S14.E25: Top Six Perform

[backformore]

Sherry 67: think that some of the singers are lacking, but I love what Harry has brought to the show in terms of judging.  He has actually toned down some of his 'technical speak' since last season, and I really wish he could just say what he truly thinks because he has some very interesting, specific comments that I feel are needed on this show.  But, someone must have gotten to him and told him that America doesn't like it when he shows his musical knowledge, and now he is often too nice and more complimentary than I feel he wants to be.    In fact, sometimes I think that Harry will get exhausted with having to edit some of his critiques to be too flattering and nice, and will end up leaving the show because he can't truly say what he wants to say.

 

Right.  Sometimes Harry seems like he's being forced into being the kindergarten teacher who says "  you got all the answers wrong, but look at how nicely you wrote your name on the page!  good job!!!"

[Padma]

I was surprised by his candor to Clark regarding his piano playing which everyone is apparently supposed to find so impressive. Yes, he said, "You're the only musician here" or something like that. But he also told him to stop playing the same boring, predictable chords and thinking it was "good enough". And I never get tired of him telling various ones who are left to "figure out how to sing on key, because I know you can do it." That is such a diss to me, but delivered in the middle of lots of praise as if its supposed to disquise it. (Sorry, but if you can't sing on key, I don't really think you deserve to be a finalist in a singing competition). I don't always agree with Harry, but I -do- enjoy when he calls it like it is regarding their -actual- level of musical knowledge and skill.

[Shannon L.]

I haven't felt compelled to comment on the last couple of shows, but, after last night's show, I had to say something.  I don't know what to think about the Quentin/Harry moment.  I thought they were both wrong, but what really bothered me was the look on Quentin's face when he walked up to Harry.  He looked so angry, I gasped and held my breath for a minute.  Not that I thought it would get really bad, but maybe bad enough.

 

That said, I agree with Harry that Quentin's performance wasn't all that.  I even said, partway through, that the band was running away with it.  Then, when Harry said something like "You need to push the band, don't let them push you", I had to nod in agreement.  It was nice to hear him sing something fast for a change, but he didn't come close to the raw, edgy, sexiness that is Lenny Kravitz when he sings that song.  I  think that Harry truly does want to help these kids and would be fantastic as a mentor.  But, since he's a judge, he has a limited amount of time to critique them and give advice and sometimes it comes out sounding a bit snobby.

 

One thing I noticed was that most of them did the songs pretty much straight with very few changes to "make them their own" (not that I'm complaining-I've never cared if they sang it straight as long as it's good).  The only ones I can remember this morning are Nick and Joey's second songs.  Speaking of Nick:  I think those two songs were his best performances so far. 

Edited April 16, 2015 by Shannon L.

[Foghorn Leghorn]

And when Harry was talking about pitch and saying I know you can do it and I forget to who the camera panned to Scott who was looking bewildered, can someone buy him a clue or has auto tune tuned these experts out?  In all of these mentor sessions none of these contestants appears to have ever sung off key so they go forth thinking they sound spot on and get told fix your pitch over and over?!  Seriously why isn't the pitch ever fixed?  What is the purpose of those ear things they wear that take over their heads.  I don't remember the contestants wearing them in the early days of Idol?  

[tobeannounced]

Re Quentin-gate, I started getting uncomfortable when they panned to Quentin during Harry's critique.  He looked PISSED that he wasn't getting a tongue bath.  I get so annoyed at these shows that they just blow kisses at these contestants.  I find Harry a breath of fresh air.  I guess we now know why he (and they) can't give more detailed, constructive critiques - the little ones would crumple up into a ball and die. 

[bluedevilblue]

If I ran a record company, I'd sign Tyanna and leave the rest of these kids behind. She has amazing natural talent and some spark to her. She's raw and uneven, but there aren't a lot of people out there with those kinds of pipes and she's really poised for 16. Some of the others can sing, like Clark, but I'm not sure any of the rest of them actually have the potential to be a huge star. I think in 5 years with the right material and mentoring/training, Tyanna could be very successful and you can't teach someone to sing like that.

[limecoke]

I thought Quentin was showing attitude before he ever took the stage.  He was very obviously pissed before performing and after.  Perhaps Harry shouldn't have gone off on him but Q was reeking attitude during his critique - I really can't remember seeing a contestant look quite that annoyed.  In the end, Harry was right - someone goes home every week so that information is hardly a news flash to Quentin and they are darn lucky to be picked for the show in the first place.  Show some humility. He's got a weird attitude and it puts me off his singing.  Anyway, times have changed so I'm not convinced he will go home next week.  

 

Listening to Joey sing "My Funny Valentine" made me run off to the Tube of You and watch, once again, Melinda Doolittle's superb performance of that song.  I also listened to the critiques of the original judges and, wow, it made me miss them.  Poor Joey.  Rayvon nailed "Always on My Mind" and her "Somebody to Loaf (sic)" was pretty bad.  She wasn't my favorite but I wish her well.

