S02.E01: The Man Who Saved Central City

[Latverian Diplomat]

2. I can see the writers' room now:

 

Writer A: Well, we could try to make this make some sort of sense --

 

Writer B: Or we could just say "angular singularity!"

 

Writer A: Let's go with that. Wouldn't want to destroy our reputation for questionable physics at this point.

In fairness, Barry said he was increasing the singularity's angular momentum. Angular momentum is one of the few classical macroscopic properties that a black hole has. 

 

Adding angular momentum wouldn't make the singularity more "stable" as far as I know. Only mass does that, and any singularity "heavy" enough to suck up cars and buildings is already pretty stable. They also seemed to mean "stable" as "not sucking up so much stuff" as opposed to decaying away, but either way, it's hard to see how it helps. But never question the ability of running in circles really fast to have amazing side effects :-) 

 

But everything else about the singularity, including the fact that it hovered over the earth instead of plunging into it, was pretty silly.

 

I thought Barry's "rebuild Central City single-handed" idea was maybe a little wrong headed? Aside from opportunity cost, the money spent on rebuilding can be enough of an economic stimulus to be a minor upside to a disaster. I have visions of disgruntled construction workers sitting around grumbling and getting hooked on vertigo because some "meta" took their "jerbs".

[Trini]

I HATED Barry's dad leaving him. I see a lot of people speculating that he's sick and trying to spare Barry the pain, but that would be even worse in my eyes. Barry's already lost so much time with his father, it seems cruel to deprive him of what could be his last chance to be closer. Plus, Barry's an adult, not a child. He's in his late twenties. He is old enough to know the truth and not have his father taking his autonomy away. I also can't believe how cavalierly the show handled the whole thing. Barry's driving force was get his dad out of jail. It should have had more impact than what we got.

 

I don't know... maybe with the introduction of Jay Garrick, they thought 3 father figures/mentors (for Barry) were too many. ... Even though that's how many they had last year.

[tennisgurl]

Please, show. This is a comic book thing. No one is dead until you've seen a body sinking into the ground. Maybe not even then. This is 2015, this aint our first rodeo. Ronnie is so alive, I`m amazed anyone is bothering to pretend otherwise. 

 

Poor Barry. He is just not meant to all broody and self hating, Oliver Queen style. Glad he seems like he is moving on. 

 

I missed Cisco so damn much. I cannot wait to see his powers in action.

 

This episode was going really well...until Barry`s dad ditch him. That is the most unbelievable part of this whole show, and yes, I count the blackhole, the super fast guy, and the magic freeze gun. 

 

I am just choosing to ignore that bit of bullshit, and focus on how happy I am that the show is back. 

[phoenics]

But then I know a lot of fans would hate her even more for taking time for herself and not immediately being there for him after HE lost Eddie and Ronnie. Sigh.

And this is probably at least part of the reason why the writers made her into the happy little ... cheerleader instead. The fandom seems to drag Iris for having legitimate emotions. She's only allowed to be happy and obedient.

[Tara Ariano]

In case you missed it, here's the Previously.TV post on the episode!

 

There's A Price To Play On The Flash
Of course Central City was saved -- but at great cost.

[Last Time Lord]

I was kind of disappointed that Atom Smasher didn't reek of awesomeness like I was expecting him to.

I thought I knew him.

[millennium]

My only gripe about this episode isn't about the episode itself but the overwhelming number of commercials.   I don't know if the experience was the same in other regions across the country, but here at least one ad break seemed to exceed 5 minutes, with 8-10 spots back to back -- long enough to momentarily forget what's happening on the show.

[Starfish35]

I mostly enjoyed it - I have missed this show.

I don't think Ronnie is dead. Which surprises me - I thought for sure he was going to be killed off for good. But no body = no death, so I think he'll be back again at some point.

I loved Joe and Cisco together. And I'm really curious now to see how they play out the reveal of Cisco's powers.

But there were a few things that kept it from being a complete win for me.

Putting Henry on a bus. This just feels like they decided to wrap up the storyline and didn't know what to do with him anymore. It was really clumsily handled and really took me out of the episode. Yeah, right, Henry is going to get out of prison and immediately walk away from the son who's been trying to get him out for years. That makes no sense and just screams of behind the scenes reasons.

While I'm glad that Iris is in the know now and taking an active role in Team Arrow, it is still oddly feeling like they don't know what to do with her. It just seemed like they should have touched more on her grief at losing Eddie, especially when constrasted with Caitlin's reaction to losing Ronnie. I'm not begrudging what they did with Caitlin, and I certainly don't want them to pull a Laurel with Iris, but I do hope we get more into her feelings in the next few episodes.

