Race & Ethnicity On TV

[possibilities]

I don't want to step on anyone's legitimate pain, and if there is bullying or other crap going on against red-haired people, that should be stopped. However, I don't think the Constitution of the United States said anything about them being 3/5 of a person, they were not routinely rounded up and killed, forcibly relocated, enslaved, or denied the right to vote. Moreover, you can buy red hair dye anywhere, and people actively seek to become red-haired in enough numbers that I find it hard to believe this is a genuine oppression on the order of what really targeted people deal with. Where are the carrot top pogroms, I ask you?

We've had Lucille Ball and any number of other red haired stars of stage and screen, as well-- and playing beloved characters, not stereotypical victims. How about "Joan" on Mad Men? That show portrayed her as a bombshell.

Again, if gingers are being beat up it should be stopped. But I don't think it's analogous to racism.

Edited June 22, 2016 by possibilities

[Rick Kitchen]

I was the one who brought up red heads, and in a specific response to this question:

Quote

I can't think of anything analogous in Caucasian culture. Is there?

 

Nobody, at least, not I, who brought it up, was comparing them to black people.

[jhlipton]

cynic, since discussion of Dark Matters and Killjoys is outside the scope of this discussion, I'm sending you a PM

In "More of the Same" news, a black actress (Marianne Jean-Baptiste) is being replaced by a light actress (Archie Panjabi) on Blindspot.  Diversity!!!!

Edited June 23, 2016 by jhlipton
Blindspot news

[Raja]

5 hours ago, jhlipton said:

cynic, since discussion of Dark Matters and Killjoys is outside the scope of this discussion, I'm sending you a PM

In "More of the Same" news, a black actress (Marianne Jean-Baptiste) is being replaced by a light actress (Archie Panjabi) on Blindspot.  Diversity!!!!

Or "diversity" doesn't just mean mostly European versus some African. There is a big world out there and other peoples not involved with the Atlantic slave trade wants their share also.

Edited June 23, 2016 by Raja

[xaxat]

The NPR podcast Code Switch just ran an episode about "Rep Sweats". The name was new to me, but it's something I've definitely experienced.

Quote

It's the feeling of anxiety that can come with watching TV shows or movies starring people who look like you, especially when People Who Look Like You tend not to get a lot of screen time.

[DearEvette]

Trailer for Queen Sugar is out.  EW has a look here  http://www.ew.com/article/2016/06/22/oprah-ava-duvernay-queen-sugar-first-teaser

also Ava Duvernay tweeted out the photos of the directors for each episode.  All Women.  Mostly WOC.

[ribboninthesky1]

Salli's a director now? You go, girl!  I look forward to seeing a series directed by all women, and how that impacts the camera's gaze.  Also, Rutina! Wesley!

[Trini]

11 hours ago, jhlipton said:

In "More of the Same" news, a black actress (Marianne Jean-Baptiste) is being replaced by a light actress (Archie Panjabi) on Blindspot.  Diversity!!!!

I don't think "replaced" is the right word here; and while I'm disappointed they killed off Jean-Baptiste's character, I'm glad another woman of color is joining the cast.

Now, if you want to be mad about "colorist" re-casting, here you go.

[Sparger Springs]

11 hours ago, jhlipton said:

cynic, since discussion of Dark Matters and Killjoys is outside the scope of this discussion, I'm sending you a PM

In "More of the Same" news, a black actress (Marianne Jean-Baptiste) is being replaced by a light actress (Archie Panjabi) on Blindspot.  Diversity!!!!

Hey its not so bad they got another minority actress. Also I'm sure she asked to leave the show to concentrate on her booming movie career that all dark skinned middle aged black actresses leave TV shows for.  

[Rick Kitchen]

I adored Marianne Jean-Baptiste in "Without a Trace".  For a British actress, she did a wonderful job with her New York African-American accent, and she was kick-ass and no-nonsense.

[vibeology]

1 hour ago, Trini said:

Now, if you want to be mad about "colorist" re-casting, here you go.

That's a nice case where colorism and ageism can merge together to screw someone out of a job. Not that Nicole Ari Parker is 20 something, but I don't doubt the producers were upset to hire someone ten years younger than their original actress.

