S02.E28: Europe's Migrant Crisis

[Athena]

Segments: Pope Francis' visit to the United States, David Cameron's alleged pig scandal, Volkswagen emissions violations, European migrant crisis

[M. Darcy]

He brought EJ back from the dead!

[Irlandesa]

Okay, I don't want to be that poster but I'm going to be that poster and revive an age-old debate.  In the summary of all that went wrong between EJ and Sami, either he or his researchers failed to mention that EJ once raped her (or "extorted" sex from her by threatening to kill her significant other if she didn't sleep with him which I guess I consider non-consensual rape).

 

That is why, even though it was fake and for a wonderful refugee, I resent bringing EJ back from the dead for a reunion.  But the refugee is smart.  When I was abroad, soaps and game shows were how I learned the language. 

 

I had heard about the VW scandal but I think this was the first time I realized how complex it was.  They could develop a car that could adjust its emission levels when it was being tested but not one that simply let out less emission?

[Wax Lion]

There should be a German word for the emotion where you feel both outraged fury and resigned disappointment when you learn that Fox News does something racist/Islamophobic.

 

I teared up at the end because it probably means a lot to hear your favorite character say your name and acknowledge your existence.

 

I couldn't help but wonder that if she was able to watch Days of Our Lives and her favorite character was EJ, does that mean she also watched EJ's stepson come out and fall in love? If that storyline wasn't censored, it struck me as amazing to think about how far a gay character's story traveled.

[M. Darcy]

 

I teared up at the end because it probably means a lot to hear your favorite character say your name and acknowledge your existence.

I did also - a combo of being tired and a really great story.  Heh, and I guess I missed EJ more than I thought.  Ergo my first post.

[attica]

I am delighted with the round up of British coverage of David Cameron: Pig Fucker. I love that story so much, both in its specifics and in the way the Official Public Discoursers have to grapple with it.

 

Somebody mentioned on another show another problem with the VW story: people who currently own these cars will not be able to sell them! Nobody's going to buy a used car that can't pass an emissions test. So unless VW can fix the programming and emissions, they will be buried under lawsuits. (I also wonder if emissions standards abroad are better than/similar to/nonexistant than the EPA's.) Might this be the beginning of the end of the company? And anyway, can just one of these corporate motherfuckers go to jail, fer fuck's sake? Sure, the fine will be in the billions. So what? Send them all to the hoosegow!

[dusang]

I had heard about the VW scandal but I think this was the first time I realized how complex it was.  They could develop a car that could adjust its emission levels when it was being tested but not one that simply let out less emission?

 

My understanding is that the cars produce the emissions, they just store them while in a test zone and then release huge volumes once they exit the test zone.  So essentially the car never runs clean it just appears cleaner when it's being tested.

 

I listened to the Slate Money podcast on the issue and they seemed to suggest that the emissions regulations in the US are stricter than abroad and they test for nitrous oxide emissions as well as carbon.

Edited September 28, 2015 by dusang

[peeayebee]

Yeah, the pollution standards for cars are weaker than here in the US. I don't quite understand the mechanics, but if the diesel cars were actually changed to produce cleaner emissions then the cars wouldn't be as fun to drive and wouldn't be as responsive. 

 

I liked the Pope segment, too. It was funny how reminiscent of Colbert's bit on the Late Show this was regarding commenting on the new iPhone.

 

My BIL now hates the Pope because Francis told the UN that they need to share the wealth. "He's more of a leftist than Obama!" railed my BIL. I refuse to watch Fox News, but I assume this is Fox's take on it as well. I was hoping Oliver would enlighten me.

 

"The Pope brought Brian Williams back from the dead!"

 

The vitriol that some European leaders are hurling at the refugees is appalling. 

 

I so enjoyed that one Syrian girl, and the filmed bit with the two DOOLs actors was so very sweet. That girl is going to be squeeing.

 

Please, John, don't go on vacation or tour for a long time.

Edited September 28, 2015 by peeayebee

[M. Darcy]

I don't want to be blasphemous and hopefully I won't upset anyone but the religious beaver really made me laugh. 

[walnutqueen]

I don't want to be blasphemous and hopefully I won't upset anyone but the religious beaver really made me laugh. 

 

Beavers always make me smile (unless they're being trapped).  I'm a Canadian, and still love our nickels.  :-)

[M. Darcy]

Plus, he's not mocking the mosques - he mocking the idiots who don't seem to understand that they can be built.  Hopefully - but that's another set of issues.

