S01.E01: Beyond The Tank: Episode 101

[yeswedo]

 

 

Robert Herjavec rolls up his sleeves to help guide San Diego, CA entrepreneurs Evan Melsohn and Nick Morton, the “Tipsy Elves” business duo from Season 5. They find themselves at a crossroads when it comes to branding their clothing design company and if Nick should quit his job as a dentist and participate full time in the business.

 

Sixteen-year old Carter Kostler from Virginia Beach, VA felt devastated when he did not get a deal for The Define Bottle, his fruit-infused water bottle, after appearing in a Season 5 episode. He shares how he turned his first venture at being an entrepreneur into a learning experience that will last him a lifetime.

 

When former pro-football player Al “Bubba” Baker and his daughter, Brittani Bo Baker, pitched the Sharks in Season 5, Daymond John won the battle to invest $300,000 in their Deboned Baby Back Ribs business. But when Daymond goes to Avon, OH and discovers that production is not under control and orders aren’t keeping up with the demand, the Shark wonders if he made the right business decision.

 

*We'll move this into a subforum soon

 

ETA: No subforum, keeping BTT in the main forum

[starri]

 

Robert Herjavec rolls up his sleeves to help guide San Diego, CA entrepreneurs Evan Melsohn and Nick Morton, the “Tipsy Elves” business duo from Season 5. They find themselves at a crossroads when it comes to branding their clothing design company and if Nick should quit his job as a dentist and participate full time in the business.

There's an Island of Misfit Toys joke in there somewhere.

[Primetimer]

We've got some catching up to do with the entrepreneurs who managed to walk away from Shark Tank with some cold hard cash in their pockets. But is this weekly Where Are They Now spinoff worth an investment of your time?

Read the story

[zxy556575]

That's me! I'm the completist! I enjoy the follow-up segments on ST so am looking forward to this. I'd like to see some utter failures as a counterpoint but don't suppose we will.

[leighdear]

Ugly sweater wearing has passed it's prime.  No telling what the hipsters will be glomming on to this year, but the ugly sweater thing is no longer ironic.  What irritates me is that the initial premise of the whole thing was to FIND the ugly sweater/shirt in your Grandmother's or Aunt's closet or a thrift store.  To deliberately produce one completely misses the point. 

 

Though Robert does seem to want to push them into a more mainstream direction, and that's smart to me. 

[me5671]

That's me! I'm the completist! I enjoy the follow-up segments on ST so am looking forward to this. I'd like to see some utter failures as a counterpoint but don't suppose we will.

 

Ditto!  They can't all be success stories.  I hope they don't exclusively feature the smashing successes.  I also would like to hear about a few that did only so-so and even a few failures just to balance it out and to get a more realistic picture.  It'll get pretty boring after awhile if every segment is "wow... we went on shark tank and sales just took off!!!"  

 

There are a few deals that were struck on the show in the past where I said to myself "no WAY that works out".  I would love the vindication to see a followup on them confirming my suspicions.  The fact that those few deals I was skeptical about haven't been featured in a follow-up segment during Shark Tank yet speaks volumes about their success (or lack thereof) it would still be nice to know for sure!

[zxy556575]

I'm pretty astonished that Tipsy Elves made the kind of money they have -- I would have kept my wallet clamped tightly shut if I were a shark during their presentation. Their expansion to t-shirts? How is that a viable, long term business? Especially considering they were pretty tacky. I did like some of the designs in their cheaper line that Robert shut down, but then, I buy clothes from JC Penney un-ironically. I was mentally tut-tutting at the endodontist. Bad decision, dude.

 

Very pleased to see the nice Define bottle kid do well. His idea wasn't new or unique and I'm sure the ST bump helped a ton, but good for him.

 

I go to a local BBQ restaurant that offers a chopped rib option with the meat off the bone. I don't really need the meat to still look like it has bones. I'm also still dubious about how Bubba gets those things out. I'm sure they're not but I imagine them being dissolved somehow.

[LotusFlower]

Not what I was expecting. It was so contrived. A reality show with storylines and scripts. Damon to Bubba, the ribs guy: Can I trust you to find a co-packer to fulfill all these order? Or will I have to pull out and cut my losses? Cue dramatic music. Next scene - Bubba secures a co-packer! Even better - the company is family owned and run,, just like Bubba's! And scene. Gag!

