Season 02

[wanderingstar]

Never watched this show before, but given my obsession with all things Theranos, I had to tune into this episode.

It makes sense that one of the patients would seek revenge. It's just really unfortunate that he turned his ire on the one person who was trying to expose the startup and its non-working technology.

[jabRI]

On 11/12/2019 at 10:12 PM, mxc90 said:

At Corrine's apartment, Scola was not that far behind Tommy. Tommy made it down all those flights of stairs and disappeared in the street. Scola needs to work on his speed.

I thought this was really weird, they go into a building, go up the elevator, chase UP the stairs, then the guy ends up at the street level. I must have looked away for a minute?

[Waterston Fan]

55 minutes ago, jabRI said:

I thought this was really weird, they go into a building, go up the elevator, chase UP the stairs, then the guy ends up at the street level. I must have looked away for a minute?

No, I really do think it was weird. I didn't look away and thought it was strange to go upstairs then suddenly end up on the street. 

[WendyCR72]

Here is the synopsis for the next episode airing on 11/19/2019, "Codename: Ferdinand":

A car crash results in the death of a photographer; Maggie sympathizes with his widow when she notices similarities with her own husband's death.

[luvly]

On 11/14/2019 at 1:47 AM, The Ringo Kidd said:

OA is really out of line for stopping his cousin from getting on the job. He really is a sanctimonious asshole.

How so? He did exactly what he was supposed to do, give an honest reference. Hell, the cousin of ill repute couldn't even be bothered to ask OA directly, instead he had his dad tell OA that he'd already given Newark PD his info for a reference. You pretty much get what you deserve when you spring that on a person you already know doesn't think very highly of you. The cousin thought he could leverage OA's professional reputation with familial obligation and it turns out he thought wrong.

[Mars477]

On 11/14/2019 at 12:47 AM, The Ringo Kidd said:

OA is really out of line for stopping his cousin from getting on the job. He really is a sanctimonious asshole.

I'm only two minutes into this episode, but how is OA out of line here?  He gets ambushed by family who tell him that a family member he doesn't particularly like put his name down as a reference without going so far as to reach out to OA first to let him know.  OA is completely justified to give this person a poor reference, and he doesn't owe it to this cousin to lie to help him get a job and place his own professional reputation on the line.

It's the cousin who's the asshole here.  If you or I put down a person's name for a reference without consulting them first or even having a decent idea of the kind of reference that person would provide it would be our fuckup, not the reference being a "sanctimonious asshole". 

[The Ringo Kidd]

He is a sanctimonious asshole because he couldn’t recommend his cousin because he has a problem “telling the truth.” What did he lie about eating the last falafel. To be a cop stretching the truth is a feature not a bug. Especially if he goes undercover like OA supposedly did when your whole life is a lie. Hasn’t he ever heard of “testalying” which is a class in the academy.

I do agree that the cousin was wrong to rely on OA for anything. Big mistake. He would have been a lot better off if he never mentioned him at all.

[FinnishViewer]

Quote

What did he lie about eating the last falafel. To be a cop stretching the truth is a feature not a bug

Those are a bit different from recommending someone, who you think is not suitable to be a cop, even if it's your cousin.

[mxc90]

The government needed a freelance photographer to take pictures? No agent available?

Were the Blakes sent to replace Philip and Elizabeth Jennings? Embarrassing Russian spies!

Maggie showed Lisa Blake a picture of "herself" (maybe in a wig with the same hair color) and asked her did she "recognize" this woman?! Maggie can recognize the scar on her palm but not Lisa's face?!

Lisa had the speed of the Flash to run from Maggie, close the door and in less than a second, fired shots through the door. As if the bullets came directly from her ass (she didn't have time to turn around and shoot).

NYPD and the FBI couldn't use binoculars to see who was in the Blake's car?

With the switch in the car, the Blakes could have been at their destination with time to spare for site seeing. Nope (why make the FBI's job hard to find them)!!! The Blakes decide to split up, didn't bother have cell phones, so Lisa shows up at the storage facility and promptly gets arrested (too bad she missed seeing the FBI vehicle parked outside).

Almost felt bad for Jubal that the CIA agent walked into his house and started to give orders.

With a big investigation going on, OA and "they" needed to look into Jeremy Parks' background because he was in a fender bender? 