[xaxat]

Another case of colorism, the upcoming HBO project Insecure

Quote

But the process to get from there to an actual series was excruciatingly slow. Before HBO inked a deal for her and co-executive producer Larry Wilmore (now host of Comedy Central’s The Nightly Show) in 2013, Rae talked to execs who essentially wanted her to make the show less, well, hers.

As per a 2015 New York Times Magazine profile of Rae, before HBO, one executive she spoke with wanted to make her show "into a pan-racial franchise operation, starting with ‘Awkward Indian Boy.’" Another suggested the show recast Rae "with a lighter-skinned actress with long, straight hair — in essence, the exact opposite of Rae."

I'm not familiar with her work. But I like the trailer and am really glad she got to make her show.

Edited June 23, 2016 by xaxat

[DearEvette]

She did a web series called The Misadventures of an Awkward Black girl

It is a good little series. A little bit of cringe humor and some good personalities in her supporting cast.  I could see this on par with Aziz Ansari's show.  The web series was a very diverse comedy built around the foibles of an African American woman, but her blackness isn't the central issue.  Some of the comedy uses racial referents but it isn't the central theme.  She has an Indian best friend and later in the series a white boyfriend.  Funny her name is Jaye and her boyfriend's name is also Jay and he is referred to as White Jay. I would say it is more workplace and relationship comedy with lots of 'observational' stuff thrown in.   Why she had such a problem getting this on air baffles me.

Edited June 24, 2016 by DearEvette

[Medicine Crow]

Anybody watching Greenleaf on the OWN channel.  I'm into the third epi & I'm liking it, but "we" haven't got a forum yet!!!???

[Sparger Springs]

31 minutes ago, Medicine Crow said:

Anybody watching Greenleaf on the OWN channel.  I'm into the third epi & I'm liking it, but "we" haven't got a forum yet!!!???

start one

[Neurochick]

20 hours ago, Sparger Springs said:

Hey its not so bad they got another minority actress. Also I'm sure she asked to leave the show to concentrate on her booming movie career that all dark skinned middle aged black actresses leave TV shows for.  

Yes, I see what you did there.  Looks like colorism and ageism ran off together there.

Edited June 24, 2016 by Neurochick

[ribboninthesky1]

Issa Rae, god bless her, had been in development hell for awhile.  I...was not that impressed by the show's trailer (production values look parallel to what she was doing on her own/with partners so I'm struggling to see the benefit), but I still plan to watch.  If I recall correctly, she was supposed to collaborate with Shonda Rhimes on a show, and I don't know why that didn't pan out.  I totally understand the desire to link up with a power player like HBO, and I hope her show works out.  If nothing else, I hope the exposure draws financial benefit for her production company, so she can continue her own vision no matter what happens. 

21 hours ago, Sparger Springs said:

Hey its not so bad they got another minority actress. Also I'm sure she asked to leave the show to concentrate on her booming movie career that all dark skinned middle aged black actresses leave TV shows for.  

I've been laughing at this for several minutes now. 

[Sparger Springs]

4 hours ago, Neurochick said:

Yes, I see what you did there.  Looks like colorism and ageism ran off together there.

For all we know they could've told her when they hired her it would be for one season and she would die at the end of the season. I just see so much nonsense in the few shows where black actress have a major role, I just automatically go for the worse scenario.  

20 hours ago, DearEvette said:

She did a web series called The Misadventures of an Awkward Black girl

It is a good little series. A little bit of cringe humor and some good personalities in her supporting cast.  I could see this on par with Aziz Ansari's show.  The web series was a very diverse comedy built around the foibles of an African American woman, but her blackness isn't the central issue.  Some of the comedy uses racial referents but it isn't the central theme.  She has an Indian best friend and later in the series a white boyfriend.  Funny her name is Jaye and her boyfriend's name is also Jay and he is referred to as White Jay. I would say it is more workplace and relationship comedy with lots of 'observational' stuff thrown in.   Why she had such a problem getting this on air baffles me.

I love Issa Rae and I can't wait to see her new show on HBO.  I hope they don't screw her over. There still isn't an official start date that I know of. My fear is her audience will be the "wrong people". No doubt she will be a hit with black women and have way more viewers than Girls ever did, but not the right type of viewers.  

[Neurochick]

8 minutes ago, Sparger Springs said:

I love Issa Rae and I can't wait to see her new show on HBO.  I hope they don't screw her over. There still isn't an official start date that I know of. My fear is her audience will be the "wrong people". No doubt she will be a hit with black women and have way more viewers than Girls ever did, but not the right type of viewers.  