 

Regarding "Moon River."  Written for the movie, "Breakfast at Tiffany's" and in later years recorded by nearly everyone and his dog, including Frank Sinatra.  However, I believe that AI was wrong in attributing the song to Sinatra.  The definitive performance of "Moon River" was by Andy Williams.  Not only is the vocal usually attributed to him, it became the theme song for his television show and his Branson, MO venue is called The Moon River Theatre.  Frank Sinatra was only one of a zillion who covered it and included it on albums.  

 

Clark and Tyanna were the best of the night for me.  Jax is beyond irritating but I think she's going to make the finals.  I like Nick, I really do, but that dead animal pelt sitting on top of a shaved head look is just not good.  

 

To be clear...my comments are about the vocal version/s of "Moon River" as written by Mercer/Mancini for "Breakfast at Tiffany's."  Vocal reality shows NEVER credit composers or lyricists and I felt they were wrong in crediting Sinatra with the definitive VOCAL version.  My intent was never to take away from Mercer/Mancini.  There.

Edited April 17, 2015 by limecoke

[BogoGog24]

As a musician myself, I can't exactly blame contestants for looking sad or disappointed when they aren't given positive remarks. Imagine working hard on something for a whole week, and thinking you did really well, and then having your ass handed to you in front of millions on live TV. I don't think I'd be all smiles and rainbows either. Of course, some of them take the criticism better than others. Some just smile awkwardly and say "Ok, thank you." Constructive criticism is at least something they can use and that's the part of it they should focus on. The rest is just somebody's opinion, the judges aren't voting so it's not like what they have to say really matters. The judges should only be taken seriously in the sense they're in the business and know what they're talking about, otherwise I'd take what they have to say with a grain of salt. Maybe if the contestants didn't take them so seriously, they'd be less disappointed when they get a negative review. There are all kinds of opinions out there besides just what the judges think.

I'm also sick of Harry constantly harping about the judging thing. Go back to being a mentor then if that is what you want to do. You're not obligated to take that million dollar salary if judging doesn't cut it for you.

By the way, I've heard all or nearly all the contestants say they like and respect that Harry gives honest and nit picky criticisms because it helps them do better. They actually said they wouldn't want him to just say "Yeah that was great" every week because it wouldn't help them improve at all.

Edited April 16, 2015 by BogoGog24

[Lonesome Rhodes]

The very first rule of performance is to honor your audience.  It's a lesson handed down through the generations.  It's a warning and a reminder to check your egos off stage and to humble yourself in service to the folks who took the time and paid out hard cash to see you at your best.  Q, whether he had a clue he was doing so or not (perhaps he was never taught?) gave a metaphorical middle finger to the voting audience with his comment.  Even if we take him at his word and put such in its best light, he was angrily criticizing the audience's taste.  That, my friends, is a major Bozo no-no.

 

I agree it is ridiculous of AI to assign random artists to song title graphics.  Originally, it was supposed to signify that the contestant was going to mimic that particular version of the tune.  That ended a long time ago.  

[Shannon L.]

Speaking of the songs:  Did I miss the part where Ryan explained how the contestants got the songs?  I know Twitter users listed their favorite American Classics, but after that, did TPTB create a list of ones they liked and could afford rights to and have the kids choose?  Or did they assign songs to each one? 

[Trooper York]

The problem is that Harry has been co-opted by the Idol machine. They have obviously told him that the audience and the contestants don't want to hear technical information. They revel in their ignorance.

 

Thus.....J-Lo.

[The Real Chon]

In wading through the comments, several very good points have been made regarding Quentin's outburst, so my redundancy should be forgiven.

In short, Quentin was acting like a petulant, entitled ass, regardless of whether he meant to speak on the judging of the panel or the judging of the voters. Harry, who is a seasoned professional who has paid his dues, was right to tell him he was acting the petulant, entitled ass. Harry's position as a paid judge is even more of a reason for him to call out Quentin, not less of one. Quentin's immaturity was never more evident than when he went to square off with Harry.

Friendships are nice and all, but music is a business -- albeit one that's based on subjectivity. If you piss off the fan base, you don't sell records. If you piss off the band, they'll make you look sad. If you piss off the executives and the professionals, you don't get to make music at any level, except maybe on your own Sound Cloud channel.

Quentin is just a passenger on that train. When he's driving it, then he can make distinctions on what is wack.

Edited April 16, 2015 by The Real Chon

[backformore]

Thus.....J-Lo.

 

yeah, J Lo yelling out the "I love you"  to her fave contestants strikes me as wrong.  With Quentin, it seems she is pre-disposed to give a positive judgement before he even opens his mouth. And she's really more about his looks, wardrobe, attitude, posturing, than about his vocal talent.  

 

the top 5 are touring?   to me, that means the top 5 are being decided and discussed by TPTB to get the best mix of contestants for a successful tour. 

[ari333]

Based on the camera angle (w-a-a-y at the back of the theater) it certainly looked like they were ready to cut to commercial. I can just imagine the director and assistant directors all furiously going "Don't cut! Don't cut! Send Quentin back out there! We finally got a watercooler moment from this dull crew!"

I thought "creamy" was meant to be the water oooler word, but Quentin out-did creamy heh.

[riley702]

I have to confess, I can't stand "Moon River". Too old-fashioned for me, although there are other old songs I quite like, but this isn't one of them. Here's an old song I like (written mid 1800s):

 

 

I find Rayvon and Clark technically good, but very boring singers. There's a spark missing there.