Jeremy's insurance goes up and get grilled for 3 hours. Pay attention next time!

[Xeliou66]

This wasn’t a great episode, mainly because I don’t like spy plots very much, I prefer regular investigations of crimes, not spy intrigue stuff. And yeah I didn’t get why the CIA had some freelance photographer working for them and not a full fledged agent. I liked how they tied in the subplot about Maggie getting rear ended into the case even though it turned out to have nothing to do with it, and I was glad we didn’t get a sappy romantic ending between Maggie and Jeremy. 

Not enough Kristen and Scola. 

I’ve warmed up to Isobel but I miss Dana still.

Jubal was good as always. 

[preeya]

2 hours ago, mxc90 said:

Were the Blakes sent to replace Philip and Elizabeth Jennings? Embarrassing Russian spies!

I had the same thought.  At the time I said "the new Americans"

The thing I still don't understand was the Blake's conversation in the car before they "stumbled" upon the accident, and why would they call 9-1-1?

[Dowel Jones]

I have some other questions:

Why would Maggie's SUV have civilian plates, but still red lights and siren?

Why would the auto-lighting system in the storage unit work for Maggie and OA, but not for the spy?  And wouldn't it be more efficient for them to head for (likely) the only exit to keep the suspect bottled up until backup arrived? She was more than willing to kill either of the two agents.

Is Mrs. Photographer still out there by the accident site?  Maggie left her hanging.

Most importantly, given the current political climate, why would the son of the Iranian Defense Minister even be allowed (by either side) into the US to study?

I was interested in Jeremy's closing statement about 'too many red lights', and how it had been happening a lot lately.  Was that foreshadowing of something, or just a college professor having a run of bad luck?

[Ellee]

@Dowel Jones 

Like your post and the part that made me go ‘duh, Ellee, that didn’t even cross your mind’ was ‘Why would the auto lighting system work for Maggie and OA but not for the spy?’  

😁

[Mars477]

Honestly the CIA hiring a freelancer to conduct noncritical tasks like takeing pictures of two people meeting  doesn't seem that farfetched.  Not only does the CIA not have infinite manpower, using cutouts and deniable freelancers is basically espionage 101, and they rightfully wouldn't expect the opposition to go so far as to murder an enemy operative on enemy soil since that's a massive overreaction.  And there's the whole "CIA isn't supposed to operate on US soil thing".  Although it would've worked better if the victim was a PI rather than just a photographer.

That said I'm not sure why FBI agents like Maggie care so much about finding murderers   They're not homicide detectives.

Also they really did work hiding Missy Peregrym's pregnancy, especially in the storage locker scene.  Props to her on being game for a fight scene while pregnant.  Knowing that I kinda winced when the female spy punched her in the stomach.

Edited November 20, 2019 by Mars477

[mxc90]

6 hours ago, preeya said:

I had the same thought.  At the time I said "the new Americans"

The thing I still don't understand was the Blake's conversation in the car before they "stumbled" upon the accident, and why would they call 9-1-1?

The conversation about her school kids or winning the lottery and getting out of this life?

As the other car was approaching (thinking they would stop to help) they needed to keep their cover as good citizens and call 911 to avoid questions. 

3 hours ago, Dowel Jones said:

Why would the auto-lighting system in the storage unit work for Maggie and OA, but not for the spy? 

If Russia could hack Ben's car, maybe she had them hack into the lighting system to only turn on for FBI agents. 

3 hours ago, Dowel Jones said:

Is Mrs. Photographer still out there by the accident site?  Maggie left her hanging.

A little follow up would be nice. Maggie said she would send a team to her right before the chase. If she remembered to call after the run, fight and arrest.... I'm impressed.

Maggie was pissed Lisa "played" her in the interrogation but during that time, she lied to Lisa about her being pregnant. 

[Waterston Fan]

Didn't care for this episode but I admit, I didn't trust that CIA agent that suddenly came in. 

I had to go back and check the accident, I guess Jeremy was tailgating? 

[Netfoot]

9 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

Jubal was good as always. 

He is the most useless and easily dispensed with character in the show.  All he does is stand there, shouting instructions to people who should already know what to do.  

ETA:  Usually, the instructions don't even originate with him!

