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S09.E02: Duggar Daughter Dates

JerseyGirl

By JerseyGirl
in 19 Kids And Counting [V]

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jodo

jodo

Jill's head must have exploded being exposed to all the food that has never graced her family's table. Goat cheese? Hummus.? Good for Derrick for having taste buds. And I'm glad they could expand a howler's palate too.

It looked to me like Jess and what's his name were going to jump each other every time they spoke. Bad case of hormones there. 

I thought the same thing!!  And figs!!!  Yummo!  Poor James though wasn't a fan saying next time he would want to know the menu first!  LOL  That kid is seriously cute and funny!!  Loved him!

And so true she can't take her eyes off him and could hardly stop hand holding while they ate and I also don't get why she doesn't reciprocate when Ben says he loves her.  Horntoads!

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Quof
Quof

Michelle, what are you doing posting here?

wanderwoman
wanderwoman

Michelle calling Jenny "stoic" was interesting. Every time Michelle is asked to describe a particular child's personality, she gets this momentarily stunned look. Then, she proceeds to deliver these

lottiedottie
lottiedottie

I suspect that James has no fucks left to give.

abseedee

abseedee

Look how shitty Boob treated the non-mechanically inclined Jed when they lost the car making contest. He wouldn't even shake the poor kid's hand. 

I noticed that.  Boob shook the hands of the other two and started talking when Jed stuck his hand out to shake.  I felt bad for Jed when he had to pull his hand back.

 

I really like James and think it's great that he is being introduced to food other than the processed food he is used to.  I cracked up when he said he was going to find out what's for dinner while they were leaving their picnic.

BitterApple

BitterApple

Every time I see Jill and Jessa I want to take a pair of scissors and hack a foot off of their scraggly, dried out hair. Besides the fact that I think waist-length hair looks ridiculous on anyone over ten, it looks even worse when it's not healthy. I wish they would just keep it at bra-strap level. That way it would still be long, but manageable. 

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PinkSprinkles

PinkSprinkles

I am just uncomfortable every single time Ben opens his mouth. It's kind of a combination of feeling a little bad for him combined with being a little creeped out. And I might be mean, but the poor kid doesn't seem like the sharpest tool in the shed (garage/guesthouse, whatever.)

 

I've made the same observation, but I'm starting to wonder if it's just the combo of speaking on camera and being infatuated with a pretty girl that is making him sound not as bright. On PR, for example, they have done challenges where they bring in the male counterpart of a woman they are designing a dress for and when they ask him what she is like/what she likes they fall all over themselves recounting their significant other's beauty and what physical aspects of them they want played up in the garment being made. Some of these guys have been married to their spouses for a very long time and to see them gushing over their wives is very sweet because every guy thinks that their wife is THE end all be all of womankind. Ben may be caught up in the twitter pated stage and when he hears the name "Jessa" his mind just turns to mush. 

 

Think if it as the 'Fleur Delacour Effect' for my Harry Potter lovers out there. 

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joanofarch4

joanofarch4

James' "I'm only here for the food" was great. Along with whichever kid Jason? said Jill & Derick make a good match because she's likes tall guys and Derick fits that picture.

Ben said something during a TH that had me cracking up but I can't remember it now. I'll need to catch it on a rerun.

"I'm shooting after Jessa"?

joanofarch4

joanofarch4

(edited)

I felt bad for poor James having to tag along on Jill and Derick's romantic picnic and hike. Derick talked so much about protecting Jill while hiking so that she wouldn't slip and poor James was just tagging along behind and trying to keep up! Jill was great to remind Derick during the picnic that James was there as well. I also noticed that she immediately started preparing food for James before Derick took it away and said he would serve her for her birthday--I didn't think she was serving herself, I thought she was about to prepare a plate for James. Chaperones on these dates tend to be ignored but I thought Jill was nice to make sure to acknowledge him.

I don't know who felt more awkward when the glasses lady left Michelle and Jennifer alone! Michelle kept rambling on and on, searching for things to say to Jenny and Jenny wasn't having it!

