, mightysparrow said:

But whenever the history of the Marone/Hayes family is brought up, both sexual and criminal, it's a problem.

I agree with @Anna Yolei. Screwing the Green Bay Packers starting lineup (I'm not a football fan but I imagine that's a lot of people), TWICE, will never be as bad as murder/attempted murder, in my opinion.  Consensual sex between two adults isn't equal to running someone over with your car, bashing someone's head in or leaving someone to die on the side of the road like an animal. 

^^^^^^^PREACH ON IT!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

[Lilac2000]

As bad as this all is right now, remember...if Bell had his way, Phoebeth might still be with Steffy and baby switch might still be happening. Not saying this is that much better but at least Hope and Liam have Beth.

[TessHarding2]

This adoption thing is so preposterous but like others have said, the B&B lawyers fill out forms with great ease.  You're a bad father, sign away your parental rights right now! The dumbness is tangible.  

And ya know Hope is really annoying me more than usual.  She has spent a couple of episodes telling people what they should do.  Liam - tell Steffy that we're a family right now! and Hey you! Thomas, give me your kid now!  Now everyone wait till I give you your next orders and keep your hands folded where I can see them!  Excuse me I have go change into another pair of jean shorts and a long Boho tunic.

[ByTor]

1 hour ago, TessHarding2 said:

Liam - tell Steffy that we're a family right now!

I'll defend Hope here, Liam needs to grow a pair and tell Steffy what's what.  And if he won't, then I blame Hope for being stupid enough to stay with him.  I'm so tired of these women waiting for that pube-chinned little twerp to make a decision, they are the ones who need to decide.  Why can't Hope, Steffy, Sally, and Brooke all drop their loser men & go off together & form their own company?  They'd never do anything to compete with Forrester, so maybe something like a modeling agency?  Hell, I don't care if they opened a bakery or a deli or a hotel (because that story is working so well on Y&R!), just something different!

[Skarzero]

5 hours ago, ByTor said:

Liam needs to grow a pair and tell Steffy what's what.  And if he won't, then I blame Hope for being stupid enough to stay with him.  I'm so tired of these women waiting for that pube-chinned little twerp to make a decision, they are the ones who need to decide. 

Couldn't have said it better myself. Liam has always been a pushover at least where Steffy is concerned. I don't know why Hope even tolerates him at this point. I've been thinking for a while now that she should've never gotten pregnant by this fool. She will now have a connection to him forever. Mini rant here: idc about Steffy because she stole Liam so she deserves what she gets from him as far as I'm concerned. Also some people say that Steffy should be with a real man, but I don't think she could handle it because a real man isn't gonna let her steamroll him the way she does Liam so idk. If she can get one, she'll get one. Maybe. 

[TigerLynx]

In the past I would have dogged Liam for being a spineless waffler (and that's putting it nicely), but Hope was the one who ended their marriage so she could marry Thomas.  The only reason Liam and Hope are back together is because Douglas told Liam the truth.  Otherwise, Hope might still be with Thomas getting the deer in the headlights look and panicking every time he mentioned sex, and Liam would be living with Steffy, Kelly, and Phoebe/Beth like Hope wanted.

Maybe the reason Liam isn't jumping on the "we need to adopt Douglas now" band wagon is because he's waiting for the other shoe to drop, and Hope to bail again.  If Hope bails because she breaks a nail, and Brooke decides she doesn't want to upset Ridge, that leaves Liam dealing with psycho Thomas.

I am perfectly fine with Brooke and Taylor being called out for what they did to Bridget and Phoebe, and some of their other selfish despicable choices, but that doesn't have anything to do with Douglas' custody.  I don't care how many guys Taylor and Brooke screw.  It's their stabbing their daughters in the back that's wrong.  Also, if you don't respect someone else's relationship or marriage, don't expect them to respect yours.

[NinjaPenguins]

I don’t get it. The fallout from the baby switch could have sprouted so many interesting storylines, but Bell chooses the worst possible one: a custody fight between a psycho and the object of his obsession. Who sits there and thinks “hmmm, after this long, dreary, depressing dead baby story, I’ll cleanse the viewer’s palate with a fight over a little boy, complete with scenes of his crazy father being verbally and emotionally abusive?” That’s a rhetorical question, as it is painfully clear that Bell is unaware of his limitations.