Edited November 20, 2019 by Netfoot

[Dowel Jones]

3 hours ago, Waterston Fan said:

I had to go back and check the accident, I guess Jeremy was tailgating? 

Not really tailgating, as they were all lined up at a stoplight.  He saw the light turn green, assumed Maggie would move, and tagged her when she didn't.  Been there, done that.

[jabRI]

"Maggie showed Lisa Blake a picture of "herself" (maybe in a wig with the same hair color) and asked her did she "recognize" this woman?! Maggie can recognize the scar on her palm but not Lisa's face?!"

I thought that was crazy, and why didn't they run facial recognition like they always do, it would have popped up right away.  The writing is getting even sloppier, if that's possible.

[illdoc]

I'm just impressed that Jubal (someone else?) saw a scar on her hand from a fuzzy photograph that had to be magnified in order to show the rest of us the scar! That's some damn good eyesight!!!

[Grrarrggh]

On 11/19/2019 at 10:09 PM, mxc90 said:

The government needed a freelance photographer to take pictures? No agent available?

The Agency depends on lots of freelancers to do simple things like that. There's not a big enough budget to pay for full-timers. 

[12catcrazy]

The writing is pretty lousy on this show.  Too bad as I enjoy the actors but the story makes you check your brain at the door.  I was disappointed that it didn't work out for Maggie and the guy who rear ended her car.  I think the actress had the biggest brightest smile I've ever seen from her on this show when she got the phone call wanting to take her out to lunch.  

And I don't think Missy did those fight scenes.  If you notice, they cut off her head in the fight scenes, so my guess is that they used a stunt person.  

[WendyCR72]

4 hours ago, 12catcrazy said:

The writing is pretty lousy on this show.  Too bad as I enjoy the actors but the story makes you check your brain at the door.  I was disappointed that it didn't work out for Maggie and the guy who rear ended her car.  I think the actress had the biggest brightest smile I've ever seen from her on this show when she got the phone call wanting to take her out to lunch.  

And I don't think Missy did those fight scenes.  If you notice, they cut off her head in the fight scenes, so my guess is that they used a stunt person.  

Pretty sure you're right, especially since Missy Peregrym is pregnant.

[WendyCR72]

Here is the description of the next episode [episode 9 for anyone counting!], "Salvation", to air on November 26, 2019:

After an altercation with a student, teacher Patrick Miller goes missing, leading the team to investigate everyone who might have had a grudge against him. Also, a key witness in the case steps up to help, and Maggie does whatever she can to ensure their safety.

[mxc90]

This episode jumped from a possible teacher/student relationship to murder to gang life to a sting operation and now immigration/clash with ICE. My goodness!

Maybe Alex thought if Max can take a swing at the Patrick then let me get my shot! 

So Patrick needed to "clear his head" and didn't go home because Alex took a swing at him and he couldn't help him reach his potential or did he have second thoughts for filing the report against him? Anyway, Patrick is taking feelings way too hard for his students. Trying to pay off Max was absurd.

The moment Patrick told Vanessa to call the police (she knows he is in Coney Island/boardwalk/ID his car), the Long Island 911 operator could have been in touch with NYPD and they could have been there in a few minutes. Nope! Her response is "What are you talking about?" She didn't mention Coney Island until Maggie and OA showed up the next day.

Too bad Patrick died not knowing if she was quick to call. At least their her home will be cleaned and spotless! She'll probably go back to Max now!

All these videos of Patrick but none of his abduction.

Scola is cool when a gun is pointed at him.

Were Maggie, OA, and the FBI SWAT team staged directly outside the gang's hideout? The gang doesn't have look outs? 

Why did The FBI agents take Jessica back to her home instead of FBI headquarters (where ICE would have trouble finding/arresting her)? By separating her from the rest of the gang during the arrest they made it obvious she was working with them (she is definitely finished when she gets back to Mexico).

When did ICE find out Jessica has a violent history? When she opened up to Maggie and OA? 

Maggie made a promise to Jessica and the judge didn't honor it??!!? I'm shocked she didn't follow Maggie's word! 

For a moment, I thought Jessica was playing Maggie and she killed Patrick.

I'm sure Maggie still has doubts if OA will take a bullet after they made up.