[bilgistic]

I didn't understand the whole co-packer DRAHMZ. Did Bubba just not sell any ribs for an extended period of time until he found his saviour in New Jersey? Didn't/wouldn't that pretty significantly hurt business? Why am I so confused by this and why is Damon so glamoured by glazed meat?

[Kenz]

I hope the dentist has kept his option open to return to a dental practice. There's no way that I would give up a lucrative dental practice (and usually young dentists have large student loans to repay) to work at a tacky clothing operation. The Christmas sweater business has a lot of competition, and I thought that the t shirts were pretty badly designed  for the most part. I'm sure that the dentist's parents were not pleased to have him give up his dental profession, and really, why couldn't they hire another manager if their sales were so great?

 

I like Bubba and hope his operation is a success. He certainly has a nice family. I don't eat meat, but the boneless rib thing looks like a good idea, although the logistics of a far away co packer seems like it would be difficult to manage.

Edited May 2, 2015 by Kenz

[Saylii]

I didn't think this was as good as some of the 20/20 specials Shark Tank has had.

I couldn't understand why the dentist couldn't be a silent partner if Robert really didn't want to green light a manager. It seemed that most of the frustration from the other partner was that he couldn't make all the decisions on his own so he was spending a lot of time doing things twice: once when he was introduced to it and once when he was debriefing the dentist. I did agree with Robert that the drunk t-shirt designs wasn't really what the company stood for. My hipster friends would wear the Christmas sweaters, onesies, and flag shirts all day long. Wearing something that highlights their drunkenness would be seen as too white trash by them. I also kind of assume that's also what Robert was referring to by the cheaper price point as well.

I'm glad the water bottle guy is doing well, but that market is so saturated as is. I swear I've seen the major companies like Nalgene and Tervis come to market with similar bottles. I can't remember if he had a patent or not.

The rib thing was ridiculous. Daymond got Bubba all these POs, but couldn't get him a copacker? Or Bubba said thanks but no thanks to Daymond's choice and Daymond let him? Then Bubba miraculously finds the perfect copacker on his own within the new timeline Daymond required? I couldn't follow all the BS on that company. Something tells me this is the product everyone always wants follow up on because it sounds delicious, but they've done so poorly some justification has to be made other then the ribs sucks.

Edited May 2, 2015 by Saylii

[AuntieDiane6]

"Very pleased to see the nice Define bottle kid do well. His idea wasn't new or unique and I'm sure the ST bump helped a ton, but good for him."

Whenever I see products like these on Shark Tank, I IMMEDIATELY go to amazon to read the reviews. The big issue to me is that the bottle HAS TO BE TAKEN APART with some of the parts having to be HAND WASHED.

Someone pointed out that one of the filtering parts is SILICON and it gets MOLDY if it isn't washed and dried. That's a deal-breaker for me. I have a novelty sink drainer that's made of silicon. I hate it: the underside gets moldy if it's left in the sink more than 2 days!

Another reviewer said that, while the bottle will fit in a car cup holder, it is so tall that it easily tips over.

[starri]

I don't see what's so unique about the Define Bottle.  I see plenty of my classmates put cut-up fruit into a regular filtered water bottle  Seems a lot simpler than the multi-part Define.

 

I couldn't walk away from a practice I'd built for an ugly sweater business.  I would have either sold my interest to someone else or hired a manager and become a silent partner.

 

Bubba had a different definition of "market research" than I do.

[anonymiss]

This needed tighter editing. The Bubba segment dragged way too long. We knew he'd end up finding his copacker so there was no suspense. I don't know why he couldn't have just used the one Daymond supposedly set him up with before if what he said was true about their being able to handle the volume.

[seacliffsal]

Very interesting that Robert had a much better understanding of the Tipsy Elves brand that they did.  The designers were kind of floundering-let's make every kind of shirt/sweater that we can think of...rather than developing a brand that would be able to transition once this trend is gone.  Also, good point Robert on not trying to price at every price point as it lowers the original value of the sweaters.

 

I was surprised by how the teenage boy reacted to not getting deal.  It felt like nobody had ever told me no before.  I'm happy for him that he's doing well, but am not personally interested in the type of bottle he created.