I'm just going to have to not think about the city treating Barry as a hero for saving them from something that he caused. :( Or all the timey-wimey stuff about Wells being wiped from existence.

Edited October 8, 2015 by Starfish35

[Maverick]

 Another problem:  Wells confessed to murdering Nora Allen, but at the time the real Wells was still living in Starling City.

[Ruby25]

While I'm glad that Iris is in the know now and taking an active role in Team Arrow, it is still oddly feeling like they don't know what to do with her. It just seemed like they should have touched more on her grief at losing Eddie, especially when constrasted with Caitlin's reaction to losing Ronnie. I'm not begrudging what they did with Caitlin, and I certainly don't want them to pull a Laurel with Iris, but I do hope we get more into her feelings in the next few episodes.

 

I kinda know what you mean. I think they're going to give her some reporter stuff to do, but I saw a theory somewhere else that I think is pretty spot on. Basically, the absolute most important and favorite relationship of the people writing this series is the one between Barry and Joe- I don't think there's any way to deny that. So given that fact, what's happened is that on the show Joe has taken the role of "most important person" in Barry's life, a role that, given the comics and everything, should have belonged to Iris. Even in this episode, Joe was ultimately the one who finally turned Barry around.

 

So, with that having happened, Iris has kinda been nudged out of that position and so she essentially becomes another friend or person on the team- except without the handy technobabble they give to Caitlin and Cisco.

 

Maybe if the show had been set at the police department and they had established some sort of professional setup between Iris and Barry, as reporter and her CSI source or something, she'd feel like she has more of an essential role to play. But right now while they're pushing aside the romance AND the supposedly deep bond that he's supposed to have with her (but really has with Joe), she feels like an afterthought waiting to play a crucial part.

Edited October 8, 2015 by Ruby25

[cambridgeguy]

 

I thought Barry's "rebuild Central City single-handed" idea was maybe a little wrong headed? Aside from opportunity cost, the money spent on rebuilding can be enough of an economic stimulus to be a minor upside to a disaster. I have visions of disgruntled construction workers sitting around grumbling and getting hooked on vertigo because some "meta" took their "jerbs".

Actually, they're probably giddy because when the building owners walk in and take a look they'll see that the person who rebuilt their stuff has no architectural knowledge whatsoever and the real professional have to be brought in anyway.  The bond for them is that all the debris has been cleaned up by CC's greatest janitor.

[cynic]

...

While I'm glad that Iris is in the know now and taking an active role in Team Arrow, it is still oddly feeling like they don't know what to do with her. It just seemed like they should have touched more on her grief at losing Eddie, especially when constrasted with Caitlin's reaction to losing Ronnie. I'm not begrudging what they did with Caitlin, and I certainly don't want them to pull a Laurel with Iris, but I do hope we get more into her feelings in the next few episodes.

I kinda know what you mean. I think they're going to give her some reporter stuff to do, but I saw a theory somewhere else that I think is pretty spot on. Basically, the absolute most important and favorite relationship of the people writing this series is the one between Barry and Joe- I don't think there's any way to deny that. So given that fact, what's happened is that on the show Joe has taken the role of "most important person" in Barry's life, a role that, given the comics and everything, should have belonged to Iris. Even in this episode, Joe was ultimately the one who finally turned Barry around.

So, with that having happened, Iris has kinda been nudged out of that position and so she essentially becomes another friend or person on the team- except without the handy technobabble they give to Caitlin and Cisco.

Maybe if the show had been set at the police department and they had established some sort of professional setup between Iris and Barry, as reporter and her CSI source or something, she'd feel like she has more of an essential role to play. But right now while they're pushing aside the romance AND the supposedly deep bond that he's supposed to have with her (but really has with Joe), she feels like an afterthought waiting to play a crucial part.

Yes to both these posts. It seems so apparent to me that the writers have no idea what to do with Iris and little interest in figuring it out. Most of her emotional beats with Barry have been reallocated to Joe and Caitlin, which both weakened Iris and Barry's OTP status and Iris as a character in her own right. She's treated as an afterthought, even seemingly when it comes to Joe, her own father.

It was especially glaring in this episode, because Iris and Caitlin basically are going through the exact same thing. Caitlin gets comforted by Barry when it happened. Later, Caitlin gets to show how it affected her. Barry goes to speak to her and they have a touching moment when they decide to watch the video together.