 

When Quentin walked over to the judges table I 100% for sure thought he was going to say, "ok then, I'm out" and just keep on walking.

I love Quentin, regardless, but that would have been just fabulous.

Really, it would have! He's been on the show long enough to take that exposure and run with it. He would have gotten quite the publicity over it, too, and it would have been true to his "just telling it like it is" persona.

 

I have little to no filter, myself, but know enough to spin it as both my greatest strength and my greatest weakness.

Edited April 16, 2015 by riley702

[rereader2]

Regarding "Moon River."  Written for the movie, "Breakfast at Tiffany's" and in later years recorded by nearly everyone and his dog, including Frank Sinatra.  However, I believe that AI was wrong in attributing the song to Sinatra.  The definitive performance of "Moon River" was by Andy Williams.  Not only is the vocal usually attributed to him, it became the theme song for his television show and his Branson, MO venue is called The Moon River Theatre.  Frank Sinatra was only one of a zillion who covered it and included it on albums.  

 

The credit for the (Oscar- and Grammy-winning) song "Moon River" goes to the composer, Henry Mancini (you heard me!) and the lyricist Johnny Mercer. Without them, no singer would have been able to interpret it. It's a great song, and I've been humming it all day, but Harry was right--the arrangement was a bit piano-bar-ish.

 

And speaking of which--it seemed to me that Harry was super-frustrated last night at not being able to get into a nice, long, try-it-this-way, try-it-that-way discussion with both Joey and Clark, the way he's probably used to doing in jazz jam-sessions. I think that also is the reason for his "musician" comment--those two are the only two that could be considered to be near his musical wheelhouse, and he probably figured that Joey was going home since Rayvon seems impossible to out-tweet.

[Waldo13]

What Harry was talking about was Idol spending money for him to be their is strictly production costs. The only compensation and I mean the only compensation the contestant receives is for doing the tour. The compensation is around 100K.

This year only 5 will get paid. I guess you can consider exposure,to the masses, as compensation. Sort of like product placement.

Harry was absolutly right to consider Q's words as an attack on AI. I'm sure someone clued him in to back peddle his remarks. If anyone thinks that Harry was harsh on him, what do you think that Simon would have done to him. I couldn't imagine Simon having one good word during his comments. As for JLo defending him or giving him some praise, JLo has never met a top 10 male contestent she didn't like. As for the females, you never hear her say that they give her the goosies nor out and our praise.

Edited April 16, 2015 by Waldo13

[backformore]

, JLo has never met a top 10 male contestent she didn't like. As for the females, you never hear her say that they give her the goosies nor out and our praise.

 

JLo and Quentin gives me the Paula Abdul/Corey Clark vibe.  She's just too invested in him. 

[rereader2]

What Harry was talking about was Idol spending money for him to be their is strictly production costs. The only compensation and I mean the only compensation the contestant receives is for doing the tour. The compensation is around 100K.

 

I'm pretty sure that, by law, reality show contestants have to join SAG and they get scale. Granted, that's not much, but it is compensation.

 

They also get free vocal coaching and music arranging, and they used to get a "costume" budget and a stylist to help them choose their outfits. (I'm not sure whether that last is still a thing.)

Edited April 16, 2015 by rereader2

[BogoGog24]

What Harry was talking about was Idol spending money for him to be their is strictly production costs. The only compensation and I mean the only compensation the contestant receives is for doing the tour. The compensation is around 100K.

This year only 5 will get paid. I guess you can consider exposure,to the masses, as compensation. Sort of like product placement.

Harry was absolutly right to consider Q's words as an attack on AI. I'm sure someone clued him in to back peddle his remarks. If anyone thinks that Harry was harsh on him, what do you think that Simon would have done to him. I couldn't imagine Simon having one good word during his comments. As for JLo defending him or giving him some praise, JLo has never met a top 10 male contestent she didn't like. As for the females, you never hear her say that they give her the goosies nor out and our praise.

 

JLo kissed Jena on the cheek last season after her performance of "Can't Help Falling In Love."

 

While Quentin was probably most close with Joey and Rayvon, I suspect he'd have been upset no matter who was in the bottom, not that he was mad it was them specifically or that he was disrespecting the choice made by America. Maybe people do not understand what "whack" means? I think all he really meant is that he was sad and upset to see 2 of his closest friends in the bottom. I'm sure if anyone else had been in the bottom, he'd probably have felt the same way, but maybe not as upset if they weren't as close. I didn't take his comments as to meaning he thought the bottom 2 should have been different, just that he was disappointed his friends were in it. 

 

I don't know for sure, but I think America tweeted song choices and TPTB probably chose the ones they could get cleared and made a short list for the contestants to choose from, not that they were specifically assigned those songs. It's been referenced quite a lot in the post-show interviews that the contestants are choosing from rather short lists this year. That would explain a lot of the uninspired song choices, or why they are choosing themes like American Classics.

[Guest]

Maybe instead of "this whole thing is wack" he could've picked an actual word, something that wouldn't get misinterpreted.  Urban dictionary defines 'wack' as 'lame, sorry ass, not even legit'. 

 

"This whole thing is difficult for me."  Two totally different meanings. 