[nottopbravo]

This show is nothing more than the Sharks advertising their previous investments (except for the water bottle kid).  And free advertising, to boot.

[basiltherat]

Why in heavens name would people spend all that money, time and effort to go to med school, dental school, law school, etc. and be making good money for their families and QUIT IT ALL to do a job that you barely need a HS diploma for?  If you are running a company, of course you need some knowledge, but why are al these people giving up dream jobs?

 

Ugly sweater dentist just needs to sell his interest in the company and go back to fixing teeth.

[retrograde]

Yeah, Tipsy Elves is pretty much only going to last as long as ironic clothing is popular. Then they're just left with yet another novelty t-shirt company, and honestly not a particularly good one. "Party like a patriot"? "I want you to beer me"? "Honesty hungover"? Those aren't even clever. 

[starri]

I was surprised by how the teenage boy reacted to not getting deal.  It felt like nobody had ever told me no before.  I'm happy for him that he's doing well, but am not personally interested in the type of bottle he created.

*cough*Special Snowflake*cough*

[raiderred1]

I'm looking forward to this show as well.  It just started here.  I'd rather my dentist have more than four or five hours of sleep before treating me, thank you very much.  I agree that their product being a seasonal one is a problem.  Also, it seems wearing ugly Christmas sweaters (and knowing full well they are ugly) has been a fad in recent years (maybe in part due to Jimmy Fallon and his segments on them during the holiday season), but I wonder how long that will last.

Damn I was thinking the same thing. 

 

I like Bubba and his family but no way would we eat that in Texas.  PLEASE do NOT put the sauce on it, PLEASE!  

 

I'm still shocked that "Tipsy Elves" got a deal and the name is horrible. What's the old saying, "Don't quit your day job."?

Edited May 3, 2015 by raiderred1

[saber5055]

I like Bubba and his family but no way would we eat that in Texas.  PLEASE do NOT put the sauce on it, PLEASE!

 

 

Actually, why couldn't two kinds of ribs be packed and sold, one with and one without sauce? Did no one think of this? Deciding to add sauce took up about one half of this entire show. Just pack and sell two products. Duh!

 

At least the snowflake kid told how he turned his rejection around to make it a positive, so that was a ... positive message. Heh.

 

I saw a reality show a while back where people had to man a booth in some street fair and sell Tipsy Elf sweaters to passers by. The person who got the most $ in sales won the contest.

Edited May 3, 2015 by saber5055

[Teddybear]

 

Yeah, Tipsy Elves is pretty much only going to last as long as ironic clothing is popular. Then they're just left with yet another novelty t-shirt company, and honestly not a particularly good one. "Party like a patriot"? "I want you to beer me"? "Honesty hungover"? Those aren't even clever.

I must admit though, "Bah Humpug" was really cute, if you're a pug lover.  

[starri]

Didn't Robert make some comment about Tipsy Elves being the most profitable company in his portfolio?

 

Maybe I's just being a jerk, but that say less about Tipsy Elves and more about his portfolio to me.

[retrograde]

I assumed he meant his Shark Tank portfolio.

[starri]

I realize that, but even so...

[candall]

". . . before America's attention inevitably wanders elsewhere."

Too late--mine's already wandered. ("Intervention." It's back!) But a whole hour of self-congratulatory back patting sounds terrible. A followup on the investments that were less successful, and why, would have been so much more informative, and therefore interesting.

[nobodyyoucare]

Didn't Robert make some comment about Tipsy Elves being the most profitable company in his portfolio?

 

Maybe I's just being a jerk, but that say less about Tipsy Elves and more about his portfolio to me.

100,000 in funding from Robert and Tipsy Elves had a revenue of 12 mill in 2014. So in one year that was a huge payoff in investment. Now revenue doesn't mean profit but even at the low end Robert could have easily made several times his investment in one year. 

 

Robert said Tipsy Elves was his best performing investment on Shark Tank. Now that could mean most profitable or the one that has done the best to make the profit in the amount of time and energy he has put in. 

 

http://www.businessinsider.com/shark-tank-investor-robert-herjavec-interview-2014-10

From 600k in Sales to 12 million in sales since he came on board. 