Iris doesn't get the hug. She doesn't get to show any effects from her loss. She goes to Barry to try to help him and gets rebuffed. (That scene irritated me so much. Barry's "you know I wasn't the hero that day" should have been followed by a "you don't have to tell ME that" from Iris. She lost her freaking fiance and is trying to help Barry through his trauma. Smh.) Iris doesn't get any concern or touching moments and she doesn't even get to be Barry's emotional support. She was basically treated by the show as just another random member of Team Flash, but one that has no useful role.

I hope the show is just saving Iris' impact for another episode, but I'm not very hopeful considering it rarely shows us Iris' POV (how did she feel after Barry's love confession? We'll never know!).

...

I'm just going to have to not think about the city treating Barry as a hero for saving them from something that he caused. :( Or all the timey-wimey stuff about Wells being wiped from existence.

Oh yeah! Am I remembering this right? Wells was in containment and they took him out so Barry could go bad in the past, right? He didn't save his mother anyway, but just used it to say goodbye and then failed to contain Wells on his return. And Wells getting the upper hand lead to the singularity and Ronnie's death, the death of thousands of others in the city, and the Eddie's suicide. Way to go hero! I can't believe Barry had the unmitigated nerve to throw attitude at Iris after that.

[Ruby25]

You know what they could have done, since they have such a hard time figuring out what to do with the role of "iconic comics love interest"? When they're figuring out how to set up the show, they could take that character and go ahead and give her another role you know is going to be needed on the show- like maybe make Iris West a reporter AND a tech wizard. Just off the top of my head here. Yes, she may not have been that in the comics, but simply adding something that's going to be essential to every part of the show onto that character's resume would immediately ensure that she's got something to do and is part of the inner circle as well as being the romantic lead.

 

See, that wasn't too hard to figure out.

[phoenics]

Yes to both these posts. It seems so apparent to me that the writers have no idea what to do with Iris and little interest in figuring it out. Most of her emotional beats with Barry have been reallocated to Joe and Caitlin, which both weakened Iris and Barry's OTP status and Iris as a character in her own right. She's treated as an afterthought, even seemingly when it comes to Joe, her own father.

It was especially glaring in this episode, because Iris and Caitlin basically are going through the exact same thing. Caitlin gets comforted by Barry when it happened. Later, Caitlin gets to show how it affected her. Barry goes to speak to her and they have a touching moment when they decide to watch the video together.

This was really, really vexing. The writers are really treading on thin ice here. I know that they think the only way they can work with Iris is to make her the "happy cheerleader" (just another word for happy negro) so this fandom doesn't crap all over her, but I wish they would take a page from Merlin and write Iris was a full woman and if the fandom goes in that unfair bashing direction, they need to write a "TAKE THAT" scene.

Merlin did - and I forever love those writers for sticking to their guns and not letting the haters have their way. Why are haters so freakin coddled all the time in US television?

So - I don't think we're going to see Iris "dealing" with what happened to Eddie. She doesn't get to grieve to feel anything. Caitlin gets those emotional beats and Iris gets to be the Strong Black Woman trope.

Disgusting.

Iris doesn't get the hug. She doesn't get to show any effects from her loss. She goes to Barry to try to help him and gets rebuffed. (That scene irritated me so much. Barry's "you know I wasn't the hero that day" should have been followed by a "you don't have to tell ME that" from Iris. She lost her freaking fiance and is trying to help Barry through his trauma. Smh.) Iris doesn't get any concern or touching moments and she doesn't even get to be Barry's emotional support. She was basically treated by the show as just another random member of Team Flash, but one that has no useful role.

Yeah - I was really upset after that scene because Barry was actually rather mean to Iris. His supposed best friend. If the writers are trying a bait and switch with Iris and Caitlin I wish they'd just tell me right now so I can quit and literally go to every media outlet to have them cover how awful that is to do given the historic nature of Candice Patton in this role.

It may just be an oversight on the part of the writers - but that was just awful. That Candice Patton acknowledged in an interview that something would happen that would tie Caitlin and Iris together (or give them something in common is what I think she said), yet we didn't get to see Iris even comforted about it in a meaningful way is really, really bad.

Terrible writing and thanks for making Iris a "happy magical negro" trope AND a "strong black woman trope". At the same fricken time.

Man - it's been two days and I'm still angry. I hate tropes - this stuff has a real life impact.

Shonda Rhymes needs to come and do a clinic for these writers on how to write women and women of color. They are failing.