I liked the contrast between the two Jills: all smiley, demure, and "Aren't you sweet?" to Derick, then turning around and stern, no-nonsense, and "Put your fork down." in another voice to James.  And Jessa always throwing Bin the "come hither" look.  Sure hope these guys get what they're signing up for after the wedding, or is it a bait-and-switch tactic?

 

As for Jenny, I can see her giving Michelle the side eye, but she didn't even crack a smile or exchange social niceties with the eyeglass lady.  At six, can't she say "thank you" and "goodbye" instead of just walking off in a huff?  That girl sure is serious!  And anyone else think her "headaches" might actually be a psychosomatic response to Michelle stepping into her mother-figure Jill's place?  Did they even test Jenny's eyes? 

 

And must we see what Anna is up to every week?  She is a Duggar only by marriage.  I feel sorry for her kids having to sit around the kitchen table with the same three people 24/7 being homeschooled out in the middle of nowhere, presumably without even a car to get into town.  DC is a big city!  I think Kinzie, at least, would enjoy expanding her horizons and having someone else to talk to and play with, but then Anna did state in one of those flashback shows that her whole ambition was to have kids and teach them how to read...

Edited by joanofarch4
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cereality

cereality

How old are James and Jason? What is known about them -- anything about their likes/dislikes, what they want to do when they grow up etc? Honestly I haven't paid attention to anyone younger than Josiah.

 

Was James in Jill's buddy group? It seems like Derick will be a good influence on him -- and any others than hang around them. There was an IG pic of Derick giving James a trumpet lesson, and he was sitting with them at the Razorback game as well. It may broaden his horizons just a bit to have Derick as a brother in law -- nothing earth shattering but who knows maybe he gets to try new foods at their house or maybe Derick talked to him about what the college days were like as Pistol Pete or wandered around U. of A with him before the game. All of these things will give the younger ones a glimpse of life outside the compound in a way that the older ones didn't have -- it may give them some motivation and hope that they can find a way to pursue some of these other things.

 

Jason (I think -- the one w Jessa) seemed sweet. I loved him saying that he had faith that Jessa would shoot better than Ben because she's his sister; nice to see him not taking the -- of course a girl can't shoot as well as a boy -- approach. Maybe he has some realization that his bro in law is a dud.

Literata

Literata

 

 

How old are James and Jason? What is known about them -- anything about their likes/dislikes, what they want to do when they grow up etc? Honestly I haven't paid attention to anyone younger than Josiah.

Michelle, what are you doing posting here?

I spat my lunch on my keyboard. :)

 

And such a pleasure to hear someone who can actually speak properly!

I love that about him. 

 

Jill could have done much, much worse. 

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GEML

GEML

I liked the contrast between the two Jills: all smiley, demure, and "Aren't you sweet?" to Derick, then turning around and stern, no-nonsense, and "Put your fork down." in another voice to James.

" ...

That was hilarious. But in a sad kind of way it was almost like watching a single mother date. I also wonder if she doesn't like to say too much in front of the chaperones because she wants SOMETHING private. I hope so. But I'm really afraid she might have really meant her Mother's Day message.

Literata

Literata

 

I think Jenny is a gorgeous little girl. Unfortunately for her, she's not the "smile and keep sweet" type. From her TH's we've learned she hates pink, hates hair bows and never wants to get married. She's the antithesis of everything the Duggars stand for and individuality isn't prized in that family. Look how shitty Boob treated the non-mechanically inclined Jed when they lost the car making contest.

Agreed. She sure looks like her dad, but in a much more attractive way. Was she the one who said she was going to tie Jill to a chair so Jill couldn't leave? Love her.

 

I'm pretty sure Jed was the one who read the original poem during the Duggar Cafe or whatever the hell that was. I'm sure Boob has already branded him as the Sissy Boy of the family, sadly. He actually seems intelligent and articulate and sensitive -- qualities enlightened families would prize highly. 