Edited November 27, 2019 by mxc90

[Raja]

1 hour ago, mxc90 said:

Why did The FBI agents take Jessica back to her home instead of FBI headquarters (where ICE would have trouble finding/arresting her)? By separating her from the rest of the gang during the arrest they made it obvious she was working with them (she is definitely finished when she gets back to Mexico).

When did ICE find out Jessica has a violent history? When she opened up to Maggie and OA? 

Maggie made a promise to Jessica and the judge didn't honor it??!!? I'm shocked she didn't follow Maggie's word! 

For a moment, I thought Jessica was playing Maggie and she killed Patrick.

I'm sure Maggie still has doubts if OA will take a bullet after they made up.

Change Maggie back into Jack McCoy and its deja vu all over again. Were was the US Attorney who actually has to try to prosecute the gang with a probably dead witness?

[Xeliou66]

I liked the episode and the way the case unfolded - from jealous ex husband to student teacher relationship to gang murder, it was a good case and a good investigation. But I didn’t care for the end, it felt more like a political statement about immigration than a part of the case, and I also wondered where the U.S. Attorney who would be prosecuting the murder case against the gang members was, his statement that he needed her testimony would be a lot more important than Maggie’s speech.

I thought that Jessica might’ve been playing the FBI as well for a while. 

I also thought it a bit odd that the girlfriend apparently didn’t tell the police that Patrick was at Coney Island when she first called them, they could’ve sent officers there quickly, it might’ve been too late but still, that seemed like an error in the plot.

More of Scola and Kristen please, I find them compelling, O.A. still gets on my nerves sometimes. 

I’ve come to like Isobel a lot more. 

[nittany cougar]

9 hours ago, mxc90 said:

When did ICE find out Jessica has a violent history? When she opened up to Maggie and OA? 

Maggie made a promise to Jessica and the judge didn't honor it??!!? I'm shocked she didn't follow Maggie's word! 

The FBI told the U.S. Attorney, who in turn told ICE.  Under the Immigration and Nationality Act, an immigrant can be removed for committing a crime of moral turpitude. The immigration hearing was to consider whether  removal was warranted, and the immigration judge considered the murder a crime of moral turpitude. 

Edited to add, they did not use the term "moral turpitude" in the episode.  This is just my interpretation from studying immigration law some years ago.  I thought the basis of the removal should have been explained better.

Edited November 27, 2019 by nittanycougar

[Ellee]

Maybe keeping Jessica here will be a part II episode. 

The sap in me wanted her here and safe.   And personally I don’t want Maggie to drop it or let it be dropped by anyone.  

The judge’s hands might have been tied but that doesn’t mean it needs to be let go.  

[Raja]

7 hours ago, nittanycougar said:

The FBI told the U.S. Attorney, who in turn told ICE.  Under the Immigration and Nationality Act, an immigrant can be removed for committing a crime of moral turpitude. The immigration hearing was to consider whether  removal was warranted, and the immigration judge considered the murder a crime of moral turpitude. 

Edited to add, they did not use the term "moral turpitude" in the episode.  This is just my interpretation from studying immigration law some years ago.  I thought the basis of the removal should have been explained better.

Of course the basic story had been done by Law & Order many times before that guy rode down the escalator  with immigration being the issue separating him from professional Republican politicians. So when the ICE guy made his I can't especially now statement it was an eye rolling bad political push.

"Can be" isn't the same as "must be" and you think  the Attorney General can have a talk with the Homeland Security Secretary just like they do within the Justice Department or even going so far as to force the federal will on the individual state counterparts when one US Attorney wants to give someone a pass into witness protection

[xtwheeler]

On 11/13/2019 at 4:11 AM, Kelda Feegle said:

I didn't much like him in Bones but I thought it was the character mannerisms but now I see him in this show with the same mannerisms I dislike him even more, YMMV.

So tow eps in a row Jubal is eating snacks in a very obvious manner - when will this anvil drop?

I thought this was funny because Scola's whole "quirk" on Bones was that he was constantly eating.

On 11/13/2019 at 10:47 PM, The Ringo Kidd said:

Once again they get everything wrong. The number 3 train terminates in Brooklyn at New Lots Avenue. It was famous for being the most dangerous train in the system and was called the beast. There is no Housten street stop.

OA is really out of line for stopping his cousin from getting on the job. He really is a sanctimonious asshole.