 

They absolutely are not unpaid. 

http://www.foxbusiness.com/personal-finance/2012/03/01/cost-being-on-american-idol/

Edited April 17, 2015 by Guest

[Waldo13]

Maybe instead of "this whole thing is wack" he could've picked an actual word, something that wouldn't get misinterpreted. Urban dictionary defines 'wack' as 'lame, sorry ass, not even legit'.

"This whole thing is difficult for me." Two totally different meanings.

They absolutely are not unpaid.

http://www.foxbusiness.com/personal-finance/2012/03/01/cost-being-on-american-idol/

I stand corrected about Idols being paid but I had it on good authority that there was no payment thru season 5. I forgot about the Jena kiss but those moments are few and far between. IMO Jessica should have gotten the kiss instead of Jena.

[AndreaK1041]

Listening to Jax mew and purr her way through Janis Joplin made me want to scream. Her shtick rubs me seriously wrong.

[Guest]

I have no idea who runs this site but it also includes about the same compensation info. 

 

http://americanidolnet.com/american-idol-faq/

[BogoGog24]

Whack can also just mean "crazy." As if Urban Dictionary is really the greatest source.

[SmallTownMom]

I really don't care for any of the contestants this season.  By now, I have clear favorites, this season, I just think they are OK from week to week. 

 

I don't blame Harry for being annoyed at Quentin.  Why does everybody piss and moan about somebody going home?  It's a competition, somebody is going home every week.  Isn't that why you are there?  To compete?  So to say it's "whack" is stupid.  That ranks right up there with somebody who gave a bad performance saying "I had fun."  I don't tune in to see if you had fun, I watch to see good performances, hopefully.  The fact that you had fun has nothing to do with anything.

 

I like Harry.  I think he is a good judge.  Jennifer just wants to hand everybody lollipops and not hurt anybody's feelings.  You are a judge, act like one.  Quit squeeing like some little teenybopper fangirl, and give some real advice.  And for God's sake, can we keep the camera off Jennifer while people are performing?!?!? The way she acts when any of the guys are performing is embarrassing.  Act your age.

[howmanywords]

Joey seems like a perfectly nice girl but I cant say I'm sad to see her go.  I get that she's considered "unique" but the tone of her voice I never liked and for me it was bordering on unpleasant.   Rayvon may be boring but if I were actually participating in this Twitter save stuff I would have probably voted for him too. I thought he sounded gorgeous last night

 

As for Quentin/Harry..well I'm in the camp that thinks they were both wrong but Quentin should have never approached the judges table. He did look pissed.  And I'm sure all of them are bummed to see their friends in the bottom every week and when someone has to go. All I kept thinking when Quentin expressed his anger about the wrong bottom two, I was like "ok, well wanna change spots with your BFF if youre that sad for her?"

Last night's show was terrible, this is my last year watching and this season will end sooner for me if it is not Clark/Tyanna in the final two.     

Yes these two remain the only ones I care much about. Clark isnt the most engaging performer but his voice is the ones that makes me feel something and I think hes just adorable.  I started following him on Instagram last week and he actually does have a personality and comes across as a typical young guy, especially in some of the videos he posts. I'm not convinced Tyanna has the kind of fanbase to get all the way to final 2 but I'll keep voting. 

[rereader2]

They absolutely are not unpaid. 

http://www.foxbusiness.com/personal-finance/2012/03/01/cost-being-on-american-idol/

 

Ah! AFTRA, not SAG. (Interesting article altogether, thanks for the link!)

[TheGreenKnight]

I loved Joey and don't really care about anyone now, except maybe Tyanna. I am in the minority, but I can't stand Clark.  He's extremely boring and I find him creepy looking, like a Stepford Singer.

I agree about Clark. You know, what confuses me is how some people find Rayvon boring, but find Clark to be a revelation. To me, they are both boring, but great technically in an old-fashioned style. The only real difference to me is that Rayvon never pushes his voice too far for a screechy out-of-range note like Clark does.

 

I never liked Joey, but I find Nick and Jax to be just as bad as she is and even less likable (as far as personality goes).

 

In regards to the Quentin-Harry thing, I do blame Ryan as much as Harry, actually. Ryan has always been a drama-stirrer when it comes to the contestants. I remember how, when some red-headed guy a few seasons was on the verge of tears, Ryan wouldn't leave him alone until he had a creepy meltdown on stage. I believe Ryan is encouraged to do this by the show to get media attention--something the show especially can't get any other way these days. The last time the show received attention for a contestant's singing was Candice Glover's "Lovesong."

 

While on the topic, I just have to say that Harry Connick, Jr. always finding a way to criticize Quentin and--well--every other contestant for having bad pitch/not being a real artist just makes me think, um, you picked this group, right??? If anything, it shows that Harry criticizing the group of girls on Mariah's year (who are the last talented top 4 this show will see, imo) is just another example of his need to nitpick and feel superior. The contestants he found this year and the last more than show he and JLO are even worse at this job than they were, and it's not as if he or JLO sing much better than this lot anyway. The judges get paid millions more than the contestants do to act as rude and arrogant as Harry did. So much for his pretension that he's trying to be some kind of "mentor" and not a "judge."  I hope the show gets cancelled after this year or at least all the judges get fired and re-hire Simon for the last season.