  • Love 4
cereality

cereality

If Jed is deemed the sissy boy -- then in JB's mind, he's in the same category as Josiah. JB and Michelle don't seem to do well with book-learnin' kinds of boys; they are better with the manual labor kinds of boys. Is he also the one who had an interest in video/cameras etc? I seem to remember one of the twins sticking an iphone through a dishwasher a few years ago to see what they could record. Dumb but shows some curiosity. Him and Josiah would likely both love to go to college because they seem like they WANT to learn, as opposed to the others who treat school as an obligation.

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Literata

Literata

I wonder how it came to be that Jason and James were featured so prominently in the dating episode. From what I've read about the crew, they seem pretty involved with the family; maybe Soundman Jim mentioned that the boys are funny and should have their own storylines. I hope so. Someone needs to take an interest in those kids.

joanofarch4

joanofarch4

(edited)

Jer was the one who read the original poem...  He also lists drawin', unicycle-ridin', and chess-playin' among his hobbies (note to Michelle).  But he doesn't pronounce them that way!  He seems like a pretty sharp cookie to me and will probably be a hunk.  I wonder what his secret ambition is?

Edited by joanofarch4
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VioletNevermind

VioletNevermind

(edited)

Well, I purposed to stay awake during these two episodes, but had a really hard time avoiding the temptation to allow my eyes to stray toward more interesting things. Still, I hung in there until the bitter end, my chastity intact, but just barely . . .

1. Chaperones everywhere! I couldn't get over the fact that the two adult (barely, in Bin's case) couples had to cart young boys along with them on their dates to basically act as mini cockblockers. I was raised pretty darned conservatively, but even my mother simply smiled and wished me a good time when I went on dates at the age of 20. The more exposure we have to the Duggar's dating lives, the more I get an arrogant vibe. It's fine with me if they want to restrict their kids, but they seem to view those of us in the "outside world" who engage in fully-clothed vertical kissing or face-to-face hugs as ungodly heathens, turning a blind eye to God's rules. There's no way on earth that the girls are 100% behind those rules, especially Jessa. She looks like she's going to eat that poor boy alive whenever she's within six feet of him.

2. Still just loving Derick to pieces. I appreciated how he treated James during the picnic: "You look like the kind of guy who would love a fig." That was some picnic he prepared for them. A far cry from tater tot casserole and the other dump-n-stir meals in the spinster J'Slaves' repertoire. I still hold out a glimmer of hope that Jill will allow Derick's normalcy to rub off on her once she's a bit more removed from the compound, but we'll see.

3. Jill sounds about 14 when she interacts with Derick. "Oh, that's so sweet!" "Totaaaally!" He is so much more worldly and mature than she is that it makes me wonder what he thinks when she says things like that.

4. Bin and Jessa. I'm almost to the point where I can't watch those two without feeling bad. Good God, they are SO. YOUNG. They have no business getting married! They're the kind of real-world couple who would "date" for a few months, fellowship each other's brains out, and move on, no hard feelings. It is a rare 19-year-old boy, indeed, who is even remotely mature enough to enter into marriage, let alone care for children. I hope he knows what he's getting into. Never underestimate the power that the promise of sex on the horizon has on a young male.

5. The fake "scouting for wedding locales." Oh, get real TLC. Anyone with basic knowledge of how things work in religious circles knows that fundie weddings almost always take place in churches, not country clubs, in gazebos, in fields, or in sunlit pastures. As for the cake lady, I wondered why Jill didn't go to an actual shop for her 1,000-count (!!!) wedding. That's a hell of a lot of cake for one person to bake out of her home kitchen.

6. Jennifer and her glasses, bless her heart. How young she is to already be so dour! She was probably wondering why her buddy-mother didn't take her. Last night's episode really highlighted the totally impassive, detached way that Michelle relates to her children. It's as if she's a teacher's aide or PTA mom helping out on a field trip. She's only there to make sure no one dies during the outing, but everything else is the real mom's job.

7. A couple of the middle boys didn't even look familiar to me, they haven't been shown in so long.

Edited by SuzyLee
  • Love 8
lottiedottie

lottiedottie

I find Derick to be very likable, I can't help it. He seems very genuine and gentle-spirited, even in front of the cameras. It's like he accepts the cameras will be a part of their life and he rolls with it--but he doesn't ham it up for the camera. I feel like he and Jill are a good match, despite her inarticulate teenage girl-isms. I'm willing to give her a pass because she hasn't had normal interactions with a boy, and it has to be hella awkward to be Duggar Dating on camera (it would be hard to act normal if you were being filmed as a normal person on a normal date).