I hope the show is just saving Iris' impact for another episode, but I'm not very hopeful considering it rarely shows us Iris' POV (how did she feel after Barry's love confession? We'll never know!).

I don't think they are. They are just going to skip over it and show Iris working really hard - but they aren't going to have ANYONE acknowledge that she's kinda deflecting her pain - or that she deflected her pain - by working hard. Honestly I think they believe they've done this so Iris can move "forward" but it still bothers me a lot that she didn't even get a hug from her so called best friend after losing Eddie.

That felt like a giant slap in the face by the writers and the last time I felt this was with Sleepy Hollow, Season 2. There was some hamfisted writing in there to take a slap directly to Ichabbie shippers and the show literally fell in the toilet. After The Flash's botching of Iris' storyline in Season 1 - they REALLY needed to put a better foot forward. But they didn't. I think for them - they don't care if she has a PoV - that's why they made her into the "happy negro - erm - happy cheerleader". For a significant part of this fanbase - that's all Iris gets to be.

This kind of representation is DAMAGING. I'm this close to sending Shonda Rhymes a tweet on schooling these writers with their women of color and women characters. And @-ing all of the flash writers and producers. I'm giving them one more episode before I start an #IrisWestDeservesBetter hashtag.

Oh yeah! Am I remembering this right? Wells was in containment and they took him out so Barry could go bad in the past, right? He didn't save his mother anyway, but just used it to say goodbye and then failed to contain Wells on his return. And Wells getting the upper hand lead to the singularity and Ronnie's death, the death of thousands of others in the city, and the Eddie's suicide. Way to go hero! I can't believe Barry had the unmitigated nerve to throw attitude at Iris after that.

I'm still fuming over how Barry snapped at Iris like that. There better be some kind of deleted scene somewhere where he apologizes to her for that ish.

[Trini]

I don't think things are quite so horrible with Iris, especially from just one episode. We'll see how things go the rest of the season.

 

Okay, so Barry owns STAR Labs now? Did he get any money to go with the building? It's a relatively minor thing, but I hope they address the upkeep of STAR Labs situation; since the place is a big part of the setting of the show.

 

Also, with Barry all 'lone wolf', and being so distant with Joe, in particular, did he move out of the West home? (Who owns Wells home now?) I'm oddly curious about the living situations of everyone.

 

I hope not all the new villains are going to be sent by Zoom. I wouldn't mind seeing the some of the Rogues from last season come back.

Edited October 11, 2015 by Trini

[Ruby25]

Oh, I'm definitely curious about people's living situations. Does Barry still live with Joe? Does Iris live there too now? Are all three of them under the same roof? (That could actually be kind of funny if they wanted to play that up).

[Jack Kerouac]

Good episode, except for Barry's dad leaving him. But then again, not such a big deal. Barry can just run at a bajillion miles per hour, visit his dad any time he wants and be back for lunch.

[shrewd.buddha]

Okay, so Barry owns STAR Labs now? Did he get any money to go with the building? It's a relatively minor thing, but I hope they address the upkeep of STAR Labs situation; since the place is a big part of the setting of the show.

Barry owning STAR Labs seems like a huge game-changer. Is he wealthy now? Or did he inherit a company that is massively in debt because of the supercollider disaster? Either way, how does he manage to keep a full-time job as forensic analyst with the police department? 

 

Having Wells leave Barry the company seems like a lazy way of keeping the laboratory set as a base of operations -- but it is pretty nonsensical. Leaving it to Cisco would have made a little more sense, considering Cisco is a full-time lab rat. In the comics, STAR Labs is full of scientists with lots of projects going on at all times -- sort of like the labs on Eureka. (And the comics are not supposed to be as 'real' as television.) 

 

Yeah, I know ... don't think about it ... 

Edited October 9, 2015 by shrewd.buddha

[FortKnox]

As far as the Firestrom thing, it can still happen. There has many different versions. First Ronnie and Dr. Stein, then Ronnie could turn into Firestrom by himself, then Ronnie and some else and then Ronnie was Friestrom and Dr. Stein was Firestrom by himself. And there's more versions.

And yes Zoom is a different version of Reverse Flash.

Man I hate DC Comics sometimes.

Edited October 9, 2015 by FortKnox

[Ottis]

I hope there is some other plan or something happening there, because there's no way Henry just abandons his son after 15 years in prison. No way. That's like the least believable way they could have gotten him out, yet not on as a regular. Sorry, guys, didn't buy it at all.