 

 

I felt for Jennifer, she was clearly trying to smooth it over for Quentin but the damage was done. Ryan and Harry's further comments escalated it and made Quentin look more like the angry black man, when I think a lot of the audience could see that his initial comments came from frustration.

corgi shade: This is the one and only time I will say I liked JLO--although I know she wouldn't have said anything that nice for a female contestant in the same position. Ryan saying, "I thought you were going to hit him" definitely helped to push the audience into seeing Quentin as that stereotype.

 

 

I wish Quentin had pointed out to HCJ that he is being paid a shitload of money to judge, and that he should never say (ad nauseum) to contestants along the way who are cut by the judges that this is so hard for them. If it is so hard for him as a judge then he should not be there as it is part of judging on a show where only one person will win and others get elimated every week. And the majority are cut by the judges. Pot. Kettle. Black.

*clap* I completely agree, UsernameFatigue.

Edited April 17, 2015 by TheGreenKnight

[Stratego]

I wish to remind the readers that Ryan actually started everything.  Recall that he was pulling some "bleacher-style" seats which were on casters, and he remarked (as close as I can recall) "Quentin did so much 'staging' that I had to move [this]...". Then, Ryan got in Quentin's face and started with "his questions" to Quentin.  I believe this was scripted (though unknown to Quentin) designed to get "this type of reaction".

[Padma]

I don't think it was scripted, but I think Ryan is generally an ass. He is sweet and nice when it serves the drama and he doesn't mind humiliating contestants if that works, too. I don't find Quentin at all likable (from what we see) and his angry and surly look didn't help. But Ryan could have/should have left him alone. But he doesn't get the (really) big bucks because of his compassion. He gets it because he's willing to do what it takes to create suspense and dramatic moments, even if it is at the young singers expense.

 

I thought some of the old time eliminations were even more humiliating than the "chairs" and Ryan didn't bat an eye about how anyone felt. He's cold and a phony, and its just funny how all the arguments are over Harry v. Quentin with Ryan skating by like the little kid who instigated it all, but no one* noticed..

 

*ETA: I meant no one in the media. Here, of course, someone notices everything! 

Edited April 17, 2015 by Padma

[UsernameFatigue]

Actually several posters, myself included pointed out that if Ryan had left Quentin alone after he first asked how he was and Quentin said "I'm fine," none of this would have happened.

Edited April 17, 2015 by UsernameFatigue

[sinkwriter]

 

That said, I agree with Harry that Quentin's performance wasn't all that.  I even said, partway through, that the band was running away with it.  Then, when Harry said something like "You need to push the band, don't let them push you", I had to nod in agreement.  It was nice to hear him sing something fast for a change, but he didn't come close to the raw, edgy, sexiness that is Lenny Kravitz when he sings that song.

 

I'm with you on this, big time. 

 

I don't watch this show with any sort of regularity, but came in to watch Quentin's performance because I heard he was doing a Lenny Kravitz song and I love that song. However, I think Harry was spot on with his critique. Quentin didn't seem to have any stage presence during that song whatsoever. In fact, during most of it he was kind of expressionless and just seemed to be walking very slowly and posing a bit. No real energy or edginess. No passion for me to connect to as a viewer. So when Harry pointed out that Quentin sang it just fine but that the band rocking out on the song pretty much overshadowed him, I found myself nodding vigorously in agreement. The guy just didn't seem to do much of anything with the song. And if he's not going to inject some personality into it in order to carry the song, then he's got to find a way to make the song different and make it his own, or it's like he's just singing karaoke in a bar, not rocking out in a concert arena. Actually, I've seen more personality out of people singing their hearts out in karaoke bars that I saw out of Quentin, LOL.

 

I have no major opinion about Quentin's argument with Harry, though. As an unbiased viewer who'd never laid eyes on Quentin before (and therefore had no preconceived notions about him as a person), to me Quentin came off as sullen (and like he wasn't taking the time to think out what he said before he said it), and Harry seemed matter-of-fact, not angry, so... *shrug* I didn't see anything wrong with Harry's comments. It's a competition, dude. Tell your friends privately that you think it sucks that they had to go home. 

Personally I think Ryan should have not pushed Quentin in the first place. That's what started everything. He kept pushing the kid to say something. And then he had to backpedal when his pushing made a mess.

[MsTree]

Quentin's an ass and Ryan's no better.  I don't think Ryan should have allowed Quentin to get up into Harry's face. The asshole could have said whatever he had to say from the stage (next to Ryan).

[karenc3]

I agree a big part of what happened with Quentin was Ryan's fault. He kept asking what's wrong, and Quentin even said he was ok at first, but Ryan kept pushing.  And I thought Harry was wrong too, he wanted to reprimand Quentin on camera, because he even asked Ryan if they had gone to commercial yet and when Ryan said no he said good.   And yes, Quentin shouldn't have said what he said.  But also, Ryan and Harry have been in entertainment for years, and Quentin is just starting out.  They should have known better than to put him on the spot like that. 

 

I thought that musician remark, when he said Clark was the only musician left was very disrespectful to the other contestants. 