Wouldn't the "right people" be people who subscribe to HBO? 

I have Time Warner and it's an open secret that many people sign on to HBO when Game of Thrones starts and then sign off when the season's over.

Edited June 24, 2016 by Neurochick

[Sparger Springs]

2 hours ago, Neurochick said:

Wouldn't the "right people" be people who subscribe to HBO? 

I have Time Warner and it's an open secret that many people sign on to HBO when Game of Thrones starts and then sign off when the season's over.

You would think that. Often time when the minorities like something it just isn't considered as prestigious.  HBO loves prestige.  I'll will get more excited when we learn the actual start date.

[possibilities]

Also, who watches becomes somewhat of a self-fulfilling prophesy. If you make programming that appeals only to certain demographics, those become the people who watch. If you want to expand the audience, you have to market to them and give them programming that makes them want to stick around.

[SmithW6079]

On 6/14/2016 at 4:21 PM, Neurochick said:

Here's what I think is offensive, when a black MAN plays a black woman; like when a man plays Oprah or something.  That bugs me because I sense they're making fun of black women. 

Like Tyler Perry playing Medea, or Jamie Foxx playing Shanaynay, a character from his TV show?

On 6/20/2016 at 1:53 AM, xaxat said:

I'm still pissed at the way Syfy killed off the entire McCawley family (Native Americans) on Defiance. But I do like their new slate of shows.

Syfy killed the entire show. 

On 6/20/2016 at 2:15 PM, Rick Kitchen said:

There's also the (apparently) real discrimination against "gingers" (who used to be called redheads).

I think in the US, they're still "redheads." The Brits call them gingers. I started using it to be different. 

[Raja]

4 minutes ago, SmithW6079 said:

Like Tyler Perry playing Medea, or Jamie Foxx playing Shanaynay, a character from his TV show?

 

That was Marin Lawrence, Jamie Foxx's character was Wanda.

[SmithW6079]

23 minutes ago, Raja said:

That was Martin Lawrence, Jamie Foxx's character was Wanda.

That's right. Add him to the list. 

[callie lee 29]

Quote

Jamie Foxx playing Shanaynay, a character from his TV show?

I read this as "Jamie Farr" and was very disturbed for a moment... 

[jhlipton]

On 6/23/2016 at 5:14 PM, DearEvette said:

Why she had such a problem getting this on air baffles me.

Quote

As per a 2015 New York Times Magazine profile of Rae, before HBO, one executive she spoke with wanted to make her show "into a pan-racial franchise operation, starting with ‘Awkward Indian Boy.’" Another suggested the show recast Rae "with a lighter-skinned actress with long, straight hair — in essence, the exact opposite of Rae."

There's your answer....

 

9 hours ago, Sparger Springs said:

My fear is her audience will be the "wrong people".

Is that a reference to Dave Chappelle, who quit his show because the "wrong people" were laughing -- laughing with "Is Wayne Brady going to have to slap a bitch" rather than laughing at it?

4 hours ago, SmithW6079 said:

Like Tyler Perry playing Medea, or Jamie Foxx playing Shanaynay, a character from his TV show?

I've always detested Perry for so many reasons and his portrayal of Medea is high among them.

Fox's Wanda was part of a menagerie of over-the-top characters, like Fire Marshal Bill, "Men on Film", Homey the Clown, etc. I don't put that character in the same universe as Lawrence's or Perry's.  And none of the three were attempting to portray real people, which also makes a difference in my book.  Your Novel May Vary.

2 hours ago, callie lee 29 said:

I read this as "Jamie Farr" and was very disturbed for a moment... 

To be fair, Farr did dress in drag most of the time.

[Neurochick]

15 hours ago, Sparger Springs said:

You would think that. Often time when the minorities like something it just isn't considered as prestigious.  HBO loves prestige.  I'll will get more excited when we learn the actual start date.

HBO loves prestige but they also love subscribers.  I do feel though that in Hollywood, what matters is if people like you.  I mean "Deadwood" got a lot of buzz and won awards, but HBO still cancelled it, supposedly because they didn't get along with the producer.  However, HBO must love David Simon because Treme got a decent run, even though it was not as popular a show as The Wire.