[Jamoche]

I've got a friend with a VW diesel. There is actually a system to process the emissions down to an acceptable level, which he told us all about in great detail when he got it - don't ask me for details, I glazed over. But apparently running it full time is more of a performance hit than was advertised, so that's what gets turned off. They can turn them all back on and make the cars sellable, but they'll be performance dogs.

[MrWhyt]

My understanding is that the cars produce the emissions, they just store them while in a test zone and then release huge volumes once they exit the test zone.  So essentially the car never runs clean it just appears cleaner when it's being tested.

No the car's computer knows when it's being tested and so alters the way the engine burns the fuel, thus meeting emission standards at a performance cost that isn't noticed during the test. Once on the road the car goes back to getting higher performance and resulting pollution.

[dusang]

No the car's computer knows when it's being tested and so alters the way the engine burns the fuel, thus meeting emission standards at a performance cost that isn't noticed during the test. Once on the road the car goes back to getting higher performance and resulting pollution.

 

Okay, thanks for the clarification.  TBH, that podcast is my full understanding of the scheme and they made a reference to the cars releasing up to 35x the emission limits outside the test zones, so I interpreted that as a release of accumulated fumes.  Maybe that's just how completely non-compliant the cars are generally?

[MrWhyt]

Okay, thanks for the clarification.  TBH, that podcast is my full understanding of the scheme and they made a reference to the cars releasing up to 35x the emission limits outside the test zones, so I interpreted that as a release of accumulated fumes.  Maybe that's just how completely non-compliant the cars are generally?

yes when the car computer is running in normal mode it is a heavy polluter.

Edited September 28, 2015 by MrWhyt

[Victor the Crab]

I'm no fan of soap operas, but I really, really, REALEEEEEY want Ollie to do a follow up on the Days of Our Lives stars acting out in character for young superfan, Noujain Moustaffa., and showing all of this to her on a tablet of some kind. I want to see the look on her face when they did this all for her. I could use a good tear shedding.

 

And I love the slashing Ollie did at Fox News for their misleading video. This would make Jon proud of him. But, if I could make one critique, make sure you use the same font that they use for their graphics when deliberately doctoring their shit. Anyone with any basic lettering knowledge knows that's Futura Fox News uses on their graphics.

[dusang]

I'm no fan of soap operas, but I really, really, REALEEEEEY want Ollie to do a follow up on the Days of Our Lives stars acting out in character for young superfan, Noujain Moustaffa., and showing all of this to her on a tablet of some kind. I want to see the look on her face when they did this all for her. I could use a good tear shedding.

 

Web exclusive!!

[fastiller]

I don't want to be blasphemous and hopefully I won't upset anyone but the religious beaver really made me laugh. 

I say we start a band called Religious Beaver!

 

 

Somebody mentioned on another show another problem with the VW story: people who currently own these cars will not be able to sell them! Nobody's going to buy a used car that can't pass an emissions test. So unless VW can fix the programming and emissions, they will be buried under lawsuits. (I also wonder if emissions standards abroad are better than/similar to/nonexistant than the EPA's.) Might this be the beginning of the end of the company? And anyway, can just one of these corporate motherfuckers go to jail, fer fuck's sake? Sure, the fine will be in the billions. So what? Send them all to the hoosegow!

Also - what about when these cars get to their next emissions tests?  Will the various DMVs accept the results?

[HelenBaby]

Hey, they can bring them to Alabama. As far as I know you can drive any old POS here and as long as you have insurance you can get a tag. No inspections here.

[dusang]

Hey, they can bring them to Alabama. As far as I know you can drive any old POS here and as long as you have insurance you can get a tag. No inspections here.

 

Honestly, after watching seasons of Pimp My Ride I find it hard to imagine that California is that strict either -- although some of those things were closer to a Flintstone car, so maybe they were good on emissions.

[Hanahope]

I have to wonder what all those VW owners are going to do when its time for their car's next emission test.  Will the testers just automatically fail all VWs so why even bother and now they all have to buy new cars?

 

I've never driven a VW before, what exactly happens that is such a "performance" difference compared to other cars?

[Maelstrom]

Hey, they can bring them to Alabama. As far as I know you can drive any old POS here and as long as you have insurance you can get a tag. No inspections here.

Arizona too. They even let those obnoxious little ATVs drive on main roads around here.