Edited May 3, 2015 by nobodyyoucare

[saber5055]

But a whole hour of self-congratulatory back patting sounds terrible. A followup on the investments that were less successful, and why, would have been so much more informative, and therefore interesting.

 

 

More interesting to us, yes, but showing failures would make the Sharks look pretty dopey, that they invested in things that tanked and they lost bundles. ST wants us to believe every investment is a great one and the Sharks are wiser than any of us. (Which they are, but still ...)

 

I know so many products quadruple sales just from being on ST. But it's interesting to me to see stuff behind the scenes as I wonder how any Shark has enough time to be personal with all the investments he/she has made on ST along with "regular" business investments. It was interesting that Robert said he had to hire a team to handle his ST investments.

[Dots And Stripes]

I think the show tried to give us a variety of outcomes. Tipsy Elves was the successful deal, Define Bottle was the success without a deal, and Bubba was the deal still struggling to figure it out. I actually think this show might be more entertaining if they picked a theme for the week. It felt disjointed this week very shallow. 

 

I think Mark once alluded to the toy renting business going under quickly. I guess they could do a follow-up like that on one of these shows, but I could see why no one would be thrilled to participate in a follow up like that.

 

I was also surprised to here Tipsy Elves was Robert's most successful Shark Tank investment, but then again, Robert tends to get passed over a lot. He's not often singled out by entrepreneurs as the shark they really want.

 

Also, maybe I wasn't paying enough attention, but did they say if either Tipsy Elf guy is a designer? It seems strange to me to focus on this as a design company while the brains behind it don't seem to be designers. I agree with everyone who thinks this is a trend, but maybe these guys will be able to transition to something more sustainable.

[kiddo82]

What irritates me is that the initial premise of the whole thing was to FIND the ugly sweater/shirt in your Grandmother's or Aunt's closet or a thrift store. To deliberately produce one completely misses the point.

That's pretty much what I yell at my TV every time we get a Tipsy Elves update. It shocks me that they are doing so well. I mean, good for them, and it doesn't matter *why* people are purchasing the product, but it does miss the point. The idea is to wear something tacky, not to drop $60 on something "cool."

I felt bad for the endodontist. I understand Robert wanting him to work full time with the company but I thought "Maybe he just likes being an endodontist." That's a very specific thing to go to school for and a lot of work just to walk away from. But I've also never been a partner in a business worth 12 million dollars so what do I know?

[saber5055]

Also, maybe I wasn't paying enough attention, but did they say if either Tipsy Elf guy is a designer? It seems strange to me to focus on this as a design company while the brains behind it don't seem to be designers. 

 

 

That's a good point. One guy was the dentist, but did his partner have a previous occupation? I also wondered who the women were who were shown. Maybe they were wives; if so, I missed it. Maybe the women were the artists/designers? Someone has to create the pictures on the sweaters, but then again, maybe the non-dentist partner does it?

[nobodyyoucare]

Actually, why couldn't two kinds of ribs be packed and sold, one with and one without sauce? Did no one think of this? Deciding to add sauce took up about one half of this entire show. Just pack and sell two products. Duh!

 

At least the snowflake kid told how he turned his rejection around to make it a positive, so that was a ... positive message. Heh.

 

I saw a reality show a while back where people had to man a booth in some street fair and sell Tipsy Elf sweaters to passers by. The person who got the most $ in sales won the contest.

 

Two skus means double the work involved. Its two different products not one that has to be put on shelves, advertising, manufacturing etc. 

Why in heavens name would people spend all that money, time and effort to go to med school, dental school, law school, etc. and be making good money for their families and QUIT IT ALL to do a job that you barely need a HS diploma for?  If you are running a company, of course you need some knowledge, but why are al these people giving up dream jobs?

 

Ugly sweater dentist just needs to sell his interest in the company and go back to fixing teeth.

Sometimes their family forced them down the path and when they see the opportunity to do something else they do it. Often times is the occupation they thought was for them wasn't because they didn't see that it involved a lot of work. If you don't like working at your job then it can slowly kill you. Not talking about the soul but it can manifest ill health and death. 

 

 

think Mark once alluded to the toy renting business going under quickly. I guess they could do a follow-up like that on one of these shows, but I could see why no one would be thrilled to participate in a follow up like that.