[Ohwell]

40 minutes ago, Neurochick said:

 I mean "Deadwood" got a lot of buzz and won awards, but HBO still cancelled it, supposedly because they didn't get along with the producer.

Arrrggghhhh!  Don't remind me.  I cancelled HBO after they cancelled Deadwood.  I'm still pissed.

[proserpina65]

On ‎06‎/‎23‎/‎2016 at 9:38 AM, Raja said:

Or "diversity" doesn't just mean mostly European versus some African. There is a big world out there and other peoples not involved with the Atlantic slave trade wants their share also.

Although it would've been better if they'd added Archie Punjabi to the cast without letting Marianne Jean-Baptiste go.  They're both terrific actresses, and I might've actually watched the show to see them work together.

Edited to note that I realize her character was killed.  I just wish they hadn't done that.  I'd have preferred it if they'd killed off the main character, but obviously doing so would eliminate the point of the show.

Edited June 29, 2016 by proserpina65

[jhlipton]

On 6/23/2016 at 6:38 AM, Raja said:

Or "diversity" doesn't just mean mostly European versus some African. There is a big world out there and other peoples not involved with the Atlantic slave trade wants their share also.

It doesn't mean versus.  But it seems like the Big 5 take "diversity" as European versus everyone else; with light-skinned people of color more favored.  As long as they have at least one non-European (or even non-Northern European -- a non-pale Greek might be considered a "person of color" as far as the networks are concerned), they have reached their goal of "diversity".

Compare with SyFy, which has darker women of color as leads in two shows (Z Nation and The Expanse), a lighter women of color in two (Dark Matters and Killjoys) -- they may have others but those are the ones I'm familiar with.  If they can do it, why can't the Big 5? 

As far as Blindspot is concerned, they could have made Archie Punjabi as the foil for Marianne Jean-Baptiste.  There was no reason for an either/or, unless the nets act like my first paragraph.

[roseslg]

Not really related to anything on TV, but I was just reading the discussion you all just had about blackness and how it presents itself in say Maya Rudolph and Rashida  Jones vs Leslie Jones and Viola Davis.  It got me thinking about a conversation I've been having with my husband and thoughts I've been having in general.  I'm black, medium-ish, if we need a shade, my husband is white.  We have a 10 month old who is whiiiiiiiiite with blue grey eyes, even our pediatrician who is black doesn't think she's going to get any darker.  I have been asked several times if I'm the nanny.  I can't help but think/worry about how she would identify and whether or not she would be accepted by the black community.  It doesn't help that in the media and on TV there is a certain way to be black, hell, even within the black community, there seems to be acceptable forms of blackness.  I've seen how colorism works upfront.  I guess with my daughter not looking at all black, but being black has had me thinking about such issues even more, and it makes me sad.   We were deciding who would get the kid if we both were to go in the near future, and although I would love for it to be someone in my family,  they are full of drama.  The best bet would be her uncle (My husband's brother), but then I worry about her sort of forgetting that she's black.   Aye.  

[DearEvette]

I think it all depends on how she feels about her own identity, tbh.  Some of it yes has to do with how people perceive her.  But a lot has to do with how he chooses to identify and present.  My roommate in college who was pale, sandy haired, freckled and light eyed and could easily pass as a white girl even though both her parents are black, but she was adamantly black.  So she was always part of the black community.  Her strong commitment to presenting as black made us forget sometimes that she didn't look black. I think it is easier for a biiracial person who is very light/near white to be accepted by the black community than it is for a biracial person who doesn't phenotypically look white to be accepted as white.  Mainly because of the deeply entrenched one-drop rule and also because black folks are more cognizant of the ranges of skin hues within the black community and just are more accepting.  Probably why Rachel Dolezal could front so easily.

On a related note there is this very good documentary called Little White Lie about a woman named Lacey Schwartz who grew up believing she was white.  Her mother knew she'd had an affair with a black man, but passed Lacey as her husband's child.  The entire family kinda committed a conspiracy of ...delusional silence.  Her somewhat tanner skin was attributed to her Sicilan grandfather.  But Lacey discovered the truth and embraced her black roots.  There was a point in the documentary when she goes to college at Georgetown fully identifying as a black woman and is embraced by the black students there.  She talks about a sense of homecoming.  It is very fascinating actually.