Do you just mean in Brooklyn or something? There is a Houston street stop for the 1 & 2 trains in the Village.

I don't think it is an asshole move to tell the truth about someone who will be depended upon by the city and its residents to be of upstanding moral character, absolutely, scrupulously honest, and always ready and able to do the right thing, even at the personal cost of injury or death. OA is literally protecting the people HE swore an oath to protect.

On 11/18/2019 at 12:40 PM, The Ringo Kidd said:

He is a sanctimonious asshole because he couldn’t recommend his cousin because he has a problem “telling the truth.” What did he lie about eating the last falafel. To be a cop stretching the truth is a feature not a bug. Especially if he goes undercover like OA supposedly did when your whole life is a lie. Hasn’t he ever heard of “testalying” which is a class in the academy.

I do agree that the cousin was wrong to rely on OA for anything. Big mistake. He would have been a lot better off if he never mentioned him at all.

OA didn't make his final decision or say anything to the person who called for the reference until after he had seen his cousin's application, and noted that there were "inaccuracies," misstatements, and probably a few outright lies sprinkled in there. It wasn't that he ruled it out altogether, but he gave him the benefit of the doubt, and talked to the person and reviewed his application, which confirmed cuz was still sitting there with pants on fire. I think OA made the only morally and ethically justified call.

On 11/20/2019 at 2:55 AM, Ellee said:

@Dowel Jones 

Like your post and the part that made me go ‘duh, Ellee, that didn’t even cross your mind’ was ‘Why would the auto lighting system work for Maggie and OA but not for the spy?’  

😁

This killed me too. Was he wearing his Invisibility Cloak or something?

[Dowel Jones]

I get that the local PD is strapped for resources, but they went right up the chain to the FBI for assistance for a state crime?  There's no county or even state police resources available?

ICE guy:  "I can't intervene.  It would mean my career."

FBI (publicly):  "Because our only witness to the gang member's confession has been deported by ICE, we have to release these 5 members of DT15 back to the streets of New York."

OCE guy:  "Oh, shit."

Maggie was absolutely right about OA.  He could say he would take a bullet, but if he was in the Middle East somewhere, and a militia guy gave him that choice when he was 14, would he still take that bullet?

[LisaM]

I really did not like this episode. Not big on gang violence. 

[Rambler]

Local police: "OMG! A woman reported that her husband didn't come home from work last night. This is way too big for us, we need all our officers to guard the local doughnut shops! Call in the FBI immediately! Only they have the resources to solve such a huge case."

[illdoc]

17 hours ago, Rambler said:

A woman reported that her husband didn't come home

Not even her husband---she was in the process of getting a divorce from someone else. He was just her boyfriend/fiance

[The Ringo Kidd]

A woman reported that the guy she was cheating with on her husband didn't come home.

[jabRI]

As soon as Maggie said, 'go back to your place and pack a few things' I knew that wouldn't end well.  And why didn't they firm up the WITSEC thing first before ENDANGERING HER LIFE!

[Waterston Fan]

What is up with the page? Its all in the middle and and kinda strange to read. Even typing this is weird too, I like it it used to be. 

Didn't care for this episode anyways and I admit, I thought Jessica would end up being deported. No new episode until next year? 

[illdoc]

1 hour ago, Waterston Fan said:

What is up with the page? Its all in the middle and and kinda strange to read. Even typing this is weird too, I like it it used to be. 

It's "center justified format" instead of "left justified". EVERYTHING is centered---the "A", "B", etc on customized homepage, individual subforums, posts, etc. It's the entire forums page and there's no way to fix it. I hope it's just a temporary glitch (I submitted a bug report anyway, expressing my displeasure if it's permanent).

[tvfanatic13]

How was this an FBI case???? 

[The Ringo Kidd]

It’s not an FBI case! Nothing in this show makes sense. It’s a pack of lies and half truths.

[WendyCR72]

Here is the synopsis for the next episode (S02.E10) airing on December 17th, titled "Ties That Bind". I have a feeling this will be it until the new year!

A former kidnapping victim is linked to a series of murders that includes the daughter of an NYPD detective. Also, Kristen begins to doubt her ability as an agent after a training exercise leaves her shaken.