[Simon Boccanegra]

It shouldn't be news to anyone at this point, not contestants and not viewers, that Ryan isn't the contestants' friend. I have no idea what he is like in his off-camera life, he might be a wonderful person, but on stage and in the media? He is self-serving at best and a ruthless production minion at worst. He will ask questions designed to make a singer look bad or foolish, badger someone to talk about a painful subject, reveal something the singer thought was said in confidence...this is all documented. Remember when he went to the media with the story of his heroics in talking Crystal Bowersox out of leaving the competition (at a time his own image was taking a beating, following a number of bizarre statements and actions during one of the performance shows that season)?

 

That he's still seen by a lot of the viewers as generally a nice guy, while past and present judges and mentors (Simon, Kara, Jimmy, Harry) get nailed for being rough on the kids, just reminds me that people pay more attention to someone's smile than to someone's eyes. Look at them sometime. Whatever is going on with his lower face, they're cold, reptilian. I've never been suckered by his slick game-show-host charm.  

 

As far as Quentin versus Harry, Team Harry here. Harry's old-school and genuine and he has a strong work ethic. I don't always agree with him, but he lives what he spouts. Quentin had major bitchface going on before he even started singing. He reacted to the news that he was safe for the week as if a judge had just ordered him into rehab and he'd have to watch a bunch of films about the negative effects of cannabis. Not everyone is well suited for this show. Which might be doubly moot shortly, because I don't think Quentin's going to be around much longer and I expect American Idol to come to its own end in a season or two. In both cases, it hasn't been a bad run, nothing to be ashamed of. 

Edited April 17, 2015 by Simon Boccanegra

[OakGoblinFly]

I don't like his excuse in the People article, "I was just being honest."  As if having no filter is a virtue.  

 

 

One can be "honest" and "keep it real" while being civil, courteous, and professional.  Quentin came across as a petulant, angry child who threw a temper tantrum because he didn't receive the praise he expected - while he might have been genuinely sad that Joey was in the bottom two, it didn't come across that way.

[BogoGog24]

Personally next season I would like to see JLo and Harry get the boot and be replaced with Kelly Clarkson and Adam Lambert, or maybe JHud. It's high time an alumni returns to judge. The ratings for the episode where Adam filled in for Keith soared, imagine if he was on every week. A lot of his hardcore fans would tune in just to see Adam. And I thought Kelly did a great job as a mentor. Both of them have undeniable talent and credits in the industry, they've been in the contestants' position, and they are nice and warm people. It could be a good panel. I'm tired of Harry's arrogance and tired of the JLo reaction shots. The only current judge I like is Keith because I think he makes interesting points the others don't and he can give constructive criticism without sounding mean or arrogant. He has a warmth about him.

[OakGoblinFly]

That said, I agree with Harry that Quentin's performance wasn't all that.  I even said, partway through, that the band was running away with it.  Then, when Harry said something like "You need to push the band, don't let them push you", I had to nod in agreement.  It was nice to hear him sing something fast for a change, but he didn't come close to the raw, edgy, sexiness that is Lenny Kravitz when he sings that song.  I  think that Harry truly does want to help these kids and would be fantastic as a mentor.  But, since he's a judge, he has a limited amount of time to critique them and give advice and sometimes it comes out sounding a bit snobby.

 

 

 

Harry even said that a few times during the broadcast, specifically to Clark and Joey, that he wish that he was allowed to mentor (but can't since he is a judge).  I think he would really help those two contestants as I see that they've already taken his advice/critiques to heart and it has shown.  I think Nick also listens to Harry and had his best night of the competition because of it.

Re Quentin-gate, I started getting uncomfortable when they panned to Quentin during Harry's critique.  He looked PISSED that he wasn't getting a tongue bath.  I get so annoyed at these shows that they just blow kisses at these contestants.  I find Harry a breath of fresh air.  I guess we now know why he (and they) can't give more detailed, constructive critiques - the little ones would crumple up into a ball and die. 

 

 

Ah, Special Snowflake Syndrome and Everybody Wins Mentality strikes again.

[cinsays]

   Well, I am still team Quentin and find all of his performances captivating.  He's actually the only one I can't wait to see each week because he has such artistry.  Liked him better without the awful nose ring, but, guess that's just a part of him and I can deal with that easier than JAX's ever present gloves and affected melodrama.

   While we are talking about Quentin's scowling and mad expressions..........what about Qaasim's similar looks when he was on the verge of being cut.  And then he was saved anyway.  I still think they just don't like Quentin and want him gone.

   I agree with comments on Ryan being a big pot stirrer.  He is beginning to remind me more and more of Andy Cohen from Bravo, whose main aim seems to be to create conflict and drama among people, regardless of who gets hurt.

 

[MrsMoltisanti]

.

Whack can also just mean "crazy." As if Urban Dictionary is really the greatest source

 

If the Urban Dictionary Pedigree isn't up to the standards, then just check out Grammarist.com or Merriam Webster.com as well.  They all say variations of the same thing --- very bad or dubious quality, not up to the mark, lousy, lame. 