Edited July 1, 2016 by DearEvette

[Neurochick]

10 hours ago, roseslg said:

Not really related to anything on TV, but I was just reading the discussion you all just had about blackness and how it presents itself in say Maya Rudolph and Rashida  Jones vs Leslie Jones and Viola Davis.  It got me thinking about a conversation I've been having with my husband and thoughts I've been having in general.  I'm black, medium-ish, if we need a shade, my husband is white.  We have a 10 month old who is whiiiiiiiiite with blue grey eyes, even our pediatrician who is black doesn't think she's going to get any darker.  I have been asked several times if I'm the nanny.  I can't help but think/worry about how she would identify and whether or not she would be accepted by the black community.  It doesn't help that in the media and on TV there is a certain way to be black, hell, even within the black community, there seems to be acceptable forms of blackness.  I've seen how colorism works upfront.  I guess with my daughter not looking at all black, but being black has had me thinking about such issues even more, and it makes me sad.   We were deciding who would get the kid if we both were to go in the near future, and although I would love for it to be someone in my family,  they are full of drama.  The best bet would be her uncle (My husband's brother), but then I worry about her sort of forgetting that she's black.   Aye.  

There are some black people who believe that biracial people should be another "race", I personally don't agree because that's something like what existed in South Africa, which isn't a model for anything IMO.

My opinion:  Decades ago biracial and lighter skinned black people were part of the black community.  There was colorism, sure but there was also activism.  Many light skinned blacks headed up organizations which helped the black community in general; people like Walter White, who was so fair he could pass, reported on lynchings in the South.  That was a time when people, in general cared more about each other.

Today things are different, people are more about me, me, me.  And to take it back to the topic of TV, something ugly is happening now.  What I see is that darker skinned actresses are cast for different types of roles than lighter skinned actresses.  If a black actress is needed to play a wife or girlfriend, in a TV show or in a commercial, I've noticed a lighter skinned actress is cast, most of the time; where darker skinned actresses don't get those roles.

I read a blog a while back about Viola Davis in "How To Get Away With Murder."  Some thought that the scene where she removes her make up, was not a good scene, because they felt a white actress would never do that on camera, never show what she looked like without make up.  Some people feel that darker skinned actresses, a lot of times, aren't cast as girly feminine women and I think that's one of the issues, as to why some black people feel biracial people should be "another" race.

Check out the youtube videos of Alexis Belon, very interesting.

Edited July 1, 2016 by Neurochick

[janie jones]

15 hours ago, Neurochick said:

There are some black people who believe that biracial people should be another "race", I personally don't agree because that's something like what existed in South Africa, which isn't a model for anything IMO.

Biracial as in black/white biracial, or any biracial person?

[kili]

Quote

 

It doesn't mean versus.  But it seems like the Big 5 take "diversity" as European versus everyone else; with light-skinned people of color more favored.  As long as they have at least one non-European (or even non-Northern European -- a non-pale Greek might be considered a "person of color" as far as the networks are concerned), they have reached their goal of "diversity".

[Snip] As far as Blindspot is concerned, they could have made Archie Punjabi as the foil for Marianne Jean-Baptiste.  There was no reason for an either/or, unless the nets act like my first paragraph.

 

Blindspot isn't acting like the first paragraph. Marianne Jean-Baptiste was not the only minority on the show. The FBI team also features an African-American male and Hispanic female (the team is made up of four people) as well as a biracial male FBI psychiatrist. The show has also shown no reluctance to kill the male white recurring characters five of which have died (two of Jane's handlers, the CIA rival/villain, romantic interest for tech girl and male lead's dad). Actually, it's best not to be a romantic interest on this show because you will get fridged. 

I like Marianne Jean-Baptiste, so I was sad to see her go, but she may be the victim of being the wrong character in the wrong spot. The show does have diversity, but as part of a conspiracy and the boss of the "good guys", her character was in a tough spot. 

[Neurochick]

On July 1, 2016 at 10:10 PM, janie jones said:

Biracial as in black/white biracial, or any biracial person?

I've only read comments that black/non black people should be another "race."