 

 

I've always thought that Henry knows more about why his wife was killed and is hiding something significant from Barry. No way a guy just gives up and goes to prison so quietly for allegedly killing a wife he loves. Throughout the series, Henry has come across almost as someone resignedly waiting for something. I wouldn't be surprised if he turned into a bad guy.

 

Basically, the absolute most important and favorite relationship of the people writing this series is the one between Barry and Joe- I don't think there's any way to deny that. So given that fact, what's happened is that on the show Joe has taken the role of "most important person" in Barry's life, a role that, given the comics and everything, should have belonged to Iris. Even in this episode, Joe was ultimately the one who finally turned Barry around.

 

 

I posted this a few eps into season one: Iris can't work as a romantic interest. Barry grew up with her as his sister, basically. the show tried to make something out of it, but it just makes no sense. You don't grow up with a person of the opposite sex as your adopted sister and then fall in love with them and want to be romantic. I don't mean it in an incest sort of way. I eman it in a relationship dynamic sort of way. And it seemed to be true from the beginning of the series, which is why I kept posting that it made no sense to have barry moon (lust/9 after iris.

So this turn of events I welcome.

Edited October 9, 2015 by Ottis

[Trini]

I've always thought that Henry knows more about why his wife was killed and is hiding something significant from Barry. No way a guy just gives up and goes to prison so quietly for allegedly killing a wife he loves. Throughout the series, Henry has come across almost as someone resignedly waiting for something. I wouldn't be surprised if he turned into a bad guy.

 

I don't think Henry's a bad guy, however, I do also think he's hiding something from Barry, and that he possibly knows more about That Night and Barry's destiny than he has let on.

[Ruby25]

I don't necessarily think the show should maintain StarLabs as the main setting. There's too many weird questions that go with it- so Barry owns it now, so does that mean he's paying Cisco and Caitlin's salaries? Is he the public face of it like Wells was? How is it being continually funded? Don't get me started on the prison they were somehow maintaining last year- I hope they don't do that again.

 

I think the show just wants it as a cave for its "Scooby gang" (I've grown more and more convinced they've flat out ripped off a lot of the show's formula and setup directly from Buffy, and a new article in The Atlantic kinda confirms that). But I think they should have the police department as the main setting, just so that they better integrate Barry's "secret identity" as the police scientist he's supposed to be (I mean seriously, how much time do he and Joe spend away from their presumably full-time day jobs?) And if they did that, they could also have better integrated Iris, who as a reporter should have sources and a relationship with the police as well.

 

I feel like in attempting to copy so much of Buffy they left out some essential Flash comic book stuff that was already there and that could have been used to set up the series as well.

[phoenics]

I posted this a few eps into season one: Iris can't work as a romantic interest. Barry grew up with her as his sister, basically. the show tried to make something out of it, but it just makes no sense. You don't grow up with a person of the opposite sex as your adopted sister and then fall in love with them and want to be romantic. I don't mean it in an incest sort of way. I eman it in a relationship dynamic sort of way. And it seemed to be true from the beginning of the series, which is why I kept posting that it made no sense to have barry moon (lust/9 after iris.

So this turn of events I welcome.

Barry did not grow up with Iris as a sister and he did NOT fall in love with her after he "grew up with her as an adopted sister" - he had a crush on her before he moved in with her and her dad. He said that to her during his confession in episode 9. When Barry expressed his feelings to Iris, he said that he had to "move into the house of the girl I had a crush on" and that he "loved her before he even knew what being in love was".

Barry's love confession made that crystal clear. The canon of the show has made that clear. Candice Patton has made it clear that there are no incest vibes with them, as has Grant Gustin.

Additionally - much of the frustration you are reading here has NOTHING to do with Westallen romantically - but actually with how the writers have fallen down in how they are writing Iris and Barry's actual FRIENDSHIP. Nothing in your comment actually speaks to that - but instead seems to be designed to undermine westallen romantically.

I think the issue fans are having is with the writers' tropification of Iris as a Magical Negro and a SBW - which has nothing to do with Iris and Barry's friendship. In fact, your comments of them being so close that their friendship reads like brother/sister (which has been refuted several times by the cast and show canon) makes it even more glaring how Iris was marginalized/tropified in this episode.

So when you say that "this turn of events I welcome" I assume you must mean seeing Iris marginalized? Because that's actually all that happened in the premiere. Nothing about westallen was telegraphed as being shelved.

I feel like in attempting to copy so much of Buffy they left out some essential Flash comic book stuff that was already there and that could have been used to set up the series as well.

Yeah - this was what I said earlier in S1 - that Team Flash robbed the show of comic material it could use for canon characters like Iris.