 

Loved the Days bit! Even though EJ was a vile character most of the time it was great to see James Scott and Ali Sweeney together again, and for such a sweet reason too. I do hope Nageen gets to see that clip! And I thought it was pretty cool the way they name-checked her three times in the skit. What a nice thing for LWT to do!

Edited September 29, 2015 by Maelstrom

[MrWhyt]

I've never driven a VW before, what exactly happens that is such a "performance" difference compared to other cars?

This is whole scandal is about the diesel engined VWs. Diesel generally gets better fuel economy vs. Gas, but at the cost of performance (acceleration/top speed). The selling point of these cars was that they perform as well as those with a gas engine, but are "clean".

Edited September 29, 2015 by MrWhyt

[izabella]

Plus, he's not mocking the mosques - he mocking the idiots who don't seem to understand that they can be built.  Hopefully - but that's another set of issues.

 

There are a lot of other issues, and I was surprised John didn't go into them since they are highly relevant to the reasons European nations are struggling with how to handle and manage a huge influx of people who have absolutely nothing.  It's one thing to see refugees on the news and feel for their suffering; it's a whole other ballgame when you have actual people, hundreds and thousands of them, suddenly amassing at your borders and requiring transportation, medical care, food, water, and a place to live.  If refugee boats washed up on US's shores, would we be capable and humane in our handling of hundreds of thousands of them? 

 

While John mentioned some of the logistical issues, I don't think he addressed the scale of the migration and the real strain it puts on the poor (not wealthy) and smaller countries in its path.  For example, Macedonia is a country of 2 million people.  If 300,000 refugees stream through there, that's 15% percent of their population.  In the US with 318M people, 15% of that is 47M people.  Can you imagine if 47 million people needed to flee Mexico to get to Canada by traveling through the US?  That's how it feels to Macedonia and Hungary and the others.

 

I'm also trying to imagine the US welcoming hundreds of thousands of Muslim refugees and finding places for them to live, and am having trouble picturing this happening in any peaceful way.  The rhetoric and fear-mongering would be staggering, far and above what the Hungarian Mayor had to say about it.

 

I was disappointed.  This is a difficult and complex issue, and I don't think John gave it his usual thoughtful care in digging into it.

Edited September 30, 2015 by izabella

[Delwyn]

From the BBC: 

Noujain, meanwhile, succeeded in reaching Germany where she was reunited with her brother. She has now applied for asylum in Dortmund. 

 

Since it was an article including the headline "US soap star back from the dead", I don't feel so shallow in saying: That's amazing! Wonderful news! But...did she get to see the clip?

 

It's really nice to see any show humanizing this crisis. Who can't relate to preferring to live another day, wanting to be an astronaut when you grow up and being into ridiculous soap plotlines as a teenager? It seems like the issue should have nothing to do with mosques and more to do with human kindness.

 

LWT can be kind of a bummer sometimes, but it gives me hope that someone cares enough to go to quite a lot of trouble putting the spotlight on important things that get overlooked. Sure, paychecks are involved, but plenty of productions get paid a lot of money and don't have anything to show for it. For me, LWT is a "leave it better than you found it" situation. They could just show us things that make us outraged. Instead, they also give an option of a positive outlet.

 

UPDATE: Noujain has seen the video and posted a YouTube of her own from Germany.

Edited October 1, 2015 by Delwyn

[possibilities]

RE how many refugees the USA is taking, and what the administration is saying about it, I thought I'd do a little research:

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2015/09/accept-tens-thousands-refugees-150921013907236.html

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2015/09/us-will-accept-more-syrians-but-not-many.html

http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/10/politics/u-s-take-10000-syrian-refugees/

 

Here's how we compare to other countries:

http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2015/09/24/how-the-u-s-compares-with-other-countries-taking-in-refugees/

 

Either way, I'm glad LWT made an attempt to humanize the refugees and call out the wrongness of casting them as worthless or worse. Whether we would be better or worse than other countries I think is secondary to the need to generate a respectful, concerned attitude, which can only help efforts to get any country to be more receptive to helping. I don't think there's anything that excuses horribleness, whether it's coming from Europeans or the USA.

 

Public opinion seems to be split:

[Notwisconsin]

There are photos of early VW bugs with Hitler ACTUALLY IN ONE. That was my only criticism of this episode.

[trow125]

OH MY GOD YOU GUYS

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-34406034

 

edited to add: oops, I didn't notice that Delwyn had updated their post (above) with this link. Anyway, Noujain's reaction couldn't be more delightful and I hope John includes it on Sunday's show so everyone can see it!