[KnotsLanding]

I've been reading this thread all day and have something I didn't see mentioned that might be interesting to discuss. Well obviously from my name I'm a soap fan and one of the most famous soap actresses is Victoria Rowell. She played Drucilla Winters on The Young and the Restless and was extremely popular throughout the 90s and 00s when she appeared. Her main costars were Tonya Lee Williams, Kristoff St. John and Shemar Moore and they all became huge in the soap community. In the 90s Rowell was so popular she also co-starred on Diagnosis Murder while also keeping her soap job which is very rare. She ended up leaving the show for a few years until Shemar Moore left and a leaked network report showed the show lost two million viewers with his exit so they brought Rowell back along with a lot of new minority characters.

Now the reason I mention this is because she is now suing Sony, CBS and the company that owns The Bold and the Beautiful because she's been blacklisted from appearing on soaps due to advocating for fair treatment of minorities. She has also been long branded as crazy and the typical angry black woman. She willingly left Y&R on 2007 (due to endless mistreatment by the cast and crew) and since then the show always teases her return, but they won't actually allow it to happen. 

Here is an article that gives some info on her lawsuit: http://tvline.com/2016/06/26/the-young-and-the-restless-victoria-rowell-lawsuit-proceeding/

The weird thing with her is that although there is so much proof to her claims, people still claim she is crazy, including some co-stars. One of her costars spit on her and has admitted it (although not apologized), but Rowell is still considered the crazy one. Brad Bell tried to bring her to The Bold and the Beautiful, but CBS wouldn't allow him to cast her. Maria Arena Bell (then serving as EP/Headwriter) tried to bring her back to Y&R and was also told no. Recently and an important part of her lawsuit is that she was asked to audition for a smaller role on Days of Our Lives and was removed from the audition list.

I cannot wait until this comes to trial because it will be juicy! Other actors on the show (Kriston St. John, Bryton James) have been suspended for speaking out on their poor treatment which is clear retaliation, not to mention all the other things that have happened. I could literally go on and on about the mistreatment of various minorities on soaps throughout the years. From having to either wear a wig or pay for your own hairstylist, to being relegated to only appearing once a week, to not getting the same writing/directing opportunities as your white cast members, the list goes on.

[atomationage]

If you want to work in the soap business again, it's probably not a good idea to write a book that thinly disguises all the people you worked with, and then trashes every single one of them, like Secrets Of A Soap Opera Diva by Victoria Rowell.  Anyway, the soaps are nearly dead.  Shemar Moore got out while the getting was good.   He's been doing very well for many years, and it's all his own fault.

[JBC344]

28 minutes ago, atomationage said:

If you want to work in the soap business again, it's probably not a good idea to write a book that thinly disguises all the people you worked with, and then trashes every single one of them, like Secrets Of A Soap Opera Diva by Victoria Rowell.  Anyway, the soaps are nearly dead.  Shemar Moore got out while the getting was good.   He's been doing very well for many years, and it's all his own fault.

Are you saying it was bad form for her to write that book despite the fact that she was mistreated? Or are you saying it was bad for her to write that book because you don't believe she was mistreated?

For me, it would depend on who exactly she called out in the book.  If she went after the then producers who mistreated her, then fair game.  It doesn't seem like she went after too many people if she still has influential people in the soap world trying to bring her back.  I think it is one thing for the studio to maybe say there is too much drama here, right or wrong, but if people are actively trying to defame her by contacting other production companies and soaps then she may have a strong case.

This explains a lot.  I always wondered why Victoria was never picked up by another soap.  She is an incredibly popular soap actress.  Actresses with her history and popularity should have had every soap in town trying to get her on their show. 

[ribboninthesky1]

What's that saying? Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean someone isn't after you? Rowell may indeed have her own issues, but it doesn't mean she doesn't have a case.  Discrediting a person's character/making them persona non grata is old hat when it comes to racial discrimination allegations.     

[atomationage]

17 minutes ago, JBC344 said:

Are you saying it was bad form for her to write that book despite the fact that she was mistreated? Or are you saying it was bad for her to write that book because you don't believe she was mistreated?

I'd suggest reading the book, and see for yourself if you would hire or rehire someone who described her co-workers in the way that Victoria Rowell described hers.  You might also compare it to Eileen Davidson's novels.  I have no idea if she was mistreated or not, any more than Brenda Dickson's allegations.  She's also generally considered crazy, and people have been making fun of her for decades since she left the show.  I also had no idea that Victoria Rowell was an incredibly popular soap actress.  I thought people were more likely watching for Kristoff St.John and Shemar Moore.  