I'm hoping the show resolves this soon.

Edited October 10, 2015 by phoenics

[kieyra]

I've always thought that Henry knows more about why his wife was killed and is hiding something significant from Barry. No way a guy just gives up and goes to prison so quietly for allegedly killing a wife he loves. Throughout the series, Henry has come across almost as someone resignedly waiting for something. I wouldn't be surprised if he turned into a bad guy.

I posted this a few eps into season one: Iris can't work as a romantic interest. Barry grew up with her as his sister, basically. the show tried to make something out of it, but it just makes no sense. You don't grow up with a person of the opposite sex as your adopted sister and then fall in love with them and want to be romantic. I don't mean it in an incest sort of way. I eman it in a relationship dynamic sort of way. And it seemed to be true from the beginning of the series, which is why I kept posting that it made no sense to have barry moon (lust/9 after iris.

So this turn of events I welcome.

I agree with the incesty thing. Some hand-wavey dialogue cannot get past the fact that Barry moved in with them as a *little kid* and that Joe is "Dad" to both of them. This is one of those things where the genie is out of the bottle. The actors can try to tell me they weren't a blended family and that a sibling dynamic never took hold, but I can't unsee the obvious so I can't "feel" the relationship without being icked. It is what it is. Continuing to force it as along the lines of continuing to tell me laurel lance is a badass. They can say it, but that doesn't mean I can feel it.

[patchwork]

There's a lot of story potential in how WestAllan have been set up, they don't really need stopgap LI because getting them from 'grew up together, share a father figure' to 'married with speedster kids' has it's own inbuilt stumbling blocks. But I doubt the show's going to ever dig into that because triangle angst is easier to write.

 

And the CW does like their love triangles. 

 

It doesn't look good but I'm still hopeful that Iris will have a pov this season and her grief about Eddie (and her tendency to bottle up her emotions and put on a happy face) will be addressed within the next few episodes. 

[KirkB]

I just wanted to mention, with all the serious discussions and speculation and such, that my favorite moment of the episode was when Barry and Joe were examining the body. Barry said he had been killed by something very large and very strong and Joe got this almost panicked expression, then Barry looked at him and rather assuredly said "It wasn't Grodd" and Joe breathed a sigh of relief. That was hilarious.

Edited October 10, 2015 by KirkB

[cynic]

I've never gotten the ick factor. Despite the living arrangements and Joe acting as a father figure, Barry and Iris are not siblings. They are not related. That fact would have been very clear to them, because Barry's real father has never been out of his life even though he could not live with him. I think that was made very apparent with the speed in which Barry decided that he should move out of Joe's house and get a place with Henry in this episode.

Anyway, since they're not actually related by blood or by law and they obviously don't consider themselves siblings, I don't see why I should have a problem with it.

[Trini]

So the whole pipeline prison idea ended up a failure, but I certainly hope that killing off the villains does not become the norm. (Now that I think about it, they did kill off quite a few last season....)

 

Also, I hope Caitlyn keeps her job at Mercury Labs; since I'm pretty sure Barry's inheritance is only going to go so far. 

 

Wait -- is Barry richer than Oliver Queen now? That would be something!

Edited October 11, 2015 by Trini

[kikaha]

Not only did she lose Eddie, but she also has to have some guilt and conflicting emotions about her feelings for Barry mixed in all of that.

 

Not to worry.  Eddie landed a job as an analyst with the FBI.  And in an important way, Iris is fortunate Eddie is gone.  Turns out he's gay, which would have made her marriage with him a disaster. 

[phoenics]

Not to worry.  Eddie landed a job as an analyst with the FBI.  And in an important way, Iris is fortunate Eddie is gone.  Turns out he's gay, which would have made her marriage with him a disaster.

LMBO!!

[maczero]

Only 2 pages!!!  The Arrow thread is at 11.  What's up with that?

 

Anyway, am I the only one who caught Cisco's meta references about how the bad guys kept waltzing into STAR labs?  

 

Also why did Atom Smasher look so cartoony?  They did a decent job with Grodd last season.  One would think it would be easier to upscale a human being than it would be to entirely create a gorilla.

[driedfruit]

Only 2 pages!!!  The Arrow thread is at 11.  What's up with that?

 

There isn't anything new to discuss that wasn't discussed to death during the hiatus.

[benteen]

One thing I noticed again last week that I noticed during the first season...The Flash feels like the longest 60 minutes on television.  That's not a bad thing, mind you.  You feel like you get your money's worth.  Maybe it's the way they space out their commercial breaks but when it feels like the show is halfway over, I'm always surprised to find out that only 20 minutes have passed.