Edited October 1, 2015 by trow125

[Jamoche]

Some numbers on how the diesel defeat device affects performance: http://jalopnik.com/heres-how-much-horsepower-volkswagens-lose-from-their-d-1734341446

[jaytee1812]

I am delighted with the round up of British coverage of David Cameron: Pig Fucker. I love that story so much, both in its specifics and in the way the Official Public Discoursers have to grapple with it.

 

David Cameron: Pig Fucker led to the greatest few hours on Twitter ever.

I thought John did really well on the refugee crisis (I really hate it being called the migrant crisis, these are refugees). My governments response is woeful at best. We're promising to take 20000 refugees in five years. Germany has taken more than that in a week.

[ebk57]

I thought John did really well on the refugee crisis (I really hate it being called the migrant crisis, these are refugees). My governments response is woeful at best. We're promising to take 20000 refugees in five years. Germany has taken more than that in a week.

 

A story on NPR a couple of week ago about just that:

http://www.npr.org/2015/09/24/443053728/resettled-syrian-says-shes-a-migrant-not-a-refugee

 

Also, an article by the NPR ombudsman:

http://www.npr.org/sections/ombudsman/2015/08/21/433493813/refugee-or-migrant-how-to-refer-to-those-fleeing-home

 

While many of the people fleeing are refugees, all of them are "migrants" as they're all moving, for whatever reason.  

 

(Sorry for the topic veer...)

[Sharpie66]

There are photos of early VW bugs with Hitler ACTUALLY IN ONE. That was my only criticism of this episode.

 

 

I think I've seen somewhere that Hitler had actually had input into the design of the original VW bug.

[Victor the Crab]

I think I've seen somewhere that Hitler had actually had input into the design of the original VW bug.

 

That he did. When giving ideas of the Beetle to car engineer Ferdinand Porsche, Hitler told him that it had to seat a family of five, get great gas mileage, could be left outside to face the cold winter elements without harm, and had to cost around the same price as a small motorcycle. After years of design work, the Beetle was introduced to the German public in 1938 and, after a groundbreaking ceremony for a factory in Wolfsburg to make these cars, Hitler announced that they would be called the KDF-Wagen, the initials standing for Kraft Durch Freude - meaning "Strength Through Joy" (which kinda sorta sounds like "Work Brings Freedom").

[Brandi Maxxxx]

So basically Hitler chose the wrong career.

[possibilities]

http://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2015/10/10/443448261/heres-where-refugees-actually-wind-up

 

This article explains the technical difference between refugees and migrants -- I had wondered why LWT was calling it a migrant crisis, instead of a refugee crisis, and now I know.

 

It also puts into perspective the so-called "burden" on Europe-- which apparently is getting only a TINY percentage of the population seeking shelter-- by far the majority goes elsewhere. I found this very interesting.

 

Yet even the "relatively international" point of view of LWT is only airing the European angle. As the article says: When was the last time you heard about the refugee crisis in Chad?

[izabella]

I wonder if John will do a follow-up now that so many US governors and even members of Congress are calling for a halt in accepting Syrian refugees to the US in the wake of Parisian events.  It's not just Europe that is concerned about the migrants/refugees.

[shok]

Yeah, you've got to be concerned about the millions of Syrians jumping in those dinghy boats trying to get across the Atlantic.

[fastiller]

I am delighted with the round up of British coverage of David Cameron: Pig Fucker. I love that story so much, both in its specifics and in the way the Official Public Discoursers have to grapple with it.

 

“I’m Going To Fuck Syria Like It’s A Pig’s Head”, Says Cameron.

[OneWhoLurks]

Quote

 

Want to see the best coverage of the global refugee crisis? The worst displacement, according to a top State Department official, since World War II?

Check out late-night comedian John Oliver's take on the subject. Oliver skewers dishonest reporting by Fox News Channel, Eastern European countries that are shutting the door on the displaced and American politicians who invoke scare tactics rooted in nativ- and other -isms. (video)

The "best coverage" designation come from Anne C. Richard, the U.S. State Department's assistant secretary for the Bureau of Population, Refugees, and Migration.

 

Comedians Call Out Politicians on Refugees

[Delwyn]

From The Guardian this week on the LWT piece:

Quote

Nujeen recalls waking the morning after watching it and feeling “as if something had been stolen from me … Days of Our Lives had been my own thing, it was private. Also the video clip wasn’t realistic – EJ and Sami would have had a fight. I would have liked that better than them talking about me”.