It would be hard to be televised.  The whole thing has been written about before and how Cuban tried to save it. 

[UsernameFatigue]

That's a good point. One guy was the dentist, but did his partner have a previous occupation?

 

The partner who was working at the business full time was a lawyer. I agree to a point that the dentist was crazy to give up his practice, but that isn't to say that either he or his partner could not go back to being an endodontist and lawyer if the business eventually fizzles out. OTTH, I wonder what their families think? Friends of ours have a son who has just graduated as an edodontist and his 10 years of university has cost them many hundreds of thousands of dollars. I doubt they would be too thrilled if their son told them he was giving up his profession to sell tacky sweaters. Tacky xmas sweater parties are still popular where I live with the 20s and 30s aged crowd, so I could see that when you run out of your relatives tacky sweaters you would need to find another source. In fact hubby and I saw the "Birthday Boy" sweater in a store here before xmas - it is the one with the picture of Jesus in a party hat and holding a balloon.  I thought it was hilarious and would have bought it for my nephew in law (who goes to at least on tacky xmas sweater party a season) but they didn't have his size left.

Edited May 3, 2015 by UsernameFatigue

[Shibori]

Doctor/dentist/lawyer doesn't automatically equal wealth and/or happiness. I left a lucrative job as a lawyer for a huge oil and gas company because it was soul-sucking misery. My law school roommate has his dream job as an Assistant DA in a big city, but still has to bartend to make ends meet and he's hardly living extravagantly. Law Clerks for judges in my area need a JD and make from $18-35k. Lots of lawyers can't find jobs, and many would be thrilled to make $40-50k a year, while law schools keep cranking out new grads. Doctors need a minimum of 10 years of education after high school with college, med school, and residency and lots of student loans, while private practices are disappearing as more and more docs work for huge hospitals because the costs and risks of running a practice are becoming prohibitive. There are lots of legit reasons why someone would walk away from one of these professions.

[saber5055]

Two skus means double the work involved. Its two different products not one that has to be put on shelves, advertising, manufacturing etc.

 

 

That meat packing worker was just squirting BBQ sauce on the ribs before it went into the plastic wrap. So, pack a bunch w/o doing the sauce squirt. Two skus means two different products AND two lucrative sources of income. It would be a win-win. Advertising wouldn't be hard ... "Buy our ribs the way you like 'em, with or without sauce!" and ... DONE.

 

The dentist guy did say he like doing dental work. It would be hard to leave a secure job one liked, but then again, it's a profession that, if you kept up your boards and continuing education, one could go back to when the sweaters get old, or the company sells for billions. Then he could do root canals to keep from getting bored while being filthy rich.

[Dots And Stripes]

That's a good point. One guy was the dentist, but did his partner have a previous occupation? I also wondered who the women were who were shown. Maybe they were wives; if so, I missed it. Maybe the women were the artists/designers? Someone has to create the pictures on the sweaters, but then again, maybe the non-dentist partner does it?

He was a lawyer. He could be a lawyer with design talent, but I would want something more than talent to base a multi-million dollar business on. I got the sense both guys were really more idea guys than artists themselves. I did assume at least one of the women was a designer. I think part of the problem with the format is we weren't with any of the businesses long enough to get to know the support team at all.

[needschocolate]

I forgot this was on and tuned in half way through - so I only ended up seeing the rib guy.  I am glad to see that there were 3 stories, I figured there were only two.  I wasn't impressed with the rib story - it went on too long and I wasn't interested in what happens to Bubba. Also, it seemed too staged or reenacted - like they had him re-do meetings so they could have them on tape.  

 

I will give the show another try, but I have a feeling that, unless I remember the products well and am interested in how they turned out, I won't be a loyal viewer.  And off the top of my head, I can't think of any product that I thought "Hmm, I wonder how well they are doing?"  

 

Actually, why couldn't two kinds of ribs be packed and sold, one with and one without sauce? Did no one think of this? Deciding to add sauce took up about one half of this entire show. Just pack and sell two products. Duh!

 

I thought they should just package the sauce separately - just put a plastic bag of sauce in the box with the ribs.  That way, people could heat with or without sauce or could use the sauce for dipping.  