The point is that at that moment Harry heard a young kid who has been given a chance that MANY do not, and he was quite possibly slandering the show on live tv.  Harry wanted to address it and let Quentin know that it was not wack indeed.  The show is  a great opportunity for young people to jump over the many hurdles that millions of wannabees actually have to go through to seek fame and fortune in the music industry where they are almost given instant fame and perks right away.  The fact that Quentin marched over there and made that little scene just showed the industry that he was the wack one. 

Harry has made his mark and done his time in the industry.  TV, movies, broadway, concerts, soundtracks, gifted musician for decades.    Quentin?  Has not earned his right yet. And now probably never will.  Who wants to work with someone who flies off the handle like that? 

[Simon Boccanegra]

One can be "honest" and "keep it real" while being civil, courteous, and professional.  Quentin came across as a petulant, angry child who threw a temper tantrum because he didn't receive the praise he expected - while he might have been genuinely sad that Joey was in the bottom two, it didn't come across that way.

 

Here's my theory.

 

He's closest to Joey, less so to Rayvon, but he probably likes him well enough. He, Quentin, has been getting a lot of positive feedback from the judges but also some dings for pitch and other issues. He's getting the sense that Clark and Jax are The Chosen Ones, and maybe he doesn't understand why Nick is still there, successfully riding the middle week after week and sailing through with the voters. Nick mentioned that he and Quentin are roommates. I'm sure they get along, but of all the ones left, I would imagine Nick and Clark would be the least likely to be Quentin's "thing" musically, followed by Jax. 

 

So, I think he was sulking all through the show as other names were called ahead of his and Joey's. At a point when most of the chairs had been emptied out for the shot of the three singers whose fate was still up in the air, Joey and Quentin were staring at each other from opposite ends of their row (Rayvon had his back to them), like, "One of us is going to be on the chopping block." That phrase "This is wack" probably was going through Quentin's head a lot that hour. When Nick was safe again. When Jax was safe again. When Clark got such good feedback for a "Superstition" that was okay but nothing outstanding. When Tyanna got good feedback for a "Why Do Fools Fall In Love?" that was okay but even less outstanding. 

 

They they call his name, and he's worked himself into a shitty mood. "I got through, but now Joey might go home." Still, he's rehearsed the thing, he goes out and does it, in his mind he "kills it," post-performance adrenaline is still running, he's in better spirits...and then Harry throws cold water on him:  nothing original; carbon copy; people are really applauding the band, not you. And he isn't going to say, "Like that 'Superstition' was original? Like 'American Girl' was that different from Tom Petty's? What's really going on here is that I don't look like the winner you guys are trying to make happen."

 

"This whole thing is wack" was as close as he was going to get. 

 

That's how I read it. Feeling as though he can't win, feeling as though the system is rigged against him, feeling that bland people are getting an easy ride from the judges and the voters, then his BFF is in B2 for the first time. Then he got criticism of a performance he felt was good, and that the people in the studio seemed to be into. It was just his snapping point. 

 

We've had pissy people before at elimination time. I remember Lee Dewyze getting so attached to the underwhelming Andrew Garcia and blatantly cold-shouldering some contestant who won the "Which will go?" Seacrest suspense sequence when AG's time finally ran out. Tim Urban, I think. 

[designing1]

Quentin's an ass and Ryan's no better.  I don't think Ryan should have allowed Quentin to get up into Harry's face. The asshole could have said whatever he had to say from the stage (next to Ryan).

 

Ryan was already standing right next to Harry when Quentin re-entered the theater from the audience/judging level, where he'd exited, so climbing back up on stage wasn't likely. I'm sure the Idol machinery is loving that Quentin got "up into Harry's face" (and that phrase seems way too strong to me) as it's gotten this show the most widespread attention it's had in years, and Ryan is nothing if not part of that machinery. If anyone should have stopped Quentin it should have been whoever runs the show from backstage, but I wouldn't be surprised if they actually encouraged him to get back out there to generate buzz. Because let's face it: This remaining group consists of dull, competent singers; quirky, accessory-laden artistes; and a lovely-voiced but too young to be consistent potential future star. Not a lot there to get notice from anyone not already onboard.

Edited April 17, 2015 by designing1

[Guest]

To me Ryan seemed to want to let Quentin speak his mind, for whatever reasons.  I'm not sure I'd label that bullying.  The 'go to commercial' music was starting up during Quentin's 'apology' later in the show and he had to talk over it, and Ryan told them to turn it off and let him have his say.  If he wanted Quentin to appear in the worst light for publicity purposes, he probably would've rushed him off instead.  

 

I felt like when Quentin said, "I was raised better than that", Harry was thinking, "wrong answer, because you basically just admitted you were angry AT ME, not at the results".  

[Sparkling Beth]

 

Quentin had major bitchface going on before he even started singing. He reacted to the news that he was safe for the week as if a judge had just ordered him into rehab and he'd have to watch a bunch of films about the negative effects of cannabis.

Which is precisely why Ryan pressed the issue.  If Ryan had just let Quentin go back to his seat at that point without asking what he was feeling, I have no doubt we'd be seeing posts complaining about how insensitive Ryan was to Quentin's feelings.  "Ryan could tell that Quentin was upset!  Why didn't he ask him what was wrong?  Clearly he doesn't care about what these kids are going through!"  Viewers would have been left wondering what was going on and maybe imagining scenarios that were worse than what the situation actually was.