Edited July 10, 2016 by atomationage

[JBC344]

1 hour ago, atomationage said:

I'd suggest reading the book, and see for yourself if you would hire or rehire someone who described her co-workers in the way that Victoria Rowell described hers.  You might also compare it to Eileen Davidson's novels.  I have no idea if she was mistreated or not, any more than Brenda Dickson's allegations.  She's also generally considered crazy, and people have been making fun of her for decades since she left the show.  I also had no idea that Victoria Rowell was an incredibly popular soap actress.  I thought people were more likely watching for Kristoff St.John and Shemar Moore.  

I haven't read the book, so I'm genuinely asking if she is referring to those co-workers who mistreated her?  I would hypothesize and say that If I thought Victoria Rowell was telling the truth and she decided to write the book, then my answer is yes I would hire her if I believed that she was mistreated by said co-workers.

Now If I believed that Victoria was completely lying about everything then no, I wouldn't hire her sans book or not.

Generally speaking, since you have read the book.  How many people did she actually trash in the book?  It seems to me like she has some very strong allies so identifying who exactly she talked "negative" and "positive" about would be a huge factor.

I guess what I'm trying to understand is that if you "have no idea if she was mistreated or not", then from your point of view what is wrong with her writing a fictionalized version of the events?

Do you just believe it to be bad form?  Do you believe she trashed all of her co-workers, including the good ones? 

[festivus]

I haven't watched any soaps for years and I don't know anything about what Victoria Rowell is like in real life but I did watch Y&R for Drusilla. I loved that character. 

[jhlipton]

And SyFy continues to lead the Big 5.  They just added a black woman to Dark Matter without sacrificing the other WoC (the MoC is out for a while, but I doubt for long).  THAT is how you do it, nets. 

[DollEyes]

Quote

I read a blog a while back about Viola Davis in "How To Get Away With Murder." Some thought that the scene where she removes her makeup was not a good scene because they felt a white actress would never do that, never show what she looked like without makeup.

  As a Black woman, I totally disagree with the critics of the makeup removal scene in How To Get Away With Murder. I thought it was a very powerful, brilliantly acted scene that not only showed Ms. Davis at her best, I believe it helped her win the Emmy for Best Dramatic Actress last year, which she richly deserved. 

 White actresses have done roles without makeup, such as Farrah Fawcett in The Burning Bed and Glenn Close at the end of the film version of Dangerous Liasons to name two and both of them were nominated for an Emmy and an Oscar, respectively. Talent is talent, with or without makeup. 

[pivot]

Jane Fonda had a scene just like that in her new Netflix show. If done right (and with Fonda and Davis it was), it can be a powerful scene.

[possibilities]

I thought I read an interview where Davis said she was the one who suggested the scene. I don't think it was something the show forced on her.

[atomationage]

20 hours ago, JBC344 said:

How many people did she actually trash in the book? 

This is all very old news, since she left Y&R nine years ago, and the book was published maybe six years ago.  I read it many years ago.   Most of the characters are easy to recognize.  It begins with her feud with Michelle Stafford, then goes on to trash her, Melody Thomas Scott and her husband Ed Scott,  and many of the other cast members, many of whom are no longer on the show.  Trashing Ed Scott, even if thinly disguised as fiction, is a pretty stupid thing to do if you would ever expect to work on Y&R or B&B.  I apologize for responding to the original post.  I have not been in the Y&R forums for probably two years, and I had forgotten that type of post turns up there every so often.

Edited July 11, 2016 by atomationage

[LydiaMoon1]

Once they started getting dragged in the comments section, EW altered its list of recommended actresses to include reader suggestions. I'm sure they would characterize this as an oversight, but Hollywood knows exactly what it is doing.

http://blackgirllonghair.com/2016/07/days-after-marvel-announced-its-new-iron-man-hollywood-is-already-erasing-her-dark-skin/

[jhlipton]

2 hours ago, LydiaMoon1 said:

Once they started getting dragged in the comments section, EW altered its list of recommended actresses to include reader suggestions. I'm sure they would characterize this as an oversight, but Hollywood knows exactly what it is doing.

http://blackgirllonghair.com/2016/07/days-after-marvel-announced-its-new-iron-man-hollywood-is-already-erasing-her-dark-skin/

It certainly does.  Adding a few tokens who are way too old to play the part is just rubbing salt in the wound.