 

The hard thing about watching Bin and Jessa is that he is just as unworldly as the Duggars, so when you get him together with Jessa, there's very little intelligent or interesting conversation going on!

  • Love 6
DangerousMinds

DangerousMinds

(edited)

The sad thing is that I don't think James was joking when he said he'd call the police if Jill and Derrick broke the courting rules.

I'm sure those kids have been brainwashed into thinking that their stupid rules are the law.

I hope not, but I would've loved to hear the police response to that call.

I find Derick to be very likable, I can't help it. He seems very genuine and gentle-spirited, even in front of the cameras. It's like he accepts the cameras will be a part of their life and he rolls with it--but he doesn't ham it up for the camera. I feel like he and Jill are a good match, despite her inarticulate teenage girl-isms. I'm willing to give her a pass because she hasn't had normal interactions with a boy, and it has to be hella awkward to be Duggar Dating on camera (it would be hard to act normal if you were being filmed as a normal person on a normal date).

The hard thing about watching Bin and Jessa is that he is just as unworldly as the Duggars, so when you get him together with Jessa, there's very little intelligent or interesting conversation going on!

In most ways Derek seems great, but I do have to really wonder why he settled down with a girl as immature and tweeny as Jill. He has been to college and met plenty of intelligent women. Edited by DangerousMinds
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GEML

GEML

I actually hadn't realized until last night how tall Jill was.  We've talked a lot about how she must have felt hearing all her life how Jessa, and sometimes Jana were "the pretty ones" but I'm also betting that she was the super tall and gawky one.  Author Madeleine L'Engle always used to think of herself as a giraffe, and I wonder if Jill hasn't thought of herself similarly.  But next to Derrick, she's just right.  And then I immediately wondered if height was the reason that Jim Bob picked Jill for Derrick.  It really could be that simple.  Especially when her brother said that Jill wanted someone "tall" so it seems this was something of a family joke.

  • Love 1
joanofarch4

joanofarch4

I hope not, but I would've loved to hear the police response to that call.

In most ways Derek seems great, but I do have to really wonder why he settled down with a girl as immature and tweeny as Jill. He has been to college and met plenty of intelligent women.

Remember, Jill was training to be a midwife/missionary in a foreign country, which was right up Derick's alley.  No doubt she was presented to him, doing charity work in Nepal at the time, as the perfect helpmate to him.  Of course, now that all seems to have fallen to the wayside, for whatever reason.  Perhaps he's going along with it to stay near his mother during her illness, but I do wonder if he'll live to regret this...

Fuzzysox

Fuzzysox

They ended up with a tiny, tiny cake. I realize that they had sheet cakes and cupcakes but for realz Erin Bates had a much better looking cake and bigger too. But I think Kelly's sister is a baker so she made a nice cake for her niece. Jill ended up with the home baker in training cake. Thanks to Boob for opening up his wallet nice and wide. *sarcasm*

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WTFFF

WTFFF

(edited)

 

Every time Michelle is asked to describe a particular child's personality, she gets this momentarily stunned look. Then, she proceeds to deliver these one word, unintuitive, ill considered descriptions. Jenny isn't exactly stoic. We've seen her express joy and eagerness whenever she's with Jill.

 

I think it's possible that Michelle just doesn't know what stoic means.  But it could also just be that Michelle doesn't realize that Jenni isn't stoic; she just hates Michelle.  I revel in every moment Jenni rejects her mother, but it makes me sad for the kid - hopefully she and Jill can stay close. 

 

I wonder if glasses shopping was their quality "one on one time" for the month. 

 

 

How old are James and Jason? What is known about them -- anything about their likes/dislikes, what they want to do when they grow up etc? Honestly I haven't paid attention to anyone younger than Josiah.

 

Michelle, what are you doing posting here?