[CabotCove]

One thing I noticed again last week that I noticed during the first season...The Flash feels like the longest 60 minutes on television.  That's not a bad thing, mind you.  You feel like you get your money's worth.  Maybe it's the way they space out their commercial breaks but when it feels like the show is halfway over, I'm always surprised to find out that only 20 minutes have passed.

 

Agree, I feel like I get to see so much of every character, every relationship and so much action in one episode. Yeah Im always nervously looking at the clock, because I cant believe they can cram so much goodness in one episode. I hope season 2 continues to be as satisfying as season 1. The premiere was not a bad start but it was missing something, I think the cliffhanger  wasn't as good as the typical Flash episode. 

Edited October 13, 2015 by WildcardC

[Oscirus]

It recently occurred to me that now that there's another world  out there with dopplegangers that anybody that died on the first season is not really dead. As a matter of fact, Atom Smasher is the only one dead for good and that's only as long as Flash doesn't mess up and open another portal to another world because he wants to say goodbye to his grandma.

[LilJen]

This was super cheesy.

 

That is all.

[zannej]

Hi. I'm new to the show. I just managed to watch the entire first season in two days and then watched the newest episodes. For some reason, my local network that is supposed to have the CW doesn't have it so I can only watch online. I can only watch online between midnight and 5am because of my ISP's bandwidth restrictions.

 

Anyway, I admit that I was very confused about a few things and also have some thoughts.

• As another poster already mentioned, Barry was risking wiping out the entire planet or even solar system or more but he still agreed to go through with it and go to save his mother.
• I'm not clear on why Barry didn't save his mother? Was it because the other version of himself indicated to him to not do it?
• Why exactly did Barry come back and smash Eobard's time machine? What was the point? If Eobard was in the future he might not be a threat or problem for Barry at that point in time and if he had truly grown fond of younger Barry, there might have been a chance to fix things.
• I wish there had been more of a hint about what it was that Barry did that upset Eobard so much. Clearly Eobard is capable of having feelings of love and wasn't a complete sociopath/psychopath. I really love the way the actor walked the line between the coldness and the affection. The conflict was evident. I kept hoping that there would have been time for Barry to just talk to Eobard about what it was that happened between them and what could be done differently to possibly avoid that situation in the future.
• I'm rusty on the comics since I stopped reading years ago, but wasn't the Thawne family the ones who had Barry Allen's children (the twins) killed and had Bart Allen put in some virtual reality world (where he likely interacted with a young Brainiac 5)? I know they rebooted things, but I believe at one point in time, Iris was actually from the future or got brought to the future.
• If Thawne killed himself and Eobard never existed then how would he have been able to kill Nora, kill Wells, take over StarLabs, and cause Barry to become the Flash? Wouldn't his nonexistence wipe out the other events? If only the future was wiped out, it still would have wiped out him going back in time to effect the changes. It also would have caused a paradox. But if it was just future events, then why would Eobard disappear if he was there at that time?
• If Barry was willing to let Captain Cold run free with the promise of not killing people, why not try to make a similar deal (only including his own life) with Eobard if possible? He could have said "Ok, if I let you return to the future will you promise to just knock it off?" or something like that. Speaking of Captain Cold, I know it was a different episode, but why couldn't they just come up with some sort of amnesia inducing device to make him forget? Mind you, I actually like Captain Cold.
• For the love of Pete, why doesn't Barry ever just zoom in at superspeed from the side and just yank the weapons away and then vibrate them into pieces?
• I'm guessing that Ronnie may have ended up crossing through one of the portals created by the singularity and he's on another version of Earth or something along those lines.
• I really like Cisco and I find it interesting that they gave him powers. I hope we get to see some sort of version of the timeline where Cisco and Eobard/Wells are still getting along because I liked the dynamic they had.
• I admit I rolled my eyes at Barry wallowing in self pity and being all broody for several months. Funny how Arrow started off with Oliver in a great mood and Barry in a bad mood.
• Am I the only person who noticed Barry's dad do a little cough before he told him he wasn't going to stick around? My guess is that he's terminally ill and doesn't want to burden Barry. But it just seems incredibly odd that he would leave so abruptly instead of sticking around longer-- unless he's actually someone else in disguise.

[ElectricBoogaloo]

The most unrealistic thing in this crazy episode was that Henry would get out of prison, go to a "welcome home" party, and then abandon Barry after missing out on over a decade of his life. When he initially told Barry they would talk about it the next day, I thought he was going to say he had cancer or some other disease.
 