[saber5055]

I thought they should just package the sauce separately - just put a plastic bag of sauce in the box with the ribs.  That way, people could heat with or without sauce or could use the sauce for dipping.

 

 

Great idea! Why didn't Bubba or Damon think of that? For St. Patrick's Day I bought corned beef that came with a Guinness packet so one could cook some really Irish corned beef if they so desired. So, it's def workable and makes perfect sense.

 

But then the Bubba part of this show would have only been maybe five minutes, so there's that.

[NikSac]

I will give the show another try, but I have a feeling that, unless I remember the products well and am interested in how they turned out, I won't be a loyal viewer.  And off the top of my head, I can't think of any product that I thought "Hmm, I wonder how well they are doing?" 

 

Same here. And I've found I'm more interested in how the product's being received as opposed to how the entrepreneurs are doing (guess I'm not a Shark!).  I'm way more inclined to hit Amazon or another site that has reviews to see how many have sold and what the reviews are like.

[Kel Varnsen]

Yeah, Tipsy Elves is pretty much only going to last as long as ironic clothing is popular. Then they're just left with yet another novelty t-shirt company, and honestly not a particularly good one. "Party like a patriot"? "I want you to beer me"? "Honesty hungover"? Those aren't even clever. 

Yea I didn't really get that either. I mean sure the sweaters are a tiny bit different. But shirts with goofy slogans or pictures on them? It seems like every website I go to has a banner ad for some site selling shirts like that. Not to mention places like Walmart and Old Navy. What makes these guys stand out in the shirt business? Because it didn't look like their designs were any better.

 

As far as the bottle guys thing goes, why do you need a two chamber bottle. Why not just have a regular bottle and put fruit in that? What am I missing?

[nobodyyoucare]

Yea I didn't really get that either. I mean sure the sweaters are a tiny bit different. But shirts with goofy slogans or pictures on them? It seems like every website I go to has a banner ad for some site selling shirts like that. Not to mention places like Walmart and Old Navy. What makes these guys stand out in the shirt business? Because it didn't look like their designs were any better.

 

As far as the bottle guys thing goes, why do you need a two chamber bottle. Why not just have a regular bottle and put fruit in that? What am I missing?

The whole thing is that the water is infused by the fruit meaning has the taste/color. You add the fruit to these bottles and have it sit overnight with the water. These infuser bottle designs have a filter to keep the fruit parts beyond a certain size out of the water.  Basically infused water is a fad. 

[LeGrandElephant]

I didn't mind the 15 year old saying it was depressing to get rejected. But I did think that if you want a six year old to stop drinking soda, it should be fairly easy to stop providing him with soda. You don't need to invent a whole fancy other way of drinking water.

Whenever I see those bottles it seems like a waste of fruit. I would just eat the fruit and drink the water. But I guess that's just me...

Edited May 6, 2015 by LeGrandElephant

[LeGrandElephant]

Also, while *I* am always horrified and stressed out when people say they've sunk all their savings and their parents mortgage into a company that might fail, usually the Sharks applaud people for being "all in". So why were they so against that kid for that? I guess I don't remember his original segment very well.

[nobodyyoucare]

Also, while *I* am always horrified and stressed out when people say they've sunk all their savings and their parents mortgage into a company that might fail, usually the Sharks applaud people for being "all in". So why were they so against that kid for that? I guess I don't remember his original segment very well.

It depends upon what the person has done with that money, how much they have made doing it, the nature of the product etc. The fruit infuser is just one of many such products on the market. So him spending 300,000 on it made him look like he lost his parents house on a foolish product due to the amount of sales he had at that point. 

[starri]

The kid is from my hometown.  I'm going to bet that his parents had a McMansion with enough equity that $300K wasn't really a burden, it was just a convenient way to pull a mass of cash to give Jr the opportunity to pad his resume for his Ivy League applications.

 

Yes, I'm cynical, but I also think I'm right.

[Quickbeam]

I am amazed that the Tipsy Elves business makes a dime. Even the civilians in my office gave up Ugly Sweater competitions last year. Put a fork in it, done.

[bilgistic]

Bunky1412, I have a friend who, along with her father, made fun of me for washing farmer's market vegetables we'd bought before we roasted them at her house. Can you imagine not washing produce before you eat it?! I was disgusted.