Ridge and Steffy have inappropriate chemistry.

I don’t care how many sex partners these characters have as long as the sex is between consenting adults. Eat shit, Thomas.

[Petunia13]

Thomas internal dialogue when Hope was speaking gave me the creeps. I don’t tune in for this rapey shit, nor do I for the child abuse yet here we are! 

wELcOmE to b&B tHeE sHoW aBoUt FaShUn 

[ByTor]

45 minutes ago, TigerLynx said:

In the past I would have dogged Liam for being a spineless waffler (and that's putting it nicely), but Hope was the one who ended their marriage so she could marry Thomas.

Hope did it twice (there was also that time she married Wyatt because Liam was 2 minutes late meeting her somewhere in France) to Liam's 8,267 times, he gets no pass as far as I'm concerned.

[Anna Yolei]

35 minutes ago, TigerLynx said:

Maybe the reason Liam isn't jumping on the "we need to adopt Douglas now" band wagon is because he's waiting for the other shoe to drop, and Hope to bail again. 

If that's the case, why BE with her? It's more straightforward to say he wants to co-parent the way he's been doing with Steffy and be glad that she doesn't have Thomas in her life.

I guess what I'm saying is given how hard Liam's fought to be with her *this* time when he would have fucked off and married the first available woman in the past, I don't buy that he's got those lingering resentments. Liam is a lot of things, but a grudge holding tosser is not one of them, even towards people who he should rightfully hate and resent.

But if I end up being wrong, then he just needs to cut bait the way Hope should have when she very blatantly had issues in 2014 and used Wyatt as a tool to keep him in line. That's just not the story Bell has written this far.

1 hour ago, TeamGabi said:

. Mini rant here: idc about Steffy because she stole Liam so she deserves what she gets from him as far as I'm concerned. 

I don't she'd boohoo tears about poor widdle Steffy but no man can be stolen that wants to actually be there. The Liam from 9 years ago was a horny nerd who wanted to fuck and sure Hope could've been a bit more tactful in her approach about her beliefs, but he also could have done a L O T more to reassure her he wasn't going anywhere. Steffy's gimmicks and tricks aside, no one put a gun to his head to force him to marry her in Aspen. And certainly there was no conceivable reason he had to.leave Ivy who had never caused him a single day's worth of headache.

He's just as much responsible for his own misery as the other two stooges.

6 minutes ago, ByTor said:

Hope did it twice (there was also that time she married Wyatt because Liam was 2 minutes late meeting her somewhere in France) to Liam's 8,267 times, he gets no pass as far as I'm concerned.

Speaking of the Hyatt marriage, I actually did get to see that wedding for the first time and God, she actually looks genuinely excited to be there, even if he wasn't the groom she was originally marrying. I can't say Wyatt's ever been my fave even before he became the newest Chicken(head) and Waffle combo at Bell's Pancake House but damn Hope actually became somewhat fun again when she was around him.

[TigerLynx]

14 minutes ago, ByTor said:

Hope did it twice (there was also that time she married Wyatt because Liam was 2 minutes late meeting her somewhere in France) to Liam's 8,267 times, he gets no pass as far as I'm concerned.

Liam doesn't get a pass, but neither does Hope, and Hope was the one telling Steffy she wasn't going to just hand Liam over to Steffy this time.  Instead Steffy proposed to Hope for Liam, then Hope did exactly what she said she wasn't going to do and sent Liam back to Steffy.  Much like Ridge/Taylor/Brooke, this situation wouldn't exist if Steffy and Hope didn't put up with it.

3 minutes ago, Anna Yolei said:

If that's the case, why BE with her? It's more straightforward to say he wants to co-parent the way he's been doing with Steffy and be glad that she doesn't have Thomas in her life.

Apparently, Liam loves Hope and wants to be with her.  So he's hoping she doesn't bail.  Isn't that exactly what Steffy, Hope, Taylor, and Brooke have done for years, or in the later cases, decades?  Hoped that this time, the guy would stick around, and not waffle back to their rival?  So this time Liam is in the position Steffy and Hope usually end up in.  Except that Steffy and Hope are also both still in that position to.  Again, a situation that wouldn't exist if all of these people didn't continue to put up with it.

Yet more reasons why Douglas would be better off with Karen.  Maybe subconsciously Liam knows that.