I would have been totally fine if his response to Barry's "Ooh, let's go look for apartments tomorrow!" had been to say, "Look, Barry, I love you and I'm really looking forward to spending time with you, but I just spent 14 years locked up with hundred of other dudes in a tiny cell being told when I could eat, when I could shower, and when I could take a crap. I need some time to adjust to everything. I was thinking maybe I'll go to a deserted tropical island for a few months and just enjoy the silence and not having to poop in front of other people. I hope you can understand that I just need to decompress for a little while, but I will be back soon because I want to be part of your life."
 
i totally expected that flash drive from Harrison to embed a program on Barry's computer or explode or something. A confession to Nora's murder was just about the last thing I would have guessed.

 

My only gripe about this episode isn't about the episode itself but the overwhelming number of commercials.   I don't know if the experience was the same in other regions across the country, but here at least one ad break seemed to exceed 5 minutes, with 8-10 spots back to back -- long enough to momentarily forget what's happening on the show.

This episode was 42:44 without commercials, so it was the same length as a regular hourlong network show.

Edited October 18, 2015 by ElectricBoogaloo

[zannej]

LOL! Yeah, his dad needing a break from prison and needing time to adjust to life outside would have made sense. But the excuse he gave did not make sense. So, I'm still thinking there must have been something wrong.

 

When Barry went to watch the message from Wells, I also was thinking it could be a virus or something bad and the smart thing would have been to get a disposable computer that had internet disabled and watch it. That way it couldn't affect the network or anything.

 

Also, as police officers have noted in the past, it is NOT easy to get a conviction overturned. There was a case of a guy who was convicted on total BS weak evidence and spent 22 years in prison. They found the real perpetrator after 20 years and it took 2 years to get him released (the lab had "misplaced" the DNA evidence so they couldn't compare it but it was "found" 2 years after requested). Sad thing was, the guy was in such bad shape that he couldn't even be fully released-- he had to be put in a transitional home to help him adjust becuase he was mentally ill. One of the cops had to lobby very hard to get that guy released and the DA did not care that there was new evidence or that the case against the guy in the first place was crap. There have been cases where they have found exculpatory evidence on death penalty cases and still refused to overturn the conviction. But, I guess if someone can be struck by lightning and get superpowers I can pretend that someone could be released from jail like that.

[Password]

I was really disappointed with this episode. The wrap up for the season 1 finale was too quick, I felt cheated.

Barry Allen gets a Flash day. The person who decided to go back in time even though there was a risk that a worm hole would open to save his mum gets. A Flash day.

If they knew that he was the reason the worm hole opened, would they would still celebrate him? Kind of like thanks for saving us FROM YOUR MESS. I guess because he stopped it by running fast (never mind Ronnie dying and Eddie dying like real heroes) he gets a pass.

Meh.

[phoenics]

On 10/7/2015 at 12:17 AM, Ruby25 said:

I don't get the weird, super close Barry/Caitlin moments if the show is never going to actually go there. And I'm pretty sure it's not, so why do they even do that? Is it seriously because every female on the show has to be kinda into Barry because he's the star? Would there be anything wrong with say, Caitlin and Cisco having a deeper bond, since supposedly they've been friends for much, much longer?

I think we now know that AJK was going to try to push Barry/Caitlin (after all, DP is his friend - so much so that she didn't have to audition and earn her spot on the show like everyone else, so he was going to cave to her machinations for SB).  Thank goodness GG squashed it and that AJK is gone now.

I remember watching the premiere and being infuriated that Barry watched the Wells tape with Caitlin.  Iris is the one who grew up with him all that time and literally believed in The Flash because he was the impossible and that meant Barry was telling the truth about what happened to his mom - so seeing her robbed of that so AJK could insert a shippy moment with B/C enrages me.  AJK was DEFINITELY going to bait and switch.  That he inserted Patty instead just makes me think he really was going to try to edge CP out and do a Patty/Cait/Zoom/Barry quad before settling on B/C for a while and pretending that he'd do Westallen later.  It appears, by GG's own words, that he stopped this in its tracks.  We probably owe WestAllen to him.

I'm probably torturing myself by rewatching some of this stuff and looking for things like this - but I can't help it.  It's confirming everything many of us worried about in the beginning - sabotage by AJK/DP at CP's expense (and ours).  It's pretty clear to me that CP (and several others) unfollowed DP on social media because of her BTS machinations to take the lead spot from CP.