 

I'm laughing so hard. 

 

To answer the question, Jason likes "science" and wants to be the doctor that cures cancer.  All I can say is, good luck with that, kid.  He's also the one who declared that the dancing in the Ethiopian restaurant made him "want to puke because it didn't make any sense."  So while he's very sweet with his family, he seems to have also embraced the xenophobia part of the party line. 

 

I don't really know anything about James except when he was a kid I thought he was the Duggar most likely to grow up to be a serial killer.  He was really obsessed with guns, knives and the idea of hunting.  He also always displayed a hilarious disdain towards Michelle - that seems to be a theme with Jill's buddy group. At some point he probably wanted to be a "missionary," which was the boys' stock answer for career goals when they didn't really have any.  (Edit: in Duggar School Daze he did indeed say he wanted to be a missionary.  However I think he was about eight then, so it's probably changed.)

Edited by WTFFF
Libby96

Libby96

What on earth is up with the timeline on this show? When Derick picks Jill up for their date, the screen says "11 weeks until the wedding." But during the date, they very clearly said they were celebrating Jill's birthday, which is May 17. That's less than five weeks before the wedding. Heck, due to the Courtship Model Rush to the Alter before You Slip Up and Fall Into Bed Plan, these two were only engaged about twelve weeks.

Sigh, who knows. James the Chaperone was killing it with his deadpan delivery. I'm liking that kid.

  • Love 2
overbooked

overbooked

I loved the picnic food.  Derick ate local food for 2 years in Nepal and I think he has a fondness for more sophisticated food.  Jill was game to try the local fare when she visited but JB made a scene like toddler with a screwed-up face and everything. I'm glad James got to try something new away from his father's childish reactions. James did say that he liked the hummus after he tried it.  Add that to the Aldi shopping list--they have very good hummus far cheaper than the regular stores.

  • Love 1
Portia

Portia

As for Jenny, I can see her giving Michelle the side eye, but she didn't even crack a smile or exchange social niceties with the eyeglass lady.  At six, can't she say "thank you" and "goodbye" instead of just walking off in a huff?  

That bothered me, too. By about age 4, even my shyest child was expected to speak when spoken to and look an adult in the eye. And my little sinners went to--gasp!--public school. Most of the homeschoolers I've known have taken pride in their children being good at interacting with adults. 

BitterApple

BitterApple

That bothered me, too. By about age 4, even my shyest child was expected to speak when spoken to and look an adult in the eye. And my little sinners went to--gasp!--public school. Most of the homeschoolers I've known have taken pride in their children being good at interacting with adults. 

Yeah, I was surprised that Michelle didn't make Jenny respond to the woman. I like Jenny, but it was very rude. 

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Literata

Literata

 

It's as if she's a teacher's aide or PTA mom helping out on a field trip. She's only there to make sure no one dies during the outing, but everything else is the real mom's job.

Best description of J'Chelle I've ever seen. 

 

I really do worry about those little ones in terms of how they're going to adapt when their sister-moms leave -- especially Jill's buddies, though, as she's already shown, she's not abandoning them. But then -- how ridiculously unfair that those girls can't leave the nest without worrying about the kids they're leaving behind.

 

All my wild speculation about Jana aside (I'm talking to YOU, Frank Sun), I'm convinced that's why she's still around; she's worried about what will happen to the little ones once she and Jill are both gone. 

WTFFF

WTFFF

Maybe I'm too soft on Jennifer because she's my favorite Duggar, but I don't think a kid with bad shyness should be forced to speak to anyone.  It seems as bad to me as forcing a kid to hug someone they don't want to.  But then, I was an electively mute child in my early years.  Perhaps Jenni is just being bratty, but I sympathize with shy kids who just can't bring themselves to speak to anyone. 

  • Love 8
Dr.Scully

Dr.Scully

I'm so sick of these asinine, self-righteous courting rules. Having a 12 year old boy accompany 2 20-somethings on a date as a chaperone is as ridiculous as it is inappropriate. An actual adult chaperone? Still ridiculous but not inappropriate. Why does a 12 year old boy need to be in the presence of 2 horny adults, forced to sit and watch them have hand sex while gazing at each other lovingly? I'm far more liberal than conservative and I found that gross and inappropriate. So much for modesty.