 

I still think Quentin acted like a petulant little brat who couldn't accept the rules of the show that he voluntarily joined.  He knew what he and the others were getting into.  Grow up, Quentin, and just be glad you and your friend Joey got a chance that thousands of people would kill for.  (I just ended two sentences in a row with a preposition.  Might have to give back my degree in English.)

[drafan]

I don't think it was scripted, but I think Ryan is generally an ass. He is sweet and nice when it serves the drama and he doesn't mind humiliating contestants if that works, too. I don't find Quentin at all likable (from what we see) and his angry and surly look didn't help. But Ryan could have/should have left him alone. But he doesn't get the (really) big bucks because of his compassion. He gets it because he's willing to do what it takes to create suspense and dramatic moments, even if it is at the young singers expense.

 

I thought some of the old time eliminations were even more humiliating than the "chairs" and Ryan didn't bat an eye about how anyone felt. He's cold and a phony, and its just funny how all the arguments are over Harry v. Quentin with Ryan skating by like the little kid who instigated it all, but no one noticed..

This 1000% (tm Randy the Dawg, who, obviously never took math).

 

Every time I get the slightest inkling that I like Ryan Seacrest, I remind myself that he was the mastermind behind foisting the Kardashian Klan onto the American landscape.

 

Maybe he can grab Jax, who he seems to favor, and make her into the next Julianne Hough. Gag.

[rab01]

Ryan's jobs are to keep the show running on time, fill for transitions and whenever he sees a chance to help create good TV, go for it. He doesn't have to like or hate any of the contestants to do that. Ryan sensed from Quentin's expression that he might say something interesting and gave it a shot. It worked. It worked really well.

 

At the time, I thought Harry's "you could just go home" comment was rude but it was really a softball compared to what he could have or should have said: "Two People have to be in the bottom two each week.  Who do you think should be in Joey and Rayvon's places?"  There is no way he could answer that question without being universally condemned as an asshole.

[Waldo13]

Personally next season I would like to see JLo and Harry get the boot and be replaced with Kelly Clarkson and Adam Lambert, or maybe JHud. It's high time an alumni returns to judge. The ratings for the episode where Adam filled in for Keith soared, imagine if he was on every week. A lot of his hardcore fans would tune in just to see Adam. And I thought Kelly did a great job as a mentor. Both of them have undeniable talent and credits in the industry, they've been in the contestants' position, and they are nice and warm people. It could be a good panel. I'm tired of Harry's arrogance and tired of the JLo reaction shots. The only current judge I like is Keith because I think he makes interesting points the others don't and he can give constructive criticism without sounding mean or arrogant. He has a warmth about him.

Harry is the musician who is all about the vocals and musicality of the contestant. JLo is all about the look and the performance because she is a performer and not a singer. Keith is both about the performance and the vocals. IMO this is the perfect balance, for the judges, and with any replacements, AI should keep this in mind. Harry is not harsh he is just truthful and is commenting with the contestants well being in mind. Simon was much harsher but didn't give the contestant anything to grow on. Quentin should count him a very lucky man that he didn't have to suffer the slings and arrows of a Simon critique. We will see next week if Quentin's goose is cooked. If it is, I'm pretty sure that haters will say it's because of his comments and not because he had a bad pervious week. At this point though, is it more about the judging or the fan base of who moves on?

IMO the only way any of the current judges will be replaced is by their resignation.

Edited April 17, 2015 by Waldo13

[OakGoblinFly]

I don't think it was scripted, but I think Ryan is generally an ass. He is sweet and nice when it serves the drama and he doesn't mind humiliating contestants if that works, too. I don't find Quentin at all likable (from what we see) and his angry and surly look didn't help. But Ryan could have/should have left him alone. But he doesn't get the (really) big bucks because of his compassion. He gets it because he's willing to do what it takes to create suspense and dramatic moments, even if it is at the young singers expense.

 

I thought some of the old time eliminations were even more humiliating than the "chairs" and Ryan didn't bat an eye about how anyone felt. He's cold and a phony, and its just funny how all the arguments are over Harry v. Quentin with Ryan skating by like the little kid who instigated it all, but no one noticed..

 

 

But that's  Ryan's job, isn't it?  It's his job to keep the show moving AND to question the contestants/judges; he's often "presses" the issue (be it asking a contestant how they're feeling when they're visibly upset, forcing the judges to name names, and so on) because it makes for good television (and this is first and foremost a television show).

 

I like Ryan's hosting abilities - I think he manages the balance between supportive shoulder, referee, clock manager, shit stirrer, and circus manager quite nicely.

[Simon Boccanegra]

Harry is the musician who is all about the vocals and musicality of the contestant. JLo is all about the look and the performance because she is a performer and not a singer. Keith is both about the performance and the vocals. IMO this is the perfect balance, for the judges, and with any replacements, AI should keep this in mind.

 

I do like the current panel. I wouldn't mind keeping this group around for however long the show goes on. The big surprise to me is Urban. He was part of that awful season 12 panel, and that would have dragged anyone down, but he's grown into the job in better company. He and Jen are better with each other and with Harry than they were in prior seasons.