[mythoughtis]

Besides the fact that a simple missing adult gone less than 24 hours is not an FBI case.... who in their right mind would ignore a request from their boyfriend to call the  police immediately? A boyfriend she said always came home when he says he would or early? 
 

[Xeliou66]

Well that was interesting, I called the twist of the brother being involved the minute he showed up on the screen, but I was unsure of whether he did it alone or whether both brothers were involved. What I didn’t see coming was the cliffhanger of Kristen’s life being in danger, I don’t think she’s leaving the show but still I didn’t see that coming. 

I liked the episode overall I thought it was a good plot even though it was somewhat predictable.

I did wonder why the police didn’t question Andrew in Jenny’s murder the first time around, given that he had a relationship with her that just ended, that seemed like a hole in the plot. 

Jubal was good with the NYPD detective father. I do think the father is somewhat responsible for what happened to Kristen, he escalated the situation, and Maggie moved in too quick to arrest Jordan, if she hadn’t moved in so quickly and instead waited for OA and Scola to arrive I don’t think Kristen would’ve gotten attacked.

I noticed we’ve seen the ME in this episode a couple of times before, I like having a recurring ME. 

[mxc90]

The more serious crime was no one on the bus gave the old lady a seat. New Yorkers can do better.  

"She is missing for 12 hours. I was missing for 6 years". That's not the right time to be a dick Andrew!

4 FBI agents go in and 20 plus NYPD officers just wait outside. Where was SWAT Jubal sent?

The moment Jordan was introduced, you knew he was the killer. Show is getting too predictable. It's never the 1st and 2nd person they suspect.

I liked the profiler "changing her tune" to Jordan after she was so sure it was Andrew. She was useless!

Terrible ending! Maggie has to be in the wrong for not making Jordan have his hands raised or check to see if he's holding a weapon. Some how they will put all the blame on Kristin for not properly backing her up. 

Angry Papa Harry just stood there as Maggie struggles with Jordan. What was the point of adding him to the scene to enter the room/gun drawn? He didn't shoot Jordan for insulting his daughter or help Maggie.

I hope Kristen isn't written off the show.

Edited December 18, 2019 by mxc90

[Bobbin]

I also suspected the brother. Tight casting doesn't allow extraneous characters. And Andrew was too obvious so early on. Yes, the takedown was a thorough screwup, Maggie's second on this case -- the other was showing the victim only Andrew's picture instead of a photo lineup. I almost expected her to walk away because her man wasn't the perp. The smart money is on Kristin's recovery. Again, no disposable characters.

[rhys]

Awww, I like Kristen. I hope she survives & isn't written off the show (unless she has a better gig elsewhere).

[preeya]

2 hours ago, Xeliou66 said:

and Maggie moved in too quick to arrest Jordan, if she hadn’t moved in so quickly and instead waited for OA and Scola to arrive I don’t think Kristen would’ve gotten attacked.

The bigger question is why was Maggie paired with Kristin and OA paired with Scola for the takedown?   And how did the father/detective get into the act?  That ending scene was really screwed up.

ETA: the master profiler is the Mayor of New Orleans on NCIS: New Orleans.

Edited December 18, 2019 by preeya

[mertensia]

5 hours ago, Bobbin said:

I also suspected the brother. Tight casting doesn't allow extraneous characters. And Andrew was too obvious so early on. Yes, the takedown was a thorough screwup, Maggie's second on this case -- the other was showing the victim only Andrew's picture instead of a photo lineup. I almost expected her to walk away because her man wasn't the perp. The smart money is on Kristin's recovery. Again, no disposable characters.

I knew it was the brother because this was ripped off from the Stayner brothers, sort of. 

[Netfoot]

Kristen screwed up in the training exercise, then she walked up to the suspect and turned her attention away from him to (apparently) distract Maggie right when he was swinging a knife around. Frankly, I'd be very surprised if she doesn't get a severe reprimand and demotion. Given that this would give everyone an opportunity to rail on about misogyny, it's almost guaranteed.

11 hours ago, mxc90 said:

I hope Kristen isn't written off the show.

She'll survive.  All they need to do is fasten a tourniquet tightly around her neck.

The brother was obvious from before he uttered his first word of dialogue.

Daddy drawing a pistol and threatening the suspect could - maybe should - have earned him two rounds in the head.