Hey Michelle, can you give up the lie that your children get to choose their own courting rules? No one believes you. You can tell your BF you love him but can't hold his hand?! Give me a break. I can't stand how they think it makes them better than everyone else.

I've watched this show since the very first 14 kids special and at first I just thought hey, I don't agree with them but they're not hurting anything, so live and let live. Now I just think they are laughably ridiculous. Their made-up courtship rules are so ridiculous it makes me want to puke more then Ethiopian dancing.

  • Love 6
mledawn

mledawn

Have to agree. Jennifer has very few choices in her life and very few opportunities to be anything more than a puppet. She's lost her mom (Jill) through marriage and was being told she had to wear glasses when none of the other children have to do that. 

 

There is a way to present new things to kids, and wearing glasses is one of those things that can be made into a positive - particularly in a family where you're just one of the masses. As a little kid glasses wearer, my mom was an artiste in getting me to be comfortable with them - and I was a massive tomboy. I was so excited to be able to see things, I kept pointing out items on the street as we walked out of the store. I think Jennifer was missing a parent's touch, there.

  • Love 2
ghoulina

ghoulina

Hey Michelle, can you give up the lie that your children get to choose their own courting rules? No one believes you.

 

That's what kills me most of all. I hate their stupid courting rules, but for the love of all things holy - own it! YOU are the ones insisting on them. I mean, is it really just coincidence that Josh, Jill, AND Jessa all "chose" the same courting rules? Do you really expect us to believe that next John David will start courting and be all, "You know what? We've decided that making out and oral sex is okay before the wedding". SMH

  • Love 3
JessDVD

JessDVD

That's what kills me most of all. I hate their stupid courting rules, but for the love of all things holy - own it! YOU are the ones insisting on them. I mean, is it really just coincidence that Josh, Jill, AND Jessa all "chose" the same courting rules? Do you really expect us to believe that next John David will start courting and be all, "You know what? We've decided that making out and oral sex is okay before the wedding". SMH

 

For real - I've seen a lot of people say the kids say that they choose their rules! and I'm like OF COURSE they're going to say that, whether it's because they don't want a TLC Breaking Duggar special, or they love their looney tunes parents too much to embarrass them on national TV & People magazine, or they just don't want to deal with the backlash, or they actually do feel that way (I offer a hefty AS IF to this one but hey, let's give them benefit of the doubt). The kids know what's expected of them and in spite of or because of their own feelings, so far they're all toeing the party line. JB & M should just be profoundly thankful that so far nobody has decided they've had enough of this crap and are going to do what they want to do.

mmmsoap

mmmsoap

Having a 12 year old boy accompany 2 20-somethings on a date as a chaperone is as ridiculous as it is inappropriate. An actual adult chaperone? Still ridiculous but not inappropriate. Why does a 12 year old boy need to be in the presence of 2 horny adults, forced to sit and watch them have hand sex while gazing at each other lovingly? .

I think that Derek and Jill are pretty smart and taking the young kids as chaperones, because that means they can have more conversations in "code" that can go right over the younger kids heads. It's a lot easier to have "private time" with a young kid around who's not going to understand what you're saying, then with your 19-year-old sister around.

I agree that these courts of rules are ridiculous though. I don't understand the idea that you can get to know your future spouse without ever being alone with them. I also don't really understand the idea behind "kissing is giving a piece of your heart away" but saying I love you is fine. If the courtship ends up dissolving in Jessa and Bin's case then don't we think both of them will have a piece of their heart damage to because they were supposedly in love?

  • Love 2
charmed1

charmed1

I felt bad for poor James having to tag along on Jill and Derick's romantic picnic and hike. Derick talked so much about protecting Jill while hiking so that she wouldn't slip and poor James was just tagging along behind and trying to keep up!

Yeah watching James hopping around on rocks following behind those two, immediately made me think of Gollum leading Sam and Frodo into that "shortcut" into Mordor.
  • Love 3
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